All signs point toward the 2007 $25 - 1/4 oz frosted freedom being legitimate. After confirming this, I am hopeful the individual will have the coin graded by NGC. Once this is confirmed, we can then assume that there will be at least a 1/2 oz and 1/10 oz frosted freedom. This will become even more interesting next week after the story for the $100 frosted freedom hits coinworld.....
Disappointed to report I checked all my 2007 plat proofs of all denominations but no luck in finding a frosted freedom, although I had a hopeful hunch I'd have one, with the best chance among my bunch of one-tenths. At least that's a tiny amount of additional evidence it's a scarce error.
I'm not sure I understand the logic that we will find these errors in every denomination. In fact, that seems highly unlikely since each die is presumably processed individually. Thoughts?
<< What is the most common error coin in terms of percent of total mintage? What error coin carries no premium while the non-error sells at a premium? >>
<< <i>I'm not sure I understand the logic that we will find these errors in every denomination. In fact, that seems highly unlikely since each die is presumably processed individually. Thoughts? >>
I agree. These were random die prep errors, and there is no reason to expect that they would have happened on all four sizes.
No reason not to look, but don't expect to find all four.
MOO TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
You can throw out any ideas you have with this regarding the die. When I found the $100 Frosted Freedom coin, I began to compare pictures and other coins as well as the other 3 denominations. The Frosted Freedom coin is an exact duplicate of the artist rendition as we have already discussed. Once the $25 - 1/4 ounce coin has been confirmed, the conversation will shift to which denomination comes next. These will all take time as the second coin is not yet official. If the die produced other examples of the $100 Frosted Freedom, where are they? I speak NGC on a daily basis as I am an authorized dealer #2583. They have yet to report any additional specimens. All of that being said, if it was a "simple" die issue, there should by now be at least one more example of the $100 coin.....
Because of the official Mint image, it seems plausible that they originally did not intend for 'Freedom' to be RP'd. If the decision to polish the letter happened late in the game, I suppose it's easy to see how one or more dies escaped the process.
Again, I think this is the coolest error to pop up in a long time--much more interesting than 08/07 (or whatever that was) and the Wisconsin leaves. I would truly covet this coin.
Just in case anyone doubts the $25 coin being legitimate, I have concrete proof it exists. This will become available when I am given the OK. I needed proof in order to confirm this and I have received it and it's 100% guaranteed by me.....
I think it is very cool as well and I truly believe that this already has and will continue to give the Platinum Collector coin market a boost at what is seemingly a very stale market. I suppose this is the wake up call people needed in order to get them to look at their coins more closely. What else have we all missed??? In fact, the coin I discovered had been touched by many, many people. Apparently, I was the one who touched it that was not blind
If there is a $50 - one half ounce Frosted Freedom out there, it could very well be held prisoner in somebody's unopened Platinum Anniversary set? I suppose its just a coincidence that 2 separate coins have been discovered
"I agree. These were random die prep errors, and there is no reason to expect that they would have happened on all four sizes."
These were not random errors at all. If they were, then why is there not a single report of a second $100 Frosty? I believe everyone's opinions will change dramatically next week. How can anyone explain why there would be a similar error but on the other denomination? Simple, it was no mistake Ask Uncle Sam, maybe he'll tell you the truth?
<< <i>"I agree. These were random die prep errors, and there is no reason to expect that they would have happened on all four sizes."
These were not random errors at all. If they were, then why is there not a single report of a second $100 Frosty? I believe everyone's opinions will change dramatically next week. How can anyone explain why there would be a similar error but on the other denomination? Simple, it was no mistake Ask Uncle Sam, maybe he'll tell you the truth? >>
For one thing, the vast majority of collectors do not read these boards, or Coinnet. It will take being published in Coin World and Numismatic News to get the word out. Be patient. This will happen.
The randomness of the error that I referred to was in how it was applied to different dies, but not necessarily to dies of all four sizes. Proving at least one coins of the two dies so mis-prepared should mean that more coins from these two dies are likely to appear. It does NOT mean that coins from other dies of other denominations are likely to appear. They are possible, but not probable. There's a difference.
TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
I agree that this will all take time. I also agree that once the news hits Coinworld, a lot of people will see this for the very first time. Prior to hearing about the $25 coin, I assumed that additional $100 coins would be discovered. My opinion has changed as a result of the $25 coin. If the next coin found is either the 1/2 or 1/10 ounce coin, then I will be more convinced that a 4 coin Frosted Freedom set exists. The majority of this is pure speculation. The only people who know the truth are the people directly responsible for the design and production of the coins. I have a very hard time believing that the U.S. Mint has no prior knowledge of these coins. If the Mint does not know, this would mean dozens of people missed the coin I discovered. I have been saying since day one that I believed that my coin was a "prototype". At this point in time it is clearly too early to make any bold predictions.
If the next couple FF coins discovered are specifically a $10 and a $50, then, arguably, I believe the price of the $100 coin might go up (even with 3 other coins in the universe). If the next couple FF coins discovered include another $100 piece, the price drops greatly in my view. So, we will see. Remember, this is an error that kind of "blends into" the coin such that even grading services and top dealers in the field could easily miss it. So, the fact that another $100 was not found in the past couple weeks (or even prior to this one being "discovered") is not all that relevant to me.
Wondercoin
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
There are certainly many possible scenarios. Honestly, I'm not overly concerned about the value of the coin right now. I have no plans of selling any time soon which means that I'm rolling the dice on this one. However, I consider myself lucky and am most interested in seeing how things eventually unfold especially since I'm a part of this. I also realize that none of you have ever heard of me prior to basically a week ago. Although, I do have a half way decent reputation on ebay for over 11 years. I personally submitted many 07 Platinum Proof and Burnished coins to both PCGS and NGC. in fact, in 2007, I sent in 8 - 2007 Platinum Burnished 4 coin sets to PCGS that I personally cherry picked out of 25 sets I ordered directly from the Mint. I'm not sure if I can pull up that grading report but if I can I will. I got a total of 27 MS70 out of the 32 coins. The coins were grading 25% ms70 at that time. Here's my point. I cannot account for anyone else not seeing this. What I can tell you is that I actually look at every coin that passes through my hands. I highly doubt that any of the people that owned these coins recently spent any time looking at the coins. They definitely got passed around from one dealer to another. The only thing they really looked at was the label. Again, I consider myself lucky to be a part of this regardless of the $ amount the $100 coin sells for one day. For me, this has already paid off in other ways more than money simply could do.
Wasn't there some discovery made about a year ago that was mentioned on here, and then no additional specimen ever turned up? Can't remember what it was.
The 1999-W uncirculated one ounce gold eagle is another case. You all know about the 1/10th and 1/4 ounce pieces that got out by mistake. Well, a one ounce piece was examined by a numismatist I know and respect at his place of employment, but the owner of the coin did not want to send it off to a TPG and nobody got the chance to take a picture of it. I ran buys for another one on the dealer-to-dealer network for months and months, but no other piece ever showed up.
Maybe sometimes the Mint does catch its goofs before they get out, and they successfully gather up and destroy all but one or two that they missed. Look at the 1975 "No S" Proof dime. It exists; I held the discovery specimen in may hands, but so far only two are known.
TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
<< <i>Does anyone know if they have a frosty the snowman avatar? I think that would work for me >>
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
Not at all. I am basically unknown and have my own opinions. I have also learned a lot from the research that was done. I still have no idea what this is worth but I do realize this is to be determined by what happens over time. I must say its been pretty cool so far...
I recall stating right on this thread (or on another related one) that if and when the coin becomes available for sale to please let me know in what venue that occurs. But, beyond that, I am not pursuing this coin in any manner. Of course, I am always buying 2007 proof platinum coins as well as every other year of proof platinum.
I do hope to meet you Jason at the upcoming Long Beach show if you decide to come out West.
Wondercoin
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
I am going to make book my flight reservations today and fly to LAX one week from tomorrow. I conveniently have a place to stay in Northridge and I will probably be there for 7 or 8 days. Mitch, I'm looking forward to meting you as well. Also to confirm, wondercoin has made no such offers, but he did ask me to let him know if and when it were available for sale.....
FYI, I'm leaving in a couple of hours to go to the Wespnex at the Westchester County Center in Westchester, NY (12-6 PM today). Does anyone know anybody there that might have some good deals Platinum? If so, please email me direct @ fishman.jason@gmail.com. My contact information can also found on ebay item#140503805124. I don't personally know any dealers there so I figured it couldn't hurt to ask. I thought about bringing MR. $100 Frosty with me but I couldn't hire a body guard in time for today
Just came me back from the coin show and got a few good deals. I am now receiving offers on the Frosted Freedom coin. No, none of the offers were from wondercoin.....
<< <i>Wasn't there some discovery made about a year ago that was mentioned on here, and then no additional specimen ever turned up? Can't remember what it was.
And, just for the record (and to not mislead Jason in any way), my interest in being made aware of the coin being available for sale is not because I want to own it for myself, but that I might ask (or they might even contact me) a number of my dedicated proof platinum customers if they would like to own it (and they certainly can have "first shot" if they want it). Of course, if the coin is going "too cheap" and my customers pass on buying it that wouldn't mean I might not get into the bidding action myself. Ditto for the $25 coin should that ever be made available for sale (assuming it does exist).
Wondercoin
P.S. I do thank you Jason for promising me "first shot" to buy the coin from you once you do know the bottom line price you would accept for it.
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
We're all good and I will let you (wondercoin) know if and when I should make any decisions to sell. As far as the $25 Frosted Freedom goes, it will become official if and when the owner decides to have it certified.
Just wanted all of you guys to know that the $25 Frosted Freedom is now official. It has been confirmed by NGC and a press release will be forthcoming.....
<< <i>Just wanted all of you guys to know that the $25 Frosted Freedom is now official. It has been confirmed by NGC and a press release will be forthcoming..... >>
Now that is exciting news!!!!!! Moderns take their fair share of forum abuse(I for one), but this is a very cool find!!!
It is very cool, but its not mine. Just wanted to let everyone know that. But, I'm half way to my prediction as far as their being a 4 coin "sample" or "prototype set". I've been doing research and I have learned that he Mint does make sample coins from time to time. The picture in the "Red Book", shows my coin, I am in the process of proving this..... Please look out for the $25 Frosted Freedom press release on the NGC website coming soon.....
By the way, has anyone read the last NGC press release regarding the newly discovered 1892 $10 Carson City Trade Dollar variety which bears a tripled reverse die. They made 40,000 of them and it ONLY took 118+ years for the first example to be found. To think that a variety could be overlooked for that length of time seems a bit surprising to me.
Possibly most are of the same opinion as me: I love plats but this is just too mundane a variation to be all that interesting. I have not even bothered to look at my '07s yet. Well, not to be a stick in the mud and appreciate enthusiasm when I see it...Different if it were a mintmark or lack of such...
Love that Milled British (1830-1960) Well, just Love coins, period.
Be sure to see Coin World this week. There is an interesting example of how the Mint applies frosting to a die nowadays. It is a 2007-S John Adams proof dollar whereon the frosting was added to the reverse die by a laser, but the pattern it cut did not quite line up with the lettering in the die. Some of the frosting is on the raised letters, and some of it, perfectly matching the shapes of the letters, is down on the field next to the letters.
Assuming that the Mint was using the same technology for the Proof platinum dies as it did on this John Adams dollar, there must have been two different templates in the computer that guided the laser that frosted the platinum dies.
TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
Comments
<< <i>http://mintnewsblog.blogspot.com/2011/01/2007-w-proof-100-platinum-eagle-frosted.html >>
Linkified
Also available in your choice of four burnished flavors at no extra cost!
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
That leads to a couple of interesting trivia answers:
What is the most common error coin in terms of percent of total mintage?
What error coin carries no premium while the non-error sells at a premium?
The finding of a $25 coin indicates that there might have been a 4 coin set produced that was accidentally released.
--Jerry
1909-S over horizontal S cent?
1879-CC capped CC Morgan dollar?
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
<< <i>I'm not sure I understand the logic that we will find these errors in every denomination. In fact, that seems highly unlikely since each die is presumably processed individually. Thoughts? >>
I agree. These were random die prep errors, and there is no reason to expect that they would have happened on all four sizes.
No reason not to look, but don't expect to find all four.
MOO
TD
Again, I think this is the coolest error to pop up in a long time--much more interesting than 08/07 (or whatever that was) and the Wisconsin leaves. I would truly covet this coin.
Wondercoin
I smell a great story here!!
Wondercoin
Sorry, was just a typo. But, I don't think you would complain too much if you opened your 10th anniversary set and found a $25 Frosty
These were not random errors at all. If they were, then why is there not a single report of a second $100 Frosty?
<< <i>"I agree. These were random die prep errors, and there is no reason to expect that they would have happened on all four sizes."
These were not random errors at all. If they were, then why is there not a single report of a second $100 Frosty?
For one thing, the vast majority of collectors do not read these boards, or Coinnet. It will take being published in Coin World and Numismatic News to get the word out. Be patient. This will happen.
The randomness of the error that I referred to was in how it was applied to different dies, but not necessarily to dies of all four sizes. Proving at least one coins of the two dies so mis-prepared should mean that more coins from these two dies are likely to appear. It does NOT mean that coins from other dies of other denominations are likely to appear. They are possible, but not probable. There's a difference.
TD
Wondercoin
The 1999-W uncirculated one ounce gold eagle is another case. You all know about the 1/10th and 1/4 ounce pieces that got out by mistake. Well, a one ounce piece was examined by a numismatist I know and respect at his place of employment, but the owner of the coin did not want to send it off to a TPG and nobody got the chance to take a picture of it. I ran buys for another one on the dealer-to-dealer network for months and months, but no other piece ever showed up.
Maybe sometimes the Mint does catch its goofs before they get out, and they successfully gather up and destroy all but one or two that they missed. Look at the 1975 "No S" Proof dime. It exists; I held the discovery specimen in may hands, but so far only two are known.
TD
<< <i>Does anyone know if they have a frosty the snowman avatar? I think that would work for me
I recall stating right on this thread (or on another related one) that if and when the coin becomes available for sale to please let me know in what venue that occurs. But, beyond that, I am not pursuing this coin in any manner. Of course, I am always buying 2007 proof platinum coins as well as every other year of proof platinum.
I do hope to meet you Jason at the upcoming Long Beach show if you decide to come out West.
Wondercoin
<< <i>Wasn't there some discovery made about a year ago that was mentioned on here, and then no additional specimen ever turned up? Can't remember what it was.
...............................................................................
You may be referring to the 2009-D Taylor dollar that was produced with 2010 date.
Wondercoin
P.S. I do thank you Jason for promising me "first shot" to buy the coin from you once you do know the bottom line price you would accept for it.
<< <i>Just wanted all of you guys to know that the $25 Frosted Freedom is now official. It has been confirmed by NGC and a press release will be forthcoming..... >>
Now that is exciting news!!!!!! Moderns take their fair share of forum abuse(I for one), but this is a very cool find!!!
WTG Jason!!!
I am curious why this thread is not pushing hundreds of posts?
It seems like a very neat find. Highly unusual.
Well, just Love coins, period.
got nothing.
Cashback from Mr. Rebates
<< <i>I am sort of surprised this thread did not get a lot more action.
I am curious why this thread is not pushing hundreds of posts?
It seems like a very neat find. Highly unusual. >>
I think all the major platinum proof players already chimed in....we are a small group
Assuming that the Mint was using the same technology for the Proof platinum dies as it did on this John Adams dollar, there must have been two different templates in the computer that guided the laser that frosted the platinum dies.
TD