<< <i>That could be true! I never thought about that. I bet that explains why some folks got empty capsules on a few occasions, and the one poor guy that got all empty boxes. >>
is there any history of folks getting orders from the Mint with this many boxes and capsules that look like they were ripped open, searched, and re-sealed?.. with encapsulated coins sitting in a plastic tray that have obvious physical evidence of being pushed out of those plastic trays from behind to quickly pop out the capsule leaving an obvious dimple in the tray, as has been reported here?..
do you or anyone else know of anyone who ordered Gold or Platinum coins and received shipments that look like the ones pictured here some days ago?.. if the boys in the warehouse were doing this on their own volition, why wouldn't they be stealing the high buck coins too?.. security wouldn't be that much of a nightmare if an order came down from on high to look through packages for 08/07s and remove them and replace them (or in some cases not even replace them with anything but air).. they simply assign security guards to watch over the worker bees doing it.. the whole inventory sitting in Memphis must Shirley be monitored by security cameras too.. i'd give your left leg to see the tapes from those cameras when the (probable) searching was going on..
eh.. we'll never know what really went on.. maybe.. possibly.. perhaps.. who knows..
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.. I don't do these things to other people.. I require the same of them.." - John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
<< <i>How do you expect these people to be going through these packages? I am sure the fulfillment center is under very tight security. the mint here in San Francisco is near my Union hall and that place has more fences and security and cameras than some prisons i have seen. >>
They probably went thru them as they were packaged; if the Mint had authorized the search and recover the errors probably would have been replaced with regular coins.. Are the people at the fulfillment center Mint employees or contracted labor?
<< <i>This still suggests to me that the production end-point has not yet been reached.
I believe that the final sales figure will be determined by wheither or not folks are willing to pay the spread over bullion, or if these are like the Proofs where folks will buy at any price.
Don't forget, about 75-100,000 of these will be going into the '08 Annual Dollar Sets also.
Regards, John >>
Why does it even matter how many regular issue coins will be produced this year; its pretty certain this error will be the lowest minted so far.
<< <i>My assessment of the 2008 W production chart is as follows:
Presently the rate of 2008W SAEs is leveling off. However, that does not mean that the mint is approaching some production end-point. If you look at the 2001W-2007W SAE production data, you find the average production over those years is ~679K, with a low of 470K and a high of 801K. This history suggests the mint will still be producing 2008Ws in the future. How they decide when to stop is unknown to me.
The percent of ’07 rev. errors is driven by the total 08W production number and a mint estimate of the ’07 rev. errors they made. Until they explicitly state they did not recover any of the errors, and offer a more definitive error count (if that’s possible), I suspect the actual number to be below 47K. That is why I began tracking the TPG counts. While it doesn’t completely answer the ‘magic question’, it does provide one piece of the puzzle… >>
The Proof mintage figures from earlier years are irrelevant. TD
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
<< <i>That could be true! I never thought about that. I bet that explains why some folks got empty capsules on a few occasions, and the one poor guy that got all empty boxes. >>
is there any history of folks getting orders from the Mint with this many boxes and capsules that look like they were ripped open, searched, and re-sealed?.. with encapsulated coins sitting in a plastic tray that have obvious physical evidence of being pushed out of those plastic trays from behind to quickly pop out the capsule leaving an obvious dimple in the tray, as has been reported here?..
do you or anyone else know of anyone who ordered Gold or Platinum coins and received shipments that look like the ones pictured here some days ago?.. if the boys in the warehouse were doing this on their own volition, why wouldn't they be stealing the high buck coins too?.. security wouldn't be that much of a nightmare if an order came down from on high to look through packages for 08/07s and remove them and replace them (or in some cases not even replace them with anything but air).. they simply assign security guards to watch over the worker bees doing it.. the whole inventory sitting in Memphis must Shirley be monitored by security cameras too.. i'd give your left leg to see the tapes from those cameras when the (probable) searching was going on..
eh.. we'll never know what really went on.. maybe.. possibly.. perhaps.. who knows.. >>
Most likely they were ravaged AFTER they left the Memphis facility.
<< <i>Check this out...MCM's dutch auction for NGC ER 70's ending in like 14 minutes and counting...LINK >>
Looks like one buyer ponied up over $850 each for all 5 of them........ but lost. edited to add: that these 5 NGC MS70s went for less $$$ than 1 Pcgs MS70!
<< <i> Most likely they were ravaged AFTER they left the Memphis facility. >>
by whom? long-haul truckers? USPS workers? DHL workers? Fedex workers? gremlins? zombies? the men in black?.. who else handles them after they ship them out of Memphis?..
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.. I don't do these things to other people.. I require the same of them.." - John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
<< <i> The Proof mintage figures from earlier years are irrelevant. TD >>
You may have missed my followup post...
For the burnished MS types that is correct. Since there were only two years of historic MS W SAE data, I opted to group all the Ws together - I realize it was not the purist thing to do...
For comparison, just using the MS W SAE production data, the 2-year production 'average is ~558K vs. the total "W" SAE average of ~679k. This still suggests to me that the production end-point has not yet been reached.
Interesting auctions just ended. NGC Brown label 08/07 sold for $50 more than the ER 70's. ($890/$838)...same seller...15 min.apart...No premium for ER??? Random auction variant???
<< <i>Check this out...MCM's dutch auction for NGC ER 70's ending in like 14 minutes and counting...LINK >>
Looks like one buyer ponied up over $850 each for all 5 of them........ but lost. edited to add: that these 5 NGC MS70s went for less $$$ than 1 Pcgs MS70! >>
Still just $$ 75 off the high ..the Ms 69s are about $$ 100 off their highs .. market absorbed extra supply this week
<< <i>PCGS MS69 FS just went for $535 = 130226412475 , that's down $200+ from last week >>
COINBOY...That's because all the (just under the window) PCGS First strike coins hatched all at once. They just need time to be absorbed into the market. JMHO
<< <i>PCGS MS69 FS just went for $535 = 130226412475 , that's down $200+ from last week >>
and how many PCGS MS69 FSs were listed at the same time that one sold for $535.00?.. what were their starting prices?.. how far apart in time were they closing?.. what was the feedback percentage of Positives of the sellers?.. were the actual slabs shown with their serial numbers, or were the serial numbers blocked out, or did the sellers use generic Mint pictures?.. and how many were listed last week.. day by day.. and what are the answers to all the same questions for the ones listed last week?..
use the other side of the paper if you need more room, create an .XLS file, print 10 color copies, take them to window #12 and get each one Notarized.. three-hole punch them, put them in a blue binder, and have it on my desk by noon tomorrow..
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.. I don't do these things to other people.. I require the same of them.." - John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
I would agree with Coin Boy that the supply and demand situation affects the pricing of the PCGS graded 2008 ASE with 07 reverse.
I quickly counted about 20 sales of PCGS MS69 coins yesterday and today with price range of $350 (BIN) - $670. There were very few sales of PCGS MS70 coins with several priced above $5,000 which did not sell.
Last weekend I think there were less than 10 PCGS MS69 coins for sale. There are now 24 PCGS MS69 and 4 MS70 coins active on eBay.
The demand situation will have to change to push up prices. But even at these prices, the coins are selling almost 2x - 3x what they were selling for only a month ago.
For those who keep debating how many of these "actually" made it out of Memphis, if you haven't kept up completely on this thread, I filed a FOIA for the documents last week. Hopefully someday we'll get an answer from the Mint
<< <i>How do you expect these people to be going through these packages? I am sure the fulfillment center is under very tight security. the mint here in San Francisco is near my Union hall and that place has more fences and security and cameras than some prisons i have seen. >>
They probably went thru them as they were packaged; if the Mint had authorized the search and recover the errors probably would have been replaced with regular coins.. Are the people at the fulfillment center Mint employees or contracted labor? >>
<< <i> Most likely they were ravaged AFTER they left the Memphis facility. >>
by whom? long-haul truckers? USPS workers? DHL workers? Fedex workers? gremlins? zombies? the men in black?.. who else handles them after they ship them out of Memphis?.. >>
The people at the fulfillment center probly knew that some were in the boxes so whats to stop them from telling the pick up driver that his shipment contains some valuable coins. A lot of those people get to know each other over time. You would be surprised how much of this kind of crap goes on.
<< <i>How do you expect these people to be going through these packages? I am sure the fulfillment center is under very tight security. the mint here in San Francisco is near my Union hall and that place has more fences and security and cameras than some prisons i have seen. >>
They probably went thru them as they were packaged; if the Mint had authorized the search and recover the errors probably would have been replaced with regular coins.. Are the people at the fulfillment center Mint employees or contracted labor? >>
All I know is the coins I recieved before this all started were in the boxes so tight you need a crowbar to get them out!
PEACE! This is the first day of the rest of your life.
<< <i> The people at the fulfillment center probly knew that some were in the boxes so whats to stop them from telling the pick up driver that his shipment contains some valuable coins. A lot of those people get to know each other over time. You would be surprised how much of this kind of crap goes on. >>
the older i get, the less anything surprises me, especially corporate corruption.. in-transit theft, you name it.. sure.. i can imagine a truck driver and a fulfillment center worker who are buddies meeting somewhere after hours.. rifling through packages in a dark alley somewhere, and splitting up the take.. but go prove it.. like Mr. Spock once said.. "proof is an interesting concept"..
i hope that FOIA request bears fruit.. but i'm not holding out any hope that it will.. the Mint will probably find some way to weasel out of it, given all the exclusionary rules and reasons an FOIA request is subject to.. after looking at the list, i could pick out one or two of them they could use to deny the request..
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.. I don't do these things to other people.. I require the same of them.." - John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
Thanks Wighty44, but... I believe we can trust numbers from published sources better than we can trust numbers reported by forum members and/or ASE owners who may or may not be watching this thread. I started to do breakdowns to include percentages from each TPG, but realized early on that numbers from some grading companies were not statistically significant at the time. Now, pops are increasing and are becoming increasingly meaningful. I guess we'll see where everyone's numbers end up. Best of luck getting a raw count now that resales, crackouts, and resubmissions have begun. Will that count be more statistically accurate (ed.) than the Mint's?
I understand the process isn't without potential flaws, but at least it's another piece of information that can be evaluated and excluded if overly suspect. For now, I still think it has a certain bit of merit...
I'm just kind of on cruise control with my percentage reports. It's something I started in order to record this info I was interested in, along with a few other things. I can't write it on my calendar, it would get lost!
<< <i>How do you expect these people to be going through these packages? I am sure the fulfillment center is under very tight security. the mint here in San Francisco is near my Union hall and that place has more fences and security and cameras than some prisons i have seen. >>
They probably went thru them as they were packaged; if the Mint had authorized the search and recover the errors probably would have been replaced with regular coins.. Are the people at the fulfillment center Mint employees or contracted labor? >>
All I know is the coins I recieved before this all started were in the boxes so tight you need a crowbar to get them out! >>
I noticed that the capsules were easy to remove from the boxes as well.
<< <i>I understand the process isn't without potential flaws, but at least it's another piece of information that can be evaluated and excluded if overly suspect... >>
Good idea to at least consider excluding it since the information gained counting replies in a thread could actually steer your numbers in the wrong direction. I appreciate the attempt I just don't see it getting any real, accurate counts.
<< <i>I received a package today (snail-mail) from the mint.....this is what I found...it was suppose to have (3) 2008 W ASE's........after a closer look, its obvious it had been opened before I opened it..no coins
>>
IMO, this appears to be a packaging error as every box I have opened has heavy creasing along the horizontal plane of the flaps. I always open these in a manner to preserve the container if I want to return something.
Granted, this container is suspicious but I do not believe it is indicative that the Fulfillment Center was opening packages to "search" for 08/07 coins. Besides, this package was delivered w-a-a-y after the date when these no longer appeared in Fulfillment Center shipments.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>That could be true! I never thought about that. I bet that explains why some folks got empty capsules on a few occasions, and the one poor guy that got all empty boxes. >>
To clear it up.
I believe it was SUMORADA that received the questionabler shipping container but it wasn't all "empty boxes" as sopme have latched onto.
It was shipping container that should have had 3 SAE's in it but only had 1 empty box half.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
The last box of 20 I received from the MINT was a previously packaged DHL with clear tape arrangement that they had re-wrapped for Reigtered but failed to remove the old tape; thus, the package was half-open with lots of stuff floating around inside sounding much like a broken lamp or decomposed squirrel parts. Anyway, all 2008; what a mess.
<< <i>The last box of 20 I received from the MINT was a previously packaged DHL with clear tape arrangement that they had re-wrapped for Reigtered but failed to remove the old tape; thus, the package was half-open with lots of stuff floating around inside sounding much like a broken lamp or decomposed squirrel parts. Anyway, all 2008; what a mess.
Miles >>
every single order i've ever placed with decomposedsquirrelparts.com has arrived in better condition than that..
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.. I don't do these things to other people.. I require the same of them.." - John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
June 2 Arizona Quarter Bags and Two-Roll Sets June 10 United States Mint Presidential $1 Coin Historical Signature Set™ - Thomas Jefferson June 12 American Presidency $1 Coin Cover Series - John Quincy Adams June 24 United States Mint Proof Set® June 30 Arizona Official First Day Coin Cover
Orders for 2008-W SAEs will be rifled through from now until the 2009-W's are released just to insure that not one more singe coin gets out to the public!
An earlier posted stated that comparing the 2006-W with the 2008-W's was comparing apples to oranges.
Kinda, but not completely in that there was a definite buying frenzy associated with the 2006-W coins. This was the first year of issue for the UNC SAE's from the mint and lot's of folks were caught off guard or had cancelled their order's because they had no idea that the mintage would be so low. Remember, these bcame "Unavailable" in mid November even though the initial offering stated "minted to demand"! Folks read that and just didn't bother ordering until the mint cut us off!
The ensuing frenzy was memorable in that I wished I hadn't sold my two or three for around $80! And the frenzy continued into 2007 with a whole lot of speculation on the 2007-W Coins and what their mintages would be!
I think its a good comparison except that more folks are jumping in at the 300-500 dollar levels. Caution needs to be exercised as these may not turn out to be the long term bonanza that many think they will be.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
<< <i>The last box of 20 I received from the MINT was a previously packaged DHL with clear tape arrangement that they had re-wrapped for Reigtered but failed to remove the old tape; thus, the package was half-open with lots of stuff floating around inside sounding much like a broken lamp or decomposed squirrel parts. Anyway, all 2008; what a mess.
Miles >>
every single order i've ever placed with decomposedsquirrelparts.com has arrived in better condition than that..
>>
PEACE! This is the first day of the rest of your life.
I think its a good comparison except that more folks are jumping in at the 300-500 dollar levels. Caution needs to be exercised as these may not turn out to be the long term bonanza that many think they will be.
Comments
<< <i>That could be true! I never thought about that. I bet that explains why some folks got empty capsules on a few occasions, and the one poor guy that got all empty boxes. >>
is there any history of folks getting orders from the Mint with this many boxes and capsules that look like they were ripped open, searched, and re-sealed?.. with encapsulated coins sitting in a plastic tray that have obvious physical evidence of being pushed out of those plastic trays from behind to quickly pop out the capsule leaving an obvious dimple in the tray, as has been reported here?..
do you or anyone else know of anyone who ordered Gold or Platinum coins and received shipments that look like the ones pictured here some days ago?.. if the boys in the warehouse were doing this on their own volition, why wouldn't they be stealing the high buck coins too?.. security wouldn't be that much of a nightmare if an order came down from on high to look through packages for 08/07s and remove them and replace them (or in some cases not even replace them with anything but air).. they simply assign security guards to watch over the worker bees doing it.. the whole inventory sitting in Memphis must Shirley be monitored by security cameras too.. i'd give your left leg to see the tapes from those cameras when the (probable) searching was going on..
eh.. we'll never know what really went on.. maybe.. possibly.. perhaps.. who knows..
- John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
<< <i>How do you expect these people to be going through these packages? I am sure the fulfillment center is under very tight security. the mint here in San Francisco is near my Union hall and that place has more fences and security and cameras than some prisons i have seen. >>
They probably went thru them as they were packaged; if the Mint had authorized the search and recover the errors probably would have been replaced with regular coins.. Are the people at the fulfillment center Mint employees or contracted labor?
<< <i>This still suggests to me that the production end-point has not yet been reached.
I believe that the final sales figure will be determined by wheither or not folks are willing to pay the spread over bullion, or if these are like the Proofs where folks will buy at any price.
Don't forget, about 75-100,000 of these will be going into the '08 Annual Dollar Sets also.
Regards, John >>
Why does it even matter how many regular issue coins will be produced this year; its pretty certain this error will be the lowest minted so far.
<< <i>My assessment of the 2008 W production chart is as follows:
Presently the rate of 2008W SAEs is leveling off. However, that does not mean that the mint is approaching some production end-point. If you look at the 2001W-2007W SAE production data, you find the average production over those years is ~679K, with a low of 470K and a high of 801K. This history suggests the mint will still be producing 2008Ws in the future. How they decide when to stop is unknown to me.
The percent of ’07 rev. errors is driven by the total 08W production number and a mint estimate of the ’07 rev. errors they made. Until they explicitly state they did not recover any of the errors, and offer a more definitive error count (if that’s possible), I suspect the actual number to be below 47K. That is why I began tracking the TPG counts. While it doesn’t completely answer the ‘magic question’, it does provide one piece of the puzzle…
The Proof mintage figures from earlier years are irrelevant.
TD
<< <i>
<< <i>That could be true! I never thought about that. I bet that explains why some folks got empty capsules on a few occasions, and the one poor guy that got all empty boxes. >>
is there any history of folks getting orders from the Mint with this many boxes and capsules that look like they were ripped open, searched, and re-sealed?.. with encapsulated coins sitting in a plastic tray that have obvious physical evidence of being pushed out of those plastic trays from behind to quickly pop out the capsule leaving an obvious dimple in the tray, as has been reported here?..
do you or anyone else know of anyone who ordered Gold or Platinum coins and received shipments that look like the ones pictured here some days ago?.. if the boys in the warehouse were doing this on their own volition, why wouldn't they be stealing the high buck coins too?.. security wouldn't be that much of a nightmare if an order came down from on high to look through packages for 08/07s and remove them and replace them (or in some cases not even replace them with anything but air).. they simply assign security guards to watch over the worker bees doing it.. the whole inventory sitting in Memphis must Shirley be monitored by security cameras too.. i'd give your left leg to see the tapes from those cameras when the (probable) searching was going on..
eh.. we'll never know what really went on.. maybe.. possibly.. perhaps.. who knows.. >>
Most likely they were ravaged AFTER they left the Memphis facility.
<< <i>Check this out...MCM's dutch auction for NGC ER 70's ending in like 14 minutes and counting...LINK >>
Looks like one buyer ponied up over $850 each for all 5 of them........ but lost.
<< <i>
Most likely they were ravaged AFTER they left the Memphis facility. >>
by whom? long-haul truckers? USPS workers? DHL workers? Fedex workers? gremlins? zombies? the men in black?.. who else handles them after they ship them out of Memphis?..
- John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
This has turned into a "WaterGate" type discussion.
I think when it comes from PCGS I'll take a nice picture and put it on the Bay.
<< <i> The Proof mintage figures from earlier years are irrelevant.
TD >>
You may have missed my followup post...
For the burnished MS types that is correct. Since there were only two years of historic MS W SAE data, I opted to group all the Ws together - I realize it was not the purist thing to do...
For comparison, just using the MS W SAE production data, the 2-year production 'average is ~558K vs. the total "W" SAE average of ~679k. This still suggests to me that the production end-point has not yet been reached.
<< <i>This still suggests to me that the production end-point has not yet been reached. >>
As I said last week they are STILL selling 2007 W's in the dollar set
<< <i>
<< <i>Check this out...MCM's dutch auction for NGC ER 70's ending in like 14 minutes and counting...LINK >>
Looks like one buyer ponied up over $850 each for all 5 of them........ but lost.
Still just $$ 75 off the high ..the Ms 69s are about $$ 100 off their highs .. market absorbed extra supply this week
<< <i>PCGS MS69 FS just went for $535 = 130226412475 , that's down $200+ from last week >>
COINBOY...That's because all the (just under the window) PCGS First strike coins hatched all at once. They just need time to be absorbed into the market. JMHO
<< <i>PCGS MS69 FS just went for $535 = 130226412475 , that's down $200+ from last week >>
and how many PCGS MS69 FSs were listed at the same time that one sold for $535.00?.. what were their starting prices?.. how far apart in time were they closing?.. what was the feedback percentage of Positives of the sellers?.. were the actual slabs shown with their serial numbers, or were the serial numbers blocked out, or did the sellers use generic Mint pictures?.. and how many were listed last week.. day by day.. and what are the answers to all the same questions for the ones listed last week?..
use the other side of the paper if you need more room, create an .XLS file, print 10 color copies, take them to window #12 and get each one Notarized.. three-hole punch them, put them in a blue binder, and have it on my desk by noon tomorrow..
- John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
Lets use the 2006 W Unc 20th Anniversary PCGS First Strike :
MS70 = 87 Coins = ?
MS69 = 2,649 Coins Selling for about $130 now
____________________________________
Verses
____________________________________
2008 ASE w/ 2007 W Reverse PCGS First Strike :
MS70 = 146 Coins = $4K-5K?
MS69 = 1,353 Coins - Selling for about $550 now
Label wars here, but the prices for the 2006 W Unc 20th Anniversary have just tanked over the last 3-4 months.
I quickly counted about 20 sales of PCGS MS69 coins yesterday and today with price range of $350 (BIN) - $670.
There were very few sales of PCGS MS70 coins with several priced above $5,000 which did not sell.
Last weekend I think there were less than 10 PCGS MS69 coins for sale. There are now 24 PCGS MS69 and 4 MS70 coins active on eBay.
The demand situation will have to change to push up prices. But even at these prices, the coins are selling almost 2x - 3x what they were selling for only a month ago.
<< <i>Lets use the 2006 W Unc 20th Anniversary PCGS First Strike : >>
Apples and oranges. Much, much higher mintage on the 2006-W ASE than on the 08REV07 ASE.
if you haven't kept up completely on this thread, I filed a FOIA for the documents
last week. Hopefully someday we'll get an answer from the Mint
commoncents123, JrGMan2004, Coll3ctor (2), Dabigkahuna, BAJJERFAN, Boom, GRANDAM, newsman, cohodk, kklambo, seateddime, ajia, mirabela, Weather11am, keepdachange, gsa1fan, cone10
-------------------------
<< <i>
<< <i>How do you expect these people to be going through these packages? I am sure the fulfillment center is under very tight security. the mint here in San Francisco is near my Union hall and that place has more fences and security and cameras than some prisons i have seen. >>
They probably went thru them as they were packaged; if the Mint had authorized the search and recover the errors probably would have been replaced with regular coins.. Are the people at the fulfillment center Mint employees or contracted labor? >>
Contracted.
<< <i>
<< <i>
Most likely they were ravaged AFTER they left the Memphis facility. >>
by whom? long-haul truckers? USPS workers? DHL workers? Fedex workers? gremlins? zombies? the men in black?.. who else handles them after they ship them out of Memphis?.. >>
The people at the fulfillment center probly knew that some were in the boxes so whats to stop them from telling the pick up driver that his shipment contains some valuable coins. A lot of those people get to know each other over time. You would be surprised how much of this kind of crap goes on.
<< <i>
<< <i>How do you expect these people to be going through these packages? I am sure the fulfillment center is under very tight security. the mint here in San Francisco is near my Union hall and that place has more fences and security and cameras than some prisons i have seen. >>
They probably went thru them as they were packaged; if the Mint had authorized the search and recover the errors probably would have been replaced with regular coins.. Are the people at the fulfillment center Mint employees or contracted labor? >>
All I know is the coins I recieved before this all started were in the boxes so tight you need a crowbar to get them out!
Fred, Las Vegas, NV
<< <i>
The people at the fulfillment center probly knew that some were in the boxes so whats to stop them from telling the pick up driver that his shipment contains some valuable coins. A lot of those people get to know each other over time. You would be surprised how much of this kind of crap goes on. >>
the older i get, the less anything surprises me, especially corporate corruption.. in-transit theft, you name it.. sure.. i can imagine a truck driver and a fulfillment center worker who are buddies meeting somewhere after hours.. rifling through packages in a dark alley somewhere, and splitting up the take.. but go prove it.. like Mr. Spock once said.. "proof is an interesting concept"..
i hope that FOIA request bears fruit.. but i'm not holding out any hope that it will.. the Mint will probably find some way to weasel out of it, given all the exclusionary rules and reasons an FOIA request is subject to.. after looking at the list, i could pick out one or two of them they could use to deny the request..
- John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
-69 84/237 35.44%
-70 65/237 27.43
Other 88/237 37.13
Thanks Wighty44, but...
I believe we can trust numbers from published sources better than we can trust numbers reported by forum members and/or ASE owners who may or may not be watching this thread. I started to do breakdowns to include percentages from each TPG, but realized early on that numbers from some grading companies were not statistically significant at the time. Now, pops are increasing and are becoming increasingly meaningful. I guess we'll see where everyone's numbers end up. Best of luck getting a raw count now that resales, crackouts, and resubmissions have begun. Will that count be more statistically accurate (ed.) than the Mint's?
I'm just kind of on cruise control with my percentage reports. It's something I started in order to record this info I was interested in, along with a few other things. I can't write it on my calendar, it would get lost!
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>How do you expect these people to be going through these packages? I am sure the fulfillment center is under very tight security. the mint here in San Francisco is near my Union hall and that place has more fences and security and cameras than some prisons i have seen. >>
They probably went thru them as they were packaged; if the Mint had authorized the search and recover the errors probably would have been replaced with regular coins.. Are the people at the fulfillment center Mint employees or contracted labor? >>
All I know is the coins I recieved before this all started were in the boxes so tight you need a crowbar to get them out! >>
I noticed that the capsules were easy to remove from the boxes as well.
2008 W EAGLE S$1 EARLY RELEASES MS 21218 2 10638 10578
2008 W EAGLE S$1 REVERSE OF 2007 MS 4293 2 2097 2194
2008 W EAGLE REV OF 07 S$1 EARLY RELEASES MS 6845 1 3757 3087
<< <i>New pops from across the street. 68 69 70 >>
Total= 11138 which is an increase of 411.......previous weekly increases were 5/26...554; 5/19....1409
Decreasing weekly numbers as expected
I have 16 in "Quality Control" and should add to next week's stats
<< <i>I understand the process isn't without potential flaws, but at least it's another piece of information that can be evaluated and excluded if overly suspect... >>
Good idea to at least consider excluding it since the information gained counting replies in a thread could actually steer your numbers in the wrong direction. I appreciate the attempt I just don't see it getting any real, accurate counts.
<< <i> ... I appreciate the attempt I just don't see it getting any real, accurate counts. >>
Thanks. I thought it was worth a try, and once the numbers are reported, we can disect their meaningfulness...
<< <i>I received a package today (snail-mail) from the mint.....this is what I found...it was suppose to have (3) 2008 W ASE's........after a closer look, its obvious it had been opened before I opened it..no coins
IMO, this appears to be a packaging error as every box I have opened has heavy creasing along the horizontal plane of the flaps. I always open these in a manner to preserve the container if I want to return something.
Granted, this container is suspicious but I do not believe it is indicative that the Fulfillment Center was opening packages to "search" for 08/07 coins. Besides, this package was delivered w-a-a-y after the date when these no longer appeared in Fulfillment Center shipments.
The name is LEE!
Good Luck.
<< <i>That could be true! I never thought about that. I bet that explains why some folks got empty capsules on a few occasions, and the one poor guy that got all empty boxes. >>
To clear it up.
I believe it was SUMORADA that received the questionabler shipping container but it wasn't all "empty boxes" as sopme have latched onto.
It was shipping container that should have had 3 SAE's in it but only had 1 empty box half.
The name is LEE!
Anyway, all 2008; what a mess.
Miles
<< <i>The last box of 20 I received from the MINT was a previously packaged DHL with clear tape arrangement that they had re-wrapped for Reigtered but failed to remove the old tape; thus, the package was half-open with lots of stuff floating around inside sounding much like a broken lamp or decomposed squirrel parts.
Anyway, all 2008; what a mess.
Miles >>
every single order i've ever placed with decomposedsquirrelparts.com has arrived in better condition than that..
- John Wayne, "The Shootist" (1976.. his final film)..
Rare opportunity !
The Keebler Elves are moving forward.
June 2 Arizona Quarter Bags and Two-Roll Sets
June 10 United States Mint Presidential $1 Coin Historical Signature Set™ - Thomas Jefferson
June 12 American Presidency $1 Coin Cover Series - John Quincy Adams
June 24 United States Mint Proof Set®
June 30 Arizona Official First Day Coin Cover
Did I tell you guys that I just love this place ?
<< <i>
<< <i>Lets use the 2006 W Unc 20th Anniversary PCGS First Strike : >>
Apples and oranges. Much, much higher mintage on the 2006-W ASE than on the 08REV07 ASE. >>
apples and oranges indeed !!!!!!!
Orders for 2008-W SAEs will be rifled through from now until the 2009-W's are released just to insure that not one more singe coin gets out to the public!
An earlier posted stated that comparing the 2006-W with the 2008-W's was comparing apples to oranges.
Kinda, but not completely in that there was a definite buying frenzy associated with the 2006-W coins. This was the first year of issue for the UNC SAE's from the mint and lot's of folks were caught off guard or had cancelled their order's because they had no idea that the mintage would be so low. Remember, these bcame "Unavailable" in mid November even though the initial offering stated "minted to demand"! Folks read that and just didn't bother ordering until the mint cut us off!
The ensuing frenzy was memorable in that I wished I hadn't sold my two or three for around $80! And the frenzy continued into 2007 with a whole lot of speculation on the 2007-W Coins and what their mintages would be!
I think its a good comparison except that more folks are jumping in at the 300-500 dollar levels. Caution needs to be exercised as these may not turn out to be the long term bonanza that many think they will be.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>
<< <i>The last box of 20 I received from the MINT was a previously packaged DHL with clear tape arrangement that they had re-wrapped for Reigtered but failed to remove the old tape; thus, the package was half-open with lots of stuff floating around inside sounding much like a broken lamp or decomposed squirrel parts.
Anyway, all 2008; what a mess.
Miles >>
every single order i've ever placed with decomposedsquirrelparts.com has arrived in better condition than that..
Fred, Las Vegas, NV
I agree with Lee. This is right on.