In response to your question about why PCGS would change the dates of eligibility around FS for this issue:
could one be that they DONT want to INFLUENCE or MAKE a rarity out of 1 or 2 coins when they are AWARE of several thousand being held up because of a USM error with shipping...?
my opinion is very good of PCGS when it comes to making the right call, they did so when they wouldn't label all varieties of Minnesota Extra Tree errors as "Extra Tree" - only the most obvious, even when expert error researchers labeled them all Extra Tree.......
an action to extend first strike treatment of these coins (UHR $20's) to begin when the first "substantial" delivery occurs (this wouldn't be hard to track, several thousand are apparently on the verge of being released) and extend for 30 days beyond that date would be proper in my opinion - and right on the mark - and wouldn't tarnish the FS label at all.
everyone can get on to just waiting for their coins, and not "jump" to cancel orders
Here is the truth why most UHR's have not been shipped
My brother, who used to work for the Mint, talked to a Mint person on the train last week and she confirmed that the problem is not the coin but the booklet. The Mint received several hundred thousand of the books and within 15 minutes the backs curled up. Apparantley Moy signed off on the books without going through proper testing. It's a lamination problem. They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem. There's been no news report provided to the public because this is a major fork up.
Now you know the real story ..... no more guessing .... and no conspiracy involved ... and it's obvious, those that canceled the books, received their coins.
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem.
Seems to me if that is the problem someone would have come up with the brain storm to send out the coins and the books later. They have the orders set up for seperate shipments (as indicated on the order page). How much could media shipping on a book set them back? If true that is a real shame. Hey Charlie...Is your book curling up?
<< <i>$1800 was a safe premium to pay considering there may be very few Early Release. I think they will be released in time for thousands to be designated Early Release/First Strike but at this time we don't know for sure (and believe it or not, I've been wrong before). >>
I agree with you if that was in fact an in hand Early Strike. However, the fact that the picture was photoshopped would have kept me from bidding.
<< <i>They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem.
Seems to me if that is the problem someone would have come up with the brain storm to send out the coins and the books later. They have the orders set up for seperate shipments (as indicated on the order page). How much could media shipping on a book set them back? If true that is a real shame. Hey Charlie...Is your book curling up? >>
Assuming they sent the 29,000 that are stuck without books x $3.00 (labor, cheap media rate, and small cardboard box) = $87,000.....Granted there is a large premium in the coins that should absorb the new cost, but honestly to incur an additional $87,000 cost I might hold up shipping too.
<< <i>Here is the truth why most UHR's have not been shipped
My brother, who used to work for the Mint, talked to a Mint person on the train last week and she confirmed that the problem is not the coin but the booklet. The Mint received several hundred thousand of the books and within 15 minutes the backs curled up. Apparantley Moy signed off on the books without going through proper testing. It's a lamination problem. They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem. There's been no news report provided to the public because this is a major fork up.
Now you know the real story ..... no more guessing .... and no conspiracy involved ... and it's obvious, those that canceled the books, received their coins. >>
I wonder if PCGS would slab the books as mint errors?
<< <i>Here is the truth why most UHR's have not been shipped
My brother, who used to work for the Mint, talked to a Mint person on the train last week and she confirmed that the problem is not the coin but the booklet. The Mint received several hundred thousand of the books and within 15 minutes the backs curled up. Apparantley Moy signed off on the books without going through proper testing. It's a lamination problem. They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem. There's been no news report provided to the public because this is a major fork up.
Now you know the real story ..... no more guessing .... and no conspiracy involved ... and it's obvious, those that canceled the books, received their coins. >>
I wonder if PCGS would slab the books as mint errors? >>
Well the comic book side of Collectors Universe could get those into "First Edition" plastic!
<<< could one be that they DONT want to INFLUENCE or MAKE a rarity out of 1 or 2 coins when they are AWARE of several thousand being held up because of a USM error with shipping...? >>>
" They " are not making rarities out of anything except their own plastic holders, all the coins are still the same.
<< <i><<< could one be that they DONT want to INFLUENCE or MAKE a rarity out of 1 or 2 coins when they are AWARE of several thousand being held up because of a USM error with shipping...? >>>
" They " are not making rarities out of anything except their own plastic holders, all the coins are still the same. >>
What you say may be 100% true but the amount collectors pay says something different.
Gold and silver are valuable but wisdom is priceless.
After reading the post about the book problem, I ran upstairs to check my book and all that was in the box was a pile of dust. jk So far my book hasn't curled up like a potato bug.
Charley,
I, like you, haven't taken my book out of the cello wrapper. If we are to believe this latest bit of information, then our books may be more valuable than the coins. I wonder if we can get PCGS to certify the book as an error, with a grade of "Garbage". Now I will surely wait till this all plays out to open the book. Maybe somebody did a Disney employee trick and put a dirty picture inside. Now the suspense is killing me.
Can anyone tell me what does "Priority Shipping" mean, aside from (per the US Mint web) $14.95 charge and 2-3 business day shipment? Do "Priority Shipments" require signatures on delivery? Are these shipments via FedEx?
US Navy/CAPT (Ret)/37yrs ------------------------- Status: Ding, Ding...Ding, Ding...Ding, Ding...
I just want to be clear that I'm playing cloak and dagger on my info because: 1) I ambushed my source 2) The source could have told me "no comment" 3) The source may not be aware I post about this often on the net. 4) I want to respect the source 5) I don't want to get the source in any trouble for giving out what info was given.
so, I'm am purposefully being secretive for the above reasons.
had I the foresight to ask: "Can I tell this to the planet?" then I would just blab it all out if permitted. I didn't ask. So.... it's gotta happen as "an unidentified source who wishes to remain anonymous" .... just like they do in news stories.
Also, to be clear...
I'm not pissed at those who have the coins nor think it is "unfair" they have them.... and I don't have any ill will whatsoever because "shiite happens." Somehow some escaped. They "got lucky."
That's the way it goes.
But the fact that "some shipped" means that PBGS could ship right now, and with the PBGS lies it is infuriating that those waiting are only receving lies and not even good lies either!
Further infurating me is the fact that all this week leading up to the 20th and even yesterday, the PBGS reps offered no better information than 2 weeks ago, which was essentially nothing.
Which lead me to believe the PBGS reps and staff in Indy are not acting to solve the problem.
the 20th came and gone and what did I have as an answer: "It could take 6-9 months" You !%^@%$@ picked! though I left out the "$@^#%!$% on the phone.
See, for me, if X isn't getting done and it is due to some huge issue and a bunch of customers are pissed.... If I can't fix it, and the supervisor can't fix it... and the manager can't fix it... then the employees should care enough to escalate this internally to someone who can. consider what we've been told by PBGS on the 20th and 21st. Does anyone here think such a thing happened in Indy? I would be surprised if it did, though it may have.
Thus my efforts to encourage you to contact anyone and everyone you can regarding this problem as the PBGS Indy people have dropped the ball big time. This is why I was looking up execs home addresses and phone numbers. Someone with authority needed to know they have an issue to fix and that the Indy people seem to have fallen down on the job. Sound crazy? well, hopefully not. I'm calling it a "customer generated escalation." How hard are the decisions here? It's not rocket surgery! cough up the extra money and pay for signatures on deliveries to people and eat the cost of shipping the coins separately. it's a business decision, not a technological hurdle preventing us from recovering the Titanic.
Hopefully, the information provided to me by {classified} will come to fruition and the coins will ship minus the thing or things in issue.
When? Don't forget I asked for, nor received, no commitment on a date the coins will ship. I don't even know.
So, CharlieC and Lureduin and a few other may be the lucky winners. no ill will towards them at all. good for them, if so... it'll make a great news story the world over.
but, I'm working trying to get things done, despite the frustrating PBGS Indy people. Hopefully the rest of us can also be the lucky ones. If not, good for CharlieC and Lureduin you got supremely lucky on this one.
edit: and I was also asking for order info to provide to that "Jan" supervisor just to show that "yes you have shipped coins and yes they weren't fifo."
why? only because she was initally claiming fifo and no idea about how many shipped and no idea about anything really. I was trying to back up my statements that "yes, coins were shipped and yes you did screw up by not doing fifo, but fifo is beside the point since YES YOU CAN AND HAVE SHIPPED and here is the #@%^%#@ proof you smarmy moron!" don't tell me "that you have no way of knowing" when you have a COMPUTER SYSTEM! ^#@%^#$
So, thus I was just trying to show the PBGS employee the customers out here do know that PBGS has screwed up and we have the proof.
but fifo is not my real concern as much as we know coins were shipped. that means PBGS can ship. Make the business decision above. it's not hard. just ship the ^@#%#@ coins!
<< <i>Can anyone tell me what does "Priority Shipping" mean, aside from (per the US Mint web) $14.95 charge and 2-3 business day shipment? Do "Priority Shipments" require signatures on delivery? Are these shipments via FedEx? >>
You mean in the list box on the mint's checkout page?
<< <i>I just want to be clear that I'm playing cloak and dagger on my info because: 1) I ambushed my source 2) The source could have told me "no comment" 3) The source may not be aware I post about this often on the net. 4) I want to respect the source 5) I don't want to get the source in any trouble for giving out what info was given.
so, I'm am purposefully being secretive for the above reasons.
had I the foresight to ask: "Can I tell this to the planet?" then I would just blab it all out if permitted. I didn't ask. So.... it's gotta happen as "an unidentified source who wishes to remain anonymous" .... just like they do in news stories.
Also, to be clear...
I'm not pissed at those who have the coins nor think it is "unfair" they have them.... and I don't have any ill will whatsoever because "shiite happens." Somehow some escaped. They "got lucky."
That's the way it goes.
But the fact that "some shipped" means that PBGS could ship right now, and with the PBGS lies it is infuriating that those waiting are only receving lies and not even good lies either!
Further infurating me is the fact that all this week leading up to the 20th and even yesterday, the PBGS reps offered no better information than 2 weeks ago, which was essentially nothing.
Which lead me to believe the PBGS reps and staff in Indy are not acting to solve the problem.
the 20th came and gone and what did I have as an answer: "It could take 6-9 months" You !%^@%$@ picked! though I left out the "$@^#%!$% on the phone.
See, for me, if X isn't getting done and it is due to some huge issue and a bunch of customers are pissed.... If I can't fix it, and the supervisor can't fix it... and the manager can't fix it... then the employees should care enough to escalate this internally to someone who can. consider what we've been told by PBGS on the 20th and 21st. Does anyone here think such a thing happened in Indy? I would be surprised if it did, though it may have.
Thus my efforts to encourage you to contact anyone and everyone you can regarding this problem as the PBGS Indy people have dropped the ball big time. This is why I was looking up execs home addresses and phone numbers. Someone with authority needed to know they have an issue to fix and that the Indy people seem to have fallen down on the job. Sound crazy? well, hopefully not. I'm calling it a "customer generated escalation." How hard are the decisions here? It's not rocket surgery! cough up the extra money and pay for signatures on deliveries to people and eat the cost of shipping the coins separately. it's a business decision, not a technological hurdle preventing us from recovering the Titanic.
Hopefully, the information provided to me by {classified} will come to fruition and the coins will ship minus the thing or things in issue.
When? Don't forget I asked for, nor received, no commitment on a date the coins will ship. I don't even know.
So, CharlieC and Lureduin and a few other may be the lucky winners. no ill will towards them at all. good for them, if so... it'll make a great news story the world over.
but, I'm working trying to get things done, despite the frustrating PBGS Indy people. Hopefully the rest of us can also be the lucky ones. If not, good for CharlieC and Lureduin you got supremely lucky on this one.
edit: and I was also asking for order info to provide to that "Jan" supervisor just to show that "yes you have shipped coins and yes they weren't fifo."
why? only because she was initally claiming fifo and no idea about how many shipped and no idea about anything really. I was trying to back up my statements that "yes, coins were shipped and yes you did screw up by not doing fifo, but fifo is beside the point since YES YOU CAN AND HAVE SHIPPED and here is the #@%^%#@ proof you smarmy moron!" don't tell me "that you have no way of knowing" when you have a COMPUTER SYSTEM! ^#@%^#$
So, thus I was just trying to show the PBGS employee the customers out here do know that PBGS has screwed up and we have the proof.
but fifo is not my real concern as much as we know coins were shipped. that means PBGS can ship. Make the business decision above. it's not hard. just ship the ^@#%#@ coins!
duh. >>
You know the lousy books holding up the coins isn't breaking news. In fact it is kinda old news. Dont stress over it.
MsM, yes. If the standard delivery ($4.95) option is the issue (it's currently contracted to be delivered without a signature, regardless of the content value), then why are orders which include Expedited Delivery ($12.95, supposedly requiring signature for delivery) also still being heldup?
Update (Monday, 23Feb): This morning I received my order of Lincoln Proof Silver Dollars which I ordered with $12.95 Expedited Delivery option. It was dropped at my door (the deliveryman did ring the door bell and left), but no signature was requested/required.
So, currently there appears to be no option to order US Mint products and force a signature to be required for delivery (even if we're willing to pay an extra cost for that service)!!
US Navy/CAPT (Ret)/37yrs ------------------------- Status: Ding, Ding...Ding, Ding...Ding, Ding...
well, for most higher value orders they do a long credit card hold on them. it has been this way for a long time. so, high value order always shipped later than low value orders placed the same day.
unfortunately, I'm wondering if the signature issue isn't also another "business decision" not yet resolved. I didn't ask my source. But I have a large order for other stuff that went through a week earlier than a much lower value of the same thing. Even though the lower value one was over $300, it shipped faster than the much higher value one.... and I would have expected them to ship by now. As it stands right now, there is not even a "pending charge" on my CC for the higher value one! So, it too is not being processed as fast as I think it would have before PBGS came into our lives. PB in PBGS must be "Pathetic Baahstahds."
PS: orders over $300 are auto-magically upgraded to next day for no additional cost. So, I have left high value orders on the $4.95 option. Though recently, I have gotten lower value parts of expensive orders shipped the "slow" way, where before the whole order got upgraded to next day no matter the item value.
Things have changed for the worse.
and upgrading it to the higher level of shipping won't guarantee it will require a signature either, no matter what PBGS says. UPS says otherwise.
<< <i>I just want to be clear that I'm playing cloak and dagger on my info because: 1) I ambushed my source 2) The source could have told me "no comment" 3) The source may not be aware I post about this often on the net. 4) I want to respect the source 5) I don't want to get the source in any trouble for giving out what info was given.
so, I'm am purposefully being secretive for the above reasons.
had I the foresight to ask: "Can I tell this to the planet?" then I would just blab it all out if permitted. I didn't ask. So.... it's gotta happen as "an unidentified source who wishes to remain anonymous" .... just like they do in news stories."
Reading between the lines it looks like my prior supposition is correct. The current contract was based on a deal that was cut with the shippers by the USMint's fulfillment contractor that was based upon a lesser cost due to not requiring signatures. Apparently a stalemate has been reached because without an act of congress or some stimulus funds the government is in no position to pay for an increased cost (and probably couldn't do so in a speedy manner due to red tape requirements for letting of contracts) and on the other hand the fulfillment contractor is maintaining that it was never required to obtain signatures under the terms of its current contract. The same scenario would apply if the added cost is alternatively as a result of two separate mailings being required because of a defective book.
<< <i>Here is the truth why most UHR's have not been shipped
My brother, who used to work for the Mint, talked to a Mint person on the train last week and she confirmed that the problem is not the coin but the booklet. The Mint received several hundred thousand of the books and within 15 minutes the backs curled up. Apparantley Moy signed off on the books without going through proper testing. It's a lamination problem. They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem. There's been no news report provided to the public because this is a major fork up.
Now you know the real story ..... no more guessing .... and no conspiracy involved ... and it's obvious, those that canceled the books, received their coins. >>
FWIW, when I handled one of the books at the opening of the UHR exhibit at the Philadelphia Mint on Feb. 3, I thought it odd that the cover was separated from the book, but assumed at the time that it was either a mockup or had been damaged by the many people who had handled it before me. The covers were not curled, just loose. TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
"In response to your question about why PCGS would change the dates of eligibility around FS for this issue:
could one be that they DONT want to INFLUENCE or MAKE a rarity out of 1 or 2 coins when they are AWARE of several thousand being held up because of a USM error with shipping...?
my opinion is very good of PCGS when it comes to making the right call, they did so when they wouldn't label all varieties of Minnesota Extra Tree errors as "Extra Tree" - only the most obvious, even when expert error researchers labeled them all Extra Tree.......
an action to extend first strike treatment of these coins (UHR $20's) to begin when the first "substantial" delivery occurs (this wouldn't be hard to track, several thousand are apparently on the verge of being released) and extend for 30 days beyond that date would be proper in my opinion - and right on the mark - and wouldn't tarnish the FS label at all.
everyone can get on to just waiting for their coins, and not "jump" to cancel orders "
I agree
Given the situation the 1st Strike window should start when there is a substanial shipment. I don't believe that this has yet occured.
Mint yo-yos: thats the way you do it make Double Eagles in high-relief - But don’t ship them - thats the way you do it Charge ‘em money for nothin and give the book for free!
Web Site: it aint workin. Thats the way they do it… The ‘Track An Order’ page is always down! Maybe ship the coins out on: 2/20 2/20 has come and gone -
>1-800-USA-MINT: >What’s going on with our deliveries?! >What’s going on with - our double eagles? >Customer Service – answer us please! ~
We don’t mind about the 40% mark-up Yeah buddy, we don’t even care - 3/11 = First Strike Deadline - I gotta get my coin so I can get my coin there.
>1-800-USA-MINT: >What’s going on with our deliveries?! >What’s going on with - our double eagles? >Customer Service – answer us please! ~
I should just relax for a minute - I shoulda just enjoy my coins - My UHR is gonna get here when it gets here - The wait will make it better when it does. And what’s up here, whats that? conspiracy theories? When the book warps, does Virgin Mary appear? Just put it on Ebay! thats the way you do it Then get your money for nothin and your coin for free!
<< <i>All the mint reps called in sick. They have heard enough complaining. >>
they were unable to deliver themselves to work but could not tell their supervisors a reason. they only could lie or say "I don't know." None are sure when they will be able to deliver themselves, but they are committed to issuing endless e-mails pushing out the dates to infinity without reason.
none will be fired because this is the way all businesses operate.
Rather than effectively communicate issues dealing with distribution, the mint has elected to close off communication, the worst thing an entity can do when things go wrong.
Of course people are anxious--many collectors don't just drop over a grand and forget about it. The mint has done little to maintain it's customers' confidence. For those who've been through this before with other popular issues, this is just par for the course.
The mint rarely fails to miss an opportunity to screw up their biggest releases.
Comments
In response to your question about why PCGS would change the dates of eligibility around FS for this issue:
could one be that they DONT want to INFLUENCE or MAKE a rarity out of 1 or 2 coins when they are AWARE of several thousand being held up because of a USM error with shipping...?
my opinion is very good of PCGS when it comes to making the right call, they did so when they wouldn't label all varieties of Minnesota Extra Tree errors as "Extra Tree" - only the most obvious, even when expert error researchers labeled them all Extra Tree.......
an action to extend first strike treatment of these coins (UHR $20's) to begin when the first "substantial" delivery occurs (this wouldn't be hard to track, several thousand are apparently on the verge of being released) and extend for 30 days beyond that date would be proper in my opinion - and right on the mark - and wouldn't tarnish the FS label at all.
everyone can get on to just waiting for their coins, and not "jump" to cancel orders
My brother, who used to work for the Mint, talked to a Mint person on the train last week and she confirmed that the problem is not the coin but the booklet. The Mint received several hundred thousand of the books and within 15 minutes the backs curled up.
Apparantley Moy signed off on the books without going through proper testing. It's a lamination problem. They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem. There's been no news report provided to the public because this is a major fork up.
Now you know the real story ..... no more guessing .... and no conspiracy involved ... and it's obvious, those that canceled the books, received their coins.
Seems to me if that is the problem someone would have come up with the brain storm to send out the coins and the books later. They have the orders set up for seperate shipments (as indicated on the order page). How much could media shipping on a book set them back? If true that is a real shame. Hey Charlie...Is your book curling up?
<< <i>$1800 was a safe premium to pay considering there may be very few Early Release. I think they will be released in time for thousands to be designated Early Release/First Strike but at this time we don't know for sure (and believe it or not, I've been wrong before). >>
I agree with you if that was in fact an in hand Early Strike. However, the fact that the picture was photoshopped would have kept me from bidding.
<< <i>They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem.
Seems to me if that is the problem someone would have come up with the brain storm to send out the coins and the books later. They have the orders set up for seperate shipments (as indicated on the order page). How much could media shipping on a book set them back? If true that is a real shame. Hey Charlie...Is your book curling up? >>
Assuming they sent the 29,000 that are stuck without books x $3.00 (labor, cheap media rate, and small cardboard box) = $87,000.....Granted there is a large premium in the coins that should absorb the new cost, but honestly to incur an additional $87,000 cost I might hold up shipping too.
The point is that there was NO INTENT to ship ANY coins.
First Strike deadlines should be revised.
PCGS--------Listen up........time to make the proper call.......
Their response, they have been receiving the coins.. not a lot, just few here and there.
USMint ship our damn coins !
<< <i>Here is the truth why most UHR's have not been shipped
My brother, who used to work for the Mint, talked to a Mint person on the train last week and she confirmed that the problem is not the coin but the booklet. The Mint received several hundred thousand of the books and within 15 minutes the backs curled up.
Apparantley Moy signed off on the books without going through proper testing. It's a lamination problem. They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem. There's been no news report provided to the public because this is a major fork up.
Now you know the real story ..... no more guessing .... and no conspiracy involved ... and it's obvious, those that canceled the books, received their coins. >>
I wonder if PCGS would slab the books as mint errors?
<< <i>
<< <i>Here is the truth why most UHR's have not been shipped
My brother, who used to work for the Mint, talked to a Mint person on the train last week and she confirmed that the problem is not the coin but the booklet. The Mint received several hundred thousand of the books and within 15 minutes the backs curled up.
Apparantley Moy signed off on the books without going through proper testing. It's a lamination problem. They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem. There's been no news report provided to the public because this is a major fork up.
Now you know the real story ..... no more guessing .... and no conspiracy involved ... and it's obvious, those that canceled the books, received their coins. >>
I wonder if PCGS would slab the books as mint errors?
Well the comic book side of Collectors Universe could get those into "First Edition" plastic!
real or not, ship the coins without the books!
<< <i>the so called real story - -
real or not, ship the coins without the books! >>
I agree ... talk to the Mint .. we wouldn't want to miss the First Strike deadline ...
" They " are not making rarities out of anything except their own plastic holders, all the coins are still the same.
<< <i><<< could one be that they DONT want to INFLUENCE or MAKE a rarity out of 1 or 2 coins when they are AWARE of several thousand being held up because of a USM error with shipping...? >>>
" They " are not making rarities out of anything except their own plastic holders, all the coins are still the same. >>
What you say may be 100% true but the amount collectors pay says something different.
Charley,
I, like you, haven't taken my book out of the cello wrapper. If we are to believe this latest bit of information, then our books may be more valuable than the coins. I wonder if we can get PCGS to certify the book as an error, with a grade of "Garbage". Now I will surely wait till this all plays out to open the book. Maybe somebody did a Disney employee trick and put a dirty picture inside. Now the suspense is killing me.
-------------------------
Status: Ding, Ding...Ding, Ding...Ding, Ding...
1) I ambushed my source
2) The source could have told me "no comment"
3) The source may not be aware I post about this often on the net.
4) I want to respect the source
5) I don't want to get the source in any trouble for giving out what info was given.
so, I'm am purposefully being secretive for the above reasons.
had I the foresight to ask: "Can I tell this to the planet?" then I would just blab it all out if permitted. I didn't ask. So.... it's gotta happen as "an unidentified source who wishes to remain anonymous" .... just like they do in news stories.
Also, to be clear...
I'm not pissed at those who have the coins nor think it is "unfair" they have them.... and I don't have any ill will whatsoever because "shiite happens."
Somehow some escaped.
They "got lucky."
That's the way it goes.
But the fact that "some shipped" means that PBGS could ship right now, and with the PBGS lies it is infuriating that those waiting are only receving lies and not even good lies either!
Further infurating me is the fact that all this week leading up to the 20th and even yesterday, the PBGS reps offered no better information than 2 weeks ago, which was essentially nothing.
Which lead me to believe the PBGS reps and staff in Indy are not acting to solve the problem.
the 20th came and gone and what did I have as an answer: "It could take 6-9 months" You !%^@%$@ picked! though I left out the "$@^#%!$% on the phone.
See, for me, if X isn't getting done and it is due to some huge issue and a bunch of customers are pissed.... If I can't fix it, and the supervisor can't fix it... and the manager can't fix it... then the employees should care enough to escalate this internally to someone who can. consider what we've been told by PBGS on the 20th and 21st. Does anyone here think such a thing happened in Indy? I would be surprised if it did, though it may have.
Thus my efforts to encourage you to contact anyone and everyone you can regarding this problem as the PBGS Indy people have dropped the ball big time. This is why I was looking up execs home addresses and phone numbers. Someone with authority needed to know they have an issue to fix and that the Indy people seem to have fallen down on the job. Sound crazy? well, hopefully not. I'm calling it a "customer generated escalation." How hard are the decisions here? It's not rocket surgery!
Hopefully, the information provided to me by {classified} will come to fruition and the coins will ship minus the thing or things in issue.
When? Don't forget I asked for, nor received, no commitment on a date the coins will ship. I don't even know.
So, CharlieC and Lureduin and a few other may be the lucky winners. no ill will towards them at all. good for them, if so... it'll make a great news story the world over.
but, I'm working trying to get things done, despite the frustrating PBGS Indy people. Hopefully the rest of us can also be the lucky ones. If not, good for CharlieC and Lureduin you got supremely lucky on this one.
edit: and I was also asking for order info to provide to that "Jan" supervisor just to show that "yes you have shipped coins and yes they weren't fifo."
why? only because she was initally claiming fifo and no idea about how many shipped and no idea about anything really. I was trying to back up my statements that "yes, coins were shipped and yes you did screw up by not doing fifo, but fifo is beside the point since YES YOU CAN AND HAVE SHIPPED and here is the #@%^%#@ proof you smarmy moron!" don't tell me "that you have no way of knowing" when you have a COMPUTER SYSTEM! ^#@%^#$
So, thus I was just trying to show the PBGS employee the customers out here do know that PBGS has screwed up and we have the proof.
but fifo is not my real concern as much as we know coins were shipped. that means PBGS can ship. Make the business decision above. it's not hard. just ship the ^@#%#@ coins!
duh.
<< <i>Can anyone tell me what does "Priority Shipping" mean, aside from (per the US Mint web) $14.95 charge and 2-3 business day shipment? Do "Priority Shipments" require signatures on delivery? Are these shipments via FedEx? >>
You mean in the list box on the mint's checkout page?
<< <i>I just want to be clear that I'm playing cloak and dagger on my info because:
1) I ambushed my source
2) The source could have told me "no comment"
3) The source may not be aware I post about this often on the net.
4) I want to respect the source
5) I don't want to get the source in any trouble for giving out what info was given.
so, I'm am purposefully being secretive for the above reasons.
had I the foresight to ask: "Can I tell this to the planet?" then I would just blab it all out if permitted. I didn't ask. So.... it's gotta happen as "an unidentified source who wishes to remain anonymous" .... just like they do in news stories.
Also, to be clear...
I'm not pissed at those who have the coins nor think it is "unfair" they have them.... and I don't have any ill will whatsoever because "shiite happens."
Somehow some escaped.
They "got lucky."
That's the way it goes.
But the fact that "some shipped" means that PBGS could ship right now, and with the PBGS lies it is infuriating that those waiting are only receving lies and not even good lies either!
Further infurating me is the fact that all this week leading up to the 20th and even yesterday, the PBGS reps offered no better information than 2 weeks ago, which was essentially nothing.
Which lead me to believe the PBGS reps and staff in Indy are not acting to solve the problem.
the 20th came and gone and what did I have as an answer: "It could take 6-9 months" You !%^@%$@ picked! though I left out the "$@^#%!$% on the phone.
See, for me, if X isn't getting done and it is due to some huge issue and a bunch of customers are pissed.... If I can't fix it, and the supervisor can't fix it... and the manager can't fix it... then the employees should care enough to escalate this internally to someone who can. consider what we've been told by PBGS on the 20th and 21st. Does anyone here think such a thing happened in Indy? I would be surprised if it did, though it may have.
Thus my efforts to encourage you to contact anyone and everyone you can regarding this problem as the PBGS Indy people have dropped the ball big time. This is why I was looking up execs home addresses and phone numbers. Someone with authority needed to know they have an issue to fix and that the Indy people seem to have fallen down on the job. Sound crazy? well, hopefully not. I'm calling it a "customer generated escalation." How hard are the decisions here? It's not rocket surgery!
Hopefully, the information provided to me by {classified} will come to fruition and the coins will ship minus the thing or things in issue.
When? Don't forget I asked for, nor received, no commitment on a date the coins will ship. I don't even know.
So, CharlieC and Lureduin and a few other may be the lucky winners. no ill will towards them at all. good for them, if so... it'll make a great news story the world over.
but, I'm working trying to get things done, despite the frustrating PBGS Indy people. Hopefully the rest of us can also be the lucky ones. If not, good for CharlieC and Lureduin you got supremely lucky on this one.
edit: and I was also asking for order info to provide to that "Jan" supervisor just to show that "yes you have shipped coins and yes they weren't fifo."
why? only because she was initally claiming fifo and no idea about how many shipped and no idea about anything really. I was trying to back up my statements that "yes, coins were shipped and yes you did screw up by not doing fifo, but fifo is beside the point since YES YOU CAN AND HAVE SHIPPED and here is the #@%^%#@ proof you smarmy moron!" don't tell me "that you have no way of knowing" when you have a COMPUTER SYSTEM! ^#@%^#$
So, thus I was just trying to show the PBGS employee the customers out here do know that PBGS has screwed up and we have the proof.
but fifo is not my real concern as much as we know coins were shipped. that means PBGS can ship. Make the business decision above. it's not hard. just ship the ^@#%#@ coins!
duh. >>
You know the lousy books holding up the coins isn't breaking news. In fact it is kinda old news. Dont stress over it.
If the standard delivery ($4.95) option is the issue (it's currently contracted to be delivered without a signature, regardless of the content value), then why are orders which include Expedited Delivery ($12.95, supposedly requiring signature for delivery) also still being heldup?
Update (Monday, 23Feb): This morning I received my order of Lincoln Proof Silver Dollars which I ordered with $12.95 Expedited Delivery option. It was dropped at my door (the deliveryman did ring the door bell and left), but no signature was requested/required.
So, currently there appears to be no option to order US Mint products and force a signature to be required for delivery (even if we're willing to pay an extra cost for that service)!!
-------------------------
Status: Ding, Ding...Ding, Ding...Ding, Ding...
unfortunately, I'm wondering if the signature issue isn't also another "business decision" not yet resolved. I didn't ask my source. But I have a large order for other stuff that went through a week earlier than a much lower value of the same thing. Even though the lower value one was over $300, it shipped faster than the much higher value one.... and I would have expected them to ship by now. As it stands right now, there is not even a "pending charge" on my CC for the higher value one! So, it too is not being processed as fast as I think it would have before PBGS came into our lives. PB in PBGS must be "Pathetic Baahstahds."
PS: orders over $300 are auto-magically upgraded to next day for no additional cost. So, I have left high value orders on the $4.95 option. Though recently, I have gotten lower value parts of expensive orders shipped the "slow" way, where before the whole order got upgraded to next day no matter the item value.
Things have changed for the worse.
and upgrading it to the higher level of shipping won't guarantee it will require a signature either, no matter what PBGS says. UPS says otherwise.
<< <i>I just want to be clear that I'm playing cloak and dagger on my info because:
1) I ambushed my source
2) The source could have told me "no comment"
3) The source may not be aware I post about this often on the net.
4) I want to respect the source
5) I don't want to get the source in any trouble for giving out what info was given.
so, I'm am purposefully being secretive for the above reasons.
had I the foresight to ask: "Can I tell this to the planet?" then I would just blab it all out if permitted. I didn't ask. So.... it's gotta happen as "an unidentified source who wishes to remain anonymous" .... just like they do in news stories."
Reading between the lines it looks like my prior supposition is correct. The current contract was based on a deal that was cut with the shippers by the USMint's fulfillment contractor that was based upon a lesser cost due to not requiring signatures. Apparently a stalemate has been reached because without an act of congress or some stimulus funds the government is in no position to pay for an increased cost (and probably couldn't do so in a speedy manner due to red tape requirements for letting of contracts) and on the other hand the fulfillment contractor is maintaining that it was never required to obtain signatures under the terms of its current contract. The same scenario would apply if the added cost is alternatively as a result of two separate mailings being required because of a defective book.
Joe
<< <i>Waiting, waiting, and more waiting.
Joe >>
Govenment Time = Hurry up and Wait
<< <i>Here is the truth why most UHR's have not been shipped
My brother, who used to work for the Mint, talked to a Mint person on the train last week and she confirmed that the problem is not the coin but the booklet. The Mint received several hundred thousand of the books and within 15 minutes the backs curled up.
Apparantley Moy signed off on the books without going through proper testing. It's a lamination problem. They may have to do two separate mailings to fix this problem. There's been no news report provided to the public because this is a major fork up.
Now you know the real story ..... no more guessing .... and no conspiracy involved ... and it's obvious, those that canceled the books, received their coins. >>
FWIW, when I handled one of the books at the opening of the UHR exhibit at the Philadelphia Mint on Feb. 3, I thought it odd that the cover was separated from the book, but assumed at the time that it was either a mockup or had been damaged by the many people who had handled it before me. The covers were not curled, just loose.
TD
I'm still digging around for something for my late 4000 post giveaway.
<< <i>Today's the day! >>
Insider info?????
could one be that they DONT want to INFLUENCE or MAKE a rarity out of 1 or 2 coins when they are AWARE of several thousand being held up because of a USM error with shipping...?
my opinion is very good of PCGS when it comes to making the right call, they did so when they wouldn't label all varieties of Minnesota Extra Tree errors as "Extra Tree" - only the most obvious, even when expert error researchers labeled them all Extra Tree.......
an action to extend first strike treatment of these coins (UHR $20's) to begin when the first "substantial" delivery occurs (this wouldn't be hard to track, several thousand are apparently on the verge of being released) and extend for 30 days beyond that date would be proper in my opinion - and right on the mark - and wouldn't tarnish the FS label at all.
everyone can get on to just waiting for their coins, and not "jump" to cancel orders "
I agree
Given the situation the 1st Strike window should start when there is a substanial shipment. I don't believe that this has yet occured.
JMHO, GrandAm
By (Quite) Dire Straits
(…I - want - my high – re-lief!)
Mint yo-yos: thats the way you do it
make Double Eagles in high-relief -
But don’t ship them - thats the way you do it
Charge ‘em money for nothin and give the book for free!
Web Site: it aint workin. Thats the way they do it…
The ‘Track An Order’ page is always down!
Maybe ship the coins out on: 2/20
2/20 has come and gone -
>1-800-USA-MINT:
>What’s going on with our deliveries?!
>What’s going on with - our double eagles?
>Customer Service – answer us please! ~
We don’t mind about the 40% mark-up
Yeah buddy, we don’t even care -
3/11 = First Strike Deadline -
I gotta get my coin so I can get my coin there.
>1-800-USA-MINT:
>What’s going on with our deliveries?!
>What’s going on with - our double eagles?
>Customer Service – answer us please! ~
I should just relax for a minute -
I shoulda just enjoy my coins -
My UHR is gonna get here when it gets here -
The wait will make it better when it does.
And what’s up here, whats that? conspiracy theories?
When the book warps, does Virgin Mary appear?
Just put it on Ebay! thats the way you do it
Then get your money for nothin and your coin for free!
I want my,
I want my,
I want my – high relief!
I want my,
I want my,
I want my – high relief!
>>>My Collection
JH
Proof Buffalo Registry Set
Capped Bust Quarters Registry Set
Proof Walking Liberty Halves Registry Set
So much angst
So much anger
Numismatics is a study in history
Take a deep breath and all will be OK
Cheers
<< <i>So can anyone confirm receiving their order yet??? >>
PCGS Grades First Submitted 2009 Ultra High Relief $20 MS70
<< <i>NOTHING FOR MONEY –
By (Quite) Dire Straits
(…I - want - my high – re-lief!)
>>
the only thing it is lacking is a cover band to record it!
All the mint reps called in sick. They have heard enough complaining.
<< <i>All the mint reps called in sick. They have heard enough complaining. >>
they were unable to deliver themselves to work but could not tell their supervisors a reason. they only could lie or say "I don't know." None are sure when they will be able to deliver themselves, but they are committed to issuing endless e-mails pushing out the dates to infinity without reason.
none will be fired because this is the way all businesses operate.
They will be fired at "manager's discretion" only.
Of course people are anxious--many collectors don't just drop over a grand and forget about it. The mint has done little to maintain it's customers' confidence. For those who've been through this before with other popular issues, this is just par for the course.
The mint rarely fails to miss an opportunity to screw up their biggest releases.
BST successful dealings with:MsMorrisine, goldman86