<< <i>Guess some large buyer or buyers got cold feet this weekend and dumped some mint state Buchanan gold. The weekly sales report crashed over 400 coins this week. Could be that they found out that the coin was struck to over 6,000 and was not the opportunity that they had hoped for.
That is some kind of Evil drop. I have NEVER seen one that bad on a percentage basis prior to final audit corrections before.
Eric >>
Boy, that guy probably got banned at the Mint for awhile. >>
No kidding...pretty sizable adjustment on the Fillmore unc. too.
Successful transactions with keepdachange, tizofthe, adriana, wondercoin
Either a massive order showed up or they have them back ordered because PB is out of coins and they have a transfer request in process to bring more coins into inventory from existing stock at the mint is my guess.
<< <i>Either a massive order showed up or they have them back ordered because PB is out of coins and they have a transfer request in process to bring more coins into inventory from existing stock at the mint is my guess. >>
Maybe this guy is anticipating a re-price higher next week.... we are in that range now after all.
I had ordered a couple Unc Buchs to go with my backordered Proof Buchs. I sent one back because of a scratch, and the replacement arrived yesterday with a different scratch. It may be going back as well, only for a refund this time.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i>I had ordered a couple Unc Buchs to go with my backordered Proof Buchs. I sent one back because of a scratch, and the replacement arrived yesterday with a different scratch. It may be going back as well, only for a refund this time. >>
You can find Buch proofs on Ebay for about $1075. You may just want to go with the coin in the hand instead of the increasingly likely no bird in the bush. Do you already have some proof bucks in hand anyway?
You may just want to go with the coin in the hand instead of the increasingly likely no bird in the bush. Do you already have some proof bucks in hand anyway?
Just one Unc & one Proof originally - the extras were a delayed afterthought, and my numismatic investing goals were geared towards the first issues of Pucks while the Buchs were coming out. I'm saving my energies...
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
Hmm, well since my name is Eric also, I would say NOT a steal. I like these "unfinished" die struck coins but not at ridiculous prices even for pop. 1 70s.
Love that Milled British (1830-1960) Well, just Love coins, period.
I think 9 grand for a 1999-w $10 gold eagle PCGS-70 is a reasonable price. I would say good price if I thought that PCSG was going to be keep the pop at one or two but with todays "market grading" standard and not the old "technical grading" standard I think we will see gradeflation or popflation on this coin like all the others.
I do think the buyer will be fine on the coin and they did not over pay. There are very few 99w gold quarters that even have a CHANCE of making 70 grade after being sent in 10 times. Its good to have an outstanding example of this coin for your long term collection because its the kind of mega coin that can lock you out when it comes to super grade w mint marked gold sets.
Last I checked NGC had 10, and awhile back a guy on HSN hawking ANACS MS70's calimed he had 25 in stock. I have also seen quite a few ICG 70's listed on ebay over the last couple years.
While some of us might sneer at the various across the street populations the fact remains that it is likely that 1 or more of their MS70s is of equal or better quality than the reported PCGS pop 1.
Its VERY hard to hit MS-70 with NCG on the 99w gold quarter eagle. PCGS is even harder. ICG, ANC and the other second rate graders will give a 70 to what is a mid range 69 with good eye appeal.
Dont pay more than 1.25 times the price of a 69 (ngc/pcgs) for a ICG/ANC etc 70 coin.
On an article about the First Spouse coins in Coin Update News I read this line and had to respond...
"These coins are an example of what Coin World editor Beth Deisher, an important voice in the coin community, called “a contrived rarity” in her April 7 testimony before the House Financial Services Committee’s Subcommittee on Monetary Policy and Technology on bullion coin programs of the US Mint."
"contrived"?? I looked up the meaning and it means planned. Now I think that is ridiculous. These coins were minted to demand as we have heard from Eric. I hate it when the "experts" get things wrong. It ends up putting things on a stupid track. Maybe I just missed her point. Does she expect the Mint to make huge quantities for the market even if they are not selling? Besides it is Congress that often sets specifics on the coins that the Mint makes. I am sure she is a nice person but I just don't get her.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
Following up, would the Cherios dollar be a contrived rarity? These are the things that spice up the hobby if you ask me. Mint everyting to the multiple millions and lose me as a customer. I might as well buy bullion bars then.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>Following up, would the Cherios dollar be a contrived rarity? These are the things that spice up the hobby if you ask me. Mint everyting to the multiple millions and lose me as a customer. I might as well buy bullion bars then. >>
I completely agree. Stuff like the Cheerios dollar spices up the hobby and keeps us buying Mint products. Besides, I don't think many of the recent rarities are due to planning. If anything they're due to the lack of planning, screwups, or low sales. My two cents.
Successful transactions with keepdachange, tizofthe, adriana, wondercoin
I worry about those who are always obsessed with affordability from the Mint. Why can't they offer stuff at low low prices AND the outrageously priced stuff also? Must we all drive the peoples car and collect the peoples coins?
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>On an article about the First Spouse coins in Coin Update News I read this line and had to respond...
"These coins are an example of what Coin World editor Beth Deisher, an important voice in the coin community, called “a contrived rarity” in her April 7 testimony before the House Financial Services Committee’s Subcommittee on Monetary Policy and Technology on bullion coin programs of the US Mint."
"contrived"?? I looked up the meaning and it means planned. Now I think that is ridiculous. These coins were minted to demand as we have heard from Eric. I hate it when the "experts" get things wrong. It ends up putting things on a stupid track. Maybe I just missed her point. Does she expect the Mint to make huge quantities for the market even if they are not selling? Besides it is Congress that often sets specifics on the coins that the Mint makes. I am sure she is a nice person but I just don't get her. >>
I think the recent "rarity" created is a product of the law but not contrived by the Mint. It is the law that requires the Mint to issue a relatively unattractive first spouse series at first, and then it is also the law that forbid the Mint to issue more 2010 coins in 2011.
But again, I also agree with you that it is the unpredictability and rarity that make collecting more exciting. If the Mint has to mint 20k for each issue, and was forced to sell them indefinitely until they are sold out, collecting the series will not be that interesting, as least to me.
However, with Eric's insight, I think the unpredictability part becomes more predictable
Any insights on why proof Silver Eagles have suddenly taken off? Currently all dates are bringing $70 or more. I doubt that collectors are behind the recent upsurge.
I was looking at the Mint's scheduled releases and I have to make the observation that they are releasing a s**tload of stuff. I believe that mintages for all of their 2011 stuff will be trending LOWER, based on the tight economy, rising precious metals prices and the constant drumbeat of more Mint stuff. That makes 2011 another low mintage year. 2012 might even be worse. You heard it here first.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i>Any insights on why proof Silver Eagles have suddenly taken off? Currently all dates are bringing $70 or more. I doubt that collectors are behind the recent upsurge. >>
My guess would be that the big tv marketers are making buys to assemble 69 sets. Those are pretty popular sellers. Just a guess though but I think that they are big enough to move the market at times.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>Any insights on why proof Silver Eagles have suddenly taken off? Currently all dates are bringing $70 or more. I doubt that collectors are behind the recent upsurge. >>
Wow, the Jane Pierce unc. is knocking on the door of Julia Tyler to take her throne. According to Coin Update News, the reported sales has been adjusted to 3333 total. That is only 190 more than the final Julia numbers. That is what I call striking distance if she is adjusted down.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>What is the difference on mint site between circulation quarter set @ 9.95 and uncirculated quarter set @ 21.95? >>
It might be just the packaging. Last year the uncirculated quarter set was Satin Finish, but this year the Satin Finish was supposedly discontinued. If they do put a special finish on the "uncirculated" set, it could be a relatively low-mintage sleeper.
here's a question, the 2008-w Unc. 1/4 gold eagle is "approx." the same value as an ounce of gold these days. sell/swap the 08w 1/4 eagle for an ounce of gold??? the thought crossed my mind last week....i think the 08w eagle still has legs, but nice to swap 1/4 oz. gold for 1 oz. of gold....strictly gold weight speaking.
<< <i>here's a question, the 2008-w Unc. 1/4 gold eagle is "approx." the same value as an ounce of gold these days. sell/swap the 08w 1/4 eagle for an ounce of gold??? the thought crossed my mind last week....i think the 08w eagle still has legs, but nice to swap 1/4 oz. gold for 1 oz. of gold....strictly gold weight speaking. >>
That is the kind of thing I would do-especially if I had a few and could still keep one or 2 for my collection.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
here's a question, the 2008-w Unc. 1/4 gold eagle is "approx." the same value as an ounce of gold these days. sell/swap the 08w 1/4 eagle for an ounce of gold??? the thought crossed my mind last week....i think the 08w eagle still has legs, but nice to swap 1/4 oz. gold for 1 oz. of gold....strictly gold weight speaking.
The 2008-W 1/4 ozer is the key for the whole series, unless you count the 99-W unfinished proofs as regular issues rather than as error coins. Coins in that category are the ones that I try to keep a little longer. What makes it even more interesting is that the 1/4 ozers are more likely to be collected than the more costly 1/2 oz and 1 oz coins.
I highly recommend looking at ericj's method of analyzing mintages in a series as a refresher course. This is a relatively "deep" key when compared to the mintages of its siblings and the total mintage of the series. The only wrench that could be thrown into this scenario is the rising price of gold. The 2008-W depends on an increase in numismatic premium in order to continue rising in price. As gold continues up, a mintage of 8,883 doesn't seem quite as rare compared to an ounce of gold that goes up 4X faster on a bullion basis.
So, your question is a very good one. As a pure speculation, I'm holding onto most of mine. I agree with ericj's outlook that this key has a ways to go until it matures. Who knows? The rising tide could lift all boats and carry everything out to sea at some point. Then, they'll all be rare.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i>here's a question, the 2008-w Unc. 1/4 gold eagle is "approx." the same value as an ounce of gold these days. sell/swap the 08w 1/4 eagle for an ounce of gold??? the thought crossed my mind last week....i think the 08w eagle still has legs, but nice to swap 1/4 oz. gold for 1 oz. of gold....strictly gold weight speaking. >>
I would sooner trade one for 1/2 oz. of gold - in the form of five 2008-W unc. 1/10 oz. gold eagles. The mintage of these coins is less than 13k, and the 1/10 oz. gold eagles are more widely collected than the 1/4 oz. Yet the 2008-W 1/10 oz. burnished are selling at only 1/5 the price of the burnished 1/4 oz.
In terms of collector supply and demand, I think the 1/10 oz. should be much higher than its current price of around $300.
<< <i>here's a question, the 2008-w Unc. 1/4 gold eagle is "approx." the same value as an ounce of gold these days. sell/swap the 08w 1/4 eagle for an ounce of gold??? the thought crossed my mind last week....i think the 08w eagle still has legs, but nice to swap 1/4 oz. gold for 1 oz. of gold....strictly gold weight speaking. >>
My tiny hoard of Unc 2008-W 1/4 eagles ain't going any where. They are all asleep in my SDB like Rip Van Wrinkle.
I purchased 1 4-coin set and it was even better looking than last year's coins. I pulled a lot of great looking coins from the Mint last year, but since they cut off my returns and the set is over 3 grand and also because the 70DCAM's I had last year barely sold, I'm just getting what I collect.
If most are like what I saw with this one set, they are going to be fantastic this year, tho.
<< <i>Wow, the Jane Pierce unc. is knocking on the door of Julia Tyler to take her throne. According to Coin Update News, the reported sales has been adjusted to 3333 total. That is only 190 more than the final Julia numbers. That is what I call striking distance if she is adjusted down. >>
WOW!
Eric-
What's your bet on these? Do you think that the final finals will beat Julia?
I think Julia is likely to hold out as low against Unc Pierce but not by much. Pierce is under valued but not as under valued as when we could by them from the mint. The very low mintage on Pierce was announced on this board well prior to sell out and that was the time to buy.
Just a suggestion to you guys but if you are holding any bullion ASEs I'd sell them and assuming you want same net exposure to silver I'd roll the $ into 2006-2008-W burnished ASEs.
Right now there seems to be little if any premium to the 2007/2008-W burnished ASEs over bullion.
I believe eventually the ASE album makers will have spots in their albums for the W burnished coins and a listing of mintages.
IMO it is nuts for 1996 ASE to sell for more than any of the W coins.
Comments
Wondercoin
<< <i>
<< <i>Guess some large buyer or buyers got cold feet this weekend and dumped some mint state Buchanan gold. The weekly sales report crashed over 400 coins this week. Could be that they found out that the coin was struck to over 6,000 and was not the opportunity that they had hoped for.
That is some kind of Evil drop. I have NEVER seen one that bad on a percentage basis prior to final audit corrections before.
Eric >>
Boy, that guy probably got banned at the Mint for awhile. >>
No kidding...pretty sizable adjustment on the Fillmore unc. too.
It's really strange.
+500 sales two weeks before.
- 418 last week
+ 33 only this week.
Did the same people(s) order 500+, and then cancelled the order, and now they ordered 800+ this week to put Buch UNC in red?
<< <i>Buchanan's Liberty UNC is in red now.
It's really strange.
+500 sales two weeks before.
- 418 last week
+ 33 only this week.
Did the same people(s) order 500+, and then cancelled the order, and now they ordered 800+ this week to put Buch UNC in red? >>
Or could it mean the mint isn't going to re-sell all the returns?
<< <i>With platinum approaching $1800/oz does anyone foresee a rush to melt? Or do you believe that most is in strong hands? >>
When platinum broke above $2000 a few years ago, there was quite a bit of reported melting of Platinum Eagles.
This time may be different - platinum has underperformed gold and silver lately, so more people might be willing to hold out for a higher price.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
<< <i>Either a massive order showed up or they have them back ordered because PB is out of coins and they have a transfer request in process to bring more coins into inventory from existing stock at the mint is my guess. >>
Maybe this guy is anticipating a re-price higher next week.... we are in that range now after all.
<< <i>
<< <i>With platinum approaching $1800/oz does anyone foresee a rush to melt? Or do you believe that most is in strong hands? >>
When platinum broke above $2000 a few years ago, there was quite a bit of reported melting of Platinum Eagles.
This time may be different - platinum has underperformed gold and silver lately, so more people might be willing to hold out for a higher price. >>
.............................................................................................
I've actually been surprised platinum prices have been as strong as they are.~ $1,800
With a significant amount of Japanese auto production compromised I would have expected spot platinum to have declined more than we've seen.
In about 6 months when production is back and IF economy continues to improve spot platinum should approach $2,000.
Box of 20
Eric
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>I had ordered a couple Unc Buchs to go with my backordered Proof Buchs. I sent one back because of a scratch, and the replacement arrived yesterday with a different scratch. It may be going back as well, only for a refund this time. >>
You can find Buch proofs on Ebay for about $1075. You may just want to go with the coin in the hand instead of the increasingly likely no bird in the bush. Do you already have some proof bucks in hand anyway?
Eric
Just one Unc & one Proof originally - the extras were a delayed afterthought, and my numismatic investing goals were geared towards the first issues of Pucks while the Buchs were coming out. I'm saving my energies...
I knew it would happen.
At the recent Stack's Bowers auction the Pop 1 1999-W $10 MS70 Unfinished Proof Dies went for 9,605 (incl. B.P.). This looks like a steal?
Well, just Love coins, period.
I think 9 grand for a 1999-w $10 gold eagle PCGS-70 is a reasonable price. I would say good price if I thought that PCSG was going to be keep the pop at one or two but with todays "market grading" standard and not the old "technical grading" standard I think we will see gradeflation or popflation on this coin like all the others.
I do think the buyer will be fine on the coin and they did not over pay. There are very few 99w gold quarters that even have a CHANCE of making 70 grade after being sent in 10 times. Its good to have an outstanding example of this coin for your long term collection because its the kind of mega coin that can lock you out when it comes to super grade w mint marked gold sets.
Thanks
Eric
No. Platinum is well below the high of 2008 of about $2300.
Also, $1800 is not some significant milestone, it was at 1800-1850 for several weeks in the beginning of the year.
Anyone with quantity probably won't care until $2000+
<< <i>What is the MS70 pop from NGC or ANACS?? >>
Last I checked NGC had 10, and awhile back a guy on HSN hawking ANACS MS70's calimed he had 25 in stock. I have also seen quite a few ICG 70's listed on ebay over the last couple years.
It is simply a matter of numbers.
Dont pay more than 1.25 times the price of a 69 (ngc/pcgs) for a ICG/ANC etc 70 coin.
Well, just Love coins, period.
"These coins are an example of what Coin World editor Beth Deisher, an important voice in the coin community, called “a contrived rarity” in her April 7 testimony before the House Financial Services Committee’s Subcommittee on Monetary Policy and Technology on bullion coin programs of the US Mint."
"contrived"?? I looked up the meaning and it means planned. Now I think that is ridiculous. These coins were minted to demand as we have heard from Eric. I hate it when the "experts" get things wrong. It ends up putting things on a stupid track. Maybe I just missed her point. Does she expect the Mint to make huge quantities for the market even if they are not selling? Besides it is Congress that often sets specifics on the coins that the Mint makes. I am sure she is a nice person but I just don't get her.
<< <i>Following up, would the Cherios dollar be a contrived rarity? These are the things that spice up the hobby if you ask me. Mint everyting to the multiple millions and lose me as a customer. I might as well buy bullion bars then. >>
I completely agree. Stuff like the Cheerios dollar spices up the hobby and keeps us buying Mint products. Besides, I don't think many of the recent rarities are due to planning. If anything they're due to the lack of planning, screwups, or low sales. My two cents.
<< <i>On an article about the First Spouse coins in Coin Update News I read this line and had to respond...
"These coins are an example of what Coin World editor Beth Deisher, an important voice in the coin community, called “a contrived rarity” in her April 7 testimony before the House Financial Services Committee’s Subcommittee on Monetary Policy and Technology on bullion coin programs of the US Mint."
"contrived"?? I looked up the meaning and it means planned. Now I think that is ridiculous. These coins were minted to demand as we have heard from Eric. I hate it when the "experts" get things wrong. It ends up putting things on a stupid track. Maybe I just missed her point. Does she expect the Mint to make huge quantities for the market even if they are not selling? Besides it is Congress that often sets specifics on the coins that the Mint makes. I am sure she is a nice person but I just don't get her. >>
I think the recent "rarity" created is a product of the law but not contrived by the Mint. It is the law that requires the Mint to issue a relatively unattractive first spouse series at first, and then it is also the law that forbid the Mint to issue more 2010 coins in 2011.
But again, I also agree with you that it is the unpredictability and rarity that make collecting more exciting. If the Mint has to mint 20k for each issue, and was forced to sell them indefinitely until they are sold out, collecting the series will not be that interesting, as least to me.
However, with Eric's insight, I think the unpredictability part becomes more predictable
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Any insights on why proof Silver Eagles have suddenly taken off? Currently all dates are bringing $70 or more. I doubt that collectors are behind the recent upsurge. >>
My guess would be that the big tv marketers are making buys to assemble 69 sets. Those are pretty popular sellers. Just a guess though but I think that they are big enough to move the market at times.
<< <i>Any insights on why proof Silver Eagles have suddenly taken off? Currently all dates are bringing $70 or more. I doubt that collectors are behind the recent upsurge. >>
.......................................................................................................................................................................
It may just be as we get close to 2011 release of proof ASE people are realizing the 2011 ASE proofs will likely be priced at around $70-$75 each.
Spot silver is up about $15 per ounce since the 2010s were released at $46 each as I recall........................
Well, just Love coins, period.
<< <i>What is the difference on mint site between circulation quarter set @ 9.95 and uncirculated quarter set @ 21.95? >>
It might be just the packaging. Last year the uncirculated quarter set was Satin Finish, but this year the Satin Finish was supposedly discontinued. If they do put a special finish on the "uncirculated" set, it could be a relatively low-mintage sleeper.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Well, just Love coins, period.
<< <i>here's a question, the 2008-w Unc. 1/4 gold eagle is "approx." the same value as an ounce of gold these days. sell/swap the 08w 1/4 eagle for an ounce of gold??? the thought crossed my mind last week....i think the 08w eagle still has legs, but nice to swap 1/4 oz. gold for 1 oz. of gold....strictly gold weight speaking. >>
That is the kind of thing I would do-especially if I had a few and could still keep one or 2 for my collection.
<< <i>Any thoughts on the '11 gold eagles >>
pass
The 2008-W 1/4 ozer is the key for the whole series, unless you count the 99-W unfinished proofs as regular issues rather than as error coins. Coins in that category are the ones that I try to keep a little longer. What makes it even more interesting is that the 1/4 ozers are more likely to be collected than the more costly 1/2 oz and 1 oz coins.
I highly recommend looking at ericj's method of analyzing mintages in a series as a refresher course. This is a relatively "deep" key when compared to the mintages of its siblings and the total mintage of the series. The only wrench that could be thrown into this scenario is the rising price of gold. The 2008-W depends on an increase in numismatic premium in order to continue rising in price. As gold continues up, a mintage of 8,883 doesn't seem quite as rare compared to an ounce of gold that goes up 4X faster on a bullion basis.
So, your question is a very good one. As a pure speculation, I'm holding onto most of mine. I agree with ericj's outlook that this key has a ways to go until it matures. Who knows? The rising tide could lift all boats and carry everything out to sea at some point. Then, they'll all be rare.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>here's a question, the 2008-w Unc. 1/4 gold eagle is "approx." the same value as an ounce of gold these days. sell/swap the 08w 1/4 eagle for an ounce of gold??? the thought crossed my mind last week....i think the 08w eagle still has legs, but nice to swap 1/4 oz. gold for 1 oz. of gold....strictly gold weight speaking. >>
I would sooner trade one for 1/2 oz. of gold - in the form of five 2008-W unc. 1/10 oz. gold eagles. The mintage of these coins is less than 13k, and the 1/10 oz. gold eagles are more widely collected than the 1/4 oz. Yet the 2008-W 1/10 oz. burnished are selling at only 1/5 the price of the burnished 1/4 oz.
In terms of collector supply and demand, I think the 1/10 oz. should be much higher than its current price of around $300.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
<< <i>here's a question, the 2008-w Unc. 1/4 gold eagle is "approx." the same value as an ounce of gold these days. sell/swap the 08w 1/4 eagle for an ounce of gold??? the thought crossed my mind last week....i think the 08w eagle still has legs, but nice to swap 1/4 oz. gold for 1 oz. of gold....strictly gold weight speaking. >>
My tiny hoard of Unc 2008-W 1/4 eagles ain't going any where. They are all asleep in my SDB like Rip Van Wrinkle.
<< <i>
<< <i>Any thoughts on the '11 gold eagles >>
pass
I purchased 1 4-coin set and it was even better looking than last year's coins. I pulled a lot of great looking coins from the Mint last year, but since they cut off my returns and the set is over 3 grand and also because the 70DCAM's I had last year barely sold, I'm just getting what I collect.
If most are like what I saw with this one set, they are going to be fantastic this year, tho.
<< <i>
<< <i>Any thoughts on the '11 gold eagles >>
pass
<< <i>Wow, the Jane Pierce unc. is knocking on the door of Julia Tyler to take her throne. According to Coin Update News, the reported sales has been adjusted to 3333 total. That is only 190 more than the final Julia numbers. That is what I call striking distance if she is adjusted down. >>
WOW!
Eric-
What's your bet on these? Do you think that the final finals will beat Julia?
Thanks! R-
Eric
Just my best quess
Right now there seems to be little if any premium to the 2007/2008-W burnished ASEs over bullion.
I believe eventually the ASE album makers will have spots in their albums for the W burnished coins and a listing of mintages.
IMO it is nuts for 1996 ASE to sell for more than any of the W coins.