Moy did an interview on coinnews and it sounds like he won't be bringing any more old classic designs back to modern coins so this is all there will be for now. I am still holding my gold buffalo coins, no reason to sell and regret it later, insanity or not.
<< <i>Does anyone have the PCGS pop. reports for the $10 2008 W AGE Unc.?
THANKS!! >>
Copied & pasted. Not sure what the "base" column is???
399928 2008-W $10 American Buffalo .9999 Fine Gold MS 1 164 600 765 Base 2008-W $10 American Buffalo .9999 Fine Gold MS 62 142 204 399929 2008-W $10 American Buffalo First Strike .9999 Fine Gold MS 1 102 458 561 edited to add: 765, 204 & 561 are the totals
A big THANK YOU to everyone who welcomed me to this forum (Eric, smokincoin, SNMAN and anyone else I might have left out).
I am a beginner and would like to hear anyone's opinion on a couple of things in relation to both US and non-US coins (please forgive me if I am asking questions that have already been asked, as I haven't gone through the entire 300+ pages of this thread yet!);
1. The 1993-P Philadelphia Set. Is this the only BULLION set issued by the US Mint that contains a medal? The design of the medal looks fantastic - I particularly like the reverse with all the different coin designs. Eric, would you be saying something about this in your book?
2. 2006-W, 2007-W, 2008-W APE Uncirculated 4 Coin Sets. If a person is on a tight budget (who isn't?), is it better to (a) own coins from all 3 years in different denominations OR (b) bang your money on 2008-W coins (because of their lower mintage, last year of issue etc)? Ditto for the AGE Uncirculated 4 Coin Sets.
3. Will PCGS allow coins in 4 coin holders to be reholdered back into single coin holders?
4. Do you feel PROOF Krugerrand coins will become more popular in the US? (Yes, I know this question is more appropriate under the World Coins forum, but I am plonking it in here anyway!).
5. Eric, can you tell me in which year(s) the actual mintage for Britannia coins was 400 or less? Are you referring to the anniversary platinum set? (Yes, another that should be under World Coins).
"1. The 1993-P Philadelphia Set. Is this the only BULLION set issued by the US Mint that contains a medal? The design of the medal looks fantastic - I particularly like the reverse with all the different coin designs. Eric, would you be saying something about this in your book?"
I'll take a stab at this one (and also welcome JCoin) - I am not aware of any other silver, gold or Platinum eagle set out there that has a medal accompanying the set. The Philly medal is a proof silver medal honroing the striking of the first official U.S. coins at the philly mint and struck specifically for the "Philly set". David Ryder, the Director of the Mint stated that this silver medal was "a modification of the Mint's United States Mint Bicentennial Medal (1792-1992). The obverse depicts a reddition of a 1914 oil painting by john Ward Dunsmore "Inspecting the First Coins". The reverse is a collage of popular and current US coinage from the first US cent to the (then current) 1992 US Olympic Gold $5 coin. This medal has always been a personal favorite of mine. The medals often come with their fair share of contact marks (which is why roughly less than 2% have achieved a perfect grade at PCGS thus far. I have handled -4- PCGS-PR70DCAM coins thus far. I believe there might be a grand total of -5- PR70DCAM medals out there now and mid 200's PR69DCAM but I have not doubled checked. One reason there have only been less than 300 medals submitted in total is that the only way to buy one of these coins (fresh) is to spend $1,300+ (current cost) to buy the 5 coin set which houses this medal. So, it is very costly to put together any kind of "bulk" submission. Consider that to own (100) "fresh" medals would cost roughly $125,000 - $150,000 for the product. Yet, the medal in PCGS "PR69" grade still often fetches well under $100. I do often see "average" quality examples offered on ebay for about $25-$50/coin raw though. A fascinating "coin" to be sure. Wondercoin
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
PCGS has not done that for at least one reason... the coins are easily interchangeable in the set as the plastic case opens and shuts with ease and coins can come in and out of the set with no problem. I have bought a great many Philly sets over the years that have been "tampered with" and contained "reject"coins in them (especially the gold coins). There are "tell-tale" signs of "bad" sets, which I have learned only by "trial and error" over the years - having purchased at least roughly 200-250 sets in the (5) years. I specifically address this set in my Coinfacts commentary on the 1993 $1 Silver Eagle for those Coinfacts members here that are interested in this topic.
Wondercoin
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
Jcoin - I did not want to "hog" the thread. I felt competent on your question #1 after handling about 200-250 Philly sets (and closer to 300-350 of these medals).
Wondercoin
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
The medal, of course, gets the special designation anyway as it is only found in Philly sets. I thought PCGS might start to designate the silver eagles with a special designation when they come into grading matching the special characteristics of the coin (discussed at Coinfacts). But, not yet.
Wondercoin
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
The medal, of course, gets the special designation anyway as it is only found in Philly sets. I thought PCGS might start to designate the silver eagles with a special designation when they come into grading matching the special characteristics of the coin (discussed at Coinfacts).
JC - You are correct. Not to mention, the spotting issues related to the silver eagles. A spectacular PR70DC of that coin is a super tough coin as well. But, I find equally cool a (raw in a safe flip) spectacular "purple toned" original 1993 proof silver eagle from the Philly set.
Wondercoin
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
2. 2006-W, 2007-W, 2008-W APE Uncirculated 4 Coin Sets. If a person is on a tight budget (who isn't?), is it better to (a) own coins from all 3 years in different denominations OR (b) bang your money on 2008-W coins (because of their lower mintage, last year of issue etc)? Ditto for the AGE Uncirculated 4 Coin Sets.
The answer depends on what you interests and ultimate goals are:
A. If you like to have a full set (but can't afford every denomination) all you have to do is pick the denomination you like most and run with it. In that case I would recommend the 1/4s or the 1/2s because they have the lowest mintages and the sizes are big enough to appreciate the designs. If money is a problem, stick with the 1/10s.
B. If you like to buy with the intention to profit at some point in the future, you'll get more bang for the buck if you buy the key dates only. Either way, I recommend you stick with one denomination and run with it. The 1/10s, being smaller and more affordable, appreciate more (percentage wise). You'll realize a higher return on investment for every dollar you spend on 1/10s (compared to the other denominations).
There is a problem with the Uncirculated Platinum coins that you should keep in mind. The mintage gaps on some of the 2006W/2008W denominations are very small. With the spike on precious metals in 2008, many 2006W dated coins were sold as bullion and were possibly mis-handled. With such small gaps in mintage, some of the 2006W dated coins might become condition rarities in high grade in the future and might fetch higher prices. This may not become noticeable until most coins produced have found a steady home and nice samples of any give date become difficult to locate. If that is a big concern I would just go with both 2006W and 2008W.
The medal, of course, gets the special designation anyway as it is only found in Philly sets. I thought PCGS might start to designate the silver eagles with a special designation when they come into grading matching the special characteristics of the coin (discussed at Coinfacts). But, not yet.
2mc2ff - I will try to get an image of the "classic" (i.e. proper) looking 93 Philly eagle from the set to include in this thread. Could be next week though.
Wondercoin
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
<< <i>2mc2ff - I will try to get an image of the "classic" (i.e. proper) looking 93 Philly eagle from the set to include in this thread. Could be next week though.
Wondercoin >>
...................................................... I'll be very interested. You got my interest up and I pulled my original set I purchased in 1993 out and compared it to ASEs. I must say the Philadelphia coin looks better, more sharply struck with better mirrored fields and sharper rims.
1. The 1993-1996 proof gold Britannia are in the 435-486 mintage range. Go to the web site TAX FREE GOLD out of Great Brittan and you will find the mintage charts for them.. They are so lovely, so rare, so cheap, prior to 1998.
2. Neostar gave you an excellent answer to the plat question.
The "condition rarity" issue you mention as "possible" would probably only relate to the larger coins in the set, specifically the 1 oz Plat Unc.
As you know, the 1/2 and 1/4 fractionals were known as the "keepers" in 2006 (06-w), and the 1/10 was small enough that even a pop in PLAT price to the 2500 range did not produce enough momentum for collectors to part with their dimes.
So the highly probable coin dated 06-w to be melted in the plat unc series is the 1 oz coin.
As such, most of the 08-w coins would be "safe" kings.
Another thing, I've heard far too much about coins "too close" in mintage to show enough "pop" in value.
Hogwash.
Keys are Keys, even by 1 coin.
Price compare a 93-S Morgan at 100k mintage to a 94-P at 110k mintage.
<< <i>2mc2ff - I will try to get an image of the "classic" (i.e. proper) looking 93 Philly eagle from the set to include in this thread. Could be next week though.
Wondercoin >>
...................................................... I'll be very interested. You got my interest up and I pulled my original set I purchased in 1993 out and compared it to ASEs. I must say the Philadelphia coin looks better, more sharply struck with better mirrored fields and sharper rims.
Is there a clear point of difference?? >>
Hi 2mc2ff!
This type of set would really interest collectors in Asia who are looking to start a modern US coin collection - apart from the bullion value, there is historic value - we love things like this. Are you gonna grade your set?
>> Keys are Keys, even by 1 coin. Price compare a 93-S Morgan at 100k mintage to a 94-P at 110k mintage. <<
For the Morgans, because of all the melts, the number of surviving coins is more important than original mintage. Bowers' Silver Dollar Encyclopedia estimates the surviving population of the 1894-P as roughly double the surviving population of the 1893-S.
The 2008 w buff. set madness continues...take a look at the latest Ebay sales. Prices seem to have stabilized - at insane levels. Wonder what they'll be year from now.
Of course, the BIG question is whether they'll be issued again.
<< <i>The 2008 w buff. set madness continues...take a look at the latest Ebay sales. Prices seem to have stabilized - at insane levels. Wonder what they'll be year from now.
Of course, the BIG question is whether they'll be issued again. >>
If they do, I'm guessing they'll be minting a lot more than the number sold for the 2008's
Granted the $50 08w Buffalo unc are the lowest mintage in the series but why are their boxes selling for $350-500 on ebay when all the other sizes go for about $50?Will the other boxes appreciate and the unc $50's pull back?Some crazy box buying bubble?The 7-10X premium for a box seems especially odd when you see the significantly higher prices that the higher mintage proof coins bring over the unc coins.
<< <i>The 2008 w buff. set madness continues...take a look at the latest Ebay sales. Prices seem to have stabilized - at insane levels. Wonder what they'll be year from now.
Of course, the BIG question is whether they'll be issued again. >>
To anyone with access to NGC population reports, will you please share NGC's total number of coins graded for the 2008-W unc. $10 Gold Buffalo? I'd appreciate it. Also, can anyone do the same over at ICG? Thanks!
1) What's up (or not up) with the 2008 W plats. - dead on Ebay.
2) I'm sure that you all caught the full page ad in CW featuring the 1995 W ASE PCGS Proof 70 to be auctioned by Teletrade. Any bets on price realized? Does anyone know the pop. for this one?
While PCGS population report shows only 2-3 at that grade that hardly means only 2-3 such coins exist.
While some may scoff certainly some of the NGC PR70s are of equal quality and there are almost certainly many more 1995-W ASE PR70 that have never been submitted.
As I believe David Hall once pointed out...........reported populations frequently rise and virtually never fall.
The teletrade offered price is pure ego driven and IMO stupid money.
1) What's up (or not up) with the 2008 W plats. - dead on Ebay.
What we've seen was the release of the mintage data, followed by a quick rise (especially in the 1/4 oz and 1/2 oz), with Proofs leading the way and now the Burnished Uncs coming into their own.
In both Proofs and Burnished Uncs, the fast price rise has bounced off of a temporary ceiling. It's an inefficient market, so there are some apparent bargains at the very same time that there are some coins that are overpriced.
We are just entering Year 1 after launch. Not bad for starters, I'd say.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
Comments
THANKS!!
<< <i>Does anyone have the PCGS pop. reports for the $10 2008 W AGE Unc.?
THANKS!! >>
Copied & pasted. Not sure what the "base" column is???
399928 2008-W $10 American Buffalo .9999 Fine Gold MS 1 164 600 765
Base 2008-W $10 American Buffalo .9999 Fine Gold MS 62 142 204
399929 2008-W $10 American Buffalo First Strike .9999 Fine Gold MS 1 102 458 561
edited to add: 765, 204 & 561 are the totals
<< <i>THANKS Smokin, but I was looking for the AGE (not Buff) numbers. Thanks very much for trying to help though!! Ron >>
393064 2008-W $10 Eagle MS 4 636 732 1,372
Base 2008-W $10 Eagle MS 3 591 691 1,285
393065 2008-W $10 Eagle First Strike MS 1 45 41 87
A big THANK YOU to everyone who welcomed me to this forum (Eric, smokincoin, SNMAN and anyone else I might have left out).
I am a beginner and would like to hear anyone's opinion on a couple of things in relation to both US and non-US coins (please forgive me if I am asking questions that have already been asked, as I haven't gone through the entire 300+ pages of this thread yet!);
1. The 1993-P Philadelphia Set. Is this the only BULLION set issued by the US Mint that contains a medal? The design of the medal looks fantastic - I particularly like the reverse with all the different coin designs. Eric, would you be saying something about this in your book?
2. 2006-W, 2007-W, 2008-W APE Uncirculated 4 Coin Sets. If a person is on a tight budget (who isn't?), is it better to (a) own coins from all 3 years in different denominations OR (b) bang your money on 2008-W coins (because of their lower mintage, last year of issue etc)? Ditto for the AGE Uncirculated 4 Coin Sets.
3. Will PCGS allow coins in 4 coin holders to be reholdered back into single coin holders?
4. Do you feel PROOF Krugerrand coins will become more popular in the US? (Yes, I know this question is more appropriate under the World Coins forum, but I am plonking it in here anyway!).
5. Eric, can you tell me in which year(s) the actual mintage for Britannia coins was 400 or less? Are you referring to the anniversary platinum set? (Yes, another that should be under World Coins).
JCoin
I'll take a stab at this one (and also welcome JCoin) - I am not aware of any other silver, gold or Platinum eagle set out there that has a medal accompanying the set. The Philly medal is a proof silver medal honroing the striking of the first official U.S. coins at the philly mint and struck specifically for the "Philly set". David Ryder, the Director of the Mint stated that this silver medal was "a modification of the Mint's United States Mint Bicentennial Medal (1792-1992). The obverse depicts a reddition of a 1914 oil painting by john Ward Dunsmore "Inspecting the First Coins". The reverse is a collage of popular and current US coinage from the first US cent to the (then current) 1992 US Olympic Gold $5 coin. This medal has always been a personal favorite of mine. The medals often come with their fair share of contact marks (which is why roughly less than 2% have achieved a perfect grade at PCGS thus far. I have handled -4- PCGS-PR70DCAM coins thus far. I believe there might be a grand total of -5- PR70DCAM medals out there now and mid 200's PR69DCAM but I have not doubled checked. One reason there have only been less than 300 medals submitted in total is that the only way to buy one of these coins (fresh) is to spend $1,300+ (current cost) to buy the 5 coin set which houses this medal. So, it is very costly to put together any kind of "bulk" submission. Consider that to own (100) "fresh" medals would cost roughly $125,000 - $150,000 for the product. Yet, the medal in PCGS "PR69" grade still often fetches well under $100. I do often see "average" quality examples offered on ebay for about $25-$50/coin raw though. A fascinating "coin" to be sure. Wondercoin
If so would these be of value??
I am surprised you didn't offer an opinion on my second question as well......
JCoin
Wondercoin
Wondercoin
Pop.....0??
The medal, of course, gets the special designation anyway as it is only found in Philly sets. I thought PCGS might start to designate the silver eagles with a special designation when they come into grading matching the special characteristics of the coin (discussed at Coinfacts). But, not yet.
Wondercoin
<< <i>So no Philadelphia sets were ever submitted to PCGS sealed??
Pop.....0?? >>
This set seems extremely difficult to "build" in PR70 - with the Medal having a Pop of 5; the 93-P ASE Pop 24; 93-P AGE Pop 22...........
<< <i>pop 0 as far as I know
The medal, of course, gets the special designation anyway as it is only found in Philly sets. I thought PCGS might start to designate the silver eagles with a special designation when they come into grading matching the special characteristics of the coin (discussed at Coinfacts).
.............................................................................................................................................................................................................................
The Philadelphia ASEs can be distinguished from the regular Proof ASE??
Wondercoin
2. 2006-W, 2007-W, 2008-W APE Uncirculated 4 Coin Sets. If a person is on a tight budget (who isn't?), is it better to (a) own coins from all 3 years in different denominations OR (b) bang your money on 2008-W coins (because of their lower mintage, last year of issue etc)? Ditto for the AGE Uncirculated 4 Coin Sets.
The answer depends on what you interests and ultimate goals are:
A. If you like to have a full set (but can't afford every denomination) all you have to do is pick the denomination you like most and run with it. In that case I would recommend the 1/4s or the 1/2s because they have the lowest mintages and the sizes are big enough to appreciate the designs. If money is a problem, stick with the 1/10s.
B. If you like to buy with the intention to profit at some point in the future, you'll get more bang for the buck if you buy the key dates only. Either way, I recommend you stick with one denomination and run with it. The 1/10s, being smaller and more affordable, appreciate more (percentage wise). You'll realize a higher return on investment for every dollar you spend on 1/10s (compared to the other denominations).
There is a problem with the Uncirculated Platinum coins that you should keep in mind. The mintage gaps on some of the 2006W/2008W denominations are very small. With the spike on precious metals in 2008, many 2006W dated coins were sold as bullion and were possibly mis-handled. With such small gaps in mintage, some of the 2006W dated coins might become condition rarities in high grade in the future and might fetch higher prices. This may not become noticeable until most coins produced have found a steady home and nice samples of any give date become difficult to locate. If that is a big concern I would just go with both 2006W and 2008W.
<< <i>pop 0 as far as I know
The medal, of course, gets the special designation anyway as it is only found in Philly sets. I thought PCGS might start to designate the silver eagles with a special designation when they come into grading matching the special characteristics of the coin (discussed at Coinfacts). But, not yet.
Wondercoin >>
....................................................................................................................................................................
??? What are the "special chacteristics of the coin" that would alow a 1993 ASE regular proof to be distinguished from a Philadelphia set ASE proof??
Wondercoin
<< <i>2mc2ff - I will try to get an image of the "classic" (i.e. proper) looking 93 Philly eagle from the set to include in this thread. Could be next week though.
Wondercoin >>
......................................................
I'll be very interested. You got my interest up and I pulled my original set I purchased in 1993 out and compared it to ASEs.
I must say the Philadelphia coin looks better, more sharply struck with better mirrored fields and sharper rims.
Is there a clear point of difference??
Wondercoin
<< <i>
<< <i>THANKS Smokin, but I was looking for the AGE (not Buff) numbers. Thanks very much for trying to help though!! Ron >>
393064 2008-W $10 Eagle MS 4 636 732 1,372
Base 2008-W $10 Eagle MS 3 591 691 1,285
393065 2008-W $10 Eagle First Strike MS 1 45 41 87 >>
THANKS!!!!
To answer your questions.
1. The 1993-1996 proof gold Britannia are in the 435-486 mintage range. Go to the web site TAX FREE GOLD out of
Great Brittan and you will find the mintage charts for them.. They are so lovely, so rare, so cheap, prior to 1998.
2. Neostar gave you an excellent answer to the plat question.
Eric
The "condition rarity" issue you mention as "possible" would probably only relate to the larger coins in the set, specifically the 1 oz Plat Unc.
As you know, the 1/2 and 1/4 fractionals were known as the "keepers" in 2006 (06-w), and the 1/10 was small enough that even a pop in PLAT price to the 2500 range did not produce enough momentum for collectors to part with their dimes.
So the highly probable coin dated 06-w to be melted in the plat unc series is the 1 oz coin.
As such, most of the 08-w coins would be "safe" kings.
Another thing, I've heard far too much about coins "too close" in mintage to show enough "pop" in value.
Hogwash.
Keys are Keys, even by 1 coin.
Price compare a 93-S Morgan at 100k mintage to a 94-P at 110k mintage.
Enough said.
Thank you both for your valuable insight.
Neostar, your $25 PCGS Set is lovely.
JCoin (A Collector from ASIA)
<< <i>
<< <i>2mc2ff - I will try to get an image of the "classic" (i.e. proper) looking 93 Philly eagle from the set to include in this thread. Could be next week though.
Wondercoin >>
......................................................
I'll be very interested. You got my interest up and I pulled my original set I purchased in 1993 out and compared it to ASEs.
I must say the Philadelphia coin looks better, more sharply struck with better mirrored fields and sharper rims.
Is there a clear point of difference?? >>
Hi 2mc2ff!
This type of set would really interest collectors in Asia who are looking to start a modern US coin collection - apart from the bullion value, there is historic value - we love things like this. Are you gonna grade your set?
Thx for the info on the Britannia's.
JCoin
For the Morgans, because of all the melts, the number of surviving coins is more important than original mintage. Bowers' Silver Dollar Encyclopedia estimates the surviving population of the 1894-P as roughly double the surviving population of the 1893-S.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Wondercoin
Thank you for the compliment and welcome to the Boards!
<< <i>Nothing to do with characteristics of strike. My comment pertains to the (very consistent) toning pattern of the original 93 silver eagles.
Wondercoin >>
I know exactly what you mean.
I have 5 sets I originally purchased early in 1993 and the ASEs all have a very nice uniform album ring toning.
Seems to have a slight bluish tint............
Thanks. Wondercoin
<< <i>anyone recall the first strike deadline for UHR's at PCGS?
Thanks. Wondercoin >>
If I remember correctly, my order shipped on 3/10/09 & the "First Strike" cut-off date was 3/11/09.
Wondercoin
Of course, the BIG question is whether they'll be issued again.
<< <i>The 2008 w buff. set madness continues...take a look at the latest Ebay sales. Prices seem to have stabilized - at insane levels. Wonder what they'll be year from now.
Of course, the BIG question is whether they'll be issued again. >>
If they do, I'm guessing they'll be minting a lot more than the number sold for the 2008's
<< <i>
<< <i>anyone recall the first strike deadline for UHR's at PCGS?
Thanks. Wondercoin >>
If I remember correctly, my order shipped on 3/10/09 & the "First Strike" cut-off date was 3/11/09. >>
yes.
march 11
<< <i>The 2008 w buff. set madness continues...take a look at the latest Ebay sales. Prices seem to have stabilized - at insane levels. Wonder what they'll be year from now.
Of course, the BIG question is whether they'll be issued again. >>
SWEET
gold isn't falling down while the dollar is rising up.
I guess the "safety" of a not currently imploding country is what the ForEx guys are buying and the gold guys realize that.
Also, can anyone do the same over at ICG? Thanks!
1) What's up (or not up) with the 2008 W plats. - dead on Ebay.
2) I'm sure that you all caught the full page ad in CW featuring the 1995 W ASE PCGS Proof 70 to be auctioned by Teletrade. Any bets on price realized? Does anyone know the pop. for this one?
While PCGS population report shows only 2-3 at that grade that hardly means only 2-3 such coins exist.
While some may scoff certainly some of the NGC PR70s are of equal quality and there are almost certainly many more 1995-W ASE PR70 that have never been submitted.
As I believe David Hall once pointed out...........reported populations frequently rise and virtually never fall.
The teletrade offered price is pure ego driven and IMO stupid money.
What we've seen was the release of the mintage data, followed by a quick rise (especially in the 1/4 oz and 1/2 oz), with Proofs leading the way and now the Burnished Uncs coming into their own.
In both Proofs and Burnished Uncs, the fast price rise has bounced off of a temporary ceiling. It's an inefficient market, so there are some apparent bargains at the very same time that there are some coins that are overpriced.
We are just entering Year 1 after launch. Not bad for starters, I'd say.
I knew it would happen.
What TT sales price? Last I had heard the coin never sold?
Wondercoin