Just received email from NGC saying that they will be doing nothing special with labels or encapsulation for these Willie Wonka coins. Hopefully PCGS will soon confirm they are encapsulating the cert with a special label for the coin.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@Aspie_Rocco said: @Goldbully
Is there any noticeable difference in finish, strike, or characteristics between the directors strike and the other peace dollars?
Nothing I could find. I looked and compared to three other Peace $1's.
This could make a graded paper and coin combo that much more valuable given the PCGS requirements!
NGC the same?
This could make a graded paper and coin combo that much more valuable given the PCGS requirements!
NGC the same?
>
no for NGC, see my post above.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@fathom said:
There is no reason to switch coins except you will probably be able buy a signed card off the web and pair it with any coin.
Also you could offer a card holder a chunk of money for a card.
So I don't think the TPGs have a choice but to open the box themselves. Maintains integrity.
or one might choose to submit the card with the 70 they pick out from the lot of opened coins.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@robec said:
This is a little strange. According to tracking the Morgan package started in Coppel, TX, while the Peace package started in Memphis. On the Morgan package, delivered just minutes ago, the return address was the Memphis Fulfillment center, not Coppel, TX.
The Peace comes tomorrow.
It’s the Mint, boxes here labels there shipping labels somewhere else but still better than the shipping wheel they used in the old days. Just ask Bullsitter
" If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. " The 1st Law of Opposition from The Firesign Theater
Update for the non-subscription crowd: I just got an email saying my order shipped. This is for a normal, non-subscription order, placed on the first day of the public sales. Not too bad of a wait.
@JeffM said:
Question for the knowledgeable numismatists out there: Would these uncirculated Morgan and Peace dollars be considered burnished? As I understand it, all of the Mint’s uncirculated silver coins are made this way.
Not burnished. Those burnished coins have an extra step and has a different look.
still waiting on my Morgan’s . Hope they make it today. Most come when the daily mail comes but for some reason these are coming by way of a different postal service. New in regards to previous orders. BTW I think I will leave them unopened until I submit. Good luck everyone!
@Onastone said:
With only 200 signed certificates, they are very rare. And since they are numbered...number 1 will be practically priceless!
the certificates are rare. the coins are plentiful.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
This is a little strange. According to tracking the Morgan package started in Coppel, TX, while the Peace package started in Memphis. On the Morgan package, delivered just minutes ago, the return address was the Memphis Fulfillment center, not Coppel, TX.
The Peace comes tomorrow.
It makes sense...that's a return address on the label, so if something went wrong, they want it to go to the main shop, not necessarily where it was contracted to ship OUT of...
My Morgans from the subscription arrived today as well...haven't opened....I looked at tracking. Coppell, TX as well. What's funny is that I have relatives that live there and was imagining how quickly I would have gotten these if I were there. As it is, they had to travel ~1500+ miles to me instead of less than 5....LOL
After all the excitement of getting my signed COA, PCGS will not encapsulate and pair with the coin, because I should have sent the entire MInt sealed box in for submission. How would I know there is a signed COA inside?
I guess rules are rules, but this is a big let down.
Still, even without being slabbed by a TPG, there should still be a premium. It’s a pretty rare bird…… only 0.08% of the Peace dollars will have one.
In all seriousness, WHY?
Unless there proves to be something different and distinguishable about the 200 "pressed" by her, then the COAs can just be put with any one of the 200k+ that were issued, right? Just like Cheerios pennies (and the gold dollars initially thought). Unless PCGS opens them themselves, who's to say WHICH dollar the COA went to?
For some, I can see a bit of excitement on these, but, overall, the "1 of 200" COAs are meaningless, imho.
Now, if, for those 200, the mint had put them in a sealed environment WITH the actual coin, THEN I could see it being more reasonable and easier for PCGS.
@Onastone said:
With only 200 signed certificates, they are very rare. And since they are numbered...number 1 will be practically priceless!
Why?
They can't be traced to specific coins, they are "loose"....so, even understanding people collecting labels, with coins with them, why do you think a COA, even "#1 of xxx", would be worth much by itself (since it could belong to any of the coins?
Now, if, for those 200, the mint had put them in a sealed environment WITH the actual coin, THEN I could see it being more reasonable and easier for PCGS.
You nailed it, my friend.
I'm seeing a new marketing space for the Mint/TPG model.
@JeffM said:
Question for the knowledgeable numismatists out there: Would these uncirculated Morgan and Peace dollars be considered burnished? As I understand it, all of the Mint’s uncirculated silver coins are made this way.
Not burnished. Those burnished coins have an extra step and has a different look.
both are still available, the longer they are still available, the less profit, if they are still available after 2 weeks, then your looking at a potential loss
@Rob9874 said:
I didn't get one of the 200 signed COAs, but one of my Peaces came without a COA. Is that something?
Sounds to me like you’re a winner! Those non-COAs could be worth some money. Send the coin and no certificate to PCGS and tell them you want both graded and slabbed.
After all the excitement of getting my signed COA, PCGS will not encapsulate and pair with the coin, because I should have sent the entire MInt sealed box in for submission. How would I know there is a signed COA inside?
I guess rules are rules, but this is a big let down.
Tells us everything PCGS told you about submitting these for the "200" label
They have a firm rule that the mint sealed box is the only way they will encapsulate the COA and pair with the coin.
This is basically what they said to me........read the link.
PCGS will encapsulate that signed peace coa. Ventris personally signed a coa for me last year, and PCGS encapsulated it. Just because it’s not paired exactly with the peace dollar with a cert # on the coin label isn’t a huge deal, it’s the coa that’s valuable.
@Rockdogz said:
I excitedly opened up my boxes today without realizing about the signed COAs...instead of sending in the sealed box to PCGS. Got COA #82....sigh
If you bought a box of 25 coins, why would you send the entire box in unless you want every coin graded and slabbed?
@Rockdogz said:
I excitedly opened up my boxes today without realizing about the signed COAs...instead of sending in the sealed box to PCGS. Got COA #82....sigh
If you bought a box of 25 coins, why would you send the entire box in unless you want every coin graded and slabbed?
@Rockdogz said:
I excitedly opened up my boxes today without realizing about the signed COAs...instead of sending in the sealed box to PCGS. Got COA #82....sigh
If you bought a box of 25 coins, why would you send the entire box in unless you want every coin graded and slabbed?
@Rockdogz said:
I excitedly opened up my boxes today without realizing about the signed COAs...instead of sending in the sealed box to PCGS. Got COA #82....sigh
If you bought a box of 25 coins, why would you send the entire box in unless you want every coin graded and slabbed?
True..I only had 2 in that box though.
Congrats on the COA. You should go get a lottery ticket with that kind of luck 😀
@Rockdogz said:
I excitedly opened up my boxes today without realizing about the signed COAs...instead of sending in the sealed box to PCGS. Got COA #82....sigh
One Morgan arrived today, four Peace due tomorrow. The one Morgan will not make 70 - I'm quite sure. I agree wholeheartedly with the notion that if one wants 70s, then one should by them that way, already slabbed.
Steve Palladino - Ike Group member - DIVa (Designated Ike Varieties) Project co-lead and attributor
@Rockdogz said:
I excitedly opened up my boxes today without realizing about the signed COAs...instead of sending in the sealed box to PCGS. Got COA #82....sigh
I'm sorry...but I must comment on this basic contradiction...
TPGs will hand out First Strike labels like candy without any actual evidence that a given coin was, in fact, struck first...however they won't accept a coin with a signed COA that states that, in fact, this coin WAS struck first!
I know what everyone will likely reply,,,but absurdities like that are the reason that I never started playing the FS label game.
@RichR said:
I'm sorry...but I must comment on this basic contradiction...
TPGs will hand out First Strike labels like candy without any actual evidence that a given coin was, in fact, struck first...however they won't accept a coin with a signed COA that states that, in fact, this coin WAS struck first!
I know what everyone will likely reply,,,but absurdities like that are the reason that I never started playing the FS label game.
He can get a first strike label for his peace dollar, no problem at all. He just can’t get a specific coa number (#194) on the coin’s label.
@Rockdogz said:
I excitedly opened up my boxes today without realizing about the signed COAs...instead of sending in the sealed box to PCGS. Got COA #82....sigh
Why the "sigh"?
A couple posts above yours reports that one sold on ebay for $1200. If you are interested in making a quick killing, get it listed asap.
A couple posts above yours reports that one sold on ebay for $1200. If you are interested in making a quick killing, get it listed asap.
I would sigh too. I can’t imagine that more than a few dozen of these coins will grade with the cert from an unopened mint package and those that do will command enormous premiums.
Opened and ungraded $1,200 is a gamble for both the buyer and seller. Having a slabbed coin with an “82 of 200” label and an accompanying slabbed cert will move it into rarified air.
Granted, at the end of the day the actual coin will be no different than what most of us bought but that provenance is going to be in high demand.
@RichR said:
I'm sorry...but I must comment on this basic contradiction...
TPGs will hand out First Strike labels like candy without any actual evidence that a given coin was, in fact, struck first...however they won't accept a coin with a signed COA that states that, in fact, this coin WAS struck first!
I know what everyone will likely reply,,,but absurdities like that are the reason that I never started playing the FS label game.
1st strike is exactly as defined. You're being too literal if you read it to literally mean 1st struck. Any 1st strike coin meets the criteria and is verified as meeting the criteria. There is simply no way to verify that the COA goes with a specific coin unless the box was sealed.
After all the excitement of getting my signed COA, PCGS will not encapsulate and pair with the coin, because I should have sent the entire MInt sealed box in for submission. How would I know there is a signed COA inside?
I guess rules are rules, but this is a big let down.
"If the COA is hand-signed or serialized the coin must be in the original sealed shipping box from the Mint or it will be ineligible for pairing with a Certificate of Authenticity"
That makes it almost impossible to get the paired coin and signed COA encapsulated. Is anybody going to send in their order sight unseen? You could make a special request to only grade and encapsulate if there is a signed COA, maybe if you were also going for First Strike labeling...
I got my two boxes (3 each) yesterday. ONE of them was...badly packaged. It had a piece of clear packing tape that was, maybe, an inch over the seam on one side. I almost thought the box had been tampered with and then taped up. AND, the flap with the adhesive hadn't been used. That is, the person who packed it, didn't peel off the cover and then stick the box shut.
I'm 99% sure that someone stole my COA coin and replaced it with a regular one
Comments
Just received email from NGC saying that they will be doing nothing special with labels or encapsulation for these Willie Wonka coins. Hopefully PCGS will soon confirm they are encapsulating the cert with a special label for the coin.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Mine also. Both fulfillment center, Memphis. One has the warning tape
The tape box weighs 0.450 and the regular box 0.360 ? Que es?
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
This could make a graded paper and coin combo that much more valuable given the PCGS requirements!
NGC the same?
>
no for NGC, see my post above.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
There is no reason to switch coins except you will probably be able buy a signed card off the web and pair it with any coin.
Also you could offer a card holder a chunk of money for a card.
So I don't think the TPGs have a choice but to open the box themselves. Maintains integrity.
or one might choose to submit the card with the 70 they pick out from the lot of opened coins.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Got box 1 of 2 today. All accounted for. No card 😒
https://www.the4thcoin.com
https://www.ebay.com/str/thefourthcoin
My four boxes:
3 were wrapped in distinctly different sized bubble wrap while the fourth was very very nicely wrapped in brown craft paper!
I find it interesting that there's not military uniformity across all the shipping...just for the sake of simplicity.
It’s the Mint, boxes here labels there shipping labels somewhere else but still better than the shipping wheel they used in the old days. Just ask Bullsitter
Update for the non-subscription crowd: I just got an email saying my order shipped. This is for a normal, non-subscription order, placed on the first day of the public sales. Not too bad of a wait.
JUST got my shipping notice on the Peace dollars, Morgan's delivered 3 hours ago 🤷
Successful transactions with forum members commoncents05, dmarks, Coinscratch, Bullsitter, DCW, TwoSides2aCoin, Namvet69 (facilitated for 3rd party), Tetromibi, ProfLizMay, MASSU2, MWallace, Bruce7789, Twobitcollector, 78saen, U1chicago, Rob41281
Not burnished. Those burnished coins have an extra step and has a different look.
With only 200 signed certificates, they are very rare. And since they are numbered...number 1 will be practically priceless!
the certificates are rare. the coins are plentiful.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
“Willie Wonka”!!
Thanks for the clarity.
I could be wrong, but> @robec said:
It makes sense...that's a return address on the label, so if something went wrong, they want it to go to the main shop, not necessarily where it was contracted to ship OUT of...
My Morgans from the subscription arrived today as well...haven't opened....I looked at tracking. Coppell, TX as well. What's funny is that I have relatives that live there and was imagining how quickly I would have gotten these if I were there. As it is, they had to travel ~1500+ miles to me instead of less than 5....LOL
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
In all seriousness, WHY?
Unless there proves to be something different and distinguishable about the 200 "pressed" by her, then the COAs can just be put with any one of the 200k+ that were issued, right? Just like Cheerios pennies (and the gold dollars initially thought). Unless PCGS opens them themselves, who's to say WHICH dollar the COA went to?
For some, I can see a bit of excitement on these, but, overall, the "1 of 200" COAs are meaningless, imho.
Now, if, for those 200, the mint had put them in a sealed environment WITH the actual coin, THEN I could see it being more reasonable and easier for PCGS.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Why?
They can't be traced to specific coins, they are "loose"....so, even understanding people collecting labels, with coins with them, why do you think a COA, even "#1 of xxx", would be worth much by itself (since it could belong to any of the coins?
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
You nailed it, my friend.
I'm seeing a new marketing space for the Mint/TPG model.
Thank you!
To all of you who bought box loads of these coins, obviously you are flippers. Do you expect to make a big profit on these?
both are still available, the longer they are still available, the less profit, if they are still available after 2 weeks, then your looking at a potential loss
I didn't get one of the 200 signed COAs, but one of my Peaces came without a COA. Is that something?
Sounds to me like you’re a winner! Those non-COAs could be worth some money. Send the coin and no certificate to PCGS and tell them you want both graded and slabbed.
PCGS will encapsulate that signed peace coa. Ventris personally signed a coa for me last year, and PCGS encapsulated it. Just because it’s not paired exactly with the peace dollar with a cert # on the coin label isn’t a huge deal, it’s the coa that’s valuable.
A Peace with signed COA just sold on eBay for over $1200. If I got one, I'd be listing it today.
I made enough to make it worth my while 😎
https://www.the4thcoin.com
https://www.ebay.com/str/thefourthcoin
I excitedly opened up my boxes today without realizing about the signed COAs...instead of sending in the sealed box to PCGS. Got COA #82....sigh
If you bought a box of 25 coins, why would you send the entire box in unless you want every coin graded and slabbed?
True..I only had 2 in that box though.
2 in the box and you got a signed COA? Congrats!!
Congrats on the COA. You should go get a lottery ticket with that kind of luck 😀
I feel your pain. Got pics?
One Morgan arrived today, four Peace due tomorrow. The one Morgan will not make 70 - I'm quite sure. I agree wholeheartedly with the notion that if one wants 70s, then one should by them that way, already slabbed.
- Ike Group member
- DIVa (Designated Ike Varieties) Project co-lead and attributor
I rec'd my Morgans -
The quality is outstanding - ALL 5 well struck, sharp, and perfect (20x).
Will definitely grade top.
So have you'll checked the coins you have received, and
any feedback on the coins, and what you are planning
to do with the grading system.
THANKS .
I'm sorry...but I must comment on this basic contradiction...
TPGs will hand out First Strike labels like candy without any actual evidence that a given coin was, in fact, struck first...however they won't accept a coin with a signed COA that states that, in fact, this coin WAS struck first!
I know what everyone will likely reply,,,but absurdities like that are the reason that I never started playing the FS label game.
He can get a first strike label for his peace dollar, no problem at all. He just can’t get a specific coa number (#194) on the coin’s label.
First strike is misleading. That is why they print a disclaimer on the back of the label.
They should be called "Shipped in 30 days or Less"
Why the "sigh"?
A couple posts above yours reports that one sold on ebay for $1200. If you are interested in making a quick killing, get it listed asap.
I would sigh too. I can’t imagine that more than a few dozen of these coins will grade with the cert from an unopened mint package and those that do will command enormous premiums.
Opened and ungraded $1,200 is a gamble for both the buyer and seller. Having a slabbed coin with an “82 of 200” label and an accompanying slabbed cert will move it into rarified air.
Granted, at the end of the day the actual coin will be no different than what most of us bought but that provenance is going to be in high demand.
1st strike is exactly as defined. You're being too literal if you read it to literally mean 1st struck. Any 1st strike coin meets the criteria and is verified as meeting the criteria. There is simply no way to verify that the COA goes with a specific coin unless the box was sealed.
"If the COA is hand-signed or serialized the coin must be in the original sealed shipping box from the Mint or it will be ineligible for pairing with a Certificate of Authenticity"
That makes it almost impossible to get the paired coin and signed COA encapsulated. Is anybody going to send in their order sight unseen? You could make a special request to only grade and encapsulate if there is a signed COA, maybe if you were also going for First Strike labeling...
Didn't see either one flip this morning.
Successful transactions with forum members commoncents05, dmarks, Coinscratch, Bullsitter, DCW, TwoSides2aCoin, Namvet69 (facilitated for 3rd party), Tetromibi, ProfLizMay, MASSU2, MWallace, Bruce7789, Twobitcollector, 78saen, U1chicago, Rob41281
Didn’t notice anything. Ofcourse…
Helps to be awake 😂
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
Received my Morgan order yesterday, 7/17. Guess it takes the Pony Express a bit longer to get to the west coast.
Mine is arriving today. Originally supposed to be here yesterday.
I got my two boxes (3 each) yesterday. ONE of them was...badly packaged. It had a piece of clear packing tape that was, maybe, an inch over the seam on one side. I almost thought the box had been tampered with and then taped up. AND, the flap with the adhesive hadn't been used. That is, the person who packed it, didn't peel off the cover and then stick the box shut.
I'm 99% sure that someone stole my COA coin and replaced it with a regular one
Latest POPS report from PCGS........lots of 70's in the early going.
Comments welcomed.