Here are some of the guys in the HOF , but with no cards in the HOF set.
I have listed what I think to be their 1st apperance on a card. (during their playing days)
I havent worked on this list in a long time so please feel free to add or correct with more/better info
Morris "Red" Badgo.......1933 Diamond matchbook Guy Chamberlin.............no card ? Jimmy Conzelman..........no card ? John "Paddy" Driscoll.....1925 Anonymous candy issue Ray Flaherty...................? Diamond match book Dan Fortmann................1936 Diamond Matchbook Joe Guyon.......................no card ? Ed Healy..........................no card ? Arnie Herber...................1932 Walkers cleaners Bill Hewitt........................1933 Diamond matchbook silver (last player to play without a helmut) Cal Hubbard....................? Walt Kiesling...................1934 Diamond Matchbook Tuffy Leemans.................no card during playing days 1936-1943 Link Lyman......................1934 Diamond Matchbooks # 71 Short print Bill Willis..........................1950 Browns team George Trafton.................? Fritz Pollard......................no card ? George Musso..................1934 Diamond match book Mike Michalske.................1932 Walkers cleaners John "Blood" McNally........1932 Walkers cleaners
I was collecting these for awhile, but lost interest and never did pick up the research to find any other available cards.
All of those guys are in the HOF Player/Coach/Admin set. They seem to be filled by using the 1991 Enor HOF cards. At least, that's what dap, fletcher and myself used.
I finally picked one of these up. It's based a lot more in reality that SMR but it's still no Jasp24 Here is a random sampling of 5 auction outcomes that I've been a bidder on in the past few months with the BV and SMR values:
1962 Fleer Shaw PSA 8 [Sold for $596; SMR $90; BV $400] 1952 Bowman Large Stydahar PSA 5 [Sold for $384; SMR $185; BV $300] 1950 Bowman Graham PSA 6 [Sold for $267; SMR $210; BV $350] 1966 Philadelphia Butkus PSA 7 [Sold for $300; SMR $280; BV $350] 1948 Leaf Conerly PSA 4 [Sold for $150; SMR $116 ($155 X .75); BV $175]
<< <i>Here are some of the guys in the HOF , but with no cards in the HOF set.
I have listed what I think to be their 1st apperance on a card. (during their playing days)
I havent worked on this list in a long time so please feel free to add or correct with more/better info
Morris "Red" Badgo.......1933 Diamond matchbook Guy Chamberlin.............no card ? Jimmy Conzelman..........no card ? John "Paddy" Driscoll.....1925 Anonymous candy issue Ray Flaherty...................? Diamond match book Dan Fortmann................1936 Diamond Matchbook Joe Guyon.......................no card ? Ed Healy..........................no card ? Arnie Herber...................1932 Walkers cleaners Bill Hewitt........................1933 Diamond matchbook silver (last player to play without a helmut) Cal Hubbard....................? Walt Kiesling...................1934 Diamond Matchbook Tuffy Leemans.................no card during playing days 1936-1943 Link Lyman......................1934 Diamond Matchbooks # 71 Short print Bill Willis..........................1950 Browns team George Trafton.................? Fritz Pollard......................no card ? George Musso..................1934 Diamond match book Mike Michalske.................1932 Walkers cleaners John "Blood" McNally........1932 Walkers cleaners
I was collecting these for awhile, but lost interest and never did pick up the research to find any other available cards.
Gabbs >>
I put together a similar spreadsheet a few years ago, listing first card and first gradable card (PSA will not slab matchbooks). Most of the slabbable cards are not from playing days, so not eligible for the HOF RC set. Here's what I came up with for the players you listed:
RED BADGRO 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1985 Football Immortals GUY CHAMBERLIN 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame JIMMY CONZELMAN 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame PADDY DRISCOLL 1928 Anonymous Candy RAY FLAHERTY 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1977 Touchdown Club DAN FORTMANN 1936 Diamond Matchbooks 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame JOE GUYON 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame ED HEALEY 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame ARNIE HERBER 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame BILL HEWITT 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame CAL HUBBARD 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame (also 1955 Bowman baseball) WALT KIESLING 1934 Diamond Matchbooks 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame TUFFY LEEMANS 1977 Touchdown Club LINK LYMAN 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame BILL WILLIS 1950 Browns Team Issue 1977 Touchdown Club GEORGE TRAFTON 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame FRITZ POLLARD - inducted after i made my list, I'd have to research him GEORGE MUSSO 1934 Diamond Matchbooks 1977 Touchdown Club MIKE MICHALSKE 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame (Walkers Cleaners was uncatalogued at the time) BLOOD MCNALLY 1934 Diamond Matchbooks 1963 Stancraft Playing Cards (Walkers Cleaners was uncatalogued at the time)
<< <i>Question for Jason or anyone else. I was looking through the NFL stat book and noticed that Ken Riley is #5 in the all time interception list. Does anyone know why he was never voted to a pro bowl or ever been mentioned in the HOF voting?
Regards,
Greg M. >>
Must have missed this while I was away, but deserves a comment. Riley is one of those severly overlooked guys that for whatever reason just never gets the respect he deserves. He played in a small market for Bengals his entire career, but was their starting RCB from 1969-1983. From 1970-1977 he played opposite Lemar Parrish who got most of the acclaim as Parrish was the flashier player. Parrish went to 6 Pro Bowls during that 8 year period and you KNOW they weren't going to select 2 CB's from the Bengals to the Pro Bowl every year. Riley was the steady workhorse you could count on, but very low key in his approach to the game.
Zero Pro Bowls is a real shame, and IMO it will keep Riley from ever making the HOF. He's probably not a HOF talent anyway, but he was better than a zero pro Bowl player. Much like Fred Taylor of the Jags...He'll surpass 10,000 yds this year and will have zero Pro Bowls to show for it...The competition during Riley's best years in the AFC were not only Parrish from his own team, but Willie Brown, Ken Houston, Mel Blount, Mike Haynes....Thats a tough roster to crack...The bengals starting Safety at the time Tommy Casanova even went to a couple of Pro Bowls, but Riley never did...Too bad, because IMO he equates to a 4-5 Pro Bowl guy...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
It's too bad there are no unwritten benchmarks for HOF induction in football like there are in baseball (3,000 hits, 500 HR, 300 wins, etc.). 60 INT's would seem like a good one. It would really be amzing if Riley made it one day without every garnering a Pro Bowl nomination.
Incidentally, which HOF'ers (in the Pro Bowl era of course) have the fewest Pro Bowl nominations?
"My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
Ok, was updating my inventory spreadsheet and thought I would post some of the more crazy prices I've paid for cards in my current HOF collection. You will be able to see based on the dates purchased how well these cards have done over the years...These are all cards PURCHASED in the same grade, no raw, crossovers, reviews or crack and re-submits included:
PSA 8 1954 Bowman Doug Atkins $64.95 in 9/2000----------Last one sold for $311.99------380% increase PSA 8 1963 Fleer Lance Alworth $288.00 in 12/2001---------Last one sold for $610.00------112% increase PSA 8 1962 Topps Mike Ditka $413.51 in in 4/2002-----------Last one sold for $1,497.30----262% increase PSA 8 1957 Topps Johnny Unitas $685.00 in 6/2002---------Last one sold for $1,147.00----67% increase PSA 9 1972 Topps Gene Upshaw $92.00 in 7/2002-----------Last one sold for $350.00------280% increase PSA 9 1976 Topps Randy White $58.01 in 9/2002------------Last one sold for $391.00-------574% increase PSA 7 1935 Chicle Turk Edwards $400.00 in 10/2003--------Last one sold for $776.75-------94% increase PSA 8 1952 Bowman Small Jack Christensen $184.50 in 1/2004-----Last one sold for $635.36---244% increase PSA 8 1950 Bowman Otto Graham $715.00 in 4/2004-------Last one sold for $1,256.00-----76% increase PSA 8 1962 Topps Fran Tarkenton $650.00 in 4/2004-------Last one sold for $1,112.00-----71% increase PSA 8 1955 Topps AA Don Hutson $410.00 in 5/2004--------Last one sold for $954.00------133% increase PSA 8 1957 Topps Dick Lane $94.99 in 10/2005--------------Last one sold for $355.00-------274% increase PSA 8 1966 Philadelphia Dick Butkus $750.00 in 3/2006----Last one sold for $1,225.00-----63% increase PSA 8 1971 Topps Charlie Sanders $20.00 in 8/2006--------Last one sold for $199.05-------895% increase PSA 9 1959 Topps Jim Taylor $279.00 in 1/2007--------------Last one sold for $896.00-------221% increase
Not every card has gained..I've overpaid on a few, mostly modern...PSA 10 1983 Marcus Allen comes to mind as a multi-$100 loss...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>It's too bad there are no unwritten benchmarks for HOF induction in football like there are in baseball (3,000 hits, 500 HR, 300 wins, etc.). 60 INT's would seem like a good one. It would really be amzing if Riley made it one day without every garnering a Pro Bowl nomination.
Incidentally, which HOF'ers (in the Pro Bowl era of course) have the fewest Pro Bowl nominations? >>
Players with less than 5 Pro Bowls (1951-present = Pro Bowl era) that are in the HOF:
QB- Bart Starr- 4 QB- Jim Kelly- 4 QB/K- George Blanda- 4 RB- Gale Sayers- 4 RB- Tony Dorsett- 4 RB- John Henry Johnson- 4 WR/RB- Bobby Mitchell- 4 WR- Don Maynard- 4 DT-Henry Jordan- 4 DT-Dan Hampton- 4 QB- Terry Bradshaw- 3 WR- Lynn Swann- 3 WR- John Stallworth- 3 WR- Charlie Joiner- 3 TE- Ozzie Newsome- 3 RB- Paul Hornung- 2 RB- John Riggins- 1 LB- Ray Nitschke- 1
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>You're probably still ahead on Allen, considering the one you sold me at market peak
Joe >>
Yeah, I wasn't too far behind..I got my current PSA 10 in 7/2004 before the POPs REALLY exploded. I paid $503 and the last one sold for $219.01...I figured more would be graded but didn't foresee the pop breaking 50+ in just a couple of years...Price you pay to play with "LOW POP" modern stuff...lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>Question for Jason or anyone else. I was looking through the NFL stat book and noticed that Ken Riley is #5 in the all time interception list. Does anyone know why he was never voted to a pro bowl or ever been mentioned in the HOF voting?
Regards,
Greg M. >>
Must have missed this while I was away, but deserves a comment. Riley is one of those severly overlooked guys that for whatever reason just never gets the respect he deserves. He played in a small market for Bengals his entire career, but was their starting RCB from 1969-1983. From 1970-1977 he played opposite Lemar Parrish who got most of the acclaim as Parrish was the flashier player. Parrish went to 6 Pro Bowls during that 8 year period and you KNOW they weren't going to select 2 CB's from the Bengals to the Pro Bowl every year. Riley was the steady workhorse you could count on, but very low key in his approach to the game.
Zero Pro Bowls is a real shame, and IMO it will keep Riley from ever making the HOF. He's probably not a HOF talent anyway, but he was better than a zero pro Bowl player. Much like Fred Taylor of the Jags...He'll surpass 10,000 yds this year and will have zero Pro Bowls to show for it...The competition during Riley's best years in the AFC were not only Parrish from his own team, but Willie Brown, Ken Houston, Mel Blount, Mike Haynes....Thats a tough roster to crack...The bengals starting Safety at the time Tommy Casanova even went to a couple of Pro Bowls, but Riley never did...Too bad, because IMO he equates to a 4-5 Pro Bowl guy...
Jason >>
Jason, Great assessment of Ken Riley. Underrated and overlooked for many years. Those of us who saw him play a few times can attest to his steady, consistent play at CB. Maybe not HOF calibre, but worth a mention.
You might say he was the Art Monk of cornerbacks during his era. Although Monk is HOF worthy, but you get the general idea. Riley was overlooked by many, but still a great player.
<< <i>Ok, was updating my inventory spreadsheet and thought I would post some of the more crazy prices I've paid for cards in my current HOF collection. You will be able to see based on the dates purchased how well these cards have done over the years...These are all cards PURCHASED in the same grade, no raw, crossovers, reviews or crack and re-submits included:
PSA 8 1954 Bowman Doug Atkins $64.95 in 9/2000----------Last one sold for $311.99------380% increase PSA 8 1963 Fleer Lance Alworth $288.00 in 12/2001---------Last one sold for $610.00------112% increase PSA 8 1962 Topps Mike Ditka $413.51 in in 4/2002-----------Last one sold for $1,497.30----262% increase PSA 8 1957 Topps Johnny Unitas $685.00 in 6/2002---------Last one sold for $1,147.00----67% increase PSA 9 1972 Topps Gene Upshaw $92.00 in 7/2002-----------Last one sold for $350.00------280% increase PSA 9 1976 Topps Randy White $58.01 in 9/2002------------Last one sold for $391.00-------574% increase PSA 7 1935 Chicle Turk Edwards $400.00 in 10/2003--------Last one sold for $776.75-------94% increase PSA 8 1952 Bowman Small Jack Christensen $184.50 in 1/2004-----Last one sold for $635.36---244% increase PSA 8 1950 Bowman Otto Graham $715.00 in 4/2004-------Last one sold for $1,256.00-----76% increase PSA 8 1962 Topps Fran Tarkenton $650.00 in 4/2004-------Last one sold for $1,112.00-----71% increase PSA 8 1955 Topps AA Don Hutson $410.00 in 5/2004--------Last one sold for $954.00------133% increase PSA 8 1957 Topps Dick Lane $94.99 in 10/2005--------------Last one sold for $355.00-------274% increase PSA 8 1966 Philadelphia Dick Butkus $750.00 in 3/2006----Last one sold for $1,225.00-----63% increase PSA 8 1971 Topps Charlie Sanders $20.00 in 8/2006--------Last one sold for $199.05-------895% increase PSA 9 1959 Topps Jim Taylor $279.00 in 1/2007--------------Last one sold for $896.00-------221% increase
Not every card has gained..I've overpaid on a few, mostly modern...PSA 10 1983 Marcus Allen comes to mind as a multi-$100 loss...
Jason >>
I think I bought half those cards in the right hand column.
LU Champions just gave me a call. He just bought a Forrest Gregg PSA 9 Rookie. He has an 8 available if anyone is interested. It was the 9 the Mint state had up for sale but did not sell at the price of $1500. I think he paid just under a grand for the card.
<< <i>LU Champions just gave me a call. He just bought a Forrest Gregg PSA 9 Rookie. He has an 8 available if anyone is interested. It was the 9 the Mint state had up for sale but did not sell at the price of $1500. I think he paid just under a grand for the card. >>
9 new PSA 8's and 2 new PSA 9's in the past 6 months..Somebody found a nice stash of 60 Topps!lol
The only 60's HOF RC with more new PSA 9's this year is Len Dawson with THREE new PSA 9's on the POP.
The mind blower is the 1982 Topps Lawrence Taylor RC...This year, 7 new PSA 9's and TEN new PSA 10's...I guess we haven't seen the end of that endless stream that was on ebay recently..I think they are down into the $450 price range..I'm a buyer at $350!lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I remember seeing a PSA 10 LT go for $5100. I recently saw one go unsold with the reserve not met at close to $800. I think another ended at $510 or so. $350 seems a more realistic price of that card, even long term that should always be a $250+ card, don't you think?
<< <i>I just got an LT RC psa 10 off line for $275, Oh, and I had to buy lunch and a beer. ($25)
I saw someone had one for sale that went over 1K a month or so ago, Jason will have to confirm that. >>
As luck would have it, I got one last night myself...With 10 newly graded, still more to come on those...lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Does anyone need a PSA 9 Leroy Butler? I have one for $6 shipped if anyone needs it. The case does have a small one inch crack on the back not affecting the card.
<< <i>Does anyone need a PSA 9 Leroy Butler? I have one for $6 shipped if anyone needs it. The case does have a small one inch crack on the back not affecting the card.
Dave >>
I'll take it..
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I am looking to trade a PSA 7 1952 Bowman Large Yale Lary for cards that I need for any of my sets. Look through my Registry and if you have anything that would add to or upgrade me, shoot me an e-mail at jabeduco@yahoo.com to discuss. Or you can PM me.
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
From the 2007 Set Registry Awards e-mail I received today from PSA:
BEST OVERALL SPECIALTY SET OF THE YEAR Jon Isaacson (Fight4oldDC) - NFL Hall of Fame Rookies
Way to go Jon!
"My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
Definitely well deserved...He has blown the MOSH set away...
It is a travesty that only ONE football set was put in the PSA Hall of Fame this year...Jon's HOF RC set belongs in the HOF IMO..Compare it to football sets that are already there and it's better than half of them...
We may all need to lobby PSA to induct it next year....Chances are his GPA will be 9.00 by then anyway..lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Congrats to you on your continued prowess as KING OF UPGRADES.
Marc. >>
And I won't give it up until I catch Jon..................Which means I'll never give up...lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>From the 2007 Set Registry Awards e-mail I received today from PSA:
BEST OVERALL SPECIALTY SET OF THE YEAR Jon Isaacson (Fight4oldDC) - NFL Hall of Fame Rookies
Way to go Jon! >>
Thanks a lot Andy and thank you to everyone. From Jason to Mark to Craig to Rick and many others on this Board - you all made this a blast to do. It is a "hobby" - meaning that it isnt business for me. It has been about having fun, meeting other enthusiastic NFL lovers and collectors. It is something I look forward to everyday as a little escape and enjoyment. This isnt the Oscars, but for every one of you that loves this set, for anyone of you who sold me a card or two or pointed one out to me...enjoy - this award is for all of us! Thanks for the kind words and emails from many of you. Lets keep it going and it is my sincere wish that someone new will pass both me and MOSH - that will mean the hobby is growing and others will enjoy.
Not sure if anyone noticed, but there was a PSA 8 1957 Ray Berry listed on ebay last night. I e-mailed the seller to see if it would be available via direct sale or BIN. We negotiated a price, I purchased and mailed the Money Order this morning so he could receive it prior to him going on vacation next weekend as stated in his auction. Now he has re-listed it with a BIN that is higher than our already agreed upon price. His reasoning is that he's gotten a bunch new offers/interest and he wants to see if he can get more. And that he will back out of the deal with me even though the money order was already mailed.
So, for anyone looking to purchase this card, just know that doing so will be screwing me on the deal.
Hopefully he will stick by his word and honor or deal. If not, I'll be looking for any collector's in the Sunrise, FL area to help me "collect" my money back..lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Josh, I cant access ebay from work. Who was the buyer? I need to e-mail.
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Edited to say: I hope the guy sends your MO back. >>
Not hope..You want to see relentless let him try and keep it....
This isn't $20 we are talking about.
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
..and "I hope he's at least honest about that and saves you the worry and hassle"
Y'know, I think if you mailed it at the post office you can actually stop it if it hasn't left yet. You can even stop it once it gets there I believe. Maybe jimq112 can answer that, he works for the PO. Might be worth a shot at least?
I can cancel the MO at the bank, but then there is another fee tacked on...
Friggin BS...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
you are buying a DEAD CENTERED - VERY HIGH END 1957 topps raymond berry rookie card. i have had this card in the vault for years and why this is not in a psa 9 holder is beyond me. you will not find a better one in a psa 9 holder and if you did it would cost you thousands. this is listed for a quick 3 day sale, but will consider a reasonable offer. card will not go cheap since there are very few ever offered. payment must be received within 5 days of the end of the sale for me to get it right out to you. i will be on vacation from 6/23 thru 7/1. who wants it?
TOTALLY classless move by this seller (with 100% feedback, too). This is what makes card collecting not worth it sometimes. Jason, hopefully this works out for you.
Honestly, I think the guy screwed himself...Karma is a wonderful thing...And whoever ends up with this card also gets the bad mojo that goes along with it..lol
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
I know who did buy it and I can assure you he had no idea the seller had agreed to sell to someone else. That is just an example of a really bad seller getting greedy and definitely not the buyers fault at all.
I know who bought it and I am positive he had no clue at the time. He knows now though! lol...
If it were me, the seller wouldn't get a dime in a second-hand deal like that. To backstab an agreement like that for a couple hundred extra bucks is pathetic and shows the true character of someone.
Whoever ends up with the card, best of luck. That card and cert # will be forever tainted in my mind...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Jason I think the bad karma is catching up to that seller right now. Hate to say it, but even at $1500 that card was a steal. As you know, they rarely show up and the Berry RC is way tougher to find in PSA 8 than the Unitas. If he ran it as a straight auction, I bet it would have gone over $2000. I know that doesn't help you, but since this guy was being greedy, you can take comfort in knowing he left money on the table.
<< <i>Jason I think the bad karma is catching up to that seller right now. Hate to say it, but even at $1500 that card was a steal. As you know, they rarely show up and the Berry RC is way tougher to find in PSA 8 than the Unitas. If he ran it as a straight auction, I bet it would have gone over $2000. I know that doesn't help you, but since this guy was being greedy, you can take comfort in knowing he left money on the table. >>
No that doesn't help at all..lol
The worst part is, I would have been willing to pay the $1500..He gave me no warning before re-listing with the BIN and I have no ebay access from work...Bottom line is the seller gets away with being a turd...Not to mention he cost me a few bucks that could have went towards other cards (Cost of M.O., cost of stamp and envelope, cost of printer ink to print his invoice e-mail, cost to cancel M.O.)...Not a big deal $$ wise, but its the principal of it...
It could be worse, he could have already received and kept my money! In times like these I wish every U.S. citizen was assigned to the military (some to serve active, others on standby)...Because I would have him called to active duty right now and let him spend a joyous 15 months in Iraq so he could have time to think about how important honesty and integrity really are in life. Instead he gets to sit in his sweaty little trailer park with a grin from ear to ear that he can do whatever he wants to us collectors and get away with it...
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
how important honesty and integrity really are in life. Instead he gets to sit in his sweaty little trailer park with a grin from ear to ear that he can do whatever he wants to us collectors and get away with it...
Jason, I totally agree. In my business, we trade billions of $$$ a day based only on our word. The successful ones live by the ir integrity, even when it costs them. The dis-honest ones end up eventually un-employed. I truly believe in karma and balance in the universe. What comes around goes around.
It's a shame the 1926 Spalding set doesn't get the attention it deserves. I for one really like it. Check out this '26 Spalding Ernie Nevers, which is the only card issued during his playing days. To me this is much more of a 'rookie' card than one issued 29 years later after Nevers retired:
"My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
<< <i>Jason I think the bad karma is catching up to that seller right now. Hate to say it, but even at $1500 that card was a steal. As you know, they rarely show up and the Berry RC is way tougher to find in PSA 8 than the Unitas. If he ran it as a straight auction, I bet it would have gone over $2000. I know that doesn't help you, but since this guy was being greedy, you can take comfort in knowing he left money on the table. >>
I honestly don't know why sellers EVER end auctions early. 9 out of 10 times they are losing money as well as irritating every single person that is bidding on or intends to bid on their auction. I think Ebay should clamp down on it in some way. People e-mailing sellers to end auction early puts everyone in a tough spot: do you adopt the strategy well if I can't beat 'em, join 'em? Or do you miss out on lots of great cards. Jason I think your situation illustrates the risks of off Ebay deals. Sometimes you get a bad seller and off Ebay you have almost no way to enforce an agreement.
I honestly don't know why sellers EVER end auctions early. 9 out of 10 times they are losing money as well as irritating every single person that is bidding on or intends to bid on their auction. I think Ebay should clamp down on it in some way. People e-mailing sellers to end auction early puts everyone in a tough spot: do you adopt the strategy well if I can't beat 'em, join 'em? Or do you miss out on lots of great cards. Jason I think your situation illustrates the risks of off Ebay deals. Sometimes you get a bad seller and off Ebay you have almost no way to enforce an agreement. >>
Totally agree...I wish every auction would run its course...In the past I have purchased cards offline either ebay or just through a friend or dealer only to see another one pop up a month later that sells for much less than I paid...
To clarify, I did NOT ask this particular seller to end early. In our discussion, completing the deal as a BIN was my preference, but when he re-listed the BIN, he put it much higher than our agreed upon price and he listed it without letting me know he was about to list it...
To me, an offline agreement regardless of how it goes down is the same as a BIN. On ebay or off, if you make a deal, you stick with it. I've never in my 8+ years of collecting HOF RCs have backed out on a deal even if I regretted doing it 5 minutes later...Unfortunately everyone isn't like that. This guy is sending me e-mails saying that he's in with all the big dealers and that he is a big time player at the National, etc, etc..I've never heard of him and neither have any of the couple of dealers I've asked today..
If anyone wants to see if they know him, PM me and I will tell you his name and location.
Jason
I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit, according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
In short... Jason P. = great guy Joe S. = great guy Seller = very very bad man (with an Indian accent)
I think Ebay should have a way to have something like a certified auction where the seller is bound by an Ebay agreement to let the auction run its course. Ebay would win by collecting more Final value fees and collectors would win by having a shot at bidding. Right now there seems to be a loophole. You wouldn't see Sotherby's pull an auction of a Picasso just because someone jumped up an offered a $100 million (I don't have a clue about art auctions so I'm assuming this is the case).
Comments
I have listed what I think to be their 1st apperance on a card. (during their playing days)
I havent worked on this list in a long time so please feel free to add or correct
with more/better info
Morris "Red" Badgo.......1933 Diamond matchbook
Guy Chamberlin.............no card ?
Jimmy Conzelman..........no card ?
John "Paddy" Driscoll.....1925 Anonymous candy issue
Ray Flaherty...................? Diamond match book
Dan Fortmann................1936 Diamond Matchbook
Joe Guyon.......................no card ?
Ed Healy..........................no card ?
Arnie Herber...................1932 Walkers cleaners
Bill Hewitt........................1933 Diamond matchbook silver (last player to play without a helmut)
Cal Hubbard....................?
Walt Kiesling...................1934 Diamond Matchbook
Tuffy Leemans.................no card during playing days 1936-1943
Link Lyman......................1934 Diamond Matchbooks # 71 Short print
Bill Willis..........................1950 Browns team
George Trafton.................?
Fritz Pollard......................no card ?
George Musso..................1934 Diamond match book
Mike Michalske.................1932 Walkers cleaners
John "Blood" McNally........1932 Walkers cleaners
I was collecting these for awhile, but lost interest and never did pick up the research to find
any other available cards.
Gabbs
My eBay Store
BigCrumbs! I made over $250 last year!
<< <i>Has anyone seen a copy of Beckett Graded Card Investor & Price Guide ? I wonder if it is anywhere in the neighborhood of reality, unlike SMR... >>
I finally picked one of these up. It's based a lot more in reality that SMR but it's still no Jasp24
1962 Fleer Shaw PSA 8 [Sold for $596; SMR $90; BV $400]
1952 Bowman Large Stydahar PSA 5 [Sold for $384; SMR $185; BV $300]
1950 Bowman Graham PSA 6 [Sold for $267; SMR $210; BV $350]
1966 Philadelphia Butkus PSA 7 [Sold for $300; SMR $280; BV $350]
1948 Leaf Conerly PSA 4 [Sold for $150; SMR $116 ($155 X .75); BV $175]
<< <i>Here are some of the guys in the HOF , but with no cards in the HOF set.
I have listed what I think to be their 1st apperance on a card. (during their playing days)
I havent worked on this list in a long time so please feel free to add or correct
with more/better info
Morris "Red" Badgo.......1933 Diamond matchbook
Guy Chamberlin.............no card ?
Jimmy Conzelman..........no card ?
John "Paddy" Driscoll.....1925 Anonymous candy issue
Ray Flaherty...................? Diamond match book
Dan Fortmann................1936 Diamond Matchbook
Joe Guyon.......................no card ?
Ed Healy..........................no card ?
Arnie Herber...................1932 Walkers cleaners
Bill Hewitt........................1933 Diamond matchbook silver (last player to play without a helmut)
Cal Hubbard....................?
Walt Kiesling...................1934 Diamond Matchbook
Tuffy Leemans.................no card during playing days 1936-1943
Link Lyman......................1934 Diamond Matchbooks # 71 Short print
Bill Willis..........................1950 Browns team
George Trafton.................?
Fritz Pollard......................no card ?
George Musso..................1934 Diamond match book
Mike Michalske.................1932 Walkers cleaners
John "Blood" McNally........1932 Walkers cleaners
I was collecting these for awhile, but lost interest and never did pick up the research to find
any other available cards.
Gabbs >>
I put together a similar spreadsheet a few years ago, listing first card and first gradable card (PSA will not slab matchbooks). Most of the slabbable cards are not from playing days, so not eligible for the HOF RC set. Here's what I came up with for the players you listed:
RED BADGRO 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1985 Football Immortals
GUY CHAMBERLIN 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame
JIMMY CONZELMAN 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame
PADDY DRISCOLL 1928 Anonymous Candy
RAY FLAHERTY 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1977 Touchdown Club
DAN FORTMANN 1936 Diamond Matchbooks 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame
JOE GUYON 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame
ED HEALEY 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame
ARNIE HERBER 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame
BILL HEWITT 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame
CAL HUBBARD 1933 Diamond Matchbooks Silver 1974 Fleer Hall of Fame (also 1955 Bowman baseball)
WALT KIESLING 1934 Diamond Matchbooks 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame
TUFFY LEEMANS 1977 Touchdown Club
LINK LYMAN 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame
BILL WILLIS 1950 Browns Team Issue 1977 Touchdown Club
GEORGE TRAFTON 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame
FRITZ POLLARD - inducted after i made my list, I'd have to research him
GEORGE MUSSO 1934 Diamond Matchbooks 1977 Touchdown Club
MIKE MICHALSKE 1975 Fleer Hall of Fame (Walkers Cleaners was uncatalogued at the time)
BLOOD MCNALLY 1934 Diamond Matchbooks 1963 Stancraft Playing Cards (Walkers Cleaners was uncatalogued at the time)
<< <i>Question for Jason or anyone else. I was looking through the NFL stat book and noticed that Ken Riley is #5 in the all time interception list. Does anyone know why he was never voted to a pro bowl or ever been mentioned in the HOF voting?
Regards,
Greg M. >>
Must have missed this while I was away, but deserves a comment. Riley is one of those severly overlooked guys that for whatever reason just never gets the respect he deserves. He played in a small market for Bengals his entire career, but was their starting RCB from 1969-1983. From 1970-1977 he played opposite Lemar Parrish who got most of the acclaim as Parrish was the flashier player. Parrish went to 6 Pro Bowls during that 8 year period and you KNOW they weren't going to select 2 CB's from the Bengals to the Pro Bowl every year. Riley was the steady workhorse you could count on, but very low key in his approach to the game.
Zero Pro Bowls is a real shame, and IMO it will keep Riley from ever making the HOF. He's probably not a HOF talent anyway, but he was better than a zero pro Bowl player. Much like Fred Taylor of the Jags...He'll surpass 10,000 yds this year and will have zero Pro Bowls to show for it...The competition during Riley's best years in the AFC were not only Parrish from his own team, but Willie Brown, Ken Houston, Mel Blount, Mike Haynes....Thats a tough roster to crack...The bengals starting Safety at the time Tommy Casanova even went to a couple of Pro Bowls, but Riley never did...Too bad, because IMO he equates to a 4-5 Pro Bowl guy...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Incidentally, which HOF'ers (in the Pro Bowl era of course) have the fewest Pro Bowl nominations?
PSA 8 1954 Bowman Doug Atkins $64.95 in 9/2000----------Last one sold for $311.99------380% increase
PSA 8 1963 Fleer Lance Alworth $288.00 in 12/2001---------Last one sold for $610.00------112% increase
PSA 8 1962 Topps Mike Ditka $413.51 in in 4/2002-----------Last one sold for $1,497.30----262% increase
PSA 8 1957 Topps Johnny Unitas $685.00 in 6/2002---------Last one sold for $1,147.00----67% increase
PSA 9 1972 Topps Gene Upshaw $92.00 in 7/2002-----------Last one sold for $350.00------280% increase
PSA 9 1976 Topps Randy White $58.01 in 9/2002------------Last one sold for $391.00-------574% increase
PSA 7 1935 Chicle Turk Edwards $400.00 in 10/2003--------Last one sold for $776.75-------94% increase
PSA 8 1952 Bowman Small Jack Christensen $184.50 in 1/2004-----Last one sold for $635.36---244% increase
PSA 8 1950 Bowman Otto Graham $715.00 in 4/2004-------Last one sold for $1,256.00-----76% increase
PSA 8 1962 Topps Fran Tarkenton $650.00 in 4/2004-------Last one sold for $1,112.00-----71% increase
PSA 8 1955 Topps AA Don Hutson $410.00 in 5/2004--------Last one sold for $954.00------133% increase
PSA 8 1957 Topps Dick Lane $94.99 in 10/2005--------------Last one sold for $355.00-------274% increase
PSA 8 1966 Philadelphia Dick Butkus $750.00 in 3/2006----Last one sold for $1,225.00-----63% increase
PSA 8 1971 Topps Charlie Sanders $20.00 in 8/2006--------Last one sold for $199.05-------895% increase
PSA 9 1959 Topps Jim Taylor $279.00 in 1/2007--------------Last one sold for $896.00-------221% increase
Not every card has gained..I've overpaid on a few, mostly modern...PSA 10 1983 Marcus Allen comes to mind as a multi-$100 loss...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Joe
<< <i>It's too bad there are no unwritten benchmarks for HOF induction in football like there are in baseball (3,000 hits, 500 HR, 300 wins, etc.). 60 INT's would seem like a good one. It would really be amzing if Riley made it one day without every garnering a Pro Bowl nomination.
Incidentally, which HOF'ers (in the Pro Bowl era of course) have the fewest Pro Bowl nominations? >>
Players with less than 5 Pro Bowls (1951-present = Pro Bowl era) that are in the HOF:
QB- Bart Starr- 4
QB- Jim Kelly- 4
QB/K- George Blanda- 4
RB- Gale Sayers- 4
RB- Tony Dorsett- 4
RB- John Henry Johnson- 4
WR/RB- Bobby Mitchell- 4
WR- Don Maynard- 4
DT-Henry Jordan- 4
DT-Dan Hampton- 4
QB- Terry Bradshaw- 3
WR- Lynn Swann- 3
WR- John Stallworth- 3
WR- Charlie Joiner- 3
TE- Ozzie Newsome- 3
RB- Paul Hornung- 2
RB- John Riggins- 1
LB- Ray Nitschke- 1
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>You're probably still ahead on Allen, considering the one you sold me at market peak
Joe >>
Yeah, I wasn't too far behind..I got my current PSA 10 in 7/2004 before the POPs REALLY exploded. I paid $503 and the last one sold for $219.01...I figured more would be graded but didn't foresee the pop breaking 50+ in just a couple of years...Price you pay to play with "LOW POP" modern stuff...lol
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>
<< <i>Question for Jason or anyone else. I was looking through the NFL stat book and noticed that Ken Riley is #5 in the all time interception list. Does anyone know why he was never voted to a pro bowl or ever been mentioned in the HOF voting?
Regards,
Greg M. >>
Must have missed this while I was away, but deserves a comment. Riley is one of those severly overlooked guys that for whatever reason just never gets the respect he deserves. He played in a small market for Bengals his entire career, but was their starting RCB from 1969-1983. From 1970-1977 he played opposite Lemar Parrish who got most of the acclaim as Parrish was the flashier player. Parrish went to 6 Pro Bowls during that 8 year period and you KNOW they weren't going to select 2 CB's from the Bengals to the Pro Bowl every year. Riley was the steady workhorse you could count on, but very low key in his approach to the game.
Zero Pro Bowls is a real shame, and IMO it will keep Riley from ever making the HOF. He's probably not a HOF talent anyway, but he was better than a zero pro Bowl player. Much like Fred Taylor of the Jags...He'll surpass 10,000 yds this year and will have zero Pro Bowls to show for it...The competition during Riley's best years in the AFC were not only Parrish from his own team, but Willie Brown, Ken Houston, Mel Blount, Mike Haynes....Thats a tough roster to crack...The bengals starting Safety at the time Tommy Casanova even went to a couple of Pro Bowls, but Riley never did...Too bad, because IMO he equates to a 4-5 Pro Bowl guy...
Jason >>
Jason,
Great assessment of Ken Riley. Underrated and overlooked for many years. Those of us who saw him play a few times can attest to his steady, consistent play at CB. Maybe not HOF calibre, but worth a mention.
You might say he was the Art Monk of cornerbacks during his era. Although Monk is HOF worthy, but you get the general idea. Riley was overlooked by many, but still a great player.
Regards,
Rich
<< <i>Ok, was updating my inventory spreadsheet and thought I would post some of the more crazy prices I've paid for cards in my current HOF collection. You will be able to see based on the dates purchased how well these cards have done over the years...These are all cards PURCHASED in the same grade, no raw, crossovers, reviews or crack and re-submits included:
PSA 8 1954 Bowman Doug Atkins $64.95 in 9/2000----------Last one sold for $311.99------380% increase
PSA 8 1963 Fleer Lance Alworth $288.00 in 12/2001---------Last one sold for $610.00------112% increase
PSA 8 1962 Topps Mike Ditka $413.51 in in 4/2002-----------Last one sold for $1,497.30----262% increase
PSA 8 1957 Topps Johnny Unitas $685.00 in 6/2002---------Last one sold for $1,147.00----67% increase
PSA 9 1972 Topps Gene Upshaw $92.00 in 7/2002-----------Last one sold for $350.00------280% increase
PSA 9 1976 Topps Randy White $58.01 in 9/2002------------Last one sold for $391.00-------574% increase
PSA 7 1935 Chicle Turk Edwards $400.00 in 10/2003--------Last one sold for $776.75-------94% increase
PSA 8 1952 Bowman Small Jack Christensen $184.50 in 1/2004-----Last one sold for $635.36---244% increase
PSA 8 1950 Bowman Otto Graham $715.00 in 4/2004-------Last one sold for $1,256.00-----76% increase
PSA 8 1962 Topps Fran Tarkenton $650.00 in 4/2004-------Last one sold for $1,112.00-----71% increase
PSA 8 1955 Topps AA Don Hutson $410.00 in 5/2004--------Last one sold for $954.00------133% increase
PSA 8 1957 Topps Dick Lane $94.99 in 10/2005--------------Last one sold for $355.00-------274% increase
PSA 8 1966 Philadelphia Dick Butkus $750.00 in 3/2006----Last one sold for $1,225.00-----63% increase
PSA 8 1971 Topps Charlie Sanders $20.00 in 8/2006--------Last one sold for $199.05-------895% increase
PSA 9 1959 Topps Jim Taylor $279.00 in 1/2007--------------Last one sold for $896.00-------221% increase
Not every card has gained..I've overpaid on a few, mostly modern...PSA 10 1983 Marcus Allen comes to mind as a multi-$100 loss...
Jason >>
I think I bought half those cards in the right hand column.
joe
<< <i>LU Champions just gave me a call. He just bought a Forrest Gregg PSA 9 Rookie. He has an 8 available if anyone is interested. It was the 9 the Mint state had up for sale but did not sell at the price of $1500. I think he paid just under a grand for the card. >>
9 new PSA 8's and 2 new PSA 9's in the past 6 months..Somebody found a nice stash of 60 Topps!lol
The only 60's HOF RC with more new PSA 9's this year is Len Dawson with THREE new PSA 9's on the POP.
The mind blower is the 1982 Topps Lawrence Taylor RC...This year, 7 new PSA 9's and TEN new PSA 10's...I guess we haven't seen the end of that endless stream that was on ebay recently..I think they are down into the $450 price range..I'm a buyer at $350!lol
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
My eBay Store
BigCrumbs! I made over $250 last year!
I saw someone had one for sale that went over 1K a month or so ago, Jason will have to confirm that.
I hate to hijack this forum but you are not returning my emails?????
ssgunnip@yahoo.com
<< <i>I just got an LT RC psa 10 off line for $275, Oh, and I had to buy lunch and a beer. ($25)
I saw someone had one for sale that went over 1K a month or so ago, Jason will have to confirm that. >>
As luck would have it, I got one last night myself
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Dave
FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
<< <i>Does anyone need a PSA 9 Leroy Butler? I have one for $6 shipped if anyone needs it. The case does have a small one inch crack on the back not affecting the card.
Dave >>
I'll take it..
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
Dave
FINISHED 12/8/2008!!!
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
BEST OVERALL SPECIALTY SET OF THE YEAR Jon Isaacson (Fight4oldDC) - NFL Hall of
Fame Rookies
Way to go Jon!
Joe
It is a travesty that only ONE football set was put in the PSA Hall of Fame this year...Jon's HOF RC set belongs in the HOF IMO..Compare it to football sets that are already there and it's better than half of them...
We may all need to lobby PSA to induct it next year....Chances are his GPA will be 9.00 by then anyway..lol
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Congrats to you on your continued prowess as KING OF UPGRADES.
Marc.
------------
BOBBY ORR
THE BEST THERE WAS!
THE BEST THERE EVER WILL BE!
------------
<< <i>Jason,
Congrats to you on your continued prowess as KING OF UPGRADES.
Marc. >>
And I won't give it up until I catch Jon..................Which means I'll never give up...lol
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>From the 2007 Set Registry Awards e-mail I received today from PSA:
BEST OVERALL SPECIALTY SET OF THE YEAR Jon Isaacson (Fight4oldDC) - NFL Hall of
Fame Rookies
Way to go Jon!
Thanks a lot Andy and thank you to everyone. From Jason to Mark to Craig to Rick and many others on this Board - you all made this a blast to do. It is a "hobby" - meaning that it isnt business for me. It has been about having fun, meeting other enthusiastic NFL lovers and collectors. It is something I look forward to everyday as a little escape and enjoyment. This isnt the Oscars, but for every one of you that loves this set, for anyone of you who sold me a card or two or pointed one out to me...enjoy - this award is for all of us! Thanks for the kind words and emails from many of you. Lets keep it going and it is my sincere wish that someone new will pass both me and MOSH - that will mean the hobby is growing and others will enjoy.
Again, THANK YOU
<< <i>
<< <i>Jason,
Congrats to you on your continued prowess as KING OF UPGRADES.
Marc. >>
And I won't give it up until I catch Jon..................Which means I'll never give up...lol
Jason >>
Never say never - you are relentless.
By the way, the HOF set has dropped a few members, but we added a couple more. Currently at 67 right now.
My eBay Store
BigCrumbs! I made over $250 last year!
Not sure if anyone noticed, but there was a PSA 8 1957 Ray Berry listed on ebay last night. I e-mailed the seller to see if it would be available via direct sale or BIN. We negotiated a price, I purchased and mailed the Money Order this morning so he could receive it prior to him going on vacation next weekend as stated in his auction. Now he has re-listed it with a BIN that is higher than our already agreed upon price. His reasoning is that he's gotten a bunch new offers/interest and he wants to see if he can get more. And that he will back out of the deal with me even though the money order was already mailed.
So, for anyone looking to purchase this card, just know that doing so will be screwing me on the deal.
Hopefully he will stick by his word and honor or deal. If not, I'll be looking for any collector's in the Sunrise, FL area to help me "collect" my money back..lol
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Edited to say: I hope the guy sends your MO back.
My eBay Store
BigCrumbs! I made over $250 last year!
Josh, I cant access ebay from work. Who was the buyer? I need to e-mail.
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>...sold this morning.
Edited to say: I hope the guy sends your MO back. >>
Not hope..You want to see relentless let him try and keep it....
This isn't $20 we are talking about.
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
..and "I hope he's at least honest about that and saves you the worry and hassle"
Y'know, I think if you mailed it at the post office you can actually stop it if it hasn't left yet. You can even stop it once it gets there I believe. Maybe jimq112 can answer that, he works for the PO. Might be worth a shot at least?
My eBay Store
BigCrumbs! I made over $250 last year!
Friggin BS...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
you are buying a DEAD CENTERED - VERY HIGH END 1957 topps raymond berry rookie card. i have had this card in the vault for years and why this is not in a psa 9 holder is beyond me. you will not find a better one in a psa 9 holder and if you did it would cost you thousands. this is listed for a quick 3 day sale, but will consider a reasonable offer. card will not go cheap since there are very few ever offered. payment must be received within 5 days of the end of the sale for me to get it right out to you. i will be on vacation from 6/23 thru 7/1. who wants it?
TOTALLY classless move by this seller (with 100% feedback, too). This is what makes card collecting not worth it sometimes. Jason, hopefully this works out for you.
FWIW, it sold to faotw29re...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Jason -- That sucks bad!!
I know who did buy it and I can assure you he had no idea the seller had agreed to sell to someone else. That is just an example of a really bad seller getting greedy and definitely not the buyers fault at all.
E-mail if you want.
Mike.
I know who bought it and I am positive he had no clue at the time. He knows now though! lol...
If it were me, the seller wouldn't get a dime in a second-hand deal like that. To backstab an agreement like that for a couple hundred extra bucks is pathetic and shows the true character of someone.
Whoever ends up with the card, best of luck. That card and cert # will be forever tainted in my mind...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
<< <i>Jason I think the bad karma is catching up to that seller right now. Hate to say it, but even at $1500 that card was a steal. As you know, they rarely show up and the Berry RC is way tougher to find in PSA 8 than the Unitas. If he ran it as a straight auction, I bet it would have gone over $2000. I know that doesn't help you, but since this guy was being greedy, you can take comfort in knowing he left money on the table. >>
No that doesn't help at all..lol
The worst part is, I would have been willing to pay the $1500..He gave me no warning before re-listing with the BIN and I have no ebay access from work...Bottom line is the seller gets away with being a turd...Not to mention he cost me a few bucks that could have went towards other cards (Cost of M.O., cost of stamp and envelope, cost of printer ink to print his invoice e-mail, cost to cancel M.O.)...Not a big deal $$ wise, but its the principal of it...
It could be worse, he could have already received and kept my money! In times like these I wish every U.S. citizen was assigned to the military (some to serve active, others on standby)...Because I would have him called to active duty right now and let him spend a joyous 15 months in Iraq so he could have time to think about how important honesty and integrity really are in life. Instead he gets to sit in his sweaty little trailer park with a grin from ear to ear that he can do whatever he wants to us collectors and get away with it...
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
Jason, I totally agree. In my business, we trade billions of $$$ a day based only on our word. The successful ones live by the ir integrity, even when it costs them. The dis-honest ones end up eventually un-employed.
I truly believe in karma and balance in the universe. What comes around goes around.
<< <i>Jason I think the bad karma is catching up to that seller right now. Hate to say it, but even at $1500 that card was a steal. As you know, they rarely show up and the Berry RC is way tougher to find in PSA 8 than the Unitas. If he ran it as a straight auction, I bet it would have gone over $2000. I know that doesn't help you, but since this guy was being greedy, you can take comfort in knowing he left money on the table.
>>
I honestly don't know why sellers EVER end auctions early. 9 out of 10 times they are losing money as well as irritating every single person that is bidding on or intends to bid on their auction. I think Ebay should clamp down on it in some way. People e-mailing sellers to end auction early puts everyone in a tough spot: do you adopt the strategy well if I can't beat 'em, join 'em? Or do you miss out on lots of great cards. Jason I think your situation illustrates the risks of off Ebay deals. Sometimes you get a bad seller and off Ebay you have almost no way to enforce an agreement.
<< <i>
I honestly don't know why sellers EVER end auctions early. 9 out of 10 times they are losing money as well as irritating every single person that is bidding on or intends to bid on their auction. I think Ebay should clamp down on it in some way. People e-mailing sellers to end auction early puts everyone in a tough spot: do you adopt the strategy well if I can't beat 'em, join 'em? Or do you miss out on lots of great cards. Jason I think your situation illustrates the risks of off Ebay deals. Sometimes you get a bad seller and off Ebay you have almost no way to enforce an agreement. >>
Totally agree...I wish every auction would run its course...In the past I have purchased cards offline either ebay or just through a friend or dealer only to see another one pop up a month later that sells for much less than I paid...
To clarify, I did NOT ask this particular seller to end early. In our discussion, completing the deal as a BIN was my preference, but when he re-listed the BIN, he put it much higher than our agreed upon price and he listed it without letting me know he was about to list it...
To me, an offline agreement regardless of how it goes down is the same as a BIN. On ebay or off, if you make a deal, you stick with it. I've never in my 8+ years of collecting HOF RCs have backed out on a deal even if I regretted doing it 5 minutes later...Unfortunately everyone isn't like that. This guy is sending me e-mails saying that he's in with all the big dealers and that he is a big time player at the National, etc, etc..I've never heard of him and neither have any of the couple of dealers I've asked today..
If anyone wants to see if they know him, PM me and I will tell you his name and location.
Jason
according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
In short...
Jason P. = great guy
Joe S. = great guy
Seller = very very bad man (with an Indian accent)
I think Ebay should have a way to have something like a certified auction where the seller is bound by an Ebay agreement to let the auction run its course. Ebay would win by collecting more Final value fees and collectors would win by having a shot at bidding. Right now there seems to be a loophole. You wouldn't see Sotherby's pull an auction of a Picasso just because someone jumped up an offered a $100 million (I don't have a clue about art auctions so I'm assuming this is the case).