And there are coins that have stickered that look like dogs for the grade and are difficult to sell for their listed “value”. Incredibly most collectors still look at the coin first.
There are certain areas on the coin that are referred to as "focal points" or "focal areas". Your eyes tend to notice contact marks, dings and scratches in those areas more so than if they are hidden in the devices. In this case those contact marks are in a prime focal area, really stand out and drop the coin from a "GEM" MS-65 to more like a 64.
The longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice is it possible for an empire to rise without His aid? Benjamin Franklin
@pmh1nic said:
There are certain areas on the coin that are referred to as "focal points" or "focal areas". Your eyes tend to notice contact marks, dings and scratches in those areas more so than if they are hidden in the devices. In this case those contract marks are in a prime focal area, really stand out and drop the coin from a "GEM" MS-65 to more like a 64.
Or could have been a “65-C” in the opinion of the person who declined to award it a CAC sticker.
Hi Tom, I'm not familiar with how CAG handles PVC. If they find PVC on a slabbed coin do they give any explanation on paperwork when the coin is returned to the owner?
The longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice is it possible for an empire to rise without His aid? Benjamin Franklin
The initial eye appeal is good with the luster and the toning, but there are too many little marks in the field to qualify as a coin in that grade IMO.
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
Hi Tom, I'm not familiar with how CAG handles PVC. If they find PVC on a slabbed coin do they give any explanation on paperwork when the coin is returned to the owner?
I've seen a number of failed submissions post with a red sticker on the front with PVC hand written on it.
@willy said: @TomB Are the spots by the T & Y PVC ??
You CANNOT tell whether a coin has PVC by looking at a picture.
Your comment isn’t necessarily accurate. It depends on the coin and the picture.
You are correct, Mark. I was referring to this specific picture and the possibility of "beginning" PVC. @TomB said on the CAC Forum,
"...if the PVC on a coin is not old then it will be more pliable and transparent, but as it ages it can get more brittle and translucent. This is likely why CAC (and CACG) catch so many PVC damaged coins in older holders."
@willy said: @TomB Are the spots by the T & Y PVC ??
You CANNOT tell whether a coin has PVC by looking at a picture.
Your comment isn’t necessarily accurate. It depends on the coin and the picture.
You are correct, Mark. I was referring to this specific picture and the possibility of "beginning" PVC. @TomB said on the CAC Forum,
"...if the PVC on a coin is not old then it will be more pliable and transparent, but as it ages it can get more brittle and translucent. This is likely why CAC (and CACG) catch so many PVC damaged coins in older holders."
Thanks. I mistakenly took your comment as a general one.
In a sense, the comment by @TomB could apply to why CAC catches coins that have been puttied. A recent putty job can be very difficult to detect, But once the putty has dried out and turned color, voila!
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@pmh1nic said:
There are certain areas on the coin that are referred to as "focal points" or "focal areas". Your eyes tend to notice contact marks, dings and scratches in those areas more so than if they are hidden in the devices. In this case those contact marks are in a prime focal area, really stand out and drop the coin from a "GEM" MS-65 to more like a 64.
Nice coin but IMO too many dings in the fields. Those dings also are really concentrated.
Your eyes kinda wander to that spot.
This has more of an MS64+ look to me.
@pmh1nic said:
There are certain areas on the coin that are referred to as "focal points" or "focal areas". Your eyes tend to notice contact marks, dings and scratches in those areas more so than if they are hidden in the devices. In this case those contact marks are in a prime focal area, really stand out and drop the coin from a "GEM" MS-65 to more like a 64.
I think spot on "LIBERTY" took this one to 63.
I think that hairlines are a more likely factor.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@lcoopie said:
Lots of defects were found by the board based upon the photos.
But the coins marks don’t appear inconsistent with the 65 grade. The biggest problem is the coin shows up as already pointed out as a 1946 Washington Quarter. Something is very wrong
Does CAC also consider strike on these? I'm thinking about another thread... full strike Walkers. Now, I can't get the hand and thumb out of my brain. Yes, I see contact Mark's too, but I'm also thinking strike...
Collecting: Dansco 7070; Middle Date Large Cents (VF-AU); Box of 20;
@lkenefic said:
Does CAC also consider strike on these? I'm thinking about another thread... full strike Walkers. Now, I can't get the hand and thumb out of my brain. Yes, I see contact Mark's too, but I'm also thinking strike...
I’m sure they do but that doesn’t appear to be an issue in this case.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@pmh1nic said:
There are certain areas on the coin that are referred to as "focal points" or "focal areas". Your eyes tend to notice contact marks, dings and scratches in those areas more so than if they are hidden in the devices. In this case those contact marks are in a prime focal area, really stand out and drop the coin from a "GEM" MS-65 to more like a 64.
I think spot on "LIBERTY" took this one to 63.
I think that hairlines are a more likely factor.
Quite likely. But the SPOT was all I could look at.
lcoopie
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I can assure you of only one thing...... There are millions of collectors out there who don't care. They like the coin.
And there are coins that have stickered that look like dogs for the grade and are difficult to sell for their listed “value”. Incredibly most collectors still look at the coin first.
"Why didn’t this walker sticker?"
Because the obverse is peppered with contact marks.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I can assure you that you can't accurately assure anyone that millions of collectors like the coin.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Thanks, now I can rest assured.
There are certain areas on the coin that are referred to as "focal points" or "focal areas". Your eyes tend to notice contact marks, dings and scratches in those areas more so than if they are hidden in the devices. In this case those contact marks are in a prime focal area, really stand out and drop the coin from a "GEM" MS-65 to more like a 64.
Or could have been a “65-C” in the opinion of the person who declined to award it a CAC sticker.
I’m going to guess PVC.
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Hi Tom, I'm not familiar with how CAG handles PVC. If they find PVC on a slabbed coin do they give any explanation on paperwork when the coin is returned to the owner?
The initial eye appeal is good with the luster and the toning, but there are too many little marks in the field to qualify as a coin in that grade IMO.
@TomB Are the spots by the T & Y PVC ??
I've seen a number of failed submissions post with a red sticker on the front with PVC hand written on it.
You CANNOT tell whether a coin has PVC by looking at a picture.
Right obverse field is a key focal area. Weak strike (and a lot of chatter) central obverse. Also, I’m not 100% convinced by the toning…
The big reading mark in the right facing obverse field.
The toning may be artificial.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
I was face to face with J A who explained it to me.
No one got it yet.
High point rub?
It's a 58.
Your comment isn’t necessarily accurate. It depends on the coin and the picture.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
The toning looks just fine and attractive to me.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Thanks for the input. I wasn't sure. It looks better to me on my PC than on my iPhone.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
You’re welcome. I’d toss the phone.
😉
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Imo it’s probably not a complicated one, I think it’s just a 64 with attractive toning to which PCGS gave a color bump. Looks weak as a technical 5.
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And I got it from a reputable board member as well.
I can and I will. Do you like it , outside of the holder ?
You are correct, Mark. I was referring to this specific picture and the possibility of "beginning" PVC.
@TomB said on the CAC Forum,
"...if the PVC on a coin is not old then it will be more pliable and transparent, but as it ages it can get more brittle and translucent. This is likely why CAC (and CACG) catch so many PVC damaged coins in older holders."
I would be happy with a 65 on that coin. I like the toning, but it’s pretty dingy.
Thanks. I mistakenly took your comment as a general one.
In a sense, the comment by @TomB could apply to why CAC catches coins that have been puttied. A recent putty job can be very difficult to detect, But once the putty has dried out and turned color, voila!
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I think spot on "LIBERTY" took this one to 63.
Dingy?
Yes, and inside too 🤪
Dings on the right arm, the sun, and behind Liberty.
Nice coin but IMO too many dings in the fields. Those dings also are really concentrated.
Your eyes kinda wander to that spot.
This has more of an MS64+ look to me.
Could another obstacle with CAC be the fact that the cert number is attached to a Washington quarter and not a walker?
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Lots of defects were found by the board based upon the photos.
I think that hairlines are a more likely factor.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
But the coins marks don’t appear inconsistent with the 65 grade. The biggest problem is the coin shows up as already pointed out as a 1946 Washington Quarter. Something is very wrong
Does CAC also consider strike on these? I'm thinking about another thread... full strike Walkers. Now, I can't get the hand and thumb out of my brain. Yes, I see contact Mark's too, but I'm also thinking strike...
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I’m sure they do but that doesn’t appear to be an issue in this case.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
My guess is that CAC feels the coin is an attractive toned slider.
Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.
Quite likely. But the SPOT was all I could look at.
When will you reveal JA answer?
JA says
It’s would sticker, he liked it, but they don’t sticker any label errors.
The answer was the full slab photo
And spots.
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"Sou Mangueira......."
I told you guys I am no expert but it did look like it was certainly right for 65, too many assumptions made about contact marks
Doh…. I just looked at the date and grade and ignored the denomination!
Nice prank, we all pretty much fell for it!