<< <i>What's the special number for Prudenrial Securities? Is the one on the first post their main number? >>
212-778-4654
Good Luck. So far nobody from this board has been able to get an order in with them. Nobody has spoken to a live person on that line. They have, however, updated the message as of yesterday.
ve about given up on this circus sideshow...see ya all on the mint's release day. Better have 5 computers open or 5 pages open at the same time so you can add every single coin to your cart.
I actually did this when I was at work. I accessed 4 computers that were not in use when the Jefferson Gold Spouse Coins went on sale.
"Coming Soon - Due to increasing prices on eBay we're going to horde our stash to maximize blackmarket profit potential beginning in the 2nd Quarter of 2011.
Please continue to visit this website for doubletalk, lies and outright deceptions"
Is it possible to both be laughing and dying a little inside..because that's how I'm feeling right now!
The Second Quarter...what, to overlap Mint sales?!? Whatever they're smoking, please pass the bong around to the rest of us...must be some good s***!
<< <i>...and someone can't count. Was there a line of 200 or 500? big difference >>
I'll bet they have the cash register receipts to prove that those 500 people came thru the door......
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
<< <i>Good Luck. So far nobody from this board has been able to get an order in with them. Nobody has spoken to a live person on that line. They have, however, updated the message as of yesterday. >>
The message is kind of suspicious, IMO. Something like "they are working through the orders as fast as they can" doesn't make sense. It implies that there are orders from other means... mail, fax, etc. I would expect it to say, "We are taking orders..." or "we are answering calls..." but to phrase it as 'working through the orders' implies that they already have the orders and they are merely working to fulfill them, rather than take them.
<< <i>Nothing in the Mint rules prevented what The Gold Center did. They could not sell sets to their own employees or Corporate Officers. As I stated last week - once the AP's realized they could only make 10%, they made sure they took care of their best customers. If you had done business with a company for years, what would you rather have as a Christmas gift: a set of pucks that are worth three times the sale price or a tin of popcorn? >>
Read them again. They were prohibited from selling to DEALERS. They were supposed to sell to the general public. I would expect them to sell to their best household customers, but NOT dealers which they were expressly prohibited from doing. >>
That quote convinces me that my earlier speculation was correct---I think he is going to blow a bunch off to telemarketers and then surrender his AP license.
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
<< <i>No mention of 'general public', just 'public' in the Mint rules. No prohibition of selling a single set to a dealer. A dealer is a member of the public that has an address, so selling one to him does not violate the terms. The AP's must sell all the coins to the public - not all at once, so contacting their chosen 'public' to see if they are interested in acquiring a set before selling OTC is allowed. >>
A dealer is NOT the public, it is a commercial entity. And a store is NOT a household. Now if they sold one set to the owners of the shops that buy from them, that is understandable, but 3100 sets? We all know what really happened. US Mint, audit those sales!
<< <i>No mention of 'general public', just 'public' in the Mint rules. No prohibition of selling a single set to a dealer. A dealer is a member of the public that has an address, so selling one to him does not violate the terms. The AP's must sell all the coins to the public - not all at once, so contacting their chosen 'public' to see if they are interested in acquiring a set before selling OTC is allowed. >>
A dealer is NOT the public, it is a commercial entity. And a store it NOT a household. Now if they sold one set to the owners of the shops that buy from them, that is understandable, but 3100 sets? We all know what really happened. US Mint, audit those sales! >>
I am sure that is what they have done, plus the owner's employees, the dealer's best customers, the dealer's mother, sister, brother and his family, his second cousin twice removed on their mother's side. The Mint can audit these sales until they are blue in the face. The AP's will have supporting documentation for each and every sale. The fact that we don't like who they are selling them do does not mean they have violated their agreement.
It is time to face the facts, we are 3 weeks out and these AP's have sold 90% or more of their sets.
<<The AP's will have supporting documentation for each and every sale. The fact that we don't like who they are selling them do does not mean they have violated their agreement. >>
Don't be too sure about that...when people get greedy, they get stupid. Most tax evasion cases prove that point.
Dummying up records for bulk under the counter transactions might be tough if someone actually attemps to call a few of the alledged purchasers on the list. That's also how voter registration fraud is usually uncovered, "What petition? I never signed that petition!"
I just got my sales confirmation e-mail from MTB - the price for the set is $860 + $25 commission + taxes. I played the same game of everyone else here only things I did not do is calling and go to their office, everything was done using my fax and e-mail. I had to push them around a little with some bs.
I was originally very enthused about these 5 oz ATBs, and was seriously thinking about going for an entire monster box on my own, before all the details were known. Then when MsMorrisine helpfully began a monster box thread, I at first signed up for ten sets. Later I reduced my commitment to two sets. Finally when Apmex offered them for 1395, I rethought the whole situation and decided not to participate, for specific reasons I listed in a post early in this thread.
The main gist of this discussion thread has developed into supplying strong evidence that the mint's approved purchasers are individually corrupt, and that the system itself, of having only about a dozen approved purchasers, engenders corruption. We need to eliminate the system completely.
The mint's distribution system, such as set up in Plainfield Indiana, is the only way that collectible US government coins should be sold to anyone. Bulk sales of bullion coins might be handled by requiring minimum orders, such as a monster box minimum. The approved purchasers are an extra unnecessary corrupt middleman.
Here's my report from the Gold Center...A very spontaneous trip. I was no way way going but a buddy/collector called and then another and by Sunday at 7 pm we hit the road...Arrived Monday at at 2 am their time. A gentleman named Wayne saw us drive up and walked over. He explained they were all sitting over at Sonics next door and had worked it out with mngt that we could sit there. Later paid $5 a car and assume it went to sonics. We signed in on the list at approx 2:30 a.m. and were numbers 51-58. Not much activity after that until approx 640ish a.m. When a small crowd rushed the facility...It got crazy and everybody got the memo to go over...Later the sign in list guy put everyone in an orderly line. There were a few troublemakers that jumped the line and their was a guy that hired a temp agency called man power to make the buys...He did get bounced along with some buyers supposedly hired from the local Dennys and there were also people supposedly brought in from a soup kitchen......We went in, 5 at a time license and money, coins came out a secure steel box, and then basically they said get the hell outta the store. So at number 51 or so I got the coins at approx 11:30 and expect there were no more than 200-250 in the line. I did meet a forum member said his screen name was OldDan...and a guy supposedly first in line named Brian from Chicago...I was told by locals the owner was a jerk and was a small time guy for 30years and now thinks he's the King of the town...Other than that, I did accidentally blow the toll in Indiana as my gps girl said stay left and apparently I went through the e pass lane...OOps...
Eventully valued in the $15K+ range?????????? Based on what? >>
I think the good fellas in Springfield is referring to $15k-$20k Japanese yen. >>
I wonder if he will buy them back at $15K?
ARTICLE
Silver bullion coins attract crowd of collectors to Springfield By AMANDA REAVY (amanda.reavy@sj-r.com) THE STATE JOURNAL-REGISTER Posted Jan 03, 2011 @ 11:30 PM Last update Jan 04, 2011 @ 05:52 AM Copyright 2011 The State Journal-Register. Some rights reserved.
Hundreds of people from across the country flooded The Gold Center Monday to get their hands on a set of rare America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins. The Gold Center, 3000 W. Iles Ave., was one of only nine outlets nationwide that were able to sell the coins to the public Monday. Owner Jim Hausman opened sales at 10 a.m. Monday, but a crowd of people had camped outside outside the business starting Sunday night. Springfield police were called to disperse those gathered before Monday, and Hausman hired three off-duty Sangamon County deputies to provide security and crowd control Monday. No arrests were made, though Hausman said one man who tried to cheat the limit of one coin of each design per household was told to leave. The coins are 3 inches in diameter and made up of 5 ounces of .999 fine silver. They are the first such coins produced by the U.S. Mint, according to the mint’s website.They are larger-scale duplicates of the first five quarters released in the America the Beautiful Quarters Program, which began in 2010 to issue quarters featuring a national parks or other national site from each of the 50 states, the District of Columbia and the five U.S. territories. Hausman said the large size of the bullion coins caused problems during the coin-striking process, so a smaller than expected number was produced. “(The U.S. Mint) only produced 33,000 of each of the five coins for the entire world,” Hausman said. “It is a very rare piece because of the mintage.” Hausman said the limited availability of the coins led their price to skyrocket. A set of the five coins goes for $2,500 to $3,000 on eBay. The Mint last month required that its 11 authorized dealers sell the coins for no more than $975 each and enforce the ordering limit of one per household, Hausman said. Nine of the dealers agreed to participate and received 3,000 coins of each design. Since two purchasers are not selling the coins, another 700 coins of each design were distributed to dealers, Hausman said. The Gold Center received its allotment three weeks ago. “We primarily wanted to take care of our own customers and dealers. Once we got through that, we opened it up to the public on Monday morning at 10 a.m.,” he said. Just before 8 p.m. Sunday, groups of people started to pitch tents in The Gold Center’s parking lot. Hausman said he called Springfield police to tell the early-bird coin collectors to move until the morning. “This is a high-security facility and we can’t have people staying on the parking lot. And there’s no bathroom outside,” he said. On Monday morning, there were about 500 people. “There’s people who drove up from Louisiana, Colorado, Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin,” he said. Hausman said one man used an employment agency to have 50 people line up and each purchase a set of coins that he could later re-sell. “He was caught and told to leave,” he said. Some people also stood in line for others, which Hausman did not allow. Otherwise, the crowd was orderly, he said. Hausman said about 600 sets of coins were available Monday morning. They sold out by that afternoon. He said he predicts the set of coins to eventually be valued in the $15,000 to $20,000-range.
I don't know what the impact might be, but if the selloff in precious metals accelerates much, it could affect the market for the resellers of these sets. If the market starts to falter, just watch how quickly a bunch of these appear.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i>Other than that, I did accidentally blow the toll in Indiana as my gps girl said stay left and apparently I went through the e pass lane...OOps... >>
Find their website and pay online ASAP to avoid getting a bill in the mail with a $20 service charge. Give them the location and the time of day.
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
<< <i>checks, faxed DLs , all to people who have never seen or met ....Good luck with that! >>
Yup...I've given up on this dog and pony show. >>
You give credit card info including the 3 digit code on the back to internet sites with people you've never seen or met.
This is how these guys set up accounts. Don't sweat it, just go with it. We already have 1 person with an order confirmation. And others with orders. Things are moving. They just don't know how to deal with the volume. >>
A stolen CC can be charged back... there is protection.
<< <i>Here's my report from the Gold Center...A very spontaneous trip. I was no way way going but a buddy/collector called and then another and by Sunday at 7 pm we hit the road...Arrived Monday at at 2 am their time. A gentleman named Wayne saw us drive up and walked over. He explained they were all sitting over at Sonics next door and had worked it out with mngt that we could sit there. Later paid $5 a car and assume it went to sonics. We signed in on the list at approx 2:30 a.m. and were numbers 51-58. Not much activity after that until approx 640ish a.m. When a small crowd rushed the facility...It got crazy and everybody got the memo to go over...Later the sign in list guy put everyone in an orderly line. There were a few troublemakers that jumped the line and their was a guy that hired a temp agency called man power to make the buys...He did get bounced along with some buyers supposedly hired from the local Dennys and there were also people supposedly brought in from a soup kitchen......We went in, 5 at a time license and money, coins came out a secure steel box, and then basically they said get the hell outta the store. So at number 51 or so I got the coins at approx 11:30 and expect there were no more than 200-250 in the line. I did meet a forum member said his screen name was OldDan...and a guy supposedly first in line named Brian from Chicago...I was told by locals the owner was a jerk and was a small time guy for 30years and now thinks he's the King of the town...Other than that, I did accidentally blow the toll in Indiana as my gps girl said stay left and apparently I went through the e pass lane...OOps... >>
I guess that I was the "OldDan" that Casman met. btw - Casman a great guy - would hang out with him at Sonic at 4am anytime.
Newspaper reporter is very good and diligent and have had good results with her on other local items. I doubt that she "made up" the 500 or 600 number. However -- I was there and saw about 200 - 250 in line from 7am to 11am.
<< <i>I just got my sales confirmation e-mail from MTB - the price for the set is $860 + $25 commission + taxes. I played the same game of everyone else here only things I did not do is calling and go to their office, everything was done using my fax and e-mail. I had to push them around a little with some bs. >>
<< <i>“We primarily wanted to take care of our own customers and dealers. Once we got through that, we opened it up to the public on Monday morning at 10 a.m.,” he said.
Key word: Dealers
Man...it just doesn't get any better than that. I guess they didn't Miranda him first >>
Anyone contact the mint about the Gold Center yet?
I received my order confirmation from MTB this morning. I faxed and emaile my documents. The interesting thing is that the order confirmation looks to be from my faxed order since it has my fax number on it and I didn't provide a fax # on my email form.
Excellent BST board members who complete their deals: WONDERCOIN, DABIGKAHUNA, GEMSTATECOINS, FIVECENTS, SILVEREAGLES92, NEWMISMATIST, GTOster, SCHMITZ7,
<< <i>checks, faxed DLs , all to people who have never seen or met ....Good luck with that! >>
Yup...I've given up on this dog and pony show. >>
You give credit card info including the 3 digit code on the back to internet sites with people you've never seen or met.
This is how these guys set up accounts. Don't sweat it, just go with it. We already have 1 person with an order confirmation. And others with orders. Things are moving. They just don't know how to deal with the volume. >>
A stolen CC can be charged back... there is protection.
a faxed DL is an ID theft kit.
big difference. >>
These guys have been in business for years and didn't get AP status because they were small potatoes.
Many places ask for SSNs. This place doesn't. Do you refuse to do business with stock brokerages, mutual funds, banks, credit card companies, car insurance companies, etc?
Just because you haven't heard from them before today, doesn't mean they just popped up to get some ATBs and have their employees steal your identity.
<< <i>I received my order confirmation from MTB this morning. I faxed and emaile my documents. The interesting thing is that the order confirmation looks to be from my faxed order since it has my fax number on it and I didn't provide a fax # on my email form. >>
Did mine by phone. Still waiting on confirmation. Give them time. I'm restless, too. But it sounds like they are busier than they have ever been.
<< <i>“We primarily wanted to take care of our own customers and dealers. Once we got through that, we opened it up to the public on Monday morning at 10 a.m.,” he said.
Key word: Dealers
Man...it just doesn't get any better than that. I guess they didn't Miranda him first >>
Anyone contact the mint about the Gold Center yet? >>
Does anyone have an email address for any of the US Mint key individuals involved with the ATB bullion program or within the legal department?
<< <i>“We primarily wanted to take care of our own customers and dealers. Once we got through that, we opened it up to the public on Monday morning at 10 a.m.,” he said.
Key word: Dealers
Man...it just doesn't get any better than that. I guess they didn't Miranda him first >>
Anyone contact the mint about the Gold Center yet? >>
Does anyone have an email address for any of the US Mint key individuals involved with the ATB bullion program or within the legal department? >>
I can give you a contact info, but I'd like to give it to someone who went to the GC and can say first hand how many people were there. I'd also prefer it to go to someone who can prove with documentation that the Gold Center is a mail order company.
I'm just trying to keep contacts down to people with proof.
<< <i>Many places ask for SSNs. This place doesn't. Do you refuse to do business with stock brokerages, mutual funds, banks, credit card companies, car insurance companies, etc?
Just because you haven't heard from them before today, doesn't mean they just popped up to get some ATBs and have their employees steal your identity. >>
All those companies you list are either extending credit or paying interest that require a report to the IRS - buying $1000 worth of silver is not (yet)...
They are shipping your coins, so the assumption is you are not lying about your address
They have been doing business this way for years. I wouldn't expect them to change. They have a system. They are just following their normal procedures.
<< <i>They have been doing business this way for years. I wouldn't expect them to change. They have a system. They are just following their normal procedures. >>
Which is what the other AP's are doing. They have done business with certain people for years and they have a system of taking care of their best customers first. The AP's are just following their normal procedures (per the owner of The Gold Center)
MTB has my DL number, not a copy...as the victim of identity theft involving a bogus version of my license about 5 years ago, I don't just let anyone make a copy of it.
And the person who committed that crime was a teller at my bank, who was making copies of licenses for "our protection" when making large transactions...and then selling the info to scammers.
<< <i>Which is what the other AP's are doing. They have done business with certain people for years and they have a system of taking care of their best customers first. The AP's are just following their normal procedures (per the owner of The Gold Center) >>
Do you think the Mint's intent in rewriting the rules was to allow an AP to sell 80% of their allotment to their best customers?
<<Do you think the Mint's intent in rewriting the rules was to allow an AP to sell 80% of their allotment to their best customers? >>
And you just know their "best customers" aren't going to settle for a single set.
Just like news reports today re Goldman Sachs already steering huge blocks of Facebook stock to their big insiders...greed knows no limits!
And the abuses (in all aspects of life) will just continue or get worse until someone stops them...just look at all the screaming by the APs when the Mint actually attempted to set down some minimal rules! Now, they need to actually audit and enforce them.
Comments
<< <i>And now Coins n Things updates their website with:
"Coming Soon - Due to overwhelming demand order request will begin 2nd Quarter 2011
Please continue to visit this website for updates" >>
And that will be for the six sets not already sold under the table...
<< <i>What's the special number for Prudenrial Securities? Is the one on the first post their main number? >>
212-778-4654
Good Luck. So far nobody from this board has been able to get an order in with them. Nobody has spoken to a live person on that line. They have, however, updated the message as of yesterday.
mbogoman
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/classic-issues-colonials-through-1964/zambezi-collection-trade-dollars/7345Asesabi Lutho
<< <i>And now Coins n Things updates their website with:
"Coming Soon - Due to overwhelming demand order request will begin 2nd Quarter 2011
Please continue to visit this website for updates" >>
Please explain how Coins n Things can have "increasing demand" when they haven't made any available yet ( to "the public" that is)
Could they be overwhelmed BEFORE they start sales??? Not a good sign...
This whole thing is ridiculous. The mint should give the AP's 5 days to sell them or take them back and put them on their website.
<< <i>Thanks all. I guess I won't bother calling them.
This whole thing is ridiculous. The mint should give the AP's 5 days to sell them or take them back and put them on their website. >>
They would probably only get 2000 total from the 9 AP's back since the rest have already been sold to "The Boys"
I actually did this when I was at work. I accessed 4 computers that were not in use when the Jefferson Gold Spouse Coins went on sale.
Box of 20
"Coming Soon - Due to increasing prices on eBay we're going to horde our stash to maximize blackmarket profit potential beginning in the 2nd Quarter of 2011.
Please continue to visit this website for doubletalk, lies and outright deceptions"
Is it possible to both be laughing and dying a little inside..because that's how I'm feeling right now!
The Second Quarter...what, to overlap Mint sales?!? Whatever they're smoking, please pass the bong around to the rest of us...must be some good s***!
<< <i>...and someone can't count. Was there a line of 200 or 500? big difference >>
I'll bet they have the cash register receipts to prove that those 500 people came thru the door......
<< <i>Good Luck. So far nobody from this board has been able to get an order in with them. Nobody has spoken to a live person on that line. They have, however, updated the message as of yesterday. >>
The message is kind of suspicious, IMO. Something like "they are working through the orders as fast as they can" doesn't make sense. It implies that there are orders from other means... mail, fax, etc. I would expect it to say, "We are taking orders..." or "we are answering calls..." but to phrase it as 'working through the orders' implies that they already have the orders and they are merely working to fulfill them, rather than take them.
<< <i>
<< <i>Nothing in the Mint rules prevented what The Gold Center did. They could not sell sets to their own employees or Corporate Officers. As I stated last week - once the AP's realized they could only make 10%, they made sure they took care of their best customers. If you had done business with a company for years, what would you rather have as a Christmas gift: a set of pucks that are worth three times the sale price or a tin of popcorn? >>
Read them again. They were prohibited from selling to DEALERS. They were supposed to sell to the general public. I would expect them to sell to their best household customers, but NOT dealers which they were expressly prohibited from doing. >>
That quote convinces me that my earlier speculation was correct---I think he is going to blow a bunch off to telemarketers and then surrender his AP license.
<< <i>No mention of 'general public', just 'public' in the Mint rules. No prohibition of selling a single set to a dealer. A dealer is a member of the public that has an address, so selling one to him does not violate the terms. The AP's must sell all the coins to the public - not all at once, so contacting their chosen 'public' to see if they are interested in acquiring a set before selling OTC is allowed. >>
A dealer is NOT the public, it is a commercial entity. And a store is NOT a household. Now if they sold one set to the owners of the shops that buy from them, that is understandable, but 3100 sets? We all know what really happened. US Mint, audit those sales!
"Hello"
"I'm calling to confirm that you received my account set-up info...I faxed and e-mailed it yesterday."
"Yeah."
"So I have an account set up?"
"Yeah."
"Good...What's the number? How much should I write the check out for?"
"Call back later."
"Hold on...what's my account number?"
"We're really busy...no time to check."
"So do I have an account or not?"
"I don't know...probably...call back later."
[click]
So for everyone putting any stock in MTB's recordkeeping...good luck there.
I hope CoinWorld has someone reading this thread on this and looking into it for an article.
I hope the APs get called to the carpet for their handling of this.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
His name is Steve Roach [sroach@amospress.com]...so please...please...please...feel free to pile on with all your ATB gripes and experiences.
Bad press seems to be the only motivator left in this world!
<< <i>
<< <i>No mention of 'general public', just 'public' in the Mint rules. No prohibition of selling a single set to a dealer. A dealer is a member of the public that has an address, so selling one to him does not violate the terms. The AP's must sell all the coins to the public - not all at once, so contacting their chosen 'public' to see if they are interested in acquiring a set before selling OTC is allowed. >>
A dealer is NOT the public, it is a commercial entity. And a store it NOT a household. Now if they sold one set to the owners of the shops that buy from them, that is understandable, but 3100 sets? We all know what really happened. US Mint, audit those sales! >>
I am sure that is what they have done, plus the owner's employees, the dealer's best customers, the dealer's mother, sister, brother and his family, his second cousin twice removed on their mother's side. The Mint can audit these sales until they are blue in the face. The AP's will have supporting documentation for each and every sale. The fact that we don't like who they are selling them do does not mean they have violated their agreement.
It is time to face the facts, we are 3 weeks out and these AP's have sold 90% or more of their sets.
Don't be too sure about that...when people get greedy, they get stupid. Most tax evasion cases prove that point.
Dummying up records for bulk under the counter transactions might be tough if someone actually attemps to call a few of the alledged purchasers on the list. That's also how voter registration fraud is usually uncovered, "What petition? I never signed that petition!"
<< <i>I was so incensed at the crap I was shoveled yesterday that I was actually e-mailing back and forth with an editor at Coin World.
His name is Steve Roach [sroach@amospress.com]...so please...please...please...feel free to pile on with all your ATB gripes and experiences.
Bad press seems to be the only motivator left in this world! >>
Has he read this thread?
The Mint staff REALLY should read this thread as well.
Great job getting in touch with him.
The main gist of this discussion thread has developed into supplying strong evidence that the mint's approved purchasers are individually corrupt, and that the system itself, of having only about a dozen approved purchasers, engenders corruption. We need to eliminate the system completely.
The mint's distribution system, such as set up in Plainfield Indiana, is the only way that collectible US government coins should be sold to anyone. Bulk sales of bullion coins might be handled by requiring minimum orders, such as a monster box minimum. The approved purchasers are an extra unnecessary corrupt middleman.
<<The Mint staff REALLY should read this thread as well.>>
Probably not. Call me old fashioned, but I didn't think it was right for me to invite "outsiders" into our conversations.
But others might feel differently...
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Story on Coins sold at The Gold Center >>
Eventully valued in the $15K+ range?????????? Based on what? >>
I think the good fellas in Springfield is referring to $15k-$20k Japanese yen. >>
I wonder if he will buy them back at $15K?
ARTICLE
Silver bullion coins attract crowd of collectors to Springfield
By AMANDA REAVY (amanda.reavy@sj-r.com)
THE STATE JOURNAL-REGISTER
Posted Jan 03, 2011 @ 11:30 PM
Last update Jan 04, 2011 @ 05:52 AM
Copyright 2011 The State Journal-Register. Some rights reserved.
Hundreds of people from across the country flooded The Gold Center Monday to get their hands on a set of rare America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins. The Gold Center, 3000 W. Iles Ave., was one of only nine outlets nationwide that were able to sell the coins to the public Monday. Owner Jim Hausman opened sales at 10 a.m. Monday, but a crowd of people had camped outside outside the business starting Sunday night. Springfield police were called to disperse those gathered before Monday, and Hausman hired three off-duty Sangamon County deputies to provide security and crowd control Monday. No arrests were made, though Hausman said one man who tried to cheat the limit of one coin of each design per household was told to leave. The coins are 3 inches in diameter and made up of 5 ounces of .999 fine silver. They are the first such coins produced by the U.S. Mint, according to the mint’s website.They are larger-scale duplicates of the first five quarters released in the America the Beautiful Quarters Program, which began in 2010 to issue quarters featuring a national parks or other national site from each of the 50 states, the District of Columbia and the five U.S. territories. Hausman said the large size of the bullion coins caused problems during the coin-striking process, so a smaller than expected number was produced. “(The U.S. Mint) only produced 33,000 of each of the five coins for the entire world,” Hausman said. “It is a very rare piece because of the mintage.” Hausman said the limited availability of the coins led their price to skyrocket. A set of the five coins goes for $2,500 to $3,000 on eBay. The Mint last month required that its 11 authorized dealers sell the coins for no more than $975 each and enforce the ordering limit of one per household, Hausman said. Nine of the dealers agreed to participate and received 3,000 coins of each design. Since two purchasers are not selling the coins, another 700 coins of each design were distributed to dealers, Hausman said. The Gold Center received its allotment three weeks ago.
“We primarily wanted to take care of our own customers and dealers. Once we got through that, we opened it up to the public on Monday morning at 10 a.m.,” he said. Just before 8 p.m. Sunday, groups of people started to pitch tents in The Gold Center’s parking lot. Hausman said he called Springfield police to tell the early-bird coin collectors to move until the morning. “This is a high-security facility and we can’t have people staying on the parking lot. And there’s no bathroom outside,” he said. On Monday morning, there were about 500 people. “There’s people who drove up from Louisiana, Colorado, Ohio, Michigan, Wisconsin,” he said. Hausman said one man used an employment agency to have 50 people line up and each purchase a set of coins that he could later re-sell. “He was caught and told to leave,” he said. Some people also stood in line for others, which Hausman did not allow. Otherwise, the crowd was orderly, he said. Hausman said about 600 sets of coins were available Monday morning. They sold out by that afternoon. He said he predicts the set of coins to eventually be valued in the $15,000 to $20,000-range.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Other than that, I did accidentally blow the toll in Indiana as my gps girl said stay left and apparently I went through the e pass lane...OOps...
Find their website and pay online ASAP to avoid getting a bill in the mail with a $20 service charge. Give them the location and the time of day.
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<< <i>checks, faxed DLs , all to people who have never seen or met ....Good luck with that! >>
Yup...I've given up on this dog and pony show. >>
You give credit card info including the 3 digit code on the back to internet sites with people you've never seen or met.
This is how these guys set up accounts. Don't sweat it, just go with it. We already have 1 person with an order confirmation. And others with orders. Things are moving. They just don't know how to deal with the volume. >>
A stolen CC can be charged back... there is protection.
a faxed DL is an ID theft kit.
big difference.
Loves me some shiny!
<< <i>Here's my report from the Gold Center...A very spontaneous trip. I was no way way going but a buddy/collector called and then another and by Sunday at 7 pm we hit the road...Arrived Monday at at 2 am their time. A gentleman named Wayne saw us drive up and walked over. He explained they were all sitting over at Sonics next door and had worked it out with mngt that we could sit there. Later paid $5 a car and assume it went to sonics. We signed in on the list at approx 2:30 a.m. and were numbers 51-58. Not much activity after that until approx 640ish a.m. When a small crowd rushed the facility...It got crazy and everybody got the memo to go over...Later the sign in list guy put everyone in an orderly line. There were a few troublemakers that jumped the line and their was a guy that hired a temp agency called man power to make the buys...He did get bounced along with some buyers supposedly hired from the local Dennys and there were also people supposedly brought in from a soup kitchen......We went in, 5 at a time license and money, coins came out a secure steel box, and then basically they said get the hell outta the store. So at number 51 or so I got the coins at approx 11:30 and expect there were no more than 200-250 in the line. I did meet a forum member said his screen name was OldDan...and a guy supposedly first in line named Brian from Chicago...I was told by locals the owner was a jerk and was a small time guy for 30years and now thinks he's the King of the town...Other than that, I did accidentally blow the toll in Indiana as my gps girl said stay left and apparently I went through the e pass lane...OOps...
I guess that I was the "OldDan" that Casman met. btw - Casman a great guy - would hang out with him at Sonic at 4am anytime.
Newspaper reporter is very good and diligent and have had good results with her on other local items. I doubt that she "made up" the 500 or 600 number. However -- I was there and saw about 200 - 250 in line from 7am to 11am.
<< <i>I just got my sales confirmation e-mail from MTB - the price for the set is $860 + $25 commission + taxes. I played the same game of everyone else here only things I did not do is calling and go to their office, everything was done using my fax and e-mail. I had to push them around a little with some bs. >>
Things are slowly rolling with them.
They are overwhelmed.
Give them a chance to catch up.
<< <i>“We primarily wanted to take care of our own customers and dealers. Once we got through that, we opened it up to the public on Monday morning at 10 a.m.,” he said.
Key word: Dealers
Man...it just doesn't get any better than that. I guess they didn't Miranda him first
Anyone contact the mint about the Gold Center yet?
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<< <i>checks, faxed DLs , all to people who have never seen or met ....Good luck with that! >>
Yup...I've given up on this dog and pony show. >>
You give credit card info including the 3 digit code on the back to internet sites with people you've never seen or met.
This is how these guys set up accounts. Don't sweat it, just go with it. We already have 1 person with an order confirmation. And others with orders. Things are moving. They just don't know how to deal with the volume. >>
A stolen CC can be charged back... there is protection.
a faxed DL is an ID theft kit.
big difference. >>
These guys have been in business for years and didn't get AP status because they were small potatoes.
Many places ask for SSNs. This place doesn't. Do you refuse to do business with stock brokerages, mutual funds, banks, credit card companies, car insurance companies, etc?
Just because you haven't heard from them before today, doesn't mean they just popped up to get some ATBs and have their employees steal your identity.
<< <i>I received my order confirmation from MTB this morning. I faxed and emaile my documents. The interesting thing is that the order confirmation looks to be from my faxed order since it has my fax number on it and I didn't provide a fax # on my email form. >>
Did mine by phone. Still waiting on confirmation. Give them time. I'm restless, too. But it sounds like they are busier than they have ever been.
What is that right below the Address area?
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<< <i>“We primarily wanted to take care of our own customers and dealers. Once we got through that, we opened it up to the public on Monday morning at 10 a.m.,” he said.
Key word: Dealers
Man...it just doesn't get any better than that. I guess they didn't Miranda him first
Anyone contact the mint about the Gold Center yet? >>
Does anyone have an email address for any of the US Mint key individuals involved with the ATB bullion program or within the legal department?
<< <i>[qMany places ask for SSNs. This place doesn't. >>
What is that right below the Address area? >>
My mistake. I forgot. I thought it was just the DL they asked for. Still, you give this type of info to lots of companies!
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<< <i>“We primarily wanted to take care of our own customers and dealers. Once we got through that, we opened it up to the public on Monday morning at 10 a.m.,” he said.
Key word: Dealers
Man...it just doesn't get any better than that. I guess they didn't Miranda him first
Anyone contact the mint about the Gold Center yet? >>
Does anyone have an email address for any of the US Mint key individuals involved with the ATB bullion program or within the legal department? >>
I can give you a contact info, but I'd like to give it to someone who went to the GC and can say first hand how many people were there. I'd also prefer it to go to someone who can prove with documentation that the Gold Center is a mail order company.
I'm just trying to keep contacts down to people with proof.
<< <i>Many places ask for SSNs. This place doesn't. Do you refuse to do business with stock brokerages, mutual funds, banks, credit card companies, car insurance companies, etc?
Just because you haven't heard from them before today, doesn't mean they just popped up to get some ATBs and have their employees steal your identity. >>
All those companies you list are either extending credit or paying interest that require a report to the IRS - buying $1000 worth of silver is not (yet)...
They are shipping your coins, so the assumption is you are not lying about your address
<< <i>They have been doing business this way for years. I wouldn't expect them to change. They have a system. They are just following their normal procedures. >>
Which is what the other AP's are doing. They have done business with certain people for years and they have a system of taking care of their best customers first. The AP's are just following their normal procedures (per the owner of The Gold Center)
And the person who committed that crime was a teller at my bank, who was making copies of licenses for "our protection" when making large transactions...and then selling the info to scammers.
Good stuff, no?
Miles
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<< <i>Looks like the only thing coins n things have left are empty boxes
http://cgi.ebay.com/AMERICA-BEAUTIFUL-5-OZ-OUNCE-EMPTY-CASE-ROLL-silver-/270687523330?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f063bd202 >>
Bridgewater, MA, >>
WINNING BID $ 31 + $ 10 SHIPPING = $ 41
<< <i>Which is what the other AP's are doing. They have done business with certain people for years and they have a system of taking care of their best customers first. The AP's are just following their normal procedures (per the owner of The Gold Center) >>
Do you think the Mint's intent in rewriting the rules was to allow an AP to sell 80% of their allotment to their best customers?
And you just know their "best customers" aren't going to settle for a single set.
Just like news reports today re Goldman Sachs already steering huge blocks of Facebook stock to their big insiders...greed knows no limits!
And the abuses (in all aspects of life) will just continue or get worse until someone stops them...just look at all the screaming by the APs when the Mint actually attempted to set down some minimal rules! Now, they need to actually audit and enforce them.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment