I picked up a raw 1911 BQ last summer and sent it in for grading at PCGS. It finally arrived back yesterday:
I have two different TrueView images for this coin- likely rare. When the submission came back in early December the holder wasn't sealed- I had to send it back to PCGS for re-holdering. They shot another image. Interesting how they vary.
@JeffMTampa said:
I picked up a raw 1911 BQ last summer and sent it in for grading at PCGS. It finally arrived...
I have two different TrueView images for this coin- likely rare. When the submission came back in early December the holder wasn't sealed- I had to send it back to PCGS for re-holdering. They shot another image. Interesting how they vary.
That is very interesting! Shows there is variability in their image-taking processes. Did you get the same PCGS#? Did there end up being any damage to the coin with what you went through?
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
The '96-O will not be available for my images... however, (finally, after much wrangling) this coin will be imaged. I have a new XF45 PCGS-holdered 1899-O Barber Quarter.
Tim
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
These two coins never did make it all the way back in a return trip from our hosts. Unfortunately lost in the shipping journey. This never happened to me before. My last bid farewell here:
VF30...
AU58...
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
@JeffMTampa said:
I picked up a raw 1911 BQ last summer and sent it in for grading at PCGS. It finally arrived...
I have two different TrueView images for this coin- likely rare. When the submission came back in early December the holder wasn't sealed- I had to send it back to PCGS for re-holdering. They shot another image. Interesting how they vary.
That is very interesting! Shows there is variability in their image-taking processes. Did you get the same PCGS#? Did there end up being any damage to the coin with what you went through?
Tim- same number on the slab. I don't know why they took another photo, likely procedure. I don't believe the coins received any noticeable damage, even though they were banging around in the box during shipment. They had the rubber collars on; I guess rubbers offer good protection.
@sedulous said:
These two coins never did make it all the way back in a return trip from our hosts. Unfortunately lost in the shipping journey. This never happened to me before. My last bid farewell here:
Wow- were just the 2 coins shipped and the entire shipment went missing? Does PCGS pay based on your declared value?
@sedulous said:
These two coins never did make it all the way back in a return trip from our hosts. Unfortunately lost in the shipping journey. This never happened to me before. My last bid farewell here:
Wow- were just the 2 coins shipped and the entire shipment went missing? Does PCGS pay based on your declared value?
Yes, They reimburse the value at grade via a payment or check. They also returned grading fee costs to my cc.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
@sedulous said:
These two coins never did make it all the way back in a return trip from our hosts. Unfortunately lost in the shipping journey. This never happened to me before. My last bid farewell here:
Wow- were just the 2 coins shipped and the entire shipment went missing? Does PCGS pay based on your declared value?
Yes, They reimburse the value at grade via a payment or check. They also returned grading fee costs to my cc.
You wonder what happens to these "lost" (stolen) coins. Does the thief know to crack the coins out of the holder, or do they try to sell them as-is? If the coins show up in the PCGS Registry later, I wonder if they have a mechanism to try and recover them.
Here's my 1898 Barber Dime in AU 58. I found it raw and submitted it to PCGS for grading. I don't have CAC submission privileges, so no Green Bean.
It looks like an original nice coin to me, but because it's not been to CAC it's become almost unmarketable. I guess people now buy the bean, not the holder or the coin. What's next?
@JeffMTampa said:
You wonder what happens to these "lost" (stolen) coins. Does the thief know to crack the coins out of the holder, or do they try to sell them as-is? If the coins show up in the PCGS Registry later, I wonder if they have a mechanism to try and recover them.
I have them sticking in my Registry. If someone ends up wanting to add the coins to theirs, I will have to release them and waw'la, I've found my stolen coins.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
@JeffMTampa "It looks like an original nice coin to me, but because it's not been to CAC it's become almost unmarketable. I guess people now buy the bean, not the holder or the coin. What's next?"
People only want the bean now. I will give you an example. I have, what I believe to be, a CAC-worthy (never sent in) 1910-D Barber Quarter in XF45 PCGS (StacksBowers 12/13/2017). Hammer $85 with $20 BP or $105):
Now, I have a 1910-D Barber Quarter XF45 PCGS with CAC Green Sticker that hammered at $400. tonight ($465 all in). The following are GC's pictures:
This should give you an idea of the value of a CAC sticker... like it or not. I'm into this new quarter for the farther right mintmark.
T
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
That's a real nice one Tim! Are you planning on keeping your '10 D now that you upgraded to that gorgeous one w/CAC the other night?
Here's one I just got from the PO box today:
@JeffMTampa said:
You wonder what happens to these "lost" (stolen) coins. Does the thief know to crack the coins out of the holder, or do they try to sell them as-is? If the coins show up in the PCGS Registry later, I wonder if they have a mechanism to try and recover them.
I had some coins stolen. Years later, when someone tried to register them in their registry, PCGS said I needed to have law enforcement contact them because they couldnt release info to me about who tried to register them. Despite many attempts, I never could get local law enforcement in Texas to contact PCGS to follow up on them.
@JeffMTampa said:
You wonder what happens to these "lost" (stolen) coins. Does the thief know to crack the coins out of the holder, or do they try to sell them as-is? If the coins show up in the PCGS Registry later, I wonder if they have a mechanism to try and recover them.
I have them sticking in my Registry. If someone ends up wanting to add the coins to theirs, I will have to release them and waw'la, I've found my stolen coins.
Good luck, I hope that works for you. My experience trying that route was not positive.
Once someone has the coin, they can simply send PCGS a picture of the front and back and PCGS will release it from your registry for them, regardless of if you release it. If insurance paid you, technically you also no longer own the coin, the insurance company does. PCGS will not tell you who tried to register them, they'll want a subpoena for that. The police can't investigate based on your complaint, because you're no longer the owner, you'll have to get the insurance company involved, and they are likely to say the $ amount isnt worth the effort.
I hope if they ever turn up you get better results than I did.
Here is my 1899-O XF45 Barber Quarter from APMEX. ... and no, there is nothing going on with the mintmark. Just a lack of toning that looks like an RPM from a distance.
EDIT: Here is a close-up of the mintmark with an additional image taken:
Tim
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Here's a new one for me that arrived in the mail yesterday, an 1899 S BQ in an ICG AU 58 holder:
Hard to say if this will make it into a PCGS AU 58 holder (or if I'll bother submitting it), but I think it's a nice coin no matter. What attracted me to the coin is what was written on the ICG slab- RPD:
The last "9" in the date is nicely re-punched. This is not a variety recognized by PCGS or NGC, but it's a known variety. In Kevin Flynn's book "The Authoritative Reference on Barber Quarter" he credits Jack Beymer with the discovery and lists it as RPD-001 in his book.
Tim- that's a nice strike for a New Orleans coin. Does anyone know why the toning tends to pull away from the bottom of the digits in the date? It's very common- there must be a reason....
The pullaway effect is often seen on NT Morgans at the stars and date. It appears as an untoned "shadow" on the outer side (the rim side) of some of these raised devices near the rim. It is the result of the extreme metal flow during striking. The metal flow lines progress radially outward. My theory is that in some of these areas, on the radially outward side of the raised devices (stars or date digits) near the rim, the flow is great enough to cause metallurgical chages at the surface - either different microcrystalline structure due to work hardening, or perhaps some thin coating of surface oxidation due to the metal heating up from stress/flow, and the locally hot surface therefore being a bit reactive off the dies. This creates a very local area of surface protection, an area less able to tone. In any case, what we see is that if the coin is then subjected to a long, slow natural toning process, these affected areas do not tone, creating an untoned halo or shadow, usually on the rim side of the stars/digits.
The coin was purchased from eBay. The sellers' photos were pretty good; I could faintly see that there was doubling on some of the obverse lettering. I've been looking for the PCGS recognized DDO variety, so I purchased the coin.
Upon receipt and photographing it, I came to the conclusion that the coin is a TDO (three punches).
I looked in Kevin Flynn's book, and he has identified 11 different DDO! I tried to match my new one to any of his published and I don't believe any of them match. One die marker for my coin is a die chip at the lower tip of the "E" in "WE" on the OBV. I don't see that on any of the other DDO's listed. Since die chips occur with die use, it's possible that mine is a later die state of a previously documented variety (but I don't believe that's the case).
Through 1892 the dies were made from a screw press with the Hub. Hydraulic presses were used starting in 1893. Is that perhaps a reason for so many different DDO and DDR Barber Quarter dies? Or was it just sloppy workmanship?
@sedulous said:
Here is one I am seeing go up in value a lot recently. I plan to keep it in this holder for now but what do you think it would cross at?
I would guess PCGS would cross it as a 40. I'd be curious to see what CAC would do with it?
@sedulous said:
NEWP from my graduated YN as he tries to better position his collection to lesser-toned coins:
Tim
Dimeman would like to report he has found a farther left shifted mintmark position for the '14-D dime. In my stash, I personally don't have a MM placement this far over. Nice find! The following coin sits in a PCGS MS60 holder. (rare in a 60 holder?) Provenance is Northeast Coin and their pics:
T
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Here is an XF45 CAC newp with a 1910-D date-mint. I also have refreshed pictures of my current 1910-D PC45. Notice the 'D' mintmark placement differences:
1910-D Barber Quarter XF45 CAC MM close to 'D' and more right.
1910-D Barber Quarter XF45 MM close to 'R' and more left.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
A few weeks ago, I posted a new find, an 1899 BQ in an NGC AU 55 holder. It had a RPD and there was a distinctive die chip on the reverse that let me identify it. I knew of the die chip marker as I had taken photos of Dave Earp's BQ with the same variety. Here's mine:
Both the 8 and last 9 are re-punched in the date. You can see the die chip on the reverse at the right tip of the eagle's wing.
Browsing on eBay recently I saw another 1899 BQ with the same die chip on the reverse. The listing photos were not of high enough quality to see if the date was re-punched. The coin was in an NGC AU 58 holder; I decided to purchase it. Upon examination, the reverse die chip looked the same as the previous coin, and the date was a RPD, but not the same:
This one has the 8 and first 9 re-punched in the date. Inside the loop of the second 9 one can see a "mess". It's possible that digit was re-punched as well, but hard to tell.
There seem to be a lot of 1899 Philadelphia Quarters with re-punched dates; does anyone else have something to show?
Comments
Looks nice! Post your photo next week so we can see what it really looks like.
I picked up a raw 1911 BQ last summer and sent it in for grading at PCGS. It finally arrived back yesterday:
I have two different TrueView images for this coin- likely rare. When the submission came back in early December the holder wasn't sealed- I had to send it back to PCGS for re-holdering. They shot another image. Interesting how they vary.
That is very interesting! Shows there is variability in their image-taking processes. Did you get the same PCGS#? Did there end up being any damage to the coin with what you went through?
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
The '96-O will not be available for my images... however, (finally, after much wrangling) this coin will be imaged. I have a new XF45 PCGS-holdered 1899-O Barber Quarter.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
These two coins never did make it all the way back in a return trip from our hosts. Unfortunately lost in the shipping journey. This never happened to me before. My last bid farewell here:
VF30...
AU58...
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Tim- same number on the slab. I don't know why they took another photo, likely procedure. I don't believe the coins received any noticeable damage, even though they were banging around in the box during shipment. They had the rubber collars on; I guess rubbers offer good protection.
Wow- were just the 2 coins shipped and the entire shipment went missing? Does PCGS pay based on your declared value?
Yes, They reimburse the value at grade via a payment or check. They also returned grading fee costs to my cc.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
You wonder what happens to these "lost" (stolen) coins. Does the thief know to crack the coins out of the holder, or do they try to sell them as-is? If the coins show up in the PCGS Registry later, I wonder if they have a mechanism to try and recover them.
Here's a nice 98 dime in PC 58 CAC. Not so common!
Nice Barber Lenny!
Here's my 1898 Barber Dime in AU 58. I found it raw and submitted it to PCGS for grading. I don't have CAC submission privileges, so no Green Bean.
It looks like an original nice coin to me, but because it's not been to CAC it's become almost unmarketable. I guess people now buy the bean, not the holder or the coin. What's next?
Less grading fees- more coins.
Newp.
This is the second Barber half that I own, that has a PL appearance.
So hard to capture on the phone.
I have them sticking in my Registry. If someone ends up wanting to add the coins to theirs, I will have to release them and waw'la, I've found my stolen coins.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
@JeffMTampa "It looks like an original nice coin to me, but because it's not been to CAC it's become almost unmarketable. I guess people now buy the bean, not the holder or the coin. What's next?"
People only want the bean now. I will give you an example. I have, what I believe to be, a CAC-worthy (never sent in) 1910-D Barber Quarter in XF45 PCGS (StacksBowers 12/13/2017). Hammer $85 with $20 BP or $105):
Now, I have a 1910-D Barber Quarter XF45 PCGS with CAC Green Sticker that hammered at $400. tonight ($465 all in). The following are GC's pictures:
This should give you an idea of the value of a CAC sticker... like it or not. I'm into this new quarter for the farther right mintmark.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Another pair of AU-58 CAC dimes....
I guess I don't understand the marketplace. I'll stick to collecting coins, not opinions.
Newp from the 2nd week in December. Just added this to my Set #1 XF Registry:
Consolation prize from the PC58.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
That's a real nice one Tim! Are you planning on keeping your '10 D now that you upgraded to that gorgeous one w/CAC the other night?
Here's one I just got from the PO box today:
I had some coins stolen. Years later, when someone tried to register them in their registry, PCGS said I needed to have law enforcement contact them because they couldnt release info to me about who tried to register them. Despite many attempts, I never could get local law enforcement in Texas to contact PCGS to follow up on them.
Good luck, I hope that works for you. My experience trying that route was not positive.
Once someone has the coin, they can simply send PCGS a picture of the front and back and PCGS will release it from your registry for them, regardless of if you release it. If insurance paid you, technically you also no longer own the coin, the insurance company does. PCGS will not tell you who tried to register them, they'll want a subpoena for that. The police can't investigate based on your complaint, because you're no longer the owner, you'll have to get the insurance company involved, and they are likely to say the $ amount isnt worth the effort.
I hope if they ever turn up you get better results than I did.
A couple more "unmarketable" PCGS 58 dimes (LOL)
@paesan "unmarketable" is that sort of like "impossible"? A real salesman doesn't know the meaning of the word.
@jedm Jed, "That's a real nice one Tim! Are you planning on keeping your '10 D now that you upgraded to that gorgeous one w/CAC the other night?"
Answer? No. Two different mintmark placements as the reason.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
A few beauties:
@Eldorado9 Wowzers!
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Another new arrival. My images. AU58 NGC 1902-P Half Dollar:
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Here is my 1899-O XF45 Barber Quarter from APMEX. ... and no, there is nothing going on with the mintmark. Just a lack of toning that looks like an RPM from a distance.
EDIT: Here is a close-up of the mintmark with an additional image taken:
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Nice new pickups, Tim!
Here's a new one for me that arrived in the mail yesterday, an 1899 S BQ in an ICG AU 58 holder:
Hard to say if this will make it into a PCGS AU 58 holder (or if I'll bother submitting it), but I think it's a nice coin no matter. What attracted me to the coin is what was written on the ICG slab- RPD:
The last "9" in the date is nicely re-punched. This is not a variety recognized by PCGS or NGC, but it's a known variety. In Kevin Flynn's book "The Authoritative Reference on Barber Quarter" he credits Jack Beymer with the discovery and lists it as RPD-001 in his book.
@JeffMTampa Jeff, Sweet! my favorite date-mint of the series. Low mintage comparable to the '09-O! The coin looks really nice!
Here is another pick-up for me in AU... an 1892-O Barber Quarter in PC55:
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Tim- that's a nice strike for a New Orleans coin. Does anyone know why the toning tends to pull away from the bottom of the digits in the date? It's very common- there must be a reason....
I think what we're seeing here is "pullaway toning".
The following is from a thread on this phenomenon and is by @Sunnywood
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/comment/10955083/#Comment_10955083
The pullaway effect is often seen on NT Morgans at the stars and date. It appears as an untoned "shadow" on the outer side (the rim side) of some of these raised devices near the rim. It is the result of the extreme metal flow during striking. The metal flow lines progress radially outward. My theory is that in some of these areas, on the radially outward side of the raised devices (stars or date digits) near the rim, the flow is great enough to cause metallurgical chages at the surface - either different microcrystalline structure due to work hardening, or perhaps some thin coating of surface oxidation due to the metal heating up from stress/flow, and the locally hot surface therefore being a bit reactive off the dies. This creates a very local area of surface protection, an area less able to tone. In any case, what we see is that if the coin is then subjected to a long, slow natural toning process, these affected areas do not tone, creating an untoned halo or shadow, usually on the rim side of the stars/digits.
Thanks for the information!
Here's another new pickup, a raw MS 1892 BQ:
The coin was purchased from eBay. The sellers' photos were pretty good; I could faintly see that there was doubling on some of the obverse lettering. I've been looking for the PCGS recognized DDO variety, so I purchased the coin.
Upon receipt and photographing it, I came to the conclusion that the coin is a TDO (three punches).
I looked in Kevin Flynn's book, and he has identified 11 different DDO! I tried to match my new one to any of his published and I don't believe any of them match. One die marker for my coin is a die chip at the lower tip of the "E" in "WE" on the OBV. I don't see that on any of the other DDO's listed. Since die chips occur with die use, it's possible that mine is a later die state of a previously documented variety (but I don't believe that's the case).
Through 1892 the dies were made from a screw press with the Hub. Hydraulic presses were used starting in 1893. Is that perhaps a reason for so many different DDO and DDR Barber Quarter dies? Or was it just sloppy workmanship?
This beauty just went to an old forum member...PCGS AU-58 CAC...
NEWP from my graduated YN as he tries to better position his collection to lesser-toned coins:
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Here is one I am seeing go up in value a lot recently. I plan to keep it in this holder for now but what do you think it would cross at?
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
@JeffMTampa I really like the quarter you have here Jeff, phenomenal look to it! Congratulations!
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
I would guess PCGS would cross it as a 40. I'd be curious to see what CAC would do with it?
Dimeman would like to report he has found a farther left shifted mintmark position for the '14-D dime. In my stash, I personally don't have a MM placement this far over. Nice find! The following coin sits in a PCGS MS60 holder. (rare in a 60 holder?) Provenance is Northeast Coin and their pics:
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
Here is an XF45 CAC newp with a 1910-D date-mint. I also have refreshed pictures of my current 1910-D PC45. Notice the 'D' mintmark placement differences:
1910-D Barber Quarter XF45 CAC MM close to 'D' and more right.
1910-D Barber Quarter XF45 MM close to 'R' and more left.
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
PCGS XF-45 and recently CAC'd....
Another CAC 97-S dime, this one is PC-40...
An 1897-S in XF for comparison. A close-up of the mintmark as well... XF45 NGC:
Another 1897-S Barber dime...
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
A few weeks ago, I posted a new find, an 1899 BQ in an NGC AU 55 holder. It had a RPD and there was a distinctive die chip on the reverse that let me identify it. I knew of the die chip marker as I had taken photos of Dave Earp's BQ with the same variety. Here's mine:
Both the 8 and last 9 are re-punched in the date. You can see the die chip on the reverse at the right tip of the eagle's wing.
Browsing on eBay recently I saw another 1899 BQ with the same die chip on the reverse. The listing photos were not of high enough quality to see if the date was re-punched. The coin was in an NGC AU 58 holder; I decided to purchase it. Upon examination, the reverse die chip looked the same as the previous coin, and the date was a RPD, but not the same:
This one has the 8 and first 9 re-punched in the date. Inside the loop of the second 9 one can see a "mess". It's possible that digit was re-punched as well, but hard to tell.
There seem to be a lot of 1899 Philadelphia Quarters with re-punched dates; does anyone else have something to show?
PCGS MS-64...Pix courtesy Barberkeys...
My 1906-O Barber Quarter in PC58... checkout the MPD below the date in the dentils area, what do you see?
I see the top of an 0 and a 6.
Other than the MPD close-up, here is the full obv and rev I have shared before:
A Barber Quartet is made up of Nickels, Dimes, Quarters, and Halves.
PCGS AU-55.....
Picked this up just because I didn't have a Barber dime, and I liked the look, and I'm a sucker for Trueviews. PCGS AU55.