"The Best Error Known" per Fred Weinberg - 1886 Morgan Die Cap at Great Collections/Mint Error News
Zoins
Posts: 33,900 ✭✭✭✭✭
The 1886 Brand-Carter Morgan Dollar Die Cap Error has been called:
- "the best error known" by @FredWeinberg
- "king of the series" and "the most spectacular Morgan dollar error of all time" by John Dannreuther.
I love die caps and apparently so did Amon Carter as this was one of his favorite coins. This coin simply looks stunning.
This coin is coming to auction at GC and has been published in Mint Error News which has a short quote from our own @ianrussell and @FredWeinberg:
@ianrussell said:
We are so privileged to be auctioning this important error coin. Back when I first met preeminent error expert Fred Weinberg about 18 years ago, I had asked him what he considered the best U.S. error coins to be. Our hour-long conversation about the top few error coins included discussion about this very coin. At the time, Fred had not seen the coin in over 35 years, yet he remembered it as if it was yesterday.
@FredWeinberg said:
The 1886 Die Cap is the first major error coin that I specifically remember from 1967, that I did not see again until the Portland ANA, March 2015. At the 1967 Error-A-Rama Coin Show, a dealer by the name of Roy Gray priced the coin at $1,000 - a huge number for any type of error coin, including 1943 Copper Cents.
@ianrussell said:
Mr. Carter owned some of the most revered coins and banknotes in numismatics, and for this 1886 Morgan Die Cap Error to be one of his personal favorites speaks volumes about the coin's importance. Prior to Carter, it was also part of the Virgil Brand collection.
The article goes on to talk about Amon Carter:
Mint Error News wrote:
Amon G. Carter, Jr. (1919-1982) assembled one of the finest and most complete collections of U.S. coins and paper money ever assembled. His collection included major rarities such as the 1794 Silver Dollar graded PCGS SP-66, the first coin to sell for over $10 million in auction, not to mention an 1804 Silver Dollar, 1870-S Silver Dollar, 1884 & 1885 Proof Trade Dollars among many other major rarities. GreatCollections recently sold another famous coin from the Carter Collection, the unique 1855 $20 Wass-Molitor Large Head graded PCGS AU-50 CAC which realized $568,125.
... but of course I'm a huge fan of Virgil Brand, so this has to be the Brand-Carter coin to me.
... and of course, there is another famous Brand-Carter coin, the 1794 silver plug dollar!
Not only is this coin featured in Mint Error News, it has an article in the Numismatist and a video interview with @FredWeinberg in CoinWeek's "COOL COINS! ANA National Money Show Portland"
- Coin Week "COOL COINS! ANA National Money Show Portland": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vof5HrYo6cY
- The Numismatist August 2015 article by John Danruther: https://nnp.wustl.edu/library/book/528915?page=59
A few questions:
- Where is this on the 100 Greatest Errors list?
- Where do people think this will end up price wise?
1886 Morgan Dollar - Obverse Die Cap Mint Error - PCGS MS64 - Ex. Virgil Michael Brand; Amon Giles Carter Sr.
Comments
Why not look what he got for a bug.
Naturally, I'm pretty ignorant to die cap errors of any kind, but what caused the negative reverse Liberty to be enlarged?
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
Here's the 2015 video interview with @FredWeinberg with a great quote from Fred's mother.
Regarding value:
Amazingly, Fred is handling the coin raw in this video!
Fred indicates this coin was owned by dealer Roy Gray and since Fred is showcasing the coin here, I have to wonder if Fred own this as well? So does the provenance include:
The die cap acts as a surrogate die for the following strikes. As the cap strikes each planchet, it gets thinner and spreads out. The image is reversed and incuse.
That certainly is an amazing error. What a great piece to examine 'in hand'. Cheers, RickO
True. Seems like a lot of spread on a single strike, although I haven't seen many Morgan die caps. I wonder if there were more than one struck.
With a planchet as large and thick as the Morgan $, where did the extra metal go as it spreads?
No magnifying glass needed for that one!
Coin appears cleaned, wiped, retoned and among other things just 'off' to me. While these effects may not detract from it's rareness or appeal otherwise, can someone that knows this coin better than I comment on the MS 64 grade ?
Although I saw that coin for the first time at Roy Gray’s table at the first Error-a Rama in 1967, and have had it raw in my hand – I’ve never owned That particular piece – there is another great Morgan dollar Die Cap that I bought and sold about 15 years ago that is in A major error collection
for PCGS. A 49+-Year PNG Member...A full numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022
Thanks for the clarification Fred! It is amazing to hold something like that raw!
Do you mean this 1903 Morgan Obverse Die Cap which you also had raw? These two coins would be an amazing pair!
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/884052/13-year-acquisition-time-finally-die-cap-morgan-dollar/p1
Here's a 2015 thread on the Brand-Carter coin, which has been referred to as a "poker chip" or "rattlesnake" due to the pattern on the rim. A number of us, myself included, posted in it!
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/949217/anyone-see-the-morgan-die-cap/p1
Yes that’s the piece
for PCGS. A 49+-Year PNG Member...A full numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022
Amazing coin! That’s certainly worth waiting for!
Is there any other known provenance for this coin?
As mentioned in the linked thread I got to fondle the 1903 cap, raw, down at Harlan J. Berk’s. God is it amazing!
TD
Was this handled by Harlan Berk then? Do you know how long ago this was! It would be great to have Fred and Harlan on the provenance chain!
See David Greenstein’s comments. I saw it at Berk’s in April of 2013.
Ah so the provenance is
Yes. I saw Fred’s post and immediately brought it to the attention of my former employer because I knew from when I worked there about our very, very serious collector of Major Errors.
Is any provenance known after Harlan handled the coin?
The customer that bought the coin from Harlan J Berk Inc. still owns it -I am not aware of his name But I know that this collector has some spectacular Error coins.
for PCGS. A 49+-Year PNG Member...A full numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022
Very cool
I wonder if any more of this collector's errors are being sold by GC now?
"I'd buy that for a dollar"
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I’d pay 90 cents because it’s defective
But if you follow the MEN link to GC, you’ll see it’s at $55k already!
Fantastic Morgan dollar error! That piece deserves to be cracked out of that holder, which is way too small for that coin.
The gasket is hiding more than what could be called the rim
Great error!
@Zoins said:
“But if you follow the MEN link to GC, you’ll see it’s at $55k already!”
It’s up to $60k at the moment.
The Mint Error News article on the Great Collections Press Release has the link to the auction listing:
https://minterrornews.com/news-11-26-21-spectacular-1886-morgan-dollar-die-cap-error-to-be-auctioned-by-greatcollections.html
That was a fun coin to play with. Pity the image links I posted are broken. Carter also referred to it as an "ash tray." This should sell north of $100K.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars
Very nice! The "Poker Chip" is on fire!
The MEN article says "One of the greatest error coins known". Would you say this is a Top 10 error? Top 20, Top 50?
Glad you were able to play with the coin.
And agreed on the images. The more the better. The images look like they were hosted by Comcast. A huge improvement of the forums was the ability to host images. Thanks for PCGS for doing this!
@Zoins asked:
“The MEN article says "One of the greatest error coins known". Would you say this is a Top 10 error? Top 20, Top 50?”
Morgan Dollar Obverse Die Caps certainly are in the top tier ranking of mint errors.
But so are the Indian Head Cents struck in gold, the Sac $/ Quarter Mules, and others as well!
If we had access to the actual coin to photograph it for the book it would’ve been in the top 10.
And as far as I know Amon Carter never referred to the coin as an ‘ashtray’ – my mother did at the
Error- A-Rama in 1967 up in Hollywood
for PCGS. A 49+-Year PNG Member...A full numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022
Good to know! It's great it would have been that high!
It's interesting it wasn't ranked due to lack of photos. Are there other significant coins that didn't make it into the book due to lack of photos or other reasons?
Certainly the Indian Head Cents in gold and the Morgan Dollar Obverse Die Caps are top ten on any list.
Thanks for clarifying.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars
Fred, if you need better pictures of the 1903 for the book talk to Mike Printz at Harlan Berk.
The next owner should put it in a Rarities holder:
https://www.pcgs.com/news/pcgs-launches-rarities-holder
I can't imagine any error more interesting than an Indian Head cent struck in gold (unless it was one of the rumored 1909-S VDB cents struck on a $2.50 gold planchet).
I agree. Those are amazing. They are almost like patterns, but are errors.
@rays said:
I can't imagine any error more interesting than an Indian Head cent struck in gold (unless it was one of the rumored 1909-S VDB cents struck on a $2.50 gold planchet).
Mike, it's awesome you owned both of those coins.
The only thing these need is "Byers Collection" on the insert
@Zoins
Yes it does need BYERS COLLECTION.
I owned it three times!
From 1975 through 1989, and twice from 2005 thru 2015😁
I think I've seen those Indian head cents in gold at LB, maybe 10 years ago or so. Beautiful.
@rays
Good memory!
I displayed both of my Gold Indian Head Cents at my booth at the Long Beach Coin Show for several years!
It's why going to a large show is so different than buying coins through auction or internet. You occasionally see things you never forget. Jay Parrino's incredible early large cents (ex: Naftzger) comes to mind, including the Atwater MS68RED Wreath and the Mickley SP65BN Ameri he brought to LB over 25 years ago now.
@rays
Yes, the experience of viewing world class rarities in person at a dealer’s booth is so different from bidding online or viewing a dealer’s inventory on the internet!
@rays
The unique gold Buffalo Nickel is very special too:
https://minterrornews.com/discoveries-11-2-20-1913-type-two-buffalo-nickel-struck-on-a-half-eagle-planchet.html
Yes, another great coin! It's interesting to think about what coins would be in the top tier of error coins along with the Brand-Carter 1886 Morgan Dollar Die Cap.
Gold off-metal errors really stand out as beautiful coins! Imagine if this is all someone focused on? It would be an insane set.
1913 Buffalo Nickel - gold - PCGS AU Details - Test Cut
Here's a great photo by MDP, that David posted in the other thread:
1903 Morgan Dollar Obverse Die Cap Mint Error - PCGS AU50 - Ex. Fred Weinberg; Harlan J. Berk
Along with the current coin to compare:
1886 Morgan Dollar Obverse Die Cap Mint Error - PCGS MS64 - Ex Virgil Michael Brand; Amon Giles Carter Sr.
@Zoins said:
“Gold off-metal errors really stand out as beautiful coins! Imagine if this is all someone focused on? It would be an insane set.”
Yes! Here is another off metal in the same category. The famous 1851 $20 Liberty struck on a Large Cent planchet. Both Fred and I have owned it before.
https://mikebyers.com/957291-002.html