@NYCMint said:
Just opened my box from the Mint that was supposed to have 10 CCs and 10 Os and instead there are 20 Os. Going to call the Mint but any suggestions before I do? I want the 10 CC!
@NYCMint said:
Just opened my box from the Mint that was supposed to have 10 CCs and 10 Os and instead there are 20 Os. Going to call the Mint but any suggestions before I do? I want the 10 CC!
in times past, the mint contractors made extremely rare mistakes. your experience will be new data for us.
keep us updated.
Thanks. Spoke with the Mint. Two options: 1) keep the 20 coins or 2) return whichever ones I don't want. No option to get the missing 10 CCs. Rep was pretty clueless and kept referring to the Mint as "they" which is just bad form when "they" is the company you work for or somehow represent. I will try again tomorrow and maybe someone else will have another answer but I doubt it.
I suggest everyone open these boxes. With 100000s of coins being packaged in a short period, something is bound to go wrong.
@jessewvu said:
I have a little over 100 of these in so far. Should I get these graded or not? I planned on sending in but with all the terrible reviews, I’m having second thoughts. I haven’t looked at any yet and have no interest in culling them prior to submitting.
You must have a really big household.
I had 4 orders of 99 for the morgan's when I caught them at a random off time a few days after release. All those orders got canceled because I had a $25 balance due with the mint because PayPal didn't pay the bill on an order for some reason and the US Mint shipped it anyway. Anyway, I submit in bulk so I buy in bulk.
Edited to add: I got taken to the cleaners on these if it makes anyone feel better.
I just got 3 Peace in the mail and all 3 have die polish lines by In God & the date.
Not a big deal and some collectors may not notice them but some may think the coin has been cleaned or wiped.
@ifthevamzarockin said:
I just got 3 Peace in the mail and all 3 have die polish lines by In God & the date.
Not a big deal and some collectors may not notice them but some may think the coin has been cleaned or wiped.
Edited to add photo:
Sorry. Yah they are noticeable. It’s killing me that so many of us are receiving dang seconds ( I know even worse they are firsts). $85 wait 5 months I am really exhausted and feeling like the wind has been knocked out of me. Wait wait wait and what a let down 🤨
So....from what I've been reading...is it safe to assume that most of these issues overall seem to be occurring on the obverse side of these coins? Only some strikethrough issues seem to be happening on the reverse.
@RichR said:
So....from what I've been reading...is it safe to assume that most of these issues overall seem to be occurring on the obverse side of these coins? Only some strikethrough issues seem to be happening on the reverse.
No, both sides all 6 show problems. I’m up to 13 different types. There’s a lot of pictures on multiple threads. This is not limited to any one coin or obverse/reverse. 🤨
@RichR said:
So....from what I've been reading...is it safe to assume that most of these issues overall seem to be occurring on the obverse side of these coins? Only some strikethrough issues seem to be happening on the reverse.
Yes. I'm guessing it's a question of anvil vs hammer
@ifthevamzarockin said:
I just got 3 Peace in the mail and all 3 have die polish lines by In God & the date.
Not a big deal and some collectors may not notice them but some may think the coin has been cleaned or wiped.
Edited to add photo:
I’ve noticed polishing lines on a few peaces as well.
I spent quite a bit of time looking at raw 2021 Morgan’s and peace dollars for sale on eBay. When I magnify them , and their pictures, not stock photos, I’m finding way over 60-70 percent with scratches, dings etc rubs 😬 I foresee a lot of returns. They look good until you magnify. And we have identified problem areas, so when you head to the areas, there they are. 🤨
@jessewvu said:
I have a little over 100 of these in so far. Should I get these graded or not? I planned on sending in but with all the terrible reviews, I’m having second thoughts. I haven’t looked at any yet and have no interest in culling them prior to submitting.
You must have a really big household.
I had 4 orders of 99 for the morgan's when I caught them at a random off time a few days after release. All those orders got canceled because I had a $25 balance due with the mint because PayPal didn't pay the bill on an order for some reason and the US Mint shipped it anyway. Anyway, I submit in bulk so I buy in bulk.
Edited to add: I got taken to the cleaners on these if it makes anyone feel better.
I know of 2 orders of 99 CC on same acct where USM applied an inconsistent rule and cancelled one of the orders.
Did not violate limits, did not fail for anything.
With all these issues popping up, I am so glad that I struck out ordering these coins from the Mint. I purchased all 6 coins slabbed PCGS MS70 from a dealer. Yes, it cost me quite a bit more, but I had no choice when I was unable to order them from the Mint. I'm glad the coins I purchased at MS70 will show no defects.
I prefer the peace obverse and the morgan reverse over the others. Anyone know a guy I can send one of each to and have him make me one with the peace obverse and morgan reverse?
@JeffM said:
With all these issues popping up, I am so glad that I struck out ordering these coins from the Mint. I purchased all 6 coins slabbed PCGS MS70 from a dealer. Yes, it cost me quite a bit more, but I had no choice when I was unable to order them from the Mint. I'm glad the coins I purchased at MS70 will show no defects.
And hopefully won’t develop any. Sounds like you did make a good choice for you and that’s the name of the game. Congratulations 😉
@JeffM said:
With all these issues popping up, I am so glad that I struck out ordering these coins from the Mint. I purchased all 6 coins slabbed PCGS MS70 from a dealer. Yes, it cost me quite a bit more, but I had no choice when I was unable to order them from the Mint. I'm glad the coins I purchased at MS70 will show no defects.
Not guaranteed. Remember a grade of 70 only means the highest grade the coin can receive. It does no guarantee a "perfect" coin. I have seen way too many coins in a 70 slab that had obvious marks and defects visible to the naked eye.
Also, once all the Franklin Mint Boomers are gone the gimmick labels ( FDOI, First Strike, Advance Release, ect.) will become worthless. The next label to come is the Pre Release label that only has a picture of the coin in it.
" If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. " The 1st Law of Opposition from The Firesign Theater
@Jzyskowski1 said:
I spent quite a bit of time looking at raw 2021 Morgan’s and peace dollars for sale on eBay. When I magnify them , and their pictures, not stock photos, I’m finding way over 60-70 percent with scratches, dings etc rubs 😬 I foresee a lot of returns. They look good until you magnify. And we have identified problem areas, so when you head to the areas, there they are. 🤨
I am sure you will also see many in 70 slabs with the same defects on them.
" If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. " The 1st Law of Opposition from The Firesign Theater
@JeffM said:
With all these issues popping up, I am so glad that I struck out ordering these coins from the Mint. I purchased all 6 coins slabbed PCGS MS70 from a dealer. Yes, it cost me quite a bit more, but I had no choice when I was unable to order them from the Mint. I'm glad the coins I purchased at MS70 will show no defects.
Not guaranteed. Remember a grade of 70 only means the highest grade the coin can receive. It does no guarantee a "perfect" coin. I have seen way too many coins in a 70 slab that had obvious marks and defects visible to the naked eye.
Also, once all the Franklin Mint Boomers are gone the gimmick labels ( FDOI, First Strike, Advance Release, ect.) will become worthless. The next label to come is the Pre Release label that only has a picture of the coin in it.
I am curious who the FDOI, First Strike, Advance Release label collectors are. How big is the market and what are the demographics? I suspect deep pocketed registry set collectors for whom the extra $ for the label is meaningless. Anyone with any insight?
What I was trying to convey was the idea that the younger generations are loosing interest in collecting coins and the market for reselling these coins will shrink and the value will shrink as well. While it is clear the market for these labels is strong now, I do not believe it will hold in the future. I have seen things hot in the market eventually take a nose dive off the cliff.
While the inherent value of the coins themselves will make the gimmicks last longer they will eventually loose their appeal.
" If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. " The 1st Law of Opposition from The Firesign Theater
@Jzyskowski1 said:
I spent quite a bit of time looking at raw 2021 Morgan’s and peace dollars for sale on eBay. When I magnify them , and their pictures, not stock photos, I’m finding way over 60-70 percent with scratches, dings etc rubs 😬 I foresee a lot of returns. They look good until you magnify. And we have identified problem areas, so when you head to the areas, there they are. 🤨
I am sure you will also see many in 70 slabs with the same defects on them.
If that's the case , then the ratings services are suspect and not following their own standards. A 70 grade should mean no visible defects at 5X magnification. But, it would not surprise me. Everyone is pushing these coins through for the $.
@HATTRICK said:
What I was trying to convey was the idea that the younger generations are loosing interest in collecting coins and the market for reselling these coins will shrink and the value will shrink as well. While it is clear the market for these labels is strong now, I do not believe it will hold in the future. I have seen things hot in the market eventually take a nose dive off the cliff.
While the inherent value of the coins themselves will make the gimmicks last longer they will eventually loose their appeal.
I agree that many of the labels are gimmicky, but am curious who is paying the premium. I don’t see the value long term either.
I don’t necessarily agree that younger generations are losing interest in numismatics. Would be curious to hear views from some larger dealers and auction companies what age demographics they see and whether they perceive a loss of interest. Of course many of us on the younger side have smaller budgets, buy online instead of in-person and approach the hobby very differently than the boomers and for these reasons it may be hard to truly measure younger engagement.
@HATTRICK said:
What I was trying to convey was the idea that the younger generations are loosing interest in collecting coins and the market for reselling these coins will shrink and the value will shrink as well. While it is clear the market for these labels is strong now, I do not believe it will hold in the future. I have seen things hot in the market eventually take a nose dive off the cliff.
While the inherent value of the coins themselves will make the gimmicks last longer they will eventually loose their appeal.
I agree that many of the labels are gimmicky, but am curious who is paying the premium. I don’t see the value long term either.
I don’t necessarily agree that younger generations are losing interest in numismatics. Would be curious to hear views from some larger dealers and auction companies what age demographics they see and whether they perceive a loss of interest. Of course many of us on the younger side have smaller budgets, buy online instead of in-person and approach the hobby very differently than the boomers and for these reasons it may be hard to truly measure younger engagement.
What really bothers me are all the coins sold by MCM/GovMint that have labels signed by John Mercanti. That guy signs everything - even coins he has no involvement with. Again, it's all for the $.
@micotu said:
I prefer the peace obverse and the morgan reverse over the others. Anyone know a guy I can send one of each to and have him make me one with the peace obverse and morgan reverse?
Using superglue, stick them together and voila, you have a two ounce coin
I had never considered the possibility that TPG might grade on a curve. Interesting if correct
100% positive transactions with SurfinxHI, bigole, 1madman, collectorcoins, proofmorgan, Luke Marshall, silver pop, golden egg, point five zero,coin22lover, alohagary, blaircountycoin,joebb21
@Jzyskowski1 said:
I spent quite a bit of time looking at raw 2021 Morgan’s and peace dollars for sale on eBay. When I magnify them , and their pictures, not stock photos, I’m finding way over 60-70 percent with scratches, dings etc rubs 😬 I foresee a lot of returns. They look good until you magnify. And we have identified problem areas, so when you head to the areas, there they are. 🤨
This shows the problem with photos. Probably also photos through capsules. I've been through over 100 in- hand. The number with scratches and dings or spotting are only 15 so far. Nowhere near 60 or 70%
@HATTRICK said:
What I was trying to convey was the idea that the younger generations are loosing interest in collecting coins and the market for reselling these coins will shrink and the value will shrink as well. While it is clear the market for these labels is strong now, I do not believe it will hold in the future. I have seen things hot in the market eventually take a nose dive off the cliff.
While the inherent value of the coins themselves will make the gimmicks last longer they will eventually loose their appeal.
I agree that many of the labels are gimmicky, but am curious who is paying the premium. I don’t see the value long term either.
I don’t necessarily agree that younger generations are losing interest in numismatics. Would be curious to hear views from some larger dealers and auction companies what age demographics they see and whether they perceive a loss of interest. Of course many of us on the younger side have smaller budgets, buy online instead of in-person and approach the hobby very differently than the boomers and for these reasons it may be hard to truly measure younger engagement.
All surveys and studies in the coin market and elsewhere show collector bases to be old and getting older. I posted links a couple weeks ago. You can Google them yourself.
Be careful of inductive reasoning. A few young collectors doesn't prove there are millions of them.
Demographic trends are a challenge for all collector markets. Millennial and Gen Z simply aren't (on average) into artifacts as much as Gen X and earlier generations.
@Jzyskowski1 said:
I spent quite a bit of time looking at raw 2021 Morgan’s and peace dollars for sale on eBay. When I magnify them , and their pictures, not stock photos, I’m finding way over 60-70 percent with scratches, dings etc rubs 😬 I foresee a lot of returns. They look good until you magnify. And we have identified problem areas, so when you head to the areas, there they are. 🤨
I am sure you will also see many in 70 slabs with the same defects on them.
If that's the case , then the ratings services are suspect and not following their own standards. A 70 grade should mean no visible defects at 5X magnification. But, it would not surprise me. Everyone is pushing these coins through for the $.
5X magnification is a lot. The majority of coins in 70 slabs will show defects at 5X.
@MsMorrisine said:
Who needs magnification to hit an at least 25% problem rate
I've now gone through 120 coins. 18 had problems under 5x magnification - including the one where the spot washed off. That's 15% not "at least 25%".
Curious. Did you send the 100 without problems in for grading since you received much better ones on average than I did? If not, are they on BST, or are you selling them on eBay OGP? If OGP on eBay, please remind me what your store is called.
My Peace dollars all look like this. Hazing and some spots on the reverse. Morgans are not any better with more marks on them than hazing. Marks like others have posted.
Sorry to hear about that. Well you have joined the club (although it’s not very exclusive anymore). It’s crazy the different amount of problems. Look back at all these posts. It’s not a good look.
Worst part was waiting 5 months for these. I really feel like the wind has been knocked out of me.
@jessewvu said:
I have a little over 100 of these in so far. Should I get these graded or not? I planned on sending in but with all the terrible reviews, I’m having second thoughts. I haven’t looked at any yet and have no interest in culling them prior to submitting.
You must have a really big household.
It's not the size of the household. It's the number of households.
...or the "number of apartment units" you have within your home address!
Looks like the HHL has been lifted on these. They haven't hung the Sold Out signs yet... hmmmmm
Its absolutely crazy! Of the dozen or so I have received, I have not noticed any problems with naked eye....Im afraid to use magnification! Not sending any in so I'm good with that.
@Onastone said:
Looks like the HHL has been lifted on these. They haven't hung the Sold Out signs yet... hmmmmm
There seem to have been a few more cancellations which I think they can resell. Still a bit unsure of some kinds of returns. Maybe they resell unopened boxes of returns. Don't really want to restart that return discussion.
This is good news that the HHL is gone except I still think there should be some order limit on these secondary offerings, like 3 or 10 again. Not a big fan of the 99 order limits when so many did not get any direct that tried the first time.
New postal employee 4 hrs late and i hear the box hitting the front porch. She just tossed it. Now I was planning on taking all the boxes unopened to a pcgs event but these Peace dollars sound like there all jiggling around the inside of the box. Update decided to open the peace box and all coin were still in the boxes. 1 Peace has a nice hit right on the cheek and no point in sending that one in. The other two look good. I may do a pocket piece with the bad one....
Comments
Sorry. This is crazy. A few of us get a bum coin every now and again but dang. 🤨
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
Thanks. Spoke with the Mint. Two options: 1) keep the 20 coins or 2) return whichever ones I don't want. No option to get the missing 10 CCs. Rep was pretty clueless and kept referring to the Mint as "they" which is just bad form when "they" is the company you work for or somehow represent. I will try again tomorrow and maybe someone else will have another answer but I doubt it.
I suggest everyone open these boxes. With 100000s of coins being packaged in a short period, something is bound to go wrong.
With the amount of product they sell every year, the mistake rate is extremely tiny.
They must have new, untrained people screwing things up this badly. You aren’t the only one with an error order on these.
That bites.
Saw that already tried the acetone wash.
Are you gonna return it back to the mint?
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/quarters/PCGS-2020-quarter-quest/album/247091
I had 4 orders of 99 for the morgan's when I caught them at a random off time a few days after release. All those orders got canceled because I had a $25 balance due with the mint because PayPal didn't pay the bill on an order for some reason and the US Mint shipped it anyway. Anyway, I submit in bulk so I buy in bulk.
Edited to add: I got taken to the cleaners on these if it makes anyone feel better.
I just got 3 Peace in the mail and all 3 have die polish lines by In God & the date.
Not a big deal and some collectors may not notice them but some may think the coin has been cleaned or wiped.
Edited to add photo:
Sorry. Yah they are noticeable. It’s killing me that so many of us are receiving dang seconds ( I know even worse they are firsts). $85 wait 5 months I am really exhausted and feeling like the wind has been knocked out of me. Wait wait wait and what a let down 🤨
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
So....from what I've been reading...is it safe to assume that most of these issues overall seem to be occurring on the obverse side of these coins? Only some strikethrough issues seem to be happening on the reverse.
No, both sides all 6 show problems. I’m up to 13 different types. There’s a lot of pictures on multiple threads. This is not limited to any one coin or obverse/reverse. 🤨
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
It is really time for the CU forum to add an
OUCH icon for threads like these.
Sorry is a button I would use 😬
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
Yes. I'm guessing it's a question of anvil vs hammer
I’ve noticed polishing lines on a few peaces as well.
VAM1-B
looks like maybe a small rough spot on the tip of her nose, if it is not just lighting reflection?
My US Mint Commemorative Medal Set
I spent quite a bit of time looking at raw 2021 Morgan’s and peace dollars for sale on eBay. When I magnify them , and their pictures, not stock photos, I’m finding way over 60-70 percent with scratches, dings etc rubs 😬 I foresee a lot of returns. They look good until you magnify. And we have identified problem areas, so when you head to the areas, there they are. 🤨
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
I know of 2 orders of 99 CC on same acct where USM applied an inconsistent rule and cancelled one of the orders.
Did not violate limits, did not fail for anything.
With all these issues popping up, I am so glad that I struck out ordering these coins from the Mint. I purchased all 6 coins slabbed PCGS MS70 from a dealer. Yes, it cost me quite a bit more, but I had no choice when I was unable to order them from the Mint. I'm glad the coins I purchased at MS70 will show no defects.
I prefer the peace obverse and the morgan reverse over the others. Anyone know a guy I can send one of each to and have him make me one with the peace obverse and morgan reverse?
Sorry for your woes.
The Mint needs to get its quality standards up.
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
And hopefully won’t develop any. Sounds like you did make a good choice for you and that’s the name of the game. Congratulations 😉
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
Not guaranteed. Remember a grade of 70 only means the highest grade the coin can receive. It does no guarantee a "perfect" coin. I have seen way too many coins in a 70 slab that had obvious marks and defects visible to the naked eye.
Also, once all the Franklin Mint Boomers are gone the gimmick labels ( FDOI, First Strike, Advance Release, ect.) will become worthless. The next label to come is the Pre Release label that only has a picture of the coin in it.
I am sure you will also see many in 70 slabs with the same defects on them.
I am curious who the FDOI, First Strike, Advance Release label collectors are. How big is the market and what are the demographics? I suspect deep pocketed registry set collectors for whom the extra $ for the label is meaningless. Anyone with any insight?
Somehow I doubt it’s “Franklin Mint Boomers”.
What I was trying to convey was the idea that the younger generations are loosing interest in collecting coins and the market for reselling these coins will shrink and the value will shrink as well. While it is clear the market for these labels is strong now, I do not believe it will hold in the future. I have seen things hot in the market eventually take a nose dive off the cliff.
While the inherent value of the coins themselves will make the gimmicks last longer they will eventually loose their appeal.
If that's the case , then the ratings services are suspect and not following their own standards. A 70 grade should mean no visible defects at 5X magnification. But, it would not surprise me. Everyone is pushing these coins through for the $.
I agree that many of the labels are gimmicky, but am curious who is paying the premium. I don’t see the value long term either.
I don’t necessarily agree that younger generations are losing interest in numismatics. Would be curious to hear views from some larger dealers and auction companies what age demographics they see and whether they perceive a loss of interest. Of course many of us on the younger side have smaller budgets, buy online instead of in-person and approach the hobby very differently than the boomers and for these reasons it may be hard to truly measure younger engagement.
What really bothers me are all the coins sold by MCM/GovMint that have labels signed by John Mercanti. That guy signs everything - even coins he has no involvement with. Again, it's all for the $.
Using superglue, stick them together and voila, you have a two ounce coin
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/quarters/PCGS-2020-quarter-quest/album/247091
I had never considered the possibility that TPG might grade on a curve. Interesting if correct
100% positive transactions with SurfinxHI, bigole, 1madman, collectorcoins, proofmorgan, Luke Marshall, silver pop, golden egg, point five zero,coin22lover, alohagary, blaircountycoin,joebb21
how many people here are returning their entire shipment of a single mintmark morgan (ex: all Ds are bad) or peace?
I'll post pictures tomorrow to the 2021 Morgan Dollar Defects Thread. I have a D with a horrible contact mark across the face.
This shows the problem with photos. Probably also photos through capsules. I've been through over 100 in- hand. The number with scratches and dings or spotting are only 15 so far. Nowhere near 60 or 70%
Just from reading the posts, looks like the D's have the most issues?
All surveys and studies in the coin market and elsewhere show collector bases to be old and getting older. I posted links a couple weeks ago. You can Google them yourself.
Be careful of inductive reasoning. A few young collectors doesn't prove there are millions of them.
Demographic trends are a challenge for all collector markets. Millennial and Gen Z simply aren't (on average) into artifacts as much as Gen X and earlier generations.
Check your tracking numbers if you're still waiting on your orders. Finally got a update on my D and S order. Shipped Oct 24, should have it Nov 6.
Throw a coin enough times, and suppose one day it lands on its edge.
.
5X magnification is a lot. The majority of coins in 70 slabs will show defects at 5X.
Who needs magnification to hit an at least 25% problem rate
Got fairly decent ones so nothing being returned from my end.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/quarters/PCGS-2020-quarter-quest/album/247091
I've now gone through 120 coins. 18 had problems under 5x magnification - including the one where the spot washed off. That's 15% not "at least 25%".
The force has a disturbance. It’s as if thousands of coins cried out in pain and were suddenly returned.
Curious. Did you send the 100 without problems in for grading since you received much better ones on average than I did? If not, are they on BST, or are you selling them on eBay OGP? If OGP on eBay, please remind me what your store is called.
My US Mint Commemorative Medal Set
My Peace dollars all look like this. Hazing and some spots on the reverse. Morgans are not any better with more marks on them than hazing. Marks like others have posted.
Sorry to hear about that. Well you have joined the club (although it’s not very exclusive anymore). It’s crazy the different amount of problems. Look back at all these posts. It’s not a good look.
Worst part was waiting 5 months for these. I really feel like the wind has been knocked out of me.
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
Looks like the HHL has been lifted on these. They haven't hung the Sold Out signs yet... hmmmmm
Its absolutely crazy! Of the dozen or so I have received, I have not noticed any problems with naked eye....Im afraid to use magnification! Not sending any in so I'm good with that.
There seem to have been a few more cancellations which I think they can resell. Still a bit unsure of some kinds of returns. Maybe they resell unopened boxes of returns. Don't really want to restart that return discussion.
This is good news that the HHL is gone except I still think there should be some order limit on these secondary offerings, like 3 or 10 again. Not a big fan of the 99 order limits when so many did not get any direct that tried the first time.
My US Mint Commemorative Medal Set
HHL been gone for awhile 😉. Agree unless you got 99 funky coins
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
I think the difference now to reopen sales might be that they have shipped a lot of them and some of the fairy dust has settled.
My US Mint Commemorative Medal Set
New postal employee 4 hrs late and i hear the box hitting the front porch. She just tossed it. Now I was planning on taking all the boxes unopened to a pcgs event but these Peace dollars sound like there all jiggling around the inside of the box. Update decided to open the peace box and all coin were still in the boxes. 1 Peace has a nice hit right on the cheek and no point in sending that one in. The other two look good. I may do a pocket piece with the bad one....
I used to be famous now I just collect coins.
Link to My Registry Set.
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/quarters/washington-quarters-specialty-sets/washington-quarters-complete-variety-set-circulation-strikes-1932-1964/publishedset/78469
Varieties Are The Spice Of LIFE and Thanks to Those who teach us what to search For.