VaultBox Survey And Changes For Series 2
WQuarterFreddie
Posts: 2,548 ✭✭✭✭✭
I just completed a survey for VaultBox. Here are the changes they are making for Series 2 boxes.😎
We’re improving our website. For the Series 1 release, our servers were overwhelmed by the number of visitors we received, leading to website crashes. Now that we’ve made it through the first launch, we have a much better idea of what we can expect. For Series 2 we’ve made changes to ensure that we are ready for launch.
Box weights correlating to contents. We’ve listened to feedback from the community and have implemented measures to randomize box weights.
**Each box will have greater coin variety. **In Series 1, some collectors were frustrated to open a box that contained three American Silver Eagles. We envision VaultBox as a fun way to experience new coins, and we believe adding more variety to each box is key to that goal. In Series 2, no box will contain three Silver Eagles, unless one of those Silver Eagles is a red core series hit.
More value per box. One of the biggest sources of inspiration for VaultBox was the idea that every single item pulled from a box should feel valuable – no “junk wax.” We accomplished this in Series 1 by only including precious metal coins. For Series 2, we’re doubling down on this idea by raising the average value per box.
**
Better communication leading up to launch day. **We love that you’re as excited as we are. Going forward we will be more communicative to ensure that we keep the VaultBox community up to date.
Comments
Yay!!!! Fool me once ...
Anyone who wants to is free to have at it. I just don't understand how they can possibly add even more value per box, since they were working on such small margins the first time around in order to get the product off to a rousing start.
It's also encouraging to see that after months of planning, they needed feedback to realize that paper and plastic covering various precious metal coins in various weights would allow motivated people to figure out differences between sealed boxes. Now, if only there was a way to document and audit how they are distributed. Maybe by Series 100. 🤣
The answer is pretty obvious. Let's see if you can figure it out...
A Pig in a Poke by any other name...
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars
Nope. I'm not nearly sharp enough.
All kidding aside, I seriously doubt it's a reference to increasing the price. I think they are probably reacting to the criticism on other sites from people not even getting $300 in value for their $600, and they are probably going to be a little more generous this time around. And I'm reacting to the fact that Blake implied in his pre-launch interview that they were basically giving these away to get the product off the ground. If that was truly the case, they'd have no room to increase values at the same price in subsequent series.
Big deal! Now that people see what it is, and how it is distributed, I doubt there will be as much enthusiasm this time around. Especially since the novelty is now gone. Don't get me wrong -- I'm sure they will sell as long as there are true believers, but I know for a fact that plenty of people who gave them the benefit of the doubt for Series 1 have now lost interest.
While there are only so many people who will be impressed with having less than $200 worth of gold thrown into their $600 box along with 2 ounces of silver, Magic Mike keeps showing up on HSN selling slabbed silver bullion for over $100 per ounce, so there absolutely is a market for this. It is more than a little surprising that there would be a receptive market for something like that on Collectors Universe, but, whatever. Please forgive me for saying this, but you really do seem more like a shill than a customer.
And no one needs people like me pointing out hidden gems in their disclosures, since they now have a track record, out in the open for all to see. This is nothing more than a way to spread something like $250,000+ worth of coins in 800 packages, distributed in something less than a totally random, verifiable manner, to sell for a collective $480,000. Anyone who thinks I am unreasonably cynical is certainly free to buy into it.
I completed the survey. I added comments that I didn't like the fact that there was a pre-sale, nor did I like the fact that one of the "hit" coins from the "demo" box just happened to be the first coin to show up on ebay before most "normal" customers could plausibly have received their boxes.
Philippians 4:4-7
Knowing that they did that before, if they told you they wouldn't going forward, would that encourage you to buy into future Series? Or would you think that their takeaway would be to hide anything people might not like from public view, but to keep doing whatever they want?
Excellent points! I forgot to mention them in my response.😉
I did suggest they offer one coin boxes and lower the price point accordingly 🤞
Dollar slots in Vegas pay out 94%.
Honestly, it was a one and done for me no matter what. I don't collect moderns, and I am not a gambler, so while it was exciting up until after the opening the main drive behind my purchase was from a slab collectors perspective. I wanted a NGCX VaultBox Series 1 slab, with the slim chance I might make a score.
I think it is important that VaultBox sees my comments because they do send up huge red flags IMHO, but the main reason I completed the survey is because of chance to win a VaultBox Series 1 sample slab. If there wasn't a drawing I wouldn't have wasted my time.
Philippians 4:4-7
I'm neither a shill nor a customer.
Let's see if you can manage to get this thread shut down like you did last time.
They could also do clad moderns
.> @jmlanzaf said:
He will never accept responsibility for getting the threads shutdown.
He is too busy trying to convince everyone how wrong they are for buying a VaultBox😂🤣
I'll see what I can do, but, honestly, it seems to me like it's the person who keeps starting these threads who also goes and gets them shut down.
That's right! I don't take responsibility. I'm not the one who keeps starting the threads, and then complaining to the mods when I don't like the comments they provoke.
And, since the two of you, combined, have bought exactly as many VBs as I have, it's unclear why you feel the need to be such advocates, and to begrudge me my point of view and right to express it. Whatever else you're doing, you're sure not putting your money where your mouths are.
I find it astonishing that this gamble could be so popular.
To each his own, but I'm gobsmacked by the whole concept.
But I suppose it gives endless excuse for fighting about something that doesn't matter.
Loot boxes make tons of money in video games and only offer things like different digital clothes for the character or a different looking weapon. The fact that there is something tangible in these boxes makes them much better than what lots of people are spending their money on these days (and no, I haven’t bought one, nor do I plan to. Just pointing this out).
If they get the price point lowered and include things my son is interested in it would be a birthday gift or something like that for him in the future.
If the good members here keep providing feedback they might get it to where more of us can be interested.
I'm glad I can start my weekend by participating in another Vault Box thread
I echo @ShaunBC5 's comments on what could possibly get me to buy one. My wife was actually suggesting that we get one of the series 1 for a birthday present for our kid but I resisted and we bought him things with real value like Robux gift cards.
The week that vaultbox came out, I bought this for $475 instead. I have a beautiful coin and $100 still in my pocket. I’m happy with my decision, but to each his own!
Says the man who admits he is going to buy another one to flip.🙄
Way to stand up to them Dan!😂🤣
Fool me once!.....well ok I will buy another one thank you!😎
Im a realist. Whether I choose to patronize them or not will have absolutely zero impact on the outcome. If you tell me I can make a quick $300 buy fiddling around on a website for a few minutes clicking the same button 30 times, ill probably take the $300 🤷♂️
Type Collector of U.S. Pre-33 Gold https://instagram.com/deplorable_dan Successful transactions with- @drfish, @Cladiator, @johnny010, @Pedzola, @PerryHall, @2windy2fish, @Ike1964, @JohnThePainter, @rpmsrpms, @REALGATOR
"Mintage 800" that's hilarious.
Keep it comin' guys very funny stuff.
I went to "strikethrough" that word in my previous comment and the whole comment went into the abyss. You're right, it is comical that I used that word but it has been in my head from looking at the mint offerings recently 😂
Type Collector of U.S. Pre-33 Gold https://instagram.com/deplorable_dan Successful transactions with- @drfish, @Cladiator, @johnny010, @Pedzola, @PerryHall, @2windy2fish, @Ike1964, @JohnThePainter, @rpmsrpms, @REALGATOR
Maybe they'll throw some lead sinkers in the boxes to futz with the weight issue.
BST: endeavor1967, synchr, kliao, Outhaul, Donttellthewife, U1Chicago, ajaan, mCarney1173, SurfinHi, MWallace, Sandman70gt, mustanggt, Pittstate03, Lazybones, Walkerguy21D, coinandcurrency242 , thebigeng, Collectorcoins, JimTyler, USMarine6, Elkevvo, Coll3ctor, Yorkshireman, CUKevin, ranshdow, CoinHunter4, bennybravo, Centsearcher, braddick, Windycity, ZoidMeister, mirabela, JJM, RichURich, Bullsitter, jmski52, LukeMarshall
I completed the survey and recommended lower, or various, price points and pre-1965 U.S. coinage in lieu of moderns.
Overall a good survey with positive future developments.
Included in box # 2.....probably all the unwanted bought back coins from box # 1 in addition to some gold bullion being used as bait.
Even more like a fishing tournament.
I don't know about anyone else, but I sure appreciate PCGS making this message board available in order to allow people I'll probably never even meet to attempt to save me from spending my own money on things they disapprove of.
The fact that they can be flipped means there is demand.
You're having fun wrong.
I thought the idea was to not spend your money the way other people think you shouldn't (for your own good, of course). I'm pretty sure fun isn't supposed to be involved.
Agreed. I never questioned the demand
Type Collector of U.S. Pre-33 Gold https://instagram.com/deplorable_dan Successful transactions with- @drfish, @Cladiator, @johnny010, @Pedzola, @PerryHall, @2windy2fish, @Ike1964, @JohnThePainter, @rpmsrpms, @REALGATOR
Definitely is demand. Google H. L. Mencken. The folks behind this apparently have a graduate degree in his teachings.
Increasingly, it's not.
The joke is, there's no right answer. If you collect modern widgets, you're doing it wrong because you aren't buying quality. If you buy a 6 figure CAC coin, you're doing it wrong because you overpaid for quality with a sticker. If you buy raw, it should be slabbed. If you buy slabbed, it better be the right slab. If you buy off ebay, you're shipping at ba flea market and overpaying because of the (alleged) high fees. If you shop at Heritage, you paid too much buyer's premium.
So many rules... so little FUN.
Then they may actually be onto something. If they work out the kinks, who knows...
The people who are trying to tell you how to spend your money think there is.
I am getting a hint of Menckensian elitism, but it's not coming from VB.
https://www.youtube.com/live/BEjzM2zsFnU?feature=share
Careful. It has a green sticker...
Of course it isn't. What's coming from them is great value, and lots and lots of fun, in each and every box.
If it's elitist to think that turning $600 into $300-400, averaged over 800 rolls of the dice, with a 0 in 800 chance to hit a $20K+ jackpot and a very decent chance to not even break $300, is a bad way to spend hard earned dollars, then I guess I am guilty as charged.
I lost track of whether @MasonG chose to play, and truly respect everyone's right to make their own decisions on how to have fun or spend their money, but I find it very interesting that the most vocal, non-elitist supporters here have not put their money where their mouths are. Say one thing and do another. Mencken would be very proud.
Except they all have a different "right" answer. Even on VB, we have one member who doesn't like them but wants to flip them. We have another member who doesn't like them but wants to collect the plastic.
You forgot the one who just doesn't like them.
I'm trying to...
The thing is, I may never buy one. Modern US is not my thing. But I don't mind other people having fun with it. If they do a series of flora or fauna NCLT, maybe I'll play.
No, you won't, because you are too smart. Your post history suggests that you wouldn't buy into anything that didn't deliver fair value, and yet you seem to have no problem encouraging others to do so.
And, by the way, I'm with @DeplorableDan on this, and, believe it or not, don't even begrudge VB its right to feed this market. My comments in the beginning were only meant to highlight the disclosures they made, and the lack of third party oversight in how boxes were going to be distributed. Everything I thought might happen did, in full view of the world.
Now that everyone can see exactly what this is, I am not telling anyone what to do. Anyone who saw how this works and wants to have "fun" and take shots while VB works out "kinks" at their expense is very free to do so. I fully support VB's right to exploit the market, and Dan's right to profit from it as well.
For the record, I don't believe there were any kinks to be worked out. They sold out in 30 minutes and commanded a 100% premium on eBay.
Things could not have gone better from their perspective. They are just doing a little damage control now with their survey, in order to demonstrate that they are responsive to negative feedback that they are surely aware of, and almost certainly anticipated, in order to keep people coming back for more.
From the outside looking in, I knew what the reaction was going to be once these were released. Do you really think they were caught by surprise, and have unanticipated kinks to work out? H.L. Mencken.
Oh, goodness gracious- that won't do.
“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.”
― C. S. Lewis
I have a confession. I’m also a bit of a label collector and have a registry set of West Point PCGS First Week of Discovery 2019 and 2020 quarters. Am I doing it wrong?
OMG...first VaultBox and now W Quarters? This thread is doomed to failure 🤣😂
I collect plastic, so I know I'm doing it wrong...
Philippians 4:4-7
I never said I didn't like them. They have their niche, and power to them. I just raised some obvious red flags, which like them or not I don't think you can dispute.
Philippians 4:4-7
I don't really see "red flags". They are what they are. I think everyone who plays the lottery knows it's a lottery.
This is a common game in the card world.
It's not really my thing. But i don't begrudge anyone their fun. I bet sports for fun. Never more than 5 bucks, maybe 10. I do okay, but it's just for fun and every bet I make I consider lost money. I feel the same about VB.
Now, if I had money and connections, I think this concept could be modified so there were more winners and fewer losers. I also think there are ways to make them a virtual must buy. But until I can figure out how to make that work, I truly hope the VB folks are successful and help make NGCX successful. Because i see it as a positive for the hobby.
I don't begrudge anyone their fun either. I never discouraged anyone from buying VB, all I said is that after series one I'm done because it isn't really my thing. However, you seem to think you speak for me, and alleged that I don't like them I just wanted to collect the plastic, as if that's somehow wrong.
If you don't see a red flag with the very first coin on ebay, being the exact coin from the "demo" box before any normal buyer could have plausibly received their box, then I can't help you.
While not perfect, to use your lottery analogy, if the relative of a PowerBall employee posted the winning ticket (claiming it as such) 30 minutes before the drawing, I think there might be a problem.
Philippians 4:4-7