@Boosibri well would you look at that! I assumed they were the same.
Did you notice the right pillar on both are a little more weakly struck? Yours has a lot less wear obviously, but I infer that the die has a weak or uneven strike. That weakness seems to show up on every version with this obverse. Those that I’ve seen so far anyway.
Here’s my example for the year. Without dot, while yours carries the Potosi dot. I wouldn’t have argued with seeing yours in a 40 holder. Nice piece!
@SimonW, yours shows (or appears to show?) a second recut 7 while mine shows a first recut 7. Die cutters seem to have trouble with that number. See appended 1770 PTS JR 05R with a first recut 7.
Also: yours looks to have two different numbers 7. The first 7 is from the 1R punch set and the second (recut) 7 is from the 1/2R punch set. Compare the shape of the bottom curl on each 7 as well as the size. Very cool coin you have there.
Here’s my example for the year. Without dot, while yours carries the Potosi dot. I wouldn’t have argued with seeing yours in a 40 holder. Nice piece!
@SimonW, yours shows (or appears to show?) a second recut 7 while mine shows a first recut 7. Die cutters seem to have trouble with that number. See appended 1770 PTS JR 05R with a first recut 7.
Also: yours looks to have two different numbers 7. The first 7 is from the 1R punch set and the second (recut) 7 is from the 1/2R punch set. Compare the shape of the bottom curl on each 7 as well as the size. Very cool coin you have there.
Cool, thanks! Yes, it appears to be recut. I noticed the different sized sevens, but it didn’t dawn on me that they might be intended for different denominations. It seems like the sevens are always different. If it was me I’d use the same punch twice, but perhaps they were forced into it because of space constraints.
Here’s my 1/2R 1770, I believe it might share the same die as yours does on the pillars side, the shield side is different. There’s a “d” with a buried stop on mine, always thought that was interesting.
Those are some beautiful pastel colors that are painted across the field of that coin, over what I think is normally considered the reverse (though I'm not 100% sure). Couple that with the coat of arms which looks as if it's being illuminated by fire, glowing with the little bursts of burnt orange and sunset yellow. That is some serious eye appeal. You got a great true view on that coin, it couldn't have been easy to capture all that coin has going on. I just seriously hope we'll get to see more of this quality imagery from the photo department going forward. Congrats on the coin / cross / Trueview
I have seen in the past a list for the rarest coins and most valuable Mexican coins ever sold, and in there is a coin of the same date and looks the same as yours but that is a MS66.
I have seen in the past a list for the rarest coins and most valuable Mexican coins ever sold, and in there is a coin of the same date and looks the same as yours but that is a MS66.
I have seen in the past a list for the rarest coins and most valuable Mexican coins ever sold, and in there is a coin of the same date and looks the same as yours but that is a MS66.
The 66+ must be a luster bomb, I've not seen it in hand but can well imagine.
The 66+ last publicly sold, as best I could tell, for the $8400 mention above at Heritage in May of '22
It had previously sold at Heritage in 2017 as an NGC 66.
One has to wonder, was it the transfer from NGC to PCGS, the upgrade from 66 to 66+, the 5 years between the two sales (I should note that I view 2022 as the peak of what was a frothy market) or was it a combination of all these things that facilitated a doubling in price. Would that price hold strong if auctioned in couple of years from now? (Say 2027 for a comparable 5 years off market). I think It would be at least close, though perhaps shy of that prior peak price.
I have seen in the past a list for the rarest coins and most valuable Mexican coins ever sold, and in there is a coin of the same date and looks the same as yours but that is a MS66.
The 66+ must be a luster bomb, I've not seen it in hand but can well imagine.
The 66+ last publicly sold, as best I could tell, for the $8400 mention above at Heritage in May of '22
It had previously sold at Heritage in 2017 as an NGC 66.
One has to wonder, was it the transfer from NGC to PCGS, the upgrade from 66 to 66+, the 5 years between the two sales (I should note that I view 2022 as the peak of what was a frothy market) or was it a combination of all these things that facilitated a doubling in price. Would that price hold strong if auctioned in couple of years from now? (Say 2027 for a comparable 5 years off market). I think It would be at least close, though perhaps shy of that prior peak price.
66+ Left <> 64 Right
Thank you all for the very kind comments!
The 2017 D Moore sale had amazing coins and the sale all around was very weak in prices realized. The Hookneck in 65 went for $27k and later it realized $96k. Very poor timing is a big factor for the 2017 price.
@Abuelo said:
Happy Thursday everyone.
Here is the new one for the week, MS66+
Simply, pristine.
Wow. Perfection
I feel bad following-up a pristine coin like that with one this beat-up, crusty and full of PVC residue. One redeeming grace is it's a new variety discovery I promise to pick up a new can of acetone tomorrow!
@Abuelo said:
Happy Thursday everyone.
Here is the new one for the week, MS66+
Simply, pristine.
Wow. Perfection
I feel bad following-up a pristine coin like that with one this beat-up, crusty and full of PVC residue. One redeeming grace is it's a new variety discovery I promise to pick up a new can of acetone tomorrow!
My OCD in action....
The acetone at a hardware store is ''100% pure'' not exactly 99.5% and 0.5 water that is 100% pure and contains no perfumes or colourants (like some acetone 100% pure at pharmacies). You can find cheap glass dishes also at most hardware stores.
Make sure you cover it with a glass or 100% metal lid (or aluminum foil will do) since some plastics (inner lids and lids) will melt due to the acetone fumes).
I would use 2 dishes one for the first bath and another for another bath. Do both sides each time. I would leave it in acetone 24 hours per side for the first bath then 3-4 hours max on the second bath. Always use fresh acetone when turning the coin over.
Wash your hands with soap and water after touching the dirty acetone. Let the old acetone evaporate outside and throw away the first dish and clean the second dish with fresh acetone.
At the end run some fresh acetone on each side of the coin. Easy to do in a new glass bowl just put a little in the bowl and rinse the coin in that then let it dry a day or 2 before putting in a mylar 2 by 2 since acetone can eat through mylar if done to soon (one hour each side is more than enough but I do 12 hours each side on a soft paper towel).
NFL: Buffalo Bills & Green Bay Packers
US Dimes: 1793-1916 (G-04 to F-12)
Latin America: Early milled 1 reales
I bought this one several years ago, but recently re-imaged it. Canada 1859 Wide 9 over 8 cent struck in coinage alignment. These were normally struck in medal alignment, except for a very, very few that the Royal Mint accidently struck in coinage alignment. PCGS has only graded two in VF, plus this one in MS-64 RB. Slab photos by Heritage.
1859/8 over-dated coins were struck using at least 15 reverse dies. I catalogued this reverse die as RD15, and any coins struck by it are very, very scarce. The few coinage-alignment 1859/8 examples I have seen were all struck by the die pair OA1 and RD15. I also have a medal alignment example struck by the same die pair. I suspect the mint staff quickly realized their error, stopped the press, and reoriented the working dies before continuing with production. Then, Die RD15 failed quite quickly after that.
Numismatic author & owner of the Uncommon Cents collections. 2011 Fred Bowman award winner, 2020 J. Douglas Ferguson award winner, & 2022 Paul Fiocca award winner.
Comments
Here we go. Happy Thursday!
Latin American Collection
@Boosibri
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
Yours is a slightly different variety with the size of the assayer “R” larger on yours.
Latin American Collection
@Boosibri well would you look at that! I assumed they were the same.
Did you notice the right pillar on both are a little more weakly struck? Yours has a lot less wear obviously, but I infer that the die has a weak or uneven strike. That weakness seems to show up on every version with this obverse. Those that I’ve seen so far anyway.
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
Just got this 1770 PTS JR 1Real back from PCGS:
New variety: errant ∙ ("stop") high between R and A of VTRA; reads VTR∙A
Really nice looking coin
Latin American Collection
Where’d you find that??? @Plus00Vltra
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
@Plus00Vltra
That’s an oddly placed stop, almost looks like an apostrophe. Have you shown it to Yonaka? Does it match up with any known die varieties?
If I recall correctly I have two similar coins with extra stops, not recorded in any reference. Both Perú. I’ll have to snap pics.
Here’s my example for the year. Without dot, while yours carries the Potosi dot. I wouldn’t have argued with seeing yours in a 40 holder. Nice piece!
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
Long ago eBay find, back when this sort of material was available on that platform. Recently crossed if from NGC to PCGS so as to burn up a voucher.
@SimonW, yours shows (or appears to show?) a second recut 7 while mine shows a first recut 7. Die cutters seem to have trouble with that number. See appended 1770 PTS JR 05R with a first recut 7.
Also: yours looks to have two different numbers 7. The first 7 is from the 1R punch set and the second (recut) 7 is from the 1/2R punch set. Compare the shape of the bottom curl on each 7 as well as the size. Very cool coin you have there.
Here's a neat little addition. See anything weird with the obverse legend?
Love how clear the underlying misspelling is.
8 Reales Madness Collection
Cool, thanks! Yes, it appears to be recut. I noticed the different sized sevens, but it didn’t dawn on me that they might be intended for different denominations. It seems like the sevens are always different. If it was me I’d use the same punch twice, but perhaps they were forced into it because of space constraints.
Here’s my 1/2R 1770, I believe it might share the same die as yours does on the pillars side, the shield side is different. There’s a “d” with a buried stop on mine, always thought that was interesting.
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
New addition that combines both a great look and a variety. 6/6 repunched digit in date.
8 Reales Madness Collection
North/South/Central American Coins The Early Edition
@pruebas Please consider coming back, your missed
Charles III Album
Charles III Portrait Set
Charles IV Album
Charles IV Portrait Set
Spanish Colonial Pillar Set
@JohnnyCache what a nice coin!
@JohnnyCache seriously impressive!
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
Beautiful coin
Latin American Collection
Latin American Collection
Those are some beautiful pastel colors that are painted across the field of that coin, over what I think is normally considered the reverse (though I'm not 100% sure). Couple that with the coat of arms which looks as if it's being illuminated by fire, glowing with the little bursts of burnt orange and sunset yellow. That is some serious eye appeal. You got a great true view on that coin, it couldn't have been easy to capture all that coin has going on. I just seriously hope we'll get to see more of this quality imagery from the photo department going forward. Congrats on the coin / cross / Trueview
Charles III Album
Charles III Portrait Set
Charles IV Album
Charles IV Portrait Set
Spanish Colonial Pillar Set
Saw that one listed. Really nice one for a scarcer early date.
Wow, what a great coin kudos for that.
I have seen in the past a list for the rarest coins and most valuable Mexican coins ever sold, and in there is a coin of the same date and looks the same as yours but that is a MS66.
I used to own it. Now 66+ I believe
Latin American Collection
This is also a great coin indeed - 66+ good for that too. Cool.
The 66+ must be a luster bomb, I've not seen it in hand but can well imagine.
The 66+ last publicly sold, as best I could tell, for the $8400 mention above at Heritage in May of '22
It had previously sold at Heritage in 2017 as an NGC 66.
One has to wonder, was it the transfer from NGC to PCGS, the upgrade from 66 to 66+, the 5 years between the two sales (I should note that I view 2022 as the peak of what was a frothy market) or was it a combination of all these things that facilitated a doubling in price. Would that price hold strong if auctioned in couple of years from now? (Say 2027 for a comparable 5 years off market). I think It would be at least close, though perhaps shy of that prior peak price.
66+ Left <> 64 Right
Thank you all for the very kind comments!
Charles III Album
Charles III Portrait Set
Charles IV Album
Charles IV Portrait Set
Spanish Colonial Pillar Set
The 2017 D Moore sale had amazing coins and the sale all around was very weak in prices realized. The Hookneck in 65 went for $27k and later it realized $96k. Very poor timing is a big factor for the 2017 price.
Latin American Collection
Happy Thursday everyone.
Here is the new one for the week, MS66+
Simply, pristine.
Wow. Perfection
I feel bad following-up a pristine coin like that with one this beat-up, crusty and full of PVC residue. One redeeming grace is it's a new variety discovery
I promise to pick up a new can of acetone tomorrow!
8 Reales Madness Collection
@TwoKopeiki not at all. A bit of everything is needed in life to be well balanced and happy! Cool discovery!
And i almost forgot this one. Finding Mexican coppers that are straight graded is exceedingly difficult.
I love the feathers on the eagle in this coin.
My OCD in action....
The acetone at a hardware store is ''100% pure'' not exactly 99.5% and 0.5 water that is 100% pure and contains no perfumes or colourants (like some acetone 100% pure at pharmacies). You can find cheap glass dishes also at most hardware stores.
Make sure you cover it with a glass or 100% metal lid (or aluminum foil will do) since some plastics (inner lids and lids) will melt due to the acetone fumes).
I would use 2 dishes one for the first bath and another for another bath. Do both sides each time. I would leave it in acetone 24 hours per side for the first bath then 3-4 hours max on the second bath. Always use fresh acetone when turning the coin over.
Wash your hands with soap and water after touching the dirty acetone. Let the old acetone evaporate outside and throw away the first dish and clean the second dish with fresh acetone.
At the end run some fresh acetone on each side of the coin. Easy to do in a new glass bowl just put a little in the bowl and rinse the coin in that then let it dry a day or 2 before putting in a mylar 2 by 2 since acetone can eat through mylar if done to soon (one hour each side is more than enough but I do 12 hours each side on a soft paper towel).
NFL: Buffalo Bills & Green Bay Packers
US Dimes: 1793-1916 (G-04 to F-12)
Latin America: Early milled 1 reales
I bought this one several years ago, but recently re-imaged it. Canada 1859 Wide 9 over 8 cent struck in coinage alignment. These were normally struck in medal alignment, except for a very, very few that the Royal Mint accidently struck in coinage alignment. PCGS has only graded two in VF, plus this one in MS-64 RB. Slab photos by Heritage.
1859/8 over-dated coins were struck using at least 15 reverse dies. I catalogued this reverse die as RD15, and any coins struck by it are very, very scarce. The few coinage-alignment 1859/8 examples I have seen were all struck by the die pair OA1 and RD15. I also have a medal alignment example struck by the same die pair. I suspect the mint staff quickly realized their error, stopped the press, and reoriented the working dies before continuing with production. Then, Die RD15 failed quite quickly after that.
http://www.victoriancent.com