<< <i>SP means satin finish, nothing more. So I wouldn't get my hopes up that there is anything extra special about these, other than the fact that they are 95% copper and have the satin finish (only found in Mint sets). Winners in my book, but the SP on the label simply notes they are satin finish. >>
SP means " Specimen Strike "
Edited to add that I don't know what the hell SP really stands for.
Nope not in the case though, SP can mean specimen strike. But when on the label of a modern mint set coin, SP on a PCGS graded coin means Satin Finish. I agree that it is confusing. Maybe they thought that SF (logical for Satin Finish) would confuse collectors since it could be thought of as San Francisco (Mint)????
In any case I am holding on to my mint and proof sets from 2009.If they are home runs in 5 or 10 years..thats great.If not they are still the last minted "copper" cents.
<< <i>someone on ebay cut the strips of pennies out of the sets and is selling them for $11 for all 8 pennies, still sealed in the mint packaging. i picked up 4 sets of these pennies. all i cared about was the pennies and these were a good price IMO. these will sit next to my 3 full mint sets. >>
I have not seen any more of these for sale on ebay. Am I looking in the right places or have they just stopped being put up for sale?
<< <i>What is a Specimen Slab ??. I have been looking over eBay and have found "SP" or "MS" on the same type of coin. The 1998 Matte Kennedy has 2 designations "SP" and "MS".
Maybe I should have started a new thread on Specimen Slabs. I would like to know what makes one a SP or a MS...Thank you.... >>
Around mid 2009, PCGS dropped the MS designation and adopted SP for ANY coin manufactured with a process other than the standard business strike or the proof manufacturing process.
A Standard Business Strike coin is MS A special process coin is SP (Such as the SMS Sets of 1964 - 1967, 1994 Jefferson, 1997 Jefferson, 1998 Kennedy and all Satin Finish US Mint Set coins - since 2005) A Proof Stike coin is PR
Since this began in mid 2009, coins graded before then will still show MS as the grade designator.
..
There will even be some oddballs graded mid-change where the Cert Number lookup shows SP while the slab shows MS.
..
The term "Satin Finish" is used two ways on PCGS Slabs. 1. Dealer Bulk Submissions get a special Satin Finish insert that has Satin Finish as a background. 2. Collector Submissions get the words "Satin Finish" below the grade.
..
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>SP means satin finish, nothing more. So I wouldn't get my hopes up that there is anything extra special about these, other than the fact that they are 95% copper and have the satin finish (only found in Mint sets). Winners in my book, but the SP on the label simply notes they are satin finish. >>
I would prefer to think of SP as Special Process since 1965-1967 SMS coins are now being slabbed as SP instead of MS.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>It will really help the aftermarket prices of these 2009 mint set cents after the major TPGS's recognize them.....which they will at some point. >>
I spoke with NGC's variety expert at the Balto. show. He said that the pennies from the Unc. set will be slabbed: "Special Mint Set Bronze" in recognition of their unique composition - sweeeeeeeeet. I should have asked PCGS as well as they were right there, but didn't feel like waiting in line again.
(Sorry if this is covered later, answered prior to reading the rest of the thread.) >>
I could live with and accept Special Mint Set Bronze.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>Great detailed explaination of the PCGS grade desinatator "SP" Lee. It makes prefect since. I FINALLY GRASP THE WHOLE SP & SATIN FINISH CONCEPT.
I agree with NGC's SMS Bronze on the label. Now PCGS needs to follow suit. >>
That will never, never happen. They have graded thousands of these already as SP. The bronze, copper label ship has sailed. >>
Actually, they've graded less than 4,000 across the four varieties and if the market demands it, PCGS will probably accomodate. It wouldn't be the first time a change was made. Look at all the 1965-1967 SMS coins previously graded as MS which are now being graded as SP.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
It sounds like we may not know the final mintages on these for a while. In the interim, I noticed today that prices have jumped on eBay to $38+ for BIN sales from $34 last week. Deals can still be had on open auctions and a few dealer websites, but it looks like these are on the rise overall.
Refs: MCM,Fivecents,Julio,Robman,Endzone,Coiny,Agentjim007,Musky1011,holeinone1972,Tdec1000,Type2,bumanchu, Metalsman,Wondercoin,Pitboss,Tomohawk,carew4me,segoja,thebigeng,jlc_coin,mbogoman,sportsmod,dragon,tychojoe,Schmitz7,claychaser, Bullsitter, robeck, Nickpatton, jwitten, and many OTHERS
Refs: MCM,Fivecents,Julio,Robman,Endzone,Coiny,Agentjim007,Musky1011,holeinone1972,Tdec1000,Type2,bumanchu, Metalsman,Wondercoin,Pitboss,Tomohawk,carew4me,segoja,thebigeng,jlc_coin,mbogoman,sportsmod,dragon,tychojoe,Schmitz7,claychaser, Bullsitter, robeck, Nickpatton, jwitten, and many OTHERS
<< <i>Will collectors want the satin finish 2009's in the same regard as collectors want the matte nickels from 1994 and 1997? >>
I don't see how a Lincoln set can be complete without them. Even disregarding the Satin Finish, the two metallic compositions are different in the same way as the 1982 "changeover" cents (or the 1864 copper-nickel and bronze cents).
<< <i>Prices for the 2009 mint sets are slowly rising on ebay to around $31 to $37. >>
I'm sure there were a number of dealers/flippers who bought many and are needing to, or just ok with, sell these for a few dollars each .... make profit in volume. Maybe they went through 100s to cherrypick a few to send in and are selling the others just to get rid of them.
For the sets to really go up, these caches of them need to be dispersed first.
<< <i>Prices for the 2009 mint sets are slowly rising on ebay to around $31 to $37. >>
I'm sure there were a number of dealers/flippers who bought many and are needing to, or just ok with, sell these for a few dollars each .... make profit in volume. Maybe they went through 100s to cherrypick a few to send in and are selling the others just to get rid of them.
For the sets to really go up, these caches of them need to be dispersed first. >>
I purchased 100 of them, went through 30 of them, and found they were tough to make MS69+'s from. Is this what you are talking about? BTW I found two new DDR's that John Wexler verified, Satin WDDR 006 and Satin WDDR 007. Is that worth anything on these, potential very low PO doubled dies?
Brian, That is what I am talking about. And, some folks bought more than 100 (1000s) to go through like that. That is some capital tied up that some folks don't want tied up, so they will blow out close to purchase price to get the capital back.
How many people collect Lincolns? There are less than 800K of these and this is the only place to get a copper Lincoln from P & D. Complete sets should do quite well in the next year or so. Just MHO.
Retired United States Mint guy, now working on an Everyman Type Set.
That's the same mintage posted for weeks now since the "sellout". The Mint may not be releasing final mintages on these for a while.
It's been said it may not be disclosed until the end of year audit.
Refs: MCM,Fivecents,Julio,Robman,Endzone,Coiny,Agentjim007,Musky1011,holeinone1972,Tdec1000,Type2,bumanchu, Metalsman,Wondercoin,Pitboss,Tomohawk,carew4me,segoja,thebigeng,jlc_coin,mbogoman,sportsmod,dragon,tychojoe,Schmitz7,claychaser, Bullsitter, robeck, Nickpatton, jwitten, and many OTHERS
Comments
<< <i>SP means satin finish, nothing more. So I wouldn't get my hopes up that there is anything extra special about these, other than the fact that they are 95% copper and have the satin finish (only found in Mint sets). Winners in my book, but the SP on the label simply notes they are satin finish. >>
SP means " Specimen Strike "
Edited to add that I don't know what the hell SP really stands for.
In any case I am holding on to my mint and proof sets from 2009.If they are home runs in 5 or 10 years..thats great.If not they are still the last minted "copper" cents.
<< <i>If they are home runs in 5 or 10 years..thats great.If not they are still the last minted "copper" cents. >>
Aren't the 2010 mint set cents also going to be copper cents?
<< <i>
<< <i>If they are home runs in 5 or 10 years..thats great.If not they are still the last minted "copper" cents. >>
Aren't the 2010 mint set cents also going to be copper cents? >>
No.
The name is LEE!
The fact that these are post 1981 one year copper issues bodes great for the future of the 2009 mint set cents!
<< <i>someone on ebay cut the strips of pennies out of the sets and is selling them for $11 for all 8 pennies, still sealed in the mint packaging. i picked up 4 sets of these pennies. all i cared about was the pennies and these were a good price IMO. these will sit next to my 3 full mint sets. >>
I have not seen any more of these for sale on ebay. Am I looking in the right places or have they just stopped being put up for sale?
http://cgi.ebay.com/2009-Lincoln-Cent-8-Coin-P-D-Satin-Mint-Mint-Cello-/230491032246?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item35aa560ab6
<< <i>Thanks for the answering my question Lee.
The fact that these are post 1981 one year copper issues bodes great for the future of the 2009 mint set cents! >>
Don't forget the matte finish nickels have even lower mintages than any one of these and they are not through the roof.
These will do well, but with regular business strikes out there for the album, I wonder if these will even make it to the super hot pricing category.
<< <i>here is some.....
http://cgi.ebay.com/2009-Lincoln-Cent-8-Coin-P-D-Satin-Mint-Mint-Cello-/230491032246?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item35aa560ab6 >>
Thank you.
<< <i>
<< <i>here is some.....
http://cgi.ebay.com/2009-Lincoln-Cent-8-Coin-P-D-Satin-Mint-Mint-Cello-/230491032246?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item35aa560ab6 >>
Thank you. >>
Those sold before I could even look at them. Wow!
<< <i>What is a Specimen Slab ??. I have been looking over eBay and have found "SP" or "MS" on the same type of coin. The 1998 Matte Kennedy has 2 designations "SP" and "MS".
Maybe I should have started a new thread on Specimen Slabs. I would like to know what makes one a SP or a MS...Thank you....
Around mid 2009, PCGS dropped the MS designation and adopted SP for ANY coin manufactured with a process other than the standard business strike or the proof manufacturing process.
A Standard Business Strike coin is MS
A special process coin is SP (Such as the SMS Sets of 1964 - 1967, 1994 Jefferson, 1997 Jefferson, 1998 Kennedy and all Satin Finish US Mint Set coins - since 2005)
A Proof Stike coin is PR
Since this began in mid 2009, coins graded before then will still show MS as the grade designator.
There will even be some oddballs graded mid-change where the Cert Number lookup shows SP while the slab shows MS.
The term "Satin Finish" is used two ways on PCGS Slabs.
1. Dealer Bulk Submissions get a special Satin Finish insert that has Satin Finish as a background.
2. Collector Submissions get the words "Satin Finish" below the grade.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>SP means satin finish, nothing more. So I wouldn't get my hopes up that there is anything extra special about these, other than the fact that they are 95% copper and have the satin finish (only found in Mint sets). Winners in my book, but the SP on the label simply notes they are satin finish. >>
I would prefer to think of SP as Special Process since 1965-1967 SMS coins are now being slabbed as SP instead of MS.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>
<< <i>It will really help the aftermarket prices of these 2009 mint set cents after the major TPGS's recognize them.....which they will at some point. >>
I spoke with NGC's variety expert at the Balto. show. He said that the pennies from the Unc. set will be slabbed: "Special Mint Set Bronze" in recognition of their unique composition - sweeeeeeeeet. I should have asked PCGS as well as they were right there, but didn't feel like waiting in line again.
(Sorry if this is covered later, answered prior to reading the rest of the thread.) >>
I could live with and accept Special Mint Set Bronze.
The name is LEE!
I agree with NGC's SMS Bronze on the label. Now PCGS needs to follow suit.
then i click on the "show buy it now" tab at the top of the completed search.
if there are any.....good luck!
<< <i>use the search on ebay and type in "2009 Lincoln Cents"
then i click on the "show buy it now" tab at the top of the completed search.
if there are any.....good luck! >>
You'll have better luck with "2009 Lincoln satin".
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
<< <i>
<< <i>use the search on ebay and type in "2009 Lincoln Cents"
then i click on the "show buy it now" tab at the top of the completed search.
if there are any.....good luck! >>
You'll have better luck with "2009 Lincoln satin". >>
That one is the best one to use.
<< <i>Great detailed explaination of the PCGS grade desinatator "SP" Lee. It makes prefect since. I FINALLY GRASP THE WHOLE SP & SATIN FINISH CONCEPT.
I agree with NGC's SMS Bronze on the label. Now PCGS needs to follow suit. >>
That will never, never happen. They have graded thousands of these already as SP. The bronze, copper label ship has sailed.
There have been satin finish coins before....
This is a different COIN because it has a different composition and was a one year change.
Don't you think THAT would be more important to add to the label than just the finish???
Being a low mintage copper/bronze cent will make this one more desired than the satin finish coins of every year
What is the big problem with noting the change in composition on the label????.
Control issues????
It's not like it's a WDDR-02384653-B looking for recognition
<< <i>
<< <i>Great detailed explaination of the PCGS grade desinatator "SP" Lee. It makes prefect since. I FINALLY GRASP THE WHOLE SP & SATIN FINISH CONCEPT.
I agree with NGC's SMS Bronze on the label. Now PCGS needs to follow suit. >>
That will never, never happen. They have graded thousands of these already as SP. The bronze, copper label ship has sailed. >>
Actually, they've graded less than 4,000 across the four varieties and if the market demands it, PCGS will probably accomodate.
It wouldn't be the first time a change was made. Look at all the 1965-1967 SMS coins previously graded as MS which are now being graded as SP.
The name is LEE!
Maybe somebody should start a poll for PCGS to see. I do not know how to do it or I would.
<< <i>Maybe somebody should start a poll for PCGS to see. I do not know how to do it or I would. >>
It should be a common sense given and not driven by a poll.... kinda like:
PCGS No Description Desig 4 12 40 60 63 64 65 66 67 68
1943 Type 2, Steel, MS Price Changes
92711 Type MS
Key word "Steel"
Almost a "Duh!" to say 2009 Type 2, Bronze
Since most albums have spaces for the 2009-S, the bronze composition will be represented.
60 years into this hobby and I'm still working on my Lincoln set!
<< <i>What are the 2008 mint sets going for? >>
$55 range, dealers are asking $65+
<< <i>Well, the coins are made of bronze whatever the TPGs do or do not decide to put on the labels.
Since most albums have spaces for the 2009-S, the bronze composition will be represented. >>
Will collectors want the satin finish 2009's in the same regard as collectors want the matte nickels from 1994 and 1997?
<< <i>What are the 2008 mint sets going for? >>
Greysheet bid is $48- and ask is $50
<< <i>Will collectors want the satin finish 2009's in the same regard as collectors want the matte nickels from 1994 and 1997? >>
If Dansco makes 8 extra holes for them in their Lincoln albums, collectors will want them or have to have them for their sets.
<< <i>If Dansco makes 8 extra holes for them in their Lincoln albums, collectors will want them or have to have them for their sets. >>
I think the boat has sailed on that one.
60 years into this hobby and I'm still working on my Lincoln set!
<< <i>Will collectors want the satin finish 2009's in the same regard as collectors want the matte nickels from 1994 and 1997? >>
Will who want the what now?
60 years into this hobby and I'm still working on my Lincoln set!
<< <i>Will collectors want the satin finish 2009's in the same regard as collectors want the matte nickels from 1994 and 1997? >>
I don't see how a Lincoln set can be complete without them. Even disregarding the Satin Finish, the two metallic compositions are different in the same way as the 1982 "changeover" cents (or the 1864 copper-nickel and bronze cents).
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Not many collectors know that these cents are going to be very popular in the future .
<< <i>Prices for the 2009 mint sets are slowly rising on ebay to around $31 to $37. >>
I'm sure there were a number of dealers/flippers who bought many and are needing to, or just ok with, sell these for a few dollars each .... make profit in volume.
Maybe they went through 100s to cherrypick a few to send in and are selling the others just to get rid of them.
For the sets to really go up, these caches of them need to be dispersed first.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>
<< <i>Prices for the 2009 mint sets are slowly rising on ebay to around $31 to $37. >>
I'm sure there were a number of dealers/flippers who bought many and are needing to, or just ok with, sell these for a few dollars each .... make profit in volume.
Maybe they went through 100s to cherrypick a few to send in and are selling the others just to get rid of them.
For the sets to really go up, these caches of them need to be dispersed first. >>
I purchased 100 of them, went through 30 of them, and found they were tough to make MS69+'s from. Is this what you are talking about? BTW I found two new DDR's that John Wexler verified, Satin WDDR 006 and Satin WDDR 007. Is that worth anything on these, potential very low PO doubled dies?
Only time and the economy will be able to answer that one.
That is what I am talking about. And, some folks bought more than 100 (1000s) to go through like that.
That is some capital tied up that some folks don't want tied up, so they will blow out close to purchase price to get the capital back.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
I feel the 2 four coin strips will do well also.
It's been said it may not be disclosed until the end of year audit.