I have seen my Seated dime set drop as lesser coins get upgraded and former top pop coins are now not top pop.
I am just waiting for PCGS to grade another seated dime a MS-69. At least I will have the only one in an old green holder and at that being 1845-O that shouldn’t even exist.
One coin for sure I sold which was a recolored coin I now see was just upgraded. It should not even be in a holder at all which is why I sold it. It changed color in the holder after I bought it.
Certain coins would require him to buy whole sets to get and with most of his sets done I don’t know if he is buying sets to get to certain pieces but I sure am glad I bought so many coins from the Gardner and Simpson collections when I did. Even buying the the top pop 57-S quarter just for the box of 30 and lone 1864 PCGS/CAC 66 Dcam PF half dime. I guess now I know who was offering 10k for that one.
Ironically when I emailed him to offer a coin he needed that was a duplicate I never heard back. It must be a blast collecting everything you see. I hope PGCS doesn’t mess up everything helping him boost the graded of his coins. In my mind I won’t downgrade any coin that I feel is properly graded. I actually will lose the #1 spot in one category because I am not taking a downgrade on my Eliasberg/ Kaufman 1852 proof dime in 67. If I did I would have stayed at #1. The point is still coins first, holders and awards are great but coins Gardner didn’t take downgrades on many pieces that did CAC. Some that didn’t cross then now are upgraded.
The 1852-O dime was graded a 66 in the Eliasberg sale, graded MS65 long ago by NGC and CAC green added for the sale. Tried to cross it as it would be the finest known, they won’t because it dark but not only a high end 65 but borderline 66. Why take a downgrade?
Numerical grades are one part of a larger puzzle. There are many great coins still yet to make it into PGCS holders and many in PCGS holders that would never CAC. Such is collecting.
I seldom check PM's but do check emails often jason@seated.org
Buying top quality Seated Dimes in Gem BU and Proof.
@mrearlygold said:
How far back in time is this collection going?
1792-Present...
John Brush President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com email: John@davidlawrence.com 2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
Ironically when I emailed him to offer a coin he needed that was a duplicate I never heard back.
Sorry to hear this! Dell Loy isn't an email kind of guy, so most messages don't get read...I've only received one email from him myself in over a year of working with him...feel free to offer anything for him to me directly and if it fits the collection, we'll try to make the process a bit shorter and easier...
Thanks!
John Brush President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com email: John@davidlawrence.com 2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
@Currin said:
Hi John,
Does the collection have many CACs that is not denoted by comments?
Yes, a ton. We're in the process (a LONG process) of organizing the sets further. Sometimes CAC was typed in when the coin was added to the registry, but often not. A number of the coins have never been to CAC either...
We hope to get that all updated in the next few months.
John Brush President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com email: John@davidlawrence.com 2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
New Addition to D.L Hansen U S Coins Complete with Major Varieties (CS)
This is what I believe to be an unappreciated copper variety that was filled by a really high grade coin. The hole could have been filled by an above average coin rather that a $100k brown copper. I think this validates what John Bush has been telling us. If a coin comes on the market, and the price is fair, that DLH is interested.
If you are a copper guy, I believe you would love to have this 1814 1C Crosslet 4, Brown MS66 in your top notch collection. This is the finest brown coin graded by PCGS (1/0). This coin has no history except according to Coin Facts there a MS66BN estimated graded coin, that I assuming to a NGC 67. Maybe DLH crossed to over to PCGS and lost a point. That is all I know for now.
There is another 1814 1C Crosslet 4, Red-Brown MS65+ coin. I don’t really know how PCGS determines the finest overall, but I believe they give a bonus point for RB that qualifies the RB as the finest. This coin is tightly held in the PCGS Set Registry Set of “High Desert” Collection, according to Coin Facts. This makes DLH’s coin overall POP as a 1/1.
Provenance: None that can be found.
1814 1C Crosslet 4, Brown MS66 Brown (CAC status is unknown)
So it was cracked and upgraded and it lost the cac. Happens all the time.
it’s criminal and borders on fraud. Dozens of people make a good living doing this.
Look at the post by seated dime. Many of his former top pops are no longer.
It’s a disgrace. Technology exists to photograph a coin so it cannot be graded again.
CAC will continue to get stronger. The sad thing is that the CAC pops are off my maybe twenty per cent. The nicest coins with the best chance to upgrade are CAC so they get cracked. Many of the crack out people do not send the tag back to CAC when they get an upgrade. Hence bad pops.
Buy cac and not the holder! Sure I could upgrade a certain amount,of my gem CAC coins and they,might
be worth a few, million more but I,would never consider that.
The cent IS beautiful regardless of the true grade. Nice buy by DLH But the CAC pop,is two. Maybe it should really be one?
I predict one day DLH will get fed up and buy mostly CAC. Many top,collectors do this.
Most people besides myself and Laura do not speak up about grading and CAC.
Laura sells the finest coins, almost all CAC. If you read her reports you will see that the way to build a top collection is to,buy the best and pay the price, She is correct. I have purchased many coins from her over the years and without a doubt the quality is superb.
There are few deals when buying the best coins. I,pay the price.
There,is no question that is almost all cases I,would rather,own a beautiful 66 Cac that i,paid
All the money for,than 67 that seems like a deal with no CAC.
@Perfection said:
** So it was cracked and upgraded and it lost the cac. Happens all the time. it’s criminal and borders on fraud.** Dozens of people make a good living doing this... Buy cac and not the holder!
This is the most ridiculous post I have ever read on the forums. You should consult a legal dictionary or maybe even an ordinary one. Last time I checked, CAC was not a deity nor are its opinions binding rules of law. CAC is not the one universally "true" opinion, and cracking a CACed coin for an upgrade doesn't come remotely close to fraud.
So you believe the crackout business is acceptable? Ok not fraud. I take that back.
Maybe others can suggest a better word?
Why for the most part do CAC coins sell for more money! The gap continues to widen.
Is it smoke and mirrors! Name another business or hobby like this one.
How about if we turn the miles back,on a car maybe 20% but the car is pristine.
Is that ok?
How do you define gradflation! Is it acceptable to you?
And if you answer the questions how about telling us why the majority of NGC coins sell for
Substantially less than PCGS?
The entire coin Arena is a joke. Don’t get me wrong I,love coins and will not stop buying.
It,is,like,chess in that you have to know the game. The sad part is that so many people are getting burned in various ways.
@Perfection said:
And if you answer the questions how about telling us why the majority of NGC coins sell for
Substantially less than PCGS?
The entire coin Arena is a joke. Don’t get me wrong I,love coins and will not stop buying.
It,is,like,chess in that you have to know the game. The sad part is that so many people are getting burned in various ways.
It truly is a game. I try my hardest to ignore the noise and just buy great coins that make sense. Otherwise it would suck the enjoyment out of the hobby for me. The day that happens you
will see my core collection in the next Legend Regency Auction.
Oddly enough all but a few of my coins are CAC. All but one are PCGS.
mark
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
It truly is a game. I try my hardest to ignore the noise and just buy great coins that make sense. Otherwise it would suck the enjoyment out of the hobby for me. The day that happens you
will see my core collection in the next Legend Regency Auction.
@perfection - This poster's comment reflects my thoughts. Enjoy the coins for the coins and do not get caught up on dressings that can change. ** If ** the coin is nice and priced fairly then the rest is superficial and can be changed. I don't like grade inflation but thought your original post was over the top. I see you are a fan of Legend. Laura recently bought a couple of coins for Bruce that will never CAC and are overgraded (1883 NGC PF69 Trade Dollar with a spot and the Dexter Specimen, PCGS PF65 1804 Dollar with obvious graffiti). Both are amazing coins regardless of plastic. Great coins sell themselves regardless of the plastic or sticker. I don't think Bruce or Laura would dispute that. They can speak for themselves of course, but actions speak louder than words. When the right coin comes along, both of them have purchased non CAC and non PCGS coins and will likely do so again in the future.
@Perfection said:
So you believe the crackout business is acceptable? Ok not fraud. I take that back.
Maybe others can suggest a better word?
Why for the most part do CAC coins sell for more money! The gap continues to widen.
Is it smoke and mirrors! Name another business or hobby like this one.
How about if we turn the miles back,on a car maybe 20% but the car is pristine.
Is that ok?
How do you define gradflation! Is it acceptable to you?
The coins with CAC stickers sell for more money primarily because they are nicer coins from the start. It wasn't the sticker that made them better. Nicer coins (in the same grade) have always sold for more. Now, the difference is admittedly exaggerated with CAC because the bean has become sought after unto itself. Also, in your example, what is wrong with owning a 67 that once was a 66+ CAC if they are priced the same? Grades are opinions - they can and do change, and often to a greater degree than most of us would like. Sometimes coins will sticker, get upgraded and sticker again. I have seen a coin jump 2 grades and green bean both times. The only people that like grade inflation are those that make money off of it, either intentionally playing the game, or those who have a great eye and are able to upgrade their coins before they sell. Btw, @cameonut2011 is one of the most outspoken people against grade inflation on this board.
All I can say is, this is a guy who has really put his money where his mouth is. I would not challenge him with anything but facts-absolute PROVEN facts when it comes to anything CAC. he is not an arm chair quarterback like so many here. While all you CAC haters lose money, he has the last laugh, He recently sold off coins he bought within the last few years for a profit.
My money is on him to make a substantial profit down the road on his 5C 1910 PCGS PR68 DC CAC he just bought.
Does anyone here really think a guy like this would have spent so much on coins if there were no CAC? NO! Take him and multiply him. So when a mindless wannabe says JA has too much power-just remind your self-hey his product has real and powerful demand. I have the an up and comer called Black Cat. He learned quick. He will ONLY buy PCGS CAC (his very first time out he had a very bad experience buying out of auction).
Does anyone here really think a guy like this would have spent so much on coins if there were no CAC? NO!
If I had his skill set - he says he can’t grade - and if I wanted to collect ultimate grade coins, I would want CAC or someone else to ok my purchases. Then again, I probably wouldn’t be such a quality freak if I didn’t know how to grade.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
@specialist said:
Sure rub it in my face,. I made the 1C 1814 into a 65+ BN. I paid the $55G out of auction. Now a 66? Really? Will this game ever end?
The best part of all of this is that we get to see some real knowledgeable powerhouses in our advocation discuss stuff that most of us only dream about.
Thanks to you specialist, TDN, perfection, cameonut and justacommonman, JB at DL, all you guys, and DLH. This is fun to watch.
So I'm confused. It was a 65 and you managed to successfully play the upgrade game and get it to a 65+. Why are you upset about someone else also getting an upgrade?
I stopped collecting high grade Peace Dollars when I tried to upgrade a 66 and was denied, but later saw the same coin in 66+ and then a 67 holder!
So I'm confused. It was a 65 and you managed to successfully play the upgrade game and get it to a 65+. Why are you upset about someone else also getting an upgrade?
Because she wasn't the one getting the upgrade. It is hypocrisy much like advocating you only buy PCGS-CAC coins when she buys non-CAC coins of various sorts and also sells them. I seem to recall a certain shipwreck gold coin on her site not too long ago in a NGC holder. It was disclosed that it failed CAC. That tells you everything you need to know. "Do as I say, not as I do."
@Currin said: New Addition to D.L Hansen U S Coins Complete with Major Varieties (CS)
This is what I believe to be an unappreciated copper variety that was filled by a really high grade coin. The hole could have been filled by an above average coin rather that a $100k brown copper. I think this validates what John Bush has been telling us. If a coin comes on the market, and the price is fair, that DLH is interested.
If you are a copper guy, I believe you would love to have this 1814 1C Crosslet 4, Brown MS66 in your top notch collection. This is the finest brown coin graded by PCGS (1/0). This coin has no history except according to Coin Facts there a MS66BN estimated graded coin, that I assuming to a NGC 67. Maybe DLH crossed to over to PCGS and lost a point. That is all I know for now.
There is another 1814 1C Crosslet 4, Red-Brown MS65+ coin. I don’t really know how PCGS determines the finest overall, but I believe they give a bonus point for RB that qualifies the RB as the finest. This coin is tightly held in the PCGS Set Registry Set of “High Desert” Collection, according to Coin Facts. This makes DLH’s coin overall POP as a 1/1.
Provenance: None that can be found.
1814 1C Crosslet 4, Brown MS66 Brown (CAC status is unknown)
I think it is gorgeous. I can't wait to see what hole Mr. Hansen fills next.
New Upgrade to D. L. Hansen Complete Basic Proof Set
After a few busy weeks of purchasing and adding several high quality complete sets, the revisions have been somewhat slower this week. This is an upgrade proof coin that caught my attention. It is not a rare specimen, not expense, or really not a must coin for filling a hole. The interesting fact of this upgrade is that Hansen paid a 33% premium to purchase a coin that he already have. This purchase does not fully fit the criteria that John B shared: If a coin comes on the market, and the price is fair, that DLH is interested.
The 1868 10C, CA PR66CA is not a coin that would receive much attention. PCGS POP on this coin is 5, with three stair-step coins graded higher. It does have the CAC sticker which has significance, right? The coin was purchased June 2018 at Long Beach for $6000 (33% more than value). PCGS Price Guide Value is $4500. The three coins with higher grades are 66+ at $5750, 67 at $15,500, and 67+ at $22,500. Is it possible that Hansen’s crew see something with this coin that has been overlooked others? Even so, it interesting with his massive collection and time consume to maintain, expand, and search for opportunities, still he would send time on a coin such as this. I can tell with comments on this board, that many of the elite collectors only spend time with the higher dollar specimens. It appears Hansen may enjoy the search for a $10K coin as he would for a $500K. I don’t know him personally; so I may be reading too much into this.
The Heritage description on this coin: Deeply reflective silver mirrors are just one half of this Premium Gem's brilliant eye appeal. Richly frosted and sharply struck devices dominate the centers, and the coin's impressive contrast is more than the sum of its parts. Random die lines across Liberty's gown confirm the F-104 proof variety.
Looks like a very nice coin.
I would be hesitant to critique an upgrade like this, unless I knew what the prior coin in this slot was (grade, etc.).
Maybe the older coin was a PR-65 non-cam, or maybe the "update" was just an added photo?
To know the grade/cert of the prior would require saving the set inventory on a regular basis.
@Currin said: New Upgrade to D. L. Hansen Complete Basic Proof Set
The coin was purchased June 2018 at Long Beach for $6000 (33% more than value). PCGS Price Guide Value is $4500. Is it possible that Hansen’s crew see something with this coin that has been overlooked others? 1868 10C, Cameo PR66CA, CAC POP 5/3
What did he have before? This coin looks borderline DCAM to me. The finest DCAM is a 66 DCAM. Maybe this is what it was? @JBatDavidLawrence - Any insight?
@Currin said: New Upgrade to D. L. Hansen Complete Basic Proof Set
The coin was purchased June 2018 at Long Beach for $6000 (33% more than value). PCGS Price Guide Value is $4500. Is it possible that Hansen’s crew see something with this coin that has been overlooked others? 1868 10C, Cameo PR66CA, CAC POP 5/3
What did he have before? This coin looks borderline DCAM to me. The finest DCAM is a 66 DCAM. Maybe this is what it was? @JBatDavidLawrence - Any insight?
I don't have a whole lot to add, but my notes from the auction say that the coin should probably Deep Cameo if re-graded. Whoever the underbidder was clearly agreed with that. We didn't buy it to crack it though. Previously there was a 65 Cameo in the set. Maybe we should submit it now...
John Brush President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com email: John@davidlawrence.com 2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
@Currin said:
I was browsing the update page. Hansen has 213 sets with recent upgrades. He has 777 sets listed. I find it a pain just keeping a handful of sets up to date. What kind of effort does it take to keep his collection updated?
Probably a full-time job for someone...
With the kind of money he has....a curator and a whole team of people dedicated to his goal. This is not your normal coin collector accumulating a piece here or there. He has a goal to accumulate the best of the best across the board and an unlimited bankroll. He has full time spotters and now a piece of the action at David Lawrence which will provide him an opportunity to scalp some more deals. If he wants something there is no haggle...he buys it. If your smarter than he is you will figure out the best of what he needs, buy it and sell it back to him at whatever number you want. Ezmoney!
Good morning
I have not posted lately so catching up.
Bruce is 100% correct in that some coins, mostly very rare ones cannot always be CAC approved. There are so few that it,does not matter. If the coin beautiful, rare and very desirable if the holder says 65 with no CAC and it is really a 64 so what. All smart CAC buyers realize this. However I beleive the two sets Bruce sold were all CAC. I am sure he could have purchases a few higher graded coins that were,not but chose not,it.
The,one exception might be a 1884 or 1885 Trade dollar.
Next: the 1868 10c. The PCGS price guide is mostly not for CAC coins so for the most part it has to be ignored. I have emailed Mike Sherman about prices but his hands are tied when it comes to,many prices especially with more expensive coins. There needs to be a CAC and a non price.
However PCGS is too proud to do this for now. Most better and higher graded coins are bringing substantially more when they are CAC. However the CU prices cannot reflect that.
So,what good is the current price guide? Isn’t it a disservice to the majority of collectors who are not as up on CAC? I must strongly add that it is irrelevant how people feel about CAC.
A price guide is supposed to reflect the market and not opinions. Gold is where the price difference stand out the most. Look at, common saints. Anyone can understand those.
This thread is supposed to be about DLH. Whe he purchased my all CAC sets he knew he could
Not pay anywhere near the CU prices. He tried but eventually realized that CAC coins are worth owning and paid a fair price. I predicted a few weeks ago,that going forward I see DLH
Buying more and more CAC coins. It takes a while to “get it”. It took me six months.
Months ago I heard that DLH was adding twenty percent for CAC. I believe that has risen
Substantially.
Cameo Nut perhaps will tell,us if this is true as,time goes on.
DLH does not 100% buy to upgrade sets. He liked the 1868, thought the price was fair ,
So he purchased it!
I am sure DLH enjoys the challenge like all serious collectors. I,would bet overtime he tried to
Upgrade certain top sets to,be all CAC. It is very difficult but possible,in time.
I read this today. It is,worth posting. It is from the other outspoken person out there!
DISHEARTENING TO US-A MUST READ
CAC haters do NOT read this.
At the show we met two good coin buyers. Nice people. They both showed us their recent purchases. We were HORRIFIED with what they showed us. We hate being the bearer of bad news.
Folks this is why you should ONLY BUY CAC coins. We will just discuss one collector who had spent some decent money in auctions. He was having fun. But how much do you want fun to cost you? One coin he spent $60,000.00 and is total dead meat. It is as harshly cleaned and retoned as you can find. We even called a friend over so he did not think we were just trashing the coin. To make it even worse, he has no real recourse as the coin was bought from a major web auction company (that has NO numismatist on staff). Even if he put the coin back in a sale, unless another “fish” was found, he is going to lose a ton of money. Had the coin been PCGS CAC and looked like that, he never would have bought it because it would have cost almost $100,000.00. He obviously thought he got a good deal. At least if it came from a legitimate dealer he might be able to work something out. In his mind the coin just looked so pretty. Now he understands that is what coin docs do. Obviously he is now a PCGS CAC ONLY person. Legend Numismatics firmly believes incidents like this are NOT the collectors fault. They have been taught grading services are good and how can an auction hurt you when there are under bidders. Now you see why its not so safe.
We believe both collectors were very typical. Busy professionals who love coins but have very little time to learn. We get angered to no end seeing people like them get burned. Since it is kind of a shark eat shark world in coins, you MUST seriously consider working with a trusted dealer. Even if you love auctions, the best buy you will ever make-is the one you do not. Paying some 5% will save you a fortune. Or if you insist on doing it your self, for the love god, buy CAC coins ONLY. To this day we are still howling over a major coin doctor who tells his customers “CAC is a fad and I do not trust it”. Of course he is slamming his collectors with absolute AT garbage. Each collector who we had to tell them they got burned all said: “I was wondering about him not liking CAC”. Yet they took his word…..
This is why CAC exists. We cannot tell you enough, why in the world today would someone offer you a coin NOT CAC’d? It has been proven over and over for 10+years, CAC coins bring the highest prices unless its a fresh estate (and then every major dealer will chase you off). There are coins that just miss CAC, but you should ONLY buy those from a trusted dealer.
Sadly, these situations happen more frequently then people know. Most people simply lose common sense and want to believe in what they are buying. To us, the sad part is it is so easy to avoid.
Can we not make this another CAC thread? This is about Hansen's numismatic accomplishments not a cheer leading thread promoting CAC or third party grading services.
You can start another thread to rehash the same old CAC talking points, but I think it has all been discussed ad nauseaum here before. The point is the coin is what the coin is regardless of sticker and plastic. It doesn't acquire special powers or special characteristics when the bean goes on that it did not have before.
@Currin said:
Ok... I have chased the rabbit all the way down in the hole. There are three of these coins incorrectly reported in the PCGS POP report. The PR63+ is registered to Simpson. There is also a PR63CAM and a PR65CAM. The 65CAM is the DuPont specimen in the Smithsonian. The first two are the same coin (obvious by the two photos). It appear the Simpson specimen dropped the CAM and upgraded from a PR63 to PR63+. Not sure why that would happen, because I don't think it was a crossover. I hope the Specialist will clear this up. Done with this. There are several new Hansen upgrades that I need to share. They are really great stuff!
Simpson's PR63+ Specimen cert #28572157 listed in registry
Simpson's PR63CAM not listed in the registry
PCGS PR63CAM Image courtesy of American Numismatic Rarities
These look like very differently exposed images of toning on the same coin.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - Geo. Orwell
@Ezmoney said:
If he wants something there is no haggle...he buys it. If your smarter than he is you will figure out the best of what he needs, buy it and sell it back to him at whatever number you want. Ezmoney!
This is why so many people do not share their sets until it is done. If you start a registry set and have deep pockets, the vultures and sharks will come.
@Ezmoney said:
If he wants something there is no haggle...he buys it. If your smarter than he is you will figure out the best of what he needs, buy it and sell it back to him at whatever number you want. Ezmoney!
This is why so many people do not share their sets until it is done. If you start a registry set and have deep pockets, the vultures and sharks will come.
I understand what you are saying. I do hope he keeps his sets open so we can follow along the quest. Also, how do we really know what he have and have not. Maybe he showing only what he wants us to see.
2 of my biggest customers do not want any part of the registry. They feel they build their sets for themselves and their families. I can respect that.
Plus, they feel (like I do) not all #1 sets are properly graded. Why participate? I occasionally get them to display coins at major shows. They are fine w/that.
@specialist said:
2 of my biggest customers do not want any part of the registry. They feel they build their sets for themselves and their families. I can respect that.
Plus, they feel (like I do) not all #1 sets are properly graded. Why participate? I occasionally get them to display coins at major shows. They are fine w/that.
ThIs set thing is mostly false. For years I have had around 13 sets. I would welcome emails from
People who have coins I need. Someone else could get them.. I would gladly pay the price within reason, maybe a twenty. Per cent premium. In nine years I have received at most ten emails offering me coins.
I WANT coins for my sets that are nicer than what I have even if the grade is the same.
Eye appeal,is key. Ask the specialist! I now buy any series coin if it is amazing looking.
Another thing about why CU prices are somewhat meaningless. As the years go,on great eye
Appeal coins are escalating over teguar examples. I do not understand why the spread isn’t much more. There are paintings of the same size by the same artist that sell for ten times more than another one.
If a dipped white cac cameo barber half is say 10k a beautiful toned one is to me perhaps 14k.
So,how can cu account for this? At a show when I am selling and coin it is 14k when Cu is
10k and buyer complains I,tell them to buy a plain example if that price makes them happy.
I,could nevef beat Scher with Pr barber halves as at some point I,only wanted toned amazing
Coins. PCGS Rarely will 68 toned dcams or call a toned coin a dcam.
Perfecto. I knew Bruce Scher really well (he was a fun loving guy). May he rest in peace. Sadly he was a total plastic buyer to build a #1 set He knew that always bothered me. So to me, his set is easily beatable. That is why I extremely dislike the registries.
Perfecto. I knew Bruce Scher really well (he was a fun loving guy). May he rest in peace. Sadly he was a total plastic buyer to build a #1 set He knew that always bothered me. So to me, his set is easily beatable. That is why I extremely dislike the registries.
Do you also dislike all plastic for the same reason?
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
I always have supported plastic. plastic started out good. then gradeflation, coins docs ran amuck, etc.
I have always felt the grading services should have charged me per coin. $100.00 to grade a $500G coin and guarantee it? It was easy to see at years ago that would not hold up.
however, with out the plastic, we'd be now where with this hobby
@specialist said:
I always have supported plastic. plastic started out good. then gradeflation, coins docs ran amuck, etc.
I have always felt the grading services should have charged me per coin. $100.00 to grade a $500G coin and guarantee it? It was easy to see at years ago that would not hold up.
however, with out the plastic, we'd be now where with this hobby
Without plastic, we would definitely be in a different place. IMHO, the market for coins under maybe $500 would be much healthier than it is, and there would be more collectors for them. The market for coins over $5000, just the opposite.
But back to the point I was trying to make. Whatever the Registry sets does to commoditize coins, i.e., to make all coins in the same plastic more equal than they actually are, plastic does the same. Actually, if there's a problem, the fault may lie entirely in the plastic, not in the registry.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
I think the focus of this thread should remain on DL Hansen's pursuit of the finest collection of all time. Any commentary on CAC or registries should go elsewhere.
Comments
Here is one if you are interested. It is not new, but looks to be in pretty good condition.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Swiss-J-G-Hansen-Bindslev-Silver-800-Mechanical-Pocket-Watch/123207990404?hash=item1cafc4bc84:g:ySkAAOSwaYVbLi~b
My 20th Century Gold Major Design Type Set ---started : 11/17/1997 ---- completed : 1/21/2004
I have seen my Seated dime set drop as lesser coins get upgraded and former top pop coins are now not top pop.
I am just waiting for PCGS to grade another seated dime a MS-69. At least I will have the only one in an old green holder and at that being 1845-O that shouldn’t even exist.
One coin for sure I sold which was a recolored coin I now see was just upgraded. It should not even be in a holder at all which is why I sold it. It changed color in the holder after I bought it.
Certain coins would require him to buy whole sets to get and with most of his sets done I don’t know if he is buying sets to get to certain pieces but I sure am glad I bought so many coins from the Gardner and Simpson collections when I did. Even buying the the top pop 57-S quarter just for the box of 30 and lone 1864 PCGS/CAC 66 Dcam PF half dime. I guess now I know who was offering 10k for that one.
Ironically when I emailed him to offer a coin he needed that was a duplicate I never heard back. It must be a blast collecting everything you see. I hope PGCS doesn’t mess up everything helping him boost the graded of his coins. In my mind I won’t downgrade any coin that I feel is properly graded. I actually will lose the #1 spot in one category because I am not taking a downgrade on my Eliasberg/ Kaufman 1852 proof dime in 67. If I did I would have stayed at #1. The point is still coins first, holders and awards are great but coins Gardner didn’t take downgrades on many pieces that did CAC. Some that didn’t cross then now are upgraded.
The 1852-O dime was graded a 66 in the Eliasberg sale, graded MS65 long ago by NGC and CAC green added for the sale. Tried to cross it as it would be the finest known, they won’t because it dark but not only a high end 65 but borderline 66. Why take a downgrade?
Numerical grades are one part of a larger puzzle. There are many great coins still yet to make it into PGCS holders and many in PCGS holders that would never CAC. Such is collecting.
Buying top quality Seated Dimes in Gem BU and Proof.
Buying great coins - monster eye appeal only.
1792-Present...
President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com
email: John@davidlawrence.com
2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
Hi John,
Does the collection have many CACs that is not denoted by comments?
My 20th Century Gold Major Design Type Set ---started : 11/17/1997 ---- completed : 1/21/2004
Sorry to hear this! Dell Loy isn't an email kind of guy, so most messages don't get read...I've only received one email from him myself in over a year of working with him...feel free to offer anything for him to me directly and if it fits the collection, we'll try to make the process a bit shorter and easier...
Thanks!
President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com
email: John@davidlawrence.com
2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
Yes, a ton. We're in the process (a LONG process) of organizing the sets further. Sometimes CAC was typed in when the coin was added to the registry, but often not. A number of the coins have never been to CAC either...
We hope to get that all updated in the next few months.
President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com
email: John@davidlawrence.com
2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
New Addition to D.L Hansen U S Coins Complete with Major Varieties (CS)
This is what I believe to be an unappreciated copper variety that was filled by a really high grade coin. The hole could have been filled by an above average coin rather that a $100k brown copper. I think this validates what John Bush has been telling us. If a coin comes on the market, and the price is fair, that DLH is interested.
If you are a copper guy, I believe you would love to have this 1814 1C Crosslet 4, Brown MS66 in your top notch collection. This is the finest brown coin graded by PCGS (1/0). This coin has no history except according to Coin Facts there a MS66BN estimated graded coin, that I assuming to a NGC 67. Maybe DLH crossed to over to PCGS and lost a point. That is all I know for now.
There is another 1814 1C Crosslet 4, Red-Brown MS65+ coin. I don’t really know how PCGS determines the finest overall, but I believe they give a bonus point for RB that qualifies the RB as the finest. This coin is tightly held in the PCGS Set Registry Set of “High Desert” Collection, according to Coin Facts. This makes DLH’s coin overall POP as a 1/1.
Provenance: None that can be found.
1814 1C Crosslet 4, Brown MS66 Brown (CAC status is unknown)
My 20th Century Gold Major Design Type Set ---started : 11/17/1997 ---- completed : 1/21/2004
Just a beautiful Large Cent!
Searching through the auction archives.
It looks like the Hansen 1814 sold as a 65 BN back in 2015. It was in an older blue label holder and CAC'd.
https://auctions.stacksbowers.com/lots/view/1-1HFNL
Then it shows up as 65+ CAC with the same cert#.
https://legendauctions.hibid.com/lot/32715157/1c-1814-crosslet-4--pcgs-ms65--bn-cac/
https://legendauctions.hibid.com/lot/37051351/l1c-1814-crosslet-4--pcgs-ms65--bn-cac/
You may be on something. Thanks
My 20th Century Gold Major Design Type Set ---started : 11/17/1997 ---- completed : 1/21/2004
Sure rub it in my face,. I made the 1C 1814 into a 65+ BN. I paid the $55G out of auction. Now a 66? Really? Will this game ever end?
I am getting a headache w/this thread.
So it was cracked and upgraded and it lost the cac. Happens all the time.
it’s criminal and borders on fraud. Dozens of people make a good living doing this.
Look at the post by seated dime. Many of his former top pops are no longer.
It’s a disgrace. Technology exists to photograph a coin so it cannot be graded again.
CAC will continue to get stronger. The sad thing is that the CAC pops are off my maybe twenty per cent. The nicest coins with the best chance to upgrade are CAC so they get cracked. Many of the crack out people do not send the tag back to CAC when they get an upgrade. Hence bad pops.
Buy cac and not the holder! Sure I could upgrade a certain amount,of my gem CAC coins and they,might
be worth a few, million more but I,would never consider that.
The cent IS beautiful regardless of the true grade. Nice buy by DLH But the CAC pop,is two. Maybe it should really be one?
I predict one day DLH will get fed up and buy mostly CAC. Many top,collectors do this.
Most people besides myself and Laura do not speak up about grading and CAC.
Laura sells the finest coins, almost all CAC. If you read her reports you will see that the way to build a top collection is to,buy the best and pay the price, She is correct. I have purchased many coins from her over the years and without a doubt the quality is superb.
There are few deals when buying the best coins. I,pay the price.
There,is no question that is almost all cases I,would rather,own a beautiful 66 Cac that i,paid
All the money for,than 67 that seems like a deal with no CAC.
1000lakes, goodvwork on the cent!
This is the most ridiculous post I have ever read on the forums. You should consult a legal dictionary or maybe even an ordinary one. Last time I checked, CAC was not a deity nor are its opinions binding rules of law. CAC is not the one universally "true" opinion, and cracking a CACed coin for an upgrade doesn't come remotely close to fraud.
So you believe the crackout business is acceptable? Ok not fraud. I take that back.
Maybe others can suggest a better word?
Why for the most part do CAC coins sell for more money! The gap continues to widen.
Is it smoke and mirrors! Name another business or hobby like this one.
How about if we turn the miles back,on a car maybe 20% but the car is pristine.
Is that ok?
How do you define gradflation! Is it acceptable to you?
And if you answer the questions how about telling us why the majority of NGC coins sell for
Substantially less than PCGS?
The entire coin Arena is a joke. Don’t get me wrong I,love coins and will not stop buying.
It,is,like,chess in that you have to know the game. The sad part is that so many people are getting burned in various ways.
It truly is a game. I try my hardest to ignore the noise and just buy great coins that make sense. Otherwise it would suck the enjoyment out of the hobby for me. The day that happens you
will see my core collection in the next Legend Regency Auction.
Oddly enough all but a few of my coins are CAC. All but one are PCGS.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
@perfection - This poster's comment reflects my thoughts. Enjoy the coins for the coins and do not get caught up on dressings that can change. ** If ** the coin is nice and priced fairly then the rest is superficial and can be changed. I don't like grade inflation but thought your original post was over the top. I see you are a fan of Legend. Laura recently bought a couple of coins for Bruce that will never CAC and are overgraded (1883 NGC PF69 Trade Dollar with a spot and the Dexter Specimen, PCGS PF65 1804 Dollar with obvious graffiti). Both are amazing coins regardless of plastic. Great coins sell themselves regardless of the plastic or sticker. I don't think Bruce or Laura would dispute that. They can speak for themselves of course, but actions speak louder than words. When the right coin comes along, both of them have purchased non CAC and non PCGS coins and will likely do so again in the future.
The coins with CAC stickers sell for more money primarily because they are nicer coins from the start. It wasn't the sticker that made them better. Nicer coins (in the same grade) have always sold for more. Now, the difference is admittedly exaggerated with CAC because the bean has become sought after unto itself. Also, in your example, what is wrong with owning a 67 that once was a 66+ CAC if they are priced the same? Grades are opinions - they can and do change, and often to a greater degree than most of us would like. Sometimes coins will sticker, get upgraded and sticker again. I have seen a coin jump 2 grades and green bean both times. The only people that like grade inflation are those that make money off of it, either intentionally playing the game, or those who have a great eye and are able to upgrade their coins before they sell. Btw, @cameonut2011 is one of the most outspoken people against grade inflation on this board.
Oh gosh, perfection is making me blush.
All I can say is, this is a guy who has really put his money where his mouth is. I would not challenge him with anything but facts-absolute PROVEN facts when it comes to anything CAC. he is not an arm chair quarterback like so many here. While all you CAC haters lose money, he has the last laugh, He recently sold off coins he bought within the last few years for a profit.
My money is on him to make a substantial profit down the road on his 5C 1910 PCGS PR68 DC CAC he just bought.
Does anyone here really think a guy like this would have spent so much on coins if there were no CAC? NO! Take him and multiply him. So when a mindless wannabe says JA has too much power-just remind your self-hey his product has real and powerful demand. I have the an up and comer called Black Cat. He learned quick. He will ONLY buy PCGS CAC (his very first time out he had a very bad experience buying out of auction).
If I had his skill set - he says he can’t grade - and if I wanted to collect ultimate grade coins, I would want CAC or someone else to ok my purchases. Then again, I probably wouldn’t be such a quality freak if I didn’t know how to grade.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Eventually, he might feel differently. The last two most expensive coins I’ve bought weren’t CAC.
It’s a starting point, not an end all
What was the coin before you made it into a 65+?
An MS65 ......
The best part of all of this is that we get to see some real knowledgeable powerhouses in our advocation discuss stuff that most of us only dream about.
Thanks to you specialist, TDN, perfection, cameonut and justacommonman, JB at DL, all you guys, and DLH. This is fun to watch.
So I'm confused. It was a 65 and you managed to successfully play the upgrade game and get it to a 65+. Why are you upset about someone else also getting an upgrade?
I stopped collecting high grade Peace Dollars when I tried to upgrade a 66 and was denied, but later saw the same coin in 66+ and then a 67 holder!
Because she wasn't the one getting the upgrade. It is hypocrisy much like advocating you only buy PCGS-CAC coins when she buys non-CAC coins of various sorts and also sells them. I seem to recall a certain shipwreck gold coin on her site not too long ago in a NGC holder. It was disclosed that it failed CAC. That tells you everything you need to know. "Do as I say, not as I do."
Edited for clarity.
I think it is gorgeous. I can't wait to see what hole Mr. Hansen fills next.
New Upgrade to D. L. Hansen Complete Basic Proof Set
After a few busy weeks of purchasing and adding several high quality complete sets, the revisions have been somewhat slower this week. This is an upgrade proof coin that caught my attention. It is not a rare specimen, not expense, or really not a must coin for filling a hole. The interesting fact of this upgrade is that Hansen paid a 33% premium to purchase a coin that he already have. This purchase does not fully fit the criteria that John B shared: If a coin comes on the market, and the price is fair, that DLH is interested.
The 1868 10C, CA PR66CA is not a coin that would receive much attention. PCGS POP on this coin is 5, with three stair-step coins graded higher. It does have the CAC sticker which has significance, right? The coin was purchased June 2018 at Long Beach for $6000 (33% more than value). PCGS Price Guide Value is $4500. The three coins with higher grades are 66+ at $5750, 67 at $15,500, and 67+ at $22,500. Is it possible that Hansen’s crew see something with this coin that has been overlooked others? Even so, it interesting with his massive collection and time consume to maintain, expand, and search for opportunities, still he would send time on a coin such as this. I can tell with comments on this board, that many of the elite collectors only spend time with the higher dollar specimens. It appears Hansen may enjoy the search for a $10K coin as he would for a $500K. I don’t know him personally; so I may be reading too much into this.
The Heritage description on this coin: Deeply reflective silver mirrors are just one half of this Premium Gem's brilliant eye appeal. Richly frosted and sharply struck devices dominate the centers, and the coin's impressive contrast is more than the sum of its parts. Random die lines across Liberty's gown confirm the F-104 proof variety.
Provenance: From The T.W. Brown Collection
1868 10C, Cameo PR66CA, CAC POP 5/3
My 20th Century Gold Major Design Type Set ---started : 11/17/1997 ---- completed : 1/21/2004
Looks like a very nice coin.
I would be hesitant to critique an upgrade like this, unless I knew what the prior coin in this slot was (grade, etc.).
Maybe the older coin was a PR-65 non-cam, or maybe the "update" was just an added photo?
To know the grade/cert of the prior would require saving the set inventory on a regular basis.
What did he have before? This coin looks borderline DCAM to me. The finest DCAM is a 66 DCAM. Maybe this is what it was? @JBatDavidLawrence - Any insight?
Nice coin!
I don't have a whole lot to add, but my notes from the auction say that the coin should probably Deep Cameo if re-graded. Whoever the underbidder was clearly agreed with that. We didn't buy it to crack it though. Previously there was a 65 Cameo in the set. Maybe we should submit it now...
President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com
email: John@davidlawrence.com
2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
With the kind of money he has....a curator and a whole team of people dedicated to his goal. This is not your normal coin collector accumulating a piece here or there. He has a goal to accumulate the best of the best across the board and an unlimited bankroll. He has full time spotters and now a piece of the action at David Lawrence which will provide him an opportunity to scalp some more deals. If he wants something there is no haggle...he buys it. If your smarter than he is you will figure out the best of what he needs, buy it and sell it back to him at whatever number you want. Ezmoney!
Enjoyed reading this - thank you to all the contributors. This would make a great book.
Good morning
I have not posted lately so catching up.
Bruce is 100% correct in that some coins, mostly very rare ones cannot always be CAC approved. There are so few that it,does not matter. If the coin beautiful, rare and very desirable if the holder says 65 with no CAC and it is really a 64 so what. All smart CAC buyers realize this. However I beleive the two sets Bruce sold were all CAC. I am sure he could have purchases a few higher graded coins that were,not but chose not,it.
The,one exception might be a 1884 or 1885 Trade dollar.
Next: the 1868 10c. The PCGS price guide is mostly not for CAC coins so for the most part it has to be ignored. I have emailed Mike Sherman about prices but his hands are tied when it comes to,many prices especially with more expensive coins. There needs to be a CAC and a non price.
However PCGS is too proud to do this for now. Most better and higher graded coins are bringing substantially more when they are CAC. However the CU prices cannot reflect that.
So,what good is the current price guide? Isn’t it a disservice to the majority of collectors who are not as up on CAC? I must strongly add that it is irrelevant how people feel about CAC.
A price guide is supposed to reflect the market and not opinions. Gold is where the price difference stand out the most. Look at, common saints. Anyone can understand those.
This thread is supposed to be about DLH. Whe he purchased my all CAC sets he knew he could
Not pay anywhere near the CU prices. He tried but eventually realized that CAC coins are worth owning and paid a fair price. I predicted a few weeks ago,that going forward I see DLH
Buying more and more CAC coins. It takes a while to “get it”. It took me six months.
Months ago I heard that DLH was adding twenty percent for CAC. I believe that has risen
Substantially.
Cameo Nut perhaps will tell,us if this is true as,time goes on.
DLH does not 100% buy to upgrade sets. He liked the 1868, thought the price was fair ,
So he purchased it!
I am sure DLH enjoys the challenge like all serious collectors. I,would bet overtime he tried to
Upgrade certain top sets to,be all CAC. It is very difficult but possible,in time.
OMG perfecto, he buys your sets and your his great protector now... LOL!!!
I read this today. It is,worth posting. It is from the other outspoken person out there!
DISHEARTENING TO US-A MUST READ
CAC haters do NOT read this.
At the show we met two good coin buyers. Nice people. They both showed us their recent purchases. We were HORRIFIED with what they showed us. We hate being the bearer of bad news.
Folks this is why you should ONLY BUY CAC coins. We will just discuss one collector who had spent some decent money in auctions. He was having fun. But how much do you want fun to cost you? One coin he spent $60,000.00 and is total dead meat. It is as harshly cleaned and retoned as you can find. We even called a friend over so he did not think we were just trashing the coin. To make it even worse, he has no real recourse as the coin was bought from a major web auction company (that has NO numismatist on staff). Even if he put the coin back in a sale, unless another “fish” was found, he is going to lose a ton of money. Had the coin been PCGS CAC and looked like that, he never would have bought it because it would have cost almost $100,000.00. He obviously thought he got a good deal. At least if it came from a legitimate dealer he might be able to work something out. In his mind the coin just looked so pretty. Now he understands that is what coin docs do. Obviously he is now a PCGS CAC ONLY person. Legend Numismatics firmly believes incidents like this are NOT the collectors fault. They have been taught grading services are good and how can an auction hurt you when there are under bidders. Now you see why its not so safe.
We believe both collectors were very typical. Busy professionals who love coins but have very little time to learn. We get angered to no end seeing people like them get burned. Since it is kind of a shark eat shark world in coins, you MUST seriously consider working with a trusted dealer. Even if you love auctions, the best buy you will ever make-is the one you do not. Paying some 5% will save you a fortune. Or if you insist on doing it your self, for the love god, buy CAC coins ONLY. To this day we are still howling over a major coin doctor who tells his customers “CAC is a fad and I do not trust it”. Of course he is slamming his collectors with absolute AT garbage. Each collector who we had to tell them they got burned all said: “I was wondering about him not liking CAC”. Yet they took his word…..
This is why CAC exists. We cannot tell you enough, why in the world today would someone offer you a coin NOT CAC’d? It has been proven over and over for 10+years, CAC coins bring the highest prices unless its a fresh estate (and then every major dealer will chase you off). There are coins that just miss CAC, but you should ONLY buy those from a trusted dealer.
Sadly, these situations happen more frequently then people know. Most people simply lose common sense and want to believe in what they are buying. To us, the sad part is it is so easy to avoid.
Specialist said;
It is kind of a shark eat shark world
in coins .
Please elaborate
@perfection @specialist
Can we not make this another CAC thread? This is about Hansen's numismatic accomplishments not a cheer leading thread promoting CAC or third party grading services.
You can start another thread to rehash the same old CAC talking points, but I think it has all been discussed ad nauseaum here before. The point is the coin is what the coin is regardless of sticker and plastic. It doesn't acquire special powers or special characteristics when the bean goes on that it did not have before.
These look like very differently exposed images of toning on the same coin.
This is why so many people do not share their sets until it is done. If you start a registry set and have deep pockets, the vultures and sharks will come.
I understand what you are saying. I do hope he keeps his sets open so we can follow along the quest. Also, how do we really know what he have and have not. Maybe he showing only what he wants us to see.
My 20th Century Gold Major Design Type Set ---started : 11/17/1997 ---- completed : 1/21/2004
2 of my biggest customers do not want any part of the registry. They feel they build their sets for themselves and their families. I can respect that.
Plus, they feel (like I do) not all #1 sets are properly graded. Why participate? I occasionally get them to display coins at major shows. They are fine w/that.
We get what's offered.
ThIs set thing is mostly false. For years I have had around 13 sets. I would welcome emails from
People who have coins I need. Someone else could get them.. I would gladly pay the price within reason, maybe a twenty. Per cent premium. In nine years I have received at most ten emails offering me coins.
I WANT coins for my sets that are nicer than what I have even if the grade is the same.
Eye appeal,is key. Ask the specialist! I now buy any series coin if it is amazing looking.
Another thing about why CU prices are somewhat meaningless. As the years go,on great eye
Appeal coins are escalating over teguar examples. I do not understand why the spread isn’t much more. There are paintings of the same size by the same artist that sell for ten times more than another one.
If a dipped white cac cameo barber half is say 10k a beautiful toned one is to me perhaps 14k.
So,how can cu account for this? At a show when I am selling and coin it is 14k when Cu is
10k and buyer complains I,tell them to buy a plain example if that price makes them happy.
I,could nevef beat Scher with Pr barber halves as at some point I,only wanted toned amazing
Coins. PCGS Rarely will 68 toned dcams or call a toned coin a dcam.
Perfecto. I knew Bruce Scher really well (he was a fun loving guy). May he rest in peace. Sadly he was a total plastic buyer to build a #1 set He knew that always bothered me. So to me, his set is easily beatable. That is why I extremely dislike the registries.
@specialist said:
Do you also dislike all plastic for the same reason?
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
I always have supported plastic. plastic started out good. then gradeflation, coins docs ran amuck, etc.
I have always felt the grading services should have charged me per coin. $100.00 to grade a $500G coin and guarantee it? It was easy to see at years ago that would not hold up.
however, with out the plastic, we'd be now where with this hobby
Without plastic, we would definitely be in a different place. IMHO, the market for coins under maybe $500 would be much healthier than it is, and there would be more collectors for them. The market for coins over $5000, just the opposite.
But back to the point I was trying to make. Whatever the Registry sets does to commoditize coins, i.e., to make all coins in the same plastic more equal than they actually are, plastic does the same. Actually, if there's a problem, the fault may lie entirely in the plastic, not in the registry.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
I think the focus of this thread should remain on DL Hansen's pursuit of the finest collection of all time. Any commentary on CAC or registries should go elsewhere.