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Another ANA Executive Director bites the dust...

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  • bidaskbidask Posts: 13,834 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I listened to the May 11 candidates forum.....

    Walt seemed as though he understands the 'strategic mission' of the
    ANA.....how wonder how he would grade himself in
    carrying it out?

    How can the president and Vice President run unopposed with the
    direction the ANA has gone the last few years?

    How can Gary Adkins proclaim the 'phenomenonal' job
    the governors have done and praise Hallenbeck?




    I manage money. I earn money. I save money .
    I give away money. I collect money.
    I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.




  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 33,811 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>How can the president and Vice President run unopposed >>



    Interesting question.
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 31,499 ✭✭✭✭✭
    There have been contested elections, but only when people care enough to run.
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • SteveSteve Posts: 3,313 ✭✭✭
    There are 9 seats on the ANA board of governors. Since Walt & Jeff are running unopposed for President and VP, that leaves 7 seats to be contested. There are 4 current ANA board members running for reelection and 10 NEW candidates running for election. It is up to the ANA members who choose to vote in this election to choose wisely among these 14 people to get the 7 BEST for the board. At worst, if all 4 current board members are reelected there still will be 3 NEW members of the board. It is true that the members would be better served if the current board publically announced how they voted in the Jeff Shevlin termination, but that probably won't happen. I personally am still evaluating my choices for the 7 governors positions. As things stand now, I intend to vote for Greg Lyon. I am impressed that thru the past two years on the board he has chosen to continue to communicate with us here in what I believe to be a fair and honest way. In the well over a decade that I have been on these boards, NO OTHER sitting ANA board governor has done this, and only a few have ever shown up here during their campaign. Baseed on what he has said here and at the candidates forum I think he will do a good job leading the new web site project to completion. I also plan on voting for Bill Hyder because I believe he too recognizes the need for change on the board and I like his technical expertise which should also help with the web site development. The third candidate I currently plan to support is Laura Sperber. I am not sure she is the answer to the ANA's problems, but if anyone currently running for the 7 governors seats has the personality and drive to make needed changes, she is the one. As I've said before, I believe she will actually be able to do something positive for the ANA or she will quit her position after a few months. I'm willing to see what she does. I'm still pondering who I will vote for the other 4 governor seats. Steveimage
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 31,499 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I voted for Bill Hyder because he is working on a book about Thomas Elder, a particular interest of mine!
    TD
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • SteveSteve Posts: 3,313 ✭✭✭
    OK. I'm reviving this thread because it links the frustrations some ANA members have with the current board's decision regarding Jeff Shevlin and the election of a new board that will be CONTINUING all thru the month of June! I guess the logic of some members is to vote as soon as they get their ballot and be done with it. The thought process is probably, "if I don't vote now, I'll probably forget". If history repeats, less than 20% of the membership will vote anyway.

    Today I finally received my electronic ballot. I was not sure what kind of timing I would have to fill out the ballot and vote UNTIL I logged in and requested the ballot. Then I was given the opportunity to read the instructions and found out I could check out the bios and make preliminary choices and log out. I could then log in later and at some time between now and July 1st submit my ballot. I was impressed with the flexibility of the whole process. It would have been better if that process was explained to the members before they had to commit to receiving the ballot. I wonder how many of those who got the electronic ballot felt they had to vote right then and there. So I guess we are stuck with jokes about Mr Obverse and Mr Reverse and whether it is worth it or not to spend 46 of our hard earned cents to pay for postage to mail in a vote. Those officers in charge really think they know what the membership is thinking. They also know what the officers themselves are thinking. Just read all the detail sections of the official ANA Bylaws and the amount of SPECIFIC information there about the duties and responsibilities of the NINE members who happen to be serving on the Board of Governors during a two year time span. It doesn't give Laura much space to operate if she wants to do what she says she will do. That's my opinions right now. What's yours? Steveimage
  • EXOJUNKIEEXOJUNKIE Posts: 1,609 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i> How can Gary Adkins ... praise Hallenbeck? >>



    This! You mean Hallenbeck the "invisible president," born into numismatic privilege with the .925 sterling spoon in his mouth? I haven't seen or heard him address a single important issue or exhibit an ounce of leadership in the past year. Last time I checked, presidents are supposed to LEAD. When the going got tough and the ANA needed someone to stand tall and be a voice to guide us through the storm, where was he? Where the *&^% is he hiding now?! I wouldn't follow him into battle EVER. I'm thoroughly disappointed in him.

    Yeah, I know that is harsh but look, he may be a great guy and a great coin dealer...I've been to his B&M a handful of times over the years and enjoyed it. But if you're not cut out to LEAD...if you don't have what it takes...then have the courtesy, common sense, and respect for the organization to NOT RUN FOR AN ANA OFFICE! image
    I'm addicted to exonumia ... it is numismatic crack!

    ANA LM

    USAF Retired — 34 years of active military service! 🇺🇸
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,302 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i> How can Gary Adkins ... praise Hallenbeck? >>



    This! You mean Hallenbeck the "invisible president," born into numismatic privilege with the .925 sterling spoon in his mouth? I haven't seen or heard him address a single important issue or exhibit an ounce of leadership in the past year. Last time I checked, presidents are supposed to LEAD. When the going got tough and the ANA needed someone to stand tall and be a voice to guide us through the storm, where was he? Where the *&^% is he hiding now?! I wouldn't follow him into battle EVER. I'm thoroughly disappointed in him.

    Yeah, I know that is harsh but look, he may be a great guy and a great coin dealer...I've been to his B&M a handful of times over the years and enjoyed it. But if you're not cut out to LEAD...if you don't have what it takes...then have the courtesy, common sense, and respect for the organization to NOT RUN FOR AN ANA OFFICE! image >>


    And how were Swiatek, Campbell, Wilson, Lewis, Horton, et. al. any better? And frankly, how is Ostromecki any better?

    ANA President is considered a feather in the cap, an entitlement, a popularity contest.

    Ask Greg. He knows. Ask Rottinghaus. He knows. Both are serving their time. And both will be up for president. Mark my words.
  • GregLGregL Posts: 470


    << <i>ANA President is considered a feather in the cap, an entitlement, a popularity contest. Ask Greg. He knows. Ask Rottinghaus. He knows. Both are serving their time. And both will be up for president. Mark my words. >>



    *IF* I ever run for President, it will likely be 15-20 years from now. There is -- believe it or not -- a serious time commitment to serve as ANA President.

    As an ANA governor, I use over two weeks of my vacation from my "real job" to attend ANA conventions and board meetings (out of three weeks total) -- while paying for almost all of my expenses to do so myself. While I get an additional week of vacation starting in 2014, I still don't think that will be enough to serve as ANA President while I'm working in the real world.

    What exactly are the "entitlements" of being ANA President? While I have my own compliments and criticisms of Tom's presidency, he has given up significant time from his own business to serve as ANA President. Being located in Colorado Springs only exacerbates that commitment.

    I ran for the ANA Board two years ago on a specific platform. Some of those items have been implemented. Some got put off based on the leadership issues the ANA has faced. Once again I'm running on a specific platform -- most notably that the ANA Board needs to wake up and stop thinking of their positions as being the head of a big coin club, but rather the heads of a $6 million a year business. That includes having proper employment policies in place... having proper financial management policies in place.. and working to provide better benefits to members.

    There are a number of candidates running this year who don't understand they are running to lead a multi-million dollar business. They don't understand they need to be the source of improvement of the organization and not just be the winner of a beauty pageant. Read the platforms and it's obvious who gets it and who does not.

    Greg
    Greg Lyon, ANA Board of Governors 2011-2017 -- The views represented here are my own personal opinions and do not represent those of the American Numismatic Association.
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,302 ✭✭✭✭✭
    None of those past presidents have had any particular qualification to be president. It was simply their "turn." And in the old boys club, nobody will oppose you when it's your turn. This year it's Ostromecki's turn. Next year it's Garrett's. Never any opposition because they're up and that's the unwritten rule.

    And after your two years as president are over, you're supposed to sail off into the sunset, feather in cap, and never have any leadership role in the organization again. That's simply the routine.
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 33,811 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>And after your two years as president are over, you're supposed to sail off into the sunset, feather in cap, and never have any leadership role in the organization again. That's simply the routine. >>



    It seems a person can only be on the Board of Governors for 10 years so if you become President for 2 years after 8 years of service, you're out of years.

    Theoretically, it seems like someone could be ANA President for 9 years. The first year as a regular Governor and the next 9 to round the 10 max years on the Board of Governors.

    Go Laura imageimage
  • GregLGregL Posts: 470


    << <i>None of those past presidents have had any particular qualification to be president. It was simply their "turn." [...] Next year it's Garrett's. Never any opposition because they're up and that's the unwritten rule.. >>



    Interestingly enough, there was another governor who announced a run for VP this year at the ANA show in Dallas last October. Upon hearing that, several people (including myself) convinced Jeff to run as an alternative. The originally announced candidate then decided not to run for VP.

    Jeff didn't plan on running for VP but felt it was best for the ANA.

    Greg
    Greg Lyon, ANA Board of Governors 2011-2017 -- The views represented here are my own personal opinions and do not represent those of the American Numismatic Association.
  • GregLGregL Posts: 470


    << <i>It seems a person can only be on the Board of Governors for 10 years so if you become President for 2 years after 8 years of service, you're out of years.

    Theoretically, it seems like someone could be ANA President for 9 years. The first year as a regular Governor and the next 9 to round the 10 max years on the Board of Governors.

    Go Laura imageimage >>



    Except elections are every two years.. and you can only serve one term as president.

    Greg
    Greg Lyon, ANA Board of Governors 2011-2017 -- The views represented here are my own personal opinions and do not represent those of the American Numismatic Association.
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 33,811 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>It seems a person can only be on the Board of Governors for 10 years so if you become President for 2 years after 8 years of service, you're out of years.

    Theoretically, it seems like someone could be ANA President for 9 years. The first year as a regular Governor and the next 9 to round the 10 max years on the Board of Governors.

    Go Laura imageimage >>



    Except elections are every two years.. and you can only serve one term as president.

    Greg >>



    Ah, good to know. Perhaps that should change if there's a President the membership likes.
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,302 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Jeff didn't plan on running for VP but felt it was best for the ANA. >>


    Maybe the candidate wasn't one of the "boys?"

    They did that when Travers ran for pres.
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,302 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Ah, good to know. Perhaps that should change if there's a President the membership likes. >>


    Why would the Board change that? Then they wouldn't all have a chance to get their turn.
  • Howdy.

    I decided maybe I just ought to join and get in on this conversation.

    The only thing that is clear in this mess is that the Board messed up. They either messed up letting Jeff go... or they messed up hiring him in the first place. Since I don't know their reasons for letting him go, I can't say which mistake was made but clearly one of them was.

    I've heard all sorts of suggestions as to the "real reason" Jeff was let go (people who do not buy what little is in the press release). I can't imagine, though, wanting to let him go even if those reasons were valid. (Pushing too hard for the website? Really? Why would anyone want to slow it down?) So the suggested possible cynical reasons just don't make sense to me. Of course my lack of imagination is not an argument; the truth could be something totally different.

    Regardless, the ball was dropped. And who is to say anything will be different this time around?

    I do think the board needs to keep a better eye on what is going on. If there was indeed a good reason to let Jeff go, it appears to have come to the board's attention very suddenly, as a surprise. If there wasn't, then we still have a failure to know what's truly going on at HQ. I personally think a board member should visit HQ for a day once a month or so. This should be a rotating duty, but failing that, I can be there as I live nearby.
    ANA LM 6100
    Howland Wood winner 2005-2007
    Candidate for the ANA Board of Governors 2013-2015
  • LochNESSLochNESS Posts: 4,829 ✭✭✭
    Man, I really thought we had moved on from this topic. Steve I know you just joined the fun, sorry! - but when I saw this atop the pile o' threads I just sighed and shook my head image
    ANA LM • WBCC 429

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    image


  • << <i>Man, I really thought we had moved on from this topic. Steve I know you just joined the fun, sorry! - but when I saw this atop the pile o' threads I just sighed and shook my head image >>



    Sorry but that is also where I found it! image
    ANA LM 6100
    Howland Wood winner 2005-2007
    Candidate for the ANA Board of Governors 2013-2015
  • GregLGregL Posts: 470


    << <i>I do think the board needs to keep a better eye on what is going on. [...] I personally think a board member should visit HQ for a day once a month or so. >>

    This should be a rotating duty, but failing that, I can be there as I live nearby. >>



    This is already under discussion as part of our work with Beth Papiano.



    << <i>This should be a rotating duty, but failing that, I can be there as I live nearby. >>



    If you do get elected, I could be very careful how you utilize the fact that you live in Colorado Springs. There is a fine line between "keeping an eye on what is going on" and "micro-managing".. the latter of which many board have been accused of. (I'm NOT saying this in any way about you personally, but rather consider it a lesson from many past ANA experiences.

    Greg
    Greg Lyon, ANA Board of Governors 2011-2017 -- The views represented here are my own personal opinions and do not represent those of the American Numismatic Association.
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 31,499 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Speaking from old experience, whenever a Governor came into headquarters word was quickly passed over the intercom system and everybody spent the day looking over their shoulders. Productivity suffered.
    TD
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • ZoinsZoins Posts: 33,811 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Speaking from old experience, whenever a Governor came into headquarters word was quickly passed over the intercom system and everybody spent the day looking over their shoulders. Productivity suffered.
    TD >>



    Perhaps a disguise and cover story will be needed.

    Here's an interesting thought, if the membership considers the staff to be doing a good job, why does the staff have to worry about the governors?
  • GregLGregL Posts: 470


    << <i>Here's an interesting thought, if the membership considers the staff to be doing a good job, why does the staff have to worry about the governors? >>



    The membership does not hire / fire staff, the Executive Director does.. who reports to the Board of Governors.

    There has been a history of the ANA Board micro-managing the staff. There are stories (dating back to the 1980s, I believe) of Governors calling specific staff members asking them to work on a pet project (and not do their daily job) and threatening to have them fired if they didn't.

    Greg
    Greg Lyon, ANA Board of Governors 2011-2017 -- The views represented here are my own personal opinions and do not represent those of the American Numismatic Association.
  • That sort of thing is precisely what I don't want, especially the "board member getting a staffer to work on their pet project" part. I remember you mentioning this sort of thing at the candidate forum and (of course) you're later in the alphabet than I am so I didn't have a chance to state my agreement with your stance.

    Really what I would propose doing is listening to the staff's concerns, either openly or on a confidential basis.
    ANA LM 6100
    Howland Wood winner 2005-2007
    Candidate for the ANA Board of Governors 2013-2015
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 31,499 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Speaking from old experience, whenever a Governor came into headquarters word was quickly passed over the intercom system and everybody spent the day looking over their shoulders. Productivity suffered.
    TD >>



    Perhaps a disguise and cover story will be needed.

    Here's an interesting thought, if the membership considers the staff to be doing a good job, why does the staff have to worry about the governors? >>



    Because back then (I did say I was speaking from old experience) there were certain Governors who could not be trusted.
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • tradedollarnuttradedollarnut Posts: 20,146 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Really what I would propose doing is listening to the staff's concerns, either openly or on a confidential basis.

    I think that one staff has concerns about buying a house after being told he was doing a good job...right before being dismissed
  • BochimanBochiman Posts: 25,285 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i> How can Gary Adkins ... praise Hallenbeck? >>



    This! You mean Hallenbeck the "invisible president," born into numismatic privilege with the .925 sterling spoon in his mouth? I haven't seen or heard him address a single important issue or exhibit an ounce of leadership in the past year. Last time I checked, presidents are supposed to LEAD. When the going got tough and the ANA needed someone to stand tall and be a voice to guide us through the storm, where was he? Where the *&^% is he hiding now?! I wouldn't follow him into battle EVER. I'm thoroughly disappointed in him.

    Yeah, I know that is harsh but look, he may be a great guy and a great coin dealer...I've been to his B&M a handful of times over the years and enjoyed it. But if you're not cut out to LEAD...if you don't have what it takes...then have the courtesy, common sense, and respect for the organization to NOT RUN FOR AN ANA OFFICE! image >>


    And how were Swiatek, Campbell, Wilson, Lewis, Horton, et. al. any better? And frankly, how is Ostromecki any better?

    ANA President is considered a feather in the cap, an entitlement, a popularity contest.

    Ask Greg. He knows. Ask Rottinghaus. He knows. Both are serving their time. And both will be up for president. Mark my words. >>



    After 3 years, I am letting my membership lapse. I don't use the library, don't attend the seminars, etc. The politics and drama aren't for me.
    That said, your question about how Walter Ostromecki is any better? Well, I have NEVER, to my knowledge, met anyone in any leadership position of the ANA except for Walt.
    I have met him, over the last 5+ years, through his work with the YNs at different venues. He works hard for the kids, involves them with humor and hard work, and is a great representative for numismatics, the ANA, etc, with the YNs.

    I see no reason that he shouldn't be president of the ANA and it isn't about "it's his time for it". It's about someone who cares about the org, has a passion for it on different levels, and can communicate with others. Heck, many of the people I have sent responses from have been pretty childish, so working with YNs should help Walt communicate with them image

    From your reply above, I take it you have something against Walt and the others? If you don't, then maybe you were just posturing to jump on the bandwagon with a pitchfork.....?

    I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment

  • dcarrdcarr Posts: 7,936 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i> How can Gary Adkins ... praise Hallenbeck? >>



    This! You mean Hallenbeck the "invisible president," born into numismatic privilege with the .925 sterling spoon in his mouth? I haven't seen or heard him address a single important issue or exhibit an ounce of leadership in the past year. Last time I checked, presidents are supposed to LEAD. When the going got tough and the ANA needed someone to stand tall and be a voice to guide us through the storm, where was he? Where the *&^% is he hiding now?! I wouldn't follow him into battle EVER. I'm thoroughly disappointed in him.

    Yeah, I know that is harsh but look, he may be a great guy and a great coin dealer...I've been to his B&M a handful of times over the years and enjoyed it. But if you're not cut out to LEAD...if you don't have what it takes...then have the courtesy, common sense, and respect for the organization to NOT RUN FOR AN ANA OFFICE! image >>


    And how were Swiatek, Campbell, Wilson, Lewis, Horton, et. al. any better? And frankly, how is Ostromecki any better?

    ANA President is considered a feather in the cap, an entitlement, a popularity contest.

    Ask Greg. He knows. Ask Rottinghaus. He knows. Both are serving their time. And both will be up for president. Mark my words. >>



    After 3 years, I am letting my membership lapse. I don't use the library, don't attend the seminars, etc. The politics and drama aren't for me.
    That said, your question about how Walter Ostromecki is any better? Well, I have NEVER, to my knowledge, met anyone in any leadership position of the ANA except for Walt.
    I have met him, over the last 5+ years, through his work with the YNs at different venues. He works hard for the kids, involves them with humor and hard work, and is a great representative for numismatics, the ANA, etc, with the YNs.

    I see no reason that he shouldn't be president of the ANA and it isn't about "it's his time for it". It's about someone who cares about the org, has a passion for it on different levels, and can communicate with others. Heck, many of the people I have sent responses from have been pretty childish, so working with YNs should help Walt communicate with them image

    From your reply above, I take it you have something against Walt and the others? If you don't, then maybe you were just posturing to jump on the bandwagon with a pitchfork.....? >>



    Ostromecki is the only Governor to have been on the board for all of the last three Executive Director disasters (Cipoletti, Sheperd, Shevlin).
    When Ostromecki and Cipoletti had their well-publicized "feud", even though it was Cipoletti's actions that caused it, I believed at the time that the ANA would be better served if they both departed.

    My suspicion is, there is a feud (power struggle) going on at the ANA in regards to keeping some dirt hiding under the rug.

    For me, it all comes down to the recent board voting. I support any board member who voted to retain Shevlin. I do not support any board members who voted to fire him. And since the board is not going to tell us how they voted, I will be voting elsewhere (Hyder, possibly Sperber, other non-incumbents). I'm not a huge fan of Sperber, but I think she might be able to expose the "dirt" and clean it up.


  • << <i>Howdy.

    I decided maybe I just ought to join and get in on this conversation.

    The only thing that is clear in this mess is that the Board messed up. They either messed up letting Jeff go... or they messed up hiring him in the first place. Since I don't know their reasons for letting him go, I can't say which mistake was made but clearly one of them was.

    I've heard all sorts of suggestions as to the "real reason" Jeff was let go (people who do not buy what little is in the press release). I can't imagine, though, wanting to let him go even if those reasons were valid. (Pushing too hard for the website? Really? Why would anyone want to slow it down?) So the suggested possible cynical reasons just don't make sense to me. Of course my lack of imagination is not an argument; the truth could be something totally different.

    Regardless, the ball was dropped. And who is to say anything will be different this time around?

    I do think the board needs to keep a better eye on what is going on. If there was indeed a good reason to let Jeff go, it appears to have come to the board's attention very suddenly, as a surprise. If there wasn't, then we still have a failure to know what's truly going on at HQ. I personally think a board member should visit HQ for a day once a month or so. This should be a rotating duty, but failing that, I can be there as I live nearby. >>



    Will comment later.................!

    Jeff Shevlin
  • tradedollarnuttradedollarnut Posts: 20,146 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I liked your original post better. image

    Perhaps you can reapply after the new board is seated....
  • PTVETTERPTVETTER Posts: 5,880 ✭✭✭✭✭
    While working in Arny operations, you learn this, trust but verify!

    That's not micro managing, it is to protect all involved.

    Any orgination that allows personal attacks to be sweep under the rug needs a complete restructure!
    Pat Vetter,Mercury Dime registry set,1938 Proof set registry,Pat & BJ Coins:724-325-7211


  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 43,796 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Welcome , Jeff Shevlin.
    I'm for what's right.


    image
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,302 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Well, I have NEVER, to my knowledge, met anyone in any leadership position of the ANA except for Walt. >>


    You speak from experience, I see.



    << <i>He works hard for the kids, involves them with humor and hard work, and is a great representative for numismatics, the ANA, etc, with the YNs. >>


    So if I understand you correctly, we should elect (not that we have a choice) Ostromecki President because he's good with kids???

    I've never heard such nonsense in my life. Why not elect Mr. Rogers the Board President and be done with it?
  • blu62vetteblu62vette Posts: 11,900 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Well, I have NEVER, to my knowledge, met anyone in any leadership position of the ANA except for Walt. >>


    You speak from experience, I see.

    So if I understand you correctly, we should elect (not that we have a choice) Ostromecki President because he's good with kids???

    I've never heard such nonsense in my life. Why not elect Mr. Rogers the Board President and be done with it? >>



    I wonder why we cant get at least 2 people running for these positions or have the option of a no confidence vote.
    http://www.bluccphotos.com" target="new">BluCC Photos Shows for onsite imaging: Nov Baltimore, FUN, Long Beach http://www.facebook.com/bluccphotos" target="new">BluCC on Facebook
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,302 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I wonder why we cant get at least 2 people running for these positions or have the option of a no confidence vote. >>


    Because like politicians everywhere, the insiders make the rules to suit themselves.

    They need to make it easy to "get their turn" as President.


  • << <i>

    << <i>Howdy.

    I decided maybe I just ought to join and get in on this conversation.

    The only thing that is clear in this mess is that the Board messed up. They either messed up letting Jeff go... or they messed up hiring him in the first place. Since I don't know their reasons for letting him go, I can't say which mistake was made but clearly one of them was.

    I've heard all sorts of suggestions as to the "real reason" Jeff was let go (people who do not buy what little is in the press release). I can't imagine, though, wanting to let him go even if those reasons were valid. (Pushing too hard for the website? Really? Why would anyone want to slow it down?) So the suggested possible cynical reasons just don't make sense to me. Of course my lack of imagination is not an argument; the truth could be something totally different.

    Regardless, the ball was dropped. And who is to say anything will be different this time around?

    I do think the board needs to keep a better eye on what is going on. If there was indeed a good reason to let Jeff go, it appears to have come to the board's attention very suddenly, as a surprise. If there wasn't, then we still have a failure to know what's truly going on at HQ. I personally think a board member should visit HQ for a day once a month or so. This should be a rotating duty, but failing that, I can be there as I live nearby. >>



    Will comment later.................! >>



    The ANA Board of Governors went through a yearlong lengthy process to insure they would hire the best Executive Director possible. There were over 50 applicants. Interviews narrowed the search down to 10, then down to 4. I was chosen for the position of Executive Director because I was the best candidate. Note that the current Executive Director did not make the final cut, so why did the current board decide to appoint the current Executive Director over a 20 minute phone conversation. Why didn't the board hire one of the remaining 3 finalists interviewed rather than quickly appointing the new Executive Director. What are they hiding, what are they trying to cover up? What are they afraid of, why did they act so quickly this time? The ANA was in shambles when I started working there. So many items were not followed through with under the previous leadership (no leadership at all). One of the huge failures with the board is that they want to manage the day to day operations at the ANA, they do not want a real leader to lead the organization.

    Jeff Shevlin


  • << <i>

    << <i>Well, I have NEVER, to my knowledge, met anyone in any leadership position of the ANA except for Walt. >>


    You speak from experience, I see.



    << <i>He works hard for the kids, involves them with humor and hard work, and is a great representative for numismatics, the ANA, etc, with the YNs. >>


    So if I understand you correctly, we should elect (not that we have a choice) Ostromecki President because he's good with kids???

    I've never heard such nonsense in my life. Why not elect Mr. Rogers the Board President and be done with it? >>



    To my knowledge Walter is not a collector of anything numismatically related, so what is his interest in the ANA? Also, Walter is the only board member to ever be expelled from the ANA. If the newly elected board conducts an investigation (as they should) of the illegal and inappropriate actions taken by the current board, Walter may be the only board member ever expelled twice from the ANA.
    Jeff Shevlin
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,302 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>To my knowledge Walter is not a collector of anything numismatically related, so what is his interest in the ANA? Also, Walter is the only board member to ever be expelled from the ANA. If the newly elected board conducts an investigation (as they should) of the illegal and inappropriate actions taken by the current board, Walter may be the only board member ever expelled twice from the ANA. >>


    I sense the first name of the 5 has come to the fore....


  • << <i>Maybe just maybe its the board of directors that are the problem along with some of the staff! >>



    You guessed it. There are disgruntled staff that reach out to naïve board members to reach their personal objectives. Board members and staff communicate but do not include the Executive Director in their discussions. The triangle of communication is missing. A few staff have learned how to manipulate board members to meet their personal objectives.
    My daughter calls it the "Separated Parent Syndrome". The staff are the "children", the board is "Mommy" the Executive Director is "Daddy". The "children" go to "Mommy" to complain about "Daddy, the children go to "Daddy" to complain about "Mommy". "Mommy" does not communicate with "Daddy" even though the line of communication is open to do so. "Mommy" needs to communicate with "Daddy" and they need to pool together to decide what is right for the "children"!
    Even though I repeatedly requested that staff come to me if they had any issues at all, if they felt they had too much work etc. but not one staff member came to me to tell me they had too much work. Instead they called certain board members and complained they had too much work. After receiving an email I was not supposed to receive that included discussions by a board member stating something to the effect of "what would be worse, to have Jeff retire or lose half the staff? I called the board member and asked him what was going on. He told me that the staff did not like me and he asked me to resign. I was shocked and asked him why the staff does not like me. He said that I "have too many projects" and I "delegate too much". I was (and still am) in disbelief that he would think this a reason to have me "resign". I tried to explain to him that my job includes delegation and I am trying to implement the strategic plan so consequently the staff have more work. I also told him that I have repeatedly asked staff to come to me if they felt they had too much work but nobody had come to me.
    In the forum this same board member expressed an interest in "protecting" the staff. I wanted to ask him what he is protecting them from, "working?" I would still like to ask him this question. Right after talking to this board member I called 6 other board members to find out if they though I was doing a good job as Executive Director. One said I was doing a "Great Job" the other five said I was doing a "good" to "fine" job. This was one week prior to my termination.
    Jeff Shevlin
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 45,301 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Maybe just maybe its the board of directors that are the problem along with some of the staff! >>



    You guessed it. There are disgruntled staff that reach out to naïve board members to reach their personal objectives. Board members and staff communicate but do not include the Executive Director in their discussions. The triangle of communication is missing. A few staff have learned how to manipulate board members to meet their personal objectives.
    My daughter calls it the "Separated Parent Syndrome". The staff are the "children", the board is "Mommy" the Executive Director is "Daddy". The "children" go to "Mommy" to complain about "Daddy, the children go to "Daddy" to complain about "Mommy". "Mommy" does not communicate with "Daddy" even though the line of communication is open to do so. "Mommy" needs to communicate with "Daddy" and they need to pool together to decide what is right for the "children"!
    Even though I repeatedly requested that staff come to me if they had any issues at all, if they felt they had too much work etc. but not one staff member came to me to tell me they had too much work. Instead they called certain board members and complained they had too much work. After receiving an email I was not supposed to receive that included discussions by a board member stating something to the effect of "what would be worse, to have Jeff retire or lose half the staff? I called the board member and asked him what was going on. He told me that the staff did not like me and he asked me to resign. I was shocked and asked him why the staff does not like me. He said that I "have too many projects" and I "delegate too much". I was (and still am) in disbelief that he would think this a reason to have me "resign". I tried to explain to him that my job includes delegation and I am trying to implement the strategic plan so consequently the staff have more work. I also told him that I have repeatedly asked staff to come to me if they felt they had too much work but nobody had come to me.
    In the forum this same board member expressed an interest in "protecting" the staff. I wanted to ask him what he is protecting them from, "working?" I would still like to ask him this question. Right after talking to this board member I called 6 other board members to find out if they though I was doing a good job as Executive Director. One said I was doing a "Great Job" the other five said I was doing a "good" to "fine" job. This was one week prior to my termination. >>



    Sounds like the staff needs to sit down with their boss and establish priorities. Also, there needs to be a clearly established chain of command and it sounds like some staff members are insubordinate and need to be replaced.







    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.


  • Sounds like the staff needs to sit down with their boss and establish priorities. Also, there needs to be a clearly established chain of command and it sounds like some staff members are insubordinate and need to be replaced. >>





    Don't get me wrong, there are MANY great hardworking employees at the ANA.
    Jeff Shevlin
  • tradedollarnuttradedollarnut Posts: 20,146 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Maybe just maybe its the board of directors that are the problem along with some of the staff! >>



    You guessed it. There are disgruntled staff that reach out to naïve board members to reach their personal objectives. Board members and staff communicate but do not include the Executive Director in their discussions. The triangle of communication is missing. A few staff have learned how to manipulate board members to meet their personal objectives.
    My daughter calls it the "Separated Parent Syndrome". The staff are the "children", the board is "Mommy" the Executive Director is "Daddy". The "children" go to "Mommy" to complain about "Daddy, the children go to "Daddy" to complain about "Mommy". "Mommy" does not communicate with "Daddy" even though the line of communication is open to do so. "Mommy" needs to communicate with "Daddy" and they need to pool together to decide what is right for the "children"!
    Even though I repeatedly requested that staff come to me if they had any issues at all, if they felt they had too much work etc. but not one staff member came to me to tell me they had too much work. Instead they called certain board members and complained they had too much work. After receiving an email I was not supposed to receive that included discussions by a board member stating something to the effect of "what would be worse, to have Jeff retire or lose half the staff? I called the board member and asked him what was going on. He told me that the staff did not like me and he asked me to resign. I was shocked and asked him why the staff does not like me. He said that I "have too many projects" and I "delegate too much". I was (and still am) in disbelief that he would think this a reason to have me "resign". I tried to explain to him that my job includes delegation and I am trying to implement the strategic plan so consequently the staff have more work. I also told him that I have repeatedly asked staff to come to me if they felt they had too much work but nobody had come to me.
    In the forum this same board member expressed an interest in "protecting" the staff. I wanted to ask him what he is protecting them from, "working?" I would still like to ask him this question. Right after talking to this board member I called 6 other board members to find out if they though I was doing a good job as Executive Director. One said I was doing a "Great Job" the other five said I was doing a "good" to "fine" job. This was one week prior to my termination. >>



    Very telling. And disturbing. Nothing like a staff that has the ability to get their boss fired and a meddling Board to go along with it...
  • streeterstreeter Posts: 4,312 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Am I the only person that finds this situation peculiar?

    Disgruntled STAFF complains, ED gets terminated, STAFF member previously passed over
    quickly succeeds fired ED.

    Am I missing something?image
    Have a nice day


  • << <i>Am I the only person that finds this situation peculiar?

    Disgruntled STAFF complains, ED gets terminated, STAFF member previously passed over
    quickly succeeds fired ED.

    Am I missing something?image >>



    This situation is extremely peculiar, I don't think you are missing anything.
    Jeff Shevlin


  • << <i>I liked your original post better. image

    Perhaps you can reapply after the new board is seated.... >>




    I felt it was a little harsh. image
    Jeff Shevlin
  • CalebCaleb Posts: 739


    << <i> Sounds like the staff needs to sit down with their boss and establish priorities. Also, there needs to be a clearly established chain of command and it sounds like some staff members are insubordinate and need to be replaced. >>



    If a member of the Board of Governors undermined the Executive Director by fielding complaints from employees that didn’t go through the proper chain of command (established protocols or employees’ personnel policy) who is at fault, the member of the Board of Governors that did it or the rest of the Board of Governors for allowing it to happen? image


    It seems to me that ARTICLE IV - Elected Officials–Powers & Duties; Section 5 - Resignation or Removal of an Elected Official, d) “Has committed any act or has engaged in conduct that is prejudicial to the welfare of the Association.” Should have been used by the remaining Board of Governors to nip this in the butt from the beginning. image
  • We still believe in the ANA! With the right board of governors voted in the ANA can again be an organization that has so much potential. Don't give up on the ANA use your voting power to vote in the right board of governors. There are so many good new candidates, choose them.

    Cecilia (for)
    Jeff Shevlin
  • CoinosaurusCoinosaurus Posts: 9,614 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Am I the only person that finds this situation peculiar?

    Disgruntled STAFF complains, ED gets terminated, STAFF member previously passed over
    quickly succeeds fired ED.

    Am I missing something?image >>



    I have no inside info on what actually happened.

    I can say that in the corporate world, in a healthy organization, if you go around your boss w/a personal agenda, the boss's boss will typically read you the riot act.
  • streeterstreeter Posts: 4,312 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I am an outsider looking in.
    There is a good reason to follow the chain of command.

    It looks to me as though this principle is not followed at the ANA



    I hope the newly elected board will take time to analyze the myriad of organizational flaws. It seems to me as though the ANA is run
    like a mustard stained dysfunctional coin shop and that is my diplomatic
    take on the last 10 years.
    Have a nice day
  • tradedollarnuttradedollarnut Posts: 20,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

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