Home U.S. Coin Forum

1919 Mercury Dime - CONFIRMED: DDO Discovery Piece (Census in 1st post)

1246725

Comments

  • StrikeOutXXXStrikeOutXXX Posts: 3,352 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Dimeman hasn't chimed in yet!!! >>



    Ooh trust me, he just hit 91% of all dimes in his registry set, the thought of going down to 90 when this one gets added I'm sure does not make him happy - we've had a few PMs already 8-)

    I don't have any immediate plans of letting go of this discovery piece, which is tentatively graded F-12

    There have been 2 more reported at higher grade, one in the XF/AU range, and the 3rd I didn't read the grade.

    The coin is still with Bill Fivaz, going to James Wiles, then John Wexler, then ANACS. It has a tentative CPG FS#, and will likely get the CONECA designation soon as well. The NGC variety guru is in on the e-mails going back and forth, as are many others, and I suspect it's inevitable that it hits the registry sets. The coin should be in the next CPG vol2. Not sure if/when it will be in other publications, probably depends on how many are found.

    Capt Henway has a press release pretty much ready to go out, just a matter of seeing the other specimens, and nailing down a few more details I believe, but he'd have to chime in on that side of things.

    With the holiday slowing down mail, probably won't hear much more until next week - I'm dying to see pics of the higher graded examples, and am real curious what an MS example of this variety looks like (especially without the crud buildup mine has).
    ------------------------------------------------------------

    "You Suck Award" - February, 2015

    Discoverer of 1919 Mercury Dime DDO - FS-101
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>A third specimen has been reported by a different dealer on my old dealer-to-dealer network. Also high grade. He is sending me pictures on Monday.

    TD

    P.S.: I expect there to be some serious cherrypicking at the shows this weekend! Let us know what you find! >>



    My monthly bourse was canceled an hour or so ago due to the weather. I had high hopes of cherrypicking another before the word really got out. I suspect by next month's show, with the articles you are writing surely to be online as well as in print, opportunity will have drastically been reduced.

    Anyone want to guess what the population will be like in a week, month, year, etc?

    I told the Capt I suspected a dozen by the end of the weekend, maybe 100 a week after the Coin World articles, but beyond that, I'm at a loss as to speculation. >>



    I suspect that your population estimates are rather high, but I am willing to be proven wrong.

    TD
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    So, did anybody cherrypick one today?
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • Congrats on the find...very cool.
    All the best,

    Rob

    image

    Successful Trades with: Coincast, MICHAELDIXON

    Successful Purchases from: Manorcourtman, Meltdown
  • koynekwestkoynekwest Posts: 10,048 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>So, did anybody cherrypick one today? >>



    I went out and tried but no luck. Only looked at two 1919 dimes-that's all the places had in stock. I'll be back out next week, snowfall allowing.
  • keyman64keyman64 Posts: 15,506 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>So, did anybody cherrypick one today? >>

    None to look at at the show I was at today. image
    "If it's not fun, it's not worth it." - KeyMan64
    Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners. :smile:
  • This content has been removed.
  • BaleyBaley Posts: 22,660 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Wow, just read through the whole thread for the first time, giant congratulations StrikeOutXXX, what a cool discovery, as someone else said, it's great when a forum member makes a find

    Astounding that it took 96 years (or 80ish) for someone to notice this variety, that's pretty darned dramatic.. and now, several people will "cherrypick" them out of their own collections

    it happens!

    Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry

  • DIMEMANDIMEMAN Posts: 22,403 ✭✭✭✭✭
    >>>Dimeman hasn't chimed in yet!!!<<<

    I have been here all along. I tried to buy the coin from 300strike, but he is keeping it for a while at least.

    I have done some searching on Ebay. I looked at my 1919 hoping to cherrypick myself.....but no.image

    I have no problem with it getting added to the set.....that's what it is all about. I have a bunch of Merc varieties I want to add.
  • fishteethfishteeth Posts: 2,245 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I hope someone finds another that matches this 1919. I think I saw what is being listed at the third one found today at the local show, he was supposed to send pictures to Tom tomorrow, Definitely NOT A match.
    So, so far only the one coin verified, hopefully the second coin will be a match.
    I have looked at over 200 1919 merc dimes in the past week and can't imagine that this has kept hiding for this long with as popular as merc dimes are.
    Really hoping to see more of these pop up.

  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    THat's why I always say "reported" until it is verified. I will post something after I see the pictures.
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I hope someone finds another that matches this 1919. I think I saw what is being listed at the third one found today at the local show, he was supposed to send pictures to Tom tomorrow, Definitely NOT A match.
    So, so far only the one coin verified, hopefully the second coin will be a match.
    I have looked at over 200 1919 merc dimes in the past week and can't imagine that this has kept hiding for this long with as popular as merc dimes are.
    Really hoping to see more of these pop up. >>



    Got the pictures today. You are correct that it is NOT the doubled die. Just machine doubling.

    That takes the population back down to one confirmed by Fivaz and one on the way to Fivaz. He should have it Tuesday. THis one I am very sure of because the guy had it in his hand while I asked him "Does it have this" and "does it have that" and everything matches Strikeout's pictures.

    Tune in tomorrow!

    TD
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • koynekwestkoynekwest Posts: 10,048 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Too bad about #3. I'll bet the same thing will happen frequently. I am very anxious to see what #2 turns out to be. As I stated previously-I'll bet this coin turns out to be extremely rare. It's my contention that's the main reason it hasn't been reported 'till now.
  • StrikeOutXXXStrikeOutXXX Posts: 3,352 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Too bad about #3. I'll bet the same thing will happen frequently. I am very anxious to see what #2 turns out to be. As I stated previously-I'll bet this coin turns out to be extremely rare. It's my contention that's the main reason it hasn't been reported 'till now. >>



    I had guessed a dozen would surface after the weekend, and 100 a week or so after the articles hit the news media.

    Maybe I should change my estimate to a dozen after the news media, 100 a year or so after.

    I'm really not sure how many will be out there. I'm not sure how far reaching the PCGS/NGC Message Boards are - I just posted it yesterday on Cointalk, but didn't see any other forums mention it since it came up here.

    Judging by the views on NGC and comments here, my guess is only about 1000 people are aware (Plus however many are in the Capt's Dealer Network).

    I do agree it should have been fairly easy to see, the question is were they stashed away without knowing who to ask about it (much like this one was 20+ years ago), will a bunch be found in rolls, or was the die found early in the production run and there really aren't that many out there.

    Certainly is fun waiting to see some of the answers though - and I STILL want to see what an Uncirculated one of these bad boys looks like.
    If these aren't priced at moon money, once things stabilize, a few years from now, I'd love to own one to go with the discovery piece.
    ------------------------------------------------------------

    "You Suck Award" - February, 2015

    Discoverer of 1919 Mercury Dime DDO - FS-101
  • koynekwestkoynekwest Posts: 10,048 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I hear you on that last point-I'd love to own one myself but I think it will always be beyond my finances.
  • seanqseanq Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I have continued to check eBay and I haven't seen anything to make me even suspicious. I have a circ roll due to arrive tomorrow, I will be sure to post what if anything I find.


    Sean Reynolds
    Incomplete planchets wanted, especially Lincoln Cents & type coins.

    "Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
  • DAMDAM Posts: 2,410 ✭✭


    << <i>I do agree it should have been fairly easy to see, the question is were they stashed away without knowing who to ask about it (much like this one was 20+ years ago), will a bunch be found in rolls, or was the die found early in the production run and there really aren't that many out there. >>



    I've been around long enough to have seen two significant silver run-ups. I've been wondering how many, in lower grades, might have been cashed in.
    Dan
  • ms70ms70 Posts: 13,954 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I just want to say congratulations! image

    Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.

  • StrikeOutXXXStrikeOutXXX Posts: 3,352 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I hear you on that last point-I'd love to own one myself but I think it will always be beyond my finances. >>



    I guess it depends where the population lands on this one (and thus the $$).

    If it ends up on par with say the 69-S Lincoln or 16 Buffalo, I'm probably out of luck.

    If it starts getting up there around the 42/41 Merc or 55 Lincoln, I can probably swing it image.


    It's a catch-22 in this case, I certainly don't want the higher grades to be moon money if I plan on buying one someday, but... if they are... my little F-12 may be good to have someday for a few semesters of college for one of the little ones (F-12 16/16 Buffalo is still around $8-9k, so you never know where this will land).
    ------------------------------------------------------------

    "You Suck Award" - February, 2015

    Discoverer of 1919 Mercury Dime DDO - FS-101
  • koynekwestkoynekwest Posts: 10,048 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think it has good potential to be worth a fair amount, especially with the right kind of promotion and depending how many more show up. It has to be "common" enough so it isn't virtually non-collectible
    like the 1936 FS 101 half dollar. I would think that some of the lower grade ones were probably melted.
  • fishteethfishteeth Posts: 2,245 ✭✭✭✭✭
    So how many 1919 dimes have we all looked at? It should be easy to get an estimate of population because its something new.

    If we have looked through thousands of 1919 dimes and only two show up then this coin may be prohibitively rare.

    Has anyone looked through all the Heritage sales of 1919 dimes? Must be a couple of hundred listed there I would think, especially in high grade.
    Really looking forward to seeing more because it really is a cool variety.
  • This content has been removed.
  • fishteethfishteeth Posts: 2,245 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I just spent an hour on Heritage, so far no luck, looked at some on coin facts, nothing.

    I am guessing by now members of this board have looked at a couple 1000 1919 merc dimes.
  • StrikeOutXXXStrikeOutXXX Posts: 3,352 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>So how many 1919 dimes have we all looked at? It should be easy to get an estimate of population because its something new.

    If we have looked through thousands of 1919 dimes and only two show up then this coin may be prohibitively rare.

    Has anyone looked through all the Heritage sales of 1919 dimes? Must be a couple of hundred listed there I would think, especially in high grade.
    Really looking forward to seeing more because it really is a cool variety. >>



    You saw the data RWB sent me earlier in the thread right?

    521 Obverse dies used in philly-1919 for mercs. Avg 71,050 minted per die.
    So finding 2 per thousand would be average.

    37,017,050 mercs were struck. 35,740,000 were released. So 1,277,050 were rejected. How many of the potential 71k were put in the reject piles?

    Was the die found before an average full run? Were the coins found just after production and rejected enmasse, lots of variables.

    1919 is a common date. Only 1,000 certified in all grades. The vast majority for sale on eBay are heavily circulated. Not many dealers have 19s in stock. How many survived the mass melting during the silver run-ups? How many are likely sitting in 90% bags not even being considered as a collectable coin today? Other than maybe one in a whitman/dansco, if you are not a dime collector, when was the last time you even looked at a 1919 merc?

    I have no idea what lies ahead for this DDO, but it's fun to be a part of it however it turns out.
    ------------------------------------------------------------

    "You Suck Award" - February, 2015

    Discoverer of 1919 Mercury Dime DDO - FS-101
  • koynekwestkoynekwest Posts: 10,048 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yep-LOTS of variables to be sure. This whole thing is very intriguing-it's not often something as dramatic as this comes along. Congratulations again on finding this excellent variety and for providing us with something really significant to look for!
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Waiting to hear from Fivaz to see if the higher grade piece shows any more doubling than the Discovery Specimen. Should be at his P.O. this morning.

    No reports of any other pieces being cherry picked over the weekend.

    TD
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • guitarwesguitarwes Posts: 9,266 ✭✭✭
    I have probably seen thousands of 1919 dimes counting bulk Mercs but never gave them a second look to see if they were special. Lots have seen the melting pot. I always pull out 1942's to give them a second look (of course).

    This find is great and will interesting to follow it. I haven't gone thru my hoard of Mercs yet but will this weekend.
    @ Elite CNC Routing & Woodworks on Facebook. Check out my work.
    Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The second specimen was a no-show at Fivaz's P.O. Box. Hopefully tomorrow.

    image
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • seanqseanq Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>The second specimen was a no-show at Fivaz's P.O. Box. Hopefully tomorrow.

    image >>



    My circ roll was also a no show, it got held up by the weather overnight.


    Sean Reynolds
    Incomplete planchets wanted, especially Lincoln Cents & type coins.

    "Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
  • BLUEJAYWAYBLUEJAYWAY Posts: 9,058 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Looks like I joined up here just in time, albeit just a little over a year ago. I'm thrilled about this new discovery news. As I've never been a part of some discovery like this,even though only as a forum member. The fact that it occurs with my favorite coin series is an added bonus. Am following this discovery news with much interest.
    Successful transactions:Tookybandit. "Everyone is equal, some are more equal than others".
  • This content has been removed.
  • ModCrewmanModCrewman Posts: 4,037 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Went to my local B&M on Saturday and looked through probably 40-50 1919's, they of course waited until I was done looking at them all to tell me they'd already been through them. image Without success.
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I did put out the word on the dealer-to-dealer network. THat's how SPecimen #2 was found.
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • guitarwesguitarwes Posts: 9,266 ✭✭✭
    "I got a Fivaz, and the only prescription is more 1919 DDO's"


    This won't be funny unless you know how to pronounce his last name and know the SNL reference.

    @ Elite CNC Routing & Woodworks on Facebook. Check out my work.
    Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.


  • << <i>"I got a Fivaz, and the only prescription is more 1919 DDO's"


    This won't be funny unless you know how to pronounce his last name and know the SNL reference. >>



    LOL!!! Thanks guitarwes, this made my day image
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Another no-show at Fivaz's P.O. Box! The sender has filed a claim to see if the P.O. can track it down.

    Sheesh!
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • seanqseanq Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Whelp my circulated roll of 50 little lottery tickets yielded squadoosh as far as doubled dies. Surely the number of coins examined by collectors here and dealers along the wire must number well into the thousands by now. If there are more out there, they are not coming out without a fight.


    Sen Reynolds
    Incomplete planchets wanted, especially Lincoln Cents & type coins.

    "Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
  • seanqseanq Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Another no-show at Fivaz's P.O. Box! The sender has filed a claim to see if the P.O. can track it down.

    Sheesh! >>




    Did Mr Fivaz check his mail yet today? image


    Sean Reynolds
    Incomplete planchets wanted, especially Lincoln Cents & type coins.

    "Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Specimen #2 received by Bill FIvaz and confirmed as same doubled die! No additonal doubling seen on head or designer's initials. Photos sent to Ken Bressett and Q. David Bowers for consideration of inclusion in the Redbook.

    Tom DeLorey
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • epcjimi1epcjimi1 Posts: 3,489 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Specimen #2 received by Bill FIvaz and confirmed as same doubled die! No additonal doubling seen on head or designer's initials. Photos sent to Ken Bressett and Q. David Bowers for consideration of inclusion in the Redbook.

    Tom DeLorey >>



    The chase is on!
  • StrikeOutXXXStrikeOutXXX Posts: 3,352 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Specimen #2 received by Bill FIvaz and confirmed as same doubled die! No additonal doubling seen on head or designer's initials. Photos sent to Ken Bressett and Q. David Bowers for consideration of inclusion in the Redbook.

    Tom DeLorey >>



    The chase is on! >>



    I saw pics of the XF example/specimen 2. Much nicer separation on the GOD. Now.. Someone find an uncirculated piece, I want to see it!!!
    ------------------------------------------------------------

    "You Suck Award" - February, 2015

    Discoverer of 1919 Mercury Dime DDO - FS-101
  • fcloudfcloud Posts: 12,133 ✭✭✭✭
    Thanks, StrikeOutXXX, I posted an image of the discovery coin on the Variety Resource Dime page at www.arsave.com

    Here is link. http://www.arsave.com/variety_resource_dimes

    President, Racine Numismatic Society 2013-2014; Variety Resource Dimes; See 6/8/12 CDN for my article on Winged Liberty Dimes; Ebay

  • seanqseanq Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This is probably a stupid question, but I've never let that stop me before: has anyone checked the examples pictured in the registry sets (either here or ATS) for this variety? If I were looking for a high grade example, that is the first place I think I'd check.


    Sean Reynolds
    Incomplete planchets wanted, especially Lincoln Cents & type coins.

    "Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Sean, I'd like to think that collectors sophisticated enough to have registry sets would have noticed this, but I may be wrong.
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,530 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>image >>



    image

    Edited to add: "Awared?" >>



    Yeah, why not? His discovery "awared" the rest of us to the possibility! image

    WTG, Jeff! image

    I think I have a 1919 Merc or two (in about that grade) in my dug detector finds album. I'll have to give 'em a closer look!

    Explore collections of lordmarcovan on CollecOnline, management, safe-keeping, sharing and valuation solution for art piece and collectibles.
  • SwampboySwampboy Posts: 12,987 ✭✭✭✭✭
    So happy for you StrikeoOutXXX. image

    This is one image thread and a great Discovery!!

    "Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working" Pablo Picasso

  • seanqseanq Posts: 8,651 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Sean, I'd like to think that collectors sophisticated enough to have registry sets would have noticed this, but I may be wrong. >>




    Tom, I don't think it's a question of of sophistication, just that not every registry collector is interested in varieties. I know if you and I cared enough about a series to build a registry set, we'd want to know about discoveries like this, but not everyone thinks like us.

    I know some folks here scoured the auction archives at Heritage after this new broke, I was curious if anyone did the same with the registries. I continue to check eBay every morning for new auctions, so nobody else needs to worry about looking there. image

    On a related subject, any idea when we will be able to see Bill Fivaz's photos of the higher grade specimen?


    Sean Reynolds
    Incomplete planchets wanted, especially Lincoln Cents & type coins.

    "Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,118 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I have asked Bill if it is OK for Jeff to post them.

    I want somebody to find a legitimate Specimen #3 this weekend!
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I continue to look.....cannot find one group of circ Mercs I KNOW I have....will be checking the antique shops today....(they have a couple of coin displays)..Cheers, RickO
  • StrikeOutXXXStrikeOutXXX Posts: 3,352 ✭✭✭✭✭
    With permission from Bill Fivaz, here is the motto from specimen #2, the XF piece.

    image

    As well as mine for comparison

    image
    ------------------------------------------------------------

    "You Suck Award" - February, 2015

    Discoverer of 1919 Mercury Dime DDO - FS-101

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Emoji
Image
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file