"""Secretary of State John Kerry confirmed Thursday a report that Jews in one restive Ukrainian city were sent notices telling them to register, a development he called "grotesque."
Kerry's comments follow a report in Israel's Ynet News that a leaflet was circulating in the eastern Ukrainian city of Donetsk, demanding that Jews register -- as well as provide a list of property they own -- or else face deportation and revocation of citizenship. Pro-Russian activists have asserted partial control over some government buildings in that city."""
Kerry should consider this as he unwisely attempts to weaken Israel. History has wound the clock back 75 years in a couple of months.
>>
What makes that doubtful is where it is alleged to have been circulated. If that happened in the west, say Lviv - I might believe it. Svoboda Ukraina is the neo-fascist organisation in Ukraine that is believed to be anti-Semitic, and they are in the west. Svoboda has absolutely no following in the east.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
And preserving petrodollar status. History has shown that the economic battlefield leads to armed conflict. Let us hope that is not the case here.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Guns and butter economic policy has worked in the past.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>White House is considering targeted sanctions.
That must have Vladimir shaking.
How about a total import/export freeze, Barry? >>
History has demonstrated that sanctions are worthless. Europe does a lot more business with Russia than the USA does and they are not going to impose sanctions because of their need of Russian gas. The USA and Russia do billions of dollars in trade, but it is a drop in the bucket for both countries. As an example, the embargo against Cuba has had the opposite desired effect - keeps Castro in power because he gets lots of political propaganda value out of it.
The only thing that would really get Putin's attention is a big show of force. Obama, Merkel, Hollande have all ruled that out.
It is becoming a foregone conclusion that Ukraine is going to be greatly truncated by Russian aggression in the next few days or weeks.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
<< <i> Europe does a lot more business with Russia than the USA does and they are not going to impose sanctions because of their need of Russian gas. >>
No pain, no gain.
If the Ukraine were in a vacuum than I suppose all is good and well in Europe, but clearly Putin has his sights on reestablishing the pre "tear down this wall" Soviet Union. So will the Eastern European nations be worth sacrificing Russian fuel to save? Is Merkel willing hand over East Germany to keep the energy flowing?
Some leadership is needed, but of course failure is not only an option with the Nato alliance, but often the first option.
NATO is worthless. Many of those "allies" like France, Germany, Italy, Spain are just fair weather friends. You can bet your bottom that if Vlad wants to make a new USSR, there will be some interesting fallout. You can expect some allies like Poland and Great Britain to be solidly against it - others will sit on the fence, like not in our neighbourhood. And then you have "allies" like France that would hurry up to welcome the Russian bear.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
What I see happening is Russia invading the entire country to protect its so called "Citizens", Im glad Obama has directly said that Military operations by the US is not going to happen. Bottom line most of Ukrainians speak Russian and dont care all that much who their leader is FROM WHAT IM TOLD I dont know one way or another however I do believe that Russia wants to invade and will do so as soon as any angle that they see fit arises. The long term problem will be what happens after Ukraine falls, does Putin try and go after the other non Nato countries?
Im nervous that this could eventually escalate into a more wider serious situation
My question is if the United States and Russian forces ever do engage in combat operations against each other does that automatically mean Nuclear warfare????
Worthless sanctions on one side, sabre rattling on the other side with the Soviet Army ready to march. Worthless agreements last week on de-escalating the situation. "Peace in our time" anyone?
The new USSR will have to be stopped. It cannot satiate the lust for power with just Ukraine. There are Russian speaking minorities in Estonia, Latvia, Kazakhstan etc.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
"""My question is if the United States and Russian forces ever do engage in combat operations against each other does that automatically mean Nuclear warfare????"""
Nah. Putin is playing chess, while Merkel is playing checkers. Obama is playing tiddlywinks.
France hasn't had any stomach for a fight since WWI. Germany hasn't since WWII. Russia came out of the first with a revolution, and the second with a resounding victory.
Putin clearly sees the Gorbachev debacle as a massive humiliation, which can only be undone by a macho assertion of power. He calculates that the West has no stomach whatever to stand up to him with anything other than sanctions, which he likely has calculated he can weather by appealing to Russian nationalism, and by forging a stronger geopolitical and economic alliance with China.
Whether Putin serves the interests of the Russian people or not in the long run, my bet is that the man will 1) stay in power one way or another until his death or deposition, and 2) will continue to press the resolve of the West whenever and wherever he has an opportunity in terms of territorial expansion and influence around Russia's periphery, as long as he is in charge.
Our problem is that we come to this with disillusionment with our projections of power after the two longest wars in our history, and with allies with the most to lose in Europe, who are likely to be of meager help.
I'm not trying to create any political animosity here, but I seem to recall Obama right before the last presidential election being recorded unbeknowst to him at the time. Essentially giving Putin what he wanted .... just Please, oh pretty please, don't do it until after I'm re-elected.
That pretty much sums up the future with Russia.
Obama's prioritys have nothing to do with Foriegn Affairs.
Obama's prioritys have nothing to do with Foriegn Affairs. >>
He fears Michelle, and leaves the foreign affairs to his Secret Service - quite a few of the agents were slapped around because of prostitute scandals in Colombia and some other countries.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>Why maintain a trillion dollar military with 7 or 8 carrier groups if we are unwilling to even project the idea of strength against Russia or China?
I don't know if JFK was willing to go head to head with the Soviets on the battlefield in 1962, but it was enough to cause Khrushchev to blink.
Now we are prepared to assert additional feeble and limited sanctions against Putin should he cross another DC created red line? Good grief. >>
The reason we have a trillion dollar military and all these carrier groups is simple, its to protect ourselves against China and Russia and everyone else who hates us, the military might of the United States is in place to keep order on a large scale, if you seriously think its a good idea to start dropping troops into Ukraine to form a shield against Russian aggression there then you are nuts and everyone else who thinks this would be a good idea is nuts as well.
Russia dropping military bases in Cuba would be reason to fight, them dropping military bases in a non Nato country who doesnt give a crap about us in eastern Europe is not reason to go to war. Obama knows this and that is why he is talking out of his butt about sanctions, he doesnt really care about how Poland feels either hence the reason he sent 600 troops there not 100,000.
If any of you think we should mobilize in Ukraine to fight Russia then you clearly dont have a brain in your head, Ukraine losing Crimea clearly has no effect on our National Security. Im not a fan of Obama but in this situation Im glad he is making these feeble sanctions. No offense to Saor Alba but I can honestly say I dont care what happens in Ukraine I care about our Men and Woman that would be giving up their blood to stop it, and the possibilty of a billion dead over a nuclear escalation.
<< <i>Why maintain a trillion dollar military with 7 or 8 carrier groups if we are unwilling to even project the idea of strength against Russia or China?
I don't know if JFK was willing to go head to head with the Soviets on the battlefield in 1962, but it was enough to cause Khrushchev to blink.
>>
Kennedy was the one who blinked. he gave up the missiles in Turkey and Italy. Google is friend...
<< <i>The reason we have a trillion dollar military and all these carrier groups is simple, its to protect ourselves against China and Russia and everyone else who hates us, the military might of the United States is in place to keep order on a large scale. . . >>
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
I don't think the military is there to protect us from russia and china . I think its there so the military industrial complex has customers for its garbage.
All that inflation all those taxes have been feeding that beast for 100 years. We would have some sort of universal health care and retirement if it weren't for all the money flowing to the military.
Lots of young men sent to their deaths by a few old cronies would be still alive and walking around too.
One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Let me state categorically - I am not in favour of boots on the ground in Ukraine. This is being made out to be a Ukrainian problem, but people in Ukraine see it as a power grab betwixt the USA and Russia. And when you have foreign special forces on the ground that are "anonymous" players from both sides you can see how murky it is. The average person on the street in Donets'k, Gorlovka, etc just wants to go on with life - and let the stupid powers settle their conflict somewhere else. They don't want their homes destroyed, their lives destroyed for Russia or USA.
So the foreigners have managed to single handedly cripple the Ukrainian economy. I have friends there that have funds socked in Swiss banks as well as some PM - when you have been through a couple of economic collapses before, ie 1992 and 2005-8 you learn quickly not to put the eggs in the local currency basket.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
<< <i>Why maintain a trillion dollar military with 7 or 8 carrier groups if we are unwilling to even project the idea of strength against Russia or China?
I don't know if JFK was willing to go head to head with the Soviets on the battlefield in 1962, but it was enough to cause Khrushchev to blink.
>>
Kennedy was the one who blinked. he gave up the missiles in Turkey and Italy. Google is friend... >>
There have been a great many more instances in history that both powers conveniently covered up to their own citizens and the outside world. Some more, USSR VVS pilots were flying the North Korean and some Vietnamese jets during those wars. Did you know that Americans that were captured were turned over to the Soviets for interrogation and then they disappeared into the maelstrom that was the Gulag of the 1950s and 1960s? If the average Russian and American citizens knew how much their military forces were actually fighting each other and how close thermo-nuclear war actually was they would have been frightened.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
<< <i>if you seriously think its a good idea to start dropping troops into Ukraine to form a shield against Russian aggression there then you are nuts and everyone else who thinks this would be a good idea is nuts as well. >>
Agreed. We cannot prosecute an efficient war in Iraq, let alone against a ruthless and well equipped Russia. But why roll over without at least the implied threat of military force. The White House has been to quick to nod and present worthless sanctions.
Quite likely this gets back to Obama and his "more flexibility" offer extended to Medvedev, directed to Putin.
<< <i>One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders. >>
But they do fund a 2.5 million + man army not to mention another 2.5 million reservists, a World leading power needs to have a strong military regardless of what they plan to do with it.
<< <i>One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders. >>
But they do fund a 2.5 million + man army not to mention another 2.5 million reservists, a World leading power needs to have a strong military regardless of what they plan to do with it. >>
Yes, China has a large Army, but the last time I checked, they still don't "walk on water," nor have they "learned to fly." Good for the defense of the "father land," but useless in an arena where massive amount of equipment for troop transportation is required. We can always sell them some Higgins Boats.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
<< <i>One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders. >>
But they do fund a 2.5 million + man army not to mention another 2.5 million reservists, a World leading power needs to have a strong military regardless of what they plan to do with it. >>
China has a much larger "secret" budget for it's military. They are working on 5th and 6th gen fighter aircraft, are actively pursuing a blue water navy and are a much much bigger power player in the APAC region now. Just ask Taiwan, Japan, Philippines, and Vietnam what they think of China asserting itself internationally.
Re: Russia - brilliant plan, put Spetnaz forces in nondescript uniforms and have them stir up trouble in Crimea and now E. Ukraine. Obama may have read Putin as a pushover, but he is a tactician that gets the desired results. He knows he holds all the cards. He has the energy resources, he has a closeby large sized army group at the ready to roll. And most of all he has a weak willed US president as an adversary.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
<< <i>One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders. >>
But they do fund a 2.5 million + man army not to mention another 2.5 million reservists, a World leading power needs to have a strong military regardless of what they plan to do with it. >>
China has a much larger "secret" budget for it's military. They are working on 5th and 6th gen fighter aircraft, are actively pursuing a blue water navy and are a much much bigger power player in the APAC region now. Just ask Taiwan, Japan, Philippines, and Vietnam what they think of China asserting itself internationally.
Re: Russia - brilliant plan, put Spetnaz forces in nondescript uniforms and have them stir up trouble in Crimea and now E. Ukraine. Obama may have read Putin as a pushover, but he is a tactician that gets the desired results. He knows he holds all the cards. He has the energy resources, he has a closeby large sized army group at the ready to roll. And most of all he has a weak willed US president as an adversary. >>
Yep China is upgrading their Air and Naval forces, the United States is funding the F-35 which is obviously a huge expense but they are keeping up with the "times" as far as advancing combat units, their Navy will never ever ever be strong enough to take our Navy on period end of discussion.
And Ukraine being a brilliant plan? How so? Its right on their border and basically as strong as Mexico in terms of military strength. Its a bully move nothing more nothing less, it would be like the United States taking a chunk of land from Mexico or Canada.
As far as Spetnaz and regular Army ripping the patches off their uniforms its a joke and obvious Putin knew the United States cant and wont interfere militarily speaking so Im at a loss trying to figure out what you mean by a brilliant plan, I think you are giving Putin too much credit.
Edit: I am the biggest offender in this thread for not keeping this PM related so I owe a PM subject, are we thinking this crisis will negativaly effect the stock market and drive up PM's?
<< <i>Edit: I am the biggest offender in this thread for not keeping this PM related so I owe a PM subject, are we thinking this crisis will negativaly effect the stock market and drive up PM's? >>
So far, it appears, to have the exact opposite affect.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
<< <i>Edit: I am the biggest offender in this thread for not keeping this PM related so I owe a PM subject, are we thinking this crisis will negativaly effect the stock market and drive up PM's? >>
If Washington and Europe continue to keep their heads in the sand, Putin's annexation of Ukraine and beyond will continue to have little effects on the markets. Should one of the Paper Tigers roar and institute real and meaningful sanctions and penalties, the markets will get shaken up.
As it stands, the consequences imposed on Don Sterling far outstrip anything directed to Putin.
<< <i>As it stands, the consequences imposed on Don Sterling far outstrip anything directed to Putin. >>
Let us not forget the shoe thrower (who missed) who is sitting in jail with no bail (say she is a flight risk ) and facing two federal charges because of who her target was (just another private citizen). Goes to show you who the "victim" is carries more weight than the actual crime.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
As it appears as though the West and Russia are going to fight on Ukraine's turf, I am glad my immediate family is not there now. Lots of concerns for our relatives in Donets'k who we haven't heard from in a week now, and friends in Horlivka(Gorlovka) which is under siege at the moment. Slavyans'k and Svyatigors'k are where we spent summers a few years ago, lovely churches and vistas. The whole conflict is looking like it is going to spiral into more and more violence. Something a decade ago seemed impossible, then when the planes were hitting the Twin Towers we thought we were in the safest place in the world in our little village in Ukraine.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
I'm so very sorry SaorAlba. I do wish your family well.
Bronco...I would have believed almost anything about Obama, but that he's a willing front and tool for the international Jewish banking cabal honestly hadn't occur to me.
<< <i>I'm so very sorry SaorAlba. I do wish your family well.
Bronco...I would have believed almost anything about Obama, but that he's a willing front and tool for the international Jewish banking cabal honestly hadn't occur to me. >>
Well the article has a nugget of truth to it , I think the financial sector is always excited by the prospect of war or two.
That being said , I intended to put a winkie face after the link
Russia has been pushing the boundaries of tolerance with military moves ever since Putin took power. They have resumed long range reconnaissance flights with their TU-95 bombers and the TU-142 and TU-160 bombers as well - even sending them to Cuba, Venezuela etc. They are making a serious effort at fielding a bluewater navy - traditionally they have only had submarines that traversed outside of their recognised waters - now they are on a naval building frenzy - a factor that saw them supporting the Assad government in Syria - because of their strategic naval depot at Tartus.
Far from standing down and being a so called "regional power" as insulted by Barack Obama, Russia is looking to expand it's borders and horizons. Russia has the material and financial wealth to sustain a military buildup and even absorbing parts of, if not all of other countries. The western media is putting on a show for the western audience trying to convince the public that Russia cannot sustain such adventures- but the truth is they do not understand the Russian mentality. The USSR crumbled into now 17 recognized and unrecognized individual states. A great majority of those new countries inherited a significant Russian population that has greater loyalties to Russia than their new states. Russia sees their position now as "bottom rail on top now" mentality - a factor no doubt helped along by the western media and their portrayal of so much negativity about Russia.
I do not like what Putin and Russia are doing, but I understand where they are coming from. Perhaps if some in the present US administration broadened their perspectives of events they would be better able to respond instead of offering up mediocre handslapping sanctions. Otherwise it will only be a matter of time before Russia makes another move to establish a territorial link to say the Kaliningrad enclave that is cut off from Russia by Belarus and Lithuania. Or they could decide that some of the oil rich states like Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan should once more be linked to Russia politically as well as economically.
Ukraine is going to become a vassal state, a rump from Kyiv west to Lviv and the rest will be part of Russia. A lot of people will needlessly die indirectly at the hands of Spetsnaz, the FSB, the CIA and the nationalist/fascist groups in Ukraine. A wonderous land with so many resources, a well educated and cultured people will be destroyed.
In memory of my kitty Seryozha 14.2.1996 ~ 13.9.2016 and Shadow 3.4.2015 - 16.4.21
A US administration, with a poor foreign policy track record, is playing with matches in the ammo bunker as it tries desperately to rekindle the cold war. Uncertantity in Ukraine is becoming an important influence on gold prices.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>A US administration, with a poor foreign policy track record, is playing with matches in the ammo bunker as it tries desperately to rekindle the cold war. Uncertantity in Ukraine is becoming an important influence on gold prices. >>
You think the US is trying to rekindle the Cold War? I think Putin is rekindling it, I mean the US was considering cutting back the Armed Forces now they will have no choice to dump more money into the Military Industrial Complex especially with this "Blue Navy" that Saor Alba is saying Russia is trying to achieve which is a joke if you ask me, I mean we already have 10 Aircraft Carriers, and 6 Fleets and Strike Groups, the United States Navy is the Boss of the Worlds Oceans period end of discussion.
<< <i>A US administration, with a poor foreign policy track record, is playing with matches in the ammo bunker as it tries desperately to rekindle the cold war. Uncertantity in Ukraine is becoming an important influence on gold prices. >>
You think the US is trying to rekindle the Cold War? I think Putin is rekindling it, I mean the US was considering cutting back the Armed Forces now they will have no choice to dump more money into the Military Industrial Complex especially with this "Blue Navy" that Saor Alba is saying Russia is trying to achieve which is a joke if you ask me, I mean we already have 10 Aircraft Carriers, and 6 Fleets and Strike Groups, the United States Navy is the Boss of the Worlds Oceans period end of discussion. >>
Your "Military Industrial Complex" needs a Cold War. Let us hope that it does not go Hot.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Comments
<< <i>Looks like there's some question about the pamphlets' authenticity and source:
Link >>
Thanks David. Always dangerous to believe anything from this administration without verification.
Interesting to see how it plays out.
<< <i>From Fox:
"""Secretary of State John Kerry confirmed Thursday a report that Jews in one restive Ukrainian city were sent notices telling them to register, a development he called "grotesque."
Kerry's comments follow a report in Israel's Ynet News that a leaflet was circulating in the eastern Ukrainian city of Donetsk, demanding that Jews register -- as well as provide a list of property they own -- or else face deportation and revocation of citizenship. Pro-Russian activists have asserted partial control over some government buildings in that city."""
Kerry should consider this as he unwisely attempts to weaken Israel. History has wound the clock back 75 years in a couple of months.
What makes that doubtful is where it is alleged to have been circulated. If that happened in the west, say Lviv - I might believe it. Svoboda Ukraina is the neo-fascist organisation in Ukraine that is believed to be anti-Semitic, and they are in the west. Svoboda has absolutely no following in the east.
It's all about the benjamins
<< <i> It's all about the benjamins
And preserving petrodollar status. History has shown that the economic battlefield leads to armed conflict. Let us hope that is not the case here.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Training for members of the Ukranian coup provided by Poland
more of the same
<< <i>This looks to be getting really ugly >>
Guns and butter economic policy has worked in the past.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
That must have Vladimir shaking.
How about a total import/export freeze, Barry?
<< <i>White House is considering targeted sanctions.
That must have Vladimir shaking.
How about a total import/export freeze, Barry? >>
History has demonstrated that sanctions are worthless. Europe does a lot more business with Russia than the USA does and they are not going to impose sanctions because of their need of Russian gas. The USA and Russia do billions of dollars in trade, but it is a drop in the bucket for both countries. As an example, the embargo against Cuba has had the opposite desired effect - keeps Castro in power because he gets lots of political propaganda value out of it.
The only thing that would really get Putin's attention is a big show of force. Obama, Merkel, Hollande have all ruled that out.
It is becoming a foregone conclusion that Ukraine is going to be greatly truncated by Russian aggression in the next few days or weeks.
<< <i> Europe does a lot more business with Russia than the USA does and they are not going to impose sanctions because of their need of Russian gas. >>
No pain, no gain.
If the Ukraine were in a vacuum than I suppose all is good and well in Europe, but clearly Putin has his sights on reestablishing the pre "tear down this wall" Soviet Union. So will the Eastern European nations be worth sacrificing Russian fuel to save? Is Merkel willing hand over East Germany to keep the energy flowing?
Some leadership is needed, but of course failure is not only an option with the Nato alliance, but often the first option.
Im nervous that this could eventually escalate into a more wider serious situation
My question is if the United States and Russian forces ever do engage in combat operations against each other does that automatically mean Nuclear warfare????
The new USSR will have to be stopped. It cannot satiate the lust for power with just Ukraine. There are Russian speaking minorities in Estonia, Latvia, Kazakhstan etc.
Nah. Putin is playing chess, while Merkel is playing checkers. Obama is playing tiddlywinks.
The days of Roosevelt, Churchill and AH are over.
Putin clearly sees the Gorbachev debacle as a massive humiliation, which can only be undone by a macho assertion of power. He calculates that the West has no stomach whatever to stand up to him with anything other than sanctions, which he likely has calculated he can weather by appealing to Russian nationalism, and by forging a stronger geopolitical and economic alliance with China.
Whether Putin serves the interests of the Russian people or not in the long run, my bet is that the man will 1) stay in power one way or another until his death or deposition, and 2) will continue to press the resolve of the West whenever and wherever he has an opportunity in terms of territorial expansion and influence around Russia's periphery, as long as he is in charge.
Our problem is that we come to this with disillusionment with our projections of power after the two longest wars in our history, and with allies with the most to lose in Europe, who are likely to be of meager help.
Keep stacking.
Here's a warning parable for coin collectors...
I don't know if JFK was willing to go head to head with the Soviets on the battlefield in 1962, but it was enough to cause Khrushchev to blink.
Now we are prepared to assert additional feeble and limited sanctions against Putin should he cross another DC created red line? Good grief.
I'm not trying to create any political animosity here, but I seem to recall Obama right before the last presidential election being recorded unbeknowst to him at the time. Essentially giving Putin what he wanted .... just Please, oh pretty please, don't do it until after I'm re-elected.
That pretty much sums up the future with Russia.
Obama's prioritys have nothing to do with Foriegn Affairs.
<< <i>
Obama's prioritys have nothing to do with Foriegn Affairs. >>
He fears Michelle, and leaves the foreign affairs to his Secret Service - quite a few of the agents were slapped around because of prostitute scandals in Colombia and some other countries.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>Why maintain a trillion dollar military with 7 or 8 carrier groups if we are unwilling to even project the idea of strength against Russia or China?
I don't know if JFK was willing to go head to head with the Soviets on the battlefield in 1962, but it was enough to cause Khrushchev to blink.
Now we are prepared to assert additional feeble and limited sanctions against Putin should he cross another DC created red line? Good grief. >>
The reason we have a trillion dollar military and all these carrier groups is simple, its to protect ourselves against China and Russia and everyone else who hates us, the military might of the United States is in place to keep order on a large scale, if you seriously think its a good idea to start dropping troops into Ukraine to form a shield against Russian aggression there then you are nuts and everyone else who thinks this would be a good idea is nuts as well.
Russia dropping military bases in Cuba would be reason to fight, them dropping military bases in a non Nato country who doesnt give a crap about us in eastern Europe is not reason to go to war. Obama knows this and that is why he is talking out of his butt about sanctions, he doesnt really care about how Poland feels either hence the reason he sent 600 troops there not 100,000.
If any of you think we should mobilize in Ukraine to fight Russia then you clearly dont have a brain in your head, Ukraine losing Crimea clearly has no effect on our National Security. Im not a fan of Obama but in this situation Im glad he is making these feeble sanctions. No offense to Saor Alba but I can honestly say I dont care what happens in Ukraine I care about our Men and Woman that would be giving up their blood to stop it, and the possibilty of a billion dead over a nuclear escalation.
<< <i>Why maintain a trillion dollar military with 7 or 8 carrier groups if we are unwilling to even project the idea of strength against Russia or China?
I don't know if JFK was willing to go head to head with the Soviets on the battlefield in 1962, but it was enough to cause Khrushchev to blink.
>>
Kennedy was the one who blinked. he gave up the missiles in Turkey and Italy. Google is friend...
<< <i>The reason we have a trillion dollar military and all these carrier groups is simple, its to protect ourselves against China and Russia and everyone else who hates us, the military might of the United States is in place to keep order on a large scale. . . >>
With all due respect, I gotta go with a two time Medal of Honor winner who disagrees with you.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
I don't think the military is there to protect us from russia and china . I think its there so the military industrial complex has customers for its garbage.
All that inflation all those taxes have been feeding that beast for 100 years. We would have some sort of universal health care and retirement if it weren't for all the money flowing to the military.
Lots of young men sent to their deaths by a few old cronies would be still alive and walking around too.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
So the foreigners have managed to single handedly cripple the Ukrainian economy. I have friends there that have funds socked in Swiss banks as well as some PM - when you have been through a couple of economic collapses before, ie 1992 and 2005-8 you learn quickly not to put the eggs in the local currency basket.
<< <i>
<< <i>Why maintain a trillion dollar military with 7 or 8 carrier groups if we are unwilling to even project the idea of strength against Russia or China?
I don't know if JFK was willing to go head to head with the Soviets on the battlefield in 1962, but it was enough to cause Khrushchev to blink.
>>
Kennedy was the one who blinked. he gave up the missiles in Turkey and Italy. Google is friend... >>
There have been a great many more instances in history that both powers conveniently covered up to their own citizens and the outside world. Some more, USSR VVS pilots were flying the North Korean and some Vietnamese jets during those wars. Did you know that Americans that were captured were turned over to the Soviets for interrogation and then they disappeared into the maelstrom that was the Gulag of the 1950s and 1960s? If the average Russian and American citizens knew how much their military forces were actually fighting each other and how close thermo-nuclear war actually was they would have been frightened.
<< <i>if you seriously think its a good idea to start dropping troops into Ukraine to form a shield against Russian aggression there then you are nuts and everyone else who thinks this would be a good idea is nuts as well. >>
Agreed. We cannot prosecute an efficient war in Iraq, let alone against a ruthless and well equipped Russia. But why roll over without at least the implied threat of military force. The White House has been to quick to nod and present worthless sanctions.
Quite likely this gets back to Obama and his "more flexibility" offer extended to Medvedev, directed to Putin.
<< <i>One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders. >>
But they do fund a 2.5 million + man army not to mention another 2.5 million reservists, a World leading power needs to have a strong military regardless of what they plan to do with it.
<< <i>
<< <i>One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders. >>
But they do fund a 2.5 million + man army not to mention another 2.5 million reservists, a World leading power needs to have a strong military regardless of what they plan to do with it. >>
Yes, China has a large Army, but the last time I checked, they still don't "walk on water," nor have they "learned to fly." Good for the defense of the "father land," but useless in an arena where massive amount of equipment for troop transportation is required. We can always sell them some Higgins Boats.
<< <i>
<< <i>One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders. >>
But they do fund a 2.5 million + man army not to mention another 2.5 million reservists, a World leading power needs to have a strong military regardless of what they plan to do with it. >>
China has a much larger "secret" budget for it's military. They are working on 5th and 6th gen fighter aircraft, are actively pursuing a blue water navy and are a much much bigger power player in the APAC region now. Just ask Taiwan, Japan, Philippines, and Vietnam what they think of China asserting itself internationally.
Re: Russia - brilliant plan, put Spetnaz forces in nondescript uniforms and have them stir up trouble in Crimea and now E. Ukraine. Obama may have read Putin as a pushover, but he is a tactician that gets the desired results. He knows he holds all the cards. He has the energy resources, he has a closeby large sized army group at the ready to roll. And most of all he has a weak willed US president as an adversary.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>One must also consider that China has near zero military installations outside of it's borders. >>
But they do fund a 2.5 million + man army not to mention another 2.5 million reservists, a World leading power needs to have a strong military regardless of what they plan to do with it. >>
China has a much larger "secret" budget for it's military. They are working on 5th and 6th gen fighter aircraft, are actively pursuing a blue water navy and are a much much bigger power player in the APAC region now. Just ask Taiwan, Japan, Philippines, and Vietnam what they think of China asserting itself internationally.
Re: Russia - brilliant plan, put Spetnaz forces in nondescript uniforms and have them stir up trouble in Crimea and now E. Ukraine. Obama may have read Putin as a pushover, but he is a tactician that gets the desired results. He knows he holds all the cards. He has the energy resources, he has a closeby large sized army group at the ready to roll. And most of all he has a weak willed US president as an adversary. >>
Yep China is upgrading their Air and Naval forces, the United States is funding the F-35 which is obviously a huge expense but they are keeping up with the "times" as far as advancing combat units, their Navy will never ever ever be strong enough to take our Navy on period end of discussion.
And Ukraine being a brilliant plan? How so? Its right on their border and basically as strong as Mexico in terms of military strength. Its a bully move nothing more nothing less, it would be like the United States taking a chunk of land from Mexico or Canada.
As far as Spetnaz and regular Army ripping the patches off their uniforms its a joke and obvious Putin knew the United States cant and wont interfere militarily speaking so Im at a loss trying to figure out what you mean by a brilliant plan, I think you are giving Putin too much credit.
Edit: I am the biggest offender in this thread for not keeping this PM related so I owe a PM subject, are we thinking this crisis will negativaly effect the stock market and drive up PM's?
<< <i>Edit: I am the biggest offender in this thread for not keeping this PM related so I owe a PM subject, are we thinking this crisis will negativaly effect the stock market and drive up PM's? >>
So far, it appears, to have the exact opposite affect.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>Edit: I am the biggest offender in this thread for not keeping this PM related so I owe a PM subject, are we thinking this crisis will negativaly effect the stock market and drive up PM's? >>
If Washington and Europe continue to keep their heads in the sand, Putin's annexation of Ukraine and beyond will continue to have little effects on the markets. Should one of the Paper Tigers roar and institute real and meaningful sanctions and penalties, the markets will get shaken up.
As it stands, the consequences imposed on Don Sterling far outstrip anything directed to Putin.
<< <i>As it stands, the consequences imposed on Don Sterling far outstrip anything directed to Putin. >>
Let us not forget the shoe thrower (who missed) who is sitting in jail with no bail (say she is a flight risk
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Brilliant to rely on the Russians for such an important task.
creating distractions
Bronco...I would have believed almost anything about Obama, but that he's a willing front and tool for the international Jewish banking cabal honestly hadn't occur to me.
Here's a warning parable for coin collectors...
<< <i>I'm so very sorry SaorAlba. I do wish your family well.
Bronco...I would have believed almost anything about Obama, but that he's a willing front and tool for the international Jewish banking cabal honestly hadn't occur to me.
Well the article has a nugget of truth to it , I think the financial sector is always excited by the prospect of war or two.
That being said , I intended to put a winkie face after the link
Far from standing down and being a so called "regional power" as insulted by Barack Obama, Russia is looking to expand it's borders and horizons. Russia has the material and financial wealth to sustain a military buildup and even absorbing parts of, if not all of other countries. The western media is putting on a show for the western audience trying to convince the public that Russia cannot sustain such adventures- but the truth is they do not understand the Russian mentality. The USSR crumbled into now 17 recognized and unrecognized individual states. A great majority of those new countries inherited a significant Russian population that has greater loyalties to Russia than their new states. Russia sees their position now as "bottom rail on top now" mentality - a factor no doubt helped along by the western media and their portrayal of so much negativity about Russia.
I do not like what Putin and Russia are doing, but I understand where they are coming from. Perhaps if some in the present US administration broadened their perspectives of events they would be better able to respond instead of offering up mediocre handslapping sanctions. Otherwise it will only be a matter of time before Russia makes another move to establish a territorial link to say the Kaliningrad enclave that is cut off from Russia by Belarus and Lithuania. Or they could decide that some of the oil rich states like Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan should once more be linked to Russia politically as well as economically.
Ukraine is going to become a vassal state, a rump from Kyiv west to Lviv and the rest will be part of Russia. A lot of people will needlessly die indirectly at the hands of Spetsnaz, the FSB, the CIA and the nationalist/fascist groups in Ukraine. A wonderous land with so many resources, a well educated and cultured people will be destroyed.
maybe the US could call its "advisers" back
I like this quote "The FBI agents are also helping the Kiev government fight organised crime, it added."
Maybe some of those spook types could return home to help fight organized crime on wall street?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>A US administration, with a poor foreign policy track record, is playing with matches in the ammo bunker as it tries desperately to rekindle the cold war. Uncertantity in Ukraine is becoming an important influence on gold prices. >>
You think the US is trying to rekindle the Cold War? I think Putin is rekindling it, I mean the US was considering cutting back the Armed Forces now they will have no choice to dump more money into the Military Industrial Complex especially with this "Blue Navy" that Saor Alba is saying Russia is trying to achieve which is a joke if you ask me, I mean we already have 10 Aircraft Carriers, and 6 Fleets and Strike Groups, the United States Navy is the Boss of the Worlds Oceans period end of discussion.
<< <i>
<< <i>A US administration, with a poor foreign policy track record, is playing with matches in the ammo bunker as it tries desperately to rekindle the cold war. Uncertantity in Ukraine is becoming an important influence on gold prices. >>
You think the US is trying to rekindle the Cold War? I think Putin is rekindling it, I mean the US was considering cutting back the Armed Forces now they will have no choice to dump more money into the Military Industrial Complex especially with this "Blue Navy" that Saor Alba is saying Russia is trying to achieve which is a joke if you ask me, I mean we already have 10 Aircraft Carriers, and 6 Fleets and Strike Groups, the United States Navy is the Boss of the Worlds Oceans period end of discussion. >>
"Washington is licking its chops"
Your "Military Industrial Complex" needs a Cold War. Let us hope that it does not go Hot.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Did the US instigate an overthrow of a newly-elected government? Probably.
Does Russia have strategic interests in the region. Yes.
Is Russia trying to expand its geographical reach. No doubt.
Is the US looking for another proxy war to support the Military Industrial Complex? Maybe so. It wouldn't be the first time.
Is Russia lilly-white in this matter? Not at all, but they don't like the US playing in their back yard, either.
From what I read, the IMF is complicit as well.
How do things get so screwed up in the world?
I don't know the answer, but I feel sorry for the Ukraine.
I knew it would happen.