My guess is that about 95% of the victims of overgraded coins on eBay don't know they are victims.
So, I have always wondered why junk dealers don't all offer generous return policies since the vast majority of buyers feel satisfied with a crappy coin. That is, pretend to be "customer friendly," sell crap, and reap the rewards.
I'm not suggesting that anyone sell crappy coins. I'm just curious why the seller would not view 5% returns as a cost of dong business to create false goodwill to keep the scheme going.
<< <i>Why have the return policy linked to the insurance? They do not seem to have anything to do with one another. >>
He says because he was wronged by a buyer before he started requiring it claiming he received a damaged coin, and returned it, yet later offered the same coin undamaged for sale on eBay. The feedbacks were done. No insurance no DC no proof. Since delivery confirmation is included as part of insurance both parties benefit. Had it been insured only the post office would've gotten stung. Insurance doesn't protect him from a coin swap but it does stop a Paypal chargeback if it is done.
If I were doing the exact same selling as him, insurance would be required <period> and included in the final price at auction close.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>Why have the return policy linked to the insurance? They do not seem to have anything to do with one another. >>
He says because he was wronged by a buyer before he started requiring it claiming he received a damaged coin, and returned it, yet later offered the same coin undamaged for sale on eBay. The feedbacks were done. No insurance no DC no proof. Since delivery confirmation is included as part of insurance both parties benefit. Had it been insured only the post office would've gotten stung. Insurance doesn't protect him from a coin swap but it does stop a Paypal chargeback if it is done.
If I were doing the exact same selling as him, insurance would be required <period> and included in the final price at auction close. >>
Are you really this dense? Or are you in cahoots with this seller?
The problem with this particular coin was not damage in shipping. The coin was cleaned and severely overgraded. Please explain to me how the cleaning and wear occured while in the mail.
<< <i>Why have the return policy linked to the insurance? They do not seem to have anything to do with one another. >>
He says because he was wronged by a buyer before he started requiring it claiming he received a damaged coin, and returned it, yet later offered the same coin undamaged for sale on eBay. The feedbacks were done. No insurance no DC no proof. Since delivery confirmation is included as part of insurance both parties benefit. Had it been insured only the post office would've gotten stung. Insurance doesn't protect him from a coin swap but it does stop a Paypal chargeback if it is done.
If I were doing the exact same selling as him, insurance would be required <period> and included in the final price at auction close. >>
Catfish seems to spend an inordinate amount of time and effort "defending" POE58. For example the following are direct quotes from Poe58's website:
<< <i> My Return Policy!
This Return Policy Covers Insured Items Only!
I have a seven-day no questions asked return policy. Just notify me with in seven days of the auction close and return the item in its original holder, and I will refund your payment less Shipping and handling. >>
BUT Here's Poe's policy on Insurance:
<< <i> Shipping and payment details Shipping and handling: (within United States) Standard shipping service: US $2.50 US Postal Service Priority Mail: US $5.55
Shipping insurance: Not offered >>
Bottom line - Poe58 has a policy of NO returns for the simple reason that he requires Insurance as a pre-requisite for a return and NO insurance is offered - It's really quite simple: Poe's intention is NOT to allow returns. BUT his statement that he offers a "a seven-day no questions asked return policy" is really quite deceptive as there is in reality NO returns allowed. All of Catfish's "spin" can't change that fact and anyone considering bidding on Poe's auctions should be EXTREMELY careful.
Personally, I wouldn't bid on any of Poe's auctions as the scans are awful, you can't see the detail, nor whether there is any luster (probably because there is none). For example, Poe has a 1927 SLQ that he describes as follows:
<< <i>a High Grade 1927 Standing Liberty Quarter that displays a full head. The Coin is sharply struck.. The coin has full mint luster. >>
The scan shows a dull greyish looking coin that does not seem to have any head detail at all - in fact the coin looks like an AU coin. But look carefully at Poe's description - He never says the coin is Uncirculated: He implies that it's UNC (fully mint luster), but only says its "High Grade", which could be AU or even EF. - Again, like his "return" (more accurately NO return policy) it seems to say one thing, but in reality it may be something completely different.
Everyone has to make their own decision as to what to bid on in Ebay auctions, and what coins to bid agressively on - I've purchased coins on Ebay, both slabbed and raw, but I make it a practice to ONLY bid when there is a fair return policy that is honored by the Seller.
It is clear from the content of Poe58's offerings and the manner in which he dealt with Mirabela, that Poe58 is not someone to buy coins from, and all Catfish's spin, cannot change the fact that Poe's "game" is to not offer a return policy. In viewing the result of ANACS grading of the coin that Mirabela purchased, one can easily conclude that Poe sells overgraded problem coins that are not accurately described and if you happen to be the unfortunate purchaser, you will have greatly over-paid for what you get.
JMHO
Collecting eye-appealing Proof and MS Indian Head Cents, 1858 Flying Eagle and IHC patterns and beautiful toned coins.
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain Newmismatist
[Catfish seems to spend an inordinate amount of time and effort "defending" POE58. For example the following are direct quotes from Poe58's website:
<< <i> My Return Policy!
This Return Policy Covers Insured Items Only!
I have a seven-day no questions asked return policy. Just notify me with in seven days of the auction close and return the item in its original holder, and I will refund your payment less Shipping and handling. >>
BUT Here's Poe's policy on Insurance:
<< <i> Shipping and payment details Shipping and handling: (within United States) Standard shipping service: US $2.50 US Postal Service Priority Mail: US $5.55
Shipping insurance: Not offered >>
Bottom line - Poe58 has a policy of NO returns for the simple reason that he requires Insurance as a pre-requisite for a return and NO insurance is offered - It's really quite simple: Poe's intention is NOT to allow returns. BUT his statement that he offers a "a seven-day no questions asked return policy" is really quite deceptive as there is in reality NO returns allowed. All of Catfish's "spin" can't change that fact and anyone considering bidding on Poe's auctions should be EXTREMELY careful.
Anyone bidding on ANYTHING on eBay needs to be extremely careful. I repeat from earlier posting.....
The insurance says "not offered" Not a valid reason to call it rigged.... 1) There is a "request total from the seller" button at auction end You can request final shipping costs with insurance in the resulting message box after clicking on it. 2) You have the opportunity to edit the final shipping costs on each and every auction you pay for on eBay. If you want insurance you simply add it to the shipping costs. 3) When paying with Paypal paypal also allows manual editing of the final shipping amount AND provides a message block for requesting insurance. BAM!!! There are 3 opportunities to request and 2 opportunities to pay for insurance on an auction! Poe's problem here is in assuming that people bidding on his auctions are intelligent enough to figure that out. I have told him this is simply not the case. Many people that are absolute experts in their fields are often completely lost when it comes to using a computer.
Personally, I wouldn't bid on any of Poe's auctions as the scans are awful, you can't see the detail, nor whether there is any luster (probably because there is none).
Also from an earlier post.... My perspective, re:results concerning this transaction so far. I feel the damage done to poe58 on eBay wasn't nearly what I thought it would be. It would appear members of this forum weren't a major part of his customer base to begin with. That being said, someone who wasn't buying in the first place couldn't hurt him by not buying.
It is clear from the content of Poe58's offerings and the manner in which he dealt with Mirabela, that Poe58 is not someone to buy coins from, and all Catfish's spin, cannot change the fact that Poe's "game" is to not offer a return policy. In viewing the result of ANACS grading of the coin that Mirabela purchased, one can easily conclude that Poe sells overgraded problem coins that are not accurately described and if you happen to be the unfortunate purchaser, you will have greatly over-paid for what you get.
JMHO
Where were you before mirabela placed that bid? I note your opinion, but I truly don't agree with it. I have purchased insurance on auctions I have won. In the big picture, Poe didn't think it necessary to point out the extra steps required to pay for the insurance because he assumed anyone he would be dealing with would be computer literate enough to figure it out. I won an auction this week and the invoice he sent now has those extra steps lined out. In this case, even with the 3 opportunities to request and 2 to pay for insurance in the transaction mirabela did not request his insurance until after the item had been shipped and was in the postal drop box for mailing.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
I have no more to gain in all of this than you do K6.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
bottom line; why spend more than $20-30.00 on raw coins on Ebay. There is a pretty good chance you will get overgraded coins. I've collected coins since 1955 and there have always been crooks in the business. Today, it's just as bad as 40 years ago. A lot of them have just moved to E-bay. Personally, I never buy a ms 58 and above coin without it being slabbed. Lower grades you can usually grade correctly from a good scan. You have to go after the guys that won't refund, no matter what their excuse. At best, they are unethical. At worst, they are out and out crooks. JMHO. Steve
I have lived in Belpre, OH. for 35 years. This is the same town that this guy poe58 claims to be from. If anyone happens to know his address, please PM me. I do not believe that I know him and probably do not want to, but would like to find out if he really is from here.
Don't waste your time debating catfish172. In his world, 1+1 = 3. He has a serious problem with facts, truth, logical argument and the English language. You need only read his bullcrap in this post to understand his blatant deceptions. Ignore catfish172's sophistry.
In case this fool's convoluted logic has not convinced anyone, this quote should seal the deal.
<< <i>Poe didn't think it necessary to point out the extra steps required to pay for the insurance because he assumed anyone he would be dealing with would be computer literate enough to figure it out. >>
OK, I've read through all 200+ posts in this thread, and the bottom line conclusion that I've come to is:
Poe58 does not stand behind his coins.
If you throw out and/or concede everything else, you are left with this inescapable conclusion. For a coin sold for a measly couple hundred dollars, were I the seller I would have refunded the buyer's money no questions asked. It is simply not worth my reputation to fight over a couple hundred dollars.
I had a similar situation a couple years ago. I had sold a Monroe half to some guy with decent enough feedback. Shortly after receiving it, he emails me and complains that it had been heavily dipped, and he didn't want it. Now, NO WAY IN HECK had that coin been dipped, but why argue? I told him to send it back, he did, I refunded his money, and resold it later to a much more appreciative buyer.
Poe58 should have done the same thing. Instead, he decided to be a tough guy and stand firm, probably on "principle". Principle, schminciple, I say: this is business. Keeping customers happy is more important than two hundred dollar principles.
Bob, he doesn't care about his reputation, he is looking to stick people with problem coins. That's why he has his "return policy" rigged to where he won't accept any returns.
I think he's figuring out that it's easier to do so w/ BIN than in auction, if you follow my logic... Whatever is the electronic equivalent of being ridden out on a rail, though, I'm real interested in seeing it eventually come to pass for this joker.
Poe58 should have done the same thing. Instead, he decided to be a tough guy and stand firm, probably on "principle". Principle, schminciple, I say: this is business. Keeping customers happy is more important than two hundred dollar principles.
Flaminio You have my vote for best statement in the thread.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>Bob, he doesn't care about his reputation, he is looking to stick people with problem coins. That's why he has his "return policy" rigged to where he won't accept any returns. >>
This statement is a blatant lie.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
Actually, catfish, you can't call it a blatant lie unless you are the seller and know it is. If you are defending him (more than he will defend himself) then you still can't call it a blatant lie.
The seller uses excuses to say why he has "no insurance offered". He sells sucky coins. He attacks a person's integrity who he has no reason to (except "suspicion" from a question).
He wasn't smart enough to take a return and resell the item. He is a scummy bottom feeding seller getting off on ripping people off.
You can defend him all you want but it is obvious he has taken the money and ran. So, if you are NOT a relative or lover or something that gives you a reason to defend him like you have, then you are pretty loyal for only being a "customer".
Makes me wonder how well you can grade the coins you bought from him....were they in slabs? Are they cleaned? Were they as advertised?
Anyway, doesn't matter. He sets it up so there is no return, he claims there is a return. He is not honest.
<< <i>Bob, he doesn't care about his reputation, he is looking to stick people with problem coins. That's why he has his "return policy" rigged to where he won't accept any returns. >>
This statement is a blatant lie. >>
Not based on the way that Poe treated Mirabela! It appears to be a very accurate and logical conclusion based on the facts outlined in this thread. After reading Catfish's numerous responses which continue to defend an Poe's indefensible conduct, another logical conclusion could be that Poe and Catfish are "Partners" (perhaps Poe sells Catfish's coins? or maybe Catfish and Poe own these little beauties jointly & they split profits?) in this enterprise. I did notice that Catfish 1st sets forth a "defense" that he ordinarily would have no knowledge of (alleges that the coins were switched) and then when the "flaws" in his argument are clearly shown, he backtracks. This has occurred numerous times in this thread and now he's reached the bottom of the barrel and now his only retort is that everyone else "lies" as indicated by the above quote.
Given the fact that ANACS has determined that the coin is not UNC., but has been severely cleaned to the point where an AU coin is net graded as XF, it's difficult to comprehend why Catfish continues to defend Poe - unless of course he's an interested party in the transaction.
Catfish just why is it that you feel compelled to defend someone who would advertise a coin as UNC., claim he has a "7 day no questions asked return policy", and absolutely refuses to accept a return of a coin that has now been determined to be a harshly cleaned AU coin that ANACS net grades as XF? If you were the buyer of that piece of swill, would you want your money back?
Maybe you don't really "give" your coins away - maybe Poe sells them for you on ebay - with his generous return policy". As Shakespeare said: - "Methinks the lady doth protest too much?"
Collecting eye-appealing Proof and MS Indian Head Cents, 1858 Flying Eagle and IHC patterns and beautiful toned coins.
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain Newmismatist
The prevailing fact in the thread is that mirabela had 3 opportunities to request the insurance and 2 methods of paying for it. He did not. Instead he waited until after shipping had been done then went back and requested it. That set poe58 into a defensive mode and is the basis of his side of the case. No matter what anyones opinion of Poe requirement of insurance being an alledged method of scamming the means are there to shoot down that possibility of a scam. This is in fact 1 isolated incident and everyone is set out to judge him completely from it. Yes, just 1 isolated incident.
I haven't stated this, but given the communications as they occured, What are the possibilities given the "late" insurance request that mirabela cleaned the coin then came here to put on this show?
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
You have to hand it to catfish, he doesn't merely settle for being shown to be a fool, he has to make sure he dances through the room with a lampshade on his head to see that everyone takes notice.
When we are planning for posterity, we ought to remember that virtue is not hereditary.
Let's revisit comments never addressed left by another board member......
Well if I'm a seller and I get an email asking about a return policy after a coin has been paid for but before it's actually been recieved by the buyer, that to me is a HUGE red flag. This guy may have seen it, feared the worst, then after you confirmed you would be returning the coin after having recieved it, he may think you're pulling a scam. I know I would.
But, it does also look like the seller is pulling a bit of a scam, stipulating returns on insured coins only and then not listing the coin with an insurance option. It would have been easy though for you to alter the payment amount manually to comply with the terms as it was clearly set forth in his auction text. However, you paid, without adding an insurance amount (why would you do that if you knew it would negate your return privelage?) and then asked about a return before even seeing the coin.
Bottom line, I think BOTH of you are being a little less than honest with each other.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
How do you KNOW it's a "blatant lie," Catfish? You'd have to be in cahoots with, or somehow connected to, the seller in order to KNOW it's a lie. >>
Check his feedback. You will see my name several times. That statement was a blatant lie based off of my own experiences with purchases from Poe. Some I added the insurance, some I did not. Therefore I KNOW it is a blatant lie. The connection is I have made several purchases without experiencing any troubles. There are many others with the same good experiences as well. This is 1 incident and the board is ready to hang him rather than aid him in a positive manner to correct this and his auctions on eBay.
Earlier, it was alluded that I may have something to gain from this...... I do not, but a particular member that jumped quickly to mirabela's side in this is another power seller on eBay. Perhaps he is in cahoots with mirabela to destroy another power seller on eBay? In a free enterprise economy things like that happen all the time. Or maybe, mirabela is a repeat customer of his and wishes to insure that he he will be by coming to bat for him? Who knows? Since mirabela, like me is a relative newby to the boards he did need some "experience" on his end to further his cause especially after his side of the email exchange.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
i was gonna take my kid to the circus today, but the weather is crummy,, but i think this thread is better and we dont even have to smell all the horse shyt,,STEVE
Catfish There are 2 "blatant lies" that have been reveled in this thread:
1. Poe claimed the 1877 Seated half was BU - this is a "blatant lie", determined by a reputable 3rd party - ANACS 2. Poe claimed he gives a "7 Day no questions asked return" This also is a "blatant lie".
You have come up with all kinds of "Spin" trying to defend this blatant lier: You claim mirabela "switched" coins - NOT true based on the photographs. Your latest claim may be the most absurd of all: Mirabela cleaned the coin to accuse Poe of selling an over-graded coin! You ask What's the chance of that? Answer ZERO. Your defense has reached the point where it is totally illogical and makes no sense whatso ever, other than coming up with absurd theories to defend someone (Poe) has sold a blatantly over-graded and misrepresented coin - and who has generated that sale on the pre-text that the is a return privilege, which doesn't exist.
Your most recent absurdity:
<< <i>a particular member that jumped quickly to mirabela's side in this is another power seller on eBay. Perhaps he is in cahoots with mirabela to destroy another power seller on eBay? >>
Yep, that member is gonna some how block every computer in the world from accessing Poe's Ebay listings, thus destroying his ability to sell his coins? Pray tell - How are they going to do THAT? Per your own "logic" Poe's customers don't come from this Forum, so it doesn't matter. Maybe they're going to spend millions of dollars and do a mass mailing to every person who owns a computer? - all over a $200 coin. Maybe Pigs Fly. Maybe Poe sells BU coins? Science Fiction maybe, but not reality. JMHO
Collecting eye-appealing Proof and MS Indian Head Cents, 1858 Flying Eagle and IHC patterns and beautiful toned coins.
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain Newmismatist
2. Poe claimed he gives a "7 Day no questions asked return" This also is a "blatant lie".
Not so, His 7 day no questions asked return policy is contingent upon insurance. Insurance easily requested and paid for on any Auction. Matt failed to do so and disqualified this transaction.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>You have to hand it to catfish, he doesn't merely settle for being shown to be a fool, he has to make sure he dances through the room with a lampshade on his head to see that everyone takes notice. >>
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>2. Poe claimed he gives a "7 Day no questions asked return" This also is a "blatant lie".
Not so, His 7 day no questions asked return policy is contingent upon insurance. Insurance easily requested and paid for on any Auction. Matt failed to do so and disqualified this transaction. >>
Per Poe's Website:
<< <i>Shipping insurance: Not offered >>
couldn't be any clearer than that - Shipping insurance: Not offered
What part of that plain english statement don't you comprehend?
Collecting eye-appealing Proof and MS Indian Head Cents, 1858 Flying Eagle and IHC patterns and beautiful toned coins.
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain Newmismatist
<< <i>2. Poe claimed he gives a "7 Day no questions asked return" This also is a "blatant lie".
Not so, His 7 day no questions asked return policy is contingent upon insurance. Insurance easily requested and paid for on any Auction. Matt failed to do so and disqualified this transaction. >>
Per Poe's Website:
<< <i>Shipping insurance: Not offered >>
couldn't be any clearer than that - Shipping insurance: Not offered
What part of that plain english statement don't you comprehend? >>
Are you really that ignorant? Haven't you read this before?
1) There is a "request total from the seller" button at auction end You can request final shipping costs with insurance in the resulting message box after clicking on it.
Edited to add: If you don't insure a purchase from poe on an item that should be it only because you were not intelligent enough to use the system to obtain it. 2) You have the opportunity to edit the final shipping costs on each and every auction you pay for on eBay. If you want insurance you simply add it to the shipping costs. 3) When paying with Paypal paypal also allows manual editing of the final shipping amount AND provides a message block for requesting insurance. BAM!!! There are 3 opportunities to request and 2 opportunities to pay for insurance on an auction!
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
I noted that also. Insurance not offered in the "shipping and payment details".
At the risk of beating a dead horse (hah! this one's mostly decomposed by now), why is it so crucial to link the insurance with the return policy? I have NEVER seen this anywhere else.
Are you really that ignorant? Haven't you read this before?....
Yes, but the express checkout will let you buy the coin without offering the insurance. It is the path of least resistence. Most people will checkout and pay before they realize that they have not paid for insurance. It's a trap.
<< <i>I noted that also. Insurance not offered in the "shipping and payment details".
At the risk of beating a dead horse (hah! this one's mostly decomposed by now), why is it so crucial to link the insurance with the return policy? I have NEVER seen this anywhere else. >>
That is just a policy of his and Poe explained it in the email exchange Matt posted in the starting post of this thread. Has nothing to do with subversiveness at all. What appears as subversive to me is requesting insurance after an item has already shipped despite having 3 opportunites to request it prior to paying for the transaction.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>why is it so crucial to link the insurance with the return policy? I have NEVER seen this anywhere else. >>
It's on page 12 in chapter four of the "How To Be A Successful eBay Scammer" manual. It's under the section titled "Roping In The Sucker With A Convoluted Unworkable Guarantee."
<< <i>Are you really that ignorant? Haven't you read this before?....
Yes, but the express checkout will let you buy the coin without offering the insurance. It is the path of least resistence. Most people will checkout and pay before they realize that they have not paid for insurance. It's a trap. >>
Not at all, a trap would be not allowing for the insurance at all. EDITED To ADD: Expres checkout also allows you to edit the final shipping costs. In his newer listings he's now added the statement "If insurance is desired, please add the amount desired to the invoice total!" It's a start at least.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
It's on page 12 in chapter four of the "How To Be A Successful eBay Scammer" manual. It's under the section titled "Roping In The Sucker With A Convoluted Unworkable Guarantee."
We are nearing 300. Shot 350. But we need a new character to enter the fray. Maybe we could email the guy who negged Poe and ask him for his perspective. Otherwise, we are recycling the same trash over and over. And over.
<< <i>I noted that also. Insurance not offered in the "shipping and payment details".
At the risk of beating a dead horse (hah! this one's mostly decomposed by now), why is it so crucial to link the insurance with the return policy? I have NEVER seen this anywhere else. >>
Easy. As I stated earlier in this thread, the "return policy" is listed to get higher bids. He then rigs it to where he will not accept returns.
Also note that he claims to have 25 years experience, then goes on to state the grade "is only my opinion", then small images "that clearly show all details". In other words, I'm going to list a coin at a certain grade, but I take no responsibility for the grade I have assigned.
Easy. As I stated earlier in this thread, the "return policy" is listed to get higher bids. He then rigs it to where he will not accept returns.
>>
There is no rigging. That is a blatant lie.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>Maybe we could email the guy who negged Poe and ask him for his perspective. >>
I sent that guy an email with a link to this thread a couple of days ago. He hasn't responded yet. >>
He may not respond, He wanted a refund and keep the coin.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
Aside from the inane attempt to keep people from buying insurance when insurance is the only way they can get a return privlege, the only thing this joker is doing is selling cleaned coins as mint state. Well heck, there are plenty of ANA Life Members doing that over at coinworld. Their pages are full of places to buy coins stated as mint state and when you get them in they have been softly whizzed with something. I myself have purchased several of these "mint state" coins and recieved such trash. When is the ANA going to join up with coin world and clean up the act of the sellers who advertise on the pages of their trade paper? The buyer who bought this peice of crap learned a valuable lesson, or should have. Either make sure you have an ironclad return privlege, or dont buy sight unseen. It is really that simple. If you get this one guy stopped, then who is going to stop the others? Really, the only way to stop these people is to educate buyers. There will always be people out there who will take advantage of others. It is human nature.
In an insane society, a sane person will appear to be insane.
<< <i>He may not respond, He want a refund and keep the coin. >>
Again, how do you know all this? You're obviously quite close to poe58 to know as many things as you seem to know. That's not a crime, but it does lead one to naturally question your objectivity. It sounds more and more like you "have a horse" in this race.
Easy. As I stated earlier in this thread, the "return policy" is listed to get higher bids. He then rigs it to where he will not accept returns.
>>
There is no rigging. That is a blatant lie. >>
And how would you know? Have you returned a coin to him?
You seem to be defending this power screwer to the death. Why? >>
You seem to want to crucify him over one transaction, Why?
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>Aside from the inane attempt to keep people from buying insurance when insurance is the only way they can get a return privlege, the only thing this joker is doing is selling cleaned coins as mint state. Well heck, there are plenty of ANA Life Members doing that over at coinworld. >>
You are right, there is. But if people get around to filing complaints, the ANA will act. Ken Pines, who owns Coast to Coast Coins, was recently expelled from the ANA for failure to respond to complaints alleging that he sold cleaned AU coins as UNCs.
<< <i>He may not respond, He want a refund and keep the coin. >>
Again, how do you know all this? You're obviously quite close to poe58 to know as many things as you seem to know. That's not a crime, but it does lead one to naturally question your objectivity. It sounds more and more like you "have a horse" in this race. >>
No horse in this race at all. I know because he sent the email exchange to me including Paypal's denial of the claim. It was his first negative and he wanted me to know. I have been a repeat buyer of his and he sometimes emails me for advice and comments. I have given advice towards this return policy of his but he hasn't fully accepted it.
Member Steamfitters Local 614 USMC Veteran 1981-1992 Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
Comments
Marc
So, I have always wondered why junk dealers don't all offer generous return policies since the vast majority of buyers feel satisfied with a crappy coin. That is, pretend to be "customer friendly," sell crap, and reap the rewards.
I'm not suggesting that anyone sell crappy coins. I'm just curious why the seller would not view 5% returns as a cost of dong business to create false goodwill to keep the scheme going.
<< <i>Why have the return policy linked to the insurance? They do not seem to have anything to do with one another. >>
He says because he was wronged by a buyer before he started requiring it claiming he received a damaged coin, and returned it, yet later offered the same coin undamaged for sale on eBay. The feedbacks were done. No insurance no DC no proof. Since delivery confirmation is included as part of insurance both parties benefit. Had it been insured only the post office would've gotten stung. Insurance doesn't protect him from a coin swap but it does stop a Paypal chargeback if it is done.
If I were doing the exact same selling as him, insurance would be required <period> and included in the final price at auction close.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>
<< <i>Why have the return policy linked to the insurance? They do not seem to have anything to do with one another. >>
He says because he was wronged by a buyer before he started requiring it claiming he received a damaged coin, and returned it, yet later offered the same coin undamaged for sale on eBay. The feedbacks were done. No insurance no DC no proof. Since delivery confirmation is included as part of insurance both parties benefit. Had it been insured only the post office would've gotten stung. Insurance doesn't protect him from a coin swap but it does stop a Paypal chargeback if it is done.
If I were doing the exact same selling as him, insurance would be required <period> and included in the final price at auction close. >>
Are you really this dense? Or are you in cahoots with this seller?
The problem with this particular coin was not damage in shipping. The coin was cleaned and severely overgraded. Please explain to me how the cleaning and wear occured while in the mail.
<< <i>
<< <i>Why have the return policy linked to the insurance? They do not seem to have anything to do with one another. >>
He says because he was wronged by a buyer before he started requiring it claiming he received a damaged coin, and returned it, yet later offered the same coin undamaged for sale on eBay. The feedbacks were done. No insurance no DC no proof. Since delivery confirmation is included as part of insurance both parties benefit. Had it been insured only the post office would've gotten stung. Insurance doesn't protect him from a coin swap but it does stop a Paypal chargeback if it is done.
If I were doing the exact same selling as him, insurance would be required <period> and included in the final price at auction close. >>
Catfish seems to spend an inordinate amount of time and effort "defending" POE58. For example the following are direct quotes from Poe58's website:
<< <i> My Return Policy!
This Return Policy Covers Insured Items Only!
I have a seven-day no questions asked return policy. Just notify me with in seven days of the auction close and return the item in its original holder, and I will refund your payment less Shipping and handling. >>
BUT Here's Poe's policy on Insurance:
<< <i> Shipping and payment details
Shipping and handling:
(within United States) Standard shipping service: US $2.50
US Postal Service Priority Mail: US $5.55
Shipping insurance: Not offered >>
Bottom line - Poe58 has a policy of NO returns for the simple reason that he requires Insurance as a pre-requisite for a return and NO insurance is offered - It's really quite simple: Poe's intention is NOT to allow returns. BUT his statement that he offers a "a seven-day no questions asked return policy" is really quite deceptive as there is in reality NO returns allowed. All of Catfish's "spin" can't change that fact and anyone considering bidding on Poe's auctions should be EXTREMELY careful.
Personally, I wouldn't bid on any of Poe's auctions as the scans are awful, you can't see the detail, nor whether there is any luster (probably because there is none). For example, Poe has a 1927 SLQ that he describes as follows:
<< <i>a High Grade 1927 Standing Liberty Quarter that displays a full head. The Coin is sharply struck.. The coin has full mint luster. >>
The scan shows a dull greyish looking coin that does not seem to have any head detail at all - in fact the coin looks like an AU coin. But look carefully at Poe's description - He never says the coin is Uncirculated: He implies that it's UNC (fully mint luster), but only says its "High Grade", which could be AU or even EF. - Again, like his "return" (more accurately NO return policy) it seems to say one thing, but in reality it may be something completely different.
Everyone has to make their own decision as to what to bid on in Ebay auctions, and what coins to bid agressively on - I've purchased coins on Ebay, both slabbed and raw, but I make it a practice to ONLY bid when there is a fair return policy that is honored by the Seller.
It is clear from the content of Poe58's offerings and the manner in which he dealt with Mirabela, that Poe58 is not someone to buy coins from, and all Catfish's spin, cannot change the fact that Poe's "game" is to not offer a return policy. In viewing the result of ANACS grading of the coin that Mirabela purchased, one can easily conclude that Poe sells overgraded problem coins that are not accurately described and if you happen to be the unfortunate purchaser, you will have greatly over-paid for what you get.
JMHO
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
Newmismatist
<< <i> My Return Policy!
This Return Policy Covers Insured Items Only!
I have a seven-day no questions asked return policy. Just notify me with in seven days of the auction close and return the item in its original holder, and I will refund your payment less Shipping and handling. >>
BUT Here's Poe's policy on Insurance:
<< <i> Shipping and payment details
Shipping and handling:
(within United States) Standard shipping service: US $2.50
US Postal Service Priority Mail: US $5.55
Shipping insurance: Not offered >>
Bottom line - Poe58 has a policy of NO returns for the simple reason that he requires Insurance as a pre-requisite for a return and NO insurance is offered - It's really quite simple: Poe's intention is NOT to allow returns. BUT his statement that he offers a "a seven-day no questions asked return policy" is really quite deceptive as there is in reality NO returns allowed. All of Catfish's "spin" can't change that fact and anyone considering bidding on Poe's auctions should be EXTREMELY careful.
Anyone bidding on ANYTHING on eBay needs to be extremely careful. I repeat from earlier posting.....
The insurance says "not offered" Not a valid reason to call it rigged....
1) There is a "request total from the seller" button at auction end You can request final shipping costs with insurance in the resulting message box after clicking on it.
2) You have the opportunity to edit the final shipping costs on each and every auction you pay for on eBay. If you want insurance you simply add it to the shipping costs.
3) When paying with Paypal paypal also allows manual editing of the final shipping amount AND provides a message block for requesting insurance.
BAM!!! There are 3 opportunities to request and 2 opportunities to pay for insurance on an auction!
Poe's problem here is in assuming that people bidding on his auctions are intelligent enough to figure that out. I have told him this is simply not the case. Many people that are absolute experts in their fields are often completely lost when it comes to using a computer.
Personally, I wouldn't bid on any of Poe's auctions as the scans are awful, you can't see the detail, nor whether there is any luster (probably because there is none).
Also from an earlier post....
My perspective, re:results concerning this transaction so far. I feel the damage done to poe58 on eBay wasn't nearly what I thought it would be. It would appear members of this forum weren't a major part of his customer base to begin with. That being said, someone who wasn't buying in the first place couldn't hurt him by not buying.
It is clear from the content of Poe58's offerings and the manner in which he dealt with Mirabela, that Poe58 is not someone to buy coins from, and all Catfish's spin, cannot change the fact that Poe's "game" is to not offer a return policy. In viewing the result of ANACS grading of the coin that Mirabela purchased, one can easily conclude that Poe sells overgraded problem coins that are not accurately described and if you happen to be the unfortunate purchaser, you will have greatly over-paid for what you get.
JMHO
Where were you before mirabela placed that bid? I note your opinion, but I truly don't agree with it. I have purchased insurance on auctions I have won. In the big picture, Poe didn't think it necessary to point out the extra steps required to pay for the insurance because he assumed anyone he would be dealing with would be computer literate enough to figure it out. I won an auction this week and the invoice he sent now has those extra steps lined out. In this case, even with the 3 opportunities to request and 2 to pay for insurance in the transaction mirabela did not request his insurance until after the item had been shipped and was in the postal drop box for mailing.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
I have no more to gain in all of this than you do K6.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
Thanks
Gary
<< <i>Poe didn't think it necessary to point out the extra steps required to pay for the insurance because he assumed anyone he would be dealing with would be computer literate enough to figure it out. >>
Poe58 does not stand behind his coins.
If you throw out and/or concede everything else, you are left with this inescapable conclusion. For a coin sold for a measly couple hundred dollars, were I the seller I would have refunded the buyer's money no questions asked. It is simply not worth my reputation to fight over a couple hundred dollars.
I had a similar situation a couple years ago. I had sold a Monroe half to some guy with decent enough feedback. Shortly after receiving it, he emails me and complains that it had been heavily dipped, and he didn't want it. Now, NO WAY IN HECK had that coin been dipped, but why argue? I told him to send it back, he did, I refunded his money, and resold it later to a much more appreciative buyer.
Poe58 should have done the same thing. Instead, he decided to be a tough guy and stand firm, probably on "principle". Principle, schminciple, I say: this is business. Keeping customers happy is more important than two hundred dollar principles.
Flaminio You have my vote for best statement in the thread.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>Bob, he doesn't care about his reputation, he is looking to stick people with problem coins. That's why he has his "return policy" rigged to where he won't accept any returns. >>
This statement is a blatant lie.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
If you are defending him (more than he will defend himself) then you still can't call it a blatant lie.
The seller uses excuses to say why he has "no insurance offered".
He sells sucky coins.
He attacks a person's integrity who he has no reason to (except "suspicion" from a question).
He wasn't smart enough to take a return and resell the item. He is a scummy bottom feeding seller getting off on ripping people off.
You can defend him all you want but it is obvious he has taken the money and ran. So, if you are NOT a relative or lover or something that gives you a reason to defend him like you have, then you are pretty loyal for only being a "customer".
Makes me wonder how well you can grade the coins you bought from him....were they in slabs? Are they cleaned? Were they as advertised?
Anyway, doesn't matter. He sets it up so there is no return, he claims there is a return. He is not honest.
Bust him and get him away.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>
<< <i>Bob, he doesn't care about his reputation, he is looking to stick people with problem coins. That's why he has his "return policy" rigged to where he won't accept any returns. >>
This statement is a blatant lie. >>
Not based on the way that Poe treated Mirabela! It appears to be a very accurate and logical conclusion based on the facts outlined in this thread. After reading Catfish's numerous responses which continue to defend an Poe's indefensible conduct, another logical conclusion could be that Poe and Catfish are "Partners" (perhaps Poe sells Catfish's coins? or maybe Catfish and Poe own these little beauties jointly & they split profits?) in this enterprise. I did notice that Catfish 1st sets forth a "defense" that he ordinarily would have no knowledge of (alleges that the coins were switched) and then when the "flaws" in his argument are clearly shown, he backtracks. This has occurred numerous times in this thread and now he's reached the bottom of the barrel and now his only retort is that everyone else "lies" as indicated by the above quote.
Given the fact that ANACS has determined that the coin is not UNC., but has been severely cleaned to the point where an AU coin is net graded as XF, it's difficult to comprehend why Catfish continues to defend Poe - unless of course he's an interested party in the transaction.
Catfish just why is it that you feel compelled to defend someone who would advertise a coin as UNC., claim he has a "7 day no questions asked return policy", and absolutely refuses to accept a return of a coin that has now been determined to be a harshly cleaned AU coin that ANACS net grades as XF? If you were the buyer of that piece of swill, would you want your money back?
Maybe you don't really "give" your coins away - maybe Poe sells them for you on ebay - with his generous return policy". As Shakespeare said: - "Methinks the lady doth protest too much?"
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
Newmismatist
I haven't stated this, but given the communications as they occured, What are the possibilities given the "late" insurance request that mirabela cleaned the coin then came here to put on this show?
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>This statement is a blatant lie. >>
How do you KNOW it's a "blatant lie," Catfish? You'd have to be in cahoots with, or somehow connected to, the seller in order to KNOW it's a lie.
When we are planning for posterity, we ought to remember that virtue is not hereditary.
Thomas Paine
Well if I'm a seller and I get an email asking about a return policy after a coin has been paid for but before it's actually been recieved by the buyer, that to me is a HUGE red flag. This guy may have seen it, feared the worst, then after you confirmed you would be returning the coin after having recieved it, he may think you're pulling a scam. I know I would.
But, it does also look like the seller is pulling a bit of a scam, stipulating returns on insured coins only and then not listing the coin with an insurance option. It would have been easy though for you to alter the payment amount manually to comply with the terms as it was clearly set forth in his auction text. However, you paid, without adding an insurance amount (why would you do that if you knew it would negate your return privelage?) and then asked about a return before even seeing the coin.
Bottom line, I think BOTH of you are being a little less than honest with each other.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>
<< <i>This statement is a blatant lie. >>
How do you KNOW it's a "blatant lie," Catfish? You'd have to be in cahoots with, or somehow connected to, the seller in order to KNOW it's a lie. >>
Check his feedback. You will see my name several times. That statement was a blatant lie based off of my own experiences with purchases from Poe. Some I added the insurance, some I did not. Therefore I KNOW it is a blatant lie. The connection is I have made several purchases without experiencing any troubles. There are many others with the same good experiences as well. This is 1 incident and the board is ready to hang him rather than aid him in a positive manner to correct this and his auctions on eBay.
Earlier, it was alluded that I may have something to gain from this...... I do not, but a particular member that jumped quickly to mirabela's side in this is another power seller on eBay. Perhaps he is in cahoots with mirabela to destroy another power seller on eBay? In a free enterprise economy things like that happen all the time. Or maybe, mirabela is a repeat customer of his and wishes to insure that he he will be by coming to bat for him? Who knows? Since mirabela, like me is a relative newby to the boards he did need some "experience" on his end to further his cause especially after his side of the email exchange.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>This statement is a blatant lie >>
Catfish There are 2 "blatant lies" that have been reveled in this thread:
1. Poe claimed the 1877 Seated half was BU - this is a "blatant lie", determined by a reputable 3rd party - ANACS
2. Poe claimed he gives a "7 Day no questions asked return" This also is a "blatant lie".
You have come up with all kinds of "Spin" trying to defend this blatant lier: You claim mirabela "switched" coins - NOT true based on the photographs. Your latest claim may be the most absurd of all: Mirabela cleaned the coin to accuse Poe of selling an over-graded coin! You ask What's the chance of that? Answer ZERO. Your defense has reached the point where it is totally illogical and makes no sense whatso ever, other than coming up with absurd theories to defend someone (Poe) has sold a blatantly over-graded and misrepresented coin - and who has generated that sale on the pre-text that the is a return privilege, which doesn't exist.
Your most recent absurdity:
<< <i>a particular member that jumped quickly to mirabela's side in this is another power seller on eBay. Perhaps he is in cahoots with mirabela to destroy another power seller on eBay? >>
Yep, that member is gonna some how block every computer in the world from accessing Poe's Ebay listings, thus destroying his ability to sell his coins? Pray tell - How are they going to do THAT? Per your own "logic" Poe's customers don't come from this Forum, so it doesn't matter. Maybe they're going to spend millions of dollars and do a mass mailing to every person who owns a computer? - all over a $200 coin. Maybe Pigs Fly. Maybe Poe sells BU coins? Science Fiction maybe, but not reality.
JMHO
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
Newmismatist
Not so, His 7 day no questions asked return policy is contingent upon insurance. Insurance easily requested and paid for on any Auction. Matt failed to do so and disqualified this transaction.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>You have to hand it to catfish, he doesn't merely settle for being shown to be a fool, he has to make sure he dances through the room with a lampshade on his head to see that everyone takes notice. >>
He's the Energizer Bunny of absurdity.
Russ, NCNE
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>2. Poe claimed he gives a "7 Day no questions asked return" This also is a "blatant lie".
Not so, His 7 day no questions asked return policy is contingent upon insurance. Insurance easily requested and paid for on any Auction. Matt failed to do so and disqualified this transaction. >>
Per Poe's Website:
<< <i>Shipping insurance: Not offered >>
couldn't be any clearer than that - Shipping insurance: Not offered
What part of that plain english statement don't you comprehend?
“It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
Newmismatist
<< <i>
<< <i>2. Poe claimed he gives a "7 Day no questions asked return" This also is a "blatant lie".
Not so, His 7 day no questions asked return policy is contingent upon insurance. Insurance easily requested and paid for on any Auction. Matt failed to do so and disqualified this transaction. >>
Per Poe's Website:
<< <i>Shipping insurance: Not offered >>
couldn't be any clearer than that - Shipping insurance: Not offered
What part of that plain english statement don't you comprehend? >>
Are you really that ignorant? Haven't you read this before?
1) There is a "request total from the seller" button at auction end You can request final shipping costs with insurance in the resulting message box after clicking on it.
Edited to add: If you don't insure a purchase from poe on an item that should be it only because you were not intelligent enough to use the system to obtain it.
2) You have the opportunity to edit the final shipping costs on each and every auction you pay for on eBay. If you want insurance you simply add it to the shipping costs.
3) When paying with Paypal paypal also allows manual editing of the final shipping amount AND provides a message block for requesting insurance.
BAM!!! There are 3 opportunities to request and 2 opportunities to pay for insurance on an auction!
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>I always provide High resolution scans in my auctions. >>
Russ, NCNE
At the risk of beating a dead horse (hah! this one's mostly decomposed by now), why is it so crucial to link the insurance with the return policy? I have NEVER seen this anywhere else.
Yes, but the express checkout will let you buy the coin without offering the insurance. It is the path of least resistence. Most people will checkout and pay before they realize that they have not paid for insurance. It's a trap.
<< <i>I noted that also. Insurance not offered in the "shipping and payment details".
At the risk of beating a dead horse (hah! this one's mostly decomposed by now), why is it so crucial to link the insurance with the return policy? I have NEVER seen this anywhere else. >>
That is just a policy of his and Poe explained it in the email exchange Matt posted in the starting post of this thread. Has nothing to do with subversiveness at all. What appears as subversive to me is requesting insurance after an item has already shipped despite having 3 opportunites to request it prior to paying for the transaction.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>why is it so crucial to link the insurance with the return policy? I have NEVER seen this anywhere else. >>
It's on page 12 in chapter four of the "How To Be A Successful eBay Scammer" manual. It's under the section titled "Roping In The Sucker With A Convoluted Unworkable Guarantee."
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Are you really that ignorant? Haven't you read this before?....
Yes, but the express checkout will let you buy the coin without offering the insurance. It is the path of least resistence. Most people will checkout and pay before they realize that they have not paid for insurance. It's a trap. >>
Not at all, a trap would be not allowing for the insurance at all. EDITED To ADD: Expres checkout also allows you to edit the final shipping costs. In his newer listings he's now added the statement "If insurance is desired, please add the amount desired to the invoice total!" It's a start at least.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
We are nearing 300. Shot 350. But we need a new character to enter the fray. Maybe we could email the guy who negged Poe and ask him for his perspective. Otherwise, we are recycling the same trash over and over. And over.
<< <i>I noted that also. Insurance not offered in the "shipping and payment details".
At the risk of beating a dead horse (hah! this one's mostly decomposed by now), why is it so crucial to link the insurance with the return policy? I have NEVER seen this anywhere else. >>
Easy. As I stated earlier in this thread, the "return policy" is listed to get higher bids. He then rigs it to where he will not accept returns.
Also note that he claims to have 25 years experience, then goes on to state the grade "is only my opinion", then small images "that clearly show all details". In other words, I'm going to list a coin at a certain grade, but I take no responsibility for the grade I have assigned.
<< <i>Maybe we could email the guy who negged Poe and ask him for his perspective. >>
I sent that guy an email with a link to this thread a couple of days ago. He hasn't responded yet.
<< <i>
Easy. As I stated earlier in this thread, the "return policy" is listed to get higher bids. He then rigs it to where he will not accept returns.
>>
There is no rigging. That is a blatant lie.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>
<< <i>Maybe we could email the guy who negged Poe and ask him for his perspective. >>
I sent that guy an email with a link to this thread a couple of days ago. He hasn't responded yet. >>
He may not respond, He wanted a refund and keep the coin.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>
<< <i>
Easy. As I stated earlier in this thread, the "return policy" is listed to get higher bids. He then rigs it to where he will not accept returns.
>>
There is no rigging. That is a blatant lie. >>
And how would you know? Have you returned a coin to him?
You seem to be defending this power screwer to the death. Why?
<< <i>He may not respond, He want a refund and keep the coin. >>
Again, how do you know all this? You're obviously quite close to poe58 to know as many things as you seem to know. That's not a crime, but it does lead one to naturally question your objectivity. It sounds more and more like you "have a horse" in this race.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
Easy. As I stated earlier in this thread, the "return policy" is listed to get higher bids. He then rigs it to where he will not accept returns.
>>
There is no rigging. That is a blatant lie. >>
And how would you know? Have you returned a coin to him?
You seem to be defending this power screwer to the death. Why? >>
You seem to want to crucify him over one transaction, Why?
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.
<< <i>Aside from the inane attempt to keep people from buying insurance when insurance is the only way they can get a return privlege, the only thing this joker is doing is selling cleaned coins as mint state. Well heck, there are plenty of ANA Life Members doing that over at coinworld. >>
You are right, there is. But if people get around to filing complaints, the ANA will act. Ken Pines, who owns Coast to Coast Coins, was recently expelled from the ANA for failure to respond to complaints alleging that he sold cleaned AU coins as UNCs.
<< <i>You seem to want to crucify him over one transaction, Why? >>
Because he is a seller of junk, overgraded coins which he refuses to stand behind, that's why.
<< <i>
<< <i>He may not respond, He want a refund and keep the coin. >>
Again, how do you know all this? You're obviously quite close to poe58 to know as many things as you seem to know. That's not a crime, but it does lead one to naturally question your objectivity. It sounds more and more like you "have a horse" in this race. >>
No horse in this race at all. I know because he sent the email exchange to me including Paypal's denial of the claim. It was his first negative and he wanted me to know. I have been a repeat buyer of his and he sometimes emails me for advice and comments. I have given advice towards this return policy of his but he hasn't fully accepted it.
USMC Veteran 1981-1992
Cold War Veteran
It's truly funny, no make that truly sad, that people in this day and age are so wrapped up in their own little world that they refuse to try and teach someone else the correct or accepted way of doing things.