@Bullsitter said:
About a dozen sold on ebay yesterday for $150-$185....
When they are available for sale at a dealer, I will not pay more than $125 each (preferably less). If the dealers get greedy, I will pass on these and maybe wait for them to sell on ebay for around the issue price.
@JeffM said:
I can't wait for the flippers to come on here, puff their chests out, and boast about the hundreds of Morgans and Peace Dollars they bought.
Any body can get hundreds of these the HHL of 10 is only for the first 24 hours. Then it is what ever you can afford.
Remember these won't ship until October.
They will buy them all on the first minute of the first hour of the first day. Many of the flippers have teams of hired goons who each order the HHL of 10. On the second day, the flippers will just buy a couple hundred more on their own.
Why do you think these will sell out?
The mint knows these are losers, that's why they had the ANA pressure the official grading company of the ANA to make them part of the Morgan Dollar Registry set.
@JeffM said:
I can't wait for the flippers to come on here, puff their chests out, and boast about the hundreds of Morgans and Peace Dollars they bought.
Any body can get hundreds of these the HHL of 10 is only for the first 24 hours. Then it is what ever you can afford.
Remember these won't ship until October.
They will buy them all on the first minute of the first hour of the first day. Many of the flippers have teams of hired goons who each order the HHL of 10. On the second day, the flippers will just buy a couple hundred more on their own.
Why do you think these will sell out?
The mint knows these are losers, that's why they had the ANA pressure the official grading company of the ANA to make them part of the Morgan Dollar Registry set.
Well, I certainly hope that I am wrong, but I am basing it on prior experience with the Mint and flippers and dealers. They will grab them and market the hell out of them (especially the dealers). I foresee e-mail after e-mail coming from the dealers offering these in all forms and combinations. The flippers will also buy these in droves because, well, that's what the flippers do. They love to boast about the hundreds of coins they bought. Then, if they can't sell them, they will complain. As I said, I hope that I am wrong. But with my experiences with the Mint, I will not even try buying them from the Mint.
@JeffM said:
Well, I certainly hope that I am wrong, but I am basing it on prior experience with the Mint and flippers and dealers. They will grab them and market the hell out of them (especially the dealers). I foresee e-mail after e-mail coming from the dealers offering these in all forms and combinations. The flippers will also buy these in droves because, well, that's what the flippers do. They love to boast about the hundreds of coins they bought. Then, if they can't sell them, they will complain. As I said, I hope that I am wrong. But with my experiences with the Mint, I will not even try buying them from the Mint.
PFS is offering a commission of $145.05 for ten of the 05/24/21 'privy' releases.
@JeffM said:
Well, I certainly hope that I am wrong, but I am basing it on prior experience with the Mint and flippers and dealers. They will grab them and market the hell out of them (especially the dealers). I foresee e-mail after e-mail coming from the dealers offering these in all forms and combinations. The flippers will also buy these in droves because, well, that's what the flippers do. They love to boast about the hundreds of coins they bought. Then, if they can't sell them, they will complain. As I said, I hope that I am wrong. But with my experiences with the Mint, I will not even try buying them from the Mint.
PFS is offering a commission of $145.05 for ten of the 05/24/21 'privy' releases.
@morgansforever said:
By the time you finally get though and get one or the limit into your bag it will be unavailable or you will get hung up on a captcha screen, good times coming.
_PFS is offering a commission of $145.05 for ten of the 05/24/21 'privy' releases.
That's not a great deal you need to tie up $854.95 for 6 months in order to get 145.05 less shipping.
You're not going to tie up $854.95 for 6 months. Only a couple of weeks because the Mint doesn't hit your cc until shipment...
$145.05 or 16.97% for two weeks...
They may not hit your credit card until they ship, but you need to keep $854.95 available for six month as you don't exactly when your order is going to ship.
You also didn't take into consideration the shipping and insurance to get the package to PFS probably about $20.00
I see lots of presales on Ebay but they wont ship out till October. Thats 5 months of a time laps that should go against Ebays sales rules as your suppose to have the deal complete. If you wait past 3 months wont Ebay cancel the sale for failure to deliver?
@Coinnmore said:
I see lots of presales on Ebay but they wont ship out till October. Thats 5 months of a time laps that should go against Ebays sales rules as your suppose to have the deal complete. If you wait past 3 months wont Ebay cancel the sale for failure to deliver?
I do not believe ebay cancels those sales, unless the buyer files a non receipt claim. I believe, it used to be but I'm not sure if it still is, that pre sale items have a 30 day window to be delivered after item is purchased.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
@Coinnmore said:
I see lots of presales on Ebay but they wont ship out till October. Thats 5 months of a time laps that should go against Ebays sales rules as your suppose to have the deal complete. If you wait past 3 months wont Ebay cancel the sale for failure to deliver?
I do not believe ebay cancels those sales, unless the buyer files a non receipt claim. I believe, it used to be but I'm not sure if it still is, that pre sale items have a 30 day window to be delivered after item is purchased.
There you go a 30 day window now we’re talking a 150 day window talk about a problem. Can you imagine all those people demanding their coin after 30 days. 60 days. 90 days! After 120 days go by I can just imagine Ebay will refund all by then. This October release date will wreak havic on all those sales.
@Coinnmore said:
I see lots of presales on Ebay but they wont ship out till October. Thats 5 months of a time laps that should go against Ebays sales rules as your suppose to have the deal complete. If you wait past 3 months wont Ebay cancel the sale for failure to deliver?
I do not believe ebay cancels those sales, unless the buyer files a non receipt claim. I believe, it used to be but I'm not sure if it still is, that pre sale items have a 30 day window to be delivered after item is purchased.
There you go a 30 day window now we’re talking a 150 day window talk about a problem. Can you imagine all those people demanding their coin after 30 days. 60 days. 90 days! After 120 days go by I can just imagine Ebay will refund all by then. This October release date will wreak havic on all those sales.
Honestly, I'm not sure how eBay will handle it. I think it is going to be more of a problem for the buyers than the sellers. eBay will NOT void those sales unless the buyer requests it. Presumably, the buyer knows they are buying a coin that won't deliver until October. Come October, however, you won't have any of your normal eBay protections and your only option will be a credit card chargeback.
Personally, I would neither buy nor sell anything on a 5 month pre-sale. I'm just asking for trouble.
@carew4me said:
So 175,000 per issue (200k Peace)
Ryder said they had difficulty securing the 1 million+ blanks.
This tells me there will be NO other 2021 special sets or additional issues that feature these coins.
Also , dealers get 17,500 of each issue secured. flood of 70s will hit market.
The flood of dealer buys didn't hurt the 2020 privy silver eagle..I have had 50 -100 coin lots of the privy eagles offered in last 3 months ... Buying the 2021 morgans
@carew4me said:
So 175,000 per issue (200k Peace)
Also , dealers get 17,500 of each issue secured. flood of 70s will hit market.
Several dealers have been offering these to their main customers on a pre-order basis, with competitive prices guaranteed, and delivery sometime in October. By grading in bulk it costs them less than an individual can sending in only a couple of each type, and no risk of getting a few 69's to try to sell, when those will the be in the market possibly at a lower cost.
Simple, easy, reliable. I will support my favorite dealers on this one and buy from them.
@AlexinPA said:
"The Mint Director emphasized that they are not commemorative coins."
What are they really? And 'Privy Marks'?
They are not commemorative coins as they do not belong to the Commemorative Series which has been ongoing since 1982.
This are tribute coins like the 2014 JFK Half Dollars, 2009 UHR St Gaudens, 2016 Mercury Dime, Standing Liberty Quarter and the 2016 Walking liberty Half, and many more.
I see these as a continuation of the Morgan and Peace series. Kennedy Half Dollars haven't been made for circulation since 2001, dollar coins haven't been made for circulation since 2012, we even have a new NCLT series the American Innovation Dollars not being made for circulation. So I have no problem grouping the 2021 coins with the original series.
How about FIRST STRIKE ELIGABILITY? I was going to buy a total of 5 in a order and the buy (1) one so I can open and touch one. Do this on both types and save the unopened boxes for possible First Strike grading in the future. Usually time does not matter as that usually goes by the Mint ship date. But since their ship date will be 150 days out from purchase date. When does our host start their First Strike elgability? Does it go buy official issue date or mint ship date? I am guessing May 24th is the start date but if I never open the box of 5 should be eligible for FS. Sorry if this question sound off sense. 👀
@Coinnmore said:
How about FIRST STRIKE ELIGABILITY? I was going to buy a total of 5 in a order and the buy (1) one so I can open and touch one. Do this on both types and save the unopened boxes for possible First Strike grading in the future. Usually time does not matter as that usually goes by the Mint ship date. But since their ship date will be 150 days out from purchase date. When does our host start their First Strike elgability? Does it go buy official issue date or mint ship date? I am guessing May 24th is the start date but if I never open the box of 5 should be eligible for FS. Sorry if this question sound off sense. 👀
Personally, I'm not sure I would ever set things like this aside for future first strike. You can't get bulk pricing on the grading. It will be cheaper to buy First Strike later than it will ever be to have your own coins graded.
All you do is risk discovering 2 years later that there are only 4 coins in the box rather than 5.
Based on the recent 2021 Christa and Law commemoratives with delayed shipping, the first strike eligibility for these silver dollars will likely start the first day the Mint actually ships, and then continue eligible 30 days from then. Inside the Mint box the packing slip has the date the order was shipped.
@AlexinPA said:
"The Mint Director emphasized that they are not commemorative coins."
What are they really? And 'Privy Marks'?
"While the 2021 Morgan and Peace Dollars coins commemorate the 100th anniversaries of each coin, they are not technically considered commemorative coins according to traditional definitions of that term. Commemorative coins, as defined in this report, by the U.S. Mint, and by the Commemorative Coin Reform Act (CCRA), are authorized by Congress to “celebrate and honor American people, places, events, and institutions” and “help raise money for important causes.”80 The 2021 Morgan and Peace dollars are differentiated from other commemorative coins because proceeds from their sale are not statutorily designated for a specific recipient group. They are solely minted to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the coins, not to raise money."
Source: page 24 here
There are only two commemorative coin programs each year.
For 2021, they were:
~ McAuliffe
~ National Law Enforcement Memorial & Museum Press Release
Their delay in shipping could very well be to know how many to strike so that everyone who wants one can get one. Tells me flipability is newgative. They are likely to also package them in different "products"/sets before Oct. which would also enlighten them on how many to strike.
Just another direct from the mint bullion product at a high premium? I say yes. I'll stick with the basic bullion ASEs. More bang for the buck.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
From the above CoinWorld article: "The mint was able to secure 1,075,000 total planchets, for production spread among six different coins at three mints, Ryder said."
that's enough planchets for an average of aprox. 180K coins for each of the six issues. You guys order as many of the first ones as you can and I'll wait for the last ones which will hopefully experience a planchet shortage.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
It’s interesting that PFS is setting a firm price they’ll pay to the flippers but yet other, including those who are part of this website, have not yet set a price but are “feeling out the market” before they provide/commit to a a price for a set of 10.
@HoneyMarket said:
It’s interesting that PFS is setting a firm price they’ll pay to the flippers but yet other, including those who are part of this website, have not yet set a price but are “feeling out the market” before they provide/commit to a a price for a set of 10.
Not really, they know they can get all they want when the household limit of ten expires. Why pay for something you can do yourself?
@HoneyMarket said:
It’s interesting that PFS is setting a firm price they’ll pay to the flippers but yet other, including those who are part of this website, have not yet set a price but are “feeling out the market” before they provide/commit to a a price for a set of 10.
Not really, they know they can get all they want when the household limit of ten expires. Why pay for something you can do yourself?
I don't think that is the reason. You are assuming that there will be any available when the HHL comes off. For some issues, by the way, they never pull the HHL. While there will be some available on later mornings, there may not be many and you are still competing against other people sitting on them.
If I believed in this issue, I would gladly pay $15 over the issue price for several hundred of them. This is inherently riskier than other issues for a couple of reasons:
You've got 5 Morgans. Will everyone want all 5 or just one? [Peace might be a better bet.] If people only want one representative coin (at $100 each, by the way) then you've got nearly a million of them available.
There is no way you get these for 4 or 5 months, maybe longer. What is the market situation at that time? You are going to have a lot of flippers selling these into the market for months before they actually arrive. In 5 months, the price could be below issue price. If the market price drops, you will have thousands of cancellations. It is quite possible that this issue is sold out tomorrow and then still available at Christmas. [See 2017 Enhanced Uncirculated sets for reference]
@derryb said:
From the above CoinWorld article: "The mint was able to secure 1,075,000 total planchets, for production spread among six different coins at three mints, Ryder said."
that's enough planchets for an average of aprox. 180K coins for each of the six issues. You guys order as many of the first ones as you can and I'll wait for the last ones which will hopefully experience a planchet shortage.
It's worth pointing out that you can't know which one is the last one struck. They don't have to strike them in the same order that they released them.
Those buying just 1 for yourself, are you sending it in to be graded? I'd like it graded, but want a 70. Big risk if I buy from mint and have it graded. But cheaper than buying a 70 on eBay later. Torn.
@MsMorrisine said:
you're late to the game, derryb
the mintages for the issues are already set. 175k for each morgan and 200k for the peace.
the planchet issue should say something to those who think there will be a "set" on sale this year.
This is a pretty easy concept to understand. Why are so many having difficulty with it? The mint secured a set number of planchets and as you said the mintages are set... so each item can be ordered up to the mintage limit and it has no effect on the succeeding ones and unless a bunch of each remain unsold, which is unlikely, it leaves nothing for a potential "set".
@MsMorrisine said:
you're late to the game, derryb
the mintages for the issues are already set. 175k for each morgan and 200k for the peace.
the planchet issue should say something to those who think there will be a "set" on sale this year.
This is a pretty easy concept to understand. Why are so many having difficulty with it? The mint secured a set number of planchets and as you said the mintages are set... so each item can be ordered up to the mintage limit and it has no effect on the succeeding ones and unless a bunch of each remain unsold, which is unlikely, it leaves nothing for a potential "set".
The mintage numbers have NOT been determined. Only the product limit.
No mintage limit have been set. Product limits (the single packaged coin) have been set that match the total number of the unique planchets currently available. If coins do not sell out at the product limit and mint does not acquire more planchets, remaining planchets can and will likely be used for sets which can be sold as separate products. There's a reason why the six coins are being sold well before actual release and it likely has to do with further products.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@Rob9874 said:
Those buying just 1 for yourself, are you sending it in to be graded? I'd like it graded, but want a 70. Big risk if I buy from mint and have it graded. But cheaper than buying a 70 on eBay later. Torn.
It is almost always cheaper to buy a 70 on eBay, especially if you wait a bit. The 70s will cost you a premium if you buy in the middle of the initial hype. Wait 6 months and the 70s will probably be cheaper than you could do it yourself UNLESS the yield on 70s is very low. But, if the yield on 70s is really low, you are likely to spend $50 to get your coin into a 69 holder anyway.
@derryb said:
No mintage limit have been set. Product limits (the single packaged coin) have been set that match the total number of the unique planchets currently available. If coins do not sell out at the product limit and mint does not acquire more planchets, remaining planchets can and will likely be used for sets which can be sold as separate products. There's a reason why the six coins are being sold well before actual release and it likely has to do with further products.
This is pure speculation and not terribly well reasoned. No offense.
There are good reasons to sell them before the actual issue date:
1. Gauge demand so you don't strike more coins than you need.
2. Space out your coin releases so you aren't flooding your system simultaneously with all of your releases late in the year.
3. Create hype
But there is almost zero point in doing so hoping that the issue is undersubscribed so that you have leftover planchets for another issue later in the year:
If the initial release is undersubscribed, then demand is flaccid and won't support yet another issue.
You would need to have significant excess capacity in your operation to be able to produce a new product later in the year.
You can't simply put together a new set on a couple of weeks' notice. You have to prepare dies, get approvals, order packaging, etc.
If there is going to be another set released later this year, it is ALREADY PLANNED and in pre-production right now.
Just received an email from the Mint announcing today's sale of the Morgan dollars. Included in the text is the statement "Only 175,000 coins featuring each privy mark will be produced.".
I still haven’t decided which ones I’ll try for: all, just the mintmarked ones + Peace, or just the Peace. I so wish I could see what the actual product looked like instead of the rendering. I haven’t been a big fan of the laser usage on dies for these, either. I feel like it loses some character.
@JeffM said:
Well, I certainly hope that I am wrong, but I am basing it on prior experience with the Mint and flippers and dealers. They will grab them and market the hell out of them (especially the dealers). I foresee e-mail after e-mail coming from the dealers offering these in all forms and combinations. The flippers will also buy these in droves because, well, that's what the flippers do. They love to boast about the hundreds of coins they bought. Then, if they can't sell them, they will complain. As I said, I hope that I am wrong. But with my experiences with the Mint, I will not even try buying them from the Mint.
PFS is offering a commission of $145.05 for ten of the 05/24/21 'privy' releases.
@derryb said:
No mintage limit have been set. Product limits (the single packaged coin) have been set that match the total number of the unique planchets currently available. If coins do not sell out at the product limit and mint does not acquire more planchets, remaining planchets can and will likely be used for sets which can be sold as separate products. There's a reason why the six coins are being sold well before actual release and it likely has to do with further products.
This is pure speculation and not terribly well reasoned. No offense.
None taken.
There are good reasons to sell them before the actual issue date:
Gauge demand so you don't strike more coins than you need.
They will use all of these unique planchets on these coins. What doesn't sell as individual coins will be released later in sets. This is the reason for the delay in shipping and why the need for pre-ordering.
Space out your coin releases so you aren't flooding your system simultaneously with all of your releases late in the year.
Agree, reduce website issues.
Create hype
Agree
But there is almost zero point in doing so hoping that the issue is undersubscribed so that you have leftover planchets for another issue later in the year.
I made no claim that mint hopes single coins are undersubscribed. I speculated that they are prepared with the set offerings in the event the individual coins are don't reach production limits.
If the initial release is undersubscribed, then demand is flaccid and won't support yet another issue.
There are always buyers for the special label set.
You would need to have significant excess capacity in your operation to be able to produce a new product later in the year.
You can't simply put together a new set on a couple of weeks' notice. You have to prepare dies, get approvals, order packaging, etc.
Same coins, different product packaging. No excess capacity needed, just another packaging contract. Any sets later sold would include coins struck from the same dies (likely struck at the time of the original release) and would only require ordering packaging.
If there is going to be another set released later this year, it is ALREADY PLANNED and in pre-production right now.
Disagree. The possibilities for sets are in the pre-planning stage but only as a contingency for unsold coins struck from unique planchets. Implementation cannot begin until the number and type of unsold individual coins (or remaining planchets) becomes known. For this reason I suspect any sets will not be announced until after completion of sales for at least the first four coins.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
In 5 months, the price could be below issue price. If the market price drops, you will have thousands of cancellations. It is quite possible that this issue is sold out tomorrow and then still available at Christmas. [See 2017 Enhanced Uncirculated sets for reference]
I remember those Enhanced Uncirculated sets what exciting times back then buying all them fancy graded labeled sets!!!!! In fact I still have all them fancy graded labeled sets that I spent BIG MONEY on back then! I am going to leave them to my grand daughter with a special note to get the big bucks on these after I am gone!
Comments
When they are available for sale at a dealer, I will not pay more than $125 each (preferably less). If the dealers get greedy, I will pass on these and maybe wait for them to sell on ebay for around the issue price.
Why do you think these will sell out?
The mint knows these are losers, that's why they had the ANA pressure the official grading company of the ANA to make them part of the Morgan Dollar Registry set.
Well, I certainly hope that I am wrong, but I am basing it on prior experience with the Mint and flippers and dealers. They will grab them and market the hell out of them (especially the dealers). I foresee e-mail after e-mail coming from the dealers offering these in all forms and combinations. The flippers will also buy these in droves because, well, that's what the flippers do. They love to boast about the hundreds of coins they bought. Then, if they can't sell them, they will complain. As I said, I hope that I am wrong. But with my experiences with the Mint, I will not even try buying them from the Mint.
PFS is offering a commission of $145.05 for ten of the 05/24/21 'privy' releases.
Link
Note - I do not know how this commission compares to prior offers.
That's not a great deal you need to tie up $854.95 for 6 months in order to get 145.05 less shipping.
You're not going to tie up $854.95 for 6 months. Only a couple of weeks because the Mint doesn't hit your cc until shipment...
$145.05 or 16.97% for two weeks...
Interesting. $14.50 profit per coin really doesn't seem like much. And I guess you don't get to keep any for yourself!
Yum 🤤 now I want steak 🥩
They may not hit your credit card until they ship, but you need to keep $854.95 available for six month as you don't exactly when your order is going to ship.
You also didn't take into consideration the shipping and insurance to get the package to PFS probably about $20.00
pfs says they provide the prepaid shipping label.
I see lots of presales on Ebay but they wont ship out till October. Thats 5 months of a time laps that should go against Ebays sales rules as your suppose to have the deal complete. If you wait past 3 months wont Ebay cancel the sale for failure to deliver?
I do not believe ebay cancels those sales, unless the buyer files a non receipt claim. I believe, it used to be but I'm not sure if it still is, that pre sale items have a 30 day window to be delivered after item is purchased.
There you go a 30 day window now we’re talking a 150 day window talk about a problem. Can you imagine all those people demanding their coin after 30 days. 60 days. 90 days! After 120 days go by I can just imagine Ebay will refund all by then. This October release date will wreak havic on all those sales.
Honestly, I'm not sure how eBay will handle it. I think it is going to be more of a problem for the buyers than the sellers. eBay will NOT void those sales unless the buyer requests it. Presumably, the buyer knows they are buying a coin that won't deliver until October. Come October, however, you won't have any of your normal eBay protections and your only option will be a credit card chargeback.
Personally, I would neither buy nor sell anything on a 5 month pre-sale. I'm just asking for trouble.
The flood of dealer buys didn't hurt the 2020 privy silver eagle..I have had 50 -100 coin lots of the privy eagles offered in last 3 months ... Buying the 2021 morgans
Has anyone heard of anyone paying more than PFS?
BST references available on request
"The Mint Director emphasized that they are not commemorative coins."
What are they really? And 'Privy Marks'?
Several dealers have been offering these to their main customers on a pre-order basis, with competitive prices guaranteed, and delivery sometime in October. By grading in bulk it costs them less than an individual can sending in only a couple of each type, and no risk of getting a few 69's to try to sell, when those will the be in the market possibly at a lower cost.
Simple, easy, reliable. I will support my favorite dealers on this one and buy from them.
My US Mint Commemorative Medal Set
They are not commemorative coins as they do not belong to the Commemorative Series which has been ongoing since 1982.
This are tribute coins like the 2014 JFK Half Dollars, 2009 UHR St Gaudens, 2016 Mercury Dime, Standing Liberty Quarter and the 2016 Walking liberty Half, and many more.
I see these as a continuation of the Morgan and Peace series. Kennedy Half Dollars haven't been made for circulation since 2001, dollar coins haven't been made for circulation since 2012, we even have a new NCLT series the American Innovation Dollars not being made for circulation. So I have no problem grouping the 2021 coins with the original series.
How about FIRST STRIKE ELIGABILITY? I was going to buy a total of 5 in a order and the buy (1) one so I can open and touch one. Do this on both types and save the unopened boxes for possible First Strike grading in the future. Usually time does not matter as that usually goes by the Mint ship date. But since their ship date will be 150 days out from purchase date. When does our host start their First Strike elgability? Does it go buy official issue date or mint ship date? I am guessing May 24th is the start date but if I never open the box of 5 should be eligible for FS. Sorry if this question sound off sense. 👀
Personally, I'm not sure I would ever set things like this aside for future first strike. You can't get bulk pricing on the grading. It will be cheaper to buy First Strike later than it will ever be to have your own coins graded.
All you do is risk discovering 2 years later that there are only 4 coins in the box rather than 5.
@Coinnmore,
Based on the recent 2021 Christa and Law commemoratives with delayed shipping, the first strike eligibility for these silver dollars will likely start the first day the Mint actually ships, and then continue eligible 30 days from then. Inside the Mint box the packing slip has the date the order was shipped.
My US Mint Commemorative Medal Set
"While the 2021 Morgan and Peace Dollars coins commemorate the 100th anniversaries of each coin, they are not technically considered commemorative coins according to traditional definitions of that term. Commemorative coins, as defined in this report, by the U.S. Mint, and by the Commemorative Coin Reform Act (CCRA), are authorized by Congress to “celebrate and honor American people, places, events, and institutions” and “help raise money for important causes.”80 The 2021 Morgan and Peace dollars are differentiated from other commemorative coins because proceeds from their sale are not statutorily designated for a specific recipient group. They are solely minted to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the coins, not to raise money."
Source: page 24 here
There are only two commemorative coin programs each year.
For 2021, they were:
~ McAuliffe
~ National Law Enforcement Memorial & Museum
Press Release
Their delay in shipping could very well be to know how many to strike so that everyone who wants one can get one. Tells me flipability is newgative. They are likely to also package them in different "products"/sets before Oct. which would also enlighten them on how many to strike.
Just another direct from the mint bullion product at a high premium? I say yes. I'll stick with the basic bullion ASEs. More bang for the buck.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
12:30 est tomorrow and we’ll know how many flippers are buying 10
Yes, but it could be weeks before we know how many are returning them.
From the above CoinWorld article:
"The mint was able to secure 1,075,000 total planchets, for production spread among six different coins at three mints, Ryder said."
that's enough planchets for an average of aprox. 180K coins for each of the six issues. You guys order as many of the first ones as you can and I'll wait for the last ones which will hopefully experience a planchet shortage.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
you're late to the game, derryb
the mintages for the issues are already set. 175k for each morgan and 200k for the peace.
the planchet issue should say something to those who think there will be a "set" on sale this year.
months... perhaps once they can't be flipped, there will be returns in november
It’s interesting that PFS is setting a firm price they’ll pay to the flippers but yet other, including those who are part of this website, have not yet set a price but are “feeling out the market” before they provide/commit to a a price for a set of 10.
BST references available on request
Not really, they know they can get all they want when the household limit of ten expires. Why pay for something you can do yourself?
I don't think that is the reason. You are assuming that there will be any available when the HHL comes off. For some issues, by the way, they never pull the HHL. While there will be some available on later mornings, there may not be many and you are still competing against other people sitting on them.
If I believed in this issue, I would gladly pay $15 over the issue price for several hundred of them. This is inherently riskier than other issues for a couple of reasons:
It's worth pointing out that you can't know which one is the last one struck. They don't have to strike them in the same order that they released them.
Do you think I should put both coins in one order? or in two orders to save time for the first coin?
In for one each.
Box of 20
Same. Don't plan on collecting them however if they go annual. How about other folks? If they go annual are u in?
I'll buy 1 of each this year, but none in following years.
although if they mint peace dollars as they were minted in the 1900s, I might do a peace dollar run.
Those buying just 1 for yourself, are you sending it in to be graded? I'd like it graded, but want a 70. Big risk if I buy from mint and have it graded. But cheaper than buying a 70 on eBay later. Torn.
This is a pretty easy concept to understand. Why are so many having difficulty with it? The mint secured a set number of planchets and as you said the mintages are set... so each item can be ordered up to the mintage limit and it has no effect on the succeeding ones and unless a bunch of each remain unsold, which is unlikely, it leaves nothing for a potential "set".
The mintage numbers have NOT been determined. Only the product limit.
No mintage limit have been set. Product limits (the single packaged coin) have been set that match the total number of the unique planchets currently available. If coins do not sell out at the product limit and mint does not acquire more planchets, remaining planchets can and will likely be used for sets which can be sold as separate products. There's a reason why the six coins are being sold well before actual release and it likely has to do with further products.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
It is almost always cheaper to buy a 70 on eBay, especially if you wait a bit. The 70s will cost you a premium if you buy in the middle of the initial hype. Wait 6 months and the 70s will probably be cheaper than you could do it yourself UNLESS the yield on 70s is very low. But, if the yield on 70s is really low, you are likely to spend $50 to get your coin into a 69 holder anyway.
Things aren’t looking good for these coins coming out today.
This is pure speculation and not terribly well reasoned. No offense.
There are good reasons to sell them before the actual issue date:
1. Gauge demand so you don't strike more coins than you need.
2. Space out your coin releases so you aren't flooding your system simultaneously with all of your releases late in the year.
3. Create hype
But there is almost zero point in doing so hoping that the issue is undersubscribed so that you have leftover planchets for another issue later in the year:
If there is going to be another set released later this year, it is ALREADY PLANNED and in pre-production right now.
Just received an email from the Mint announcing today's sale of the Morgan dollars. Included in the text is the statement "Only 175,000 coins featuring each privy mark will be produced.".
I still haven’t decided which ones I’ll try for: all, just the mintmarked ones + Peace, or just the Peace. I so wish I could see what the actual product looked like instead of the rendering. I haven’t been a big fan of the laser usage on dies for these, either. I feel like it loses some character.
TurtleCat Gold Dollars
There are offers of +$60 per coin out there (or a $600 premium for household limit of 10).
PFS is paying a pittance. I like their emails in that it gives you an idea if there is any flipping potential, but no way would I use them.
None taken.
They will use all of these unique planchets on these coins. What doesn't sell as individual coins will be released later in sets. This is the reason for the delay in shipping and why the need for pre-ordering.
Agree, reduce website issues.
Agree
I made no claim that mint hopes single coins are undersubscribed. I speculated that they are prepared with the set offerings in the event the individual coins are don't reach production limits.
There are always buyers for the special label set.
Same coins, different product packaging. No excess capacity needed, just another packaging contract. Any sets later sold would include coins struck from the same dies (likely struck at the time of the original release) and would only require ordering packaging.
Disagree. The possibilities for sets are in the pre-planning stage but only as a contingency for unsold coins struck from unique planchets. Implementation cannot begin until the number and type of unsold individual coins (or remaining planchets) becomes known. For this reason I suspect any sets will not be announced until after completion of sales for at least the first four coins.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
@jmlanzaf said:
In 5 months, the price could be below issue price. If the market price drops, you will have thousands of cancellations. It is quite possible that this issue is sold out tomorrow and then still available at Christmas. [See 2017 Enhanced Uncirculated sets for reference]
I remember those Enhanced Uncirculated sets what exciting times back then buying all them fancy graded labeled sets!!!!! In fact I still have all them fancy graded labeled sets that I spent BIG MONEY on back then!
I am going to leave them to my grand daughter with a special note to get the big bucks on these after I am gone! 