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Eleanor Roosevelt 2014 First spouse Uncirculated Gold Sold out in 6 months. final sales # 1886, New

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    RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Raw Eleanor sealed UNC up to $1350.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!
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    winkywinky Posts: 1,671
    Let them go, I collect the real ROOSIE'S. image
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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭
    Drip. , drip , drip , drip....................



    30. - Florence



    77. - Grace



    One day these will be all gone. imageimage
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    fishcookerfishcooker Posts: 3,446 ✭✭
    It's possible, but why would someone melt 0.9999 gold which is backed by the US Mint.
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    OverdateOverdate Posts: 6,942 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>It's possible, but why would someone melt 0.9999 gold which is backed by the US Mint. >>


    Reportedly thousands of the 2007 first spouses were melted during the gold runup.

    My Adolph A. Weinman signature :)

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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭
    This is a funny funny game. But not a humorous game at all.
    Looks like some returns came in




    Florence Harding Proofs left : 44

    Grace Coolidge Proofs left. : 76
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    MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 32,230 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>It's possible, but why would someone melt 0.9999 gold which is backed by the US Mint. >>


    Reportedly thousands of the 2007 first spouses were melted during the gold runup. >>



    still...

    it's four nines pure.

    who'd want to cut that to 3? it'd still trade for melt no matter. it is still puzzling to me to hear anyone wanting to melt a 99.99% product.

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
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    kiyotekiyote Posts: 5,568 ✭✭✭✭✭
    You buy it for the purity then use it for jewelry or industrial applications. Don't forget gold's value to industry. There are people who could care less if it's a queen or a baboon's butt on a coin-- they just need pure gold for its physical properties.

    Also, if a dealer buys 10 first spouse coins for melt and can't sell them for $50 over melt why not send them to the refiner and get a check?
    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
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    jmski52jmski52 Posts: 22,383 ✭✭✭✭✭
    You can count on some further returns. The coins I received this week were obviously picked-over, had sticky notes stuck to the Mint boxes, and half-open capsules loose in the boxes, not to mention some unfortunate and hard-to-ignore marks on some of the coins. I've been led to believe that the Mint doesn't recycle rejects, but that's BS as far as I'm concerned.
    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
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    MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 32,230 ✭✭✭✭✭
    loose coins is not new. it's an ongoing issue even with first day releases.


    the mint definitely re-sells returns.





    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
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    kiyotekiyote Posts: 5,568 ✭✭✭✭✭
    You'd think with only 1500 coins struck the quality would be about the same across the board but obviously not. Did you order 2013, 2014 or 2015 spouses?
    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭


    << <i>loose coins is not new. it's an ongoing issue even with first day releases.


    the mint definitely re-sells returns. >>





    Ive long suspected that the big MS/PF 70 Flippers ordered in the 100's, submitted, then returned and/or ebayed the non-70 rejects.

    Small buyers get stuck buying returns.

    Bunch of BS if you ask me.
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    kiyotekiyote Posts: 5,568 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Fullstrike, which year coins did you order? Thanks for the heads up.
    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Fullstrike, which year coins did you order? Thanks for the heads up. >>



    Like most I ordered a few in the beginning, M Washington, Dolly Madison, a few
    Liberties and maybe a few I just can't remember.

    Most recently I got about 6 - 2013's and I've got around 14 -2014's.

    I fully expect to be burned on all these but it's still Gold - isn't it?

    At the worst it's slingshot ammo. Don't laugh, I'll bet it would hurt.

    image


    I sort of plan to get most of the rest of these Spouses (2015 onward - nothing from past years)in BU but I'm just
    not in the mood with Bess Truman or Mamie Eisenhower. Jackie O, yes,
    most definitely.
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    jmski52jmski52 Posts: 22,383 ✭✭✭✭✭
    You'd think with only 1500 coins struck the quality would be about the same across the board but obviously not. Did you order 2013, 2014 or 2015 spouses?

    I ordered 2 ea. of the remaining Unc 2014 Spouses. Sent back 1 ea. of all 3. Decided to try again later, maybe. We're probably slogging through the low mintage point of the series, but nobody ever said it would be easy.image
    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
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    kiyotekiyote Posts: 5,568 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I just picked up a Grace Coolidge PCGS MS70 FS off of eBay. I dumped my Lucy and Lucretia MS69 FSs for barely above what the mint is charging for new coins. (I got $825) which is thankfully what I paid for them.
    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
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    RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Chasing the key is an expensive game. Eleanor could easily be unseated. Who knows? Unless one wants to keep each of the contenders long term, as each is unseated one will likely have to sell at a loss. There can be only one key in the end.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!
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    It does not matter whether Eleanor Roosevelt coins will be unseated or not. They will soon become the the most expensive first spouse coins.
    I have recently been informed (by credible sources) that several dealers have hoarded hundreds of 2014 and 2015 FS gold coins. I don't think that these "smart cookies" are hoarding them for melting in the future image




    << <i>Chasing the key is an expensive game. Eleanor could easily be unseated. Who knows? Unless one wants to keep each of the contenders long term, as each is unseated one will likely have to sell at a loss. There can be only one key in the end. >>

    To the free man, the country is the collection of individuals who compose it, not something over and above them. -M. Friedman
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    RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>It does not matter whether Eleanor Roosevelt coins will be unseated or not. They will soon become the the most expensive first spouse coins.
    I have recently been informed (by credible sources) that several dealers have hoarded hundreds of 2014 and 2015 FS gold coins. I don't think that these "smart cookies" are hoarding them for melting in the future image




    << <i>Chasing the key is an expensive game. Eleanor could easily be unseated. Who knows? Unless one wants to keep each of the contenders long term, as each is unseated one will likely have to sell at a loss. There can be only one key in the end. >>

    >>



    Of course anything is possible, but whichever FS was key at a given time has, I believe, always been the most valuable at that time. In the end, whichever UNC is the low mintage key will, I think very likely be the most valuable.

    I've been impressed at how quickly the immediately former key drops as well.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!
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    CalGoldCalGold Posts: 2,609 ✭✭
    Sorry to spoil the party but it is naïve to believe that whichever coin winds up with the lowest mintage will become the “key” to the series. When there are more coins than collectors for all coins in the series nothing is a key. How many people are actually actively collecting these with the goal of completing the set vs. the number of speculators? The trend has been declining mintages followed by brief periods of sales at premium prices for the new low mintage coin, right after anyone who was really collecting these could have purchased as many as they wanted at issue price from the Mint. Since the set builders already would have bought their coins, the resales as premiums were to speculators who will in a short while just dump them and cut their losses or hold them and then dump them at the first sight of the possibility of getting their money back. A mintage of 1886 with a 100% survival rate and many in the hands of speculators shows how few people really are collecting these and does not inspire confidence of future premium prices. And this does not even account for proofs which are generally considered more attractive by collectors and more likely to be what any new collectors will want.

    CG
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    wondercoinwondercoin Posts: 16,732 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The "key" maybe the spouse de jour that someone needs and is willing to pay up for. In other words, you want a Margaret Taylor PR70FS... try to buy one today for less than an E. Roosevelt MS (or at nearly any reasonable price level). For that matter, watch what you have to pay for a Julia Tyler MS70FS if you need one quickly. If you want a complete collection... There may only be a few dealers in the country that can supply a full set at a reasonable price same day. A complete collection may turn out to be the "key". Or, maybe the (8) pc. Liberty sets (or 10 pc) turn out to be the "key". Who knows what the future holds for this series.

    I am personally putting the "finishing touches" on completing roughly (10) complete PCGS 70 sets (MS and Pr) 2007-date. When I start to offer a few for sale in a few years, will they outperform my AAPL stock I have held for a number of years? Highly unlikely. But, I had fun building them and that's what DH told me to do with my coins!

    Just my 2 cents.

    Wondercoin
    Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
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    OperationButterOperationButter Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭
    Fast forward 10 years and I am willing to bet that it will be VERY difficult to find a full set of spouses. The key will probably be the entire series after the next run up in gold.
    Gold is for savings. Fiat is for transactions.



    BST Transactions (as the seller): Collectall, GRANDAM, epcjimi1, wondercoin, jmski52, wheathoarder, jay1187, jdsueu, grote15, airplanenut, bigole
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    RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Sorry to spoil the party but it is naïve to believe that whichever coin winds up with the lowest mintage will become the “key” to the series. When there are more coins than collectors for all coins in the series nothing is a key. How many people are actually actively collecting these with the goal of completing the set vs. the number of speculators? The trend has been declining mintages followed by brief periods of sales at premium prices for the new low mintage coin, right after anyone who was really collecting these could have purchased as many as they wanted at issue price from the Mint. Since the set builders already would have bought their coins, the resales as premiums were to speculators who will in a short while just dump them and cut their losses or hold them and then dump them at the first sight of the possibility of getting their money back. A mintage of 1886 with a 100% survival rate and many in the hands of speculators shows how few people really are collecting these and does not inspire confidence of future premium prices. And this does not even account for proofs which are generally considered more attractive by collectors and more likely to be what any new collectors will want.

    CG >>



    Sorry if I'm missing something, replying quickly from my phone.
    I've observed that whichever UNC had the lowest mintage at the time has commanded the highest prices.
    I sold a Julia MS70 FS for $4k when she was key. Hayes, then Garfield brought the big bucks. Eleanor came in lowest now Hayes and Garfield have dropped substantially.
    I'm defining key as the lowest mintage post final, audited sales figures.
    When the series is competed w/all audited sales figures in I think that its a safe bet that the lowest mintage MS70FS and for that matter that coin raw, in OGP, will realize the highest prices.
    I think that this is absolutely consistent with behavior to date.
    I think that final, audited sales figures are easier to demonstrate and to prove than survival.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!
  • Options
    wondercoinwondercoin Posts: 16,732 ✭✭✭✭✭
    "I think that its a safe bet that the lowest mintage MS70FS and for that matter that coin raw, in OGP, will realize the highest prices."

    I am not at all clear why a lower mintage coin with 200-300+ FS70's will be higher priced than a low pop (perhaps sub-100) 70FS coin (with a higher mintage). Like I said, try buying a Margaret Taylor PR70DC FS today for the same price as an E. Roosevelt PR70DC FS (or MS70FS for that matter).

    In fact, I would be surprised if E. Roosevelt ends up the low mintage coin.

    Just my 2 cents.

    Wondercoin

    Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
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    RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>"I think that its a safe bet that the lowest mintage MS70FS and for that matter that coin raw, in OGP, will realize the highest prices."

    I am not at all clear why a lower mintage coin with 200-300+ FS70's will be higher priced than a low pop (perhaps sub-100) 70FS coin (with a higher mintage). Like I said, try buying a Margaret Taylor PR70DC FS today for the same price as an E. Roosevelt PR70DC FS (or MS70FS for that matter).

    In fact, I would be surprised if E. Roosevelt ends up the low mintage coin.

    Just my 2 cents.

    Wondercoin >>



    Hi Mitch,
    I was basing my comments on the prior prices realized for whichever MS coin was the key at the time.
    If there has been a time when the then current low mintage key MS coin has not also brought the highest prices both in MS70 and raw then I've just missed it.

    I totally agree that Eleanor could b unseated.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!
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    wondercoinwondercoin Posts: 16,732 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Raufus .. sounds reasonable.

    When the dust settles, there may be some fairly high priced coins throughout the spouse series that have low mintages, but nowhere near the absolute lowest levels.

    Supply and demand.

    Consider that the lowest mintage proof Buffalo Gold $50 is hardly worth anything today while the higher mintage 2008-W Proof $50 flourishes.

    Just my two cents.

    Wondercoin
    Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
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    RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Mitch,
    I was getting ready to edit my note to say that I absolutely defer to u in terms of moderns knowledge. My posts were based on my own close following of the MS Spouse coins.

    I've not really followed the proofs as its whichever MS spouse that ends up with the lowest mintage that will likely b the lowest mintage coin in a century. That intregues me.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!
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    OperationButterOperationButter Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭
    I think Eleanor will most likely be unseated. We know that the 2013s wont do it and its somewhat doubtful that another 2014 will do it. Will it be a 2015...
    Gold is for savings. Fiat is for transactions.



    BST Transactions (as the seller): Collectall, GRANDAM, epcjimi1, wondercoin, jmski52, wheathoarder, jay1187, jdsueu, grote15, airplanenut, bigole
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    Notice who are on NGC's first spouse special label?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2560608/Eleanor-Roosevelt-tops-poll-popular-ladies.html

    Eleanor Roosevelt tops poll of most popular first ladies, Michelle Obama comes in fifth

    Eleanor Roosevelt has been voted the greatest first lady of the U.S. for the fifth time
    The survey has been conducted five times since 1982
    Michelle Obama came in fifth and Hillary Clinton was sixth
    Following Roosevelt were Abigail Adams, Jacqueline Kennedy and Dolly Madison
    Laura Bush, Pat Nixon, Mamie Eisenhower, and Bess Truman were voted the first ladies who 'could have done more'


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2560608/Eleanor-Roosevelt-tops-poll-popular-ladies.html#ixzz3Z8GDcZoQ
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

    Eleanor Roosevelt was named the greatest first lady of the United States in a survey of historians released on Saturday, while Michelle Obama, in fifth place, edged out Hillary Clinton in sixth.


    Roosevelt, whose husband, Franklin, served as president from 1933 to 1945, has come up number one each of the five times the survey has been conducted by Siena College Research Institute since 1982.


    In the top finishers after Roosevelt were Abigail Adams, Jacqueline Kennedy and Dolley Madison.


    President Harry S. Truman later called Eleanor Roosevelt the 'First Lady of the World' in tribute to her human rights achievements, which include civil rights activism and playing a role in drafting the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

    She was the first presidential spouse to hold press conferences, write a syndicated newspaper column, and speak at a national convention.

    'What’s surprising is the incredible consistency this poll has shown for 32 years,' Don Levy, director of the Siena Research Institute in Loudonville, New York told the Christian Science Monitor. 'Still, Eleanor Roosevelt is far and away the top-rated first lady.'

    'It’s not even close,' he says.

    Least impressive, according to the survey, was Jane Pierce, the wife of 14th U.S. president, Franklin Pierce.


    Although historians disagree over exactly when the title of first lady came into common usage, it has traditionally been given to a president's wife and is an unofficial, but potentially powerful, role.

    Pollsters asked 242 historians and political scientists to rate 38 presidents' wives in 10 categories such as 'courage,' 'integrity,' 'value to the country' and 'accomplishments.'





    To the free man, the country is the collection of individuals who compose it, not something over and above them. -M. Friedman
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    wondercoinwondercoin Posts: 16,732 ✭✭✭✭✭
    #2 and #4 greatest First Ladies of all time still sell around melt to this day. Sometimes back of melt.

    Obviously, popularity has not translated into value after 8 years.

    I'm not betting the ranch #1 most popular is going to mean all that much down the road.

    Just my two cents.

    Wondercoin.
    Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
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    kiyotekiyote Posts: 5,568 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Non-key Raw and MS69 coins are still going very cheaply. An Unc Mary Todd Lincoln, for example, has a mintage of less than 4,000. In an age of 100k+ coins all over the place that still seems really low.
    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
  • Options
    What's are the mintage of the #2 and #4 greatest First Ladies of all time ? 20k?

    Mintage of Eleanor Roosevelt 1886 (1886/20000<9.5%)...........

    Mintage of the mysterious key (in case it is not ER) ? Maybe around 1800 ? .............

    Market is forward-looking and usually right.

    Yes, it is always about demand/supply, but it is always about the expectations of the future demand/supply.




    << <i>#2 and #4 greatest First Ladies of all time still sell around melt to this day. Sometimes back of melt.

    Obviously, popularity has not translated into value after 8 years.

    I'm not betting the ranch #1 most popular is going to mean all that much down the road.

    Just my two cents.

    Wondercoin. >>

    To the free man, the country is the collection of individuals who compose it, not something over and above them. -M. Friedman
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    RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Eleanor may well command a nice premium even if unseated.
    My grandmother who was born in 1909 actually met Eleanor and liked her very much. We have a photo of them together. Nice momento to keep w my coin.
    Still, I believe that whichever MS spouse has the lowest final mintage will do best. It will b the lowest mintage US coin in a century and that may hold for many, many years.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!
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    kiyotekiyote Posts: 5,568 ✭✭✭✭✭
    1886 is such a low mintage. It's like we're in 1881 and can order proof coins from the US Mint.
    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
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    OverdateOverdate Posts: 6,942 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>1886 is such a low mintage. It's like we're in 1881 and can order proof coins from the US Mint. >>


    And in 100 years or so our descendents can cash out at a good profit. image

    My Adolph A. Weinman signature :)

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    OperationButterOperationButter Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>1886 is such a low mintage. It's like we're in 1881 and can order proof coins from the US Mint. >>


    And in 100 years or so our descendents can cash out at a good profit. image >>



    its hit or miss. Roosevelts have doubled in price already. Try finding some of the back issues, they are becoming more scarce.
    Gold is for savings. Fiat is for transactions.



    BST Transactions (as the seller): Collectall, GRANDAM, epcjimi1, wondercoin, jmski52, wheathoarder, jay1187, jdsueu, grote15, airplanenut, bigole
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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭

    Well it looks like maybe the hoards yesterday carried off a few of these sleeping beauties



    43 - Florence Harding Proofs remaining


    71 - Grace Coolidge Proofs remaining
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    OperationButterOperationButter Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭
    Thank you for updating
    Gold is for savings. Fiat is for transactions.



    BST Transactions (as the seller): Collectall, GRANDAM, epcjimi1, wondercoin, jmski52, wheathoarder, jay1187, jdsueu, grote15, airplanenut, bigole
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    Good news or bad news for first spouse gold collectors?

    ModernCoinMart Sold to Asset Marketing Services


    http://www.coinweek.com/education/coin-grading/ngc/breaking-news-moderncoinmart-sold-to-asset-marketing-services/
    To the free man, the country is the collection of individuals who compose it, not something over and above them. -M. Friedman
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    OperationButterOperationButter Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭
    bad news for all modern coin collectors imo
    Gold is for savings. Fiat is for transactions.



    BST Transactions (as the seller): Collectall, GRANDAM, epcjimi1, wondercoin, jmski52, wheathoarder, jay1187, jdsueu, grote15, airplanenut, bigole
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    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/04/21/gutierrez-woman-20-dollar_n_7112478.html

    Congressman Proposes Putting A Woman On The $20 Bill
    The Huffington
    To the free man, the country is the collection of individuals who compose it, not something over and above them. -M. Friedman
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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Well it looks like maybe the hoards yesterday carried off a few of these sleeping beauties



    43 - Florence Harding Proofs remaining


    71 - Grace Coolidge Proofs remaining >>






    And the beat goes on...........



    39 - Florence

    63 - Grace
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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭
    Jackie O, oh Jackie O

    Wherefore art thou, oh Jackie O ?






    6-25-15 Jacqueline Kennedy First Spouse Gold Coins on sale date
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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭
    Just a quick heads up on the lovely Bess Truman FS Coin. There are 5 BU's and around 40 Proofs left. I don't think this is
    a sell-out but it may be a while before they make more. On the other hand there may be more on the way right now.

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    kiyotekiyote Posts: 5,568 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The Bess Truman reverse is really attractive. One of the best of the bunch.
    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
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    FullStrikeFullStrike Posts: 4,353 ✭✭✭

    Well the Proof and BU Bess Truman Coins are both gone now - listed as unavailable. They got the Remind Me
    button out, so more may be comming - one day.

    Latest Sales through Sunday were 1,565 Proofs and 1,089 BU's. If these numbers held, in addition to those sold in
    the last few days, this would be a mind boggling low mintage.

    Looks like my Eleanors may have been blasted out of the water. image

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    OverdateOverdate Posts: 6,942 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I would expect more Bess Trumans to appear later this year. Something similar happened with the Buchanan Liberty first spouse coin in 2010, current inventory was exhausted before the end of the year and as a consequence more were struck.

    My Adolph A. Weinman signature :)

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    Great development for those who bought 2014 spouse coins! First batch Sold out in four weeks. Guess what? The Mint will confidently produce more 2015 and 2016 spouse coins, yes, the tide has turned!
    To the free man, the country is the collection of individuals who compose it, not something over and above them. -M. Friedman
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    CoinMaster1229CoinMaster1229 Posts: 1,092 ✭✭


    << <i>Great development for those who bought 2014 spouse coins! First batch Sold out in four weeks. Guess what? The Mint will confidently produce more 2015 and 2016 spouse coins, yes, the tide has turned! >>




    Hope your right, I have all the 2014`s image
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    RaufusRaufus Posts: 6,784 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Well the Proof and BU Bess Truman Coins are both gone now - listed as unavailable. They got the Remind Me
    button out, so more may be comming - one day.

    Latest Sales through Sunday were 1,565 Proofs and 1,089 BU's. If these numbers held, in addition to those sold in
    the last few days, this would be a mind boggling low mintage.

    Looks like my Eleanors may have been blasted out of the water. image >>



    I can't imagine that Bess will not be back.
    Land of the Free because of the Brave!

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