<< <i>I think you are making a VERY big assumption...that these "stupid" dealers who got the coins graded sold all of them at cost to individuals....maybe, just maybe, they know what they are doing and sold the high grade coins at a major markup...
I don't think they would be allowes under the rules to do that but maybe the lawyers said otherwise. >>
They were able to come up with extend families with addresses to send the high grades out to. And have not sold or moved from there vaults yet.A review of the AP`s grades from the TPG`ers would be very interesting to see, not that anyone ever will.I wonder how many coins were graded in the experiment? 3300 with the lower grades sent out as bullion, the MID grades held for a future premium but had to be sent to clear the shelves to ready for 2011, The 69DMPL`s still in hiding waiting on the payoff. Sounds about right to bad we will never know.
I really wanted to hold but I do not have anymore MS69DMPL coins and really want to try and make a couple sets. I do have quite a few MS68DMPL so maybe I can complete a set of them. >>
Sold for buy it now price of $1950. >>
That didn't take long! Get it while the gettings good!
I feel your pain, Pink. I use a PO box for everything, including drivers license & checks. But on the instructions for the W9 they indicate no PO Boxes. So what am I supposed to do? Guess they don't need my biz.
"The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary."
I'm not going to complain to anyone about anything as far as these pucks go. These big mint bureaucratic nightmares are the very thing that builds my core collection. Instant rarity, now below spot, can buy from multiple sources, easy to flip, good chance of a home-run, yeh lets go fix that problem so it won't happen again ever.
<< <i>A nice graded set below melt. I really dont see the problem here. >>
I disagree.
<< <i>A lot of folks ordered just one set from other sellers and got a raw pile of junk. >>
And a lot of folks ordered from other sellers and got very nice pucks, too. Luck of the draw, but with other sellers everyone was on an equal basis. Amark, Fidelitrade, MTB come to mind where evidence of cherry picking does not rear its ugly head.
Problem is, there is a significant amount of circumstantial evidence that this AP has cherry picked it's allotment of pucks from the mint.
I didn't say it well before, but I'll be succinct now - I'd much rather take my chances to receive raw DMPL69s (or not) from an allotment that had not been closely examined and cherry picked, than receive slabbed coins where I have no chance of receiving a DMPL69 coin.
<< <i>While its a bit funky, you are getting great value. If anything, I'd send Jack a thank you note. >>
So whats going on with your DG order. I faxed and paid 2 Mondays ago. Got a shipping order the next day and nothing since. Is that shipping order confirmation of receipt of payment or is it like JH and sent to everyone who faxed a form?
My take on the whole 2010 ATB drama is that these APs would rather never deal with the public again. Honestly how many of you ever even heard of these guys before or even sniffed at their door to make a purchase - these guys deal in millions of dollars of bullion a year. What a bunch of wet noodles.
<< <i>So whats going on with your DG order. I faxed and paid 2 Mondays ago. Got a shipping order the next day and nothing since. Is that shipping order confirmation of receipt of payment or is it like JH and sent to everyone who faxed a form? >>
My DG came in today. What a small and insignificant box.
<< <i>My take on the whole 2010 ATB drama is that these APs would rather never deal with the public again. Honestly how many of you ever even heard of these guys before or even sniffed at their door to make a purchase - these guys deal in millions of dollars of bullion a year. What a bunch of wet noodles. >>
They do a lot of those sales with people like us We just didn't know who some of them were and are glad that we know who they are now.Probably won`t hurt there sales any but we can hope and deal with the ones that treated us fairly.
The winners were the ones that got 1 or 2--- 69 graded coins I bet no 69`s were DMPL. The ones that got ungraded (probably below 68 ) or the 68 sets were just screwed. Got to love the luck of the draw. These type games are closed down at the state fairs because they are not a game of chance you know RIGGED.
<< <i>For all of you who ordered from Jack hunt and received a raw set May I encourage you to leave a nice message with jack. leave them a note And than after your done with leaving jack a nice message may I again encourage you to call the u.s. mint legal dept and talk to those people.The Mint Office of Legal Council (no one was in, of course) but it is the correct office and number: 202-354-7280.Now I have fought since the beginning when ampex started with there high prices, I have forwarded all articles and called when the gold center took us all for a ride, THIS IS NO DIFFERENT! It has now been proven that Jack hunt has cherry picked the coins they were suppose to release to the public, they should not be allowed to order the new ones period. For those of you getting graded coins have you noticed there are NO 69 dmpl being sent out? So while I totally feel screwed over How do the rest of you feel knowing that THIS company is going to keep all the 69dmpl and send you the crap? Yes I am Ticked off, and such is life, But if by chance you feel the same than make the phone call today................................................ >>
All of the AP's orders that I have read state that you are buying bullion coins and possibly have some kind of defects. This seems to be what is delivered, some better than others. You are buying them under spot. What's the beef?? >>
It should have read you are buying BULLION ONLY there will be NO 69DMPL`s in any orders then we would have had a fair chance.
just got my JH set now. fedex delivered at 8:30 at night!?!?!? all are PCGS slabbed. not a 69 in the bunch. did they cherrypick? kinda looks like it. nobody here got any 69`s in slabbed coins. i submitted 2 sets a month ago and got 6 69`s, 1 68 and 3 67`s. seems odd nobody has received a 69 from them. on the other hand how can i complain when i got free plastic to protect my bullion.
Grand Canyon MS68 Yosemite MS68PL Mount Hood MS68DMPL Hot Springs MS68DMPL Yellowstone MS68DMPL
OK, so we got 125 pucks submitted and not one DMPL.
I see in the list from the link: MS68, MS68PL, MS68DM, MS 69, MS 69PL, MS 69DM and finally, some BU.
NO DMPL IN THE LIST. OUT OF 125 PUCKS.
Back on Monday April 18, 2011 2:45 PM Nurmaler posted -
Why/How do ppl keep making this mistake?.... THERE ISN'T SUCH A THING AS (A PLAIN) DM. DM = DMPL! Deep Mirrors are (by default) Proof Like.
Aron
Question - According to Aron's theory, all those MS68 and MS 69 DM are really DMPL. Has the puck grading criteria changed / evolved / morphed once again? Will we see no more DMPL pucks? :
<< <i>My son got his Fidelitrade set last week and it was terrible. The one I got from them about a month ago was very good. Makes me wonder if the sets they have left are the sets that have been sent back. Still a good deal if all you're looking for is to stack some silver. I was trying to put together a decent set but will fall short now. Just can't afford any more sets of these while looking down the barrel at the Mints 2010 set and the two 2011 sets. >>
I hope they are not down to rejects I need 2 DMPL`s to make a set The last 2 sets were almost all DMPL`s just 68`s instead of 69`s.If fidelatrade and JHCB are watching load me up with 69-DMPL`s and we will see about ordering some monster boxes . >>
I even offered to play there game but they didn`t care.
OK, so we got 125 pucks submitted and not one DMPL.
I see in the list from the link: MS68, MS68PL, MS68DM, MS 69, MS 69PL, MS 69DM and finally, some BU.
NO DMPL IN THE LIST. OUT OF 125 PUCKS.
Back on Monday April 18, 2011 2:45 PM Nurmaler posted -
Why/How do ppl keep making this mistake?.... THERE ISN'T SUCH A THING AS (A PLAIN) DM. DM = DMPL! Deep Mirrors are (by default) Proof Like.
Aron
Question - According to Aron's theory, all those MS68 and MS 69 DM are really DMPL. Has the puck grading criteria changed / evolved / morphed once again? Will we see no more DMPL pucks? : >>
Huh? DM=DMPL. Plain and simple. They may vary by abbreviation but they are THE SAME. No theory, it is what it is. That is not a change in the grading criteria at all.
Not supporting JackHunt at all but at least they seem smart enough to have bulk submitted for a minimum grade of a 68. Otherwise people would be receiving 67's, 66's or worse. I hope Apmex did the same. If I get the "better" part of PCGS BU or better, I would be just fine with 68 or better. The difference being though that with Apmex I believe we may have a chance at getting those 69's...fingers crossed!
Huh? DM=DMPL. Plain and simple. They may vary by abbreviation but they are THE SAME. No theory, it is what it is. That is not a change in the grading criteria at all. >>
Yes, I get it now. It says DM on the list and comes slabbed DMPL.
<< <i>I thought at APs ... were not allowed to have these "graded"... >>
There's nothing in the Mint guidelines prohibiting grading. It just wouldn't make any economic sense for an AP to do it because an AP can only charge their cost plus 10% and a reasonable shipping and handling charge. It's a mystery why JH is sending out graded coins.
<< <i>Not supporting JackHunt at all but at least they seem smart enough to have bulk submitted for a minimum grade of a 68. Otherwise people would be receiving 67's, 66's or worse. I hope Apmex did the same. If I get the "better" part of PCGS BU or better, I would be just fine with 68 or better. The difference being though that with Apmex I believe we may have a chance at getting those 69's...fingers crossed! >>
I think we may have gotten 67 and 66`s they were raw coins.
Your a better man than me Miles. I have nothing but disdain and envy for those folks that rcvd those. Unless of course the ones I got grade out with a few 69's. Have 3 JH sets. Actually waiting on acetone to get them all out but what I have seen have been DMPL.
So the only difference between these sets and the one I got from DG last week is that they are holdered? They are only a few dollars over spot right now, so still a good deal I guess. BTW, spot is pushing $46 right now.
As this is my first post, I'd like to thank everyone who has posted in this thread (not individually, as that would take about a year ). The information I garnered from reading this thread has helped me to purchase a few ATB sets!
<< <i>Prudential has got to be returning a large percentage of order forms for "errors." They are certainly not moving these things fast. >>
I spoke to what seemed like a very knowledgeable Prudential rep just yesterday, and he told me their rejection rate is running about 20%. He also told me that their supply of sets is getting very low. Anyone who's on the fence needs to decide quickly - and it's probably best to send in your app. via overnight shipping.
A few other things to consider for those who are still gonna send in their paperwork...
1. On the last page where the application form says "By:", your signature is required. 2. The address on all forms must match your driver's license AND your personal check. 3. Send in ALL pages of ALL forms - even the pages you don't have to fill out. 4. Later, you'll need to pay a separate $65 shipping fee in addition to your original check.
Finally, FWIW, he absolutely guaranteed me that none of the coins have been cherry-picked.
Comments
<< <i>I think you are making a VERY big assumption...that these "stupid" dealers who got the coins graded sold all of them at cost to individuals....maybe, just maybe, they know what they are doing and sold the high grade coins at a major markup...
I don't think they would be allowes under the rules to do that but maybe the lawyers said otherwise. >>
They were able to come up with extend families with addresses to send the high grades out to. And have not sold or moved from there vaults yet.A review of the AP`s grades from the TPG`ers would be very interesting to see, not that anyone ever will.I wonder how many coins were graded in the experiment? 3300 with the lower grades sent out as bullion, the MID grades held for a future premium but had to be sent to clear the shelves to ready for 2011, The 69DMPL`s still in hiding waiting on the payoff. Sounds about right to bad we will never know.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>With the Jack Hunt fiasco are we are about to see a lot of MS69DMPLs flood the market? >>
Doubt it. I would bet they did not grade but a few since it was an "experiment" and whatever they got is already reflected in the numbers. >>
Well I posted my PCGS MS69DMPL Yellowstone on ebay, what do you think this coin will be worth in 1 and 5 years from now?:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150594577309&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT#shId
I really wanted to hold but I do not have anymore MS69DMPL coins and really want to try and make a couple sets. I do have quite a few MS68DMPL so maybe I can complete a set of them. >>
Sold for buy it now price of $1950. >>
That didn't take long!
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
Well, guys, sorry to say I have some further Prudential advice.
I've moved a few times so my driver's license addy was different than the one I put on my W9.
REJECTED! Got the paperwork back in the mail today. Now I need to find an ID that has a good address. I really cannot believe it.
I feel your pain, Pink. I use a PO box for everything, including drivers license & checks. But on the instructions for the W9 they indicate no PO Boxes. So what am I supposed to do? Guess they don't need my biz.
"The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary."
~ Vince Lombardi
Grand Canyon pcgs fs ms68
Mt Hood pcgs fs ms68dmpl
Yellowstone pcgs fs gem bu
Yosemite pcgs fs gem bu
Hot Spring pcgs fs ms68dmpl
Looks like cherrypicking to me
Grand Canyon pcgs fs MS68
Mt Hood pcgs fs GEM BU
Yellowstone pcgs fs GEM BU
Yosemite pcgs fs MS69PL
Hot Spring pcgs fs MS68DMPL
Loves me some shiny!
A nice graded set below melt. I really dont see the problem here. A lot of folks ordered just one set from other sellers and got a raw pile of junk.
While its a bit funky, you are getting great value. If anything, I'd send Jack a thank you note.
<< <i>Looks like cherrypicking to me
A nice graded set below melt. I really dont see the problem here. A lot of folks ordered just one set from other sellers and got a raw pile of junk.
While its a bit funky, you are getting great value. If anything, I'd send Jack a thank you note. >>
Dear Jack Hunt,Thank you for taking the best coins and keeping them for yourself.
<< <i>Looks like cherrypicking to me
<< <i>A nice graded set below melt. I really dont see the problem here. >>
I disagree.
<< <i>A lot of folks ordered just one set from other sellers and got a raw pile of junk. >>
And a lot of folks ordered from other sellers and got very nice pucks, too. Luck of the draw, but with other sellers everyone was on an equal basis. Amark, Fidelitrade, MTB come to mind where evidence of cherry picking does not rear its ugly head.
Problem is, there is a significant amount of circumstantial evidence that this AP has cherry picked it's allotment of pucks from the mint.
I didn't say it well before, but I'll be succinct now - I'd much rather take my chances to receive raw DMPL69s (or not) from an allotment that had not been closely examined and cherry picked, than receive slabbed coins where I have no chance of receiving a DMPL69 coin.
<< <i>While its a bit funky, you are getting great value. If anything, I'd send Jack a thank you note. >>
Send JH a thank you. Now that is
http://www.pcgs.com/MEMBERSHIP/sharedorder.aspx?OrderNo=20487353
Lots of 68 and 69 DM.
**********************************************************
Thank you Miles for posting a link.
<< <i>So whats going on with your DG order. I faxed and paid 2 Mondays ago. Got a shipping order the next day and nothing since. Is that shipping order confirmation of receipt of payment or is it like JH and sent to everyone who faxed a form? >>
My DG came in today. What a small and insignificant box.
<< <i>My take on the whole 2010 ATB drama is that these APs would rather never deal with the public again. Honestly how many of you ever even heard of these guys before or even sniffed at their door to make a purchase - these guys deal in millions of dollars of bullion a year. What a bunch of wet noodles. >>
They do a lot of those sales with people like us We just didn't know who some of them were and are glad that we know who they are now.Probably won`t hurt there sales any but we can hope and deal with the ones that treated us fairly.
Yosemite 68 PL
Mt. Hood 68 PL
Yellowstone 68 DMPL
Hot Springs 68 DMPL
Grand Canyon MS 68
Grand Canyon PCGS MS68
Hot Springs PCGS MS68DMPL
Yellowstone PCGS MS68DMPL
Mt. Hood PCGS MS68PL
Yosemite PCGS MS68PL
Not bad
<< <i>
<< <i>For all of you who ordered from Jack hunt and received a raw set May I encourage you to leave a nice message with jack. leave them a note And than after your done with leaving jack a nice message may I again encourage you to call the u.s. mint legal dept and talk to those people.The Mint Office of Legal Council (no one was in, of course) but it is the correct office and number: 202-354-7280.Now I have fought since the beginning when ampex started with there high prices, I have forwarded all articles and called when the gold center took us all for a ride, THIS IS NO DIFFERENT! It has now been proven that Jack hunt has cherry picked the coins they were suppose to release to the public, they should not be allowed to order the new ones period. For those of you getting graded coins have you noticed there are NO 69 dmpl being sent out? So while I totally feel screwed over How do the rest of you feel knowing that THIS company is going to keep all the 69dmpl and send you the crap? Yes I am Ticked off, and such is life, But if by chance you feel the same than make the phone call today................................................
All of the AP's orders that I have read state that you are buying bullion coins and possibly have some kind of defects. This seems to be what is delivered, some better than others. You are buying them under spot. What's the beef?? >>
It should have read you are buying BULLION ONLY there will be NO 69DMPL`s in any orders then we would have had a fair chance.
Grand Canyon MS68
Yosemite MS68PL
Mount Hood MS68DMPL
Hot Springs MS68DMPL
Yellowstone MS68DMPL
<< <i>Was looking at my order. Saw this.
http://www.pcgs.com/MEMBERSHIP/sharedorder.aspx?OrderNo=20487353
Lots of 68 and 69 DM.
**********************************************************
Thank you Miles for posting a link. >>
<< <i>PCGS Linkage for the BIG Set. >>
OK, so we got 125 pucks submitted and not one DMPL.
I see in the list from the link: MS68, MS68PL, MS68DM, MS 69, MS 69PL, MS 69DM and finally, some BU.
NO DMPL IN THE LIST. OUT OF 125 PUCKS.
Back on Monday April 18, 2011 2:45 PM Nurmaler posted -
Why/How do ppl keep making this mistake?.... THERE ISN'T SUCH A THING AS (A PLAIN) DM. DM = DMPL! Deep Mirrors are (by default) Proof Like.
Aron
Question - According to Aron's theory, all those MS68 and MS 69 DM are really DMPL. Has the puck grading criteria changed / evolved / morphed once again? Will we see no more DMPL pucks? :
<< <i>
<< <i>My son got his Fidelitrade set last week and it was terrible. The one I got from them about a month ago was very good. Makes me wonder if the sets they have left are the sets that have been sent back. Still a good deal if all you're looking for is to stack some silver. I was trying to put together a decent set but will fall short now. Just can't afford any more sets of these while looking down the barrel at the Mints 2010 set and the two 2011 sets. >>
I hope they are not down to rejects I need 2 DMPL`s to make a set The last 2 sets were almost all DMPL`s just 68`s instead of 69`s.If fidelatrade and JHCB are watching load me up with 69-DMPL`s and we will see about ordering some monster boxes . >>
I even offered to play there game but they didn`t care.
<< <i>I reported yesterday receiving a Yosemite MS69 PL from Jack Hunt, Guess I got lucky. >>
my mistake. i guess a couple were sent out to us.
<< <i> I need 2 DMPL`s to make a set The last 2 sets were almost all DMPL`s just 68`s instead of 69`s >>
Crack 'em out and resubmit 'em.
BREAKING NEWS.....now a word from our sponsor...EAT MORE BEANS......OK now the news...DG has 155 NGC gem sets for sale.
<< <i>
<< <i>Was looking at my order. Saw this.
http://www.pcgs.com/MEMBERSHIP/sharedorder.aspx?OrderNo=20487353
Lots of 68 and 69 DM.
**********************************************************
Thank you Miles for posting a link. >>
<< <i>PCGS Linkage for the BIG Set. >>
OK, so we got 125 pucks submitted and not one DMPL.
I see in the list from the link: MS68, MS68PL, MS68DM, MS 69, MS 69PL, MS 69DM and finally, some BU.
NO DMPL IN THE LIST. OUT OF 125 PUCKS.
Back on Monday April 18, 2011 2:45 PM Nurmaler posted -
Why/How do ppl keep making this mistake?.... THERE ISN'T SUCH A THING AS (A PLAIN) DM. DM = DMPL! Deep Mirrors are (by default) Proof Like.
Aron
Question - According to Aron's theory, all those MS68 and MS 69 DM are really DMPL. Has the puck grading criteria changed / evolved / morphed once again? Will we see no more DMPL pucks? :
Huh? DM=DMPL. Plain and simple. They may vary by abbreviation but they are THE SAME.
No theory, it is what it is. That is not a change in the grading criteria at all.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
No theory, it is what it is. That is not a change in the grading criteria at all. >>
Yes, I get it now. It says DM on the list and comes slabbed DMPL.
69PL Yosemite
68dmpl Yelowstone
68dmpl Hot Springs
bu mt hood
bu grand canyon
<< <i>I thought at APs ... were not allowed to have these "graded"... >>
There's nothing in the Mint guidelines prohibiting grading. It just wouldn't make any economic sense for an AP to do it because an AP can only charge their cost plus 10% and a reasonable shipping and handling charge. It's a mystery why JH is sending out graded coins.
Kinda puts the BU A-Mark sets to shame...unless of course, ya crack em'.
Staying raw, staying real, staying below spot.....
Miles
<< <i>Not supporting JackHunt at all but at least they seem smart enough to have bulk submitted for a minimum grade of a 68. Otherwise people would be receiving 67's, 66's or worse. I hope Apmex did the same. If I get the "better" part of PCGS BU or better, I would be just fine with 68 or better. The difference being though that with Apmex I believe we may have a chance at getting those 69's...fingers crossed! >>
I think we may have gotten 67 and 66`s they were raw coins.
<< <i>Congrats to those that won the JH Late Entry Lottery!!
Kinda puts the BU A-Mark sets to shame...unless of course, ya crack em'.
Staying raw, staying real, staying below spot.....
Miles >>
I got 4-69`s out of each amark bu set after grading
<< <i>DOH!!
Well, guys, sorry to say I have some further Prudential advice.
I've moved a few times so my driver's license addy was different than the one I put on my W9.
REJECTED! Got the paperwork back in the mail today. Now I need to find an ID that has a good address. I really cannot believe it. >>
That blows. My ID doesn't match my shipping address either.
<< <i>Congrats to those that won the JH Late Entry Lottery!!
Kinda puts the BU A-Mark sets to shame...unless of course, ya crack em'.
Staying raw, staying real, staying below spot.....
Miles >>
Your a better man than me Miles. I have nothing but disdain and envy for those folks that rcvd those. Unless of course the ones I got grade out with a few 69's. Have 3 JH sets. Actually waiting on acetone to get them all out but what I have seen have been DMPL.
<< <i>
<< <i>DOH!!
Well, guys, sorry to say I have some further Prudential advice.
I've moved a few times so my driver's license addy was different than the one I put on my W9.
REJECTED! Got the paperwork back in the mail today. Now I need to find an ID that has a good address. I really cannot believe it. >>
That blows. My ID doesn't match my shipping address either. >>
Prudential has got to be returning a large percentage of order forms for "errors." They are certainly not moving these things fast.
<< <i>You guys keep comparing your JH slabs.
BREAKING NEWS.....now a word from our sponsor...EAT MORE BEANS......OK now the news...DG has 155 NGC gem sets for sale. >>
So the only difference between these sets and the one I got from DG last week is that they are holdered? They are only a few dollars over spot right now, so still a good deal I guess. BTW, spot is pushing $46 right now.
Cheers!
Bob
Vietnam Vet 1968-1969
If you do not have their correct address and everything that Prudential wants, you better get it corrected before sending them in or you will
miss out on your final chance to win the lottery on these things as future coins will be going through the roof. I wish I had not had to sell those
last 2 sets to buy the 2 that I have coming.
$1159 is too high boys......the $930 to $974 range is appropriate.
They are prohibitied to sell any sets (even re-sale) outside of the purchase price +10% rules +reasonable shipping
<< <i>Prudential has got to be returning a large percentage of order forms for "errors." They are certainly not moving these things fast. >>
I spoke to what seemed like a very knowledgeable Prudential rep just yesterday, and he told me their rejection rate is running about 20%. He also told me that their supply of sets is getting very low. Anyone who's on the fence needs to decide quickly - and it's probably best to send in your app. via overnight shipping.
A few other things to consider for those who are still gonna send in their paperwork...
1. On the last page where the application form says "By:", your signature is required.
2. The address on all forms must match your driver's license AND your personal check.
3. Send in ALL pages of ALL forms - even the pages you don't have to fill out.
4. Later, you'll need to pay a separate $65 shipping fee in addition to your original check.
Finally, FWIW, he absolutely guaranteed me that none of the coins have been cherry-picked.