If you don't mind, talk about the silver unc 'w' eagles on your list. From mintages, they don't look that special to me. Then again, I don't follow the series so much. Thoughts? Thanks!
BTW, I like the list. I didn't hit every one, but enough to make me smile. >>
I think if we take the represented mintage of the 2008/07's of 46,318, and deduct it from the 2008 W known mintage it's around 424,000 for the 08 W's which would make it the lowest mintage in the series. The 06 W's are at 470,000, with 250,000 in the 20th anniversary sets + 220,000 singles. Should command a premium unless they remain on sale into 09...IMO
The 06 W's are at 470,000, with 250,000 in the 20th anniversary sets + 220,000 singles.
There were 250,000 in the 20th Anniversary set, 20,000 in the gold and silver uncirculated 1 oz. set, and 200,000 singles, which are currently available for less than $60 each on eBay (including single coin box and COA). I don't see much upside for the regular 2008-W burnished silver eagles, given the Mint's $25.95 price.
Devotion is not at play here and muleheadedness does not apply,
what matters is common sense.
Common sense tells us that the USM wont be short striking every other series and going "all out" and striking the h&ll out of plat unc w's....that's just a fools bet.
What the last few weeks on this forum has taught me is that most of the members are completely impatient and quick to shoot down rational judgement when it comes to these plat unc -w coins.
Their play is the "coin de jour" , whatever can be flipped quick for profit. No time for looking for evidence and piecing together an educated guess on where mintages will end up.
No matter how sharp the member is, they cant answer the simple question of where all those backordered coins are? 7 weeks, no shipments. 1000+ coins overordered on the 1/4oz unc w plat. Hundreds of cancellations not reflected.
I like Eric's reasoning when it comes to collector demand and how these Modern's are collected, whether it is by Type (changing reverse) or series. But one area which I have talked with Eric on is the box of twenty concept, which seems to be creeping it's way into Modern collecting. Yes, it is extremely hard to model, but you can gaurantee that the rarest of the rare will be included, across several series, even if that key is king by 10 pieces over the next least minted by type.
So, when new keys are born, think of it like my example of the 94P Morgan vs the 93S Morgan. 110K vs 100K. Huge spread in values at all levels.
I do think that these issues, whether it's unc or proof plats, unc or proof buffs, etc, if it's the key by 10 pieces - it's the key and will demand a much higher price than it's little semi-key brother..
Plat unc's are not dependent on proof plat collectors to make the market. They have their own following. This is getting much bigger than just plat collectors. This is becoming a search for the great rarities. If I want the lowest mintage plat, what do I care if it's proof or unc....?
I am still buying platnum the way I look at it is I can buy a 1 /10 Oz. Buffalo off the bay for 299 or two plats for the same price. I'll buy the plat and we dont know the mintage this my be a gift with out us knowing it the mint will give out the numbers after the 30 day return is over so all of them are "SOLD". But that is just me.
<< <i>I am still buying platnum the way I look at it is I can buy a 1 /10 Oz. Buffalo off the bay for 299 or two plats for the same price. I'll buy the plat and we dont know the mintage this my be a gift with out us knowing it the mint will give out the numbers after the 30 day return is over so all of them are "SOLD". But that is just me. >>
This time next month will tell us what is up...there will be no more debating about it...
I do know this...the US Government HATES for things to go to the press and they always...almost always...settle lawsuits out of court...so keep that in mind NYC
I mention that just encase sales numbers jump up drastically in the future....I spoke to general counsel a few months ago who represents the US Government entity that I work for right now...I explained to him what happened in 2006 and how the mint could not get the sales numbers straight with the one ounce coins, etc...how they suddenly jumped up by 500 coins a couple months later. To make the long story short...he agreed that a congressional as well as a class action lawsuit would have been a good course of action and that it would have been easily justifiable and reasonable to have done so in the eyes of the court.
I guess this all relative. Looking a PCGS Price Guide, a 2006 $100 and a 2006-W $100 plat both in MS69 are $945-955!? What gives? I haven't looked at them in a while. I remember selling a -70 06-W for just over $4,000. Of course that was March of 2007. I know all plats have come down but to have no premium on the 06-W is a bit unnerving.
It's BS, plain and simple. You dont buy in bulk, and then flip them for under mint issue price right after they sell out with speculation running high. Add Ebay's fees and you LOSE money on this auction! Forum member? Must have been out to lunch because all we've talked for the last month were Buffs, and the plat unc/ proof speculations. SOMETHING doesnt add up. And what a coincidence, these people that won the auction never got the coins. If it seems too good to be true, it probably is.
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
Goldbully I think it is going to be a slow recovery for the prices on 2008 platinum except for the proof coins which should start going up once a few more sales reports come out. I think the economy and people focusing on gold has something to do with it. I saw on HSN over the weekend they sold out of 500 gold buffalo $5 coins in 5 minutes once they were told this was the last year for those. People love the buffalo coins but hopefully the platinum will follow eventually.
Goldbully I am not sure one auction or even a series of auctions today mean much, I am more interested in what they sell for years down the road. The spouse coins were selling for crazy money right after sellout and now look at those. It is all long-term with these.
Also look at this ended price:
PCGS MS70 2008-W Platinum Eagle $10 RARE!This seller accepts PayPal View similar active items | Sell one like this Sold As Best OfferSold $255.00 Dec-21 14:48
$255 for a pcgs ms70 plat 2008 W, that isn't very good for the seller, for the buyer it is though.
2008 Plat. Unc set just sold on Ebay for $3000 Raw and not in the sealed mint box. Unreal. I sold three sets, in the sealed mint box, over the past week or so for $2600-$2650/set. The difference a week makes!
<<What is a bit unnerving is the other thread about a well known dealer/collector forum member selling multiple 4 pc plat proof sets at 2150.>>
<<Says he hasnt kept track of value or sellout. Hmmm. Interesting.>>
<<Smells like a cash flow issue in the marketplace.....>>
7over8:
I actually bought the last $2150 set on Saturday morning...as it was only the Plat 4-coin proof set that I stupidly overlooked this year! I actually felt like I struck gold (platinum?) for about 12 hours until the other thread erupted...and caused me a restless night...with visions of everything but sugerplums dancing in my head.
Hopefully, that situation is now being squared away.
Yes the following might seem totally off topic, but isn't...
Fourth quarterly income taxes are due by 1/15/09, NOT 12/31/08...correct?
I ask, because with all my gold and plat cc bills coming in, I'd rather not have to jump through hoops to also have to send out a check to the IRS in the next week and a half...!
Surely you've just forgotten. That's one of the *TOP SECRET* buy/sell codes. You'll have to go back to the beginning and re-read the thread until you find the chart that contains all the letters, numerals & "special" characters used as code words.
Effective July 23, 2008, the United States Mint will commence selling the following 2008 American Eagle Proof Coins according to the following price schedule: Description Price American Eagle Platinum Proof Coins:
I asked this on another thread, but is their evidence that some of the APE 2006-W uncs were melted...if so, how many?
Several regular contributors to this thread reported selling 2006-w platinum uncs to bullion dealers for melt value. Whether they were actually melted or not, I don't know. Some reported shaking the coins in a jar before sending to take them out of the MS69 range. As far as I know, this was only the $100 coins; the smaller coins retained a premium over melt value even at 2300/oz.
I sold 50K+ of 1 and 1/2 oz. 2006 and 2007 plats all taken from 4 coin sets. Both proof and unc. At the time plat was $1900-$2000 and I could sell the big coins and clear the 1/4 and 1/10. Wish I had sold more but it freed up enough money that I was able to get into 2008 buffalo and proof plats in a big way.
It is hard to believe it is time again for the new mintage numbers tomorrow. The way things have been going we will probably know nothing more than we know today.
It is hard to believe it is time again for the new mintage numbers tomorrow. The way things have been going we will probably know nothing more than we know today.
There are quite a few buffalo's in the next hour that will ending that I will be watching. Should be interesting. We haven't seen any new highs it seems in the last week.
Comments
So So return on this 1/2oz Unc Plat
Going to take time before the reality of low mintages take hold in the collector base I suppose.
1 oz Platinum Unc.
<< <i>Ericj,
If you don't mind, talk about the silver unc 'w' eagles on your list. From mintages, they don't look that special to me. Then again, I don't follow the series so much. Thoughts? Thanks!
BTW, I like the list. I didn't hit every one, but enough to make me smile.
I think if we take the represented mintage of the 2008/07's of 46,318, and deduct it from the 2008 W known mintage it's around 424,000 for the 08 W's which would make it the lowest mintage in the series. The 06 W's are at 470,000, with 250,000 in the 20th anniversary sets + 220,000 singles. Should command a premium unless they remain on sale into 09...IMO
There were 250,000 in the 20th Anniversary set, 20,000 in the gold and silver uncirculated 1 oz. set, and 200,000 singles, which are currently available for less than $60 each on eBay (including single coin box and COA). I don't see much upside for the regular 2008-W burnished silver eagles, given the Mint's $25.95 price.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Devotion is not at play here and muleheadedness does not apply,
what matters is common sense.
Common sense tells us that the USM wont be short striking every other series and going "all out" and striking the h&ll out of plat unc w's....that's just a fools bet.
What the last few weeks on this forum has taught me is that most of the members are completely impatient and quick to shoot down rational judgement when it comes to these plat unc -w coins.
Their play is the "coin de jour" , whatever can be flipped quick for profit. No time for looking for evidence and piecing together an educated guess on where mintages will end up.
No matter how sharp the member is, they cant answer the simple question of where all those backordered coins are? 7 weeks, no shipments. 1000+ coins overordered on the 1/4oz unc w plat. Hundreds of cancellations not reflected.
I like Eric's reasoning when it comes to collector demand and how these Modern's are collected, whether it is by Type (changing reverse) or series. But one area which I have talked with Eric on is the box of twenty concept, which seems to be creeping it's way into Modern collecting. Yes, it is extremely hard to model, but you can gaurantee that the rarest of the rare will be included, across several series, even if that key is king by 10 pieces over the next least minted by type.
So, when new keys are born, think of it like my example of the 94P Morgan vs the 93S Morgan. 110K vs 100K. Huge spread in values at all levels.
I do think that these issues, whether it's unc or proof plats, unc or proof buffs, etc, if it's the key by 10 pieces - it's the key and will demand a much higher price than it's little semi-key brother..
Plat unc's are not dependent on proof plat collectors to make the market. They have their own following. This is getting much bigger than just plat collectors. This is becoming a search for the great rarities. If I want the lowest mintage plat, what do I care if it's proof or unc....?
"SOLD". But that is just me.
Hoard the keys.
<< <i>My last Proof Plat order that was just shipped was ordered at 9:13 pm on 12/8. Cutoff date was after that obviously.
Order number: 30630xxx
Order Date: 12/08/2008 at 09:13 PM
Order Status: Your order request has been shipped.
Billed to: ------
Shipped to: -------
Shipping Method:
EXPEDITED
Tracking Number(s):
953214258xxx FEDERAL EXPRESS
Product Name Quantity Price
(each) Total Item Status Cancel
2008 AE PLAT PRF 1/2 OZ 4 $599.95 $2,399.80 4 units shipped on 12/20/2008 >>
My Proof Plat set was ordered 12/8 @ 9:51 pm. This give me hope that it will be shipped.
<< <i>I am still buying platnum the way I look at it is I can buy a 1 /10 Oz. Buffalo off the bay for 299 or two plats for the same price. I'll buy the plat and we dont know the mintage this my be a gift with out us knowing it the mint will give out the numbers after the 30 day return is over so all of them are
"SOLD". But that is just me.
This time next month will tell us what is up...there will be no more debating about it...
I do know this...the US Government HATES for things to go to the press and they always...almost always...settle lawsuits out of court...so keep that in mind NYC
I mention that just encase sales numbers jump up drastically in the future....I spoke to general counsel a few months ago who represents the US Government entity that I work for right now...I explained to him what happened in 2006 and how the mint could not get the sales numbers straight with the one ounce coins, etc...how they suddenly jumped up by 500 coins a couple months later. To make the long story short...he agreed that a congressional as well as a class action lawsuit would have been a good course of action and that it would have been easily justifiable and reasonable to have done so in the eyes of the court.
Alright well enough of that for now...
My 1oz, 1/2 oz, and 1/4 showed up today. Still waiting on my 1/10, backordered. Fingers crossed
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
I have a credit long overdue from the mint of $1250.
The USM acknowledged this via email last week but has not yet credited my card.
I am so pissed!
I am also not getting the coins they promised were set aside for me.
They told me they would not refund my $ and let me have at lower price but would first credit me and then rebill me for the coins an ship. BS
Now I have neither.
You need big $$ to play this game.
I wonder how fast thy will fill the 2009 HR.
<< <i>Pretty good return on this 1 oz Plat Unc.
1 oz Platinum Unc. >>
I guess this all relative. Looking a PCGS Price Guide, a 2006 $100 and a 2006-W $100 plat both in MS69 are $945-955!? What gives? I haven't looked at them in a while. I remember selling a -70 06-W for just over $4,000. Of course that was March of 2007. I know all plats have come down but to have no premium on the 06-W is a bit unnerving.
Ren(W)
<< <i>jbw, my order for 4coin plat proofs was placed 12/8 442pm... still shows backorder. I'll keep you posted as it seems Im ahead of you by 2 hours.
My 1oz, 1/2 oz, and 1/4 showed up today. Still waiting on my 1/10, backordered. Fingers crossed >>
Thanks DCW... If the status on my order changes, I'll keep you posted also.
Says he hasnt kept track of value or sellout. Hmmm. Interesting.
Smells like a cash flow issue in the marketplace.....
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
I hope things pick up after the holidays,
I've got to say, the Gold Buffs are doing very well as far as bringing top dollars.
Now, if and when Platinum spot starts to rise, it will be a different story.
eBay Link
It's about F'ing Time!!!!!!!
$3k for an Unc set!!!!!
Is the Plat base finally coming around now??????
<< <i>Check it out Half-Strike........
It's about F'ing Time!!!!!!!
$3k for an Unc set!!!!!
Is the Plat base finally coming around now??????
Peanuts compared to what they will bring in a few years. I wouldn't sell my sets for $3k.
subsequently cancelled.......
there aren't any there to ship, the numbers are VERY LOW
Also look at this ended price:
PCGS MS70 2008-W Platinum Eagle $10 RARE!This seller accepts PayPal
View similar active items | Sell one like this
Sold As Best OfferSold $255.00 Dec-21 14:48
$255 for a pcgs ms70 plat 2008 W, that isn't very good for the seller, for the buyer it is though.
Linky
23 hours to go. Any guesses where it will end?
<<Says he hasnt kept track of value or sellout. Hmmm. Interesting.>>
<<Smells like a cash flow issue in the marketplace.....>>
7over8:
I actually bought the last $2150 set on Saturday morning...as it was only the Plat 4-coin proof set that I stupidly overlooked this year! I actually felt like I struck gold (platinum?) for about 12 hours until the other thread erupted...and caused me a restless night...with visions of everything but sugerplums dancing in my head.
Hopefully, that situation is now being squared away.
linky
Yes the following might seem totally off topic, but isn't...
Fourth quarterly income taxes are due by 1/15/09, NOT 12/31/08...correct?
I ask, because with all my gold and plat cc bills coming in, I'd rather not have to jump through hoops to also have to send out a check to the IRS in the next week and a half...!
Thanks much, nycounsel...touch when you have to decide which unit of the Treasury to pay first, the Mint or the IRS!!!
That's just 13 away from the 3544 mintage of the 2006-w uncirculated $10 platinum coins, the highest mintage of the 2006-w uncirculated platinums.
<< <i>Post 3531.
That's just 13 away from the 3544 mintage of the 2006-w uncirculated $10 platinum coins, the highest mintage of the 2006-w uncirculated platinums.
What are you talking about?
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
<< <i>What are you talking about? >>
Surely you've just forgotten. That's one of the *TOP SECRET* buy/sell codes. You'll have to go back to the beginning and re-read the thread until you find the chart that contains all the letters, numerals & "special" characters used as code words.
Slow day, eh counsel?
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Unless you have one of the CU decoder rings!
Ren(W)
Description Price American Eagle Platinum Proof Coins:
Oneounce platinum coin............................... $2,509.95
Onehalf ounce platinum coin.......................... 1,279.95
Onequarter ounce platinum coin....................... 664.95
Onetenth ounce platinum coin......................... 279.95
Fourcoin platinum set................................ 4,589.95
Several regular contributors to this thread reported selling 2006-w platinum uncs to bullion dealers for melt value. Whether they were actually melted or not, I don't know. Some reported shaking the coins in a jar before sending to take them out of the MS69 range. As far as I know, this was only the $100 coins; the smaller coins retained a premium over melt value even at 2300/oz.
Both proof and unc.
At the time plat was $1900-$2000 and I could sell the big coins and clear the 1/4 and 1/10.
Wish I had sold more but it freed up enough money that I was able to get into 2008 buffalo and proof plats in a big way.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=200289013385
I count 7, most with buy it now prices of around $3800.
Edited to add: none are mine, just observing.
I count 7, most with buy it now prices of around $3800.
For those who believe the 2008 w uncirculateds will be the new kings, $3800 for an MS70 4 coin set is a bargain.
It makes sense to keep a close eye on the next released numbers and act quickly if there's a significant drop.