Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
perhaps the idea for a big and thin version monetized at twenty-five cents was on purpose? >>
Not sure what the big deal is concerning the face value. ALL bullion coins have face values that are a small fraction of their bullion value. Since the 1 oz ASE has a face value of $1.00, it would have made more sense to give these 5 oz coins a face value of $5.00 but it's really not that important since these will trade for melt. >>
not a complaint
just noting that they look like giant quarters and have the face value of one, too. Gotta wonder if they meant it this way or if it was just luck.
The 3-inch bullion pieces are excellent and look like the quarters, except bigger and better detailed.
The dies are hand finished.
Roger, do you know anything about the release date or the pricing? If you are bound by confidentiality, can you tell us the best place to keep updated on this? Thanks, jmski.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
Sorry, I don't know anything about release date or pricing. Since they will be sold only through the ASE bullion program, you’ll have the mint’s cost recovery and then the bullion distributor’s markup. The whole 3-inch project has been much more complicated and expensive than I think the Congressional sponsor realized. So much of it is arbitrary and not aimed at getting US silver bullion into the hands of citizens who want to buy.
Well, at least it sounds like they are well-made on the front end. Do you know if they are going to be distributed raw or in plastic sheets like the Gold Buffs? Just askin'. Any info is good info.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
With such an unprecedented coin/product, it does seem odd that the Mint is going with bullion dealers instead of doing the whole presentation box thing. Of course we are probably getting them cheaper now, as they are only bullion.
The 3-inch bullion pieces are supposed to be packaged in rolls, much like the regular ASEs. There might -- might -- be plastic spacers to reduce surface scrapes.
[Frankly, were I the mint director when this bill hit Congress, I’d have been over there bending ears and jerking chains until the Congress listened to the problems associated with these things. Millions spent on equipment and training; space appropriated for the press; new packaging equip; all sorts of production problems to solve; likely high markup; no meaningful benefit to anyone; and no thought to how to market the things effectively.]
[Frankly, were I the mint director when this bill hit Congress, I’d have been over there bending ears and jerking chains until the Congress listened to the problems associated with these things. Millions spent on equipment and training; space appropriated for the press; new packaging equip; all sorts of production problems to solve; likely high markup; no meaningful benefit to anyone; and no thought to how to market the things effectively.]
I agree 100%! Furthermore, there was zero thought given to using the same designs as the quarters. Zip. Nada. It's kinda sad.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i>wonder if there will be position a & b edge lettering with these??? >>
It is my understanding that the edge inscription will be imparted to the coin during the strike using a segmented collar, which would provide a fixed position and alignment for the edge lettering. TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
<< <i>For those that remember, Russ offered a preventive measure for milk spots on ASE's a long time ago. A bath in acetone, upon receipt, and no spotting develops. Cheers, RickO >>
Of course, if The Mint actually cared about it's customers you'd think that they would do this themselves!!! HOW FRUSTURATING.
I'm still curious if the National Park Service will offer these in their own unique packaging. Might be a good way to get one that hasn't been picked over (or maybe not). If the NPS provides a cohesive design that ties the entire series together, but with branding unique to each park, that would be a very appealing way to collect them.
<< <i>I'm still curious if the National Park Service will offer these in their own unique packaging. Might be a good way to get one that hasn't been picked over (or maybe not). If the NPS provides a cohesive design that ties the entire series together, but with branding unique to each park, that would be a very appealing way to collect them. >>
They can if they want to... but I don't see anything on their web site: nps.gov
The America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins are sold in bulk quantities to business firms approved by the United States Mint which have met the qualifying criteria discussed in Section V below. Approved firms can purchase these coins in the following quantities: - A minimum of 10,000 ounces (2,000 coins) of silver. Purchases above the minimum must be in 500-ounce (100-coin) increments, the standard packaged quantity. - However, the United States Mint reserves the right to sell less than the minimum quantity, impose a maximum order quantity and suspend all sales at any time as circumstances warrant. (the same language is in there for the ASEs, too) The America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins are packaged in semi-clear plastic tubes (10 five-ounce coins to a tube). The tubes are then placed in vacuum-formed inserts in sealed molded plastic shipping containers. The tops of the plastic tubes and the shipping containers are imprinted with the United States Mint seal. The price of the America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coin is based on the silver content plus a fixed premium per ounce. The premium for this coin will be established in 2010 prior to the launch of this program and is subject to change. United States Mint bullion coin premium changes are posted in the Federal Register.
I'm going to take a flying wild guess and say these will be boxed as a single issue per monster box of 500 ounce box. (100 coins per box)
100 coins in a box, 10 coins in a tube, and 10 tubes in a box. I expect 1 issue per box instead of mixed issue boxes.** (**If they sold them 2 tubes per issue and 5 issues in a box, I think we have enough interest to swing a mixed issue monster box.)
So, I estimate we have interest for only about 20 to 25 coins for each issue right now. If they do come 100 coins in a single issue box, then we are 75 to 80 coins short.
Any more interest out there for these?
> > >
Here are some replies posted to the thread already: DrBuster - Single design? If it were a mixed box and lots had one of each I would. Akbeez - I'm a player. I think they are a refreshing change and will be collecting. coasterfan - I'm interested. GritsMan - Not sure what a Monster Box is or how many I'd need to commit to, but I'd be in for buying two of them--two coins, 5-oz rounds, I mean. Zubie - Im in for 5 if we do a monster box! 08HALA20 - I am good for 2 as long as price isn't crazy. llafoe - PM me when you get your group together. bigmarty58 - Put me in for one also. MrSpud - I'd take one also if someone puts this together. PipestonePete - Please put me down for two OPA** - I'm in for one as long as the price does not exceed $125 per puck. (**I think this is a premium based comment, as melt is now over $125. ) blue594 - I'd be interested in one or two of each.
<< <i>I am afraid by the time the 5oz is released, the high silver price will stop me from buying it. >>
We've lowered the minimum order from 100 to 10 when the come in, does that help? >>
Is that ten of one of the states ? Or will they allow 2 of each state to be in that order of ten? I would like to get 1 of each so count me in on any group order................
I was originally thinking I would get a tube (10) each of Yosemites, Grand Canyons and "Jellystones", but that was back when silver was below $20. Now I'm thinking only two tubes. Put me on the list for a tube of Yosemites and a tube of Grand Canyons.
The speculation is that end dealer markup will be more per ounce than for the ASEs as sales are expected to be lower than with ASEs and the mint may have a higher markup due to production problems.
This makes ordering a box of 100 even more compelling. The end dealer would be out of the picture.
However, the facts in the numbers are inescapable: everyone wants 1 - need 100 people everyone wants 2 - need 50 people everyone wants 3 - need 34 people everyone wants 4 - need 25 people everyone wants 5 - need 20 people ... then 17, then 15, then 13, then 12 everyone wants 10 - need 10 people
it can be 15 people.... 5 for 10 each and 10 for 5 each.
when this idea was first floated, silver was around 17-18, now it's 26. melt on 10x5oz is $1,300 @26/oz, before markup and expenses(shipping&ins.)
As the price of silver creeps (rockets?) up, I see fewer people interested in 10 coins each just due to the price. So, if this ever gets close to getting off the ground, firm orders will be firm orders with no backing out. (That is... You send the $ for 10, you're getting 10 coins and not 5 coins plus 5x$price of 1 back.)
<< <i>Anyone have any idea on what the premium over spot these will cost me? >>
The "Authorized Purchasers" a/k/a the huge whales that broker this stuff by the thousands of ounces.... do not even have an idea right now because the mint has them and everyone else 100% in the dark about everything not already posted.
<< <i>Well I'm just taking names right now. Step #1 is finding enough interest for 100 coins of each issue.
If not enough interest is out there, then nothing happens.
but I'll update the total with a +2. >>
we only need to buy 10 rolls minimum now, if we bought 2 rolls of each state for our minimum order that would only be 20 coins of each issue right ? >>
I'm guessing the min. order will be a monster box of 100 coins.
I'm guessing the box will be a single issue. So, that's mean finding interest in 100 coins for each issue. (instead of 20 coins of 5 issues. boy, I hope hope hope they put 5 issues in a box.)
So, as it stands... I'm looking to place 100 coins for each issue (5 issue this year) to guarantee a monster box can be ordered (for each issue). If they put all 5 issues in a single box... then they just all come at the same time, huh?
<< <i>At $130 just for the silver these will end up between $150 and $175 each retail. >>
and climbing! But I think silver will pause, which is a gamble that all of QE2 is priced in and not just the first $75Bil. installment.
<< <i>Who are you planning to buy the monster box from? Did an authorized dealer say that he/she would sell you a monster box? >>
I'm thinking the same thing. What's the benefit here? >>
I'm hoping I can beat or at least match APMEX.
the benefit? The hopes of an MS70. (my biggest fear is that the big time dealers who have these tons of MS70 First Strike ASEs on their web sites (never ending supply!) will have first pickings on these, and the markups for an MS70 version of these will be astronomical because they will have them all.)
Everyone that reads regularly enough knows I'm too much of a dork to cherry pick these if I promise not to.
And I'm promising not to. My name goes in the middle of the list. Whoever is on top gets the first coin. period. Whoever is next in line is next. No picking and choosing.
I take it Ms is coordinating the buy? Memory fails me...
It all comes done to whether there is sufficient discount to warrant a box -- I've never done that so newbie I am.
PM sent for undisclosed amount...but I will want all five species.
Refs: MCM,Fivecents,Julio,Robman,Endzone,Coiny,Agentjim007,Musky1011,holeinone1972,Tdec1000,Type2,bumanchu, Metalsman,Wondercoin,Pitboss,Tomohawk,carew4me,segoja,thebigeng,jlc_coin,mbogoman,sportsmod,dragon,tychojoe,Schmitz7,claychaser,and many OTHERS
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
Comments
<< <i>how thick will the dansco pages be?
Think they can squeeze two coins onto a page?????
<< <i>
<< <i>Attack of the giant quarters.
perhaps the idea for a big and thin version monetized at twenty-five cents was on purpose? >>
Not sure what the big deal is concerning the face value. ALL bullion coins have face values that are a small fraction of their bullion value. Since the 1 oz ASE has a face value of $1.00, it would have made more sense to give these 5 oz coins a face value of $5.00 but it's really not that important since these will trade for melt. >>
not a complaint
just noting that they look like giant quarters and have the face value of one, too. Gotta wonder if they meant it this way or if it was just luck.
The dies are hand finished.
Roger, do you know anything about the release date or the pricing? If you are bound by confidentiality, can you tell us the best place to keep updated on this? Thanks, jmski.
I knew it would happen.
I knew it would happen.
Yes, we will.
<< <i>Will PCGS grade/holder them?
Yes, we will. >>
Great news! Will there be a premium for the holder... a special service?
[Frankly, were I the mint director when this bill hit Congress, I’d have been over there bending ears and jerking chains until the Congress listened to the problems associated with these things. Millions spent on equipment and training; space appropriated for the press; new packaging equip; all sorts of production problems to solve; likely high markup; no meaningful benefit to anyone; and no thought to how to market the things effectively.]
I agree 100%! Furthermore, there was zero thought given to using the same designs as the quarters. Zip. Nada. It's kinda sad.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>wonder if there will be position a & b edge lettering with these??? >>
Not to mention size A and size B.
<< <i>wonder if there will be position a & b edge lettering with these??? >>
It is my understanding that the edge inscription will be imparted to the coin during the strike using a segmented collar, which would provide a fixed position and alignment for the edge lettering.
TD
<< <i>Will PCGS grade/holder them?
Yes, we will. >>
Time to renew my membership then...Thanks for answering this question.
<< <i>The crazy thing is these quarters are already done in silver, I guess whoever wrote the law forgot about that.
and they have a face value of 25 cents....
<< <i>For those that remember, Russ offered a preventive measure for milk spots on ASE's a long time ago. A bath in acetone, upon receipt, and no spotting develops. Cheers, RickO >>
Of course, if The Mint actually cared about it's customers you'd think that they would do this themselves!!! HOW FRUSTURATING.
<< <i>I'm still curious if the National Park Service will offer these in their own unique packaging. Might be a good way to get one that hasn't been picked over (or maybe not). If the NPS provides a cohesive design that ties the entire series together, but with branding unique to each park, that would be a very appealing way to collect them. >>
They can if they want to... but I don't see anything on their web site: nps.gov
The America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins are sold in bulk quantities to business firms approved by the United States Mint which have met the qualifying criteria discussed in Section V below. Approved firms can purchase these coins in the following quantities:
- A minimum of 10,000 ounces (2,000 coins) of silver. Purchases above the minimum must be in 500-ounce (100-coin) increments, the standard packaged quantity.
- However, the United States Mint reserves the right to sell less than the minimum quantity, impose a maximum order quantity and suspend all sales at any time as circumstances warrant. (the same language is in there for the ASEs, too)
The America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coins are packaged in semi-clear plastic tubes
(10 five-ounce coins to a tube). The tubes are then placed in vacuum-formed inserts in sealed molded plastic shipping containers. The tops of the plastic tubes and the shipping containers are imprinted with the United States Mint seal.
The price of the America the Beautiful Silver Bullion Coin is based on the silver content plus a fixed premium per ounce. The premium for this coin will be established in 2010 prior to the launch of this program and is subject to change. United States Mint bullion coin premium changes are posted in the Federal Register.
I'm going to take a flying wild guess and say these will be boxed as a single issue per monster box of 500 ounce box. (100 coins per box)
>
>
Hopes are DIM for a group monster box buy.
100 coins in a box, 10 coins in a tube, and 10 tubes in a box. I expect 1 issue per box instead of mixed issue boxes.**
(**If they sold them 2 tubes per issue and 5 issues in a box, I think we have enough interest to swing a mixed issue monster box.)
So, I estimate we have interest for only about 20 to 25 coins for each issue right now. If they do come 100 coins in a single issue box, then we are 75 to 80 coins short.
Any more interest out there for these?
>
>
>
Here are some replies posted to the thread already:
DrBuster - Single design? If it were a mixed box and lots had one of each I would.
Akbeez - I'm a player. I think they are a refreshing change and will be collecting.
coasterfan - I'm interested.
GritsMan - Not sure what a Monster Box is or how many I'd need to commit to, but I'd be in for buying two of them--two coins, 5-oz rounds, I mean.
Zubie - Im in for 5 if we do a monster box!
08HALA20 - I am good for 2 as long as price isn't crazy.
llafoe - PM me when you get your group together.
bigmarty58 - Put me in for one also.
MrSpud - I'd take one also if someone puts this together.
PipestonePete - Please put me down for two
OPA** - I'm in for one as long as the price does not exceed $125 per puck. (**I think this is a premium based comment, as melt is now over $125.
blue594 - I'd be interested in one or two of each.
<< <i>I am afraid by the time the 5oz is released, the high silver price will stop me from buying it. >>
We've lowered the minimum order from 100 to 10 when the come in, does that help?
<< <i>
<< <i>I am afraid by the time the 5oz is released, the high silver price will stop me from buying it. >>
We've lowered the minimum order from 100 to 10 when the come in, does that help? >>
Is that ten of one of the states ? Or will they allow 2 of each state to be in that order of ten? I would like to get 1 of each so count me in on any group order................
I used to be famous now I just collect coins.
Link to My Registry Set.
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/quarters/washington-quarters-specialty-sets/washington-quarters-complete-variety-set-circulation-strikes-1932-1964/publishedset/78469
Varieties Are The Spice Of LIFE and Thanks to Those who teach us what to search For.
<< <i>Any more interest out there for these? >>
I was originally thinking I would get a tube (10) each of Yosemites, Grand Canyons and "Jellystones", but that was back when silver was below $20. Now I'm thinking only two tubes. Put me on the list for a tube of Yosemites and a tube of Grand Canyons.
mbogoman
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/classic-issues-colonials-through-1964/zambezi-collection-trade-dollars/7345Asesabi Lutho
This makes ordering a box of 100 even more compelling. The end dealer would be out of the picture.
However, the facts in the numbers are inescapable:
everyone wants 1 - need 100 people
everyone wants 2 - need 50 people
everyone wants 3 - need 34 people
everyone wants 4 - need 25 people
everyone wants 5 - need 20 people ... then 17, then 15, then 13, then 12
everyone wants 10 - need 10 people
it can be 15 people.... 5 for 10 each and 10 for 5 each.
when this idea was first floated, silver was around 17-18, now it's 26. melt on 10x5oz is $1,300 @26/oz, before markup and expenses(shipping&ins.)
As the price of silver creeps (rockets?) up, I see fewer people interested in 10 coins each just due to the price. So, if this ever gets close to getting off the ground, firm orders will be firm orders with no backing out. (That is... You send the $ for 10, you're getting 10 coins and not 5 coins plus 5x$price of 1 back.)
I can't front the cost of a monster box.
a group buy means that people commit their money and the order is placed.
> Until enough people are willing to commit money to a group of 100 coins, then it can't happen. <
as mentioned above, it's all a matter of numbers.
5 people at 20 coins each
10 people at 10 coins each
15 people.... 10 at 5 each and 5 at 10 each...
any way to get 100.
as it stands right now we're at 36 - 42 coins
<< <i>Would it be possible to get 10 coins, 2 each of the 5 different designs? >>
Well I'm just taking names right now. Step #1 is finding enough interest for 100 coins of each issue.
If not enough interest is out there, then nothing happens.
but I'll update the total with a +2.
If not enough interest is out there, then nothing happens.
as it stands right now we're at 38 - 44 coins
If it's just a single issue, I'll commit to two coins.
If it's all five issues, I'll commit to five coins as I want one of each. I'll commit up to ten coins if we come up short.
If it's just a single issue, I'll commit to two coins.
Last question. Anyone have any idea on what the premium over spot these will cost me?
Cashback from Mr. Rebates
Well I'm just taking names right now. Step #1 is finding enough interest for 100 coins of each issue.
If not enough interest is out there, then nothing happens.
but I'll update the total with a +2. >>
we only need to buy 10 rolls minimum now, if we bought 2 rolls of each state for our minimum order that would only be 20 coins of each issue right ?
I used to be famous now I just collect coins.
Link to My Registry Set.
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/quarters/washington-quarters-specialty-sets/washington-quarters-complete-variety-set-circulation-strikes-1932-1964/publishedset/78469
Varieties Are The Spice Of LIFE and Thanks to Those who teach us what to search For.
<< <i>Anyone have any idea on what the premium over spot these will cost me? >>
The "Authorized Purchasers" a/k/a the huge whales that broker this stuff by the thousands of ounces.... do not even have an idea right now because the mint has them and everyone else 100% in the dark about everything not already posted.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>Well I'm just taking names right now. Step #1 is finding enough interest for 100 coins of each issue.
If not enough interest is out there, then nothing happens.
but I'll update the total with a +2. >>
we only need to buy 10 rolls minimum now, if we bought 2 rolls of each state for our minimum order that would only be 20 coins of each issue right ? >>
I'm guessing the min. order will be a monster box of 100 coins.
I'm guessing the box will be a single issue. So, that's mean finding interest in 100 coins for each issue. (instead of 20 coins of 5 issues. boy, I hope hope hope they put 5 issues in a box.)
So, as it stands... I'm looking to place 100 coins for each issue (5 issue this year) to guarantee a monster box can be ordered (for each issue). If they put all 5 issues in a single box... then they just all come at the same time, huh?
<< <i>At $130 just for the silver these will end up between $150 and $175 each retail. >>
and climbing! But I think silver will pause, which is a gamble that all of QE2 is priced in and not just the first $75Bil. installment.
<< <i>Who are you planning to buy the monster box from? Did an authorized dealer say that he/she would sell you a monster box? >>
From what I've read, I have a place.
To put people at ease, I can give them a call tomorrow to confirm it.
<< <i>Who are you planning to buy the monster box from? Did an authorized dealer say that he/she would sell you a monster box? >>
I'm thinking the same thing. What's the benefit here?
I know AMEX sells the box for less per oz than a single, but are they willing to do that?
Just looked at amex, they have boxes for $3 over spot and single for $4 over spot. That would be a savings of $5 for each coin.
<< <i>
<< <i>Who are you planning to buy the monster box from? Did an authorized dealer say that he/she would sell you a monster box? >>
I'm thinking the same thing. What's the benefit here? >>
I'm hoping I can beat or at least match APMEX.
the benefit? The hopes of an MS70.
(my biggest fear is that the big time dealers who have these tons of MS70 First Strike ASEs on their web sites (never ending supply!) will have first pickings on these, and the markups for an MS70 version of these will be astronomical because they will have them all.)
Everyone that reads regularly enough knows I'm too much of a dork to cherry pick these if I promise not to.
And I'm promising not to. My name goes in the middle of the list. Whoever is on top gets the first coin. period. Whoever is next in line is next. No picking and choosing.
I take it Ms is coordinating the buy? Memory fails me...
It all comes done to whether there is sufficient discount to warrant a box -- I've never done that so newbie I am.
PM sent for undisclosed amount...but I will want all five species.
as it stands right now we're at 50 - 56 coins out of 100 (for each issue)