I think the 5oz ATB coins will be hot. Potential for a smaller run than next year's releases and potential for it being the only year with a 3 inch diameter** (**pending legislation)
What's ATB? I think that not only will the rising price of silver affect sales, but that the premiums will be a detriment to sales as well. If the overall pool of buyers is strong enough, the bell curve simply moves to the right regardless of pricing. Still, for a bullion product - the intent was to supply silver to the market rather than to gouge investors/collectors.
At some point, people will opt for more bullion at a lower premium rather than another Mint product marketed as a limited edition piece. The question really does boil down to 25 oz. of premium 5 oz. silver vs. 31 oz. of silver eagles @ $2.00 over melt.
At this point, I'm still in - but the Mint & their distributor network have got me mentally hedging a bit.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
With a relative low production it seems the Mint should sell these directly. These are more of a collector item than bullion in my O so going through dealers like bullion could lead to high margins (for bullion) and poor sales. Of course, just that fact might induce speculators to buy anyway. We shall see.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>I think the 5oz ATB coins will be hot. Potential for a smaller run than next year's releases and potential for it being the only year with a 3 inch diameter** (**pending legislation)
Another possibility is whatever the mint sells directly from their website will be the low mintage ones, and if they don't sell from the mint website then the 2010 will be.
<< <i>Thank you Mr Ben Bernanke. You just made buying gold and silver coins from the Mint a bit more costly. (and maybe other things too) >>
The printing of another $600 Billion of worthless paper Dollars will just accelerate the destruction of our currency. In Gold we trust! >>
Isn't that just amazing. The banks have money they just don't lend it out anymore. For my mom two homes and 40 acres was not enough to get a 20k loan. When press Wells said they don't give personal loans anymore.
<< <i>Thank you Mr Ben Bernanke. You just made buying gold and silver coins from the Mint a bit more costly. (and maybe other things too) >>
The printing of another $600 Billion of worthless paper Dollars will just accelerate the destruction of our currency. In Gold we trust! >>
Isn't that just amazing. The banks have money they just don't lend it out anymore. For my mom two homes and 40 acres was not enough to get a 20k loan. When press Wells said they don't give personal loans anymore. >>
Maybe Bernanke will decide to buy up all the proof Eagles with fresh dollars to create a bubble there also. I think your illustration shows the bank lending stuff is a cover story for something else but meanwhile back to our regularly scheduled topic.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
<< <i>I think you will be using a $300 (minimum) beverage coaster if you do. This is the only 5 ounce coin the Mint will ever make. Every type collector will need one, not to mention all the flippers driving the price. $300 may be a low number when all is said and done. However, we will have to wait another 4 or 5 months for these coins. >>
the law mandates they be sold in the year the clad quarters are issued.
<< <i>Thank you Mr Ben Bernanke. You just made buying gold and silver coins from the Mint a bit more costly. (and maybe other things too) >>
The printing of another $600 Billion of worthless paper Dollars will just accelerate the destruction of our currency. In Gold we trust! >>
Isn't that just amazing. The banks have money they just don't lend it out anymore. For my mom two homes and 40 acres was not enough to get a 20k loan. When press Wells said they don't give personal loans anymore. >>
isn't it insane in the other direction now? hard to get a loan, even with good assets. people with the ability to repay loans aren't getting them because they are self-employed or they may have heavy assets but not enough monthly income (which might sound logical, but when one has more than enough assets to repay the loan the question becomes how afraid are they?
Now back to on-topic here.... Gold just popped to a bit under $1400 and silver exploded to over $26 (and platinum is near $1790.)
The mint has probably already made (or made most of) these 2010 5oz ATB pucks, and soon they will go to the dealers.
Plus, the 2010 AGE 1oz Proofs are on a waiting list.
The the price moves going to scare away end consumers of both? Will fewer end consumers want to buy at the higher price levels fearing a sharp correction?
Will dealers tighten their markup if the spots climb over their dealer purchase prices? Or is that a foolish hope?
> > > Are you considering buying 1 or more of each of the 5oz Silver National Park Coins? > > Consider adding the number of each of the 5 you plan on buying into the 5oz Silver National Park "we wanna get a monster box of these" thread. > > Check out the thread for it > (don't worry, the thread has lots of pages, but there are lots and lots of "count me in" posts to skip over)
Tempting. Only $138 premium. These should go fast. If I had the funds, I would buy a set for bullion value only, but sunk most of my gold purchases in the Buchs.
the age gold proofs are a "no brainer" at 2938 for four coin set....
ordered...
these are not a scarcity play, but once these proofs are gone, sit back and watch the secondary market take off with their buy prices several hundred dollars above gold.
flip them wholesale and convert to bullion.
the easiest flip ever.
guys - these were a wholesale 2100-2200 buy price for 1 oz'ers at 1100-1200 gold.
<< <i>The 2008W fractionals had a mania run up and sell off several months ago.
we're in post price spike mode right now. >>
So if I had any 2008-W fractional buffs (or AGEs) that I wanted to sell, it's too late to maximize profit?
Real life crisis took me out of the game for a few months, now I'm trying to play catch-up. >>
Maximum?
Who's to know they won't take off again?
They did hit well over $8,000 (was it $8800??) for an ungraded, open box 4-coin proof set on eBay. (I know it's somewhere in this thread.... somewhere...)
I see they are now around $6700. That's still a very good profit.
<< <i>I made some good points in that previous quote if I must say so myself.... and then along came the 08-W burnished plats and put another dagger in the heart of the 06-W burnished plats! Now the gradkids might be asking about 08-W plats, not 06-W!! LOL.
Wondercoin >>
I thought that one of the '06 burnished denominatons has a lower mintage then the same denomination in '08. Is this correct? Thanks.
<< <i>I agree that all of these will attract some interest. Perhaps the ASE will be the only one that has long-term numismatic interest, but who knows? It's hard to view the hockey pucks as real coins, and I would think the Lincoln issue will be large enough to thwart long-term interest, but who knows? >>
The 2010 ASE proof will be a high-mintage issue. Why any potential beyond the original markup (plus any increase in spot)? Thanks.
<< <i>I think you will be using a $300 (minimum) beverage coaster if you do. This is the only 5 ounce coin the Mint will ever make. Every type collector will need one, not to mention all the flippers driving the price. $300 may be a low number when all is said and done. However, we will have to wait another 4 or 5 months for these coins. >>
Just think of how much we all get to spend if they do Proof and MS versions!!
(Sorry for the three posts in a row - been out for a while.)
<< <i>the age gold proofs are a "no brainer" at 2938 for four coin set....
ordered...
these are not a scarcity play, but once these proofs are gone, sit back and watch the secondary market take off with their buy prices several hundred dollars above gold.
flip them wholesale and convert to bullion.
the easiest flip ever.
guys - these were a wholesale 2100-2200 buy price for 1 oz'ers at 1100-1200 gold. >>
Pay attention my amigos/amigas - this is very good advice and as he says, "a no brainer" which I described these as when they were first issued!
<< <i>I agree that all of these will attract some interest. Perhaps the ASE will be the only one that has long-term numismatic interest, but who knows? It's hard to view the hockey pucks as real coins, and I would think the Lincoln issue will be large enough to thwart long-term interest, but who knows? >>
The 2010 ASE proof will be a high-mintage issue. Why any potential beyond the original markup (plus any increase in spot)? Thanks. >>
now that silver spot is that much closer to the release price, and mintage will be high, but how high compared to.. expected demand that is definitely going to be higher than last year.
Back when spot was in the low $20s I was thinking not flippable, but now I'm thinking it may be possible.
<< <i>So with current spot prices on Gold, that puts ths the 1.85 ounces of Gold in the AGE proof Set at $1588 an ounce.
You can buy a 2010 AGE UNC at APMEX for $1477 with alot more in shipping costs. Which has the better appreciation over time? >>
I like the way you look at that. And it is interesting to note that $1588/oz is only $3/oz more than the single 1oz Proof AGE at $1585 right now.(which is on wait list only!)
<< <i>I thought that one of the '06 burnished denominatons has a lower mintage then the same denomination in '08. Is this correct? Thanks. >>
The only 2006-W with a lower mintage than the 2008-W is the half ounce AGE by only 518 coins. All other 2006-W burnished AGEs are much higher mintage than the 2008-W burnished AGEs.
<< The only 2006-W with a lower mintage than the 2008-W is the half ounce AGE by only 518 coins. >>
I think he was referring to plats, not gold.
<< The 2010 ASE proof will be a high-mintage issue. Why any potential beyond the original markup (plus any increase in spot)? Thanks. >>
Common date ASE proofs are going for $55 and up on eBay, including shipping.
I don't think the 2010's will add enough proofs to dampen demand. If they're scarce, they will probably fetch a premium. If they're common, continuing demand for common dates should help support the price.
I like the 4 coin but if you are looking at investment with a flip isn't the real value in the 1 oz coin? Buying the fractionals to get the ounce, is that what is being suggested and then assuming the ounce will eventually cover the fractional investment in the secondary market?
They jump the price to the range indicated by the average. So, that's 1 level up right now, barring some sharp decline in gold. If the fixes tomorrow are both $1431.25 or both add to $2862.50, then we will jump by 2 levels
Comments
What's ATB? I think that not only will the rising price of silver affect sales, but that the premiums will be a detriment to sales as well. If the overall pool of buyers is strong enough, the bell curve simply moves to the right regardless of pricing. Still, for a bullion product - the intent was to supply silver to the market rather than to gouge investors/collectors.
At some point, people will opt for more bullion at a lower premium rather than another Mint product marketed as a limited edition piece. The question really does boil down to 25 oz. of premium 5 oz. silver vs. 31 oz. of silver eagles @ $2.00 over melt.
At this point, I'm still in - but the Mint & their distributor network have got me mentally hedging a bit.
I knew it would happen.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
<< <i>I think the 5oz ATB coins will be hot. Potential for a smaller run than next year's releases and potential for it being the only year with a 3 inch diameter** (**pending legislation)
What's ATB? ... >>
America The Beautiful
<< <i>Thank you Mr Ben Bernanke. You just made buying gold and silver coins from the Mint a bit more costly. (and maybe other things too) >>
The printing of another $600 Billion of worthless paper Dollars will just accelerate the destruction of our currency. In Gold we trust!
No.
So we have to sell this gold and silver to get paper to pay bills. What a game this is.
<< <i>
<< <i>Thank you Mr Ben Bernanke. You just made buying gold and silver coins from the Mint a bit more costly. (and maybe other things too) >>
The printing of another $600 Billion of worthless paper Dollars will just accelerate the destruction of our currency. In Gold we trust! >>
Isn't that just amazing. The banks have money they just don't lend it out anymore. For my mom two homes and 40 acres was not enough to get a 20k loan. When press Wells said they don't give personal loans anymore.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Thank you Mr Ben Bernanke. You just made buying gold and silver coins from the Mint a bit more costly. (and maybe other things too) >>
The printing of another $600 Billion of worthless paper Dollars will just accelerate the destruction of our currency. In Gold we trust! >>
Isn't that just amazing. The banks have money they just don't lend it out anymore. For my mom two homes and 40 acres was not enough to get a 20k loan. When press Wells said they don't give personal loans anymore. >>
Maybe Bernanke will decide to buy up all the proof Eagles with fresh dollars to create a bubble there also. I think your illustration shows the bank lending stuff is a cover story for something else but meanwhile back to our regularly scheduled topic.
<< <i>I think you will be using a $300 (minimum) beverage coaster if you do. This is the only 5 ounce coin the Mint will ever make. Every type collector will need one, not to mention all the flippers driving the price. $300 may be a low number when all is said and done. However, we will have to wait another 4 or 5 months for these coins. >>
the law mandates they be sold in the year the clad quarters are issued.
they can't wait 4 or 5 months.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Thank you Mr Ben Bernanke. You just made buying gold and silver coins from the Mint a bit more costly. (and maybe other things too) >>
The printing of another $600 Billion of worthless paper Dollars will just accelerate the destruction of our currency. In Gold we trust! >>
Isn't that just amazing. The banks have money they just don't lend it out anymore. For my mom two homes and 40 acres was not enough to get a 20k loan. When press Wells said they don't give personal loans anymore. >>
isn't it insane in the other direction now? hard to get a loan, even with good assets. people with the ability to repay loans aren't getting them because they are self-employed or they may have heavy assets but not enough monthly income (which might sound logical, but when one has more than enough assets to repay the loan the question becomes how afraid are they?
Now back to on-topic here.... Gold just popped to a bit under $1400 and silver exploded to over $26 (and platinum is near $1790.)
The mint has probably already made (or made most of) these 2010 5oz ATB pucks, and soon they will go to the dealers.
Plus, the 2010 AGE 1oz Proofs are on a waiting list.
The the price moves going to scare away end consumers of both? Will fewer end consumers want to buy at the higher price levels fearing a sharp correction?
Will dealers tighten their markup if the spots climb over their dealer purchase prices? Or is that a foolish hope?
<< <i>I lost the link to who will be selling the 2010 5oz ATB's. Also saw an ebay preorder for a single 2010 5oz ATB at $350 I think.
any dealer that sells ASE bullion can get these.
APMEX has an "Alert Me" sign-up list for these
Has anyone been following the 2008-W gold buffaloes?
Can you tell me if they are dropping in price now that the gold price is rising?
we're in post price spike mode right now.
PCGS MS70 FS
and NGC MS70PL (not sure about ER MS70PL)
are going nuts on eBay.
PCGS - rotten picture & 14 Day Return, US only with Free Ship @ AUCTION! -> $3,452.99
but
PCGS - rotten picture & no returns, US only with Free Ship @ Auction - > $2,725.00
and
PCGS - 1 Bid wonder Auction - $3,095.00
and
PCGS - Best Offer $2,850.00 + 17 ship
-----------------------------------------------------------
Here's a live auction with 19hours left (not mine)
$2,951.99 + $5 shipping
and another live auction with 22hours left (not mine)
$3,056.99
====================
Those other guys...
MS70PL - Best Offer - $4,100.00
MS70PL - BIN - $4,675.00
MS70PL - Best Offer $4,650.00
MS70 PL @ Auction - $4,300.00
--------------------------------
MS70PL @ live auction(not mine) w/ 7 days 21 hours left
$4,199.00 + $25
==================================
perhaps it is because there are only 3 live auctions and 2 high BINs for MS70 FS on eBay right now. They are falling into tight hands. which is good.
>
>
Are you considering buying 1 or more of each of the 5oz Silver National Park Coins?
>
>
Consider adding the number of each of the 5 you plan on buying into the 5oz Silver National Park "we wanna get a monster box of these" thread.
>
>
Check out the thread for it
>
(don't worry, the thread has lots of pages, but there are lots and lots of "count me in" posts to skip over)
If gold stays above $1400, the price could jump 2 increments to $3115 later in the week.
This could be the last chance to buy at these prices.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Box of 20
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
here's a cut-n-paste:
Change – Use
Range of
Weekly
Average
<< <i>The 2008W fractionals had a mania run up and sell off several months ago.
we're in post price spike mode right now. >>
So if I had any 2008-W fractional buffs (or AGEs) that I wanted to sell, it's too late to maximize profit?
Real life crisis took me out of the game for a few months, now I'm trying to play catch-up.
ordered...
these are not a scarcity play, but once these proofs are gone, sit back and watch the secondary market take off with their buy prices several hundred dollars above gold.
flip them wholesale and convert to bullion.
the easiest flip ever.
guys - these were a wholesale 2100-2200 buy price for 1 oz'ers at 1100-1200 gold.
<< <i>
<< <i>The 2008W fractionals had a mania run up and sell off several months ago.
we're in post price spike mode right now. >>
So if I had any 2008-W fractional buffs (or AGEs) that I wanted to sell, it's too late to maximize profit?
Real life crisis took me out of the game for a few months, now I'm trying to play catch-up. >>
Maximum?
Who's to know they won't take off again?
They did hit well over $8,000 (was it $8800??) for an ungraded, open box 4-coin proof set on eBay. (I know it's somewhere in this thread.... somewhere...)
I see they are now around $6700. That's still a very good profit.
(even the OGP only prices were going crazy)
<< <i>I made some good points in that previous quote if I must say so myself.... and then along came the 08-W burnished plats and put another dagger in the heart of the 06-W burnished plats! Now the gradkids might be asking about 08-W plats, not 06-W!! LOL.
Wondercoin >>
I thought that one of the '06 burnished denominatons has a lower mintage then the same denomination in '08. Is this correct? Thanks.
<< <i>I agree that all of these will attract some interest. Perhaps the ASE will be the only one that has long-term numismatic interest, but who knows? It's hard to view the hockey pucks as real coins, and I would think the Lincoln issue will be large enough to thwart long-term interest, but who knows? >>
The 2010 ASE proof will be a high-mintage issue. Why any potential beyond the original markup (plus any increase in spot)? Thanks.
<< <i>I think you will be using a $300 (minimum) beverage coaster if you do. This is the only 5 ounce coin the Mint will ever make. Every type collector will need one, not to mention all the flippers driving the price. $300 may be a low number when all is said and done. However, we will have to wait another 4 or 5 months for these coins. >>
Just think of how much we all get to spend if they do Proof and MS versions!!
(Sorry for the three posts in a row - been out for a while.)
<< <i>the age gold proofs are a "no brainer" at 2938 for four coin set....
ordered...
these are not a scarcity play, but once these proofs are gone, sit back and watch the secondary market take off with their buy prices several hundred dollars above gold.
flip them wholesale and convert to bullion.
the easiest flip ever.
guys - these were a wholesale 2100-2200 buy price for 1 oz'ers at 1100-1200 gold. >>
Pay attention my amigos/amigas - this is very good advice and as he says, "a no brainer" which I described these as when they were first issued!
Now they are a NO-NO Brainer.
Miles
I believe you are correct regarding the $10 denomination
Wondercoin
You can buy a 2010 AGE UNC at APMEX for $1477 with alot more in shipping costs. Which has the better appreciation over time?
Miles
<< <i>
<< <i>I agree that all of these will attract some interest. Perhaps the ASE will be the only one that has long-term numismatic interest, but who knows? It's hard to view the hockey pucks as real coins, and I would think the Lincoln issue will be large enough to thwart long-term interest, but who knows? >>
The 2010 ASE proof will be a high-mintage issue. Why any potential beyond the original markup (plus any increase in spot)? Thanks. >>
now that silver spot is that much closer to the release price,
and
mintage will be high, but how high compared to..
expected demand that is definitely going to be higher than last year.
Back when spot was in the low $20s I was thinking not flippable, but now I'm thinking it may be possible.
Anyone remember the Box Of 10 going for over $7000??
Not now of course, but we all understand the initial feeding frenzy post-sellout on popular mint issues.
Miles
<< <i>So with current spot prices on Gold, that puts ths the 1.85 ounces of Gold in the AGE proof Set at $1588 an ounce.
You can buy a 2010 AGE UNC at APMEX for $1477 with alot more in shipping costs. Which has the better appreciation over time? >>
I like the way you look at that. And it is interesting to note that $1588/oz is only $3/oz more than the single 1oz Proof AGE at $1585 right now.(which is on wait list only!)
dont think
just buy
1588/oz on the 4 coin set.
<< <i>I thought that one of the '06 burnished denominatons has a lower mintage then the same denomination in '08. Is this correct? Thanks. >>
The only 2006-W with a lower mintage than the 2008-W is the half ounce AGE by only 518 coins. All other 2006-W burnished AGEs are much higher mintage than the 2008-W burnished AGEs.
HERE ARE THE MINTAGE FIGURES....
Date .......1 oz. 1/2 oz. 1/4 oz. 1/10 oz.
2006-W *
..........45,053 / 15,164 / 15,188 / 20,643
2007-W
..........18,066 / 11,455 / 12,766 / 22,501
2008-W *
.........11,908 / 15,682 / 8,883 / 12,657
dont think
just buy
1588/oz on the 4 coin set.
I think he was referring to plats, not gold.
<< The 2010 ASE proof will be a high-mintage issue. Why any potential beyond the original markup (plus any increase in spot)? Thanks. >>
Common date ASE proofs are going for $55 and up on eBay, including shipping.
I don't think the 2010's will add enough proofs to dampen demand. If they're scarce, they will probably fetch a premium. If they're common, continuing demand for common dates should help support the price.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
They jump the price to the range indicated by the average. So, that's 1 level up right now, barring some sharp decline in gold. If the fixes tomorrow are both $1431.25 or both add to $2862.50, then we will jump by 2 levels
Box of 20
<< <i>Looks like the 4 coin set is now red. Sprung for one set, see if I get it. >>
Buffalo one-ounce gold proof is still available at $1610.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Well...I did my part, I'm backordered for the 4-coin set and also ordered one each of the tenth, quarter and half ouncers!