Peanuts from the gallery.....It is blindingly obvious to me that a decent seller would suspend selling coins until he was able to properly handle refunds/payments and not use the bank's restrictions as an excuse. If he travels where this isn't possible, then suspend selling coins. Duh, right?
Seated Half Society member #38 "Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
joebb is a smart guy but blew it going public prematurely........unless the goal was only to generate a 100 post thread.
Whatever the circumstances, the trade partner repaid a substantial part of the amount owed and would have likely paid the remainder in pretty short order. Likely feeling scorned (misguided but there is money involved) he likely sent a reimbursement to the other party mentioned instead.
It's not huge except for those suffering the loss until it gets paid off. Tulving was a big shot and had trust employing people of integrity like Miles Standish back in their haydays, but later failed. I have had debtors claim I will get my money back if only I wait around a month as long as I call off the dogs. Excuses are the stock in trade of flim flams.
One year ago this month, I asked planonit via email if he would accept a personal check for a $20. coin he was selling on the BST.
Instead of answering yes or no, he responded with what I felt were very personal questions for such a small purchase.
Since this was a common coin that I could purchase anywhere else, not worth getting interrogated over, I told planonit to "disregard" my previous request to buy the coin.
He responded by calling me a Nigerian scammer, among other odd things.
@CoinHoarder said:
One year ago this month, I asked planonit via email if he would accept a personal check for a $20. coin he was selling on the BST.
Instead of answering yes or no, he responded with what I felt were very personal questions for such a small purchase.
Since this was a common coin that I could purchase anywhere else, not worth getting interrogated over, I told planonit to "disregard" my previous request to buy the coin.
He responded by calling me a Nigerian scammer, among other odd things.
He knows first hand , what could go wrong so he wanted to be safe
@logger7 said:
It's not huge except for those suffering the loss until it gets paid off. Tulving was a big shot and had trust employing people of integrity like Miles Standish back in their haydays, but later failed. I have had debtors claim I will get my money back if only I wait around a month as long as I call off the dogs. Excuses are the stock in trade of flim flams.
Happened to me with a top level and well-respected dealer (ANA life member, PCGS and NGC member dealer, ICTA and NSDR member). My only mistake was giving the guy more and more time to make it right. Months turned into years as the excuses and reasons piled up....and then they declared bankruptcy, sticking me with an $11K loss. Now I'm a strong proponent of going with the big stick as early as you can. Create a stink if you have to. It's your money and you have a right to be paid promptly. If a month goes by....it's time to step things up.
sellers need to take full responsibility of owning the item until proof of delivery. That responsibility does not involve the monthly payment plan on refunds. Prompt and full payment demands prompt and full refund.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
I have an 8 year old case where the perpetrator agreed with my collection agency to pay $50 a month, which is better than nothing. This doesn't even recoup my cost of lawyer and collection agency skip trace but I figure it is vital to go after fraud for others in the business/hobby.
@CoinHoarder said:
One year ago this month, I asked planonit via email if he would accept a personal check for a $20. coin he was selling on the BST.
Instead of answering yes or no, he responded with what I felt were very personal questions for such a small purchase.
Since this was a common coin that I could purchase anywhere else, not worth getting interrogated over, I told planonit to "disregard" my previous request to buy the coin.
He responded by calling me a Nigerian scammer, among other odd things.
He knows first hand , what could go wrong so he wanted to be safe
Perfect example of "the pot calling the kettle black".
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
@Coinstartled said:
joebb is a smart guy but blew it going public prematurely........unless the goal was only to generate a 100 post thread.
Whatever the circumstances, the trade partner repaid a substantial part of the amount owed and would have likely paid the remainder in pretty short order. Likely feeling scorned (misguided but there is money involved) he likely sent a reimbursement to the other party mentioned instead.
The point of this thread was simple. Since I only knew of myself and Macge waiting for a refund I should warn the rest of the coin community here to stay away. Perhaps if I waited only 3 more days both macge and myself would have been reimbursed. Its also possible we would have been reimbursed with someone else's money and more people might become sucked into a possible scam. So I made a call. Possibly lose another $3-400 and save other people or wait more time and others lose out.
He stated he would be back from whatever country he was in on Friday and sent Macge $100 while telling Macge he sent me another $900. This would make little sense as Im only owed $380. Either way I have received no new payments.
@Aspie_Rocco said:
My two cents with an outside the box thought. What scammer sends money BACK?
I was curious from the start when I read the OP had some of or most of the money returned.
Anyone who has been scammed ever... did you get any money back via simple email or phone call?
It has been a riveting thread with the accused and the accuser both posting. I'll give @planonit a nod of respect for
A. ) posting in this thread or the site after this thread release.
B. ) Sending funds to try and repay.
I'm not taking sides or defending anyone. I will say that when I was deployed abroad, or traveling, my American Banks have been or were extra cautious about transactions.
@CoinHoarder said:
One year ago this month, I asked planonit via email if he would accept a personal check for a $20. coin he was selling on the BST.
Instead of answering yes or no, he responded with what I felt were very personal questions for such a small purchase.
Since this was a common coin that I could purchase anywhere else, not worth getting interrogated over, I told planonit to "disregard" my previous request to buy the coin.
He responded by calling me a Nigerian scammer, among other odd things.
He knows first hand , what could go wrong so he wanted to be safe
Exactly.. no this thread isn't about just buyer and seller .. thread about not being scammed in BST, which affects forum members....... no matter how uncomfortable it may be for some members
Reply back in thread said it right ,why would seller continue to sell coins, when seller hadn't delivered on coins that were paid for earlier ..Nuff said..
@CoinHoarder said:
One year ago this month, I asked planonit via email if he would accept a personal check for a $20. coin he was selling on the BST.
Instead of answering yes or no, he responded with what I felt were very personal questions for such a small purchase.
Since this was a common coin that I could purchase anywhere else, not worth getting interrogated over, I told planonit to "disregard" my previous request to buy the coin.
He responded by calling me a Nigerian scammer, among other odd things.
He knows first hand , what could go wrong so he wanted to be safe
Exactly.. no this thread isn't about just buyer and seller .. thread about not being scammed in BST, which affects forum members....... no matter how uncomfortable it may be for some members
Reply back in thread said it right ,why would seller continue to sell coins, when seller hadn't delivered on coins that were paid for earlier ..Nuff said..
I see. More have details surfaced. As I said I was not taking sides. I just found it curious that money in any amount was returned. I had not heard of that before. It has been educational to say the least.
I have NEVER had dealings with any of the people involved. I have only had good positive transactions from the BST and members here.
@planonit said:
I told Mr. Baker I would not comment on this and I won't. I told him I was wrong to forget about (which he admittedly forgot as well). I was the one who realized a few weeks ago that no check was cashed. He has been very understanding.
For the few who know me: I have a long track record (on this very forum) of posting scam warnings. I pushed the police to investigate Danny Fricker in California and tried to spread the word on "James Salmeron" in Vegas. As a result I, shall we say, "P.O." a lot of scam artists on Ebay and often Craigslist. They do routinely post things about me. So what.
If you can find ONE person who claims I "scammed" them. Bring them forward. I await it. Prepare to look for a long, long time because does not exist.
Now I don't blame Mr. Baker. He has every right to be upset. I am not a dealer and as some of you know this time of year I am often in very remote areas in Africa with limited access to many of the amenities and have to do things or proxy. I won't name the the bank we use but me an Mr. Baker use the same bank which provides a P2P service. I have routinely sent payments but with limits the bank puts on and the fact I often am using the service out of country the bank can be extremely over zealous in putting limits on how much I can send.
Mr. Baker will be made whole and then some. He has every right to be upset and I honestly cannot blame him. He told me over last couple of days if I did not send him this P2P asap he would post this. I told him (as I am sure he would confirm) that is his right and I do not blame him but nothing I can do. My hands our tied at times.
So I guess I have failed in my position to not commit but I wanted this to be here. I have been on this forum for....3 years?
The only "problem" I had was last year when I sold two Dahlonega gold pieces to a member and the USPS lost it (for a couple of days) and that was 100% out of my hands and at the end of the day the coins came late from a damaged package. I had one person sell me a cleaned coin but they were very understanding about it and that has been it.
Mr. Baker will be made whole and he knows that. I feel bad that we both got busy and lost touch and again at the end of the day as the SELLER it is on me. So again people can know come out of the woodwork and say what they want: nobody has ever, ever got the short end of the stick with me. Ever.
So sorry but I am not running away to Mexico.
Oh and one last note: I do occasionally sell. I have told members on here before I am 100% happy to meet (If we are close) and I am HAPPPYYYYY to send a coin before ANY payment. Repeat: I do not demand money upfront. If you are a member on here and say "I think I want to buy what you are selling" give me an address and I will ship it.
So there. I am sure other responses will come. I will (promise) not reply to them at all.
There are a lot of really ethical, honest, and principled people in the numismatics hobby, it is a good one, but somehow the termites will find sound wood to drill into. There are a number of good options to insulate buyers from fraud, like paypal. Or have them ship stuff to you on approval, ask for verifiable references, see how that goes over, you probably won't hear from them again.
i'm not sure if you posted that for me or the readers but i will say i added it because buying from/selling to, are both probably a risky proposition of drama with one thing in common. him.
whatever it is, i sure hope he gets it worked out, for everyone's benefit.
i know, i'll add him to my prayer list. ty boston.
.
@LanceNewmanOCC said:
.
so hunter contacted me out of the blue to offer a 1796 large cent (mentioned previously?) friday about an hour before i was going to a seminar series about end times described in the Bible and also happened to be about 1 hour before the Sabbath started, at sunset, so I didn't have much time to give to the potential offering much thought, as i stated, and he seemed to be fairly cordial and pretty well spoken, albeit a bit excitable, much to my shock. even after reading this thread as it was growing and all the posts therein. figured it would come out of the gate with a bunch of drama. nope, it was saved until later.
long story short, he did end up assigning a number for his ask, in an email, we did some texting prior and a phone call. really seemed like a decent person but felt the item was not for me as i very politely and repeatedly iterated.
so the email i just read this morning as i was too tired after a good day of church service, another seminar and evangelizing and until a bit after Sabbath end saturday at sunset to read it last night, didn't get home until 10:30pm or so, saturday.
well, sometime between then and now, he apparently lost his medication bottle(s) and like a/some former posts stated, became incessant, rude and belligerent but i kept calm and figured the best way to get away, somewhat clean, was to be polite, say my little peace and be done with it. hopefully for him as well, since i asked him to not contact me again and seems, so far, to be holding up. thankfully.
i feel good that he got a chance by me, against what i felt i should do. sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
this is a doesn't. so if you do business with him, and some may do so successfully, caveat emptor and possibly venditor.
no grudge on my part but will safely steer clear.
not a fan of these types of posts but this is a rare instance that merits it.
.
...I think I got confused when I thought you referred to the coin as an "offering" right in the middle of sermon...good for you
I know eBay really discourages it members from trying to buy outside their system where there are no
checks n balances between buyers and sellers. I would never ever under any circumstances would deal with some
globe trotter who could not send me a coin on time and then try to refund me in dribs and drabs.
Caveat Emptor -- let the buyer beware, sure does apply here.
Collector of Buffalo Nickels and other 20th century United States Coinage a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
It has been another 8 days since this thread began and hunter came on to defend himself as being a moral character.
I have still not received any new payment or word that payment is coming. For those who believed hunters response earlier was sincere and that he would come through- I would say his inability to complete this and complete lack of communication should be enough of a warning
It would certainly appear at this point that Hunter decided that his reputation could be sold for a few hundred dollars. The problem with that is that he can't buy it back, ever, at any price. Maybe he and Shane Canup and Dickie Betz can become trading partners.
Thank you for posting this, you have done your civic duty and should be commended. In past threads I have heard every excuse under the sun trying to defend why a seller might or might have not done something.
"right is right and wrong is wrong"
Successful coin BST transactions with Gerard and segoja.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
@coindeuce said:
It would certainly appear at this point that Hunter decided that his reputation could be sold for a few hundred dollars. The problem with that is that he can't buy it back, ever, at any price. Maybe he and Shane Canup and Dickie Betz can become trading partners.
Dickie Betz? From the Allman brothers, love that guy what did he do?
I have done a few transactions with joebb21. He has always been great to work with. Very sorry to hear someone is stringing him along. No excuses for sellers actions. Its a shame other forum members would say he Joe doesnt have patience. Bet they would be singing a different tune if it were their money.
@coindeuce said:
It would certainly appear at this point that Hunter decided that his reputation could be sold for a few hundred dollars. The problem with that is that he can't buy it back, ever, at any price. Maybe he and Shane Canup and Dickie Betz can become trading partners.
Dickie Betz? From the Allman brothers, love that guy what did he do?
The moral compass of some people is woeful.
You have the power of the pen and legal recourse at your disposal. Please, and all other shafted.....USE IT!
"Just because you were born on 3rd base doesn't mean you hit a triple"
@coindeuce said:
It would certainly appear at this point that Hunter decided that his reputation could be sold for a few hundred dollars. The problem with that is that he can't buy it back, ever, at any price. Maybe he and Shane Canup and Dickie Betz can become trading partners.
Hunter a lost cause .. someone else will come around to scam him too .. so much for working in Africa .. maybe that was NY
Comments
Peanuts from the gallery.....It is blindingly obvious to me that a decent seller would suspend selling coins until he was able to properly handle refunds/payments and not use the bank's restrictions as an excuse. If he travels where this isn't possible, then suspend selling coins. Duh, right?
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
So the more patient of the two debtors receives a payment.....
And, unlike 99% of the people commenting in this thread, he is one of the few that has a right to comment about it.
Glicker - you weren't impacted, so you should put away your rope and let the adults that were affected handle it and update as they want.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
joebb is a smart guy but blew it going public prematurely........unless the goal was only to generate a 100 post thread.
Whatever the circumstances, the trade partner repaid a substantial part of the amount owed and would have likely paid the remainder in pretty short order. Likely feeling scorned (misguided but there is money involved) he likely sent a reimbursement to the other party mentioned instead.
It's not huge except for those suffering the loss until it gets paid off. Tulving was a big shot and had trust employing people of integrity like Miles Standish back in their haydays, but later failed. I have had debtors claim I will get my money back if only I wait around a month as long as I call off the dogs. Excuses are the stock in trade of flim flams.
And a $1785 hit is way worse than a $380 hit.
I am not condoning the counterparty but refunding 80% of the money originally tendered is not the footprint of a Bernie Madoff.
Unless I am misreading something, there is only one debtor in this thread.
Yes, one debtor and two creditors.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
This is more interesting than a Shane Canup thread <sarc. off>
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
I take joebb21 as a man of his word and believe what he says without question.
I would contact the local police department in Hunter's home town and follow with with IC3.
Recently I exchanged emails with Hunter Smith, his dirty mouth told me all I needed to know. Run Forest Run!!!
One year ago this month, I asked planonit via email if he would accept a personal check for a $20. coin he was selling on the BST.
Instead of answering yes or no, he responded with what I felt were very personal questions for such a small purchase.
Since this was a common coin that I could purchase anywhere else, not worth getting interrogated over, I told planonit to "disregard" my previous request to buy the coin.
He responded by calling me a Nigerian scammer, among other odd things.
hmmmmm the plot has taken a much more serious turn
He knows first hand , what could go wrong so he wanted to be safe
Happened to me with a top level and well-respected dealer (ANA life member, PCGS and NGC member dealer, ICTA and NSDR member). My only mistake was giving the guy more and more time to make it right. Months turned into years as the excuses and reasons piled up....and then they declared bankruptcy, sticking me with an $11K loss. Now I'm a strong proponent of going with the big stick as early as you can. Create a stink if you have to. It's your money and you have a right to be paid promptly. If a month goes by....it's time to step things up.
sellers need to take full responsibility of owning the item until proof of delivery. That responsibility does not involve the monthly payment plan on refunds. Prompt and full payment demands prompt and full refund.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
I have an 8 year old case where the perpetrator agreed with my collection agency to pay $50 a month, which is better than nothing. This doesn't even recoup my cost of lawyer and collection agency skip trace but I figure it is vital to go after fraud for others in the business/hobby.
Correct. > @TopographicOceans said:
Do any of the police contacts work out??
I liked the days of the honor system where people were honest.
100% Positive BST transactions
Perfect example of "the pot calling the kettle black".
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
I'm surprised no one has linked to planonit's recent thread: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/comment/11660376#
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
I'm 2 business days away from the pitchfork and torches crowd
Incidents of busted deals go back to the earliest days of the forum.
The point of this thread was simple. Since I only knew of myself and Macge waiting for a refund I should warn the rest of the coin community here to stay away. Perhaps if I waited only 3 more days both macge and myself would have been reimbursed. Its also possible we would have been reimbursed with someone else's money and more people might become sucked into a possible scam. So I made a call. Possibly lose another $3-400 and save other people or wait more time and others lose out.
He stated he would be back from whatever country he was in on Friday and sent Macge $100 while telling Macge he sent me another $900. This would make little sense as Im only owed $380. Either way I have received no new payments.
Makes sense, joebb21. Hope that you guys are made whole.
Exactly.. no this thread isn't about just buyer and seller .. thread about not being scammed in BST, which affects forum members....... no matter how uncomfortable it may be for some members
Reply back in thread said it right ,why would seller continue to sell coins, when seller hadn't delivered on coins that were paid for earlier ..Nuff said..
I see. More have details surfaced. As I said I was not taking sides. I just found it curious that money in any amount was returned. I had not heard of that before. It has been educational to say the least.
I have NEVER had dealings with any of the people involved. I have only had good positive transactions from the BST and members here.
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
Theft of funds and non return of those funds....
what would you call this ?
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !
New Barber Purchases
Fraud
Bullspit
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
Bring back the Circle of Trust™
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
If I owed someone money, I would be as polite as polite can be.
.
Venditor = The seller
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
There are a lot of really ethical, honest, and principled people in the numismatics hobby, it is a good one, but somehow the termites will find sound wood to drill into. There are a number of good options to insulate buyers from fraud, like paypal. Or have them ship stuff to you on approval, ask for verifiable references, see how that goes over, you probably won't hear from them again.
i'm not sure if you posted that for me or the readers but i will say i added it because buying from/selling to, are both probably a risky proposition of drama with one thing in common. him.
whatever it is, i sure hope he gets it worked out, for everyone's benefit.
i know, i'll add him to my prayer list. ty boston.
.
No faster way to hell than stealing from a preacherman, like grandpa used to say.
...I think I got confused when I thought you referred to the coin as an "offering" right in the middle of sermon...good for you
I know eBay really discourages it members from trying to buy outside their system where there are no
checks n balances between buyers and sellers. I would never ever under any circumstances would deal with some
globe trotter who could not send me a coin on time and then try to refund me in dribs and drabs.
Caveat Emptor -- let the buyer beware, sure does apply here.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
It has been another 8 days since this thread began and hunter came on to defend himself as being a moral character.
I have still not received any new payment or word that payment is coming. For those who believed hunters response earlier was sincere and that he would come through- I would say his inability to complete this and complete lack of communication should be enough of a warning
It would certainly appear at this point that Hunter decided that his reputation could be sold for a few hundred dollars. The problem with that is that he can't buy it back, ever, at any price. Maybe he and Shane Canup and Dickie Betz can become trading partners.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
Joe,
Thank you for posting this, you have done your civic duty and should be commended. In past threads I have heard every excuse under the sun trying to defend why a seller might or might have not done something.
"right is right and wrong is wrong"
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
Dickie Betz? From the Allman brothers, love that guy what did he do?
If you've actually been here for 6 years you should know about that scammer too.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
I have done a few transactions with joebb21. He has always been great to work with. Very sorry to hear someone is stringing him along. No excuses for sellers actions. Its a shame other forum members would say he Joe doesnt have patience. Bet they would be singing a different tune if it were their money.
Allmans were very good a generation or two ago.
I am done giving this guy breaks until all money is confirmed received by both people.
persona non businessa
Best of luck to all HONEST people involved, I hope it works out but time and waiting are not good JMO
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
The moral compass of some people is woeful.
You have the power of the pen and legal recourse at your disposal. Please, and all other shafted.....USE IT!
"Just because you were born on 3rd base doesn't mean you hit a triple"
Hunter a lost cause .. someone else will come around to scam him too .. so much for working in Africa .. maybe that was NY