<< <i>Has anyone acquired the pucks at a price lower than APMEX? They charged $859.95 + $19.95 shipping ($879.90 total). Wouldn't the other sellers be close to this price - and the ones in Springfield be less, as no shipping? I would think theirs would be $859.95... >>
ProofCollection posted this morning:
Just emailed back my Patriot form & passport scan to MTB, asked them to reply with payment instructions and they returned a sales confirmation.
$860 for the set $45 Freight $25 Commission
"Please make checks payable to Manfra, Tordella & Brookes Inc.
We hold personal checks for 17 calendar days.
As I mentioned, we are still waiting for the capsules to arrive, I will let you know when it will ship"
I just received official confirmation and bill of sale from MBT that I'm being sold one complete set of the five silver, five ounce coins in the "America the Beautiful" series. Total cost is $930.00, broken down as $860. for the coins themselves, $45.00 for freight and $25.00 for commission.
Checks will take a minimum of 17 business days to clear while bank wire transfers will go through practically immediately. They are awaiting receipt of the properly sized capsules to hold the coins before shipping them. It could be a maximum of six weeks (which counting 17 business days for checks to clear isn't that much of an extension) but that they hope/anticipate receiving the capsules in the near future, thereby sending the coins out much sooner.
I just got back after my unsuccessful trip to MTB. I got there around 1:30pm. There were anywhere from 40-50 people ahead of me on line, prolly 30 of whom had black hats & long black coats (not ONE of them collectors). They were milling about, ignoring instructions to form a polite and quiet line and generally were a nuisance to everyone else patiently waiting. At 1:50pm or so, a gentleman from MTB came out and said sales were done for the day and to call in the morning. It was obvious to me that this was a result of the disturbances in the lobby by these gentlemen on line.
As I was waiting... one of them asked what the line was for (as he was standing on line!!!!!!) and got right on his Blackberry to contact the rest of his troops to come down and get some sets.
Of the 40-50 people on line, I'd guess that no more than 10% there were collectors... the rest were there for the profits.
Almost reminded me of the Ferengie from Star Trek.... except the Ferengie are far more polite.
Successful BSTs with adriana, barrytrot, Bochiman, Dabigkahuna, Modern Coin Mart, oilstates2003, terburn88, THEGENERAL
What is with the $25 commission MTB is charging? The 10% profit is in the coin price ($860), so are they violating their agreement? Do we need to call the Mint and put a stop to this gouging?
Just got off the phone with Mint Public Affairs and then Treasury Legal Affairs in DC.
They were EXTREMLY interested in MTB's BLAME THE MINT routine...in fact, they were also very happy to know that I recorded it on my cell phone!
They will definitely be looking into the policies and procedures as practiced by MTB today, up to and possibly including stripping them of their AP status for future coin programs.
And although I'm still seething, I feel better that I may have damaged MTB going forward!
(PS...I was one of the non-black coat/hat wearing men...second on line when they stopped sales 2 hours early (a wasted 3 hours)!)
<< <i>What is with the $25 commission MTB is charging? The 10% profit is in the coin price ($860), so are they violating their agreement? Do we need to call the Mint and put a stop to this gouging? >>
<<The Gold Center people paid over $60 tax on the sale....this is still cheaper >>
No it's not...MTB was also charging the normal 8+% sales tax this AM...and wouldn't allow you to add anything to your order to get it up over $1000, which someone said was the cut-off for charging tax...so don't expect any breaks from those bloodsuckers!
<< <i>prolly 30 of whom had black hats & long black coats (not ONE of them collectors). They were milling about, ignoring instructions to form a polite and quiet line and generally were a nuisance to everyone else patiently waiting. >>
Now that's funny (only 'cuz I wasn't there) because I can picture exactly what they looked like.
<< <i>What is with the $25 commission MTB is charging? The 10% profit is in the coin price ($860), so are they violating their agreement? Do we need to call the Mint and put a stop to this gouging? >>
The Gold Center people paid over $60 tax on the sale....this is still cheaper >>
Bullion is exempt from sales tax in Illinois
<< <i>Effective January 11, 1985, receipts from sales of certain legal tender, medallions, and bullion are exempt from the sales tax. See Public Act 83-1495 (Senate Bill 1727). "Legal tender" includes currency, gold coins, silver coins, and any other item accepted as money in the country in which it is issued. "Medallions" are coins, other than legal tender, which are issued by a governmental body, usually as a memorial. "Bullion" is gold, silver, or platinum in a bulk state with a purity of not less than 980 parts per 1,000. To qualify for the exemption the legal tender or medallions must have been issued by the State of Illinois, the United State , or the government of any foreign country EXCEPT the Republic of South Africa. >>
<< <i><<The Gold Center people paid over $60 tax on the sale....this is still cheaper >>
No it's not...MTB was also charging the normal 8+% sales tax this AM...and wouldn't allow you to add anything to your order to get it up over $1000, which someone said was the cut-off for charging tax...so don't expect any breaks from those bloodsuckers! >>
I humbly stand corrected....I forgot the successful purchases here were out of state purchases
<< <i>I just received official confirmation and bill of sale from MBT that I'm being sold one complete set of the five silver, five ounce coins in the "America the Beautiful" series. Total cost is $930.00, broken down as $860. for the coins themselves, $45.00 for freight and $25.00 for commission.
Checks will take a minimum of 17 business days to clear while bank wire transfers will go through practically immediately. They are awaiting receipt of the properly sized capsules to hold the coins before shipping them. It could be a maximum of six weeks (which counting 17 business days for checks to clear isn't that much of an extension) but that they hope/anticipate receiving the capsules in the near future, thereby sending the coins out much sooner. >>
I was going to send a bank wire but the instructions said not to send funds until an account was set up. Not thinking that my account was set up as I had just faxed the forms, I sent a certified bank check via USPS Express Mail w/delivery before noon tomorrow. I certainly hope that they don't hold a certified bank check for so long.
<< <i>Just got off the phone with Mint Public Affairs and then Treasury Legal Affairs in DC.
They were EXTREMLY interested in MTB's BLAME THE MINT routine...in fact, they were also very happy to know that I recorded it on my cell phone!
They will definitely be looking into the policies and procedures as practiced by MTB today, up to and possibly including stripping them of their AP status for future coin programs.
And although I'm still seething, I feel better that I may have damaged MTB going forward!
(PS...I was one of the non-black coat/hat wearing men...second on line when they stopped sales 2 hours early (a wasted 3 hours)!) >>
At least MTB is selling some of the things and not just to walk-ins. What about all the others who aren't doing jack? What about the HSN fiasco, etc...
Just to elaborate on the MTB debacle...it wasn't like an unruly mob had formed before they cut off sales, in fact the line was located directly in front of the main lobby security desk and the guard wasn't having any problems.
It might have helped if someone from MTB actually appeared at some point to provide an update or instructions, before making people wait hours in vain.
<< <i> I was going to send a bank wire but the instructions said not to send funds until an account was set up. Not thinking that my account was set up as I had just faxed the forms, I sent a certified bank check via USPS Express Mail w/delivery before noon tomorrow. I certainly hope that they don't hold a certified bank check for so long. >>
I thought they were holding shipment for 8 weeks or so because of lack of capsules.....The 10-17 days for a personal check to clear would be way before shipment is ready
As of this writing, none of the Authorized Purchasers have said they will begin accepting orders from the public before January 3, 2011. The 9 AP's who will offer the .999 fine America the Beautiful Silver Coins include:
¡A-Mark Precious Metals, Los Angeles, CA - www.amark.com ¡American Precious Metals Exchange - Oklahoma City, OK - www.apmex.com ¡Coins 'N Things, Bridgewater, MA - atb.cntofma.com ¡Dillon Gage Inc. Dallas, TX - www.dillongage.com ¡FideliTrade Inc., Wilmington, DE - www.fidelitrade.com ¡The Gold Center, Springfield, IL - (217)793-8002 ¡Jack Hunt Coin Broker, Buffalo, NY - www.jackhunt.com ¡MTB, New York City, NY - www.mtbcoins.com ¡Prudential Securities Inc., New York City, NY - (212)778-6667
Just to elaborate on the MTB debacle...it wasn't like an unruly mob had formed before they cut off sales, in fact the line was located directly in front of the main lobby security desk and the guard wasn't having any problems.
It might have helped if someone from MTB actually appeared at some point to provide an update or instructions, before making people wait hours in vain.
And as for capsules...they were handing them out in soft plastic and envelopes today...so suddenly they're concerned about damage? More likely they want to kill all 17 (and I thought I had misheard that number, silly me) days for check clearing!
<< <i>At least MTB is selling some of the things and not just to walk-ins. What about all the others who aren't doing jack? What about the HSN fiasco, etc... >>
This morning I called Jack, the director of the ATB Bullion program, and left a message about the HSN video. He hasn't returned my call yet. I suspect he's quite busy today listening to all of the complaints he's been receiving.
<< <i> I was going to send a bank wire but the instructions said not to send funds until an account was set up. Not thinking that my account was set up as I had just faxed the forms, I sent a certified bank check via USPS Express Mail w/delivery before noon tomorrow. I certainly hope that they don't hold a certified bank check for so long. >>
I thought they were holding shipment for 8 weeks or so because of lack of capsules.....The 10-17 days for a personal check to clear would be way before shipment is ready >>
Correct, but I thought that he said that they may ship more quickly if capsules became available.
<< <i>Just to elaborate on the MTB debacle...it wasn't like an unruly mob had formed before they cut off sales, in fact the line was located directly in front of the main lobby security desk and the guard wasn't having any problems.
It might have helped if someone from MTB actually appeared at some point to provide an update or instructions, before making people wait hours in vain.
And as for capsules...they were handing them out in soft plastic and envelopes today...so suddenly they're concerned about damage? More likely they want to kill all 17 (and I thought I had misheard that number, silly me) days for check clearing! >>
You mean they turned away those guys waiting there since this morning?
I spoke with Apmex today and they are not offering any of the ATB sets for sale at this time.
I got a call from Scotsman Coins and they are offering the sets for $2,450 or something like that. I didn't get the exact number because my eyes were already shooting blood when he said $2,400........I didn't bother asking him how they got a supply of them, but he volunteered that they had paid $2,280 for theirs.....
I have one comment. Just say no.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
I just got off the phone from FideliTrade. They will begin selling this week. They are selling the whole set. I think I will wait and see how this pans out. Wilmington is only an hour away from me. I would even drive up there to get the set.
<< <i>I would lighten up on MTB. They obviously never dealt with the public like this before. At least they are selling and be grateful for that. I would gladly pay their commission. I am still deciding whether I want to purchase from them. >>
Their $930 is still the least expensive of all (not counting the 380 lucky APMEX gamblers).
<< <i><<The Gold Center people paid over $60 tax on the sale....this is still cheaper >>
No it's not...MTB was also charging the normal 8+% sales tax this AM...and wouldn't allow you to add anything to your order to get it up over $1000, which someone said was the cut-off for charging tax...so don't expect any breaks from those bloodsuckers! >>
I humbly stand corrected....I forgot the successful purchases here were out of state purchases >>
Soooooooooo how the Gold Center price WITHOUT tax and shipping was higher than MTB ($930 per poster here) WITH the shipping and commission. Methinks a tax was added
<< <i>Gold Center Update #3 Price verified by the owner directly for $975 >>
If you happen to invest any time in calling the Mint, you should have the information in this thread to present to them, i.e., Gold Center selling about 300 and saying that only 10 sets are left, Apmex selling 380 and not selling any more, TV scammers selling hundreds at exorbitant prices, people showing up on ebay with multiple sets at exorbitant prices BEFORE the AP's started selling any of them to "the public", ad nauseum. Get your data together and try to get the point across.
The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i>If you happen to invest any time in calling the Mint, you should have the information in this thread to present to them, i.e., Gold Center selling about 300 and saying that only 10 sets are left, Apmex selling 380 and not selling any more, TV scammers selling hundreds at exorbitant prices, people showing up on ebay with multiple sets at exorbitant prices BEFORE the AP's started selling any of them to "the public", ad nauseum. Get your data together and try to get the point across.
The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance. >>
<< <i> The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance. >>
I don't think any of them are playing fair BUT I am sure they have names and addresses to back up ALL the sales....one per name. That is what the delay is...getting all those names together.
The Mint can't drop all of them since they do provide a service for them and remove the grief of dealing with a bazillion bullion buyers. 11 is a much more controlled number
The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance.
As stated before in a previous post, do you think the mint would get rid of most of their Bullion Distributors because of what is happening and destabilize their distribution network. Could they easily be replaced? I really don't know the answer to that.
<< I would lighten up on MTB. They obviously never dealt with the public like this before. At least they are selling and be grateful for that. I would gladly pay their commission. I am still deciding whether I want to purchase from them. >>
I will absolutely NOT lighten up on them...in fact I've contacted both the Mint and Coin World's editors...I blew over 3 hours this morning, including a trip to the bank and $40 in cabfare to have a door slammed in my face!
No way, I was there, cash in hand as instructed...and they decided to close at 1:35 instead of 3:00 today, because "We just can't take it anymore?" WTF? Just to be clear, THEY LOCKED THEIR DOORS ON AT LEAST 40 PEOPLE who were waiting without any prior notice or announcements!
And then it comes out that they have been selling them to their select customers over the phone, despite the fact that we called from the line and asked and would have ordered them right then and there. AND then, when we asked if we could hand in our completed USA Patriot Act forms to expediate this suddenly magical account set-up...they said "No...and get out of our office!"
So, no way, no how am I cutting them any slack! They're scum....they run a sleazy outfit...and the Mint should drop them like hot potatos!
<< <i>I don't think any of them are playing fair BUT I am sure they have names and addresses to back up ALL the sales....one per name. That is what the delay is...getting all those names together. >>
There's no reason that HSN or similar couldn't have provided an AP with a list of names and addresses of hundreds of employees, along with order assignments where each purchaser directed the AP to send their order to HSN (i.e., drop ship) instead of them. I think an arrangement like that *may* have technically met the conditions. An AP would have gladly done that to reduce shipping and packaging effort.
<< <i>The Mint can't drop all of them since they do provide a service for them and remove the grief of dealing with a bazillion bullion buyers. 11 is a much more controlled number >>
The mint only needs to drop one of them and it will send the appropriate message.
Ed Moy is disputing Beth Deisher's characterization of the ATB program of "moving from bungling a debacle" in the Coin World Editorial.
They had 2 years before December 2010 to get their act together. They took 14 months to get the coin press onsite, and the rest of the process from March 8, 2010 forward involved installation and startup.
As a Monday-morning quarterback, I have to wonder why they didn't call up one of their counterparts at the Aussie Mint or the Canadian Mint and ask them where they got their press for larger coins? It's not like they've never been to a business conference or a trade show where they all get entertained by vendors and enjoy a few days at taxpayer expense. 14 Months to find and obtain a press? I'm sorry, but the responsibility goes to the top. Moy didn't make it happen.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i>What is with the $25 commission MTB is charging? The 10% profit is in the coin price ($860), so are they violating their agreement? Do we need to call the Mint and put a stop to this gouging? >>
They charge 1% commission to all retail customers. They have before this and they are for this.
Let me make a prediction re MTB...their fax and telephone lines will be busy and their e-mail won't accept any new messages until 1 second after they "sell out" their supply. I guess their phones only make outgoing calls.
Real shoestring operation they must be running there!
<< <i><< I would lighten up on MTB. They obviously never dealt with the public like this before. At least they are selling and be grateful for that. I would gladly pay their commission. I am still deciding whether I want to purchase from them. >>
I will absolutely NOT lighten up on them...in fact I've contacted both the Mint and Coin World's editors...I blew over 3 hours this morning, including a trip to the bank and $40 in cabfare to have a door slammed in my face!
No way, I was there, cash in hand as instructed...and they decided to close at 1:35 instead of 3:00 today, because "We just can't take it anymore?" WTF? Just to be clear, THEY LOCKED THEIR DOORS ON AT LEAST 40 PEOPLE who were waiting without any prior notice or announcements!
And then it comes out that they have been selling them to their select customers over the phone, despite the fact that we called from the line and asked and would have ordered them right then and there. AND then, when we asked if we could hand in our completed USA Patriot Act forms to expediate this suddenly magical account set-up...they said "No...and get out of our office!"
So, no way, no how am I cutting them any slack! They're scum....they run a sleazy outfit...and the Mint should drop them like hot potatos! >>
I can definitely understand why you're fuming!! I would be soooooooooooooooooooooo p.o.'d! I'm p.o.'d for you just reading about what you went through.
<< <i> There's no reason that HSN or similar couldn't have provided an AP with a list of names and addresses of hundreds of employees, along with order assignments where each purchaser directed the AP to send their order to HSN (i.e., drop ship) instead of them. I think an arrangement like that *may* have technically met the conditions. An AP would have gladly done that to reduce shipping and packaging effort.
>>
Let me take this a step further.
What if an order taken by HSN is a Household? HSN then approaches, (already has a deal with) an AP with a list of 500 HH, 1 per. I think this would be doable. I'm not much a believer that a company would mkae its employees purchase item for the show.
<< <i>If you happen to invest any time in calling the Mint, you should have the information in this thread to present to them, i.e., Gold Center selling about 300 and saying that only 10 sets are left, Apmex selling 380 and not selling any more, TV scammers selling hundreds at exorbitant prices, people showing up on ebay with multiple sets at exorbitant prices BEFORE the AP's started selling any of them to "the public", ad nauseum. Get your data together and try to get the point across.
The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance. >>
all of the above except for the gold center info has been given to the mint.
if someone with first hand knowledge of the gold center's practices wants to contact them, I'll give out the mint contact info. however, I caution and condition my response on people having the knowledge first hand and have proof they do mail order.
I do not want to waste their time investigating anything without proof.
<<I can definitely understand why you're fuming!! I would be soooooooooooooooooooooo p.o.'d! I'm p.o.'d for you just reading about what you went through. >>
My wife saw the look on my face when I got home...she thought someone died...and I blurted out "I feel like I got the short end of the bar of soap in a prison shower!!!"
And when I got in line there were only about 15 people ahead of me, and I thought. "Gee that's not too bad." Maybe an hour, tops.
But no, they dragged us through the mill at about 1 person every 15 minutes, bringing you downstairs into their offices with an escort a single person at a time. Meanwhile, they had a bulletproof glass cashier's window set-up in their lobby that wasn't being used...so you go figure out their logic.
And 3 hours later...get out of offices...we don't care if you're next or we're supposed to be open for 2 more hours. "Go blame the Mint. They forced us to do it this way!"
<< <i>Let me make a prediction re MTB...their fax and telephone lines will be busy and their e-mail won't accept any new messages until 1 second after they "sell out" their supply. I guess their phones only make outgoing calls.
Real shoestring operation they must be running there! >>
you have to realize they are getting weeks worth of calls in 1 day.
the "bounced e-mails" have been an issue since I've been in touch with them in early december.
It was poor customer service to cut-off sales early without advance warning, and really poor customer service to not sell anything else with these to get them above the no tax limit.
However, I do not feel that anything they are doing is worthy of bugging the mint about. even the $25 commission. they charge 1% commission, with $25 min., to all retail customers. They have since I first contacted them as a source back in November.
Nothing MTB has done rises past poor customer service. This is not something to contact the mint over.
Comments
<< <i>Has anyone acquired the pucks at a price lower than APMEX? They charged $859.95 + $19.95 shipping ($879.90 total). Wouldn't the other sellers be close to this price - and the ones in Springfield be less, as no shipping? I would think theirs would be $859.95... >>
ProofCollection posted this morning:
Just emailed back my Patriot form & passport scan to MTB, asked them to reply with payment instructions and they returned a sales confirmation.
$860 for the set
$45 Freight
$25 Commission
"Please make checks payable to Manfra, Tordella & Brookes Inc.
We hold personal checks for 17 calendar days.
As I mentioned, we are still waiting for the capsules to arrive, I will let you know when it will ship"
Checks will take a minimum of 17 business days to clear while bank wire transfers will go through practically immediately. They are awaiting receipt of the properly sized capsules to hold the coins before shipping them. It could be a maximum of six weeks (which counting 17 business days for checks to clear isn't that much of an extension) but that they hope/anticipate receiving the capsules in the near future, thereby sending the coins out much sooner.
As I was waiting... one of them asked what the line was for (as he was standing on line!!!!!!) and got right on his Blackberry to contact the rest of his troops to come down and get some sets.
Of the 40-50 people on line, I'd guess that no more than 10% there were collectors... the rest were there for the profits.
Almost reminded me of the Ferengie from Star Trek.... except the Ferengie are far more polite.
They were EXTREMLY interested in MTB's BLAME THE MINT routine...in fact, they were also very happy to know that I recorded it on my cell phone!
They will definitely be looking into the policies and procedures as practiced by MTB today, up to and possibly including stripping them of their AP status for future coin programs.
And although I'm still seething, I feel better that I may have damaged MTB going forward!
(PS...I was one of the non-black coat/hat wearing men...second on line when they stopped sales 2 hours early (a wasted 3 hours)!)
<< <i>What is with the $25 commission MTB is charging? The 10% profit is in the coin price ($860), so are they violating their agreement? Do we need to call the Mint and put a stop to this gouging? >>
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK!!!!!!!!!!
The Gold Center people paid over $60 tax on the sale....this is still cheaper
No it's not...MTB was also charging the normal 8+% sales tax this AM...and wouldn't allow you to add anything to your order to get it up over $1000, which someone said was the cut-off for charging tax...so don't expect any breaks from those bloodsuckers!
<< <i>prolly 30 of whom had black hats & long black coats (not ONE of them collectors). They were milling about, ignoring instructions to form a polite and quiet line and generally were a nuisance to everyone else patiently waiting. >>
Now that's funny (only 'cuz I wasn't there) because I can picture exactly what they looked like.
<< <i>
<< <i>What is with the $25 commission MTB is charging? The 10% profit is in the coin price ($860), so are they violating their agreement? Do we need to call the Mint and put a stop to this gouging? >>
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK!!!!!!!!!!
The Gold Center people paid over $60 tax on the sale....this is still cheaper >>
Bullion is exempt from sales tax in Illinois
<< <i>Effective January 11, 1985, receipts from sales of certain legal tender, medallions, and bullion are exempt from the sales tax. See Public Act 83-1495 (Senate Bill 1727). "Legal tender" includes currency, gold coins, silver coins, and any other item accepted as money in the country in which it is issued. "Medallions" are coins, other than legal tender, which are issued by a governmental body, usually as a memorial. "Bullion" is gold, silver, or platinum in a bulk state with a purity of not less than 980 parts per 1,000. To qualify for the exemption the legal tender or medallions must have been issued by the State of Illinois, the United State , or the government of any foreign country EXCEPT the Republic of South Africa. >>
<< <i><<The Gold Center people paid over $60 tax on the sale....this is still cheaper >>
No it's not...MTB was also charging the normal 8+% sales tax this AM...and wouldn't allow you to add anything to your order to get it up over $1000, which someone said was the cut-off for charging tax...so don't expect any breaks from those bloodsuckers! >>
I humbly stand corrected....I forgot the successful purchases here were out of state purchases
<< <i>I just received official confirmation and bill of sale from MBT that I'm being sold one complete set of the five silver, five ounce coins in the "America the Beautiful" series. Total cost is $930.00, broken down as $860. for the coins themselves, $45.00 for freight and $25.00 for commission.
Checks will take a minimum of 17 business days to clear while bank wire transfers will go through practically immediately. They are awaiting receipt of the properly sized capsules to hold the coins before shipping them. It could be a maximum of six weeks (which counting 17 business days for checks to clear isn't that much of an extension) but that they hope/anticipate receiving the capsules in the near future, thereby sending the coins out much sooner. >>
I was going to send a bank wire but the instructions said not to send funds until an account was set up. Not thinking that my account was set up as I had just faxed the forms, I sent a certified bank check via USPS Express Mail w/delivery before noon tomorrow. I certainly hope that they don't hold a certified bank check for so long.
<< <i>Just got off the phone with Mint Public Affairs and then Treasury Legal Affairs in DC.
They were EXTREMLY interested in MTB's BLAME THE MINT routine...in fact, they were also very happy to know that I recorded it on my cell phone!
They will definitely be looking into the policies and procedures as practiced by MTB today, up to and possibly including stripping them of their AP status for future coin programs.
And although I'm still seething, I feel better that I may have damaged MTB going forward!
(PS...I was one of the non-black coat/hat wearing men...second on line when they stopped sales 2 hours early (a wasted 3 hours)!) >>
At least MTB is selling some of the things and not just to walk-ins. What about all the others who aren't doing jack? What about the HSN fiasco, etc...
It might have helped if someone from MTB actually appeared at some point to provide an update or instructions, before making people wait hours in vain.
<< <i> I was going to send a bank wire but the instructions said not to send funds until an account was set up. Not thinking that my account was set up as I had just faxed the forms, I sent a certified bank check via USPS Express Mail w/delivery before noon tomorrow. I certainly hope that they don't hold a certified bank check for so long. >>
I thought they were holding shipment for 8 weeks or so because of lack of capsules.....The 10-17 days for a personal check to clear would be way before shipment is ready
Box of 20
<< <i>Northwest Territorial Mint is not carrying these. I just got an email. I mistakenly thought they were an AP also. >>
List of Authorized Purchasers Selling America the Beautiful Bullion Coins
As of this writing, none of the Authorized Purchasers have said they will begin accepting orders from the public before January 3, 2011. The 9 AP's who will offer the .999 fine America the Beautiful Silver Coins include:
¡A-Mark Precious Metals, Los Angeles, CA - www.amark.com
¡American Precious Metals Exchange - Oklahoma City, OK - www.apmex.com
¡Coins 'N Things, Bridgewater, MA - atb.cntofma.com
¡Dillon Gage Inc. Dallas, TX - www.dillongage.com
¡FideliTrade Inc., Wilmington, DE - www.fidelitrade.com
¡The Gold Center, Springfield, IL - (217)793-8002
¡Jack Hunt Coin Broker, Buffalo, NY - www.jackhunt.com
¡MTB, New York City, NY - www.mtbcoins.com
¡Prudential Securities Inc., New York City, NY - (212)778-6667
It might have helped if someone from MTB actually appeared at some point to provide an update or instructions, before making people wait hours in vain.
And as for capsules...they were handing them out in soft plastic and envelopes today...so suddenly they're concerned about damage? More likely they want to kill all 17 (and I thought I had misheard that number, silly me) days for check clearing!
<< <i>At least MTB is selling some of the things and not just to walk-ins. What about all the others who aren't doing jack? What about the HSN fiasco, etc... >>
This morning I called Jack, the director of the ATB Bullion program, and left a message about the HSN video. He hasn't returned my call yet. I suspect he's quite busy today listening to all of the complaints he's been receiving.
<< <i>
<< <i> I was going to send a bank wire but the instructions said not to send funds until an account was set up. Not thinking that my account was set up as I had just faxed the forms, I sent a certified bank check via USPS Express Mail w/delivery before noon tomorrow. I certainly hope that they don't hold a certified bank check for so long. >>
I thought they were holding shipment for 8 weeks or so because of lack of capsules.....The 10-17 days for a personal check to clear would be way before shipment is ready >>
Correct, but I thought that he said that they may ship more quickly if capsules became available.
<< <i>Just to elaborate on the MTB debacle...it wasn't like an unruly mob had formed before they cut off sales, in fact the line was located directly in front of the main lobby security desk and the guard wasn't having any problems.
It might have helped if someone from MTB actually appeared at some point to provide an update or instructions, before making people wait hours in vain.
And as for capsules...they were handing them out in soft plastic and envelopes today...so suddenly they're concerned about damage? More likely they want to kill all 17 (and I thought I had misheard that number, silly me) days for check clearing! >>
You mean they turned away those guys waiting there since this morning?
Coinfame,Kaelasdad,Type2,UNLVino,MICHAELDIXON
Justacommeman,tydye,78saen,123cents,blue62vette,Segoja,Nibanny
I got a call from Scotsman Coins and they are offering the sets for $2,450 or something like that. I didn't get the exact number because my eyes were already shooting blood when he said $2,400........I didn't bother asking him how they got a supply of them, but he volunteered that they had paid $2,280 for theirs.....
I have one comment. Just say no.
I knew it would happen.
Box of 20
http://www.jackhunt.com/
So in one day they sold TO WALK IN ONLY at least 2910.
What a joke when we were just told that there was about 200-300 people there today
<< <i>I would lighten up on MTB. They obviously never dealt with the public like this before. At least they are selling and be grateful for that. I would gladly pay their commission. I am still deciding whether I want to purchase from them. >>
<< <i>
<< <i><<The Gold Center people paid over $60 tax on the sale....this is still cheaper >>
No it's not...MTB was also charging the normal 8+% sales tax this AM...and wouldn't allow you to add anything to your order to get it up over $1000, which someone said was the cut-off for charging tax...so don't expect any breaks from those bloodsuckers! >>
I humbly stand corrected....I forgot the successful purchases here were out of state purchases >>
Soooooooooo how the Gold Center price WITHOUT tax and shipping was higher than MTB ($930 per poster here) WITH the shipping and commission. Methinks a tax was added
<< <i>Gold Center Update #3 Price verified by the owner directly for $975 >>
The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>If you happen to invest any time in calling the Mint, you should have the information in this thread to present to them, i.e., Gold Center selling about 300 and saying that only 10 sets are left, Apmex selling 380 and not selling any more, TV scammers selling hundreds at exorbitant prices, people showing up on ebay with multiple sets at exorbitant prices BEFORE the AP's started selling any of them to "the public", ad nauseum. Get your data together and try to get the point across.
The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance. >>
Class action lawuite
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i> The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance. >>
I don't think any of them are playing fair BUT I am sure they have names and addresses to back up ALL the sales....one per name. That is what the delay is...getting all those names together.
The Mint can't drop all of them since they do provide a service for them and remove the grief of dealing with a bazillion bullion buyers. 11 is a much more controlled number
As stated before in a previous post, do you think the mint would get rid of most of their Bullion Distributors because of what is happening and destabilize their distribution network. Could they easily be replaced? I really don't know the answer to that.
Box of 20
I will absolutely NOT lighten up on them...in fact I've contacted both the Mint and Coin World's editors...I blew over 3 hours this morning, including a trip to the bank and $40 in cabfare to have a door slammed in my face!
No way, I was there, cash in hand as instructed...and they decided to close at 1:35 instead of 3:00 today, because "We just can't take it anymore?" WTF? Just to be clear, THEY LOCKED THEIR DOORS ON AT LEAST 40 PEOPLE who were waiting without any prior notice or announcements!
And then it comes out that they have been selling them to their select customers over the phone, despite the fact that we called from the line and asked and would have ordered them right then and there. AND then, when we asked if we could hand in our completed USA Patriot Act forms to expediate this suddenly magical account set-up...they said "No...and get out of our office!"
So, no way, no how am I cutting them any slack! They're scum....they run a sleazy outfit...and the Mint should drop them like hot potatos!
<< <i>I don't think any of them are playing fair BUT I am sure they have names and addresses to back up ALL the sales....one per name. That is what the delay is...getting all those names together. >>
There's no reason that HSN or similar couldn't have provided an AP with a list of names and addresses of hundreds of employees, along with order assignments where each purchaser directed the AP to send their order to HSN (i.e., drop ship) instead of them. I think an arrangement like that *may* have technically met the conditions. An AP would have gladly done that to reduce shipping and packaging effort.
<< <i>The Mint can't drop all of them since they do provide a service for them and remove the grief of dealing with a bazillion bullion buyers. 11 is a much more controlled number >>
The mint only needs to drop one of them and it will send the appropriate message.
They had 2 years before December 2010 to get their act together. They took 14 months to get the coin press onsite, and the rest of the process from March 8, 2010 forward involved installation and startup.
As a Monday-morning quarterback, I have to wonder why they didn't call up one of their counterparts at the Aussie Mint or the Canadian Mint and ask them where they got their press for larger coins? It's not like they've never been to a business conference or a trade show where they all get entertained by vendors and enjoy a few days at taxpayer expense. 14 Months to find and obtain a press? I'm sorry, but the responsibility goes to the top. Moy didn't make it happen.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>I emailed MTB and got a bounce message, not delivered for 4 hrs. >>
That happens to me occaisionally, too.
There service provider must have mail transfer issues.
<< <i>What is with the $25 commission MTB is charging? The 10% profit is in the coin price ($860), so are they violating their agreement? Do we need to call the Mint and put a stop to this gouging? >>
They charge 1% commission to all retail customers. They have before this and they are for this.
Sorry this happened to you. I removed my post, but you already pasted it in your reply. Good luck in obtaining a set.
Box of 20
Real shoestring operation they must be running there!
<< <i><< I would lighten up on MTB. They obviously never dealt with the public like this before. At least they are selling and be grateful for that. I would gladly pay their commission. I am still deciding whether I want to purchase from them. >>
I will absolutely NOT lighten up on them...in fact I've contacted both the Mint and Coin World's editors...I blew over 3 hours this morning, including a trip to the bank and $40 in cabfare to have a door slammed in my face!
No way, I was there, cash in hand as instructed...and they decided to close at 1:35 instead of 3:00 today, because "We just can't take it anymore?" WTF? Just to be clear, THEY LOCKED THEIR DOORS ON AT LEAST 40 PEOPLE who were waiting without any prior notice or announcements!
And then it comes out that they have been selling them to their select customers over the phone, despite the fact that we called from the line and asked and would have ordered them right then and there. AND then, when we asked if we could hand in our completed USA Patriot Act forms to expediate this suddenly magical account set-up...they said "No...and get out of our office!"
So, no way, no how am I cutting them any slack! They're scum....they run a sleazy outfit...and the Mint should drop them like hot potatos! >>
I can definitely understand why you're fuming!! I would be soooooooooooooooooooooo p.o.'d! I'm p.o.'d for you just reading about what you went through.
Here's one that's not from APMEX ending soon
flips
<< <i>The gold center just told me that they only have about "ten sets left"
So in one day they sold TO WALK IN ONLY at least 2990.
What a joke when we were just told that there was about 200-300 people there today >>
soooo much BS
and I agree that if they did mail order before I can't see why they do not do it now.
does anyone have a url or something to prove they currently do mail order for bullion like ASEs ?
<< <i>
There's no reason that HSN or similar couldn't have provided an AP with a list of names and addresses of hundreds of employees, along with order assignments where each purchaser directed the AP to send their order to HSN (i.e., drop ship) instead of them. I think an arrangement like that *may* have technically met the conditions. An AP would have gladly done that to reduce shipping and packaging effort.
>>
Let me take this a step further.
What if an order taken by HSN is a Household? HSN then approaches, (already has a deal with) an AP with a list of 500 HH, 1 per. I think this would be doable. I'm not much a believer that a company would mkae its employees purchase item for the show.
<< <i>If you happen to invest any time in calling the Mint, you should have the information in this thread to present to them, i.e., Gold Center selling about 300 and saying that only 10 sets are left, Apmex selling 380 and not selling any more, TV scammers selling hundreds at exorbitant prices, people showing up on ebay with multiple sets at exorbitant prices BEFORE the AP's started selling any of them to "the public", ad nauseum. Get your data together and try to get the point across.
The APs need to be dropped like a hot rock as Mint distributors if they are found not to be in compliance. >>
all of the above except for the gold center info has been given to the mint.
if someone with first hand knowledge of the gold center's practices wants to contact them, I'll give out the mint contact info. however, I caution and condition my response on people having the knowledge first hand and have proof they do mail order.
I do not want to waste their time investigating anything without proof.
My wife saw the look on my face when I got home...she thought someone died...and I blurted out "I feel like I got the short end of the bar of soap in a prison shower!!!"
And when I got in line there were only about 15 people ahead of me, and I thought. "Gee that's not too bad." Maybe an hour, tops.
But no, they dragged us through the mill at about 1 person every 15 minutes, bringing you downstairs into their offices with an escort a single person at a time. Meanwhile, they had a bulletproof glass cashier's window set-up in their lobby that wasn't being used...so you go figure out their logic.
And 3 hours later...get out of offices...we don't care if you're next or we're supposed to be open for 2 more hours. "Go blame the Mint. They forced us to do it this way!"
Weasels!
<< <i>Let me make a prediction re MTB...their fax and telephone lines will be busy and their e-mail won't accept any new messages until 1 second after they "sell out" their supply. I guess their phones only make outgoing calls.
Real shoestring operation they must be running there! >>
you have to realize they are getting weeks worth of calls in 1 day.
the "bounced e-mails" have been an issue since I've been in touch with them in early december.
It was poor customer service to cut-off sales early without advance warning, and really poor customer service to not sell anything else with these to get them above the no tax limit.
However, I do not feel that anything they are doing is worthy of bugging the mint about. even the $25 commission. they charge 1% commission, with $25 min., to all retail customers. They have since I first contacted them as a source back in November.
Nothing MTB has done rises past poor customer service. This is not something to contact the mint over.
<< <i>SPRINGFIELD ALL SOLD OUT. >>
I'm sure the Mint will request a list. This will be interesting.
How do you sell 3000+ sets in 8 hours, to walk ins? That's 375 sets an hour or 6.25 a minute.
3500 !!