Yet another scam to be aware of in the hobby..

The Pujols signature on this card is not authentic. If you look closely, you can see the sticker has been tampered with. It probably originally came from a worthless no-name player autograph that was wiped clean, and a forged Pujols auto signed on the sticker, and applied to this card. More than likely, they wanted the legit Pujols autograph for another project(as I have been seeing some people doing in recent times), and thought they could keep it and replace the authentic Pujols sig on this card, and it would never be suspected since the sigs are card-company certified..

image

Altered

I am just passing on the info, so any of you folks who buy modern cards can be aware of what looks to be a new scam. The Hanley Ramirez and David Wright signatures are fine, only the Pujols was altered on this one. Just keep your eyes peeled if you are buying modern cards with card-company certified autographs on them. Not all is what it seems at first glance..

* And I am not saying the current Ebay seller is the scammer. That person may have been scammed and unaware.

EDIT:Fix link

«13456

Comments


  • notjustcollectible ( 645)

    2 years 9 months

    NC,United States



    Pretty sure I know who that might be.
    Folks Who Bite Get Bitten. Folks Who Don't Bite Get Eaten.
  • Here is what an authentic Pujols signed sticker from Topps should look like:

    image

  • And just a quick glance, here are more forged Pujols signatures I found on TTT cards:

    image

    Altered

    image

    Altered

    There are more currently on Ebay, but you get the idea of what to be on the lookout for.

    And here is another authentic Pujols signature for comparison against the forgeries:

    image




  • Is it possible that Pujols had someone else sign the stickers/sheet for him to send back to Topps? They all look the same to me.


  • << <i>Is it possible that Pujols had someone else sign the stickers/sheet for him to send back to Topps? They all look the same to me. >>



    No, the Pujols forgeries have the same characteristics that a certain forger/scammer/trimmer have been using lately. I have a feeling I know who is behind this, and I believe storm does too.

    And no, they are not all the same. Look closer at the authentic examples I have provided in this thread.
  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭
    If it's him, ban all card sellers from NC, ...might not stop him though since he's "STUNTIN FROM STATE 2 STATE" ...


  • << <i>notjustcollectible ( 645)

    2 years 9 months

    NC,United States



    Pretty sure I know who that might be. >>



    Me too. Tempting to buy from them to see if it's another acct. Can you tell me if the ebay name 'stats' with the questionable Pujols is from NC as well?
    imageimageimage
  • One from FL.

    One from IL. (stats)


    ........

    The famous guy from NC has associates in FL.

    Prolly in other places, too.
    Folks Who Bite Get Bitten. Folks Who Don't Bite Get Eaten.
  • I guess one good thing about Topps' stickers is when there peeled off and placed on a card with other stickers.

    I mean how much more obvious can you get?


    EDITED TO ADD: I love reading replies I make when im drinking image
  • If it's him, ban all card sellers from NC, ...might not stop him though since he's "STUNTIN FROM STATE 2 STATE" ...

    Is from NC, and is EXTREMELY HONEST...sometimes to a fault, so that statement is absurd!
  • Stantheman, while I appreciate the input, you are barking up the wrong tree... This is how the Pujols autographs are coming out of the packs. I have seen break on multiple sites and one at a local show with Pujols autographs just like the ones you say are altered, so either topps is using fake stickers or pujols changed his sig...
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ
  • Also, go look at the completed ones. You will see a bunch of ones which you are saying are fake and a bunch that you are saying are realy. I highly doubt that many pujols autos were altered by that many different sellers.
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ


  • << <i>notjustcollectible ( 645)

    2 years 9 months

    NC,United States



    Pretty sure I know who that might be. >>




    good catch

    this is a good reason to stop sticker autos card companies if your are listening

    sticker autos suk
    My 2001 PSA Pujols RC Collection 100% complete

    image

    ---------------------------------------------
  • MorgothMorgoth Posts: 3,956 ✭✭✭
    If they aren't tampered with then why is the Pujols sticker the only one not refracting light in any of those picts? Trick of the scanner on all the scans???? Are you saying that Topps used a different type of sticker for some of the Pujols tripple thread autos? Are you saying that the U in all of those Pujols autos doesn't bother you? That the seller is from NC (sorry NC guys) and that is a known home for the biggest forger on Ebay?

    That is a alot of conicidences and too many for me not to be suspicious.
    Currently completing the following registry sets: Cardinal HOF's, 1961 Pittsburgh Pirates Team, 1972 Pittsburgh Pirates Team, 1980 Pittsburgh Pirates Team, Bill Mazeroski Master & Basic Sets, Roberto Clemente Master & Basic Sets, Willie Stargell Master & Basic Sets and Terry Bradshaw Basic Set


  • << <i>If they aren't tampered with then why is the Pujols sticker the only one not refracting light in any of those picts? Trick of the scanner on all the scans???? Are you saying that Topps used a different type of sticker for some of the Pujols tripple thread autos? Are you saying that the U in all of those Pujols autos doesn't bother you? That the seller is from NC (sorry NC guys) and that is a known home for the biggest forger on Ebay?

    That is a alot of conicidences and too many for me not to be suspicious. >>



    If you look at the NC seller and all of the other alleged fakers posted in this thread, they do not have the common "theme" of the ones who are doing the other fakes. There are not any other questionable cards for sale, they are not buying cards to be made into questionable cards, and their only link is that they are selling triple threads pujols autographs.

    This one is one of the ones that was pulled here locally. Notice the non-refracting sticker. My guess is that TOpps gud into their archives and used older Pujols autographs that were supposed to be for other products beecasues they could not get him to sign. He was omitted from the checklist from 3 different products earleir this year and i am guessing they are having him trouble getting him to sign. I will be on a conference call with topps stoday so i will see what kind of answer I can get from them.
    Instead of going ahead and accusing these sellers, and runing around with all of this doom and gloom, I think a bit more of research needs to be done. Because i dont think everyone is as much of an expert as they think they are.
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ
  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭


    << <i>If it's him, ban all card sellers from NC, ...might not stop him though since he's "STUNTIN FROM STATE 2 STATE" ...

    Is from NC, and is EXTREMELY HONEST...sometimes to a fault, so that statement is absurd! >>



    bobbyw8469, I was being facetious ...and the ridiculous "STUNTIN" comment came from a certain NC sellers My Space page.
  • AricAric Posts: 764 ✭✭
    I'm certainly no expert, but the differences in the P and the u are pretty substantial.
  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭
    Also, STMM, why don't you get a comment from Topps, they don't look good imo but a Topps confirmation would seal the deal for everyone.
  • FWIW- Burge has numerous selling accounts and a different buying acct. Also known to have accomplices. He sells alot and alot are real. If your going to scam, the "smarter" ones will sprinkle in a few fakes over numerous accounts to draw less attention.

    Was it Burge who had the Pujols SGC wiped/redone auto? Yep....


    I just got an email forewarning me of a scam that is on the verge of hitting eBay with full force. Kevin Burge, aka shoelessjoejackson, had quite the situation on his hands at the Philly show last weekend when he tried to get JSA, PSA, SGC and BGS to slab his COUNTERFEIT 2001 Albert Pujols Bowman Chrome autos. For those of you who are unfamiliar with the ****** that this guy is, he is the mastermind behind the Topps Rookie Premiere fakes that are all over eBay, and have made it practically impossible to figure out which of the cards are real or fake. Per some preliminary reports, some of the fakes even made it past BGS, thus making things even more difficult. Burge has been a known patch faker for years, but creating actual fake cards is something new for him. Obviously he has found a way to get his grubby ***** fingers on some way to produce the Pujols chromes, and it wont be long before they get out of control. The fact that the Pujols fakes are a new breed of fake is quite frightening. At least his usual stupidity got the best of him when trying to pass them through the graders. Apparently, Burge didnt do his research, as always, and tried to forge a later style Pujols auto on the 2001 card, therefore setting off all sorts of red flags for the people who examined the cards. To add to it, a few of the numbers were off, so it was pretty easy to see why the cards failed inspection. People, things are getting pretty ****** bad, and I encourage you to do MASSIVE amounts of research before making any sort of big purchases now. As long as ****** like Kevin Burge are out there, we are all at risk to get our money ripped off. More importantly, with this info, watch out for the Pujols fakes that are sure to start popping up on eBay soon, and email me if you see one at [email protected] How he has not gone to jail for the amount of money he has stolen from people is beyond me.

    Here are a few of his names we know of:
    shoeless-joejackson
    peopleschoice7373
    cardsrahabit
    jmvariety09
    blameitonthealcohol (buying account)
    cauckcards


    SGC thread *Language warning*
    imageimageimage


  • << <i>FWIW- Burge has numerous selling accounts and a different buying acct. Also known to have accomplices. He sells alot and alot are real. If your going to scam, the "smarter" ones will sprinkle in a few fakes over numerous accounts to draw less attention.

    Was it Burge who had the Pujols SGC wiped/redone auto? Yep....


    I just got an email forewarning me of a scam that is on the verge of hitting eBay with full force. Kevin Burge, aka shoelessjoejackson, had quite the situation on his hands at the Philly show last weekend when he tried to get JSA, PSA, SGC and BGS to slab his COUNTERFEIT 2001 Albert Pujols Bowman Chrome autos. For those of you who are unfamiliar with the ****** that this guy is, he is the mastermind behind the Topps Rookie Premiere fakes that are all over eBay, and have made it practically impossible to figure out which of the cards are real or fake. Per some preliminary reports, some of the fakes even made it past BGS, thus making things even more difficult. Burge has been a known patch faker for years, but creating actual fake cards is something new for him. Obviously he has found a way to get his grubby ***** fingers on some way to produce the Pujols chromes, and it wont be long before they get out of control. The fact that the Pujols fakes are a new breed of fake is quite frightening. At least his usual stupidity got the best of him when trying to pass them through the graders. Apparently, Burge didnt do his research, as always, and tried to forge a later style Pujols auto on the 2001 card, therefore setting off all sorts of red flags for the people who examined the cards. To add to it, a few of the numbers were off, so it was pretty easy to see why the cards failed inspection. People, things are getting pretty ****** bad, and I encourage you to do MASSIVE amounts of research before making any sort of big purchases now. As long as ****** like Kevin Burge are out there, we are all at risk to get our money ripped off. More importantly, with this info, watch out for the Pujols fakes that are sure to start popping up on eBay soon, and email me if you see one at [email protected] How he has not gone to jail for the amount of money he has stolen from people is beyond me.

    Here are a few of his names we know of:
    shoeless-joejackson
    peopleschoice7373
    cardsrahabit
    jmvariety09
    blameitonthealcohol (buying account)
    cauckcards


    Actually, that email is completly wrong. Kevin Burge had nothing to do with those Bowman Chrome Pujols autographs... As for the Triple threads autographs, look at the cards being sold. There are about 25 or so Pujols autographs that are currently listed or have ended. About hald resmble a current pujols auto and about half do not. Do you really think that within the last week, He has bought 10-12 pujols autographs, got them re-done, spread them across the county all within 1 week? I Amean seriously? I think everyone seems to want to cream the sky is flaling without really looking at the situation in a logical way.
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ


  • << <i>Stantheman, while I appreciate the input, you are barking up the wrong tree... This is how the Pujols autographs are coming out of the packs. I have seen break on multiple sites and one at a local show with Pujols autographs just like the ones you say are altered, so either topps is using fake stickers or pujols changed his sig... >>



    I am hardly barking up the wrong tree. I know Pujols' signature, and the all the different styles of his signature over the years, as well as anyone in the hobby. I live in the St. Louis area, and have received my fair share of Pujols signatures over the years in person(2001-current). I clearly know a Pujols forgery when I see one. The examples I provided show a vast difference in the real ones and the forgeries. My knowledge on Pujols autographs on this board stands solid, so I don't appreciate people like you trying to discredit what I know, or suggest I don't know what I truly do. Maybe you need to further educate yourself, and you will see I am onto something here..
  • That's right- apm-cards was selling the SGC Pujols.


    ebay
    imageimageimage


  • << <i>

    << <i>Stantheman, while I appreciate the input, you are barking up the wrong tree... This is how the Pujols autographs are coming out of the packs. I have seen break on multiple sites and one at a local show with Pujols autographs just like the ones you say are altered, so either topps is using fake stickers or pujols changed his sig... >>



    I am hardly barking up the wrong tree. I know Pujols' signature, and the all the different styles of his signature over the years, as well as anyone in the hobby. I live in the St. Louis area, and have received my fair share of Pujols signatures over the years in person(2001-current). I clearly know a Pujols forgery when I see one. The examples I provided show a vast difference in the real ones and the forgeries. My knowledge on Pujols autographs on this board stands solid, so I don't appreciate people like you trying to discredit what I know, or suggest I don't know what I truly do. Maybe you need to further educate yourself, and you will see I am onto something here.. >>



    BY Barking up the wrong tree i was referring to the fact that you were saying it was Kevin Burge who was responsible for all of the questionable autographs. If you look at the auction i posted as well as all of hte current and completed auctions on ebay, you will see that it is highligh improbable that these cards are being faked after the fact and it would be impossible that they are being done by Kevin Burge...
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ


  • << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>Stantheman, while I appreciate the input, you are barking up the wrong tree... This is how the Pujols autographs are coming out of the packs. I have seen break on multiple sites and one at a local show with Pujols autographs just like the ones you say are altered, so either topps is using fake stickers or pujols changed his sig... >>



    I am hardly barking up the wrong tree. I know Pujols' signature, and the all the different styles of his signature over the years, as well as anyone in the hobby. I live in the St. Louis area, and have received my fair share of Pujols signatures over the years in person(2001-current). I clearly know a Pujols forgery when I see one. The examples I provided show a vast difference in the real ones and the forgeries. My knowledge on Pujols autographs on this board stands solid, so I don't appreciate people like you trying to discredit what I know, or suggest I don't know what I truly do. Maybe you need to further educate yourself, and you will see I am onto something here.. >>



    BY Barking up the wrong tree i was referring to the fact that you were saying it was Kevin Burge who was responsible for all of the questionable autographs. If you look at the auction i posted as well as all of hte current and completed auctions on ebay, you will see that it is highligh improbable that these cards are being faked after the fact and it would be impossible that they are being done by Kevin Burge... >>



    Where did I mention Kevin Burge? I simply said I had a feeling I knew who was behind it. I never mentioned anyone by name. And JFYI, there has been another alleged fake patch maker/trimmer/forger mentioned on this forum linked to Pujols forged signatures in the last few months.

    The Pujols autographs I called out are fakes. No doubt. There are more of them out there. I provided examples of real ones and forgeries. There is a clear difference. And if a certain group of scum bags are working together, they can spread them out in short time. Don't think scammers can't push their scam around in a short time. That is how they cash in before anyone catches onto their scam. Just like they done the 2001 Fleer Legacy Pujols forged autographs.


  • << <i>i was referring to the fact that you were saying it was Kevin Burge who was responsible >>



    image That's funny because I noticed stmm was being careful with his wording. And I knew why. He's no stranger to this type of thing. And that's a fact.

    image
  • Here are examples from completed Ebay auctions that are authentic:

    image
    image
    image
    image

    And here are some more Pujols forgeries from completed auctions:

    image
    image
    image

    There are more forgeries and authentic ones in completed auctions, but I am just posting examples as comparision.

  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭
    Ted, I'm just playing devils advocate here but how can you say Burge had nothing to do with the Pujols Chrome Auto's when SGC said it was him submitting them?


    "Actually, that email is completly wrong. Kevin Burge had nothing to do with those Bowman Chrome Pujols autographs."
  • I am firmly convinced that after reading thread after thread after thread regarding bogus Pujols autos:

    1)No Pujols autographed card out there is real. Even if I was to pull one out of a pack tomorrow, it is most likely a forgery.

    2) I need more therapy to fully understand why I keep reading these Pujols threads.


  • << <i>I am firmly convinced that after reading thread after thread after thread regarding bogus Pujols autos:

    1)No Pujols autographed card out there is real. Even if I was to pull one out of a pack tomorrow, it is most likely a forgery.

    2) I need more therapy to fully understand why I keep reading these Pujols threads. >>



    1. There are plenty of them that are real. I have provided examples of such.

    2. This is NOT just about Pujols, but it seems to be starting with his signatures. If they are doing this with Pujols stuff, don't think the scammers are not going to try and migrate into other stars. Jeter, A-Rod, ect.. This thread is to HELP EDUCATE OTHERS IN THE HOBBY FROM BEING SCAMMED, so if you can't appreciate that, then it's probably best that you don't read these threads.


  • << <i>Ted, I'm just playing devils advocate here but how can you say Burge had nothing to do with the Pujols Chrome Auto's when SGC said it was him submitting them?

    "Actually, that email is completly wrong. Kevin Burge had nothing to do with those Bowman Chrome Pujols autographs." >>




    /////////////////////////////////////////////

    From another TPG who KNOWS who the bad guy is:

    "...Additionally, as was clarified but worth repeating, the individual that sells some of these cards on eBay has no affiliation with ......... Joe's Vintage Sportscards. They both have or had "Shoeless" in their names at one time or another...."

    ...........................

    Re: Wide and Rapid Distribution

    It takes less than an hour for a crew chief to place DOZENS of cards
    in DOZENS of his associates listings; all in different states.

    The crew members do NOT have to have the cards in their hands, in
    order to list them for sale.

    Folks Who Bite Get Bitten. Folks Who Don't Bite Get Eaten.
  • dtsadtsa Posts: 239 ✭✭
    my computer is insane. it automatically enters my user name/password and the last thing i wrote on the boards and hits enter.

    i was going to say that the cut isnt even close to the worst one of those that i have seen. some are at angle and have 3/4 of auto window not even covered.
  • dtsadtsa Posts: 239 ✭✭
    i am slightly confused. Are these cards that are not autographed coming from packs and stickers are added? are there cards in ttm that only have 2 autos and pujols are left blank?Then the scammers add a pujols?
  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭
    basically it's possible to wipe off the auto (and resign someone elses name) on the topps stickers, what is being reported to happen here is the real Pujols auto is removed, then they take a, say, Erik Aybar, wipe the auto off, resign it 'A.Pujols' and put the sticker back in the card ....kind of like switching a game jersey piece for a game jersey patch piece and selling it as the later.


  • << <i>Here are examples from completed Ebay auctions that are authentic:

    image
    image
    image
    image

    And here are some more Pujols forgeries from completed auctions:

    image
    image
    image

    There are more forgeries and authentic ones in completed auctions, but I am just posting examples as comparision. >>



    I have already verified that one of the cards you have posted as fake was pulled by a collector about 20 minutes from here. So you are telling me that this collector is also into faking pujols autos? Also, look arpund at some of hte box breaks on the various message boards and you will see that other collectos are pulling these as well Or are they into faking pujols autographs as well??... I am not disputing that there are questionable autographs on these cards, i am disputing wether these were done after the cards came out of the packs.
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ
  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭
    Stan have you attempted to contact Topps to get their opinion?


  • << <i>Ted, I'm just playing devils advocate here but how can you say Burge had nothing to do with the Pujols Chrome Auto's when SGC said it was him submitting them?


    "Actually, that email is completly wrong. Kevin Burge had nothing to do with those Bowman Chrome Pujols autographs." >>



    The cards were at my booth for about 90% of the show. I know the submitter, I know where he got them from and neitehr were Kevin Burge
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ
  • <<I have already verified that one of the cards you have posted as fake was pulled by a collector about 20 minutes from here. So you are telling me that this collector is also into faking pujols autos? Also, look arpund at some of hte box breaks on the various message boards and you will see that other collectos are pulling these as well Or are they into faking pujols autographs as well??... I am not disputing that there are questionable autographs on these cards, i am disputing wether these were done after the cards came out of the packs.>>


    Ted,

    Did you personally see it pulled? If so, then we need to dig deeper, because it's a forgery, and not a very good one. Just look how shakey it was done..


    Vguerrero,

    I can't contact Topps. I am at work right now.
  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Ted, I'm just playing devils advocate here but how can you say Burge had nothing to do with the Pujols Chrome Auto's when SGC said it was him submitting them?


    "Actually, that email is completly wrong. Kevin Burge had nothing to do with those Bowman Chrome Pujols autographs." >>



    The cards were at my booth for about 90% of the show. I know the submitter, I know where he got them from and neitehr were Kevin Burge >>



    Could you explain a little more? So SGC is lying?


  • << <i>

    << <i>I am firmly convinced that after reading thread after thread after thread regarding bogus Pujols autos:

    1)No Pujols autographed card out there is real. Even if I was to pull one out of a pack tomorrow, it is most likely a forgery.

    2) I need more therapy to fully understand why I keep reading these Pujols threads. >>



    1. There are plenty of them that are real. I have provided examples of such.

    2. This is NOT just about Pujols, but it seems to be starting with his signatures. If they are doing this with Pujols stuff, don't think the scammers are not going to try and migrate into other stars. Jeter, A-Rod, ect.. This thread is to HELP EDUCATE OTHERS IN THE HOBBY FROM BEING SCAMMED, so if you can't appreciate that, then it's probably best that you don't read these threads. >>




    So let me get this straight. There are certain people out there, apparently a ring that encompasses many states that are distributing Pujols forgeries all throughout the hobby and getting paid a pretty penny in doing it? This said ring wipes Pujols off of a triple signed card and replaces it with a blatant forgery? What purpose does that serve? I mean seriously, two of your alleged fakes have a God awful Cabrera signature on them. Why not wipe that one clean as well to pretty it up? I'll give you credit for finding the wipe offs on single signed cards--much more logic for the scammers to doctor those. But a triple signed card? Sorry, ain't buying it.

    I am all for educating the hobby, and these boards do a great job of teaching people about things to look out for, but this has become a witch hunt for you. I need to ask, are you an expert on autographs? Do you do it for a living? Because if not, then for every forgery you are catching and posting about, there is another one you are claiming to be bogus that isn't. But hey, what's a little colateral damage for the innocent, right? I feel bad for the sellers that are legit.

    Here's a better question--how many autographs has Pujols signed for Topps? Do you know the number? I'll gander that it's in the thousands, maybe tens of thousands. I highly doubt that he is dead on on every single one of his autographs. I figure If he's sitting at his kitchen table and he's already signed 500 or 600 for the day (trying to catch up on a commitment to Topps) that those last few are gonna look like crap compared to the first few.

    Everyone's hand writing changes through the years. Everyone will have some degree of variation in their signature from one signature to the next. Sit down and sign your name a few hundred times in a row with a sharpie on a shiny sticker and tell me if your signature is going to be perfect every time.

  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭


    << <i><<I have already verified that one of the cards you have posted as fake was pulled by a collector about 20 minutes from here. So you are telling me that this collector is also into faking pujols autos? Also, look arpund at some of hte box breaks on the various message boards and you will see that other collectos are pulling these as well Or are they into faking pujols autographs as well??... I am not disputing that there are questionable autographs on these cards, i am disputing wether these were done after the cards came out of the packs.>>


    Ted,

    Did you personally see it pulled? If so, then we need to dig deeper, because it's a forgery, and not a very good one. Just look how shakey it was done..


    Vguerrero,

    I can't contact Topps. I am at work right now. >>



    I'll shoot them a email, maybe they will say they were clearing out old inventory and they realize some are lower quality and surprise us...
  • vladguerrerovladguerrero Posts: 4,083 ✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>I am firmly convinced that after reading thread after thread after thread regarding bogus Pujols autos:

    1)No Pujols autographed card out there is real. Even if I was to pull one out of a pack tomorrow, it is most likely a forgery.

    2) I need more therapy to fully understand why I keep reading these Pujols threads. >>



    1. There are plenty of them that are real. I have provided examples of such.

    2. This is NOT just about Pujols, but it seems to be starting with his signatures. If they are doing this with Pujols stuff, don't think the scammers are not going to try and migrate into other stars. Jeter, A-Rod, ect.. This thread is to HELP EDUCATE OTHERS IN THE HOBBY FROM BEING SCAMMED, so if you can't appreciate that, then it's probably best that you don't read these threads. >>




    So let me get this straight. There are certain people out there, apparently a ring that encompasses many states that are distributing Pujols forgeries all throughout the hobby and getting paid a pretty penny in doing it? This said ring wipes Pujols off of a triple signed card and replaces it with a blatant forgery? What purpose does that serve? I mean seriously, two of your alleged fakes have a God awful Cabrera signature on them. Why not wipe that one clean as well to pretty it up? I'll give you credit for finding the wipe offs on single signed cards--much more logic for the scammers to doctor those. But a triple signed card? Sorry, ain't buying it.

    I am all for educating the hobby, and these boards do a great job of teaching people about things to look out for, but this has become a witch hunt for you. I need to ask, are you an expert on autographs? Do you do it for a living? Because if not, then for every forgery you are catching and posting about, there is another one you are claiming to be bogus that isn't. But hey, what's a little colateral damage for the innocent, right? I feel bad for the sellers that are legit.

    Here's a better question--how many autographs has Pujols signed for Topps? Do you know the number? I'll gander that it's in the thousands, maybe tens of thousands. I highly doubt that he is dead on on every single one of his autographs. I figure If he's sitting at his kitchen table and he's already signed 500 or 600 for the day (trying to catch up on a commitment to Topps) that those last few are gonna look like crap compared to the first few.

    Everyone's hand writing changes through the years. Everyone will have some degree of variation in their signature from one signature to the next. Sit down and sign your name a few hundred times in a row with a sharpie on a shiny sticker and tell me if your signature is going to be perfect every time. >>



    basically it's possible to wipe off the auto (and resign someone elses name) on the topps stickers, what is being reported to happen here is the real Pujols auto is removed out of the card, then they take a, say, Erik Aybar, wipe the auto off, resign it 'A.Pujols' and put this sticker into the card ....kind of like switching a game jersey piece for a game jersey patch piece and selling it as the later.

    I don't think the idea is that far fetched, people are doing similar things on way higher value cards than TTT (2001 Bowman Chrome A-Pu)


  • << <i>

    << <i><<I have already verified that one of the cards you have posted as fake was pulled by a collector about 20 minutes from here. So you are telling me that this collector is also into faking pujols autos? Also, look arpund at some of hte box breaks on the various message boards and you will see that other collectos are pulling these as well Or are they into faking pujols autographs as well??... I am not disputing that there are questionable autographs on these cards, i am disputing wether these were done after the cards came out of the packs.>>


    Ted,

    Did you personally see it pulled? If so, then we need to dig deeper, because it's a forgery, and not a very good one. Just look how shakey it was done..


    Vguerrero,

    I can't contact Topps. I am at work right now. >>




    I'll shoot them a email, maybe they will say they were clearing out old inventory and they realize some are lower quality and surprise us... >>



    Vguerrero, that was my theory from earlier in the thread. As i had said then, i know they had toruble getting pujols to sign... I emailed topps and am waiting their reply. They did not get to answer it during the conference call today
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ


  • << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>I am firmly convinced that after reading thread after thread after thread regarding bogus Pujols autos:

    1)No Pujols autographed card out there is real. Even if I was to pull one out of a pack tomorrow, it is most likely a forgery.

    2) I need more therapy to fully understand why I keep reading these Pujols threads. >>



    1. There are plenty of them that are real. I have provided examples of such.

    2. This is NOT just about Pujols, but it seems to be starting with his signatures. If they are doing this with Pujols stuff, don't think the scammers are not going to try and migrate into other stars. Jeter, A-Rod, ect.. This thread is to HELP EDUCATE OTHERS IN THE HOBBY FROM BEING SCAMMED, so if you can't appreciate that, then it's probably best that you don't read these threads. >>




    So let me get this straight. There are certain people out there, apparently a ring that encompasses many states that are distributing Pujols forgeries all throughout the hobby and getting paid a pretty penny in doing it? This said ring wipes Pujols off of a triple signed card and replaces it with a blatant forgery? What purpose does that serve? I mean seriously, two of your alleged fakes have a God awful Cabrera signature on them. Why not wipe that one clean as well to pretty it up? I'll give you credit for finding the wipe offs on single signed cards--much more logic for the scammers to doctor those. But a triple signed card? Sorry, ain't buying it.You clearly missed the point of what's happening. Please go back and read and comprehend exactly what has been laid out

    I am all for educating the hobby, and these boards do a great job of teaching people about things to look out for, but this has become a witch hunt for you. I need to ask, are you an expert on autographs? Do you do it for a living? Because if not, then for every forgery you are catching and posting about, there is another one you are claiming to be bogus that isn't. But hey, what's a little colateral damage for the innocent, right? I feel bad for the sellers that are legit. A witch hunt? How many threads have I started pertaining to this in say the last year? An expert on autographs? Oh, I guess I am pretty accurate. I have a credible track record of such on here with a good deal of respected board members getting my opinion before submitting to JSA or PSA/DNA, or buying online. Not trying to sound arrogant, but I do know Pujols and HOF autographs quite well. You need to wise up, as some of the stuff you are saying is nonsense.

    Here's a better question--how many autographs has Pujols signed for Topps? Do you know the number? I'll gander that it's in the thousands, maybe tens of thousands. I highly doubt that he is dead on on every single one of his autographs. I figure If he's sitting at his kitchen table and he's already signed 500 or 600 for the day (trying to catch up on a commitment to Topps) that those last few are gonna look like crap compared to the first few.

    Everyone's hand writing changes through the years. Everyone will have some degree of variation in their signature from one signature to the next. Sit down and sign your name a few hundred times in a row with a sharpie on a shiny sticker and tell me if your signature is going to be perfect every time. >>

    Again, it's not about every sig being exactly the same, but a signature has certain characteristics; slant, flow, letter formation, ect.. that does not change, as it comes from repitition/muscle memory of signing you name over and over. That stays consistent.


  • << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i><<I have already verified that one of the cards you have posted as fake was pulled by a collector about 20 minutes from here. So you are telling me that this collector is also into faking pujols autos? Also, look arpund at some of hte box breaks on the various message boards and you will see that other collectos are pulling these as well Or are they into faking pujols autographs as well??... I am not disputing that there are questionable autographs on these cards, i am disputing wether these were done after the cards came out of the packs.>>


    Ted,

    Did you personally see it pulled? If so, then we need to dig deeper, because it's a forgery, and not a very good one. Just look how shakey it was done..


    Vguerrero,

    I can't contact Topps. I am at work right now. >>






    I'll shoot them a email, maybe they will say they were clearing out old inventory and they realize some are lower quality and surprise us... >>



    Vguerrero, that was my theory from earlier in the thread. As i had said then, i know they had toruble getting pujols to sign... I emailed topps and am waiting their reply. They did not get to answer it during the conference call today >>



    Ted,

    I'll ask again; Did you personally see that Pujols pulled from a pack? If so, we need to dig deeper, because it's a forgery. I see it was sold in the NJ area, and I know one of the forgers linked to all of this stuff mingles in that area.

    And just because Topps may have had a hard time getting Pujols to sign, does not make his signature look exactly like many of the forgeries that are floating around. As you can see from the authentic examples I have provided, Pujols signature is consistent on the authentic examples.


  • << <i>


    Ted,

    I'll ask again; Did you personally see that Pujols pulled from a pack? If so, we need to dig deeper, because it's a forgery. I see it was sold in the NJ area, and I know one of the forgers linked to all of this stuff mingles in that area.

    And just because Topps may have had a hard time getting Pujols to sign, does not make his signature look exactly like many of the forgeries that are floating around. As you can see from the authentic examples I have provided, Pujols signature is consistent on the authentic examples. >>



    I did not see this one pulled, but I do know the collector who pulled it. Again, if you look on the various message boards you will see these cards are being pulled by collectors with the fraudulant Pujols auto... It is not being done after the fact.
    www.sportsnutcards.com
    Specializing in Certified Autograph Cards, Rookies, Rare Inserts and other quality modern cards! Over 8000 Cards in stock now! Come visit our physical store located at 1210 Main St. Belmar ,NJ


  • << <i>

    << <i><<I have already verified that one of the cards you have posted as fake was pulled by a collector about 20 minutes from here. So you are telling me that this collector is also into faking pujols autos? Also, look arpund at some of hte box breaks on the various message boards and you will see that other collectos are pulling these as well Or are they into faking pujols autographs as well??... I am not disputing that there are questionable autographs on these cards, i am disputing wether these were done after the cards came out of the packs.>>


    Ted,

    Did you personally see it pulled? If so, then we need to dig deeper, because it's a forgery, and not a very good one. Just look how shakey it was done..


    Vguerrero,

    I can't contact Topps. I am at work right now. >>



    I'll shoot them a email, maybe they will say they were clearing out old inventory and they realize some are lower quality and surprise us... >>



    A signed sticker from a sheet, is a signed sticker from a sheet. Do you honestly think they set around at Topps and cherry pick what sticker they peel from a sheet to be slapped on a card? Even if you go back and look on Ebay at 2007 TTT Pujols signed stickers, the authentic signatures matches up with the authentic 2009 TTT examples I have provided. None of them look anything like the forgeries.

    Authentic 2009 example:

    image

    Authentic 2007 example:

    image

    Forged 2009 Example:

    image

    Authentic 2009 Example:

    image


  • << <i>

    << <i>


    Ted,

    I'll ask again; Did you personally see that Pujols pulled from a pack? If so, we need to dig deeper, because it's a forgery. I see it was sold in the NJ area, and I know one of the forgers linked to all of this stuff mingles in that area.

    And just because Topps may have had a hard time getting Pujols to sign, does not make his signature look exactly like many of the forgeries that are floating around. As you can see from the authentic examples I have provided, Pujols signature is consistent on the authentic examples. >>



    I did not see this one pulled, but I do know the collector who pulled it. Again, if you look on the various message boards you will see these cards are being pulled by collectors with the fraudulant Pujols auto... It is not being done after the fact. >>



    If you did not see it pulled from a pack, then how do you know that? When we personally see one come from a pack that is bogus, then I will be alarmed. Can you direct me to the message board you mentioned, to see one that was pulled directly from a pack? If you can, I would like to see what it looks like. The problem at this point is that those forgeries are pretty similar to the 2001 Fleer Legacy and some of the Topps buy back Pujols forgeries.
  • And going back even further, here is an authentic 2006 Topps sticker signed by Pujols:

    image

    If you compare it to the authentic 2007, 2008, & 2009 examples I have provided, you can see they are all consistent. They look nothing like the forgeries in question.

  • So let me get this straight. There are certain people out there, apparently a ring that encompasses many states that are distributing Pujols forgeries all throughout the hobby and getting paid a pretty penny in doing it? This said ring wipes Pujols off of a triple signed card and replaces it with a blatant forgery? What purpose does that serve? I mean seriously, two of your alleged fakes have a God awful Cabrera signature on them. Why not wipe that one clean as well to pretty it up? I'll give you credit for finding the wipe offs on single signed cards--much more logic for the scammers to doctor those. But a triple signed card? Sorry, ain't buying it.You clearly missed the point of what's happening. Please go back and read and comprehend exactly what has been laid out


    I didn't miss your point. I just find it extremely amazing that you are picking off all of these forgeries. My God, you are so adept at it, why aren't you working for PSA/DNA?


    I am all for educating the hobby, and these boards do a great job of teaching people about things to look out for, but this has become a witch hunt for you. I need to ask, are you an expert on autographs? Do you do it for a living? Because if not, then for every forgery you are catching and posting about, there is another one you are claiming to be bogus that isn't. But hey, what's a little colateral damage for the innocent, right? I feel bad for the sellers that are legit. A witch hunt? How many threads have I started pertaining to this in say the last year? An expert on autographs? Oh, I guess I am pretty accurate. I have a credible track record of such on here with a good deal of respected board members getting my opinion before submitting to JSA or PSA/DNA, or buying online. Not trying to sound arrogant, but I do know Pujols and HOF autographs quite well. You need to wise up, as some of the stuff you are saying is nonsense.


    Yeah. You were trying to sound arrogant. Again Mr. Pujols expert, why aren't you working for PSA/DNA? Oh, and I'll wise up when you stop acting like a keyboard cowboy.


    Here's a better question--how many autographs has Pujols signed for Topps? Do you know the number? I'll gander that it's in the thousands, maybe tens of thousands. I highly doubt that he is dead on on every single one of his autographs. I figure If he's sitting at his kitchen table and he's already signed 500 or 600 for the day (trying to catch up on a commitment to Topps) that those last few are gonna look like crap compared to the first few.

    Everyone's hand writing changes through the years. Everyone will have some degree of variation in their signature from one signature to the next. Sit down and sign your name a few hundred times in a row with a sharpie on a shiny sticker and tell me if your signature is going to be perfect every time. >>

    Again, it's not about every sig being exactly the same, but a signature has certain characteristics; slant, flow, letter formation, ect.. that does not change, as it comes from repitition/muscle memory of signing you name over and over. That stays consistent.


    Here's a thought, instead of calling all of these suspect forgeries as coming from a scammer or scammers, maybe the real scammer is Albert Pujols? Maybe he is having someone else sign his stickers for Topps? I find that to be more credible than multiple stickers showing up on multiple signed cards all be replaced with forgeries.

    Again, I'll give you credit for the single signed cards. I'll give you credit on the autographed rookies. But your credibility is running real thin when you are so condescending to others that question anything you have to say.
  • larryallen73larryallen73 Posts: 5,935 ✭✭✭
    I have no clue what's real or fake and my statement has nothing to do with Pujols (except to say WOW some people are REALLY into him) but this just tells me it's foolish to spend big money on autographs. I do not think anybody knows what's real and what's fake. I have two Tommy John autographed cards at home. Both are on issued cards, from packs, and are now in PSA holders. They are obviously not faked as I am pretty sure nobody is faking his autograph. The autographs are night and day different. Does not even look like the same name. It just tells me you have no clue what you are buying even if it comes right out of a pack. I think in a few years autographs will be like game used and all the crazy insert cards of the last 15 years and, by and large, become worth little. I am glad people are posting to beware of the fake cards but I am not 100% sure that anybody is really sure what is fake and what is real.
This discussion has been closed.