For all new early copper collectors, I would offer a small bit of advice that I have learned by listening to the opinions of those more knowledgeable than I, when researching attributions do not rely on what matches, as you can find many things alike and still be wrong, but instead look for what is different. One item different can stop the attribution for that specific Sheldon or Cohen number. JMO
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
@jesbroken said:
For all new early copper collectors, I would offer a small bit of advice that I have learned by listening to the opinions of those more knowledgeable than I, when researching attributions do not rely on what matches, as you can find many things alike and still be wrong, but instead look for what is different. One item different can stop the attribution for that specific Sheldon or Cohen number. JMO
Jim
@DarkStar
Your 1806 would be a C-4 due to the Large 6 and with Stems.
Your 1825(nice by the way) is a C-2 (2 items leaf at M matches and lower left berry has short stem)
JMO's
Jim
There are 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who do not.
1800 - C-1 (R.1) - There is only one die variety for this date. But, given my past here, I am taking the time to review the die markers. The wreath of the reverse has the top two leaves pointing toward each other. There is also the die break from the berry in the wreath to the "E" in United. I really like that this coin has misaligned dies.
1803 - C-3 (R.1) - There are four varieties for this date. The C-3 can commonly be identified by the cross-eyed zeros in the 1/200 fraction of the. In the date the "3" is spaced further than the other numbers.
1804 - C-9 (R.1) - There are 13 varieties for the 1804 date. The c-9 is known for having the cross-eyed zeros in the 1/200 fraction of the reverse. There is also a die crack that comes off the "R" in America with is unique to the C-9.
1804 - C-6 (R.1) - The C-6 likely has the coolest terminal die state of any half cent, and I believe there are ~20 different die states for this variety.
1805 - C-1 (R.1) - There are four varieties for the 1805 date. This is the medium 5. While I cannot see the prepunch on the date of this example, it does look correct. The stemless wreath is another marker that is unique to this variety.
1806 - C-1 (R.1) - There are four varieties for this date. This validity is known for having the "small 6" that nearly touches the bust, and no stems on the reverse.
1807 - C-1 (R.1) - this is my old friend from earlier in the thread, and we have two posted. There is only one variety of the date. And I will say that the top coin is genuine.
The bottom coin I will say is "inconclusive". I say this because I don't have a lot to work with in terms of leaves in the wreath and the fraction. My gut tells me this is genuine, but I cannot tell if the "F" in Half of the reverse is touching the wreath. If it is, this is not genuine. So far, this is the only coin in the lot that has me questioning its authenticity.
1808 - C-3 (R.1) - This is known as the "normal date" however, it sure does look strange to me. The "8" is made by using the zeros from the fraction 1/200; one over the other. One the reverse, there is a berry in the wreath to the right of the "T" in Cent.
1809 - C-4 (R.2) - This variety is known as the "circle in O", because there is a smaller zero inside the 0. The top leaf of the wreath extends almost to the "O" in Of.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
1802 C-1 (R.5+) - While we know this is a copy, this coin would be the reverse of 1800 - a very rare coin, and expensive in any condition. This coin would be in very nice condition for the variety, as most of these coins are in very low grade.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
How about this one?
I know there aren't that many varieties for this overdate(/RPD?) I've just never taken the time to figure it out, sorry for the picture quality, still working on those slab photos!
."It's a dangerous business... going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to" -JRR Tolkien_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Outstanding BST transactions as a seller, buyer and trader with: ----- mustanggt, Kliao, claudewill87, MWallace, paesan, mpbuck82, moursund, basetsb, lordmarcovan, JWP, Coin hunter 4, COINS MAKE CENTS, PerryHall, Aspie_Rocco, Braddick, DBSTrader2, SanctionII, Histman, The_Dinosaur_Man, jesbroken, CentSearcher ------ANA Member #3214817
@WilliamF said:
How about this one?
I know there aren't that many varieties for this overdate(/RPD?) I've just never taken the time to figure it out, sorry for the picture quality, still working on those slab photos!
I've got that one also, but its somewhat corroded and in a 3 month soak.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
1809/6 (inverted 9) - C-5 (R.1) - There are six varieties for 1809. The C-5 is known for having the inverted, re-punched 9, and has been commonly called the 1809/6. The 9 is also shifted to the right a bit. On the reverse the top leaf of the wreath barely passes the last "S" in States
1809 - C-6 (R.1) - I believe this to be the C-6, rather than the C-5 suggested. On the reverse top leaf extends to the midpoint between the last "S" in States and the "O" in Of. On the obverse, the date is spaced wide, and the bottom curl of the hair falls directly between the 0 and 9. I cannot see any evidence of a re-punched 9 in the date.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
1804 - C-10 (R.1) - This variety has a crosslet 4 that is punched high and close to the 0. The 4 also stands more upright. The die break above the "R" in America has widened on the reverse from the C-9.
1833 - C-1 (R.1) - There is only one variety for the date. All 1833 half cents have the die craving through the stars.
Very beautiful coins.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Thanks everyone for posting all of the beautiful (and sometimes beautifully fake) half cents on this thread. It is fun for me, and I have learned a ton already!
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
My guess so far is that there is a small ding/dent of the left side of the wreath. This is directly at the first berry branch on the righthand side of that branch. I looked at other examples, and I don't see the ding. I may be off, but it's all I've got so far.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
I also believe the obverse on the second coin is different. The E in Liberty is different than the other two (with a hook-like formation off the back). I have not seen this (even in late state examples)
Liberty's eye also appears to be different
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Well gang - I have been told that my first guess on an attribution point was correct, but my second guess was not. A special thanks to @burfle23 for posting such a cool brain buster
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Oh, now I see. It looks like it's partially filled. Would this mean it's a later die state, or did they try to go back in and correct it? (maybe an unanswerable question)
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Tried to repair it; part of the risk of publishing info on these but there is no way to get the word out without some clear attribution points to pick up. The source example was genuine in an ANACS holder; I own 7 of the struck counterfeits with 5 being in TPG holders as genuine.
One of my favorite varieties, 1806 C-1 counterfeit, 2 die states...
1825 - C-2 (R.1) - There are two varieties for this date. The C-2 is known for having the lowest hair curl fall directly between the 2 and 5 of the date (the C-1 would have the curl directly over the 5).
Very nice coin!
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
@burfle23 said:
Tried to repair it; part of the risk of publishing info on these but there is no way to get the word out without some clear attribution points to pick up.
.
after giving it MUUUCHH thought and analysis over many years, i've determined that collectors (of anything) are better off being informed BUT with the counterfeiters knowing what we are identifying to avoid their crap vs having uninformed buyers that have really no idea what to look for and find doing it themselves (alone?) too exhausting/daunting of a task and the counterfeiters pumping the stuff out at a record pace.
i'd bet farm that is the way to go.
edited to add, they aren't going to stop and they aren't (some) going to stop getting better, if collectors don't try to keep up, they will be left behind.
perhaps there can start being some sort of badge/sign that certain dealers have passed a course on counterfeit detection of raw and certified coins giving potential buyers something solid to go with. there are plenty out there that would like to think they are good at it but in this arena, NOTHING says i am a good counterfeit detection numismatist like putting one's money where one's mouth is.
you are concerned about posting attribution points for counterfeits when those very same people making the crap COULD be reading what we post and/or the information slowly working it's way to them BUT don't fret too much as they are going to keep doing it and getting better no matter what. collectors need this intricate information and FAST.
so when analyzed, it is worth the risk of posting stuff like you and others do because it is better having informed collectors vs having counterfeiters slowly starting to improve their work based partially on info that we provide.
better to have collectors have a little knowledge than none at all. ya know?
It would be very helpful if credible people in each coin series that have studied this extreme counterfeiting crisis and the diagnostics of the counterfeit coins so they could be attributed could publish either an online digital info or weekly reader, similar to Penny Whimsy, and charge for it. Just think the counterfeiters are learning daily on what they are doing wrong, so we must educate ourselves via some update source or we will soon not know what is real and what is not. If the knowledge is published as soon as it is discovered, we might have a chance. I'm not talking about a book, takes too long and by the time it is published it is outdated. Just as legitimate coins have diagnostics allowing us to attribute them, so do illigitimate coins have diagnostics.
Maybe PCGS could place a continuing open discussion pinned to the top of the discussion board. Just throwing out ideas. I, for one, do not wish to invest what little funds I have available for this hobby in a piece of copper with no numismatic value. I'm sure that most collectors would feel that way about their copper, silver, zinc, nickel or other metallic coins. JMO
I thank you @burfle23 for this info, had I just read this on the internet, I would probably have not trusted the source. I hope someone can come up with a solution soon. Any knowledge beats no knowledge.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
1857 - C-1 (R.2) - There is only one variety of the braided hair series, but this one is a COUNTERFEIT. The 7 in the date is not correct (although close), also, the notch in the hair is not really there (although I see a faint semblance of what it should be. A good looking fake, really!
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Also the top of the 5 is incorrect in association with the hair curl as is the 8. The curl over the 8 does not nearly complete covering the top of the 8. This coin looks really good. How they could mess the date up this bad and get the rest so close is a mystery but a thankful one. Thanks for sharing these. I hope you continue to share what you have in this venue. We need your help along with any others that have spent their valuable time gathering like information.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
1857 - C-1 (R.2) - There is only one variety of the braided hair series, but this one is a COUNTERFEIT. The 7 in the date is not correct (although close), also, the notch in the hair is not really there (although I see a faint semblance of what it should be. A good looking fake, really!
1811 C-1 (R.3+) - There are two varieties for this date. The C-1 is known for having the first 1 of the date wider spaced from the 811. I am afraid that this coin is COUNTERFEIT. The 1's in the date are thin, and have a top that is flat. Some of the leaves on the reverse to not line up where they should. I feel bad making this post, but I do not believe this to be genuine.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
This 1806 C-1 is counterfeit and made from the same dies that made the group of C-1 counterfeits posted by @burfle23 (above). There are many attribution points for this fake, but the two that are easiest to see are the dent in the lefthand wreath of the reverse (that I pointed out above). Also, the A in Half cent has the same defect as the others above.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
1843 C-1 (R.1) - There is only one variety for this date. Although this coin appears to be NGC graded, I checked all of the attribution points. The date is evenly space, and the 1 in the date is low. On the reverse, all of the leaf tips line-up as they should.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
1811 C-1 (R.3+) - There are two varieties for this date. The C-1 is known for having the first 1 of the date wider spaced from the 811. I am afraid that this coin is COUNTERFEIT. The 1's in the date are thin, and have a top that is flat. Some of the leaves on the reverse to not line up where they should. I feel bad making this post, but I do not believe this to be genuine.
Looks similar to the "1811" I posted earlier; the reverse is wrong and from an 1826 C-1:
@burfle23
Thank you for your link to your article on 1806 counterfeit half cent. Any chance of having dates and issues for finding the other 13 articles you provided? I would love to read them and learn also. Thank you very much for your assistance with these fakes.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
1811 C-1 (R.3+) - There are two varieties for this date. The C-1 is known for having the first 1 of the date wider spaced from the 811. I am afraid that this coin is COUNTERFEIT. The 1's in the date are thin, and have a top that is flat. Some of the leaves on the reverse to not line up where they should. I feel bad making this post, but I do not believe this to be genuine.
This one resides in my Dansco-type set of contemporary counterfeits, so no hard feelings!
This one looks okay to me. I see coins in this thread that look genuine to me and the vast majority of collectors. How can you be sure that the coin in question is not just a new discovery? How many of them were made by the counterfeiter, and when?
@jesbroken said: @burfle23
Thank you for your link to your article on 1806 counterfeit half cent. Any chance of having dates and issues for finding the other 13 articles you provided? I would love to read them and learn also. Thank you very much for your assistance with these fakes.
Jim
Comments
For all new early copper collectors, I would offer a small bit of advice that I have learned by listening to the opinions of those more knowledgeable than I, when researching attributions do not rely on what matches, as you can find many things alike and still be wrong, but instead look for what is different. One item different can stop the attribution for that specific Sheldon or Cohen number. JMO
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
+1
@burfle23
As per your request, here are photos of the R,C,C 1802. Could not afford the real deal at the time.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
Duly noted. Thanks!
There are 10 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who do not.
@jesbroken
1800 - C-1 (R.1) - There is only one die variety for this date. But, given my past here, I am taking the time to review the die markers. The wreath of the reverse has the top two leaves pointing toward each other. There is also the die break from the berry in the wreath to the "E" in United. I really like that this coin has misaligned dies.
1803 - C-3 (R.1) - There are four varieties for this date. The C-3 can commonly be identified by the cross-eyed zeros in the 1/200 fraction of the. In the date the "3" is spaced further than the other numbers.
1804 - C-9 (R.1) - There are 13 varieties for the 1804 date. The c-9 is known for having the cross-eyed zeros in the 1/200 fraction of the reverse. There is also a die crack that comes off the "R" in America with is unique to the C-9.
1804 - C-6 (R.1) - The C-6 likely has the coolest terminal die state of any half cent, and I believe there are ~20 different die states for this variety.
1805 - C-1 (R.1) - There are four varieties for the 1805 date. This is the medium 5. While I cannot see the prepunch on the date of this example, it does look correct. The stemless wreath is another marker that is unique to this variety.
1806 - C-1 (R.1) - There are four varieties for this date. This validity is known for having the "small 6" that nearly touches the bust, and no stems on the reverse.
1807 - C-1 (R.1) - this is my old friend from earlier in the thread, and we have two posted. There is only one variety of the date. And I will say that the top coin is genuine.
The bottom coin I will say is "inconclusive". I say this because I don't have a lot to work with in terms of leaves in the wreath and the fraction. My gut tells me this is genuine, but I cannot tell if the "F" in Half of the reverse is touching the wreath. If it is, this is not genuine. So far, this is the only coin in the lot that has me questioning its authenticity.
1808 - C-3 (R.1) - This is known as the "normal date" however, it sure does look strange to me. The "8" is made by using the zeros from the fraction 1/200; one over the other. One the reverse, there is a berry in the wreath to the right of the "T" in Cent.
1809 - C-4 (R.2) - This variety is known as the "circle in O", because there is a smaller zero inside the 0. The top leaf of the wreath extends almost to the "O" in Of.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
@jesbroken -
1802 C-1 (R.5+) - While we know this is a copy, this coin would be the reverse of 1800 - a very rare coin, and expensive in any condition. This coin would be in very nice condition for the variety, as most of these coins are in very low grade.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
How about this one?
I know there aren't that many varieties for this overdate(/RPD?) I've just never taken the time to figure it out, sorry for the picture quality, still working on those slab photos!
."It's a dangerous business... going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to" -JRR Tolkien_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________Outstanding BST transactions as a seller, buyer and trader with: ----- mustanggt, Kliao, claudewill87, MWallace, paesan, mpbuck82, moursund, basetsb, lordmarcovan, JWP, Coin hunter 4, COINS MAKE CENTS, PerryHall, Aspie_Rocco, Braddick, DBSTrader2, SanctionII, Histman, The_Dinosaur_Man, jesbroken, CentSearcher ------ANA Member #3214817
I've got that one also, but its somewhat corroded and in a 3 month soak.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
@WilliamF
1809/6 (inverted 9) - C-5 (R.1) - There are six varieties for 1809. The C-5 is known for having the inverted, re-punched 9, and has been commonly called the 1809/6. The 9 is also shifted to the right a bit. On the reverse the top leaf of the wreath barely passes the last "S" in States
@jesbroken
1809 - C-6 (R.1) - I believe this to be the C-6, rather than the C-5 suggested. On the reverse top leaf extends to the midpoint between the last "S" in States and the "O" in Of. On the obverse, the date is spaced wide, and the bottom curl of the hair falls directly between the 0 and 9. I cannot see any evidence of a re-punched 9 in the date.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
I may as well join the fun with my two. Thank you, much appreciated.
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
@robec
1804 - C-10 (R.1) - This variety has a crosslet 4 that is punched high and close to the 0. The 4 also stands more upright. The die break above the "R" in America has widened on the reverse from the C-9.
1833 - C-1 (R.1) - There is only one variety for the date. All 1833 half cents have the die craving through the stars.
Very beautiful coins.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Thanks everyone for posting all of the beautiful (and sometimes beautifully fake) half cents on this thread. It is fun for me, and I have learned a ton already!
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
OK, the obvious answer is likely not the correct one for these
...
Wow @burfle23, I am really stumped. But, don't tell me. I know the obvious answer, but these are good and I really need to think on it.
Now -- if anyone else knows... by all means, go ahead. (but Burfle23 has to give me a min - or maybe hours
)
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
One hint- all in TPG holders- they don't get much better than this...
My guess so far is that there is a small ding/dent of the left side of the wreath. This is directly at the first berry branch on the righthand side of that branch. I looked at other examples, and I don't see the ding. I may be off, but it's all I've got so far.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
I also believe the obverse on the second coin is different. The E in Liberty is different than the other two (with a hook-like formation off the back). I have not seen this (even in late state examples)
Liberty's eye also appears to be different
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Well gang - I have been told that my first guess on an attribution point was correct, but my second guess was not. A special thanks to @burfle23 for posting such a cool brain buster
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
And then there is this one!
Now, I see all the same markers as the three above (there are many more attribution points to this counterfeit than I called out).
Edit Note: Actually, this one makes the three above easier to solve
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
But look at the main att, the "A" of HALF to the 1st three!
Oh, now I see. It looks like it's partially filled. Would this mean it's a later die state, or did they try to go back in and correct it? (maybe an unanswerable question)
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Tried to repair it; part of the risk of publishing info on these but there is no way to get the word out without some clear attribution points to pick up. The source example was genuine in an ANACS holder; I own 7 of the struck counterfeits with 5 being in TPG holders as genuine.
One of my favorite varieties, 1806 C-1 counterfeit, 2 die states...
Thanks for helping us to attribute it. This is great information!
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Would love an attribution on this one.
@Inspired70
1825 - C-2 (R.1) - There are two varieties for this date. The C-2 is known for having the lowest hair curl fall directly between the 2 and 5 of the date (the C-1 would have the curl directly over the 5).
Very nice coin!
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Your 1825 appears to be a C-2(without the reverse to verify). The lowest curl is between the 2 and the 5. Provide a reverse photo.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
https://coins.ha.com/itm/half-cents/1825-1-2-c-c-2-b-2-r1-ms65-brown-pcgs-gold-cac/a/1278-5030.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515
.
after giving it MUUUCHH thought and analysis over many years, i've determined that collectors (of anything) are better off being informed BUT with the counterfeiters knowing what we are identifying to avoid their crap vs having uninformed buyers that have really no idea what to look for and find doing it themselves (alone?) too exhausting/daunting of a task and the counterfeiters pumping the stuff out at a record pace.
i'd bet farm that is the way to go.
edited to add, they aren't going to stop and they aren't (some) going to stop getting better, if collectors don't try to keep up, they will be left behind.
perhaps there can start being some sort of badge/sign that certain dealers have passed a course on counterfeit detection of raw and certified coins giving potential buyers something solid to go with. there are plenty out there that would like to think they are good at it but in this arena, NOTHING says i am a good counterfeit detection numismatist like putting one's money where one's mouth is.
Really not sure what you just said @LanceNewmanOCC ...
you are concerned about posting attribution points for counterfeits when those very same people making the crap COULD be reading what we post and/or the information slowly working it's way to them BUT don't fret too much as they are going to keep doing it and getting better no matter what. collectors need this intricate information and FAST.
so when analyzed, it is worth the risk of posting stuff like you and others do because it is better having informed collectors vs having counterfeiters slowly starting to improve their work based partially on info that we provide.
better to have collectors have a little knowledge than none at all. ya know?
It would be very helpful if credible people in each coin series that have studied this extreme counterfeiting crisis and the diagnostics of the counterfeit coins so they could be attributed could publish either an online digital info or weekly reader, similar to Penny Whimsy, and charge for it. Just think the counterfeiters are learning daily on what they are doing wrong, so we must educate ourselves via some update source or we will soon not know what is real and what is not. If the knowledge is published as soon as it is discovered, we might have a chance. I'm not talking about a book, takes too long and by the time it is published it is outdated. Just as legitimate coins have diagnostics allowing us to attribute them, so do illigitimate coins have diagnostics.
Maybe PCGS could place a continuing open discussion pinned to the top of the discussion board. Just throwing out ideas. I, for one, do not wish to invest what little funds I have available for this hobby in a piece of copper with no numismatic value. I'm sure that most collectors would feel that way about their copper, silver, zinc, nickel or other metallic coins. JMO
I thank you @burfle23 for this info, had I just read this on the internet, I would probably have not trusted the source. I hope someone can come up with a solution soon. Any knowledge beats no knowledge.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
Ironic this came out after this post!
Contacted the Dealer and he ended the auction:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/364048730670?hash=item54c2feca2e:g:ajMAAOSwCJhjccUg&nma=true&si=wFo5xj4RAoNRDuxsvMmKliUlmck%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&trksid=p2047675.l2557&fbclid=IwAR3-DxoE-sdxjGpGhTZeKVZUlIUbsJoTnBEapnrTNn4U5toBPgSUu-Wf04
@burfle23
1857 - C-1 (R.2) - There is only one variety of the braided hair series, but this one is a COUNTERFEIT. The 7 in the date is not correct (although close), also, the notch in the hair is not really there (although I see a faint semblance of what it should be. A good looking fake, really!
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Also the top of the 5 is incorrect in association with the hair curl as is the 8. The curl over the 8 does not nearly complete covering the top of the 8. This coin looks really good. How they could mess the date up this bad and get the rest so close is a mystery but a thankful one. Thanks for sharing these. I hope you continue to share what you have in this venue. We need your help along with any others that have spent their valuable time gathering like information.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
that date is terrible!
what is the obvious pup for the 1806?
My Dansco type set coin:
peacockcoins
@peacockcoins
1811 C-1 (R.3+) - There are two varieties for this date. The C-1 is known for having the first 1 of the date wider spaced from the 811. I am afraid that this coin is COUNTERFEIT. The 1's in the date are thin, and have a top that is flat. Some of the leaves on the reverse to not line up where they should. I feel bad making this post, but I do not believe this to be genuine.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
@LanceNewmanOCC
This 1806 C-1 is counterfeit and made from the same dies that made the group of C-1 counterfeits posted by @burfle23 (above). There are many attribution points for this fake, but the two that are easiest to see are the dent in the lefthand wreath of the reverse (that I pointed out above). Also, the A in Half cent has the same defect as the others above.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Here's one for you! Thanks.
Click on this link to see my ebay listings.
1843 C-1 (R.1) - There is only one variety for this date. Although this coin appears to be NGC graded, I checked all of the attribution points. The date is evenly space, and the 1 in the date is low. On the reverse, all of the leaf tips line-up as they should.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
My summary article for the 1806 C-1 fakes for anyone interested: https://coinweek.com/counterfeits/struck-counterfeit-coin-week-1806-c-1-half-cent-1-page-attribution-guide/?fbclid=IwAR3N_0hiRPSuff5b_bpbaCq7rFS1gATUA46df0rAXUuUoZvVZVuxq-kFL6k
Looks similar to the "1811" I posted earlier; the reverse is wrong and from an 1826 C-1:
Thanks so much for teaching me @burfle23 !
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
@burfle23
Thank you for your link to your article on 1806 counterfeit half cent. Any chance of having dates and issues for finding the other 13 articles you provided? I would love to read them and learn also. Thank you very much for your assistance with these fakes.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
This one resides in my Dansco-type set of contemporary counterfeits, so no hard feelings!
peacockcoins
This one looks okay to me. I see coins in this thread that look genuine to me and the vast majority of collectors. How can you be sure that the coin in question is not just a new discovery? How many of them were made by the counterfeiter, and when?
https://coinweek.com/author/jack-d-young/?fbclid=IwAR0JueN48gwhitCAFvtcCRhcYhbV9jiuBdzbrKjCvg1sPL5_JPd7a3736ZA