@derryb said:
Just a matter of time before "sale" prices are higher than current regular prices. That's how inflation works.
I wish I could say the same about PM's
like too many here, you focus on the short to intermediate performance hoping for a good return on something that should not be purchased as an investment.
Step back and compare prices over the long term. PMs are a one of a few good ways to protect from dollar destruction.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
So a month ago or so I said the publix had 12ers of cokes/sodas for 6....went in today, almost 7 but buy 2 get one so figure that math......
If you're not in a position to splurge on 3 that's the rub. Tax makes it 5 almost, still way high...and I work for ko. Sub 3 for 12 was just last year on the regular pre covi crap.
"Prices in the economy are acting a bit like a boxer would do after taking a right hand from Mike Tyson. Staggering from one side of the ring to the other before finally recovering and standing upright again. Or, do they simply go to the mat? After the supply-side and demand-side shock that World War C created, prices will find their natural equilibrium as they always do."
And food prices? I believe they will not only stick, but continue to rise.
Prices of all goods and services will overshoot then drop but create a higher floor. Just as silver went from 4 to 50 then crashed and established a floor in the teens.
That’s because of the Hunt Brothers trying to corner the silver market.
If they hadn’t done that silver never would’ve gotten anywhere near $50.
Hunt brother silver spike was a man-made anomaly. Once should not trend it into normal price activity. However, it did expose the sensitivity of price discovery in a true supply and demand market. Won't see that again for quite a while.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
@derryb said:
Hunt brother silver spike was a man-made anomaly. Once should not trend it into normal price activity. However, it did expose the sensitivity of price discovery in a true supply and demand market. Won't see that again for quite a while.
Just like the current silver "shortage" man (covid) made anomaly. Premiums dropping like a rock. Nothing to do with a few reddit kids living in mom and pops basement. lol
@derryb said:
Hunt brother silver spike was a man-made anomaly. Once should not trend it into normal price activity. However, it did expose the sensitivity of price discovery in a true supply and demand market. Won't see that again for quite a while.
Just like the current silver "shortage" man (covid) made anomaly. Premiums dropping like a rock. Nothing to do with a few reddit kids living in mom and pops basement. lol
and you continue to confuse premiums with prices. lol
Back in May [the OP of this thread documented an APMEX random year ASE] [https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1056803/silver-spot-vs-premium-tracking-thread/p1) over spot. Today that same APMEX ASE has a premium of 41% which drops to 37% when taking advantage of their current $1 off sale. Premiums are not dropping like a rock. They are simply pulling back a wee bit as demand decreases. The reason demand has decreased is that the controllers of the spot price have determined they want a new current low spot price. I'm gonna peg it at $21 for now. When spot rises keep an eye on the those "rock falling" premiums. lol
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
"Prices in the economy are acting a bit like a boxer would do after taking a right hand from Mike Tyson. Staggering from one side of the ring to the other before finally recovering and standing upright again. Or, do they simply go to the mat? After the supply-side and demand-side shock that World War C created, prices will find their natural equilibrium as they always do."
And food prices? I believe they will not only stick, but continue to rise.
Prices of all goods and services will overshoot then drop but create a higher floor. Just as silver went from 4 to 50 then crashed and established a floor in the teens.
That’s because of the Hunt Brothers trying to corner the silver market.
If they hadn’t done that silver never would’ve gotten anywhere near $50.
@derryb said:
Just a matter of time before "sale" prices are higher than current regular prices. That's how inflation works.
I wish I could say the same about PM's
like too many here, you focus on the short to intermediate performance hoping for a good return on something that should not be purchased as an investment.
Step back and compare prices over the long term. PMs are a one of a few good ways to protect from dollar destruction.
If the dollar is destroyed, your "Insurance Policy" of PM's will not save you. Land, crops and staple items will or a migration to Mars.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
@derryb said:
Just a matter of time before "sale" prices are higher than current regular prices. That's how inflation works.
I wish I could say the same about PM's
like too many here, you focus on the short to intermediate performance hoping for a good return on something that should not be purchased as an investment.
Step back and compare prices over the long term. PMs are a one of a few good ways to protect from dollar destruction.
If the dollar is destroyed, your "Insurance Policy" of PM's will not save you. Land, crops and staple items will or a migration to Mars.
you keep assuming that dollar destruction is limited to a complete wipe out of the dollar; it is not. It includes the current and past baby step devaluations that are constantly reducing its value effectively cutting your paycheck. The FED has purposely made it a slow, stealth process, not a main event.
Like so many others you have been conditioned by your central bank to accept this slow destruction as normal. There is no valid reason why your dollar should purchase less each year. A mandate of 2% annual inflation is not acceptable. Looking at what it has done to purchasing power over the long term makes it simple to project future dollar value - it will continue to buy less as real wages continue to fail to follow pace.
The wise will protect this slowly but surely declining future value with the best insurance policies they can find. PMs are one proven method.
It's really simple: to protect one's extra cash holdings, simply convert them to PMs until the dollars are actually needed.
How's that savings account and it's interest working out for ya. Hope you realize you are losing money with it. lol
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
"How's that savings account and it's interest working out for ya. Hope you realize you are losing money with it. lol"
Might not be as good as your PM IRA, but it lets me sleep at night. Keep pushing your PM propaganda like you have for the last 10+ years, with luck, you might get a convert, but I'm not one.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
@OPA said:
"How's that savings account and it's interest working out for ya. Hope you realize you are losing money with it. lol"
Might not be as good as your PM IRA, but it lets me sleep at night. Keep pushing your PM propaganda like you have for the last 10+ years, with luck, you might get a convert, but I'm not one.
comment about the savings account is to offer proof (and not be once again accused of conspiracy theory) of what the FED is doing to the dollar. Sounds like you disagree that the FED is slowly destroying your dollars. So many cannot see the forest because of the trees. Wake up. lol
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Entropy is a scapegoat for poor money management. It's no different than saying "$hit happens." Like a warehouse full of goods whose value should be protected by its producer, money, including that under the mattress, should be protected as a store of value by its issuing central bank. Such protection however, requires restraint and fiscal responsibility, characteristics that go against the grain of the FED's hidden mandates. Decay is too easily accepted when it comes to money, especially when there is no real reason, other than mismanagement, to have such decay.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
@OPA said:
"How's that savings account and it's interest working out for ya. Hope you realize you are losing money with it. lol"
Might not be as good as your PM IRA, but it lets me sleep at night. Keep pushing your PM propaganda like you have for the last 10+ years, with luck, you might get a convert, but I'm not one.
comment about the savings account is to offer proof (and not be once again accused of conspiracy theory) of what the FED is doing to the dollar. Sounds like you disagree that the FED is slowly destroying your dollars. So many cannot see the forest because of the trees. Wake up. lol
The Utopian world that you enlighten does not exist. There is not one currency in the world, that has retained the same buying power that it did 10 years ago. Inflation is a fact of life and has been since currency became into existence. Blaming the Fed. is shortsighted ( I suppose we all need a scapegoat) ... Now if you blamed humanity with it's inherent needs, wants and greed's, I'd agree with you.
edited to correct lousy grammar
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
There is not one currency in the world, that has retained the same buying power that it did 10 years ago. Inflation is a fact of life and has been since currency became into existence.
Then you're gonna just love Modern Money Theory.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Ordering a couple hundred more ounces of silver. It's like that bin at the grocery store selling moldy cheese and bread for pennies, cause it's shelf life is expiring. Gotta love it.
Penicillin from the moldy bread, anti- bacterial product forever with silver.
@jmski52 said: Enough inflation will reduce the size of the national debt
How does money creation by the issuance of more debt reduce the size of the national debt?
It reduces the size relative to GDP. We never paid back most of what we borrowed to fund WW 2, a HUGE amount relative to GDP at the time, that amount is now insignificant.
agree. think of it in terms of earlier years' cheap mortgages that now costs a fortune. Thanks to inflation time waters down debt. Unpaid government debt benefits from this.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
This is a crazy statement. Money creation doesn't reduce the size of the debt relative to anything.
Money creation increases the debt. It's a direct relationship, and It's not that difficult to understand.
Increased debt isn't directly related to GDP, but it has been shown that increasing levels of debt have an increasingly diminished impact on economic growth as more and more debt is issued.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
it is how central banks work. Creating new money causes inflation.
Well, at least you have that part almost right, except that creating new money IS inflation, it doesn't "cause" inflation.
The amount paid in interest one the national debt is lower than the inflation rate.
Only as long as the Fed keeps pumping out $Trillions in free money for their "select" clientele, and that's only as long as it takes before the inflation numbers flare up, like right now. Stay tuned, it's happening now.
If there were a balanced budget the relative size of the nation debt vs GDP would get smaller and smaller over time.
This is where you lack understanding. How Keynesian of you. "If" is only a hypothetical, not the current reality. There is no balanced budget, and there is no reduction in the debt to GDP ratio.
The minute they stop creating more and more $Trillions is the minute that you will see the stock & bond markets drop precipitously and you will get to experience what happens when a government and its banking system is "BadWithMoney". Que sera, sera.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
Well, at least you have that part almost right, except that creating new money IS inflation, it doesn't "cause" inflation.
No. it is not. Inflation is when prices rise, printing money does not automatically cause prices to rise. They printed a ton of money after the 2009 meltdown and prices did not rise.
In economic circles inflation refers to an increase in the money supply, normally resulting in price inflation. The word "inflation" is often used to refer to "price inflation."
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
In economic circles inflation refers to an increase in the money supply, normally resulting in price inflation. The word "inflation" is often used to refer to "price inflation."
Inflation is a general, sustained upward movement of prices for goods and services in an economy.
:
Economists say that inflation is caused by “too much money chasing too few goods.” What does this mean?
Well, when people have money, they tend to spend it. And the more money people have, the more they tend to spend. As a result, if the money supply increases too quickly, the supply of good and services might not keep up with what people want to buy. So, prices are pushed higher as people compete to buy goods and services.
As such, how much money is available for spending—the money supply—affects the level of spending—and inflation—in the economy. That is what “too much money chasing too few goods” means.
Economists say that inflation is caused by “too much money chasing too few goods.” What does this mean?
Imagine a coin auction where all the bidders just got an injection that doubled their spending funds. Guess what that would do to the prices realized.
millionaires and billionaires have their stopping point. they don't necessarily win at all costs.
I've bid in auctions, I don't pay 10% more because I have 10% more money or because I've got a wad of cash.
You miss the point: if all of the competing bidders had 10% more money, you would pay more or you would not win the auction. This is how an increase in the supply of money increases prices. More money chasing the same amount of goods. Stock market in recent years is a perfect example.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
@MsMorrisine said:
increase in money supply Might increase inflation
Increase in money supply Might normally leads to price inflation. When the increase in money gets into the hands of consumers they spend. In the face of price inflation there is little incentive to save.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Housing would suggest an infusion of cash (and artificially low interest rate) leads to some fairly healthy inflation. Of course to some this is a 'let them eat cake' moment...
Almost 20 years later and we're still debating the meaning of words like Money and Inflation!
Stick around BWM, the more things change, the more they stay the same. Many of us have tried and tried long ago, occasionally old threads with many of us in Rare Form will rise to be updated... many sentences and paragraphs on these subjects from a wide variety of viewpoints....
OMG, why am I even bothering with this? Are you people just being deliberately obtuse? it's like trying to discuss something with a 5 year old.
Interesting personal remark. The question is, why are you arguing at all? But since you asked.......
Inflation is when prices rise,
Not exactly. But, I'll leave you to figure it our for yourself.
printing money does not automatically cause prices to rise.
Nobody said it does, in 2008 there was a specific reason that money creation didn't cause a rise in prices, but again.....you can figure it for yourself.
Your thinking refers only to hypotheticals, and that's what Keynesians are selling you.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
printing money does not automatically cause prices to rise.
Nobody said it does,
Yes, they did, that was what I was responding too.
Here is exactly what was said earlier:
"Increase in money supply normally leads to price inflation. When the increase in money gets into the hands of consumers they spend. In the face of price inflation there is little incentive to save."
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Historically, the US bond market is used to predict inflation/deflation. Apparently our economic guru leaders continue to rely on it, particularly the 10 year note because the average economic cycle lasts for 10 years. Unfortunately the 10 year bond is no longer reliable as an inflation barometer. Why, because the FED has cornered the market in these bonds by owning 60% of them. The 10 year no longer predicts anything except FED activity as the FED continues to buy 120B in bonds each month. Keep in mind that this is nothing short of 120B a month in QE.
As the "manipulated" bond market is no longer reliable for monitoring inflation, expect inflation to catch the "inflation fighters" with their pants down.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Comments
like too many here, you focus on the short to intermediate performance hoping for a good return on something that should not be purchased as an investment.
Step back and compare prices over the long term. PMs are a one of a few good ways to protect from dollar destruction.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
So a month ago or so I said the publix had 12ers of cokes/sodas for 6....went in today, almost 7 but buy 2 get one so figure that math......
If you're not in a position to splurge on 3 that's the rub. Tax makes it 5 almost, still way high...and I work for ko. Sub 3 for 12 was just last year on the regular pre covi crap.
That’s because of the Hunt Brothers trying to corner the silver market.
If they hadn’t done that silver never would’ve gotten anywhere near $50.
Hunt brother silver spike was a man-made anomaly. Once should not trend it into normal price activity. However, it did expose the sensitivity of price discovery in a true supply and demand market. Won't see that again for quite a while.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Just like the current silver "shortage" man (covid) made anomaly. Premiums dropping like a rock. Nothing to do with a few reddit kids living in mom and pops basement. lol
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
and you continue to confuse premiums with prices. lol
Back in May [the OP of this thread documented an APMEX random year ASE] [https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1056803/silver-spot-vs-premium-tracking-thread/p1) over spot. Today that same APMEX ASE has a premium of 41% which drops to 37% when taking advantage of their current $1 off sale. Premiums are not dropping like a rock. They are simply pulling back a wee bit as demand decreases. The reason demand has decreased is that the controllers of the spot price have determined they want a new current low spot price. I'm gonna peg it at $21 for now. When spot rises keep an eye on the those "rock falling" premiums. lol
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Inflation? Think of it as a pay cut, courtesy of your central bank.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
From 2002 to 2011?
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
If the dollar is destroyed, your "Insurance Policy" of PM's will not save you. Land, crops and staple items will or a migration to Mars.
you keep assuming that dollar destruction is limited to a complete wipe out of the dollar; it is not. It includes the current and past baby step devaluations that are constantly reducing its value effectively cutting your paycheck. The FED has purposely made it a slow, stealth process, not a main event.
Like so many others you have been conditioned by your central bank to accept this slow destruction as normal. There is no valid reason why your dollar should purchase less each year. A mandate of 2% annual inflation is not acceptable. Looking at what it has done to purchasing power over the long term makes it simple to project future dollar value - it will continue to buy less as real wages continue to fail to follow pace.
The wise will protect this slowly but surely declining future value with the best insurance policies they can find. PMs are one proven method.
It's really simple: to protect one's extra cash holdings, simply convert them to PMs until the dollars are actually needed.
How's that savings account and it's interest working out for ya. Hope you realize you are losing money with it. lol
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
"How's that savings account and it's interest working out for ya. Hope you realize you are losing money with it. lol"
Might not be as good as your PM IRA, but it lets me sleep at night. Keep pushing your PM propaganda like you have for the last 10+ years, with luck, you might get a convert, but I'm not one.
comment about the savings account is to offer proof (and not be once again accused of conspiracy theory) of what the FED is doing to the dollar. Sounds like you disagree that the FED is slowly destroying your dollars. So many cannot see the forest because of the trees. Wake up. lol
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Entropy is a scapegoat for poor money management. It's no different than saying "$hit happens." Like a warehouse full of goods whose value should be protected by its producer, money, including that under the mattress, should be protected as a store of value by its issuing central bank. Such protection however, requires restraint and fiscal responsibility, characteristics that go against the grain of the FED's hidden mandates. Decay is too easily accepted when it comes to money, especially when there is no real reason, other than mismanagement, to have such decay.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
The Utopian world that you enlighten does not exist. There is not one currency in the world, that has retained the same buying power that it did 10 years ago. Inflation is a fact of life and has been since currency became into existence. Blaming the Fed. is shortsighted ( I suppose we all need a scapegoat) ... Now if you blamed humanity with it's inherent needs, wants and greed's, I'd agree with you.
edited to correct lousy grammar
Then you're gonna just love Modern Money Theory.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Ordering a couple hundred more ounces of silver. It's like that bin at the grocery store selling moldy cheese and bread for pennies, cause it's shelf life is expiring. Gotta love it.
Penicillin from the moldy bread, anti- bacterial product forever with silver.
Enough inflation will reduce the size of the national debt
How does money creation by the issuance of more debt reduce the size of the national debt?
I knew it would happen.
Every Monday since 2020 I buy the organic chicken for my Wife. $10.99 last year , now $14.99.
100% Positive BST transactions
agree. think of it in terms of earlier years' cheap mortgages that now costs a fortune. Thanks to inflation time waters down debt. Unpaid government debt benefits from this.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
It reduces the size relative to GDP.
This is a crazy statement. Money creation doesn't reduce the size of the debt relative to anything.
Money creation increases the debt. It's a direct relationship, and It's not that difficult to understand.
Increased debt isn't directly related to GDP, but it has been shown that increasing levels of debt have an increasingly diminished impact on economic growth as more and more debt is issued.
I knew it would happen.
it is how central banks work. Creating new money causes inflation.
Well, at least you have that part almost right, except that creating new money IS inflation, it doesn't "cause" inflation.
The amount paid in interest one the national debt is lower than the inflation rate.
Only as long as the Fed keeps pumping out $Trillions in free money for their "select" clientele, and that's only as long as it takes before the inflation numbers flare up, like right now. Stay tuned, it's happening now.
If there were a balanced budget the relative size of the nation debt vs GDP would get smaller and smaller over time.
This is where you lack understanding. How Keynesian of you. "If" is only a hypothetical, not the current reality. There is no balanced budget, and there is no reduction in the debt to GDP ratio.
The minute they stop creating more and more $Trillions is the minute that you will see the stock & bond markets drop precipitously and you will get to experience what happens when a government and its banking system is "BadWithMoney". Que sera, sera.
I knew it would happen.
In economic circles inflation refers to an increase in the money supply, normally resulting in price inflation. The word "inflation" is often used to refer to "price inflation."
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
There are a variety of people here.
Feel free to discuss or argue with those as you see fit.
or you could do like some and argue with yourself.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
https://www.stlouisfed.org/education/economic-lowdown-video-series/episode-9-inflation
Inflation is a general, sustained upward movement of prices for goods and services in an economy.
:
Economists say that inflation is caused by “too much money chasing too few goods.” What does this mean?
Well, when people have money, they tend to spend it. And the more money people have, the more they tend to spend. As a result, if the money supply increases too quickly, the supply of good and services might not keep up with what people want to buy. So, prices are pushed higher as people compete to buy goods and services.
As such, how much money is available for spending—the money supply—affects the level of spending—and inflation—in the economy. That is what “too much money chasing too few goods” means.
Imagine a coin auction where all the bidders just got an injection that doubled their spending funds. Guess what that would do to the prices realized.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
increase in money supply Might increase inflation
as pointed out, during the great recession the increase in money supply didn't cause inflation
and
by the text above inflation in price increases, not money supply increases.
millionaires and billionaires have their stopping point. they don't necessarily win at all costs.
I've bid in auctions, I don't pay 10% more because I have 10% more money or because I've got a wad of cash.
You miss the point: if all of the competing bidders had 10% more money, you would pay more or you would not win the auction. This is how an increase in the supply of money increases prices. More money chasing the same amount of goods. Stock market in recent years is a perfect example.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
I don’t think that is necessarily true
Increase in money supply Might normally leads to price inflation. When the increase in money gets into the hands of consumers they spend. In the face of price inflation there is little incentive to save.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
one cannot tell you how to think, only give you the info to process.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Housing would suggest an infusion of cash (and artificially low interest rate) leads to some fairly healthy inflation. Of course to some this is a 'let them eat cake' moment...
nah
stick around and enjoy the many flavors this place has.
we also have some usefulness too.
Almost 20 years later and we're still debating the meaning of words like Money and Inflation!
Stick around BWM, the more things change, the more they stay the same. Many of us have tried and tried long ago, occasionally old threads with many of us in Rare Form will rise to be updated... many sentences and paragraphs on these subjects from a wide variety of viewpoints....
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
OMG, why am I even bothering with this? Are you people just being deliberately obtuse? it's like trying to discuss something with a 5 year old.
Interesting personal remark. The question is, why are you arguing at all? But since you asked.......
Inflation is when prices rise,
Not exactly. But, I'll leave you to figure it our for yourself.
printing money does not automatically cause prices to rise.
Nobody said it does, in 2008 there was a specific reason that money creation didn't cause a rise in prices, but again.....you can figure it for yourself.
Your thinking refers only to hypotheticals, and that's what Keynesians are selling you.
I knew it would happen.
Indeed BWM. Stick around. This forum is very entertaining and rife with pseudo-altruistic and hypocritical comment.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Here is exactly what was said earlier:
"Increase in money supply normally leads to price inflation. When the increase in money gets into the hands of consumers they spend. In the face of price inflation there is little incentive to save."
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Historically, the US bond market is used to predict inflation/deflation. Apparently our economic guru leaders continue to rely on it, particularly the 10 year note because the average economic cycle lasts for 10 years. Unfortunately the 10 year bond is no longer reliable as an inflation barometer. Why, because the FED has cornered the market in these bonds by owning 60% of them. The 10 year no longer predicts anything except FED activity as the FED continues to buy 120B in bonds each month. Keep in mind that this is nothing short of 120B a month in QE.
As the "manipulated" bond market is no longer reliable for monitoring inflation, expect inflation to catch the "inflation fighters" with their pants down.
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Inflation, the hidden tax - Shrinkflation, the hidden inflation
Keep an open mind, or get financially repressed -Zoltan Pozsar
Shrinkflation-
Why we need to track price per ounce etc on stuff for inflation reports