<< <i> Wanna buy an Elizabeth Monroe First Spouse in MS69 (PCGS Graded) for double bullion value ($1,402). Its a low mintage coin with only 4,519 minted. (W@W!!!) A terrific investment for the future and sure to increase in price! >>
Scarcity is tied to interest in the subject matter. I'd argue that the national park series is about 10x more interesting than uninteresting spouses. Nearly 289 million people visited the US Parks in 2009. A very small percentage of these people will be coin collectors with a budget to collect these. But I'd argue that 33k does represent scarcity for this series with its wider appeal.
~0.01% of the total visitors visiting the US parks in 2009 would be able to have one of these sets. >>
I expect that most folks would prefer either a Silver Proof ATB Quarter, a regular Proof ATB Quarter, or some piece of circulated stuff thats been silver plated and placed in a cardbaord holder at the park gift shops over this 3" 5 troy ounce piece of Silver.
I'll be surprised if interest in these lasts more than a year. Thats about what it took for the First Spouse pieces that were selling in the beginning at double bullion value. I mean, folks have to admit that they've been waiting for these to make an appearance since 1/1/2010.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
"`(2) AVAILABILITY FOR SALE- Bullion coins minted under paragraph (1)– `(A) shall become available for sale no sooner than the first day of the calendar year in which the circulating quarter dollar of which such bullion coin is a duplicate is issued; and `(B) may only be available for sale during the year in which such circulating quarter dollar is issued."
I interpret this as: The USM must send the coins to their distributors by year's end. They have 3.5 weeks.
Interesting that there is nothing in the legislation pointing to a numismatic 5 oz piece. BUT...refer to the following:
"`(6) ISSUANCE- `(A) QUALITY OF COINS- The Secretary may mint and issue such number of quarter dollars of each design selected under paragraph (3) in uncirculated and proof qualities as the Secretary determines to be appropriate. `(B) SILVER COINS- Notwithstanding subsection (b), the Secretary may mint and issue such number of quarter dollars of each design selected under paragraph (3) as the Secretary determines to be appropriate, with a content of 90 percent silver and 10 percent copper."
The law doesn't say anything about a numismatic 5 oz. version. However, it only states that silver coins must be 90% silver. Nothing specifying the size. >>
you're not reading the whole law.
the bullion part is at the bottom. it has it's own subsection. look for: TITLE II—BULLION INVESTMENT PRODUCTS
the part you reference is for 90% silver proof set quarters that are the same size as the regular quarters.
the part you reference is for 90% silver proof set quarters that are the same size as the regular quarters. >>
I read the part at the bottom. No mention of a numismatic version. And the bullion cannot be issued next year anyway. Therefore, I am guessing they are producing the numismatic versions under the authority of the silver issues listed in the top section.
There is nothing I read in the silver quarter section specifying a size.
Just a guess.
Successful transactions with keepdachange, tizofthe, adriana, wondercoin
Nearly 1000 posts in five days - is this a record??
Totally unrelated to the above, but it just popped into my head, I sure miss ericj96. I would love to read his insight into this - and other - modern issues.
<< <i>I'm just on understanding why anyone would talk about a HH limit. At least for APMEX.
Here's the facts:
18 hours to sell, everyone had plenty of time to buy; you could buy as much as your CC could hold; and it still took 18 HOURS to sell ONLY 1000 sets, out of 33,000. Nobody missed out on this opportunity. So, how would that be fair to the people who ordered and were totally willing to pay the original price? The ones who put their money on the line while people on THIS board said NO WAY, it's a ripeoff, the ones who bought BEFORE anything was on ebay or anyplace else. That would be as unjust as APMEX charging $1395. Just my opinion. >>
IMHO, Those that paid exorbitant prices and took the risk, ought to be able to reap the reward. The reward just keeps going up, up, and away. Almost $700 a coin translates to $3500 a set. Looks like that $1395/set was a bargain.
<< <i>I'm just on understanding why anyone would talk about a HH limit. At least for APMEX.
Here's the facts:
18 hours to sell, everyone had plenty of time to buy; you could buy as much as your CC could hold; and it still took 18 HOURS to sell ONLY 1000 sets, out of 33,000. Nobody missed out on this opportunity. So, how would that be fair to the people who ordered and were totally willing to pay the original price? The ones who put their money on the line while people on THIS board said NO WAY, it's a ripeoff, the ones who bought BEFORE anything was on ebay or anyplace else. That would be as unjust as APMEX charging $1395. Just my opinion. >>
IMHO, Those that paid exorbitant prices and took the risk, ought to be able to reap the reward. The reward just keeps going up, up, and away. Almost $700 a coin translates to $3500 a set. Looks like that $1395/set was a bargain. >>
I agree. I took the risk and was very stressed about the potential downside of this for my business. If the mint puts a limit of 1 per HH they are WAY overstepping their bounds IMHO. This entire thing was about PRICE. The mint KNEW the MINTAGE and didn't put a HH limit before..... why now??????? That wouldn't be fair to those who bought from APMEX at those "crazy" prices.
<< <i>I'm just on understanding why anyone would talk about a HH limit. At least for APMEX.
Here's the facts:
18 hours to sell, everyone had plenty of time to buy; you could buy as much as your CC could hold; and it still took 18 HOURS to sell ONLY 1000 sets, out of 33,000. Nobody missed out on this opportunity. So, how would that be fair to the people who ordered and were totally willing to pay the original price? The ones who put their money on the line while people on THIS board said NO WAY, it's a ripeoff, the ones who bought BEFORE anything was on ebay or anyplace else. That would be as unjust as APMEX charging $1395. Just my opinion. >>
IMHO, Those that paid exorbitant prices and took the risk, ought to be able to reap the reward. The reward just keeps going up, up, and away. Almost $700 a coin translates to $3500 a set. Looks like that $1395/set was a bargain. >>
I agree. I took the risk and was very stressed about the potential downside of this for my business. If the mint puts a limit of 1 per HH they are WAY overstepping their bounds IMHO. This entire thing was about PRICE. The mint KNEW the MINTAGE and didn't put a HH limit before..... why now??????? That wouldn't be fair to those who bought from APMEX at those "crazy" prices. >>
I know people are tired of me harping on the idea that the price of these sets will be lower now that the Mint suspended delivery....but...
There are sellers on the Bay that obviously ordered many sets from an AP and are expecting delivery which may or not happen...
Collectors are paying beaucoup bucks for the potential to own these sets. The last three from one seller went for BIN's of $2749 and singles for $682. Another seller sold 16 for $1950.
Sooooooo HH limit of one is imposed....
..and ALL these sets come off the market creating a huge demand and price markup for those lucky purchasers deciding to sell their single sets to collectors unable to get one from the Mint. The dealers, who ALWAYS seem to get as many as they want, go wild with their new found cash cow.
I originally assumed that the pre-sales on Ebay were being pulled by the sellers because of the potential that the sellers would not get their sets but NOW I know they were pulled because the price listed was too low ($1695-1945) and have been re-listed higher or are sitting this out.
Remind me again why all the weeping and gnashing at $1395/set??? That is now half of the going price...
Please do not repeat the reply that these are dummy sales intended to push the price up...these are multiple sellers and it will cost them around $100 per sale in Ebay fees...not chump change.
I am not defending APMEX since they started this mess by jumping the gun but this actually makes some sense:
<< <i> According to Mr. Thomas, APMEX performed price diligence by reviewing market conditions and comparing two similar products, a 2010 Chinese five-ounce Silver Panda with a mintage of 10,000 coins that sells for $425 and a 2010 Mexican Libertad five-ounce silver coin with an unlimited mintage that sells for $225. Based on this information, APMEX made the decision to set its price at $279 a coin. >>
I ordered 1 set sat before they sold out. I don't have any connections with other distributors or coin dealers who will get them and maybe sell to their best customers so I thought this maybe my best shot at a set. Now I look at it this way, 1. If they don't get them I will get my money back. 2. sale goes and I get the set 3. sale goes and I get a rebate or credit.
<< <i>I am not defending APMEX since they started this mess by jumping the gun but this actually makes some sense:
<< <i> According to Mr. Thomas, APMEX performed price diligence by reviewing market conditions and comparing two similar products, a 2010 Chinese five-ounce Silver Panda with a mintage of 10,000 coins that sells for $425 and a 2010 Mexican Libertad five-ounce silver coin with an unlimited mintage that sells for $225. Based on this information, APMEX made the decision to set its price at $279 a coin. >>
>>
Ampex didn't start this, Monaco sold the set the day before ampex even started, the first sets went for 900 bucks the next morning prices were at 1100 a set by the end of that day it went to 1500 than sold out. Now My question is where and how did Monaco get 1000 sets? Another thread here shows a letter yesterday from a dealer saying expect sticker shock when we finally get them, again i ask if these 33,000 sets went to 11 or whatever dealers, than apparently some of these dealers already promised some of these to the other dealers. And at what price ?
What's really going to be interesting are all those pre-sales on Ebay for $2500-$2800. Many of the sellers have sold multiple sets; some more than 10 sets at various prices already. If there is a low HH limit applied, these guys are screwed! Sure, they can cancel the sale, but I don't imagine the "canceled" buyers are going to be too happy and post positive feedback. Finding the sets to fulfill the orders on the open market might be a bit expensive!!!
<< <i>What's really going to be interesting are all those pre-sales on Ebay for $2500-$2800. Many of the sellers have sold multiple sets; some more than 10 sets at various prices already. If there is a low HH limit applied, these guys are screwed! Sure, they can cancel the sale, but I don't imagine the "canceled" buyers are going to be too happy and post positive feedback. Finding the sets to fulfill the orders on the open market might be a bit expensive!!! >>
...and they are out some major bucks with the "final value fee" which is not refundable unless the buyer agrees to the cancellation (NOT!). This can be near $100 per sale
<< <i>Also, if you cancel the transaction in our Resolution Center and the buyer agrees, you can receive a final value fee credit. >>
The last I heard from apmex, they said if they get the sets, I'll get what I ordered from them. Has it been determined they won't get these, or they will reneg on their promise?
<< <i>The last I heard from apmex, they said if they get the sets, I'll get what I ordered from them. Has it been determined they won't get these, or they will reneg on their promise? >>
Nothing has been determined as yet. We're all still waiting word from the mint on what they're going to do. Anything up till the announcement is just speculation. Along those lines, is anyone who spoke with the mint legal reps expecting a call back? Or are we just awaiting something to work its way through the grapevine?
APMEX will not renege on their promise, unless they lose their allocation, of course. They've already done enough damage to their public image. Pulling out of a sales agreement when they've already collected the money is not a good practice. Even if they had to pay up for the sets I think they would eat the loss to fulfill the orders...JMHO
<< <i>I am not defending APMEX since they started this mess by jumping the gun but this actually makes some sense:
<< <i> According to Mr. Thomas, APMEX performed price diligence by reviewing market conditions and comparing two similar products, a 2010 Chinese five-ounce Silver Panda with a mintage of 10,000 coins that sells for $425 and a 2010 Mexican Libertad five-ounce silver coin with an unlimited mintage that sells for $225. Based on this information, APMEX made the decision to set its price at $279 a coin. >>
>>
Ampex didn't start this, Monaco sold the set the day before ampex even started, the first sets went for 900 bucks the next morning prices were at 1100 a set by the end of that day it went to 1500 than sold out. Now My question is where and how did Monaco get 1000 sets? Another thread here shows a letter yesterday from a dealer saying expect sticker shock when we finally get them, again i ask if these 33,000 sets went to 11 or whatever dealers, than apparently some of these dealers already promised some of these to the other dealers. And at what price ? >>
Monico was at $1000 per set the night before you called. The lower cost was for 10 sets. I am wishing I said nothing because if no one was aware of the Monico deal then they might not have been so agitated at Apmex's $1395. Now I may not even get the one I ordered. We should have just keep our beef with Apmex and not run to the idiot giant called uncle sam. We should know they will screw things up almost every time.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>Monico was at $1000 per set the night before you called. The lower cost was for 10 sets. I am wishing I said nothing because if no one was aware of the Monico deal then they might not have been so agitated at Apmex's $1395. Now I may not even get the one I ordered. We chould have just keep our beef with Apmex and not run to the idiot giant called uncle sam. >>
The Monaco sales are not well-known. They're not even mentioned on the MintNewsBlog threads, and yet the outrage at APMEX is dripping from those threads.
<< <i>unless somehow mandated by the mint...I don't think we'll see anything as low as $1395 again >>
So who will everyone call then???? Who can they sue now????
The "Off with their heads" group of a few days ago only have themselves to blame for this cluster....
>>
>>
You summed it up perfectly..$1395 will be a steal, once these are in the market place. BTW indiv. pucks are selling for over $600 each on eBay. Set of 5 is going for over $2k
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
Knowing what sales are going for now can't you imagine the phone line and internet gridlock at the Mint if they sold them for $1000 or less. What a mess.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>Knowing what sales are going for now can't you imagine the phone line and internet gridlock at the Mint if they sold them for $1000 or less. What a mess. >>
Just imagine The Mint phone lines/web site the day that the even lower mintage collector versions go on sale at noon!!
<< <i>Knowing what sales are going for now can't you imagine the phone line and internet gridlock at the Mint if they sold them for $1000 or less. What a mess. >>
Just imagine The Mint phone lines/web site the day that the even lower mintage collector versions go on sale at noon!! >>
Now double that number of customers including a few more flippers. If I decide to get some I hope I can get to a computer that day and can stay with it for 2 hours.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
The mint should hold a lottery for their existing customers ( the loyal ones who have bought for at least 5 years from them), that would solve the frenzy when they go on sale next year.
<< <i>The mint should hold a lottery for their existing customers ( the loyal ones who have bought for at least 5 years from them), that would solve the frenzy when they go on sale next year. >>
More complaints and running to lawyers.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
Ok...I feel better now.....I went and did some Xmas shopping and put my cynic self on hold..........
<< <i> PS it was well clustered friday when Monaco started selling and raising their prices. >>
I think on Friday you were seeing the start of market pricing that would have formed a base if it was given the chance. Now there is the low mintage, hoopla, articles in major newspapers, and perceived rarity that have skewed the issue.
When the market NOW comes up with a base price it will not be as believable as it would have been on Friday-Monday with dealers allowed to do their thing.
<< <i>Ok...I feel better now.....I went and did some Xmas shopping and put my cynic self on hold..........
<< <i> PS it was well clustered friday when Monaco started selling and raising their prices. >>
I think on Friday you were seeing the start of market pricing that would have formed a base if it was given the chance. Now there is the low mintage, hoopla, articles in major newspapers, and perceived rarity that have skewed the issue.
When the market NOW comes up with a base price it will not be as believable as it would have been on Friday-Monday with dealers allowed to do their thing.
Too bad..... >>
point understood.
we'll see what the market does.
there is some cooling off taking effect on me.
I eventually drank the kool-aid on monday.
I'm trying to promise myself 2x or 10x that I won't chase these again when they are re-released.
I hope others are re-thinking the situation as well.
blame when the time comes and after the events have unfolded.
Comments
<< <i>
<< <i>
Wanna buy an Elizabeth Monroe First Spouse in MS69 (PCGS Graded) for double bullion value ($1,402). Its a low mintage coin with only 4,519 minted. (W@W!!!) A terrific investment for the future and sure to increase in price! >>
Scarcity is tied to interest in the subject matter. I'd argue that the national park series is about 10x more interesting than uninteresting spouses. Nearly 289 million people visited the US Parks in 2009. A very small percentage of these people will be coin collectors with a budget to collect these. But I'd argue that 33k does represent scarcity for this series with its wider appeal.
~0.01% of the total visitors visiting the US parks in 2009 would be able to have one of these sets. >>
I expect that most folks would prefer either a Silver Proof ATB Quarter, a regular Proof ATB Quarter, or some piece of circulated stuff thats been silver plated and placed in a cardbaord holder at the park gift shops over this 3" 5 troy ounce piece of Silver.
I'll be surprised if interest in these lasts more than a year. Thats about what it took for the First Spouse pieces that were selling in the beginning at double bullion value. I mean, folks have to admit that they've been waiting for these to make an appearance since 1/1/2010.
The name is LEE!
Subject to my getting these from somewhere, of course.
Someone feel free to offer the ones I commit to you for at $900/per coin on ebay. We can work out the details later.
Subject to you getting them from me, of course.
If I can't supply them in the end, you are free to continue thinking that you "deserve" to receive them because you ordered from me.
Don't worry about anything else.
There! That ought to prove that a market has been established. Carry on.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>www.wsj.com has a new article on the 5 oz silver coins. >>
Good article with an interview with Scott Thomas.
WSJ Link
<< <i>The following is from the legislation:
"`(2) AVAILABILITY FOR SALE- Bullion coins minted under paragraph (1)–
`(A) shall become available for sale no sooner than the first day of the calendar year in which the circulating quarter dollar of which such bullion coin is a duplicate is issued; and
`(B) may only be available for sale during the year in which such circulating quarter dollar is issued."
I interpret this as: The USM must send the coins to their distributors by year's end. They have 3.5 weeks.
Interesting that there is nothing in the legislation pointing to a numismatic 5 oz piece. BUT...refer to the following:
"`(6) ISSUANCE-
`(A) QUALITY OF COINS- The Secretary may mint and issue such number of quarter dollars of each design selected under paragraph (3) in uncirculated and proof qualities as the Secretary determines to be appropriate.
`(B) SILVER COINS- Notwithstanding subsection (b), the Secretary may mint and issue such number of quarter dollars of each design selected under paragraph (3) as the Secretary determines to be appropriate, with a content of 90 percent silver and 10 percent copper."
The law doesn't say anything about a numismatic 5 oz. version. However, it only states that silver coins must be 90% silver. Nothing specifying the size. >>
you're not reading the whole law.
the bullion part is at the bottom. it has it's own subsection. look for: TITLE II—BULLION INVESTMENT PRODUCTS
the part you reference is for 90% silver proof set quarters that are the same size as the regular quarters.
<< <i> The distributors must stop selling after Dec. 31. If they don't all sell, do the distributors send the coins back to the mint for melting? >>
the law requiring their sales during the calendar year is for the mint.
any private sales afterwards can happen whenever they want.
<< <i>Coins are bringing close to $700 EACH on ebay now.
Hot Springs 5 ounce
I'm waiting for the "5 oz. of the silver quarters" auctions to hit eBay.
Hmmmm.... I better check my math on that one... it could be expensive... what's the mint's premium on silver proof sets??
<< <i>Coins are bringing close to $700 EACH on ebay now.
Hot Springs 5 ounce
At $700/coin, I'd offer free shipping :-)
TOTALLY INSANE!
<< <i>
the part you reference is for 90% silver proof set quarters that are the same size as the regular quarters. >>
I read the part at the bottom. No mention of a numismatic version. And the bullion cannot be issued next year anyway. Therefore, I am guessing they are producing the numismatic versions under the authority of the silver issues listed in the top section.
There is nothing I read in the silver quarter section specifying a size.
Just a guess.
Totally unrelated to the above, but it just popped into my head, I sure miss ericj96. I would love to read his insight into this - and other - modern issues.
the 90% silver coins are "quarter dollars" listed under the "quarter dollar" subsection in the law, as opposed to the bullion subsection that follows.
<< <i>I'm just on understanding why anyone would talk about a HH limit. At least for APMEX.
Here's the facts:
18 hours to sell, everyone had plenty of time to buy; you could buy as much as your CC could hold; and it still took 18 HOURS to sell ONLY 1000 sets, out of 33,000. Nobody missed out on this opportunity. So, how would that be fair to the people who ordered and were totally willing to pay the original price? The ones who put their money on the line while people on THIS board said NO WAY, it's a ripeoff, the ones who bought BEFORE anything was on ebay or anyplace else. That would be as unjust as APMEX charging $1395. Just my opinion.
IMHO, Those that paid exorbitant prices and took the risk, ought to be able to reap the reward. The reward just keeps going up, up, and away.
Almost $700 a coin translates to $3500 a set. Looks like that $1395/set was a bargain.
Anyone who ordered, or will order, will get these coins CHEAPER than 1395 a set.
Whoever is paying 700 per coin is a huge fool.
Once they find out they can acquire one for under $200, they will be requesting a refund or not completing the deal.
<< <i>
<< <i>I'm just on understanding why anyone would talk about a HH limit. At least for APMEX.
Here's the facts:
18 hours to sell, everyone had plenty of time to buy; you could buy as much as your CC could hold; and it still took 18 HOURS to sell ONLY 1000 sets, out of 33,000. Nobody missed out on this opportunity. So, how would that be fair to the people who ordered and were totally willing to pay the original price? The ones who put their money on the line while people on THIS board said NO WAY, it's a ripeoff, the ones who bought BEFORE anything was on ebay or anyplace else. That would be as unjust as APMEX charging $1395. Just my opinion.
IMHO, Those that paid exorbitant prices and took the risk, ought to be able to reap the reward. The reward just keeps going up, up, and away.
Almost $700 a coin translates to $3500 a set. Looks like that $1395/set was a bargain. >>
I agree. I took the risk and was very stressed about the potential downside of this for my business. If the mint puts a limit of 1 per HH they are WAY overstepping their bounds IMHO. This entire thing was about PRICE. The mint KNEW the MINTAGE and didn't put a HH limit before..... why now??????? That wouldn't be fair to those who bought from APMEX at those "crazy" prices.
<< <i>Good article with an interview with Scott Thomas. WSJ Link >>
Can't read it without a subscription...
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I'm just on understanding why anyone would talk about a HH limit. At least for APMEX.
Here's the facts:
18 hours to sell, everyone had plenty of time to buy; you could buy as much as your CC could hold; and it still took 18 HOURS to sell ONLY 1000 sets, out of 33,000. Nobody missed out on this opportunity. So, how would that be fair to the people who ordered and were totally willing to pay the original price? The ones who put their money on the line while people on THIS board said NO WAY, it's a ripeoff, the ones who bought BEFORE anything was on ebay or anyplace else. That would be as unjust as APMEX charging $1395. Just my opinion.
IMHO, Those that paid exorbitant prices and took the risk, ought to be able to reap the reward. The reward just keeps going up, up, and away.
Almost $700 a coin translates to $3500 a set. Looks like that $1395/set was a bargain. >>
I agree. I took the risk and was very stressed about the potential downside of this for my business. If the mint puts a limit of 1 per HH they are WAY overstepping their bounds IMHO. This entire thing was about PRICE. The mint KNEW the MINTAGE and didn't put a HH limit before..... why now??????? That wouldn't be fair to those who bought from APMEX at those "crazy" prices. >>
Well said. I agree.
There are sellers on the Bay that obviously ordered many sets from an AP and are expecting delivery which may or not happen...
Collectors are paying beaucoup bucks for the potential to own these sets. The last three from one seller went for BIN's of $2749 and singles for $682. Another seller sold 16 for $1950.
Sooooooo HH limit of one is imposed....
..and ALL these sets come off the market creating a huge demand and price markup for those lucky purchasers deciding to sell their single sets to collectors unable to get one from the Mint. The dealers, who ALWAYS seem to get as many as they want, go wild with their new found cash cow.
I originally assumed that the pre-sales on Ebay were being pulled by the sellers because of the potential that the sellers would not get their sets but NOW I know they were pulled because the price listed was too low ($1695-1945) and have been re-listed higher or are sitting this out.
Remind me again why all the weeping and gnashing at $1395/set??? That is now half of the going price...
Please do not repeat the reply that these are dummy sales intended to push the price up...these are multiple sellers and it will cost them around $100 per sale in Ebay fees...not chump change.
<< <i> According to Mr. Thomas, APMEX performed price diligence by reviewing market conditions and comparing two similar products, a 2010 Chinese five-ounce Silver Panda with a mintage of 10,000 coins that sells for $425 and a 2010 Mexican Libertad five-ounce silver coin with an unlimited mintage that sells for $225. Based on this information, APMEX made the decision to set its price at $279 a coin. >>
Now I look at it this way,
1. If they don't get them I will get my money back.
2. sale goes and I get the set
3. sale goes and I get a rebate or credit.
<< <i>I am not defending APMEX since they started this mess by jumping the gun but this actually makes some sense:
<< <i> According to Mr. Thomas, APMEX performed price diligence by reviewing market conditions and comparing two similar products, a 2010 Chinese five-ounce Silver Panda with a mintage of 10,000 coins that sells for $425 and a 2010 Mexican Libertad five-ounce silver coin with an unlimited mintage that sells for $225. Based on this information, APMEX made the decision to set its price at $279 a coin. >>
>>
Ampex didn't start this, Monaco sold the set the day before ampex even started, the first sets went for 900 bucks the next morning prices were at 1100 a set by the end of that day it went to 1500 than sold out. Now My question is where and how did Monaco get 1000 sets? Another thread here shows a letter yesterday from a dealer saying expect sticker shock when we finally get them, again i ask if these 33,000 sets went to 11 or whatever dealers, than apparently some of these dealers already promised some of these to the other dealers. And at what price ?
I used to be famous now I just collect coins.
Link to My Registry Set.
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/quarters/washington-quarters-specialty-sets/washington-quarters-complete-variety-set-circulation-strikes-1932-1964/publishedset/78469
Varieties Are The Spice Of LIFE and Thanks to Those who teach us what to search For.
mbogoman
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/classic-issues-colonials-through-1964/zambezi-collection-trade-dollars/7345Asesabi Lutho
<< <i>What's really going to be interesting are all those pre-sales on Ebay for $2500-$2800. Many of the sellers have sold multiple sets; some more than 10 sets at various prices already. If there is a low HH limit applied, these guys are screwed! Sure, they can cancel the sale, but I don't imagine the "canceled" buyers are going to be too happy and post positive feedback. Finding the sets to fulfill the orders on the open market might be a bit expensive!!! >>
...and they are out some major bucks with the "final value fee" which is not refundable unless the buyer agrees to the cancellation (NOT!). This can be near $100 per sale
<< <i>Also, if you cancel the transaction in our Resolution Center and the buyer agrees, you can receive a final value fee credit. >>
Here's a warning parable for coin collectors...
<< <i>Looks like I paid APMEX $1400 for a can of popcorn.
Tin will be skyrocketing soon!
<< <i>The last I heard from apmex, they said if they get the sets, I'll get what I ordered from them. Has it been determined they won't get these, or they will reneg on their promise? >>
Nothing has been determined as yet. We're all still waiting word from the mint on what they're going to do. Anything up till the announcement is just speculation. Along those lines, is anyone who spoke with the mint legal reps expecting a call back? Or are we just awaiting something to work its way through the grapevine?
APMEX will not renege on their promise, unless they lose their allocation, of course. They've already done enough damage to their public image. Pulling out of a sales agreement when they've already collected the money is not a good practice. Even if they had to pay up for the sets I think they would eat the loss to fulfill the orders...JMHO
mbogoman
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/classic-issues-colonials-through-1964/zambezi-collection-trade-dollars/7345Asesabi Lutho
--Severian the Lame
<< <i>So...in hindsight, was it wrong of me to price my set at $2k? >>
yes. You left money on the table.
<< <i>
<< <i>So...in hindsight, was it wrong of me to price my set at $2k? >>
yes. You left money on the table. >>
--Severian the Lame
<< <i>So...in hindsight, was it wrong of me to price my set at $2k? >>
don't derail this thread!
I'd hate to see it go poof!
but I didn't post to that thread because I think BST pricing comments, whether on that forum or this forum, is bad form.
<< <i>So...in hindsight, was it wrong of me to price my set at $2k? >>
I think no one has any clue what the market price of these sets will be until a market of REAL sets develops.
<< <i>unless somehow mandated by the mint...I don't think we'll see anything as low as $1395 again >>
So who will everyone call then???? Who can they sue now????
The "Off with their heads" group of a few days ago only have themselves to blame for this cluster....
<< <i>
<< <i>unless somehow mandated by the mint...I don't think we'll see anything as low as $1395 again >>
So who will everyone call then???? Who can they sue now????
The "Off with their heads" group of a few days ago only have themselves to blame for this cluster....
>>
<< <i>
<< <i>I am not defending APMEX since they started this mess by jumping the gun but this actually makes some sense:
<< <i> According to Mr. Thomas, APMEX performed price diligence by reviewing market conditions and comparing two similar products, a 2010 Chinese five-ounce Silver Panda with a mintage of 10,000 coins that sells for $425 and a 2010 Mexican Libertad five-ounce silver coin with an unlimited mintage that sells for $225. Based on this information, APMEX made the decision to set its price at $279 a coin. >>
>>
Ampex didn't start this, Monaco sold the set the day before ampex even started, the first sets went for 900 bucks the next morning prices were at 1100 a set by the end of that day it went to 1500 than sold out. Now My question is where and how did Monaco get 1000 sets? Another thread here shows a letter yesterday from a dealer saying expect sticker shock when we finally get them, again i ask if these 33,000 sets went to 11 or whatever dealers, than apparently some of these dealers already promised some of these to the other dealers. And at what price ?
Monico was at $1000 per set the night before you called. The lower cost was for 10 sets. I am wishing I said nothing because if no one was aware of the Monico deal then they might not have been so agitated at Apmex's $1395. Now I may not even get the one I ordered. We should have just keep our beef with Apmex and not run to the idiot giant called uncle sam. We should know they will screw things up almost every time.
<< <i>Monico was at $1000 per set the night before you called. The lower cost was for 10 sets. I am wishing I said nothing because if no one was aware of the Monico deal then they might not have been so agitated at Apmex's $1395. Now I may not even get the one I ordered. We chould have just keep our beef with Apmex and not run to the idiot giant called uncle sam. >>
The Monaco sales are not well-known. They're not even mentioned on the MintNewsBlog threads, and yet the outrage at APMEX is dripping from those threads.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>unless somehow mandated by the mint...I don't think we'll see anything as low as $1395 again >>
So who will everyone call then???? Who can they sue now????
The "Off with their heads" group of a few days ago only have themselves to blame for this cluster....
>>
You summed it up perfectly..$1395 will be a steal, once these are in the market place. BTW indiv. pucks are selling for over $600 each on eBay. Set of 5 is going for over $2k
<< <i>
<< <i>unless somehow mandated by the mint...I don't think we'll see anything as low as $1395 again >>
So who will everyone call then???? Who can they sue now????
The "Off with their heads" group of a few days ago only have themselves to blame for this cluster.... >>
it may have made things worse.
but that is in the future right now.
blame when the time comes.
PS it was well clustered friday when Monaco started selling and raising their prices.
<< <i>Knowing what sales are going for now can't you imagine the phone line and internet gridlock at the Mint if they sold them for $1000 or less. What a mess. >>
Just imagine The Mint phone lines/web site the day that the even lower mintage collector versions go on sale at noon!!
<< <i>
<< <i>Knowing what sales are going for now can't you imagine the phone line and internet gridlock at the Mint if they sold them for $1000 or less. What a mess. >>
Just imagine The Mint phone lines/web site the day that the even lower mintage collector versions go on sale at noon!! >>
Now double that number of customers including a few more flippers. If I decide to get some I hope I can get to a computer that day and can stay with it for 2 hours.
Box of 20
<< <i>The mint should hold a lottery for their existing customers ( the loyal ones who have bought for at least 5 years from them), that would solve the frenzy when they go on sale next year. >>
More complaints and running to lawyers.
<< <i> PS it was well clustered friday when Monaco started selling and raising their prices. >>
I think on Friday you were seeing the start of market pricing that would have formed a base if it was given the chance. Now there is the low mintage, hoopla, articles in major newspapers, and perceived rarity that have skewed the issue.
When the market NOW comes up with a base price it will not be as believable as it would have been on Friday-Monday with dealers allowed to do their thing.
Too bad.....
The name is LEE!
<< <i>Ok...I feel better now.....I went and did some Xmas shopping and put my cynic self on hold..........
<< <i> PS it was well clustered friday when Monaco started selling and raising their prices. >>
I think on Friday you were seeing the start of market pricing that would have formed a base if it was given the chance. Now there is the low mintage, hoopla, articles in major newspapers, and perceived rarity that have skewed the issue.
When the market NOW comes up with a base price it will not be as believable as it would have been on Friday-Monday with dealers allowed to do their thing.
Too bad..... >>
point understood.
we'll see what the market does.
there is some cooling off taking effect on me.
I eventually drank the kool-aid on monday.
I'm trying to promise myself 2x or 10x that I won't chase these again when they are re-released.
I hope others are re-thinking the situation as well.
blame when the time comes and after the events have unfolded.
<< <i>Who's Monaco anyway? >>
I don't even think they are an AP.
I think it's just another dealer.
google 'em.