How about TE's on the Senior list. I would include Jerry Smith at a minimum.
Also, I really think the Jason Taylor should be on the modern HOF list. I am biased because I'm a Dolphins fan, but he is dominating, had a AFC Defensive Player of the Year under his belt and is a 5 time pro bowl selection. Also, how about Richmond Webb? He went to 7 straight pro bowls, is a member of the 1990's team of the decade, Dolphins Hall of Fame and started on a line that led the league in least sacks given up for several years (I don't know how many off the top of my head). I think he should be strongly considered.
Regards,
Greg M.
Collecting vintage auto'd fb cards and Dan Marino cards!!
What do you think about the price of the PSA 8 Tony Canadeo rc that ended Wed night for $1525??!! The price seems ridiculous in my opinion (considering I bought my PSA 8 Otto Graham and PSA 8 Elroy Hirsch for $500 less over the past year) and the card is a weak PSA 8 in my opinion. I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts including Jason's stats of how much the card normally sells for.
Regards,
Greg M.
Collecting vintage auto'd fb cards and Dan Marino cards!!
One more question for everyone. Does anyone want to venture a guess as to why the MLB HOF rookie set is not as popular as the NFL HOF rookie set? I couldn't find a post on the MLB rookie set and there doesn't seem to be a community to the extent that exists for the NFL rookie set. Just curious.
Regards,
Greg M.
Collecting vintage auto'd fb cards and Dan Marino cards!!
<< <i>I have to add Louis Wright CB from Denver and Remove Dick Anderson.
I also have to add Jim Bakken to the list. The guy is on two all Decade Teams. I know I will get flack for Bakken >>
Louis Wright is an excellent choice...But he is still a modern candidate for the next 4 HOF elections..I don't see him getting in as a modern guy, but its possible he could get a push one day as a Senior...Keep him in mind 4 years from now..
I will add Bakken to the list. Based on the fact it is TOUGH for kicker/punters to get in the HOF to begin with, I can't see the Senior committee putting a Kicker in...FYI, Bakken hasn't even been a Senior Nominee in the last 3 years..The only Special Teamer on any Senior list lately was Tommy Davis..A Punter from back in the 50s/60s...
I'll add him to the list with your vote though..I mean I already have his card for the 60's Team of the Decade, but I still can't vote for him..
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I can think of many more who could at least be considered, although I don't know if there's a cutoff for certain years with modern/seniors. I'm familiar with all of these guys. Obviously some of them aren't in the Hall yet because they maybe don't belong there.
Off the top of my head including AFL and not listed on your above list Jason:
QB:
Brodie Gabriel Simms Ken Anderson Stabler
RB:
Paul Lowe Clem Daniels William Andrews Chuck Foreman Don Perkins, 6 pro bowls in 8 years! Alan Ameche 'Deacon' Dan Towler
WR:
Max McGee Ken Kavanaugh, 1940's Bears end Lavie Dilweg, 1920's & '30's Packers end Jim Benton, 1940's Cleveland end Drew Pearson Billy Howton Gino Cappelletti, leading scorer in AFL history Cliff Branch Gary Collins
TE:
Jerry Smith, Redskins Bob Tucker, Giants Lionel Taylor, Broncos 1960's
OL:
Grady Alderman Dick Schafrath Gale Gillingham Len Hauss Jeff Van Note George Kunz, 8 pro bowls Ray Wietecha Jim Ray Smith Ralph Neely Bucko Kilroy
DL:
Cedric Hardman Fred Dean Bill Stanfill
LB:
Robert Brazile Bill Bergey Randy Gradishar Mike Stratton, 1960's Bills Isiah Robertson
DB's:
Bob Boyd Bobby Dillion Jake Scott Erich Barnes Jimmy Patton Dave Grayson
K/P:
Jim Bakken Jerrel Wilson Happy Feller
Just seeing if you were paying attention.
Not sure if any of these guys would qualify for consideration, just merely throwing out additional players to maybe consider that are not on Jason's fine list of candidates.
maybe a little more info like you did for feathers would help some of us that dont have the insight that you have.
jay >>
Who do you want to know about???It would take a week to do a write up on all 50...lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
How about TE's on the Senior list. I would include Jerry Smith at a minimum.
Also, I really think the Jason Taylor should be on the modern HOF list. I am biased because I'm a Dolphins fan, but he is dominating, had a AFC Defensive Player of the Year under his belt and is a 5 time pro bowl selection. Also, how about Richmond Webb? He went to 7 straight pro bowls, is a member of the 1990's team of the decade, Dolphins Hall of Fame and started on a line that led the league in least sacks given up for several years (I don't know how many off the top of my head). I think he should be strongly considered.
Regards,
Greg M. >>
Greg, unfortunatley, Taylor didn't get the votes...I know his accomplishments well, but at this point would it be enough to get him in the HOF? I think he needs a couple of more dominant years...Just my opinion..Maybe even just one more...
Webb is someone we could re-visit down the road, but for OL, you really need to be a stand-out guy. Richmond Webb was 7 Pro Bowl, 2 First team All-Pro...Hes definitely behind all the other listed OLs to include Walter Jones (7 Pro Bowls, 3 First Team All-Pro) who didn;t make the set just yet.
This is going to be a fluid set..Once we get it online, changes/additions/subtractions will be the norm...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I'll vote for everyone that currently has votes as well as:
Del Shofner (Impressed by JasP receiver ranking) Walt Sweeney (he's a San Diego Charger) Les Rhichter
One idea I had on the senior list would be to automatically include every player that made the most recent HOF nomination list (minus the guys that got in of course) in addition to the guys we vote for. Most of us will be doing this anyway when the list comes out, why not incorporate it into our set. It would be a way of making the set more fluid and relevant.
QBs Charlie Conerly-4 John Hadl Jack Kemp John Brodie Roman Gabriel
RBs Larry Brown Beattie Feathers Willie Galimore Floyd Little-4 Paul Lowe Clem Daniels Chuck Foreman Don Perkins Alan Ameche 'Deacon' Dan Towler
WRs Bob Hayes-4 Billy Howton Art Powell Pete Retzlaff Del Shofner-1 Mac Speedie-5 Otis Taylor-4 Billy Wilson-4 Max McGee Ken Kavanaugh Gino Cappelletti Gary Collins
TE Jerry Smith Bob Tucker Lionel Taylor
OL Ed Budde Ken Gray Winston Hill Jerry Kramer-4 John Niland Dick Stanfel-4 Walt Sweeney-2 Mick Tingelhoff-4 Fuzzy Thurston Jim Tyrer Grady Alderman Dick Schafrath Gale Gillingham Len Hauss George Kunz Ray Wietecha Jim Ray Smith Ralph Neely Bucko Kilroy
DLs Gene Brito Curley Culp L.C. Greenwood-4 Claude Humphrey-4 Rich Jackson-4 Alex Karras-4 Gene Lipscomb-4 Jim Marshall-2 Jerry Mays Tom Sestak Cedric Hardman Bill Stanfill
LBs Maxie Baughan Chris Hanburger-4 E.J. Holub Chuck Howley-4 Lee Roy Jordan-4 Tommy Nobis-4 Les Richter-1 Dave Robinson-4 Andy Russell-4 Bill Bergey Mike Stratton Isiah Robertson
DBs Dick Anderson Jack Butler-4 Pat Fischer-4 Cliff Harris-4 Lemar Parrish-4 Johnny Robinson-3 Bob Boyd Bobby Dillion Jake Scott Erich Barnes Jimmy Patton Dave Grayson
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I'll vote for everyone that currently has votes as well as:
Del Shofner (Impressed by JasP receiver ranking) Walt Sweeney (he's a San Diego Charger) Les Rhichter
One idea I had on the senior list would be to automatically include every player that made the most recent HOF nomination list (minus the guys that got in of course) in addition to the guys we vote for. Most of us will be doing this anyway when the list comes out, why not incorporate it into our set. It would be a way of making the set more fluid and relevant. >>
Mike, every Senior finalist from the past THREE years is on the list..lol(minus the guys who got in the HOF)..
I will add your votes.
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>I can think of many more who could at least be considered, although I don't know if there's a cutoff for certain years with modern/seniors. I'm familiar with all of these guys. Obviously some of them aren't in the Hall yet because they maybe don't belong there.
Not sure if any of these guys would qualify for consideration, just merely throwing out additional players to maybe consider that are not on Jason's fine list of candidates.
Rich >>
Rich, I added all players who would qualify..Many of them are still modern candidates (Senior will have had to played his last season in 1982 or earlier to be considered in the 2008 Senior pool)....One or tow of them don;t have cards in mainstream sets..We can't use Kahn Weiners and stuff like that in the HOF sets...
I assume you didn't want to vote for all these guys, so let em know who from both lists you want to vote for...I can't vote for anyone from your list of Seniors...All fine players, but I just don;t see any HOFers in that group.
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>So Jason, before I vote, how many players should we choose?
Also, thanks for including some of the other candidates for consideration.
Rich >>
As many as you feel are deserving, and that you think are POSSIBLE HOFers in the future...
BTW, No one has given me an answer on Terrell Davis...Do you guys want SP or Select Certified??? Thats all I need before sending this to PSA.
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
One question, why is Galimore on the list? I mean I've seen many of his fabulous TD runs on tape. The guy was unreal and fast. He could've played flanker. But from a career standpoint his stats aren't any better than Alan Ameche's who was on two NFL Championship teams, lead the NFL in rushing as a rookie, scored the winning TD in the so-called 'Greatest game ever played', and won the Heisman in 1954, plus I believe he rushed for the third most yards in the NFL during the years he was playing. His career was cut short because of injury.
Just curious why Galimore and not Ameche on the list?
To be honest, I don't think either guy will ever make the Hall of Fame. They were both great players nonetheless.
<< <i>One question, why is Galimore on the list? I mean I've seen many of his fabulous TD runs on tape. The guy was unreal and fast. He could've played flanker. But from a career standpoint his stats aren't any better than Alan Ameche's who was on two NFL Championship teams, lead the NFL in rushing as a rookie, scored the winning TD in the so-called 'Greatest game ever played', and won the Heisman in 1954, plus I believe he rushed for the third most yards in the NFL during the years he was playing. His career was cut short because of injury.
Just curious why Galimore and not Ameche on the list?
To be honest, I don't think either guy will ever make the Hall of Fame. They were both great players nonetheless.
Rich >>
My mistake on Amache, I missed those last few RBs from your list..They have now been added...As you can see, no one has voted for Galimore here, but he was on my initial list of 50, because he has been a HOF finalist before (1983), and has been a Senior finalist in the past 3 years..Obviously, the Senior comittee thinks more highly of him for whatever reason..I would vote Amache over Galimore, but honestly don't think either has much of a shot...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I love the modern set. I need 9 cards though. I missed out on a PSA 10 Ogden not all that long ago that I think Marc outbid me on.
On Terrell Davis, the Select Certified would get my vote. First for consistency with the other two sets. It still irritates me I have two different Eddie George cards and two different Charles Woodson cards. But changing it now is kind of pointless and it would make the card that wasn't chosen, essentially worthless at sale. Also, it was THE card back in 97/98/99. Especially that Mirror Gold, but since we aren't doing parallel's, the regular select certified gets my vote.
Unfortunately for me, the senior list isn't my bread and butter. In fact, most of those guys played long before I was born and in many cases, I have not even seen film on them. So I'll refrain from voting on those guys that I know nothing about.
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>On the Senior set, I'll defer to the senior candidate experts on this one; however, I definitely want a vote for Mac Speedie
On the Modern set, I don't care which T. Davis card 50/50 either way. >>
Gotcha...For the record, I am voting for the 1995 SP Terrell Davis. I like to collect the most valuable rookie of each player, and the SP consistently outsells the Select Certified in PSA 10...I don't track PSA 9 prices, so not sure about those..
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
maybe its because football is better than baseball. more stable league too in terms of player movement even with FA.
<< <i>One more question for everyone. Does anyone want to venture a guess as to why the MLB HOF rookie set is not as popular as the NFL HOF rookie set? I couldn't find a post on the MLB rookie set and there doesn't seem to be a community to the extent that exists for the NFL rookie set. Just curious.
Regards,
Greg M. >>
Packers Fan for Life Collecting: Brett Favre Master Set Favre Ticket Stubs Favre TD Reciever Autos Football HOF Player/etc. Auto Set Football HOF Rc's
I think it's because HOF set collecting is a new concept..The guys who collect baseball are the same guys that tend to collect year sets..Like 1959 Topps, 1950 Bowman, etc...Football cards are the new up-and-comers, baseball is the old guard and they tend to stick with tradition. The football guys, and the NFL in general is building its tradition as we speak...One day, when we are the old guard, HOF and Key Card set collecting will be the norm.
Just my opinion of course, Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Bob Hayes-4 Mac Speedie-5 Billy Wilson-4 Jerry Kramer-4 Mick Tingelhoff-4 Jim Tyrer (ignoring off the field murder... he was HOF material) L.C. Greenwood-4 Claude Humphrey-4 Chris Hanburger-4 Chuck Howley-4 Lee Roy Jordan-4 Tommy Nobis-4 Dave Robinson-4 (too many LBs I know, but I feel 3 of the 5 are at the same level and that one or more will eventually get in) Dick Anderson (biased because I work with his son and have taken a special interest in his career... He looks great in the film I have seen) Cliff Harris-4 Johnny Robinson-3
Updated list w/vote count...As of tight now, anyone with 4 or more votes would make the set:
QBs Charlie Conerly-4 John Hadl Jack Kemp John Brodie Roman Gabriel
RBs Larry Brown Beattie Feathers Willie Galimore Floyd Little-4 Paul Lowe Clem Daniels Chuck Foreman Don Perkins Alan Ameche 'Deacon' Dan Towler
WRs Bob Hayes-5 Billy Howton Art Powell Pete Retzlaff Del Shofner-1 Mac Speedie-6 Otis Taylor-4 Billy Wilson-5 Max McGee Ken Kavanaugh Gino Cappelletti Gary Collins
TE Jerry Smith Bob Tucker Lionel Taylor
OL Ed Budde Ken Gray Winston Hill Jerry Kramer-5 John Niland Dick Stanfel-4 Walt Sweeney-2 Mick Tingelhoff-5 Fuzzy Thurston Jim Tyrer-1 Grady Alderman Dick Schafrath Gale Gillingham Len Hauss George Kunz Ray Wietecha Jim Ray Smith Ralph Neely Bucko Kilroy
DLs Gene Brito Curley Culp L.C. Greenwood-5 Claude Humphrey-5 Rich Jackson-4 Alex Karras-4 Gene Lipscomb-4 Jim Marshall-2 Jerry Mays Tom Sestak Cedric Hardman Bill Stanfill
LBs Maxie Baughan Chris Hanburger-5 E.J. Holub Chuck Howley-5 Lee Roy Jordan-5 Tommy Nobis-5 Les Richter-1 Dave Robinson-5 Andy Russell-4 Bill Bergey Mike Stratton Isiah Robertson
DBs Dick Anderson-1 Jack Butler-4 Pat Fischer-4 Cliff Harris-5 Lemar Parrish-4 Johnny Robinson-4 Bob Boyd Bobby Dillion Jake Scott Erich Barnes Jimmy Patton Dave Grayson
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
What do you think about the price of the PSA 8 Tony Canadeo rc that ended Wed night for $1525??!! The price seems ridiculous in my opinion (considering I bought my PSA 8 Otto Graham and PSA 8 Elroy Hirsch for $500 less over the past year) and the card is a weak PSA 8 in my opinion. I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts including Jason's stats of how much the card normally sells for.
Regards,
Greg M.
Collecting vintage auto'd fb cards and Dan Marino cards!!
<< <i>Jason, my votes should be on there too. I like them all but add the Cardinal's kick.
Also, SP for the the Terrell Davis >>
Bakken is on there now...So you want to vote for everyone on the above list?
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
What do you think about the price of the PSA 8 Tony Canadeo rc that ended Wed night for $1525??!! The price seems ridiculous in my opinion (considering I bought my PSA 8 Otto Graham and PSA 8 Elroy Hirsch for $500 less over the past year) and the card is a weak PSA 8 in my opinion. I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts including Jason's stats of how much the card normally sells for.
Regards,
Greg M. >>
A few have sold in private sales recently for right about $1500...The last one to auction on ebay was more than 2 years ago, and it was $600 range...I was in at $1,000, but not $1,500...The Canadeo is lower pop than Otto or Hirsch and for whatever reason, comes available even less often..Plus he's a Packer!
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I applaud you guys for giving all that you give to this set, it's an awesome set. I have to say, though, don't you guys even think these prices are so far out of whack, it's ridiculous?
<< <i>I applaud you guys for giving all that you give to this set, it's an awesome set. I have to say, though, don't you guys even think these prices are so far out of whack, it's ridiculous? >>
Not at all..In fact, I consider most of them bargains...Compare the vintage card prices to baseball prices from the same years...Eventually football is going to catch baseball..Its already happened in the 70s and 80s and 90s sets...The prices have been steadily climbing for the past 8 years that I have been collecting these HOF RCs...Why would it stop now? Demand is at an all-time high and there is no where to go but up...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
These "Future Hall of Fame Sets" are a GREAT GREAT idea. You guys might know me as Superdave or JoeCarrLives. I don't post much but I read this thread pretty much daily. Maybe I'll crawl out of my shell and jump in to a few discussions in the future.
David
It is always easier to fight for one’s principles than to live up to them-Adlai Stevenson
<< <i>These "Future Hall of Fame Sets" are a GREAT GREAT idea. You guys might know me as Superdave or JoeCarrLives. I don't post much but I read this thread pretty much daily. Maybe I'll crawl out of my shell and jump in to a few discussions in the future.
David >>
Dave, now that you are back (and climbing quickly) your input is welcome..You were buying some of the HOF RCs a few years ago..Maybe you could expound on how sharply the prices have continued to rise...
Hey, you got a vote on the Senior guys?lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>I applaud you guys for giving all that you give to this set, it's an awesome set. I have to say, though, don't you guys even think these prices are so far out of whack, it's ridiculous? >>
Not at all..In fact, I consider most of them bargains...Compare the vintage card prices to baseball prices from the same years...Eventually football is going to catch baseball..Its already happened in the 70s and 80s and 90s sets...The prices have been steadily climbing for the past 8 years that I have been collecting these HOF RCs...Why would it stop now? Demand is at an all-time high and there is no where to go but up...
Jason >>
To be honest, I think football has passed baseball a long time ago. There's never been a $2500 come out of '84 Topps Baseball like the Stephenson did in Football. There's many examples, but some of the early 70s Steelers in PSA 10 haven't been remotely touched on the same scale in Baseball, pricewise. I'm not seeing any bargains out there, I don't know about anyone else...
<< <i>I applaud you guys for giving all that you give to this set, it's an awesome set. I have to say, though, don't you guys even think these prices are so far out of whack, it's ridiculous? >>
Not at all..In fact, I consider most of them bargains...Compare the vintage card prices to baseball prices from the same years...Eventually football is going to catch baseball..Its already happened in the 70s and 80s and 90s sets...The prices have been steadily climbing for the past 8 years that I have been collecting these HOF RCs...Why would it stop now? Demand is at an all-time high and there is no where to go but up...
Jason >>
To be honest, I think football has passed baseball a long time ago. There's never been a $2500 come out of '84 Topps Baseball like the Stephenson did in Football. There's many examples, but some of the early 70s Steelers in PSA 10 haven't been remotely touched on the same scale in Baseball, pricewise. I'm not seeing any bargains out there, I don't know about anyone else... >>
Well, as I said, football has already passed baseball in the 70s, 80s and 90s....But for the 40s, 50s and 60s stuff football is just scratching the surface...With modern stuff, pops increasing will lower some of those prices...But make no mistake, demand is growing...As you have witnessed...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I can tell you this. I collect 1950 Bowman FB in PSA 8 and I should have bought my Tom Fears about a year ago. I think that card has doubled in the last year alone!
<< <i>I can tell you this. I collect 1950 Bowman FB in PSA 8 and I should have bought my Tom Fears about a year ago. I think that card has doubled in the last year alone! >>
No doubt about it, gone from $150-$300...Now find a baseball HOF RC in PSA 8 condition from the 1950 Bowman baseball set for $300!!!lol..You can't...
Then check the pop report to see that the Fears is even LOWER POP than the baseball...5 years from now you'll be talking about how cheap these football rookies used to be in 2007...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Updated list w/ vote count...As of right now, anyone with 4 or more votes would make the set:
QBs Charlie Conerly-6 John Hadl-2 Jack Kemp-2 John Brodie-2 Roman Gabriel-2
RBs Larry Brown-2 Beattie Feathers-2 Willie Galimore-2 Floyd Little-6 Paul Lowe-2 Clem Daniels-2 Chuck Foreman-2 Don Perkins-2 Alan Ameche-2 'Deacon' Dan Towler-2
WRs Bob Hayes-7 Billy Howton-2 Art Powell-2 Pete Retzlaff-2 Del Shofner-3 Mac Speedie-8 Otis Taylor-6 Billy Wilson-7 Max McGee-2 Ken Kavanaugh-2 Gino Cappelletti-2 Gary Collins-2 Charley Hennigan-1
TE Jerry Smith-2 Bob Tucker-2 Lionel Taylor-2
OL Ed Budde-2 Ken Gray-2 Winston Hill-2 Jerry Kramer-7 John Niland-2 Dick Stanfel-6 Walt Sweeney-4 Mick Tingelhoff-7 Fuzzy Thurston-2 Jim Tyrer-5 Grady Alderman-2 Dick Schafrath-2 Gale Gillingham-2 Len Hauss-2 George Kunz-2 Ray Wietecha-2 Jim Ray Smith-2 Ralph Neely-2 Bucko Kilroy-2
DLs Gene Brito-2 Curley Culp-2 L.C. Greenwood-7 Claude Humphrey-7 Rich Jackson-6 Alex Karras-6 Gene Lipscomb-6 Jim Marshall-4 Jerry Mays-2 Tom Sestak-2 Cedric Hardman-2 Bill Stanfill-2
LBs Maxie Baughan-2 Chris Hanburger-7 E.J. Holub-2 Chuck Howley-7 Lee Roy Jordan-7 Tommy Nobis-7 Les Richter-3 Dave Robinson-7 Andy Russell-6 Bill Bergey-2 Mike Stratton-2 Isiah Robertson-2
DBs Dick Anderson-2 Jack Butler-6 Pat Fischer-6 Cliff Harris-7 Lemar Parrish-6 Johnny Robinson-6 Bob Boyd-2 Bobby Dillion-2 Jake Scott-2 Erich Barnes-2 Jimmy Patton-2 Dave Grayson-2
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Terrel Davis: I vote for SP (anyone have an extra PSA 10?) I have the select certified in PSA 10, but I agree it should be SP.
Prices: Short term I think looks good as does the long term especially for football due to demographics. Medium term I would worry about the impact of a possible recession. I've seen a couple of recessions hit the sportscard market and it has been very brutal. Of course, the part of the market that will be least affected is older high grade stuff.
Senior voting: Add Jim Tyrer to my list. I think it could be that he was suffering from post concussion brain damage that led to depression and his later actions. I think head injuries will continue to be a major issue that the league will have to be addressed at sometime. Just pure speculation on my part of course.
<< <i>Terrel Davis: I vote for SP (anyone have an extra PSA 10?) I have the select certified in PSA 10, but I agree it should be SP.
Prices: Short term I think looks good as does the long term especially for football due to demographics. Medium term I would worry about the impact of a possible recession. I've seen a couple of recessions hit the sportscard market and it has been very brutal. Of course, the part of the market that will be least affected is older high grade stuff.
Senior voting: Add Jim Tyrer to my list. I think it could be that he was suffering from post concussion brain damage that led to depression and his later actions. I think head injuries will continue to be a major issue that the league will have to be addressed at sometime. Just pure speculation on my part of course. >>
Vote added..I also added my vote for Tyrer..He was one of the guys I was on the fence with, but after looking more closely at his credentials and game play, the guy as dominant in the AFL as anyone else that played there. All it will take is one committee member to push this guy and have his career reviewed closely and he would go in, easy.
I'll wait on a couple more votes for TD before closing the voting.
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>Terrel Davis: I vote for SP (anyone have an extra PSA 10?) I have the select certified in PSA 10, but I agree it should be SP. >>
I remember selling a PSA 10 Terrell Davis SP rookie for $621 back in 2000. It had clearly outdistanced Select Certified when TD cards were hot, so that would be my vote. I did have an extra PSA 10, but I sold it around December for like $40 or so. You should be able to get one for less than $50.
"My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
<< <i>Terrel Davis: I vote for SP (anyone have an extra PSA 10?) I have the select certified in PSA 10, but I agree it should be SP.
Prices: Short term I think looks good as does the long term especially for football due to demographics. Medium term I would worry about the impact of a possible recession. I've seen a couple of recessions hit the sportscard market and it has been very brutal. Of course, the part of the market that will be least affected is older high grade stuff.
Senior voting: Add Jim Tyrer to my list. I think it could be that he was suffering from post concussion brain damage that led to depression and his later actions. I think head injuries will continue to be a major issue that the league will have to be addressed at sometime. Just pure speculation on my part of course. >>
Vote added..I also added my vote for Tyrer..He was one of the guys I was on the fence with, but after looking more closely at his credentials and game play, the guy as dominant in the AFL as anyone else that played there. All it will take is one committee member to push this guy and have his career reviewed closely and he would go in, easy.
I'll wait on a couple more votes for TD before closing the voting.
Jason >>
In my humble opinion, guys like Tyrer and Gene Lipscomb will never make the hall w/ their baggage (especially Tyrer). Considering Tyrer shot and killed himself and his wife....I think his induction would tarnish the Hall's image. The same goes with Lipscomb. He died of a drug overdose in a hotel room with two women (which doesn't sound like the worst way to depart this world)...so I don't see the hall inducting him either.
Regards,
Greg M.
Collecting vintage auto'd fb cards and Dan Marino cards!!
In my humble opinion, guys like Tyrer and Gene Lipscomb will never make the hall w/ their baggage (especially Tyrer). Considering Tyrer shot and killed himself and his wife....I think his induction would tarnish the Hall's image. The same goes with Lipscomb. He died of a drug overdose in a hotel room with two women (which doesn't sound like the worst way to depart this world)...so I don't see the hall inducting him either.
Regards,
Greg M. >>
The football HOF voters are instructed NOT to consider any off the field issues when voting...Obviously they have in the past and still do to some extent. But as time goes by, it gets easier to forget whatever these players did off the field..Football is not a sport for gentlemen...Its centered on violence, its a mean game made for mean guys. The ONLY thing that should be considered when deciding on who belongs in the HOF is what they did on the football field...Honestly, thats all I care to know about them..I don't consider them role models or need them to be upstanding citizens to have been good football players. My opinion of someone's personality or character is totally separate from my football opinion. Maybe thats just me, its easy to separate the 2..I can only hope that more and more of the voters can do the same...Tyrer and Lipscomb are deserving based on what they did on the field, and that's the only part of the game of football that I study and care about...I dont think it would tarnish the HOF's image at all...Just as I don't think OJ Simpson tarnishes it...He tarnished himself, but that doesnt take away what he did when he played.
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
There is also the fact that a lot of Big Daddy's friends suspect foul play in his death, citing his near-pathological fear of needles and the incongruity of the placement of the needle marks (in the same arm he wrote with.)
<< <i>..Football is not a sport for gentlemen...Its centered on violence, its a mean game made for mean guys. The ONLY thing that should be considered when deciding on who belongs in the HOF is what they did on the football field...Honestly, thats all I care to know about them..I don't consider them role models or need them to be upstanding citizens to have been good football players. >>
I am with you Jason! Free Pacman Jones! Oh, wait, he hasn't been convicted of anything... except by the NFL and the media...
<I reserve the right to edit this post if said Pacman is convicted of wrong doing>
Comments
How about TE's on the Senior list. I would include Jerry Smith at a minimum.
Also, I really think the Jason Taylor should be on the modern HOF list. I am biased because I'm a Dolphins fan, but he is dominating, had a AFC Defensive Player of the Year under his belt and is a 5 time pro bowl selection. Also, how about Richmond Webb? He went to 7 straight pro bowls, is a member of the 1990's team of the decade, Dolphins Hall of Fame and started on a line that led the league in least sacks given up for several years (I don't know how many off the top of my head). I think he should be strongly considered.
Regards,
Greg M.
References:
Onlychild, Ahmanfan, fabfrank, wufdude, jradke, Reese, Jasp, thenavarro
E-Bay id: greg_n_meg
What do you think about the price of the PSA 8 Tony Canadeo rc that ended Wed night for $1525??!! The price seems ridiculous in my opinion (considering I bought my PSA 8 Otto Graham and PSA 8 Elroy Hirsch for $500 less over the past year) and the card is a weak PSA 8 in my opinion. I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts including Jason's stats of how much the card normally sells for.
Regards,
Greg M.
References:
Onlychild, Ahmanfan, fabfrank, wufdude, jradke, Reese, Jasp, thenavarro
E-Bay id: greg_n_meg
Regards,
Greg M.
References:
Onlychild, Ahmanfan, fabfrank, wufdude, jradke, Reese, Jasp, thenavarro
E-Bay id: greg_n_meg
<< <i>I have to add Louis Wright CB from Denver and Remove Dick Anderson.
I also have to add Jim Bakken to the list. The guy is on two all Decade Teams. I know I will get flack for Bakken >>
Louis Wright is an excellent choice...But he is still a modern candidate for the next 4 HOF elections..I don't see him getting in as a modern guy, but its possible he could get a push one day as a Senior...Keep him in mind 4 years from now..
I will add Bakken to the list. Based on the fact it is TOUGH for kicker/punters to get in the HOF to begin with, I can't see the Senior committee putting a Kicker in...FYI, Bakken hasn't even been a Senior Nominee in the last 3 years..The only Special Teamer on any Senior list lately was Tommy Davis..A Punter from back in the 50s/60s...
I'll add him to the list with your vote though..I mean I already have his card for the 60's Team of the Decade, but I still can't vote for him..
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Off the top of my head including AFL and not listed on your above list Jason:
QB:
Brodie
Gabriel
Simms
Ken Anderson
Stabler
RB:
Paul Lowe
Clem Daniels
William Andrews
Chuck Foreman
Don Perkins, 6 pro bowls in 8 years!
Alan Ameche
'Deacon' Dan Towler
WR:
Max McGee
Ken Kavanaugh, 1940's Bears end
Lavie Dilweg, 1920's & '30's Packers end
Jim Benton, 1940's Cleveland end
Drew Pearson
Billy Howton
Gino Cappelletti, leading scorer in AFL history
Cliff Branch
Gary Collins
TE:
Jerry Smith, Redskins
Bob Tucker, Giants
Lionel Taylor, Broncos 1960's
OL:
Grady Alderman
Dick Schafrath
Gale Gillingham
Len Hauss
Jeff Van Note
George Kunz, 8 pro bowls
Ray Wietecha
Jim Ray Smith
Ralph Neely
Bucko Kilroy
DL:
Cedric Hardman
Fred Dean
Bill Stanfill
LB:
Robert Brazile
Bill Bergey
Randy Gradishar
Mike Stratton, 1960's Bills
Isiah Robertson
DB's:
Bob Boyd
Bobby Dillion
Jake Scott
Erich Barnes
Jimmy Patton
Dave Grayson
K/P:
Jim Bakken
Jerrel Wilson
Happy Feller
Just seeing if you were paying attention.
Not sure if any of these guys would qualify for consideration, just merely throwing out additional players to maybe consider that are not on Jason's fine list of candidates.
Rich
<< <i>jason,
maybe a little more info like you did for feathers would help some of us that dont have the insight that you have.
jay >>
Who do you want to know about???It would take a week to do a write up on all 50...lol
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>Jason,
How about TE's on the Senior list. I would include Jerry Smith at a minimum.
Also, I really think the Jason Taylor should be on the modern HOF list. I am biased because I'm a Dolphins fan, but he is dominating, had a AFC Defensive Player of the Year under his belt and is a 5 time pro bowl selection. Also, how about Richmond Webb? He went to 7 straight pro bowls, is a member of the 1990's team of the decade, Dolphins Hall of Fame and started on a line that led the league in least sacks given up for several years (I don't know how many off the top of my head). I think he should be strongly considered.
Regards,
Greg M. >>
Greg, unfortunatley, Taylor didn't get the votes...I know his accomplishments well, but at this point would it be enough to get him in the HOF? I think he needs a couple of more dominant years...Just my opinion..Maybe even just one more...
Webb is someone we could re-visit down the road, but for OL, you really need to be a stand-out guy. Richmond Webb was 7 Pro Bowl, 2 First team All-Pro...Hes definitely behind all the other listed OLs to include Walter Jones (7 Pro Bowls, 3 First Team All-Pro) who didn;t make the set just yet.
This is going to be a fluid set..Once we get it online, changes/additions/subtractions will be the norm...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I'll vote for everyone that currently has votes as well as:
Del Shofner (Impressed by JasP receiver ranking)
Walt Sweeney (he's a San Diego Charger)
Les Rhichter
One idea I had on the senior list would be to automatically include every player that made the most recent HOF nomination list (minus the guys that got in of course) in addition to the guys we vote for. Most of us will be doing this anyway when the list comes out, why not incorporate it into our set. It would be a way of making the set more fluid and relevant.
QBs
Charlie Conerly-4
John Hadl
Jack Kemp
John Brodie
Roman Gabriel
RBs
Larry Brown
Beattie Feathers
Willie Galimore
Floyd Little-4
Paul Lowe
Clem Daniels
Chuck Foreman
Don Perkins
Alan Ameche
'Deacon' Dan Towler
WRs
Bob Hayes-4
Billy Howton
Art Powell
Pete Retzlaff
Del Shofner-1
Mac Speedie-5
Otis Taylor-4
Billy Wilson-4
Max McGee
Ken Kavanaugh
Gino Cappelletti
Gary Collins
TE
Jerry Smith
Bob Tucker
Lionel Taylor
OL
Ed Budde
Ken Gray
Winston Hill
Jerry Kramer-4
John Niland
Dick Stanfel-4
Walt Sweeney-2
Mick Tingelhoff-4
Fuzzy Thurston
Jim Tyrer
Grady Alderman
Dick Schafrath
Gale Gillingham
Len Hauss
George Kunz
Ray Wietecha
Jim Ray Smith
Ralph Neely
Bucko Kilroy
DLs
Gene Brito
Curley Culp
L.C. Greenwood-4
Claude Humphrey-4
Rich Jackson-4
Alex Karras-4
Gene Lipscomb-4
Jim Marshall-2
Jerry Mays
Tom Sestak
Cedric Hardman
Bill Stanfill
LBs
Maxie Baughan
Chris Hanburger-4
E.J. Holub
Chuck Howley-4
Lee Roy Jordan-4
Tommy Nobis-4
Les Richter-1
Dave Robinson-4
Andy Russell-4
Bill Bergey
Mike Stratton
Isiah Robertson
DBs
Dick Anderson
Jack Butler-4
Pat Fischer-4
Cliff Harris-4
Lemar Parrish-4
Johnny Robinson-3
Bob Boyd
Bobby Dillion
Jake Scott
Erich Barnes
Jimmy Patton
Dave Grayson
K/P
Jim Bakken-2
Jerrel Wilson
Votes counted: jasp24, BillsGridironGreats, davemri, mikescardcloset, JLoo
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>On the seniors:
I'll vote for everyone that currently has votes as well as:
Del Shofner (Impressed by JasP receiver ranking)
Walt Sweeney (he's a San Diego Charger)
Les Rhichter
One idea I had on the senior list would be to automatically include every player that made the most recent HOF nomination list (minus the guys that got in of course) in addition to the guys we vote for. Most of us will be doing this anyway when the list comes out, why not incorporate it into our set. It would be a way of making the set more fluid and relevant. >>
Mike, every Senior finalist from the past THREE years is on the list..lol(minus the guys who got in the HOF)..
I will add your votes.
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Also, thanks for including some of the other candidates for consideration.
Rich
<< <i>I can think of many more who could at least be considered, although I don't know if there's a cutoff for certain years with modern/seniors. I'm familiar with all of these guys. Obviously some of them aren't in the Hall yet because they maybe don't belong there.
Not sure if any of these guys would qualify for consideration, just merely throwing out additional players to maybe consider that are not on Jason's fine list of candidates.
Rich >>
Rich, I added all players who would qualify..Many of them are still modern candidates (Senior will have had to played his last season in 1982 or earlier to be considered in the 2008 Senior pool)....One or tow of them don;t have cards in mainstream sets..We can't use Kahn Weiners and stuff like that in the HOF sets...
I assume you didn't want to vote for all these guys, so let em know who from both lists you want to vote for...I can't vote for anyone from your list of Seniors...All fine players, but I just don;t see any HOFers in that group.
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>So Jason, before I vote, how many players should we choose?
Also, thanks for including some of the other candidates for consideration.
Rich >>
As many as you feel are deserving, and that you think are POSSIBLE HOFers in the future...
BTW, No one has given me an answer on Terrell Davis...Do you guys want SP or Select Certified??? Thats all I need before sending this to PSA.
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Just curious why Galimore and not Ameche on the list?
To be honest, I don't think either guy will ever make the Hall of Fame. They were both great players nonetheless.
Rich
<< <i>One question, why is Galimore on the list? I mean I've seen many of his fabulous TD runs on tape. The guy was unreal and fast. He could've played flanker. But from a career standpoint his stats aren't any better than Alan Ameche's who was on two NFL Championship teams, lead the NFL in rushing as a rookie, scored the winning TD in the so-called 'Greatest game ever played', and won the Heisman in 1954, plus I believe he rushed for the third most yards in the NFL during the years he was playing. His career was cut short because of injury.
Just curious why Galimore and not Ameche on the list?
To be honest, I don't think either guy will ever make the Hall of Fame. They were both great players nonetheless.
Rich >>
My mistake on Amache, I missed those last few RBs from your list..They have now been added...As you can see, no one has voted for Galimore here, but he was on my initial list of 50, because he has been a HOF finalist before (1983), and has been a Senior finalist in the past 3 years..Obviously, the Senior comittee thinks more highly of him for whatever reason..I would vote Amache over Galimore, but honestly don't think either has much of a shot...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
On Terrell Davis, the Select Certified would get my vote. First for consistency with the other two sets. It still irritates me I have two different Eddie George cards and two different Charles Woodson cards. But changing it now is kind of pointless and it would make the card that wasn't chosen, essentially worthless at sale. Also, it was THE card back in 97/98/99. Especially that Mirror Gold, but since we aren't doing parallel's, the regular select certified gets my vote.
Unfortunately for me, the senior list isn't my bread and butter. In fact, most of those guys played long before I was born and in many cases, I have not even seen film on them. So I'll refrain from voting on those guys that I know nothing about.
On the modern list, I love it.
My eBay Store
BigCrumbs! I made over $250 last year!
On the Modern set, I don't care which T. Davis card 50/50 either way.
1995 SP-2
1995 Select Certified-3
Either-1
Votes cast- JasP24, vjsteele4, JLoo, envoy98, gregm13, bcd33
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>On the Senior set, I'll defer to the senior candidate experts on this one; however, I definitely want a vote for Mac Speedie
On the Modern set, I don't care which T. Davis card 50/50 either way. >>
Gotcha...For the record, I am voting for the 1995 SP Terrell Davis. I like to collect the most valuable rookie of each player, and the SP consistently outsells the Select Certified in PSA 10...I don't track PSA 9 prices, so not sure about those..
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>One more question for everyone. Does anyone want to venture a guess as to why the MLB HOF rookie set is not as popular as the NFL HOF rookie set? I couldn't find a post on the MLB rookie set and there doesn't seem to be a community to the extent that exists for the NFL rookie set. Just curious.
Regards,
Greg M. >>
Collecting:
Brett Favre Master Set
Favre Ticket Stubs
Favre TD Reciever Autos
Football HOF Player/etc. Auto Set
Football HOF Rc's
Just my opinion of course,
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>Terrell Davis--
1995 SP-1
1995 Select Certified-2
Either-1
Votes cast- JasP24, vjsteele4, JLoo, envoy98 >>
I vote for Select Certified for TD
Greg M.
References:
Onlychild, Ahmanfan, fabfrank, wufdude, jradke, Reese, Jasp, thenavarro
E-Bay id: greg_n_meg
I cast a vote for the SP T. Davis.
Terrell Davis--
1995 SP-4
1995 Select Certified-3
Either-1
Votes cast- JasP24, vjsteele4, JLoo, envoy98, gregm13, bcd33 , Favrefan1971, drewsef
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Bob Hayes-4
Mac Speedie-5
Billy Wilson-4
Jerry Kramer-4
Mick Tingelhoff-4
Jim Tyrer (ignoring off the field murder... he was HOF material)
L.C. Greenwood-4
Claude Humphrey-4
Chris Hanburger-4
Chuck Howley-4
Lee Roy Jordan-4
Tommy Nobis-4
Dave Robinson-4 (too many LBs I know, but I feel 3 of the 5 are at the same level and that one or more will eventually get in)
Dick Anderson (biased because I work with his son and have taken a special interest in his career... He looks great in the film I have seen)
Cliff Harris-4
Johnny Robinson-3
QBs
Charlie Conerly-4
John Hadl
Jack Kemp
John Brodie
Roman Gabriel
RBs
Larry Brown
Beattie Feathers
Willie Galimore
Floyd Little-4
Paul Lowe
Clem Daniels
Chuck Foreman
Don Perkins
Alan Ameche
'Deacon' Dan Towler
WRs
Bob Hayes-5
Billy Howton
Art Powell
Pete Retzlaff
Del Shofner-1
Mac Speedie-6
Otis Taylor-4
Billy Wilson-5
Max McGee
Ken Kavanaugh
Gino Cappelletti
Gary Collins
TE
Jerry Smith
Bob Tucker
Lionel Taylor
OL
Ed Budde
Ken Gray
Winston Hill
Jerry Kramer-5
John Niland
Dick Stanfel-4
Walt Sweeney-2
Mick Tingelhoff-5
Fuzzy Thurston
Jim Tyrer-1
Grady Alderman
Dick Schafrath
Gale Gillingham
Len Hauss
George Kunz
Ray Wietecha
Jim Ray Smith
Ralph Neely
Bucko Kilroy
DLs
Gene Brito
Curley Culp
L.C. Greenwood-5
Claude Humphrey-5
Rich Jackson-4
Alex Karras-4
Gene Lipscomb-4
Jim Marshall-2
Jerry Mays
Tom Sestak
Cedric Hardman
Bill Stanfill
LBs
Maxie Baughan
Chris Hanburger-5
E.J. Holub
Chuck Howley-5
Lee Roy Jordan-5
Tommy Nobis-5
Les Richter-1
Dave Robinson-5
Andy Russell-4
Bill Bergey
Mike Stratton
Isiah Robertson
DBs
Dick Anderson-1
Jack Butler-4
Pat Fischer-4
Cliff Harris-5
Lemar Parrish-4
Johnny Robinson-4
Bob Boyd
Bobby Dillion
Jake Scott
Erich Barnes
Jimmy Patton
Dave Grayson
K/P
Jim Bakken-2
Jerrel Wilson
Votes counted: jasp24, BillsGridironGreats, davemri, mikescardcloset, JLoo, bcd33
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Also, SP for the the Terrell Davis
What do you think about the price of the PSA 8 Tony Canadeo rc that ended Wed night for $1525??!! The price seems ridiculous in my opinion (considering I bought my PSA 8 Otto Graham and PSA 8 Elroy Hirsch for $500 less over the past year) and the card is a weak PSA 8 in my opinion. I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts including Jason's stats of how much the card normally sells for.
Regards,
Greg M.
References:
Onlychild, Ahmanfan, fabfrank, wufdude, jradke, Reese, Jasp, thenavarro
E-Bay id: greg_n_meg
<< <i>Jason, my votes should be on there too. I like them all but add the Cardinal's kick.
Also, SP for the the Terrell Davis >>
Bakken is on there now...So you want to vote for everyone on the above list?
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>All,
What do you think about the price of the PSA 8 Tony Canadeo rc that ended Wed night for $1525??!! The price seems ridiculous in my opinion (considering I bought my PSA 8 Otto Graham and PSA 8 Elroy Hirsch for $500 less over the past year) and the card is a weak PSA 8 in my opinion. I'd like to hear everyone's thoughts including Jason's stats of how much the card normally sells for.
Regards,
Greg M. >>
A few have sold in private sales recently for right about $1500...The last one to auction on ebay was more than 2 years ago, and it was $600 range...I was in at $1,000, but not $1,500...The Canadeo is lower pop than Otto or Hirsch and for whatever reason, comes available even less often..Plus he's a Packer!
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>I applaud you guys for giving all that you give to this set, it's an awesome set. I have to say, though, don't you guys even think these prices are so far out of whack, it's ridiculous? >>
Not at all..In fact, I consider most of them bargains...Compare the vintage card prices to baseball prices from the same years...Eventually football is going to catch baseball..Its already happened in the 70s and 80s and 90s sets...The prices have been steadily climbing for the past 8 years that I have been collecting these HOF RCs...Why would it stop now? Demand is at an all-time high and there is no where to go but up...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
You guys might know me as Superdave or JoeCarrLives. I don't post much but I read this thread pretty much daily. Maybe I'll crawl out of my shell and jump in to a few discussions in the future.
David
<< <i>These "Future Hall of Fame Sets" are a GREAT GREAT idea.
You guys might know me as Superdave or JoeCarrLives. I don't post much but I read this thread pretty much daily. Maybe I'll crawl out of my shell and jump in to a few discussions in the future.
David >>
Dave, now that you are back (and climbing quickly) your input is welcome..You were buying some of the HOF RCs a few years ago..Maybe you could expound on how sharply the prices have continued to rise...
Hey, you got a vote on the Senior guys?lol
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>
<< <i>I applaud you guys for giving all that you give to this set, it's an awesome set. I have to say, though, don't you guys even think these prices are so far out of whack, it's ridiculous? >>
Not at all..In fact, I consider most of them bargains...Compare the vintage card prices to baseball prices from the same years...Eventually football is going to catch baseball..Its already happened in the 70s and 80s and 90s sets...The prices have been steadily climbing for the past 8 years that I have been collecting these HOF RCs...Why would it stop now? Demand is at an all-time high and there is no where to go but up...
Jason >>
To be honest, I think football has passed baseball a long time ago. There's never been a $2500 come out of '84 Topps Baseball like the Stephenson did in Football. There's many examples, but some of the early 70s Steelers in PSA 10 haven't been remotely touched on the same scale in Baseball, pricewise. I'm not seeing any bargains out there, I don't know about anyone else...
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I applaud you guys for giving all that you give to this set, it's an awesome set. I have to say, though, don't you guys even think these prices are so far out of whack, it's ridiculous? >>
Not at all..In fact, I consider most of them bargains...Compare the vintage card prices to baseball prices from the same years...Eventually football is going to catch baseball..Its already happened in the 70s and 80s and 90s sets...The prices have been steadily climbing for the past 8 years that I have been collecting these HOF RCs...Why would it stop now? Demand is at an all-time high and there is no where to go but up...
Jason >>
To be honest, I think football has passed baseball a long time ago. There's never been a $2500 come out of '84 Topps Baseball like the Stephenson did in Football. There's many examples, but some of the early 70s Steelers in PSA 10 haven't been remotely touched on the same scale in Baseball, pricewise. I'm not seeing any bargains out there, I don't know about anyone else... >>
Well, as I said, football has already passed baseball in the 70s, 80s and 90s....But for the 40s, 50s and 60s stuff football is just scratching the surface...With modern stuff, pops increasing will lower some of those prices...But make no mistake, demand is growing...As you have witnessed...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>I can tell you this. I collect 1950 Bowman FB in PSA 8 and I should have bought my Tom Fears about a year ago. I think that card has doubled in the last year alone! >>
No doubt about it, gone from $150-$300...Now find a baseball HOF RC in PSA 8 condition from the 1950 Bowman baseball set for $300!!!lol..You can't...
Then check the pop report to see that the Fears is even LOWER POP than the baseball...5 years from now you'll be talking about how cheap these football rookies used to be in 2007...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
QBs
Charlie Conerly-6
John Hadl-2
Jack Kemp-2
John Brodie-2
Roman Gabriel-2
RBs
Larry Brown-2
Beattie Feathers-2
Willie Galimore-2
Floyd Little-6
Paul Lowe-2
Clem Daniels-2
Chuck Foreman-2
Don Perkins-2
Alan Ameche-2
'Deacon' Dan Towler-2
WRs
Bob Hayes-7
Billy Howton-2
Art Powell-2
Pete Retzlaff-2
Del Shofner-3
Mac Speedie-8
Otis Taylor-6
Billy Wilson-7
Max McGee-2
Ken Kavanaugh-2
Gino Cappelletti-2
Gary Collins-2
Charley Hennigan-1
TE
Jerry Smith-2
Bob Tucker-2
Lionel Taylor-2
OL
Ed Budde-2
Ken Gray-2
Winston Hill-2
Jerry Kramer-7
John Niland-2
Dick Stanfel-6
Walt Sweeney-4
Mick Tingelhoff-7
Fuzzy Thurston-2
Jim Tyrer-5
Grady Alderman-2
Dick Schafrath-2
Gale Gillingham-2
Len Hauss-2
George Kunz-2
Ray Wietecha-2
Jim Ray Smith-2
Ralph Neely-2
Bucko Kilroy-2
DLs
Gene Brito-2
Curley Culp-2
L.C. Greenwood-7
Claude Humphrey-7
Rich Jackson-6
Alex Karras-6
Gene Lipscomb-6
Jim Marshall-4
Jerry Mays-2
Tom Sestak-2
Cedric Hardman-2
Bill Stanfill-2
LBs
Maxie Baughan-2
Chris Hanburger-7
E.J. Holub-2
Chuck Howley-7
Lee Roy Jordan-7
Tommy Nobis-7
Les Richter-3
Dave Robinson-7
Andy Russell-6
Bill Bergey-2
Mike Stratton-2
Isiah Robertson-2
DBs
Dick Anderson-2
Jack Butler-6
Pat Fischer-6
Cliff Harris-7
Lemar Parrish-6
Johnny Robinson-6
Bob Boyd-2
Bobby Dillion-2
Jake Scott-2
Erich Barnes-2
Jimmy Patton-2
Dave Grayson-2
K/P
Jim Bakken-3
Jerrel Wilson-2
Votes counted: jasp24, BillsGridironGreats, davemri, mikescardcloset, JLoo, bcd33, FavreFan1971, gregm13
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Terrell Davis--
1995 SP-6
1995 Select Certified-3
Either-1
Votes cast- JasP24, vjsteele4, JLoo, envoy98, gregm13, bcd33 , Favrefan1971, drewsef, mikescardcloset, shagrotn77
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Jason
yup except for Dick Anderson
Prices: Short term I think looks good as does the long term especially for football due to demographics. Medium term I would worry about the impact of a possible recession. I've seen a couple of recessions hit the sportscard market and it has been very brutal. Of course, the part of the market that will be least affected is older high grade stuff.
Senior voting: Add Jim Tyrer to my list. I think it could be that he was suffering from post concussion brain damage that led to depression and his later actions. I think head injuries will continue to be a major issue that the league will have to be addressed at sometime. Just pure speculation on my part of course.
<< <i>Terrel Davis: I vote for SP (anyone have an extra PSA 10?) I have the select certified in PSA 10, but I agree it should be SP.
Prices: Short term I think looks good as does the long term especially for football due to demographics. Medium term I would worry about the impact of a possible recession. I've seen a couple of recessions hit the sportscard market and it has been very brutal. Of course, the part of the market that will be least affected is older high grade stuff.
Senior voting: Add Jim Tyrer to my list. I think it could be that he was suffering from post concussion brain damage that led to depression and his later actions. I think head injuries will continue to be a major issue that the league will have to be addressed at sometime. Just pure speculation on my part of course. >>
Vote added..I also added my vote for Tyrer..He was one of the guys I was on the fence with, but after looking more closely at his credentials and game play, the guy as dominant in the AFL as anyone else that played there. All it will take is one committee member to push this guy and have his career reviewed closely and he would go in, easy.
I'll wait on a couple more votes for TD before closing the voting.
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>Terrel Davis: I vote for SP (anyone have an extra PSA 10?) I have the select certified in PSA 10, but I agree it should be SP. >>
I remember selling a PSA 10 Terrell Davis SP rookie for $621 back in 2000. It had clearly outdistanced Select Certified when TD cards were hot, so that would be my vote. I did have an extra PSA 10, but I sold it around December for like $40 or so. You should be able to get one for less than $50.
<< <i>
<< <i>Terrel Davis: I vote for SP (anyone have an extra PSA 10?) I have the select certified in PSA 10, but I agree it should be SP.
Prices: Short term I think looks good as does the long term especially for football due to demographics. Medium term I would worry about the impact of a possible recession. I've seen a couple of recessions hit the sportscard market and it has been very brutal. Of course, the part of the market that will be least affected is older high grade stuff.
Senior voting: Add Jim Tyrer to my list. I think it could be that he was suffering from post concussion brain damage that led to depression and his later actions. I think head injuries will continue to be a major issue that the league will have to be addressed at sometime. Just pure speculation on my part of course. >>
Vote added..I also added my vote for Tyrer..He was one of the guys I was on the fence with, but after looking more closely at his credentials and game play, the guy as dominant in the AFL as anyone else that played there. All it will take is one committee member to push this guy and have his career reviewed closely and he would go in, easy.
I'll wait on a couple more votes for TD before closing the voting.
Jason >>
In my humble opinion, guys like Tyrer and Gene Lipscomb will never make the hall w/ their baggage (especially Tyrer). Considering Tyrer shot and killed himself and his wife....I think his induction would tarnish the Hall's image. The same goes with Lipscomb. He died of a drug overdose in a hotel room with two women (which doesn't sound like the worst way to depart this world)...so I don't see the hall inducting him either.
Regards,
Greg M.
References:
Onlychild, Ahmanfan, fabfrank, wufdude, jradke, Reese, Jasp, thenavarro
E-Bay id: greg_n_meg
<< <i>
In my humble opinion, guys like Tyrer and Gene Lipscomb will never make the hall w/ their baggage (especially Tyrer). Considering Tyrer shot and killed himself and his wife....I think his induction would tarnish the Hall's image. The same goes with Lipscomb. He died of a drug overdose in a hotel room with two women (which doesn't sound like the worst way to depart this world)...so I don't see the hall inducting him either.
Regards,
Greg M. >>
The football HOF voters are instructed NOT to consider any off the field issues when voting...Obviously they have in the past and still do to some extent. But as time goes by, it gets easier to forget whatever these players did off the field..Football is not a sport for gentlemen...Its centered on violence, its a mean game made for mean guys. The ONLY thing that should be considered when deciding on who belongs in the HOF is what they did on the football field...Honestly, thats all I care to know about them..I don't consider them role models or need them to be upstanding citizens to have been good football players. My opinion of someone's personality or character is totally separate from my football opinion. Maybe thats just me, its easy to separate the 2..I can only hope that more and more of the voters can do the same...Tyrer and Lipscomb are deserving based on what they did on the field, and that's the only part of the game of football that I study and care about...I dont think it would tarnish the HOF's image at all...Just as I don't think OJ Simpson tarnishes it...He tarnished himself, but that doesnt take away what he did when he played.
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>..Football is not a sport for gentlemen...Its centered on violence, its a mean game made for mean guys. The ONLY thing that should be considered when deciding on who belongs in the HOF is what they did on the football field...Honestly, thats all I care to know about them..I don't consider them role models or need them to be upstanding citizens to have been good football players. >>
I am with you Jason! Free Pacman Jones! Oh, wait, he hasn't been convicted of anything... except by the NFL and the media...
<I reserve the right to edit this post if said Pacman is convicted of wrong doing>