Official Basketball HOF Rookies Thread###################################

I started the football HOF RC thread, so I thought I would go ahead and do basketball. I am done with the basketball HOF set (less one card), but still love the set. It is one that I will not get rid of in the near future. So many cards that you can find on the cheap as compared to Baseball and Basketball. I just wanted to get some disscussions going about HOF eligibility and anything else you want to share. I will post pics of some of my favorite cards from this set when I get a chance.

Dave

FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
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Comments

  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
    Stolen from somewhere on future HOF'ers.


    Class of 2008
    Best bets: Patrick Ewing, Hakeem Olajuwon
    On the bubble: Mitch Richmond
    THE SKINNY: Two of the all-time greatest pivots take center stage. The '94 NBA Finals, when the Dream denied Ewing in his lone appearance in the title series, surely will be remembered by those in attendance. Of course, Ewing fans will prefer to dwell on the '84 NCAA Finals, when Ewing's Georgetown squad defeated Olajuwon's "Phi Slamma Jamma" Houston team. As for Richmond, he likely will join his Run TMC partner -- and current boss -- Mullin as a near-miss.
    Class of 2009
    Best bets: Michael Jordan, John Stockton, Pat Riley, David Robinson
    THE SKINNY: A class for the ages, with the emphasis on "class." Jordan, the greatest ever to play the game, will be joined by Stockton, the league's all-time leader in assists and steals, and Robinson, one of the game's all-time statesmen. All three were NBA legends who played the game the right way. Riley, third all-time in NBA coaching victories and owner of four NBA rings, will bring his slick-backed hair and Armani style to the proceedings as well.
    Class of 2010
    Best bet: Karl Malone
    THE SKINNY: Assuming he doesn't heed those annual calls to come out of retirement, the Mailman should be ready to follow his pick-and-roll buddy Stockton at this time. In his acceptance speech, he can tell the world how hard he worked to make it from humble beginnings to perhaps the greatest power forward of all time. But please, Mailman, for the sake of English teachers everywhere, make sure the speech contains the correct verb tenses.
    Class of 2011
    Best bet: Reggie Miller, Scottie Pippen
    THE SKINNY: One was the consummate showman. The other was the perfect sidekick. In that sense, Miller and Pippen will provide Hall spectators proof that there is more than one way to achieve greatness in basketball. And think of the possibilities for presenters: Jordan for Pippen, and Spike Lee for Miller.

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
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  • gosteelersgosteelers Posts: 2,674 ✭✭✭
    Do you think DJ (Dennis Johnson) will ever get enshrined posthumously?
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Do you think DJ (Dennis Johnson) will ever get enshrined posthumously? >>



    Honsetly, I don't really know that much about the older players. I was born in 1976 and did not become a basketball fan until the late 90's when I moved to INDY. Maybe someone else can chime in on the who should be in debate. One player I've heard mentioned over and over is Adrian Dantley..

    Dave

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
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  • gosteelersgosteelers Posts: 2,674 ✭✭✭
    Nice set...I was thinking of starting one myself. What was your toughest card to obtain (besides the Mikan and the one you don't have)?
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
    One good thing about the Basketball set is that it is not tough to complete, as compared to others. The problem with all these is finding decent copies. The 57 Topps and 61 fleer set's are notorious for terrible printing/centering issues. Look at some scans on ebay and it is very tough to find nice, centered copies out of either of these sets.


    Of course the Mikan is the "Nagurski" of the set and the other 48 Bowman and 33 Sport kings can be tough to find in nice condition, but that's the thrill of the hunt..image

    From 69- present all the cards are readily available on ebay at decent prices. In fact, most can be had in decent grades for under $100 or so (except Alcindor, Maravich, Erving and Bird/Magic.)

    Dave

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
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  • fujfuj Posts: 551 ✭✭
    Dave,
    Thanks for starting this thread. I agree with your assessment of pretty much all of the players you mentioned. As a Warriors fan, I think Mitch was a great player but just won't quite have the reputation, stats or the backing to ever make the Hall. I do however think Mullin will eventually make it in.

    I do not think Dennis Johnson is deserving but he will always have support from Celtics fans and may get some sympathy votes after his unfortunate passing. His defense was unmatched, but the rest of his game just does not warrant enshrinement IMHO.

    As far as older players are concerned, I always liked Artis Gilmore as a kid. He seemed to always be overshadowed by Kareem and Walton when talking about the best centers of the 70s.


    Dantley? He was a little too one dimensional for me, but he could score! I would vote no but I'm guessing that he might be one of those guys whose scoring totals look more impressive as time passes.

    Greg
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,105 ✭✭✭
    I think Dennis Johnson will get in, maybe even this year. He had the rings and was one of the top defenders of his era.

    And Adrian Dantley is the most snubbed deserving Hall-of-Famer in any sport. Period. You don't average more than 24 points for your career, including four straight 30-point seasos, without HOF talent. I don't care if Dantley was one dimensional. He did that ONE thing really well.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
    Do you know when the HOF announces it's new class?

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
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  • fujfuj Posts: 551 ✭✭
    Looks like last year's announcement was on April 2nd
  • gosteelersgosteelers Posts: 2,674 ✭✭✭
    What is with the 0.50 grade weights in the Registry? That's odd...
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
    I think most of the sets that are weighted include the 0.5. Most start at 1. I was actually the one that weighed this set back in the day. I'm sure it needs updated.

    Dave

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
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  • gosteelersgosteelers Posts: 2,674 ✭✭✭


    << <i>I think most of the sets that are weighted include the 0.5. Most start at 1. I was actually the one that weighed this set back in the day. I'm sure it needs updated.

    Dave >>



    Didn't mean to rip the idea...I just never saw it before.
  • aro13aro13 Posts: 2,014 ✭✭✭
    Dave - Thanks for starting this thread. I am currently #4 on the Hall of Fame rookie set and #1 on the Hall of Fame Players set. While I agree with Dave that the mainstream set is pretty easy to find the Hall of Fame players set is pretty difficult as many of the players are in one or two sets at most. I think I am down to less than 10 rookies to complete the "master" set and just the Mikan and Lopchick to complete the main set.

    While there are not as many "controversial" candidates as in baseball or even football there are some names to be bandied about. I also think people forget that the Basketball Hall of Fame includes more than just a players professional career like in the other sports.
  • GOODLIEUGOODLIEU Posts: 632 ✭✭
    You think collecting their Rookie cards is tough try the Autograph Set.LOL Goodlieu's HOF Auto Set
  • As far as potential canidates go for the HOF, Adrian Dantley and Dennis Johnson are way overdue especially when you consider the fact that two players who's resumes are almost identical to them Alex English/Joe Dumars are in and were playing in the NBA after them. Hakeem and Ewing I think are a lock and my bubble guy would be Bernard King. Also dont be surprised if Cynthia Cooper gets a nod and with their penchant for International players Arvydas Sabonis who was a Basketball God in Europe (Like Drazen Petrovic) could also appear on the ballot. and than there is the Basketball Hall of Fames worst nightmare Dennis Rodman I know people will say are you kidding but its hard to ignore his Rebounding/Defensive Awards and his Championship rings .
  • gosteelersgosteelers Posts: 2,674 ✭✭✭


    << <i>You think collecting their Rookie cards is tough try the Autograph Set.LOL Goodlieu's HOF Auto Set >>



    Wow, how much was that Mikan auto?
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
    I actually went one step further to make it a little more challenging. I have alot of rookies of players from foreign sets. I tried to find the first card ever made of players. I actually built a website attemping to document all the issues I've found.

    Basketball HOF Rookies

    It is a free site and if it gets too much traffic, its shuts down for an hour or so. If you cant view it, just try back later.

    Also, I built a website about the international hall of famers. I once had all the cards linked to pics but they dont currently work.

    International HOF Rookies

    Dave

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
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  • Very nice, and looking at your site just reminded me of the amazing Oscar Schmidt who received plaudits from the original Dream Team in the Olympic games who felt he could not only played in the NBA but would have been a major star.
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
    If I remember correctly, he was drafted by an NBA team wasn't he? Here is my Schmidt RC..

    image

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
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  • << <i>

    << <i>You think collecting their Rookie cards is tough try the Autograph Set.LOL Goodlieu's HOF Auto Set >>



    Wow, how much was that Mikan auto? >>



    Actually I pulled that card out of a pack of the 1996 Topps Stars which was dedicated to the 1996 NBA 50th Anniversary Top 50 Team. Incidently I had to send this card even though its from a major card company into PSA/DNA authentication as they wont grade any Auto cards from the manufacturer pre 1988 (Really Stupid Policy IMO)
  • Your right he was 6th round by the Nets 1984 Googled this "He was drafted by the New Jersey Nets in 1984, and had several other opportunities to play in the NBA, but declined them all in order to maintain his "amateur" status and continue to play in Brazil's national team (until 1989 NBA players were not allowed to play in the national teams). He retired on May 26, 2003".

  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,105 ✭✭✭
    They should be releasing the names of this year's finalists in a week or 2. I'm hoping the backlash the voters have received over the last couple of years will lead them to put a few more players in. Obviously I'm all for A.D. I'd love to see D.J. get in too.

    What do you guys think of Mullin's chances?
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • First off I am a alumni of St Johns in NY so you have to believe me when I say how much I personally loved Chris Mullins game. He was a great Shooter/Passer and had a very high Basketball IQ on the court. He had a great career college and pro but in my opinion will go down as a great player like say a Lou Hudson/Bob Love/Tom Chambers type of player who are all borderline HOFers. As I stated before I think that Bernard King and most certaily Adrian Dantley are more likely to get nominated when the Hall calls.
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,105 ✭✭✭
    I certainly wouldn't mind seeing King get in. I just picked up a PSA 9 King rookie for $36 last night.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • A nice article I found on the net

    Open those doors
    Ten NBA types who deserve inclusion in Hall of Fame
    Posted: Friday January 11, 2008 2:03PM; Updated: Friday January 11, 2008 3:22PM

    Adrian Dantley's prolific scoring hasn't been enough to earn him a Hall of Fame spot.
    Adrian Dantley's prolific scoring hasn't been enough to earn him a Hall of Fame spot.
    Manny Millan/SI

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    The Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame is the duck-billed platypus of sports' great shrines, a little-of-this, little-of-that place -- the organization, by the way, not the state-of-the-art facility in Springfield, Mass. -- designed by committee. As a result, it has too little of some very deserving potential members.

    Buncha cooks, one spoiled broth.

    Established in 1959, the basketball Hall tries to be all-inclusive, honoring coaches, players, referees and contributors from the professional, collegiate and international ranks, including both men and women. In that process of being all things to all hoopsters, though, it excludes some pretty worthy names.

    There is room for Sandro Gamba in the Hall, but so far, not Adrian Dantley. Van Chancellor got in, even though Don Nelson did not. Drazen Petrovic is in, Bernard King is out.

    (Pause for head scratching.)

    One problem, obviously, is this unwieldy attempt to honor all levels of basketball under one roof, rather than divvying up the acclaim at least between professional and amateur shrines or letting the NBA peel off for its own glittery, multimedia showplace on Fifth Avenue, strategically located adjacent to its NBA Store. Better yet, because the college, women's and international games also have specific halls or museums, commissioner David Stern ought to commandeer the building in Springfield.

    It doesn't help that there aren't any statistical standards, or "milestone'' thresholds, that will assure enshrinement; every selection is subjective. And that is made worse by the process itself, a relative star chamber compared with baseball's imperfect but essentially democratic approach to ushering its biggest names into Cooperstown.

    In basketball, a secret and frequently changing committee of 24 voters massages a list of candidates through more steps than the moon has phases; the rules of enshrinement require intensive scrolling on the Hall's Web site. They even send possible nominees into limbo for five years if the process doesn't smile their way sufficiently, an enforced waiting game that works great if you want more posthumous selections.

    Enough. No one person, with the possible exception of Stern, can correct all of the flaws associated with the basketball Hall. What I can do is remind whoever it is that will be a part of future voting, whenever they get around to it for the Class of 2008 or beyond (the finalists for this year won't be announced until next month), that a bunch of deserving people have been neglected.

    Miami Heat coach Pat Riley (having met the 25-year eligibility rule for active coaches) and centers Hakeem Olajuwon and Patrick Ewing (five years after their final seasons) should be no-brainer selections this year. Limiting our list to those with NBA qualifications, here are 10 more (in no particular order) to consider:
    1. Adrian Dantley

    Dantley is the Jim Rice of basketball, a powerful offensive force who dominated his sport like few others for a period of six season or so. His best years came with Utah from 1979 to 1986, but the burly low-post scorer from Notre Dame played for seven teams in 15 seasons. He averaged 24.3 points per game, topped 30.0 points for four consecutive seasons and won two NBA scoring titles. Everyone ahead of him in career scoring average is either in the Hall or will be once eligible, along with many behind him.

    "He could get out to 15 feet. He could take it to the basket. And he could get off his shots against taller guys, in traffic,'' said Miami assistant coach Bob McAdoo, a Hall of Famer who played with Dantley in Buffalo in 1976-77 and against him the rest of McAdoo's career. "He was so strong, he'd just muscle guys. He should be in.''

    Another Hall of Famer, Bill Walton, put it more hyperbolically not long ago, calling Dantley's omission "one of the most egregious errors in the history of basketball.''
    1 of 2

    2. Dennis Johnson

    Dennis Johnson (right) was a key part of the Celtics' classic battles with Magic Johnson and the Lakers.
    Dennis Johnson (right) was a key part of the Celtics' classic battles with Magic Johnson and the Lakers.
    AP


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    Johnson won one NBA title in Seattle (1979) and two in Boston (1984, 1986), earning the Finals MVP after the first one, then blending into the greater Celtics whole. Meanwhile, he was named to nine All-Defensive first or second teams and played in five All-Star games. He averaged 14.1 points and 5.0 assists in 1,100 games.

    "Sometimes you can look and say, 'Well, his statistics ...' But the teams he played on won,'' said Kevin McHale, part of Boston's Hall of Fame frontcourt in the 1980s. "He was a guy who was a big-game player, did so many different things, defended, did a lot of stuff you didn't see on the stat sheet. But he was a reason we were a championship team.''

    Sadly, Johnson died last February at age 52 while working his way back up the coaching ranks from the D-League. "He really 'got' the whole thing of working with guys,' '' McHale said. "I was really happy for him. I was sad when I heard about it, but I knew he was in a good place.''
    3. Chet Walker

    Walker was a seven-time NBA All-Star, averaged 18.2 points and 7.1 rebounds as a pro, was the second option on the 1966-67 Philadelphia 76ers (one of the greatest teams in league history) and was an All-American at Bradley. So why isn't he in? Some contend that Walker, as one of the plaintiffs in the league's historic "Oscar Robertson'' labor fight for free agency, has been blackballed from the Hall. Because it's hard to know who votes, it's hard to seek out their denials in Walker's case.
    4. Spencer Haywood

    Haywood is another player toting around some political baggage. He left the University of Detroit after one season there, at age 20, to sign with the ABA Denver Nuggets. After leading that upstart league in scoring and rebounding, Haywood signed with Seattle, upsetting both the ABA and a bunch of NBA teams that had no provisions at the time for underclassmen. To settle the squabble, the NBA created its "hardship clause,'' while Haywood settled into a solid career (19.2 ppg, 9.3 rpg) with several teams, picking up a ring with the Lakers in 1980.
    5. Artis Gilmore

    Gilmore currently is waiting out the Hall's probationary period after not attracting enough interest in his previous eligibility period. Why not? All the 7-foot-2 center with the wicked sideburns did was average 18.1 points and 12.3 rebounds for 17 ABA/NBA seasons while playing in 11 All-Star games.
    6. Don Nelson

    The view here is, Halls of Fame mostly are for players. But in Nelson's case, as with a few others, we'll make an exception. A two-time NBA Coach of the Year, Nelson ranks second in coaching victories and long has been considered one of the game's great innovators. With his five championships in 14 seasons as a player, Nellie has been involved in more NBA competition than any other man.

    We'll put in a bonus plug here for Bill Fitch, the former North Dakota and Minnesota Gophers coach who helped the Celtics win it all in 1981, got back to the finals with the Rockets in 1986 and won 944 games in 25 seasons.
    7. Rudy Tomjanovich

    Terrific player, successful coach and one of the NBA's tragic figures who made it all the way back. Tomjanovich was a five-time All-Star for Houston before suffering a near-fatal punch from the Lakers' Kermit Washington in 1977. After recovering, Rudy T returned but his production slid the next three seasons. He took over as Rockets coach in 1993 and, with Olajuwon in 1994 and 1995, won consecutive NBA titles while Michael Jordan was chasing curveballs.
    8. Johnny (Red) Kerr

    As a contributor, for sure, but as a player or coach, too, Kerr belongs in the Hall. A college star at Illinois, Kerr helped Syracuse win the NBA title in his rookie season in 1955. He was the league's first "iron man,'' playing in 844 consecutive games, and he averaged a double-double (13.8 ppg, 11.2 rpg) over 12 seasons. The teams he played on reached the playoffs every year, so maybe it shouldn't have been a surprise when he coached Chicago, as an expansion team, into the playoffs in its initial season. Kerr has been a Bulls broadcaster and ambassador of the game ever since, extending his league involvement beyond 50 years.

    Tex Winter, frankly, is another graybeard who deserves to be in Springfield, but his college achievements should get him in, not just his work with the Bulls' and Lakers' triangle offense.
    9. Bernard King

    King hasn't made it in despite a 22.5 scoring average that he boosted by two points in the postseason. Nor has his league scoring trophy (32.9 in 1984-85), 51.8 percent shooting accuracy, four All-Star appearances or inspiring comeback from major knee surgery earned him enshrinement. King's alleged drug use might be a hang-up for some voters, which also could explain Walter Davis' absence from the Hall.
    10. Dennis Rodman

    There simply is no reason to have a Hall of Fame if you're going to snub a wiry, 6-foot-7 forward who managed to win seven consecutive rebounding titles and play for five NBA championships. Odds are, it isn't what Rodman has or hasn't done on the court that prevents him from getting into this place; it's what he might be inclined to do at the induction ceremony that could have voters shying away. Of course, by wearing one of his elegant gowns, with a feather boa, Rodman could satisfy fans of both the men's and the women's game at this so-inclusive Hall.

    Steve Aschburner covered the Minnesota Timberwolves and the NBA for 13 seasons for the Minneapolis Star Tribune. He has served as president or vice president of the Professional Basketball Writers Association since 2005.
    Looking for in PSA graded
    1. 75-76 Topps Keith/Jamaal Wilkes in Psa 8+
    2. 1971-72 Trio stickers PSA 8+
    3. BSKB 1977-78 topps psa 10

    Basketball Autos
    1992 Courtside Flashback
    Action Packed HOF Autos(need elvin hayes,both bill bradley,and the 1st bill walton)
    2001 and 2005 Greats of the Game
    UD=retro,epic,legends,legendary,generations and chronology
    2006 Topps Style 1952 Fan Favorites Autos #/10 (Refractor Autos)
    Press Pass Legends
  • GDM67GDM67 Posts: 2,309 ✭✭✭
    AD, Bernard, DJ, Walter Davis and Gilmore are total no brainers, to me. And, as long time members may remember, I really disliked Dennis as a Celtic, so I'm hadly being sentimental in this. He's a clear HOFer.

    While I agree that Dantley's best statistical years were in that run in Utah, his too short, but undeniably excellent, tenure in Detroit shouldn't be overlooked. That trade, in which the Pistons offloaded two guys I didn't like (Tripucka and Kent Benson) for one that I always had, put them on my radar for real. Adrian played some of the most fearless, dazzling ball I have ever seen from a guy his size. Like that whole team, he played flat out, all the time.

    Just as an aside about something that has always rubbed me the wrong way...the ABA and it's players, as a rule, get the bad end of the stick, historically. In refusing to count the stats officially, the NBA shows itself to be insecure and churlish. With Auerbach finally off to that Great Parque Floor In The Sky, it's time for them to rectify that and treat the numbers with their due respect (as the NFL does the AFL statistics.) Julius Erving, for one, would take his more rightful place on the various lists.
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,105 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Just as an aside about something that has always rubbed me the wrong way...the ABA and it's players, as a rule, get the bad end of the stick, historically. In refusing to count the stats officially, the NBA shows itself to be insecure and churlish. With Auerbach finally off to that Great Parque Floor In The Sky, it's time for them to rectify that and treat the numbers with their due respect (as the NFL does the AFL statistics.) Julius Erving, for one, would take his more rightful place on the various lists. >>



    Excellent point. And I think it's important to remember that it's the BASKETBALL Hall of Fame, not the NBA Hall of Fame. People tend to forget that. So why give the ABA players the shaft? Gilmore is not even eligible again until 2012 after getting zero votes three years in a row from an anonymous committee. It needs a total revamp IMO.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • gregmo32gregmo32 Posts: 2,690 ✭✭✭
    Mullin will get in for sure. King and Dantley will eventually. Mitch Richmond is not quite a HOF, in my opinion. The lack of postseason success and championships is held against big scorers who play for less than stellar teams. In basketball, unlike baseball, someone will compile stats on every team. The ultimate indicator of success comes from winning as a team, and the voters weigh that heavily, as they should in basketball.
    I am buying and trading for RC's of Wilt Chamberlain, George Mikan, Bill Russell, Oscar Robertson, Jerry West, and Bob Cousy!
    Don't waste your time and fees listing on ebay before getting in touch me by PM or at [email protected] !
  • aro13aro13 Posts: 2,014 ✭✭✭
    Goodlieu - great set. That is a great challenge and undertaking to complete that set.


    On the Hall of Fame debate I am usually pretty neutral. I can see the point about Dantley being in and I can see why he has yet to be elected. I do feel there are 4 factors keeping him out:
    1) He is thought of as one dimensional - I worked out his scoring as representing 66% of his value. I think the only other player with a higher value is George Gervin at 68%.
    2) He played in "only" six all-star games and was only selected a member of the all-NBA second team twice.
    3) Looked at quickly his play-off statistics are lower than his regular season stats and he played in very few play-off series.
    4) The Pistons won after they traded him for Mark Aguire - a trade that was lobbied for by Isiah Thomas and that the Pistons ended up coughing up a first round pick as well.

    Eventually I think he will get into the Hall of Fame.

    The player I would most like to see elected who has been bypassed is Sidney Moncrief.
  • gosteelersgosteelers Posts: 2,674 ✭✭✭
    Does anybody have any extra NBA HOF RCs or Autos? I was looking to start both of these sets, possibly. Also looking for potential HOF RCs, as well (King, Dantley, etc.)...

    Mark


  • << <i>Does anybody have any extra NBA HOF RCs or Autos? I was looking to start both of these sets, possibly. Also looking for potential HOF RCs, as well (King, Dantley, etc.)...

    Mark >>



    Hi, I collect Basketball HOF autos too, you can see my set registry in my sign at the botton there. I currently only have 6 cards, but I am trying to get some cards ready for grading, but I never get the time. I was getting cards ready for grading under the $5.00 special but missed that too, lol. I gotta stop being lazy, and send some in soon, so check back as I will eventualy add more cards to my set.

    I do have many HOF members doubles available for trade. I currently have an extra DeBusshere auto, but I twill need a high end HOF auto for that one. I have many other members doubles too. Please feel free to PM me with a list of what you have for trade, and I will do the same. I don't do RC, only autos, so I will only trade for auto, not RC.

    Giovanni image
    Got 19 autographs and 239 more to go! image

    ***** The Tinamarie Collection *****

    image
  • GDM67GDM67 Posts: 2,309 ✭✭✭


    << <i> Looked at quickly his play-off statistics are lower than his regular season stats and he played in very few play-off series. >>

    I think that bespeaks of him playing a more team oriented game in the playoffs. I know that that horrible head to head collision between AD and Vinnie Johnson which took them both off the floor finished their chances in that '87 series against Boston. That was about as empty a feeling as I've ever had as a sports fan (although I can call some others to mind, unfortunately...)

    << <i>The player I would most like to see elected who has been bypassed is Sidney Moncrief. >>

    I need to keep better track of who is in and who isn't. His absence is simply indefensible image
  • aro13aro13 Posts: 2,014 ✭✭✭
    GDM67 - When you do a quick look at Dantley's career play-off statistics versus his regular season stats his scoring and field goal percentage are lower in the post-season, which is somewhat common. However, his rebounding, assists, free throw percentage and times at the line are also lower which is not good.

    I think some writers tend to just observe those numbers and assume he did not elevate his game in the play-offs. But if you put them in context, the years his teams were in the play-offs his numbers were improved, especially his rebounding and he did get to the line more. I do not know if he played a more team oriented game in the play-offs (his assists did not rise at all) but he did help his team in more ways than just scoring.

  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,105 ✭✭✭
    Sidney Moncrief? Really? I do not think of him as a HOF'er. I'll take Spencer Haywood over him any day - though he will never get in due to the powers that be.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • Spencer Haywood was a great player that was responsible for taking on the NBA for its policy at the time of keeping college players out of the NBA until there graduating class year. He played in the ABA and tore it up. When he finally got into the NBA after the Supreme Court ruled in his favor he posted great numbers but was basically ostracized by the NBA. A later injury and personal/drug problems really hurt him in later years. I recently heard Bill Walton mention him on TV and he reiterated what the players of his era knew that he was a great power forward. I think his career can actually be best compared to Curt Flood of Baseball in that both these guys had HOF type skills/numbers but their battles with the powers that be at the time distracted them and caused stress in their personal lives that effected their careers.
  • GDM67GDM67 Posts: 2,309 ✭✭✭
    John Mackey got a lot of the same treatment from the NFL, although he eventually made it into Canton.
  • aro13aro13 Posts: 2,014 ✭✭✭
    ~"Sidney Moncrief? Really? I do not think of him as a HOF'er."~

    shagrotn77 - Moncrief certainly does not have eye popping stats. He does have the following in his favour:

    2 time NBA defensive player of the year
    1 time all-NBA first team
    4 time all-NBA second team
    4 time all-NBA defensive first team
    1 time all-NBA defensive second team

    In the years he played for Milwaukee (79-89) the Bucks won an AVERAGE of 52 games per season. He was easily the Bucks best player between at least 81 and 86. The Bucks were the 4th best team in the league practically every year. They have 0 Hall of Famers.

    He was probably the second best rebounding guard of his era behind Magic. He elevated his game significantly in the play-offs.

    His dominant period might have been too short and his career totals are certainly not impressive and I understand that works against him. If I could choose one player that was not in the Hall of Fame (that is eligible) to build a team around I would choose Moncrief.
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,105 ✭✭✭
    Well said Albie. Haywood definitely could have posted better stats. But his 19.2 PPG, 9.3 RPG NBA-only career averages are still quite impressive, and worthy of a spot in the HOF IMO.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • gosteelersgosteelers Posts: 2,674 ✭✭✭
    I think that was a great point regarding Moncrief and the Bucks of the early to mid-80s. They were just a notch below the Sixers, Celtics, and Lakers for so many years and they have zero HOF'ers...What were the total HOF'ers of the previous three teams mentioned? I almost forgot that Nellie was the coach of those teams, too...
  • I also forgot about "Nellie" coaching stint in Milwaukee. You have to admire as proven last year with the Warriors the production he gets out of his teams.
  • busted a pack of '86 fleer yesterday & pulled this.

    image

    centering stinks, but was fun as hell pulling.

    J
    image
    RIP GURU
  • gosteelersgosteelers Posts: 2,674 ✭✭✭
    Can't see the pics, dude...
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
    Nice pull!!! Looks like a 9oc to me.

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
    image
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,105 ✭✭✭
    From the HOF website:

    February 15th: 2008 Finalists will be announced on NBA TV.

    Doesn't specify a time. Let's go A.D. and D.J.!!!
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • aro13aro13 Posts: 2,014 ✭✭✭
    ~"What were the total HOF'ers of the previous three teams mentioned? I almost forgot that Nellie was the coach of those teams, too"~

    For the 10 years Moncrief played with the Bucks:

    The Celtics had Bird, McHale, Parish, Cowens, Walton, Maravich, Archibald and coach K.C. Jones - really only Bird, McHale and Parish would be considered HOFers based on their play with the Celtics over that 10 year span. The others are in the Hall for their play elsewhere or for earlier in their career.

    The Sixers had Erving, Malone, Barkley and coach Billy Cunningham.

    The Lakers had Magic, Kareem, Worthy and Bob Mcadoo. With Mcadoo in the Hall for play outside of L.A.

    The Bucks had Bob Lanier for three years at the end of his career and Dave Cowens and Tiny Archibald for abbreviated one year stints.

    Average Wins per season over Moncrief's 10 years
    Celtics 59
    Lakers 59
    Sixers 54
    Bucks 52
  • DavemriDavemri Posts: 2,105 ✭✭✭
    OK..Time to see some scans. This is one of my favorite cards from the HOF set. This card just screams 1970's..

    image

    FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
    image
  • Ok, not a rookie card but I got a new auto. Its a coach Bobby Knight to add to my Basketball HOF Autograph set. I gotta get it graded of course, but one of these days I guess. image

    image

    Giovanni
    Got 19 autographs and 239 more to go! image

    ***** The Tinamarie Collection *****

    image
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,105 ✭✭✭
    Very nice Dave! Exceptional centering for a nororiously oc card. And what basketball collectionis complete without this card...

    image
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • immaculate rick barry, i should get into basketball cards. they seem to be relatively inexpensive & undervalued by hobby.

    1980 topps rc, wow!

    j
    image
    RIP GURU
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