<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties. >>
If your plan for the mint to suspend ATB puck sales works - there are gonna be some pretty P.O.'d people standing in line in Springfield!
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties. >>
Good luck with that!
PEACE! This is the first day of the rest of your life.
I hope everyone realizes that the chances of getting these at issue price are very slim. The APs win one more time and the mint will not do anything about it. All it takes is faking the books and make it seem they have "sold" to the public.
The only chance we have now is that there is an audit and even if there was there is not much that will be found. Best of luck to whoever can acquire one at issue price....
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties. >>
Comrade, it's like spitting in the wind ... how about a reality check? The Pucks are paid for and in the hands of the AP's & secondary market.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties. >>
If your plan for the mint to suspend ATB puck sales works - there are gonna be some pretty P.O.'d people standing in line in Springfield! >>
The few sets they will have for "the public" Monday will be LONG gone by the time the phone rings at the Mint
Edited to add: and it will be pointless anyway 'cuz the AP's will have a list of "the public" that they sold them to as mandated.
If someone can do it, i would advise to somehow record the video at HSN and forward it to the US mint...I doubt it will do any good but worth a try. I would do it but im military stationed in Germany so it is a bit hard to call or forward anything to them.
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties. >>
Comrade, it's like spitting in the wind ... how about a reality check? The Pucks are paid for and in the hands of the AP's & secondary market. >>
That's true.... for this time around and this issue. But by keeping the pressure on the Mint by calls, etc., perhaps something can be changed for the next time around. Otherwise, rest assured that the situation will only get worse in the future. If the APs are not held accountable for the misdeeds, they will continue to lock future issues up in the same way. Better get it corrected now, or lose your future chances also for lower mintages (and I suspect there will be more low mintages to come).
Do the AP's care if they lose the AP status because of this? Probably not.... just do the math. By ignoring the Mint and selling these for whatever they want, each AP is slipping a no risk immediate 2 million dollar profit into their pockets. If they sent them off for grading, they can potentially double that. How many silver eagles would they have to sell to make that kind of profit? So what if the Mint will no longer let them sell silver Eagles? It would take years of selling Eagles to get that kind of profit... so for a business perspective, it would be a no brainer for the AP. Give up the AP status and smile all the way to the bank with a 2 - 4 million profit, curtesy of the Mint and the US taxpayers.
I am in the process of uploading the HSN video to YouTube and will post a link of the video once the upload is complete. All that wil be needed is one of the forum members who has had contact with the mint recently to give the mint the link to the video. It is the only proof that we have showing that an AP sold them an allotment of hundreds of sets
Me thinks that the video will not be on their website very long because it is proof of them purchasing all these sets directly from the APs
There won't be a "next time around", since the Mint plans to produce a minimum of 100,000 bullion pucks per Park in the future along with a limited number of collectors versions. btw The Mint is a money cow & not subsidized by the US Tax payer.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
I realize the PLAN is to mint 100,000 of each. But I fully expect that during the life of this program, that will not always be the case. Much can happen in regards to Mint schedules, difficulties in obtaining planchets, lack of interest collecting the series, price of silver skyrocketing, etc. I would be willing to bet there will be other short issues.
<< <i>I realize the PLAN is to mint 100,000 of each. But I fully expect that during the life of this program, that will not always be the case. Much can happen in regards to Mint schedules, difficulties in obtaining planchets, lack of interest collecting the series, price of silver skyrocketing, etc. I would be willing to bet there will be other short issues. >>
Quite possible, but I was referring to collector demand. The first set of pucks will be the only 3" coins produced by the Mint. The first set is the key issue.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
Even if the Mint does produce the 100,000 for each issue in the future.... if the current setup is not changed, your chances of getting any future error coins will be practically nil with the cherrypicking practices that are taking place. Likewise, getting any MS69 or potential MS70 hockey pucks. This all ties in to the same problem.
<< <i>I am in the process of uploading the HSN video to YouTube and will post a link of the video once the upload is complete. All that wil be needed is one of the forum members who has had contact with the mint recently to give the mint the link to the video. It is the only proof that we have showing that an AP sold them an allotment of hundreds of sets
Me thinks that the video will not be on their website very long because it is proof of them purchasing all these sets directly from the APs >>
Thanks, rodzm. That's a great idea. Was it jmski52 who has previously contacted the Office of Legal Council? Otherwise, I will call them on Monday with the YouTube link.
The only problem with your logic about the remaining 6000 or so sets - is that CW reported that the remaining 9 split them equally - meaning there in NO WAY one AP acquired 9000 sets directly.
Well this gets even better...a forum member on the Kitco forum by the name of oober just posted the following:
Yes this whole thing is getting better. So my dealer tells me The gold center ended up wiht 9k of these sets, then sold some to Silvertowne who is selling these on HSN. I'm going by what a dealer who has beein in the business for a long time, so take it for what it's worth.
HSN is selling all the coins they acquired as MS 69. How did they know all would grade 69 at ANACS? What does this say about the integrity of this grading company?
<< <i>HSN is selling all the coins they acquired as MS 69. How did they know all would grade 69 at ANACS? What does this say about the integrity of this grading company? >>
They state in the video that they were able to acquire hundreds of sets so my best guess is that they still have some ungraded and 210 were only the few who graded that high. It would not amaze me they managed to acquire over 1,000 sets to get such high grades, either that or ANACS got paid a speical fee for the grade
<< <i>Do the AP's care if they lose the AP status because of this? Probably not.... just do the math. By ignoring the Mint and selling these for whatever they want, each AP is slipping a no risk immediate 2 million dollar profit into their pockets. If they sent them off for grading, they can potentially double that. How many silver eagles would they have to sell to make that kind of profit? So what if the Mint will no longer let them sell silver Eagles? It would take years of selling Eagles to get that kind of profit... so for a business perspective, it would be a no brainer for the AP. Give up the AP status and smile all the way to the bank with a 2 - 4 million profit, curtesy of the Mint and the US taxpayers. >>
The AP's should care if they lose status. The AP's sold ~35M ASEs this year, 3M a piece from ASE only (not counting AGEs and APEs). At .50 to $1 markup (estimated), that's $1.5-$3M each on average for doing nothing other than distributing coins to DEALERS, not the public, in quantity, with little or no marketing. That's a pretty sweet gig if you can get it, and NOT something you'd want to lose.
They made a lot more than that...since silver came up so much this year...probably every purchase they made from the mint went up in value before they sold it for spot plus.
Great BST experiences: abitofthisabitofthat, silvercoinsdude, gerard, coinfame, mikescoins, wondercoin
<< <i>Do the AP's care if they lose the AP status because of this? Probably not.... just do the math. By ignoring the Mint and selling these for whatever they want, each AP is slipping a no risk immediate 2 million dollar profit into their pockets. If they sent them off for grading, they can potentially double that. How many silver eagles would they have to sell to make that kind of profit? So what if the Mint will no longer let them sell silver Eagles? It would take years of selling Eagles to get that kind of profit... so for a business perspective, it would be a no brainer for the AP. Give up the AP status and smile all the way to the bank with a 2 - 4 million profit, curtesy of the Mint and the US taxpayers. >>
The AP's should care if they lose status. The AP's sold ~35M ASEs this year, 3M a piece from ASE only (not counting AGEs and APEs). At .50 to $1 markup (estimated), that's $1.5-$3M each on average for doing nothing other than distributing coins to DEALERS, not the public, in quantity, with little or no marketing. That's a pretty sweet gig if you can get it, and NOT something you'd want to lose. >>
They probably figured the Mint will do nothing since this is a one time screw up. Of course they may not have expected a tv reseller to actually blab it over tv.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
Thanks, rodzm. That's a great idea. Was it jmski52 who has previously contacted the Office of Legal Council? Otherwise, I will call them on Monday with the YouTube link.
I forget who else it was, but someone else called them too. I've called them 3 times. The first time, a receptionist called me back and after I voiced my concerns, she said that one of the attorneys would call me back. He never called me back. The 2nd and 3rd times that I left messages, they blew me off and never returned my calls.
I may call them again on Monday and be a whole lot more forceful, but I am having serious doubts that anything will come of it. It's crystal-clear to me that there are 9 Authorized Distributors who should either have to prove that they've followed the terms of their agreements or lose their status, period.
In my opinion, the system is outdated and corrupt as well. There shouldn't be any "Authorized Distributors". It's an abusive system.
Look at any coin blog on the internet. Read the commentary in NN and Coin World. It's no secret as to what has taken place. This is big. There aren't any sets being sold to the public, except for the Apmex order list of those who ordered at $1,395.00. Hell, I've been on Apmex's Alert Me since they posted in back in October, and I've re-registered twice since then - and have never heard from them. They only sold a small number of sets in order to "appear" legit.
I'd still like to know how our fellow forum members got ahold of their multiple sets. It would certainly help pinpoint how the sets are getting out, and from whom. But then, that is expecting a bit too much, isn't it?
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
I have also forwarded the video link to Michael Zielinski of Mint News Blog and see if he can contact the US Mint as well. I really doubt this will change anything but we can only hope
The only problem with your logic about the remaining 6000 or so sets - is that CW reported that the remaining 9 split them equally - meaning there in NO WAY one AP acquired 9000 sets directly.
7/8 >>
Oh, well.......it was a good theory that would have explained the reported round number of 9,000 sets. It just happened to be wrong......
. . So each AP got approx. 3,666 sets. If two of the other AP's dumped their entire load to another AP he would control approx. 11,000 sets. Make a minimum of $1,000 a set selling them to telemarketers and that's $11,000,000 to divvy up. Make more than $1,000 a set and that's...........................?
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
<< <i>Thanks, rodzm. That's a great idea. Was it jmski52 who has previously contacted the Office of Legal Council? Otherwise, I will call them on Monday with the YouTube link.
I forget who else it was, but someone else called them too. I've called them 3 times. The first time, a receptionist called me back and after I voiced my concerns, she said that one of the attorneys would call me back. He never called me back. The 2nd and 3rd times that I left messages, they blew me off and never returned my calls.
I may call them again on Monday and be a whole lot more forceful, but I am having serious doubts that anything will come of it. It's crystal-clear to me that there are 9 Authorized Distributors who should either have to prove that they've followed the terms of their agreements or lose their status, period.
In my opinion, the system is outdated and corrupt as well. There shouldn't be any "Authorized Distributors". It's an abusive system.
Look at any coin blog on the internet. Read the commentary in NN and Coin World. It's no secret as to what has taken place. This is big. There aren't any sets being sold to the public, except for the Apmex order list of those who ordered at $1,395.00. Hell, I've been on Apmex's Alert Me since they posted in back in October, and I've re-registered twice since then - and have never heard from them. They only sold a small number of sets in order to "appear" legit.
I'd still like to know how our fellow forum members got ahold of their multiple sets. It would certainly help pinpoint how the sets are getting out, and from whom. But then, that is expecting a bit too much, isn't it? >>
I've spoken with them as well. The Atty. did call me back. This was in early Dec.
Very much possible that this 9,000 figure could be that 8 of the 9 dealers decided to only take their allocation of 3,000 leaving one sole AP with an allocation of an extra 6,000 sets.
The only problem with your logic about the remaining 6000 or so sets - is that CW reported that the remaining 9 split them equally - meaning there in NO WAY one AP acquired 9000 sets directly.
7/8 >>
Oh, well.......it was a good theory that would have explained the reported round number of 9,000 sets. It just happened to be wrong......
. . So each AP got approx. 3,666 sets. If two of the other AP's dumped their entire load to another AP he would control approx. 11,000 sets. Make a minimum of $1,000 a set selling them to telemarketers and that's $11,000,000 to divvy up. Make more than $1,000 a set and that's...........................? >>
The 6000 sets that were reallocated must be distributed under the same rules as the initial allocation. That is, marketed to the general public and the one per household limit still applies. I don't see how an AP can take possession of their share of the reallocation and transfer it to another AP of their choosing.
<< <i><< The first set of pucks will be the only 3" coins produced by the Mint. >>
Is that for sure? My understanding was that the change in size was permitted but not required. >>
HSN is the used car salesman of the numismatic world. You can take anything they say with a grain of salt. >>
That is true, but 2010 will be the last of the 3" pucks. It was well publicized by the Mint. They requested Congress for approval & got it to reduce them to 2.5"
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
The flagrant violation of the agreed on US mint rules might be easier to get away with due to change in leadership at the top. Moy's resignation is effective Sunday January 9th, and he may have already cleaned out his desk, be taking his terminal vacation leave, and only just show up on Friday the 7th for the departure party. When his replacement will be named and start in office has not been announced. The new director will need time for orientation. The APs are of course fully aware of the transition and the loopholes and evasive excuses it may give them. Somebody at the mint probably hinted to the APs that an audit would be unlikely, and it certainly won't happen without strong agitation from the collecting public. My salutes to those in this forum who are taking an active role.
I am leaning to the theory they used their employees addresses to acquire the sets, one set per employee. There was no requirement to ship the pucks to the address, just to show you sold them one to an address. HSN probably had to buy a monster box or two of Gem BU 2010 Eagles for $60/oz from the AP's to get the sets and they probably paid the Mint mandated price. They making statements like 'we walked right in' to make the viewers think they pucks are gone from the AP's and if you want a set, here is your chance and this is our price. Any AP that was planning on selling via phone or internet spent the last 8 working days acquiring shipping supplies. Air-Tite has been out of Z5 holders and won't have any until the end of January. IMHO, that is the only thing that any AP will use to ship the sets, as they don't want the sets returned by the customer.
We are going to be doing this again in a couple of months. The Mint cannot win with the pricing of the numismatic version. If they price them at $1250 a set (assume $30/oz silver), they will be $3000 on eBay and people will complain that the Mint left millions on the table and the taxpayers are subsiding these flippers. If they price them at $2500, they will APMEX.
someone should just forward that video link (Youtube) to the USM Legal Department and USM Marketing Department of HSN selling 210 sets.
Forget about Moy - he has lieutenants that are responsible for monitoring these programs. The USM was worried about "giving the AP's time" to get their sale and distribution network in place.
I call BS.
Enough time. Time to crack down on these violations.
What is being done amounts to nothing more than limiting supply for the purpose of price fixing in the secondary market, and not selling these as agreed to the general public.......not your "selected" general public, the all encompassing general public.
The moment they sold one set to the TV, they should sell to ANYONE.
someone should just forward that video link (Youtube) to the USM Legal Department and USM Marketing Department of HSN selling 210 sets.
Forget about Moy - he has lieutenants that are responsible for monitoring these programs. The USM was worried about "giving the AP's time" to get their sale and distribution network in place.
I call BS.
Enough time. Time to crack down on these violations.
What is being done amounts to nothing more than limiting supply for the purpose of price fixing in the secondary market, and not selling these as agreed to the general public.......not your "selected" general public, the all encompassing general public.
The moment they sold one set to the TV, they should sell to ANYONE. >>
I'll be calling Monday. I don't have an email address, but have phone numbers of key individuals. I will ask for email addresses so I can forward the link to them.
<< <i>Besides the flip potential, who would ever want to own a set of these monstrosities??? >>
I view it as cheap Mint silver - if you can get it at the issue price. Otherwise you are counting on spot silver going way up.
What costs would the Mint incur trying to drop the diameter to 2.5"? What other Mint products are 2.5" silver? Wouldn't the Mint keep this planchet size, as Sunshine is tooled up to produce the blanks and the Mint has the tooling to produce the dies?
Comments
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties.
If your plan for the mint to suspend ATB puck sales works - there are gonna be some pretty P.O.'d people standing in line in Springfield!
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties.
Good luck with that!
Fred, Las Vegas, NV
The only chance we have now is that there is an audit and even if there was there is not much that will be found. Best of luck to whoever can acquire one at issue price....
We The People are given the finger once again
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties.
Comrade, it's like spitting in the wind ... how about a reality check? The Pucks are paid for and in the hands of the AP's & secondary market.
<< <i>
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties.
If your plan for the mint to suspend ATB puck sales works - there are gonna be some pretty P.O.'d people standing in line in Springfield! >>
The few sets they will have for "the public" Monday will be LONG gone by the time the phone rings at the Mint
Edited to add: and it will be pointless anyway 'cuz the AP's will have a list of "the public" that they sold them to as mandated.
<< <i>
<< <i>It's time to call the Mint on Monday and complain loudly. The evidence of deceit is overwhelming. Mint needs to suspend all sales and perform an audit of each AP to find the guilty parties.
Comrade, it's like spitting in the wind ... how about a reality check? The Pucks are paid for and in the hands of the AP's & secondary market. >>
That's true.... for this time around and this issue. But by keeping the pressure on the Mint by calls, etc., perhaps something can be changed for the next time around. Otherwise, rest assured that the situation will only get worse in the future. If the APs are not held accountable for the misdeeds, they will continue to lock future issues up in the same way. Better get it corrected now, or lose your future chances also for lower mintages (and I suspect there will be more low mintages to come).
Do the AP's care if they lose the AP status because of this? Probably not.... just do the math. By ignoring the Mint and selling these for whatever they want, each AP is slipping a no risk immediate 2 million dollar profit into their pockets. If they sent them off for grading, they can potentially double that. How many silver eagles would they have to sell to make that kind of profit? So what if the Mint will no longer let them sell silver Eagles? It would take years of selling Eagles to get that kind of profit... so for a business perspective, it would be a no brainer for the AP. Give up the AP status and smile all the way to the bank with a 2 - 4 million profit, curtesy of the Mint and the US taxpayers.
Me thinks that the video will not be on their website very long because it is proof of them purchasing all these sets directly from the APs
<< <i>I realize the PLAN is to mint 100,000 of each. But I fully expect that during the life of this program, that will not always be the case. Much can happen in regards to Mint schedules, difficulties in obtaining planchets, lack of interest collecting the series, price of silver skyrocketing, etc. I would be willing to bet there will be other short issues. >>
Quite possible, but I was referring to collector demand. The first set of pucks will be the only 3" coins produced by the Mint. The first set is the key issue.
<< <i>I am in the process of uploading the HSN video to YouTube and will post a link of the video once the upload is complete. All that wil be needed is one of the forum members who has had contact with the mint recently to give the mint the link to the video. It is the only proof that we have showing that an AP sold them an allotment of hundreds of sets
Me thinks that the video will not be on their website very long because it is proof of them purchasing all these sets directly from the APs >>
Thanks, rodzm. That's a great idea. Was it jmski52 who has previously contacted the Office of Legal Council? Otherwise, I will call them on Monday with the YouTube link.
Just PM'd you all the phone numbers I have for the important guys at the USM, hope it helps
The only problem with your logic about the remaining 6000 or so sets - is that CW reported that the remaining 9 split them equally - meaning there in NO WAY one AP acquired 9000 sets directly.
7/8
HSN Video 5 oz ATB MS69 Coins
<< <i>Ok guys here is the video uploaded to YouTube
HSN Video 5 oz ATB MS69 Coins >>
I have watched most of the video and I have a question. How does that prove that they got the sets from an AP?
<< <i>
<< <i>Ok guys here is the video uploaded to YouTube
HSN Video 5 oz ATB MS69 Coins >>
I have watched most of the video and I have a question. How does that prove that they got the sets from an AP? >>
Well I dont know...other than they specifically say they walked into one of the APs stores and bought hundreds of them.
<< <i>Ok guys here is the video uploaded to YouTube
HSN Video 5 oz ATB MS69 Coins >>
The guy on the left, Mr. suntan makes me want to puke.
Yes this whole thing is getting better. So my dealer tells me The gold center ended up wiht 9k of these sets, then sold some to Silvertowne who is selling these on HSN. I'm going by what a dealer who has beein in the business for a long time, so take it for what it's worth.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Ok guys here is the video uploaded to YouTube
HSN Video 5 oz ATB MS69 Coins >>
I have watched most of the video and I have a question. How does that prove that they got the sets from an AP? >>
Well I dont know...other than they specifically say they walked into one of the APs stores and bought hundreds of them. >>
I guess I didn't stay with it long enough or I missed it somehow.
What does this say about the integrity of this grading company?
<< <i>HSN is selling all the coins they acquired as MS 69. How did they know all would grade 69 at ANACS?
What does this say about the integrity of this grading company? >>
They state in the video that they were able to acquire hundreds of sets so my best guess is that they still have some ungraded and 210 were only the few who graded that high. It would not amaze me they managed to acquire over 1,000 sets to get such high grades, either that or ANACS got paid a speical fee for the grade
Is that for sure? My understanding was that the change in size was permitted but not required.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
<< <i>Do the AP's care if they lose the AP status because of this? Probably not.... just do the math. By ignoring the Mint and selling these for whatever they want, each AP is slipping a no risk immediate 2 million dollar profit into their pockets. If they sent them off for grading, they can potentially double that. How many silver eagles would they have to sell to make that kind of profit? So what if the Mint will no longer let them sell silver Eagles? It would take years of selling Eagles to get that kind of profit... so for a business perspective, it would be a no brainer for the AP. Give up the AP status and smile all the way to the bank with a 2 - 4 million profit, curtesy of the Mint and the US taxpayers. >>
The AP's should care if they lose status. The AP's sold ~35M ASEs this year, 3M a piece from ASE only (not counting AGEs and APEs). At .50 to $1 markup (estimated), that's $1.5-$3M each on average for doing nothing other than distributing coins to DEALERS, not the public, in quantity, with little or no marketing. That's a pretty sweet gig if you can get it, and NOT something you'd want to lose.
<< <i>
<< <i>Do the AP's care if they lose the AP status because of this? Probably not.... just do the math. By ignoring the Mint and selling these for whatever they want, each AP is slipping a no risk immediate 2 million dollar profit into their pockets. If they sent them off for grading, they can potentially double that. How many silver eagles would they have to sell to make that kind of profit? So what if the Mint will no longer let them sell silver Eagles? It would take years of selling Eagles to get that kind of profit... so for a business perspective, it would be a no brainer for the AP. Give up the AP status and smile all the way to the bank with a 2 - 4 million profit, curtesy of the Mint and the US taxpayers. >>
The AP's should care if they lose status. The AP's sold ~35M ASEs this year, 3M a piece from ASE only (not counting AGEs and APEs). At .50 to $1 markup (estimated), that's $1.5-$3M each on average for doing nothing other than distributing coins to DEALERS, not the public, in quantity, with little or no marketing. That's a pretty sweet gig if you can get it, and NOT something you'd want to lose. >>
They probably figured the Mint will do nothing since this is a one time screw up. Of course they may not have expected a tv reseller to actually blab it over tv.
I forget who else it was, but someone else called them too. I've called them 3 times. The first time, a receptionist called me back and after I voiced my concerns, she said that one of the attorneys would call me back. He never called me back. The 2nd and 3rd times that I left messages, they blew me off and never returned my calls.
I may call them again on Monday and be a whole lot more forceful, but I am having serious doubts that anything will come of it. It's crystal-clear to me that there are 9 Authorized Distributors who should either have to prove that they've followed the terms of their agreements or lose their status, period.
In my opinion, the system is outdated and corrupt as well. There shouldn't be any "Authorized Distributors". It's an abusive system.
Look at any coin blog on the internet. Read the commentary in NN and Coin World. It's no secret as to what has taken place. This is big. There aren't any sets being sold to the public, except for the Apmex order list of those who ordered at $1,395.00. Hell, I've been on Apmex's Alert Me since they posted in back in October, and I've re-registered twice since then - and have never heard from them. They only sold a small number of sets in order to "appear" legit.
I'd still like to know how our fellow forum members got ahold of their multiple sets. It would certainly help pinpoint how the sets are getting out, and from whom. But then, that is expecting a bit too much, isn't it?
I knew it would happen.
Box of 20
<< <i>Captain-----
The only problem with your logic about the remaining 6000 or so sets - is that CW reported that the remaining 9 split them equally - meaning there in NO WAY one AP acquired 9000 sets directly.
7/8 >>
Oh, well.......it was a good theory that would have explained the reported round number of 9,000 sets. It just happened to be wrong......
.
.
So each AP got approx. 3,666 sets. If two of the other AP's dumped their entire load to another AP he would control approx. 11,000 sets. Make a minimum of $1,000 a set selling them to telemarketers and that's $11,000,000 to divvy up. Make more than $1,000 a set and that's...........................?
<< <i>Thanks, rodzm. That's a great idea. Was it jmski52 who has previously contacted the Office of Legal Council? Otherwise, I will call them on Monday with the YouTube link.
I forget who else it was, but someone else called them too. I've called them 3 times. The first time, a receptionist called me back and after I voiced my concerns, she said that one of the attorneys would call me back. He never called me back. The 2nd and 3rd times that I left messages, they blew me off and never returned my calls.
I may call them again on Monday and be a whole lot more forceful, but I am having serious doubts that anything will come of it. It's crystal-clear to me that there are 9 Authorized Distributors who should either have to prove that they've followed the terms of their agreements or lose their status, period.
In my opinion, the system is outdated and corrupt as well. There shouldn't be any "Authorized Distributors". It's an abusive system.
Look at any coin blog on the internet. Read the commentary in NN and Coin World. It's no secret as to what has taken place. This is big. There aren't any sets being sold to the public, except for the Apmex order list of those who ordered at $1,395.00. Hell, I've been on Apmex's Alert Me since they posted in back in October, and I've re-registered twice since then - and have never heard from them. They only sold a small number of sets in order to "appear" legit.
I'd still like to know how our fellow forum members got ahold of their multiple sets. It would certainly help pinpoint how the sets are getting out, and from whom. But then, that is expecting a bit too much, isn't it? >>
I've spoken with them as well. The Atty. did call me back. This was in early Dec.
<< <i>
<< <i>Captain-----
The only problem with your logic about the remaining 6000 or so sets - is that CW reported that the remaining 9 split them equally - meaning there in NO WAY one AP acquired 9000 sets directly.
7/8 >>
Oh, well.......it was a good theory that would have explained the reported round number of 9,000 sets. It just happened to be wrong......
.
.
So each AP got approx. 3,666 sets. If two of the other AP's dumped their entire load to another AP he would control approx. 11,000 sets. Make a minimum of $1,000 a set selling them to telemarketers and that's $11,000,000 to divvy up. Make more than $1,000 a set and that's...........................?
The 6000 sets that were reallocated must be distributed under the same rules as the initial allocation. That is, marketed to the general public and the one per household limit still applies. I don't see how an AP can take possession of their share of the reallocation and transfer it to another AP of their choosing.
<< <i><< The first set of pucks will be the only 3" coins produced by the Mint. >>
Is that for sure? My understanding was that the change in size was permitted but not required. >>
HSN is the used car salesman of the numismatic world. You can take anything they say with a grain of salt.
<< <i>
<< <i><< The first set of pucks will be the only 3" coins produced by the Mint. >>
Is that for sure? My understanding was that the change in size was permitted but not required. >>
HSN is the used car salesman of the numismatic world. You can take anything they say with a grain of salt. >>
That is true, but 2010 will be the last of the 3" pucks. It was well publicized by the Mint. They requested Congress for approval & got it to reduce them to 2.5"
We are going to be doing this again in a couple of months. The Mint cannot win with the pricing of the numismatic version. If they price them at $1250 a set (assume $30/oz silver), they will be $3000 on eBay and people will complain that the Mint left millions on the table and the taxpayers are subsiding these flippers. If they price them at $2500, they will APMEX.
someone should just forward that video link (Youtube) to the USM Legal Department and USM Marketing Department of HSN selling 210 sets.
Forget about Moy - he has lieutenants that are responsible for monitoring these programs. The USM was worried about "giving the AP's time" to get their sale and distribution network in place.
I call BS.
Enough time. Time to crack down on these violations.
What is being done amounts to nothing more than limiting supply for the purpose of price fixing in the secondary market, and not selling these as agreed to the general public.......not your "selected" general public, the all encompassing general public.
The moment they sold one set to the TV, they should sell to ANYONE.
<< <i>just saw the uploaded video on youtube.
someone should just forward that video link (Youtube) to the USM Legal Department and USM Marketing Department of HSN selling 210 sets.
Forget about Moy - he has lieutenants that are responsible for monitoring these programs. The USM was worried about "giving the AP's time" to get their sale and distribution network in place.
I call BS.
Enough time. Time to crack down on these violations.
What is being done amounts to nothing more than limiting supply for the purpose of price fixing in the secondary market, and not selling these as agreed to the general public.......not your "selected" general public, the all encompassing general public.
The moment they sold one set to the TV, they should sell to ANYONE. >>
I'll be calling Monday. I don't have an email address, but have phone numbers of key individuals. I will ask for email addresses so I can forward the link to them.
<< <i>How's things going in line in Springfield? Need a report - doors open in one day, 15 hrs - >>
I used to be famous now I just collect coins.
Link to My Registry Set.
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/quarters/washington-quarters-specialty-sets/washington-quarters-complete-variety-set-circulation-strikes-1932-1964/publishedset/78469
Varieties Are The Spice Of LIFE and Thanks to Those who teach us what to search For.
<< <i>Ok guys here is the video uploaded to YouTube
HSN Video 5 oz ATB MS69 Coins >>
I just watched / listened to this.
You get an over sized wood box to store those GIGANTIC slabs in for $4799?
Besides the flip potential, who would ever want to own a set of these monstrosities???
Wow, what a deal.
Good Lord.
<< <i>
<< <i>How's things going in line in Springfield? Need a report - doors open in one day, 15 hrs - >>
Hang in there bro! Right on, thanks!
<< <i>Ok guys here is the video uploaded to YouTube
HSN Video 5 oz ATB MS69 Coins >>
LOL. I love the part that he will sell the MS70 set for a min of $25k, $50k if they only get one set. Classic.
<< <i>Besides the flip potential, who would ever want to own a set of these monstrosities??? >>
I view it as cheap Mint silver - if you can get it at the issue price. Otherwise you are counting on spot silver going way up.
What costs would the Mint incur trying to drop the diameter to 2.5"? What other Mint products are 2.5" silver? Wouldn't the Mint keep this planchet size, as Sunshine is tooled up to produce the blanks and the Mint has the tooling to produce the dies?