You put yourself in this position (and others) by not requesting a reverse scan AND not inspecting the card upon arrival (a generous assumption). Take some responsibility for your actions and customer service shortcomings.
Eleven pages and no popcorn girl. This place is going to hell in a handbasket.
---------------------- Working on the following: 1970 Baseball PSA, 1970-1976 Raw, World Series Subsets PSA, 1969 Expansion Teams PSA, Fleer World Series Sets, Texas Rangers Topps Run 1972-1989 ----------------------
Successful deals to date: thedudeabides,gameusedhoop,golfcollector,tigerdean,treetop,bkritz, CapeMOGuy,WeekendHacker,jeff8877,backbidder,Salinas,milbroco,bbuckner22,VitoCo1972,ddfamf,gemint,K,fatty macs,waltersobchak,dboneesq
<< <i>Whoever bought it from Mile High should have been the one to turn it in back to Mile High....but NOOOOO....It gets passed onto Memory Lane!! >>
The point is that you tried to pass a defect on to somebody else like Mile High and Memory Lane did. At least Memory Lane provided a clear scan of the back.
<< <i>At least Memory Lane provided a clear scan of the back. >>
Memory Lane provided NO scan of the back.....Mile High did this past summer when the card sold for almost $800. Bottom line, is everyone wants ME to be accountable. I never noticed the back. But HEY - everyone wants me to be Card Vigilante....and I want EVERYONE else to man-up as well and be held accountable. As much as noone wants to believe it, it doesn't all fall on me. Like I said, this card traded hands NUMEROUS times!!! How come noone else had the balls to send it to PSA?????????????
<< <i>i think what i like best about bobbyw threads is just add water and watch it grow. >>
(page 1, post 16)
'Sir, I realize it's been difficult for you to sleep at night without your EX/MT 1977 Topps Tom Seaver, but I swear to you that you'll get it safe and sound.' -CDs Nuts, 1/20/14
Bobby as usual you do not get the point. (Or, if you do YOU like playing stupid)
YOU are accountable because YOU are the person that last sold the card.
If YOU wanted ML to be accountable YOU should have brought it to there attention upon receipt. Since YOU did not inspect the card properly YOU are accountable.
YOUR buyer inspected it upon delivery.
Stop making up excuses. The fact remains your audience is not as stupid as you would like to think.
<< <i>Stop making up excuses. The fact remains your audience is not as stupid as you would like to think. >>
THe point is the buck always stops with me.....nevermind the fact that this EXACT card changed hands 25 times before I got hold of it........I need to be the one to send it to PSA. Not the person who won it from Mile High. Not the person who won it from Ebay.....I wish others would grow some balls!!! I guess the buck stops with me however....carry on!
...is that supposed to be a big secret Mr Mint??? Dang Kirk!! I can always count on you if I want to sell some stuff for pennies on the dollar!!! You've bought from me before!!!! hello??? Like I said, this card has been bought and sold NUMEROUS times!! Yet, I am the only one with balls enough to send it in! Why didn't the original submitter tell PSA they made a mistake???? I got one simple reason why....MONEY! Why didn't the winning bidder from the Mile High Auction send it in????? Who the freak knows....he just passed it on to Memory Lane.........I like how everyone passes the freaking buck, but yet I am the criminal here....I am a victim too!! But I am the only one with balls enough to send it in........
It is unfortunate that the card made it this far. I've had about 3 "problem" cards that I purchased from sellers on EBAY. In 2 cases I dealt with the seller and in 1 case I dealt with the grading company. To be more exact on the 1 case....It was a 1964 Mantle that was clearly damaged by the GAI holder insert. I called GAI and Mike B was more than willing to take a look at the card. Little did I know that they were going to take the card for real....I had to call a million times and they kept telling me that had it in different vaults, this and that. They sent it to a wrong address twice. After about 3 months I did receive the card back with no compensation at all. I cracked it out and took my PSA 6 from the 7.5 holder and that was it. The sellers in the last 2 cases accepted a return.
MH and ML should know better also. I'm not letting them completely off the hook.
But Bobby has to make this right and needed to deal with this from the moment it started when Bobby received the card from the auction house. Although, I've heard some auction houses are very strict about no returns.
<< <i>But Bobby has to make this right and needed to deal with this from the moment it started when Bobby received the card from the auction house. Although, I've heard some auction houses are very strict about no returns >>
Bobby never got a call from the auction house. I have called twice now with nary a return call in sight. I am just tired of the witch hunters. I never noticed the little speck on the back. Now that I received the card back, it is really small. The buyers scan blew it up really big. I bet if everyones 10's were blew up that big, NONE of them would be 10's.....
<< <i>...is that supposed to be a big secret Mr Mint??? You've bought from me before!!!! hello??? Like I said, this card has been bought and sold NUMEROUS times!! Yet, I am the only one with balls enough to send it in! Why didn't the original submitter tell PSA they made a mistake???? I got one simple reason why....MONEY! Why didn't the winning bidder from the Mile High Auction send it in????? Who the freak knows....he just passed it on to Memory Lane.........I like how everyone passes the freaking buck, but yet I am the criminal here....I am a victim too!! But I am the only one with balls enough to send it in........ >>
You have no balls, you tried to pass the problem along.
You were the victim when you purchased it, you became the perp when you sold it.
I don't think Bobby did anything wrong. This is on PSA. He bought a PSA 8 in good faith and, if it's even the slightest bit plausible that he might not have looked at the back OR might not have applied the explicit grading standards for a PSA 8 to this particular card, sold a PSA 8 in good faith. He's not obligated to make the assessment that the card was overgraded, even if he saw the damage on the card before shipping it to the buyer. As for Bobby initially not wanting to issue a refund for a graded card, I see where he's coming from, but on the other hand, I agree with most here that once he saw the damage sustained on the back of the card, a refund was in order, given the circumstances.
People have different standards that they expect others to live up to, and that's fine. But I'm very sensitive to mob mentality or "crowd mind" behavior, and I think on the whole, Bobby is being treated unfairly. It's evident that mainstream society has adopted "guilty until proven innocent" as a general overriding policy, and that attitude has permeated the CU message boards. Not a single one of you can prove that Bobby knew he was passing on a bad card and acted with malicious and/or fraudulent forethought. You can think it, you can feel it, you can believe it, but you can NEVER EVER PROVE IT. Since being innocent until proven guilty is such a basic, fundamental principle of American idealism, it has become painfully clear that hypocrisy rules the day. It's a tragic shame, and what's even more troubling is that most hypocrites lack the basic self-awareness they'd need to recognize their own double standards.
Considering how many times this card was bought and sold on fleabay, they're the true winners. They've probably collected more in total fees than the card ever sold for.
I think another issue that should be addressed is that ML didn't return Bobbys phone call.
From what I can tell, 707 is the DOLLAR STORE compared to deans_cards. For what that guy charges, if I ever bought anything from him I would expect it to be delivered to me in a frickin' limo. ~WalterSobchak
Seems like Bobby was the last one holding the hot potato, and now he has to eat it. That really sucks for Bobby. He probably could sell it on ebay and get away with it (eventually) like everyone else did before him, but that would be wrong, and bad for the hobby. It just sucks to have to be the guy who takes a hit for someone else's greed and misjudgment. I don't agree with how he handled this whole return thing, but I do feel bad for him being in this sticky situation.
I'm not taking sides here, but as a lover of this hobby, somebody needs to get that card out of that holder. OR send it to Waverly82 and have him color it in...
<< <i>Do you see the irony of you initially not wanting to give a refund, and now you're looking to get a refund from the party you bought it from? >>
Cause I never noticed the back Lee!!! I told the buyer he could have a refund, but now it is fine and dandy if I get stuck with a card?? Sure, just send Bobby all your bad cards.....WinPitcher...send me your $2,000 card.......
I am already stuck with one card that everyone seems to have a field day with......now I am stuck with another....the irony here is that everyone seems to enjoy slamming my name in the mud as a screwball and lowlife, and I AM BUYING THESE CARDS FROM LEGITIMATE PLACES THE SAME AS YOU!! >>
Then start a thread with a beef about the dealer/people you are BUYING these junk cards from.....not a whine about how the buyer you scammed is now unhappy.
..is that supposed to be a big secret Mr Mint??? Dang Kirk!! I can always count on you if I want to sell some stuff for pennies on the dollar!!! You've bought from me before!!!! hello??? Like I said, this card has been bought and sold NUMEROUS times!! Yet, I am the only one with balls enough to send it in! Why didn't the original submitter tell PSA they made a mistake???? I got one simple reason why....MONEY! Why didn't the winning bidder from the Mile High Auction send it in????? Who the freak knows....he just passed it on to Memory Lane.........I like how everyone passes the freaking buck, but yet I am the criminal here....I am a victim too!! But I am the only one with balls enough to send it in........
Wow this thread has completely spiraled out of control. First things first...
Bobby: ML and MH aren't here posting, you are. That's why you're taking heat. If they came in here and starting posting reasons why they won't accept a return they'd get piled on too. In the end you did the right thing- the buyer was refunded and you contacted the place where you bought it from for recourse. Unfortunately, the auction houses have a pretty strong reputation of not refunding buyers and generally acting shady so you're probably screwed. So now the card goes to PSA and hopefully they will foot the bill for their mistake. It sucks that you got stuck with the card, but you can only control what happens to it from here on out. Just because Jane gave you Chlamydia doesn't mean you can blame her when you pass it on to Betty.
I think the point you might be missing is that you seem to want the auction houses to take all the heat here. The fact is we all know they are pretty shady and expect them to act accordingly. Nobody here is surprised that they are passing along overgraded cards and they aren't accepting refunds for them. Dealing that way on this message board is a whole different story- there is a reasonable expectation here that overgraded stuff won't get passed along, and that if it is then a refund is given no questions asked. In reading your initial post, it seems you were trying to ask the community whether you should accept the refund, but you had apparently already told the buyer you wouldn't (or so the buyer says). Makes it seem ingenuine, like maybe you were just looking for validation of your actions rather than actual advice. But as I said, in the end you did the right thing and that should be pointed out even if you are flying off the handle a little trying to defend yourself.
I rarely throw my opinion on these boards but I wanted to share my thoughts on returning items. I personally think that a seller should refund the buyer regardless. I usually deal with 5 or 6 of the same sellers on ebay and I know they would refund me immediately if I had an issue- and that's exactly the reason I like dealing with those same 5 or 6 sellers. I know that there are a lot of scammers out there (buyers and sellers) but it's just good business to do a speedy refund without any fight. My grandfather always would tell me that if a store can easily take my money for an item, then they better just as easily refund me that money it if Im unhappy. And refunding the money after giving the buyer grief about it is almost as bad as not giving a refund at all. I hope all the parties involved in this Jordan card end up happy in the end.
<< <i>I rarely throw my opinion on these boards but I wanted to share my thoughts on returning items. I personally think that a seller should refund the buyer regardless. I usually deal with 5 or 6 of the same sellers on ebay and I know they would refund me immediately if I had an issue- and that's exactly the reason I like dealing with those same 5 or 6 sellers. I know that there are a lot of scammers out there (buyers and sellers) but it's just good business to do a speedy refund without any fight. My grandfather always would tell me that if a store can easily take my money for an item, then they better just as easily refund me that money it if Im unhappy. And refunding the money after giving the buyer grief about it is almost as bad as not giving a refund at all. I hope all the parties involved in this Jordan card end up happy in the end. >>
I agree with all of the above EXCEPT for allowing returns on bullion sales. The reason is obvious.
"Listen. I don't care what you say. Chlamydia is a soup. It's my opinion. I can have that if I'd like. You don't have to argue. I've seen it on the grocery store shelf. Don't argue with me about it. I don't care if you are a doctor"
Issues like these seem to follow Bobby around, it appears...
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Comments
looks like we picked the wrong week.
How to get hard to get autographs.
Working on the following: 1970 Baseball PSA, 1970-1976 Raw, World Series Subsets PSA, 1969 Expansion Teams PSA, Fleer World Series Sets, Texas Rangers Topps Run 1972-1989
----------------------
Successful deals to date: thedudeabides,gameusedhoop,golfcollector,tigerdean,treetop,bkritz, CapeMOGuy,WeekendHacker,jeff8877,backbidder,Salinas,milbroco,bbuckner22,VitoCo1972,ddfamf,gemint,K,fatty macs,waltersobchak,dboneesq
<< <i>Whoever bought it from Mile High should have been the one to turn it in back to Mile High....but NOOOOO....It gets passed onto Memory Lane!! >>
The point is that you tried to pass a defect on to somebody else like Mile High and Memory Lane did. At least Memory Lane provided a clear scan of the back.
can someone direct me to that reply...
thanks
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
Positive Transactions - tennesseebanker, Ahmanfan, Donruss, Colebear, CDsNuts, rbdjr1, Downtown1974, yankeeno7, drewsef, mnolan, mrbud60, msassin, RipublicaninMass, AkbarClone, rustywilly, lsutigers1973, julen23 and nam812, plus many others...
<< <i>At least Memory Lane provided a clear scan of the back. >>
Memory Lane provided NO scan of the back.....Mile High did this past summer when the card sold for almost $800. Bottom line, is everyone wants ME to be accountable. I never noticed the back. But HEY - everyone wants me to be Card Vigilante....and I want EVERYONE else to man-up as well and be held accountable. As much as noone wants to believe it, it doesn't all fall on me. Like I said, this card traded hands NUMEROUS times!!! How come noone else had the balls to send it to PSA?????????????
<< <i>i think what i like best about bobbyw threads is just add water and watch it grow. >>
(page 1, post 16)
-CDs Nuts, 1/20/14
*1956 Topps baseball- 97.4% complete, 7.24 GPA
*Clemente basic set: 85.0% complete, 7.89 GPA
YOU are accountable because YOU are the person that last sold the card.
If YOU wanted ML to be accountable YOU should have brought it to there attention
upon receipt. Since YOU did not inspect the card properly YOU are accountable.
YOUR buyer inspected it upon delivery.
Stop making up excuses. The fact remains your audience is not as stupid as you would like to think.
Steve
<< <i>Stop making up excuses. The fact remains your audience is not as stupid as you would like to think. >>
THe point is the buck always stops with me.....nevermind the fact that this EXACT card changed hands 25 times before I got hold of it........I need to be the one to send it to PSA. Not the person who won it from Mile High. Not the person who won it from Ebay.....I wish others would grow some balls!!! I guess the buck stops with me however....carry on!
Ebay selling account tarheeltreasurehunt
MH and ML should know better also. I'm not letting them completely off the hook.
But Bobby has to make this right and needed to deal with this from the moment it started when Bobby received the card from the auction house. Although, I've heard some auction houses are very strict about no returns.
Mickey71
<< <i>But Bobby has to make this right and needed to deal with this from the moment it started when Bobby received the card from the auction house. Although, I've heard some auction houses are very strict about no returns >>
Bobby never got a call from the auction house. I have called twice now with nary a return call in sight. I am just tired of the witch hunters. I never noticed the little speck on the back. Now that I received the card back, it is really small. The buyers scan blew it up really big. I bet if everyones 10's were blew up that big, NONE of them would be 10's.....
<< <i>...is that supposed to be a big secret Mr Mint??? You've bought from me before!!!! hello??? Like I said, this card has been bought and sold NUMEROUS times!! Yet, I am the only one with balls enough to send it in! Why didn't the original submitter tell PSA they made a mistake???? I got one simple reason why....MONEY! Why didn't the winning bidder from the Mile High Auction send it in????? Who the freak knows....he just passed it on to Memory Lane.........I like how everyone passes the freaking buck, but yet I am the criminal here....I am a victim too!! But I am the only one with balls enough to send it in........ >>
You have no balls, you tried to pass the problem along.
You were the victim when you purchased it, you became the perp when you sold it.
People have different standards that they expect others to live up to, and that's fine. But I'm very sensitive to mob mentality or "crowd mind" behavior, and I think on the whole, Bobby is being treated unfairly. It's evident that mainstream society has adopted "guilty until proven innocent" as a general overriding policy, and that attitude has permeated the CU message boards. Not a single one of you can prove that Bobby knew he was passing on a bad card and acted with malicious and/or fraudulent forethought. You can think it, you can feel it, you can believe it, but you can NEVER EVER PROVE IT. Since being innocent until proven guilty is such a basic, fundamental principle of American idealism, it has become painfully clear that hypocrisy rules the day. It's a tragic shame, and what's even more troubling is that most hypocrites lack the basic self-awareness they'd need to recognize their own double standards.
Well that was nice of him, glad someone did
~WalterSobchak
Buying Vintage, all sports.
Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
That way those that care can decide if they want/need one.
Thanks
I'm not taking sides here, but as a lover of this hobby, somebody needs to get that card out of that holder. OR send it to Waverly82 and have him color it in...
<< <i>
<< <i>Do you see the irony of you initially not wanting to give a refund, and now you're looking to get a refund from the party you bought it from? >>
Cause I never noticed the back Lee!!! I told the buyer he could have a refund, but now it is fine and dandy if I get stuck with a card?? Sure, just send Bobby all your bad cards.....WinPitcher...send me your $2,000 card.......
I am already stuck with one card that everyone seems to have a field day with......now I am stuck with another....the irony here is that everyone seems to enjoy slamming my name in the mud as a screwball and lowlife, and I AM BUYING THESE CARDS FROM LEGITIMATE PLACES THE SAME AS YOU!! >>
Then start a thread with a beef about the dealer/people you are BUYING these junk cards from.....not a whine about how the buyer you scammed is now unhappy.
Wow this thread has completely spiraled out of control. First things first...
Bobby: ML and MH aren't here posting, you are. That's why you're taking heat. If they came in here and starting posting reasons why they won't accept a return they'd get piled on too. In the end you did the right thing- the buyer was refunded and you contacted the place where you bought it from for recourse. Unfortunately, the auction houses have a pretty strong reputation of not refunding buyers and generally acting shady so you're probably screwed. So now the card goes to PSA and hopefully they will foot the bill for their mistake. It sucks that you got stuck with the card, but you can only control what happens to it from here on out. Just because Jane gave you Chlamydia doesn't mean you can blame her when you pass it on to Betty.
I think the point you might be missing is that you seem to want the auction houses to take all the heat here. The fact is we all know they are pretty shady and expect them to act accordingly. Nobody here is surprised that they are passing along overgraded cards and they aren't accepting refunds for them. Dealing that way on this message board is a whole different story- there is a reasonable expectation here that overgraded stuff won't get passed along, and that if it is then a refund is given no questions asked. In reading your initial post, it seems you were trying to ask the community whether you should accept the refund, but you had apparently already told the buyer you wouldn't (or so the buyer says). Makes it seem ingenuine, like maybe you were just looking for validation of your actions rather than actual advice. But as I said, in the end you did the right thing and that should be pointed out even if you are flying off the handle a little trying to defend yourself.
http://www.psacard.com/SetRegistry/Composite.aspx?c=1786
Leave it to Lee to put it in layman's terms for the rest of us.
<< <i>I rarely throw my opinion on these boards but I wanted to share my thoughts on returning items. I personally think that a seller should refund the buyer regardless. I usually deal with 5 or 6 of the same sellers on ebay and I know they would refund me immediately if I had an issue- and that's exactly the reason I like dealing with those same 5 or 6 sellers. I know that there are a lot of scammers out there (buyers and sellers) but it's just good business to do a speedy refund without any fight. My grandfather always would tell me that if a store can easily take my money for an item, then they better just as easily refund me that money it if Im unhappy. And refunding the money after giving the buyer grief about it is almost as bad as not giving a refund at all. I hope all the parties involved in this Jordan card end up happy in the end. >>
I agree with all of the above EXCEPT for allowing returns on bullion sales. The reason is obvious.
-Leon Phelps
Geez boys, why does it always take a woman to post popcorn girl???
Oh, and Trent rocks my world.
Hi Trent!!!!
<< <i><<Just because Jane gave you Chlamydia doesn't mean you can blame her when you pass it on to Betty.>> >>
That is sig line material.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.