That is actually very cool and a service as a buyer I'd pay for. eBay is a bit of a dinosaur, and I'm sure there will be mistakes, but that is pretty slick.
@MisterTim1962 said:
I wonder how hard it would be cut those stickers off the flimsy penny sleeve and stick it to another penny sleeve with a counterfeit card inside? Or slice the top of the penny sleeve with a razor blade, take out the legit card and slide in a bogus one. Then heat seal it back up. Just a thought on eBay's weak attempt at encapsulating cards...
That’s a bit harsh there, considering the service was completely covered by EBay and went quite smoothly. I’m not sure the authentication is supposed to be transferable to the next owner or not. I believe the whole point of the authentication is for the initial raw sale. Subsequent sales may trigger another free authentication by EBay, but possibly not. Either way it’s better than nothing unless you have a problem with extra handling of your cards or delay. I was a bit worried about how careful they would be with the handling of the card as I do plan on grading, but all went well in this instance.
Interesting when you scan the QR code at least... although it might be concerning that there is no mention of it being blackless. That's an important detail about the card.
@jeffcbay said:
Interesting when you scan the QR code at least... although it might be concerning that there is no mention of it being blackless. That's an important detail about the card.
Yeah, I agree. I expected about as much from a peripheral grading company doing strictly “authentication”. I know PSA graded a few of these blackless cards and got the flips wrong classifying them as normal corrected cards.
I didn’t realize that any grading company recognized the blackless except the Thomas NNOF. See there are a couple graded so PSA now recognizes. If you are not familiar with the thread on here (the greatest thread of all-time) - I doubt you know the blackless exist.
Does not surprise me that they missed this, but you would think they would flag something about a 1990 Franco AS as being over $750.
PSA and BGS currently recognize all 13 of the 1990 Topps Partial Blackless cards and there is actually a PSA registry for the checklist of the NNOF, the 12 other related errors, and the more minor variation which is the 414C Frank Thomas partial missing black - it’s only missing a couple chunks of black out of the nameplate.
I received my card extremely quickly and like that it was authenticated.
However, I didn’t like the way the Cardsaver is wrapped and obscures part of the back. It also makes the card look dull.
I took my card out - which is fine because I don’t plan on selling it. However, I can easily re-seal it into the bag and nobody would be able to tell. These are not tamper proof by any means and have no value to show authenticity past the original purchase. Very disappointing. The sticker left a little residue but if you re-seal it over the residue you cannot tell I opened it.
I wonder if it's just a matter of time before eBay/CCG offer an option to have them encapsulate and assign a grade to the card being Authenticated. That would save round-trip shipping for grading a card. Since they have the card in hand, why not grade it for me? As a buyer of a raw card that gets authenticated by them I would pay a reasonable fee to have them grade it for me (with encapsulation).
Am I the only one who assumes that the sole purpose of this is to reassure the buyer of the authenticity of the card? That is, once the card reaches the buyer, all bets are off. I assume that if the card is resold through eBay, it would have to be authenticated again, and that there is no warranty implied on third party sales.
@DotStore said:
I wonder if it's just a matter of time before eBay/CCG offer an option to have them encapsulate and assign a grade to the card being Authenticated. That would save round-trip shipping for grading a card. Since they have the card in hand, why not grade it for me? As a buyer of a raw card that gets authenticated by them I would pay a reasonable fee to have them grade it for me (with encapsulation).
Agreed, I think this is the endgame. Would be another revenue stream for eBay and satisfy a pretty large demand for low-mid tier graded cards that aren’t high end enough to require the PSA/BGS treatment.
@daltex said:
Am I the only one who assumes that the sole purpose of this is to reassure the buyer of the authenticity of the card? That is, once the card reaches the buyer, all bets are off. I assume that if the card is resold through eBay, it would have to be authenticated again, and that there is no warranty implied on third party sales.
This is how I imagine things playing out. Also as others have mentioned, this hugely benefits the seller who ships a legit item now has recourse if a shady buyer tries a bait and switch and filing a “item not as described” or similar complaint.
Recently I was both a buyer and seller of two raw cards totaling $2500 value. The peace of mind on both ends (even tho, a from the buyer end, I was positive the Franco Partial Blackless could not be forged) was invaluable. From the seller end, it would be quite awful to lose $1000+ because some buyer pretended not to get the card.
@brad31 said:
I took my card out - which is fine because I don’t plan on selling it. However, I can easily re-seal it into the bag and nobody would be able to tell. These are not tamper proof by any means and have no value to show authenticity past the original purchase. Very disappointing. The sticker left a little residue but if you re-seal it over the residue you cannot tell I opened it.
Thank you for posting this! It's a little disappointing about being able to easily open /close the seal. I expected more since they stated this: "Finally, the card will receive a tamper-proof sticker sealing the packaging and certifying that the card is authentic."
I guess we will now see some scammers replace cards that have been eBay/CSG Authenticated, list them as Authenticated and somehow get around the process of Authenticated again by eBay by listing it for $749 or some other method.
ETA
Overall though, I think this is a great service for both Sellers and Buyers. As a Buyer -- I am now looking at RAW cards that I would not really have considered in the past (unless from reputable dealers). And as a Seller I will be starting to list some of my Raw cards with peace of mind -- I don't accept returns, so once I send it to eBay/CSG and they Authenticate it, eBay then considers it a FINAL SALE.
What is going to happen when an eBay approved card is sent to BGS or PSA in it's ebay sealed envelope and rejected for authenticity or trimming etc.? Who is responsible then? Ebay? CCG?
eBay has BGS and PSA on the approved authenticator list, and I would trust their opinion over this CCG company.
@daltex said:
Am I the only one who assumes that the sole purpose of this is to reassure the buyer of the authenticity of the card? That is, once the card reaches the buyer, all bets are off. I assume that if the card is resold through eBay, it would have to be authenticated again, and that there is no warranty implied on third party sales.
That's exactly how I interpreted the service as well. Just a peace of mind for that one purchase, not for resale later.
Not interested in getting another person's opinion on cards I am buying or selling, even though I rarely buy/sell at the prices that are being mentioned.
PSA does a pretty good job. Now we are going to be forced to listen to another "expert"? These are the same greedy people who refuse to eliminate bid retractions because it costs them money.
I will be looking at other options in the future.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
To each their own, but I'm not sure I understand how people are upset about this. Worst case scenario is the card comes a few days later and has a second set of eyes on it. If it is fake, saves you a bunch of time on returns. If real, you can take it out of the CS1 like you would any new card coming in.
Not interested in getting another person's opinion on cards I am buying or selling, even though I rarely buy/sell at the prices that are being mentioned.
PSA does a pretty good job. Now we are going to be forced to listen to another "expert"? These are the same greedy people who refuse to eliminate bid retractions because it costs them money.
This is simply going to be a disaster. When they receive 20 thousand individual packages a day they will be overwhelmed. When they implement the $250 for graded cards....it will be a tidal wave. How many $250 cards are sold each day on EBAY ?? They will be backed up like PSA. Plus on a $1000 item what will this cost.....$50 or some crazy amount. It won't be free. DISASTER. Plus who made this company an expert on anything? I wouldn't send them anything to grade. They're experts on MONEY not Sports Cards. This is all BS.
@80sOPC said:
To each their own, but I'm not sure I understand how people are upset about this. Worst case scenario is the card comes a few days later and has a second set of eyes on it. If it is fake, saves you a bunch of time on returns. If real, you can take it out of the CS1 like you would any new card coming in.
Not interested in getting another person's opinion on cards I am buying or selling, even though I rarely buy/sell at the prices that are being mentioned.
PSA does a pretty good job. Now we are going to be forced to listen to another "expert"? These are the same greedy people who refuse to eliminate bid retractions because it costs them money.
I will be looking at other options in the future.
Sometimes you just see something, say "THAT'S STUPID" and move on.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
What is stupid about an authenticity guarantee? I get that you and I don't need this, but man I sure would have loved this when I got back in to collecting. I have a fake Patrick Roy RC, and a trimmed 80 Gretzky #250 that I bought early back into collecting that would would have benefited from this program.
I guess I don't see any downside today. There has been endless complaining about the number of fakes and how eBay should police their marketplace. This is that.
@80sOPC said:
To each their own, but I'm not sure I understand how people are upset about this. Worst case scenario is the card comes a few days later and has a second set of eyes on it. If it is fake, saves you a bunch of time on returns. If real, you can take it out of the CS1 like you would any new card coming in.
Not interested in getting another person's opinion on cards I am buying or selling, even though I rarely buy/sell at the prices that are being mentioned.
PSA does a pretty good job. Now we are going to be forced to listen to another "expert"? These are the same greedy people who refuse to eliminate bid retractions because it costs them money.
I will be looking at other options in the future.
Sometimes you just see something, say "THAT'S STUPID" and move on.
I guess I don't see any downside today. There has been endless complaining about the number of fakes and how eBay should police their marketplace. This is that.
The downside is they're going to start charging for this service eventually. You don't really think eBay will keep doing this for free, do you? No way. It's a money grab, plain and simple. And every time the card is sold to another buyer, you'll have to pay eBay to confirm that the card is real once again. EBay sees this as a cash cow, not a way to police their site.
EBay does a terrible job policing their site and this won't change anything. I see hundreds of counterfeit cards listed there with only "RP" to tell you that they're reprints or fakes. I report them, but they never take them down or make the sellers use the word "reprint" in their listings.
Everyone is talking about "Authenticity Guarantee".....that's hilarious. Maybe they could have hired PRO or KSA. Heck GAI could have been resurrected from the card grave to implement their scandalous ways. Only thing I know for sure is this-When they open the $250 for graded cards the shipping and receiving department will be the most secure job in the world. They will have to hire a million employees. They will be completely overwhelmed. If you get 20 thousand packages everyday....can you imagine simply opening them? Some will be damaged, some will not even have an item in them and some will be fine when the box is opened 22 days later and "LOGGED" in. Then you need "GRADERS" to authenticate the graded cards-LOL. Then they need to be placed in that album or whatever you call that travesty. Then it needs to be re-boxed and shipped to the buyer 3 months later by that same shipping department who is already overwhelmed. The Newport Beach USPS was completely overwhelmed during the famous 3 month period last year and this will happen to this company's local USPS forever. They will get thousands of individual packages everyday except Sunday because of Harry Potter/No post on Sunday. I'm glad this whole process will be totally free for sellers as I'm sure the byers and EBAY will eat the entire cost of it.....That's funny. But hey, I'm just glad Henry the 18 year old says my item is authentic. I will simply cherish it. Then 5 years later PSA/SGC reject the RAW item.......................................................... "TO BE CONTINUED"
I have to apologize for causing a panic about the shipping problem that will occur if this doesn't get sorted out or a solid plan. I feel much better now....EBAY just contacted me and they are hiring COMC shipping department to sort all of this out.
I put that in for humor. I will edit it as I don't want to offend anybody. I'm aware that it can be very beneficial medically. But yes I am a touch angry as I think this is going to be a DISASTER.
Does anyone know an approximate volume? I’ve seen some huge numbers thrown out here, but someone in a thread on a different board had much lower results based on actual eBay searches.
I’m not eBay search savvy, so this could be way off. But if it’s close, then we’re looking at 140K-ish over 2 months for the graded/raw $250+ service. That’s about 2,250/day. Still a bunch, but not 20K daily. Someone with eBay skills could probably hone in on a number if this guy’s logic is faulty.
@burghman said:
Does anyone know an approximate volume? I’ve seen some huge numbers thrown out here, but someone in a thread on a different board had much lower results based on actual eBay searches.
I’m not eBay search savvy, so this could be way off. But if it’s close, then we’re looking at 140K-ish over 2 months for the graded/raw $250+ service. That’s about 2,250/day. Still a bunch, but not 20K daily. Someone with eBay skills could probably hone in on a number if this guy’s logic is faulty.
That seems low. I saw somewhere #'s based just on PSA 10's that were quite high. Yes, my 20,000 was just a number to say it's going to be a high number. Every month I believe there are thousands of just Mantle sold that are more than $250.
@jeffcbay said:
Seller Fees are going up March 1st... I wonder how much that has to do with this wonderful useless service.
Probably just their first salvo. A flat fee likley coming next for the authentication for both slabbed and un-slabbed.
Having CSG (CGC) authenticate a PSA Slabbed card is beyond absurd. I've also no trust in CSG "ability". regardless of their PR statements their card authentication staff are amateurs paid only slightly above minimum wage. I have a contact at CGC but believe me or not don't matter to me
Blackstone is an ultra stingy firm that even with the Collectible boom has been too cheap to hire more graders. They had 20 CGC graders before the pandemic began that number is lower now. They don't eve bother to try to handle the continuing inbound flood. They just let the comics pile up in their new warehouse. While they only grade on business days each grader actually grades 32 hours or less a week, the other 8 hours are other job related tasks and "admin" type stuff, thus they have only 4 grading days a week and only if they are business days.
CGC won't stop the flow as PSA did thus estimated Turn-Around for Comics will soon measure in years and for some services and service levels they already are over a year.
They will not hire more staff to keep up with card authentication as more and more floods in, the cards will simply pile up as the comics have. Warehouse space (rather inexpensive in Florida) costs them less than salaried workers.
Those sending stuff for eBay authentication may not be able to sell their items for months, possibly a year, as it piles up to ceiling at CSG. Remember Blackstone's goal is to make things look really good on a balance sheet then skedaddle before what in this case may be a literal house o'cards collapses.
I do hope this becomes a contributing factor in the beginning of the end of FEE-PAY
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
@jeffcbay said:
Seller Fees are going up March 1st... I wonder how much that has to do with this wonderful useless service.
Probably just their first salvo. A flat fee likley coming next for the authentication for both slabbed and un-slabbed.
Having CSG (CGC) authenticate a PSA Slabbed card is beyond absurd. I've also no trust in CSG "ability". regardless of their PR statements their card authentication staff are amateurs paid only slightly above minimum wage. I have a contact at CGC but believe me or not don't matter to me
>
Everyone is so overly negative on here, it’s a bit silly if you ask me. First of all, they don’t authenticate cards already in a PSA/BGS slab. It’s only raw cards over $750. And even if I have to pay .6% extra fees, that’s worth it to me to prevent sketchy buyers filing not as described claims or trying to make off with the card for free by making some absurd claim (I always do signature on delivery and usps insurance for big cards but even that isn’t 100% foolproof).
Now, if eBay keeps increasing fees moving forward, that’s a different story.
@80sOPC said:
What is stupid about an authenticity guarantee? I get that you and I don't need this, but man I sure would have loved this when I got back in to collecting. I have a fake Patrick Roy RC, and a trimmed 80 Gretzky #250 that I bought early back into collecting that would would have benefited from this program.
I guess I don't see any downside today. There has been endless complaining about the number of fakes and how eBay should police their marketplace. This is that.
@80sOPC said:
To each their own, but I'm not sure I understand how people are upset about this. Worst case scenario is the card comes a few days later and has a second set of eyes on it. If it is fake, saves you a bunch of time on returns. If real, you can take it out of the CS1 like you would any new card coming in.
Not interested in getting another person's opinion on cards I am buying or selling, even though I rarely buy/sell at the prices that are being mentioned.
PSA does a pretty good job. Now we are going to be forced to listen to another "expert"? These are the same greedy people who refuse to eliminate bid retractions because it costs them money.
I will be looking at other options in the future.
Sometimes you just see something, say "THAT'S STUPID" and move on.
There's simply no need for any more self proclaimed experts out there (many who know little or nothing about anything)
that I am being forced to listen to. I too got fooled a few times in the past, it's called learning.
If ebay wants to offer an optional service for those who don't know if they're buying something that may not be authentic, that would be just great. Those buyers can pay for it and wait a little longer if they choose to.
Lots of people are going to get screwed when the underqualified people ebay hires to authenticate make a high percentage of mistakes. Buyers and sellers alike.
PSA has the best authenticator/graders in the business and they make mistakes. I am betting the people ebay hires will be several steps below PSA's employees.
2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
@jeffcbay said:
Seller Fees are going up March 1st... I wonder how much that has to do with this wonderful useless service.
Probably just their first salvo. A flat fee likley coming next for the authentication for both slabbed and un-slabbed.
Having CSG (CGC) authenticate a PSA Slabbed card is beyond absurd. I've also no trust in CSG "ability". regardless of their PR statements their card authentication staff are amateurs paid only slightly above minimum wage. I have a contact at CGC but believe me or not don't matter to me
>
Everyone is so overly negative on here, it’s a bit silly if you ask me. First of all, they don’t authenticate cards already in a PSA/BGS slab. It’s only raw cards over $750. And even if I have to pay .6% extra fees, that’s worth it to me to prevent sketchy buyers filing not as described claims or trying to make off with the card for free by making some absurd claim (I always do signature on delivery and usps insurance for big cards but even that isn’t 100% foolproof).
You are not entirely correct. Yes in Feb 2022 they do not but soon they will required authentication for all graded cards sold for $250USD and up.
In what i am perceiving as your zeal to pounce on my post and others as being "negative" and "silly", you appear to have missed the updated news from late Jan.
By mid-2022, the service will expand to include _graded, autograph and patch cards sold for $250+_
@80sOPC said:
Regarding the fee increases, that probably has more to do with inflation and other macro factors.
Yep, you ain't seen nothing yet. My guess is $10-$15 for the Authentication possibly with an added shipping charge.
eBay will enlist this as their authentication fee theme song:
You ain't seen nothin' yet
B-b-b-baby, you just ain't seen n-n-n-nothin' yet
Here's something that you're never gonna forget
B-b-b-baby, you just ain't seen n-n-n-nothin' yet
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
@80sOPC said:
Regarding the fee increases, that probably has more to do with inflation and other macro factors.
Yep, you ain't seen nothing yet. My guess is $10-$15 for the Authentication possibly with an added shipping charge.
eBay will enlist this as their authentication fee theme song:
You ain't seen nothin' yet
B-b-b-baby, you just ain't seen n-n-n-nothin' yet
Here's something that you're never gonna forget
B-b-b-baby, you just ain't seen n-n-n-nothin' yet
Did you see the packaging? It's got a booklet/box and QR/Hologram etc. I will be quite surprised if it's $10. I'm anticipating something like 10% of the value which is simply going to hurt us all real bad. Sorry I'm being so negative on this; but I just don't see the positives on the graded cards with authentication from an inferior grading team. Just don't see why I should be excited...plus the absurd cost that about to be applied to SELLERS. It should be optional for BUYERS; but obviously that ship has sailed.
I agree they will try to monetize this, but I'm in Payments and I am convinced the biggest reason for the change is significant losses their were taking on raw and fraudulent card sales. I explained how it works above- most folks probably do not understand how the full chargeback process works. This change is going to reduce chargebacks dramatically, because the seller won't be funded until the card passes authentication. The return will happen before making it's way to the buyer.
@80sOPC said:
Regarding the fee increases, that probably has more to do with inflation and other macro factors.
Yep, you ain't seen nothing yet. My guess is $10-$15 for the Authentication possibly with an added shipping charge.
eBay will enlist this as their authentication fee theme song:
You ain't seen nothin' yet
B-b-b-baby, you just ain't seen n-n-n-nothin' yet
Here's something that you're never gonna forget
B-b-b-baby, you just ain't seen n-n-n-nothin' yet
Did you see the packaging? It's got a booklet/box and QR/Hologram etc. I will be quite surprised if it's $10. I'm anticipating something like 10% of the value which is simply going to hurt us all real bad. Sorry I'm being so negative on this; but I just don't see the positives on the graded cards with authentication from an inferior grading team. Just don't see why I should be excited...plus the absurd cost that about to be applied to SELLERS. It should be optional for BUYERS; but obviously that ship has sailed.
On fixed price sellers of course will raise price of graded cards to compensate. What about auctions? Hard to do that except as handling fee.
Of course as buyer I will feel better CSG has authenticated my PSA Slab. Perhaps as a bonus CGC (CSG) will be able to Introduce Newton's Rings to the PSA Slabs. Or reduce the integrity on sonic seal of the PSA slabs to mimic all the times CGC fails do to that properly on a Comic slab.
All of that is bargain at an addition $25 per $250 of value of the card slabbed
FeePay eliminates most trading card charge backs and now collects huge fee revenue in the process. They did figure a way to eliminate an expense and add a profit, at least in short-term - someone there is gettin' a large 7 fig bonus.
I'm glad i don't sell trading cards. Those of you that do leaner times are a comin' but be overjoyed eBay and CGC/Blackstone will profit like bandits from your reduced income.
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
You are not entirely correct. Yes in Feb 2022 they do not but soon they will required authentication for all graded cards sold for $250USD and up.
In what i am perceiving as your zeal to pounce on my post and others as being "negative" and "silly", you appear to have missed the updated news from late Jan.
By mid-2022, the service will expand to include _graded, autograph and patch cards sold for $250+_
You are correct I did miss that news. I agree it is silly to authenticate slabs from $250 up. I don’t see a problem confirming the slab on super high end items such as $10K up but if the threshold is $250 they will be inundated.
If they can somehow do this without passing the cost off to the end user it would probably be a good thing, but I don’t see how they swing it with these low thresholds.
That being said, there is definitely still a gigantic chunk of the market they will service even with all these changes. Facebook groups are tricky sometimes and major auction houses don’t make sense for a lot of mid tier items.
I appreciate the correction as I haven’t been keeping up with all the changes.
If they do start charging a fee for this service, I’m guessing it will have certain cap limits based on valuation “thresholds”
I mean it will only cost $60 to submit a raw card for actual grading/slabbing to CSG with a declared value up to $10k
The counterfeiters are getting better and better. Cards that look properly graded in a slab with a real matching serial number can fool many people. Having an Authenticator take a look at it seems like a good idea to me.
A few months ago I saw an MJ rookie card in a PSA slab on eBay that looked a little “off” to me. I reported it to eBay but it ended up selling for 5 figures. A newbie who is buying on eBay will think they are “safe” because it’s graded by PSA. But they would have no idea they just bought a forgery. The middleman Authenticator could have saved them…
The counterfeiters are getting better and better. Cards that look properly graded in a slab with a real matching serial number can fool many people. Having an Authenticator take a look at it seems like a good idea to me.
A few months ago I saw an MJ rookie card in a PSA slab on eBay that looked a little “off” to me. I reported it to eBay but it ended up selling for 5 figures. A newbie who is buying on eBay will think they are “safe” because it’s graded by PSA. But they would have no idea they just bought a forgery. The middleman Authenticator could have saved them…
Serious snarkless question. Let’s posit that CSG is competent to catch inauthentic or altered cards, though that is certainly not a slam dunk given PSA’s own imperfection in that regard.
Why should we think they have some special level of proficiency at spotting fake PSA slabs? Anymore than, say, the average collector of PSA graded cards?
@PaulMaul said:
Serious snarkless question. Let’s posit that CSG is competent to catch inauthentic or altered cards, though that is certainly not a slam dunk given PSA’s own imperfection in that regard.
Why should we think they have some special level of proficiency at spotting fake PSA slabs? Anymore than, say, the average collector of PSA graded cards?
Keep in mind what they are doing regarding counterfeit / forged slabs (assuming they do start Authenticating cards already slabbed). The original cards were presumably and most likely legit and properly graded by say PSA. But the counterfeiters have found a way to get slabs that might be authentic, putting in a forged copy of the card, and inserting a legit label that has a true serial number, and also the barcode is legit (printing/copying technology is amazing nowadays). Well, at least a third party authenticator can take a look -- I believe it doesn't hurt. It will certainly help the newbie who doesn't know what to look for and only relies on buying a card that is in a PSA Slab. All I know is the MJ rookie card I saw was from a dealer with a few thousand positive feedback, the slab looked legit, the serial number lookup was for the card described, and the barcode scanned properly.
CSG might be a newborn in the sportscard grading world, but I do have hundreds of graded coins/currency from their sister companies NGC and PMG. CSG also is one of only 2 (I think) current sportscard grading companies offering a Grade Guarantee for cards they grade and slab. Granted, the Authentication they are providing for eBay is not a grade/slab process -- but the company behind it I believe in. But that's just me.
If eBay/CSG eventually do offer grading/encapsulating of RAW cards for a reasonable fee (current CSG cost for a card valued up to $10K is a $60 fee), I say in a few years we might be looking at a new #2 in the TPG World.
Only time will tell if this was a good or bad idea. I vote it was a very good idea (and should have been available years ago).
All the negative comments remind me of the Superbowl Commercial with Larry David.
@brad31 said:
The were able to keep up at $750 so makes sense. The true test will be when they open it up to graded since the volume will grow exponentially.
It really seems ill-considered to include graded cards above $250. If the goal is to catch elaborate fake slabs, maybe up it to $5K cutoff? Trying to deal with every $300 slab that sells will ultimately lead to rubber-stamping them anyway, since careful examination of such a quantity of graded cards will prove impossible.
@jeffcbay said:
How soon until you see people relisting their "sealed and QR-coded" cards? And will they have to go through the whole authentication process again?
What happens if you finally get your card and it's damaged? What we need is more people handling your card and more trips through the mail service......what could go wrong?
Comments
That is actually very cool and a service as a buyer I'd pay for. eBay is a bit of a dinosaur, and I'm sure there will be mistakes, but that is pretty slick.
That’s a bit harsh there, considering the service was completely covered by EBay and went quite smoothly. I’m not sure the authentication is supposed to be transferable to the next owner or not. I believe the whole point of the authentication is for the initial raw sale. Subsequent sales may trigger another free authentication by EBay, but possibly not. Either way it’s better than nothing unless you have a problem with extra handling of your cards or delay. I was a bit worried about how careful they would be with the handling of the card as I do plan on grading, but all went well in this instance.
Yes, I think it simply looks awful. Seriously. Ridiculous. Looks terrible.
Happy to see the QR code goes to a photo of the card. I will crack mine out as I don’t like that the code obscures part of the back of the card.
Interesting when you scan the QR code at least... although it might be concerning that there is no mention of it being blackless. That's an important detail about the card.
Yeah, I agree. I expected about as much from a peripheral grading company doing strictly “authentication”. I know PSA graded a few of these blackless cards and got the flips wrong classifying them as normal corrected cards.
I didn’t realize that any grading company recognized the blackless except the Thomas NNOF. See there are a couple graded so PSA now recognizes. If you are not familiar with the thread on here (the greatest thread of all-time) - I doubt you know the blackless exist.
Does not surprise me that they missed this, but you would think they would flag something about a 1990 Franco AS as being over $750.
PSA and BGS currently recognize all 13 of the 1990 Topps Partial Blackless cards and there is actually a PSA registry for the checklist of the NNOF, the 12 other related errors, and the more minor variation which is the 414C Frank Thomas partial missing black - it’s only missing a couple chunks of black out of the nameplate.
https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/baseball/key-card-sets/1990-topps-partial-blackless/21251
That is some impressive packaging by Ebay.
I received my card extremely quickly and like that it was authenticated.
However, I didn’t like the way the Cardsaver is wrapped and obscures part of the back. It also makes the card look dull.
I took my card out - which is fine because I don’t plan on selling it. However, I can easily re-seal it into the bag and nobody would be able to tell. These are not tamper proof by any means and have no value to show authenticity past the original purchase. Very disappointing. The sticker left a little residue but if you re-seal it over the residue you cannot tell I opened it.
I wonder if it's just a matter of time before eBay/CCG offer an option to have them encapsulate and assign a grade to the card being Authenticated. That would save round-trip shipping for grading a card. Since they have the card in hand, why not grade it for me? As a buyer of a raw card that gets authenticated by them I would pay a reasonable fee to have them grade it for me (with encapsulation).
Am I the only one who assumes that the sole purpose of this is to reassure the buyer of the authenticity of the card? That is, once the card reaches the buyer, all bets are off. I assume that if the card is resold through eBay, it would have to be authenticated again, and that there is no warranty implied on third party sales.
Agreed, I think this is the endgame. Would be another revenue stream for eBay and satisfy a pretty large demand for low-mid tier graded cards that aren’t high end enough to require the PSA/BGS treatment.
This is how I imagine things playing out. Also as others have mentioned, this hugely benefits the seller who ships a legit item now has recourse if a shady buyer tries a bait and switch and filing a “item not as described” or similar complaint.
Recently I was both a buyer and seller of two raw cards totaling $2500 value. The peace of mind on both ends (even tho, a from the buyer end, I was positive the Franco Partial Blackless could not be forged) was invaluable. From the seller end, it would be quite awful to lose $1000+ because some buyer pretended not to get the card.
Thank you for posting this! It's a little disappointing about being able to easily open /close the seal. I expected more since they stated this: "Finally, the card will receive a tamper-proof sticker sealing the packaging and certifying that the card is authentic."
I guess we will now see some scammers replace cards that have been eBay/CSG Authenticated, list them as Authenticated and somehow get around the process of Authenticated again by eBay by listing it for $749 or some other method.
ETA
Overall though, I think this is a great service for both Sellers and Buyers. As a Buyer -- I am now looking at RAW cards that I would not really have considered in the past (unless from reputable dealers). And as a Seller I will be starting to list some of my Raw cards with peace of mind -- I don't accept returns, so once I send it to eBay/CSG and they Authenticate it, eBay then considers it a FINAL SALE.
What is going to happen when an eBay approved card is sent to BGS or PSA in it's ebay sealed envelope and rejected for authenticity or trimming etc.? Who is responsible then? Ebay? CCG?
eBay has BGS and PSA on the approved authenticator list, and I would trust their opinion over this CCG company.
That's exactly how I interpreted the service as well. Just a peace of mind for that one purchase, not for resale later.
Good by ebay.
Not interested in getting another person's opinion on cards I am buying or selling, even though I rarely buy/sell at the prices that are being mentioned.
PSA does a pretty good job. Now we are going to be forced to listen to another "expert"? These are the same greedy people who refuse to eliminate bid retractions because it costs them money.
I will be looking at other options in the future.
To each their own, but I'm not sure I understand how people are upset about this. Worst case scenario is the card comes a few days later and has a second set of eyes on it. If it is fake, saves you a bunch of time on returns. If real, you can take it out of the CS1 like you would any new card coming in.
This is simply going to be a disaster. When they receive 20 thousand individual packages a day they will be overwhelmed. When they implement the $250 for graded cards....it will be a tidal wave. How many $250 cards are sold each day on EBAY ?? They will be backed up like PSA. Plus on a $1000 item what will this cost.....$50 or some crazy amount. It won't be free. DISASTER. Plus who made this company an expert on anything? I wouldn't send them anything to grade. They're experts on MONEY not Sports Cards. This is all BS.
Sometimes you just see something, say "THAT'S STUPID" and move on.
What is stupid about an authenticity guarantee? I get that you and I don't need this, but man I sure would have loved this when I got back in to collecting. I have a fake Patrick Roy RC, and a trimmed 80 Gretzky #250 that I bought early back into collecting that would would have benefited from this program.
I guess I don't see any downside today. There has been endless complaining about the number of fakes and how eBay should police their marketplace. This is that.
The downside is they're going to start charging for this service eventually. You don't really think eBay will keep doing this for free, do you? No way. It's a money grab, plain and simple. And every time the card is sold to another buyer, you'll have to pay eBay to confirm that the card is real once again. EBay sees this as a cash cow, not a way to police their site.
EBay does a terrible job policing their site and this won't change anything. I see hundreds of counterfeit cards listed there with only "RP" to tell you that they're reprints or fakes. I report them, but they never take them down or make the sellers use the word "reprint" in their listings.
Everyone is talking about "Authenticity Guarantee".....that's hilarious. Maybe they could have hired PRO or KSA. Heck GAI could have been resurrected from the card grave to implement their scandalous ways. Only thing I know for sure is this-When they open the $250 for graded cards the shipping and receiving department will be the most secure job in the world. They will have to hire a million employees. They will be completely overwhelmed. If you get 20 thousand packages everyday....can you imagine simply opening them? Some will be damaged, some will not even have an item in them and some will be fine when the box is opened 22 days later and "LOGGED" in. Then you need "GRADERS" to authenticate the graded cards-LOL. Then they need to be placed in that album or whatever you call that travesty. Then it needs to be re-boxed and shipped to the buyer 3 months later by that same shipping department who is already overwhelmed. The Newport Beach USPS was completely overwhelmed during the famous 3 month period last year and this will happen to this company's local USPS forever. They will get thousands of individual packages everyday except Sunday because of Harry Potter/No post on Sunday. I'm glad this whole process will be totally free for sellers as I'm sure the byers and EBAY will eat the entire cost of it.....That's funny. But hey, I'm just glad Henry the 18 year old says my item is authentic. I will simply cherish it. Then 5 years later PSA/SGC reject the RAW item.......................................................... "TO BE CONTINUED"
I have to apologize for causing a panic about the shipping problem that will occur if this doesn't get sorted out or a solid plan. I feel much better now....EBAY just contacted me and they are hiring COMC shipping department to sort all of this out.
My best to eBay and it's partner
I put that in for humor. I will edit it as I don't want to offend anybody. I'm aware that it can be very beneficial medically. But yes I am a touch angry as I think this is going to be a DISASTER.
Does anyone know an approximate volume? I’ve seen some huge numbers thrown out here, but someone in a thread on a different board had much lower results based on actual eBay searches.
I’m not eBay search savvy, so this could be way off. But if it’s close, then we’re looking at 140K-ish over 2 months for the graded/raw $250+ service. That’s about 2,250/day. Still a bunch, but not 20K daily. Someone with eBay skills could probably hone in on a number if this guy’s logic is faulty.
Jim
That seems low. I saw somewhere #'s based just on PSA 10's that were quite high. Yes, my 20,000 was just a number to say it's going to be a high number. Every month I believe there are thousands of just Mantle sold that are more than $250.
Seller Fees are going up March 1st... I wonder how much that has to do with this wonderful useless service.
Probably just their first salvo. A flat fee likley coming next for the authentication for both slabbed and un-slabbed.
Having CSG (CGC) authenticate a PSA Slabbed card is beyond absurd. I've also no trust in CSG "ability". regardless of their PR statements their card authentication staff are amateurs paid only slightly above minimum wage. I have a contact at CGC but believe me or not don't matter to me
Blackstone is an ultra stingy firm that even with the Collectible boom has been too cheap to hire more graders. They had 20 CGC graders before the pandemic began that number is lower now. They don't eve bother to try to handle the continuing inbound flood. They just let the comics pile up in their new warehouse. While they only grade on business days each grader actually grades 32 hours or less a week, the other 8 hours are other job related tasks and "admin" type stuff, thus they have only 4 grading days a week and only if they are business days.
CGC won't stop the flow as PSA did thus estimated Turn-Around for Comics will soon measure in years and for some services and service levels they already are over a year.
They will not hire more staff to keep up with card authentication as more and more floods in, the cards will simply pile up as the comics have. Warehouse space (rather inexpensive in Florida) costs them less than salaried workers.
Those sending stuff for eBay authentication may not be able to sell their items for months, possibly a year, as it piles up to ceiling at CSG. Remember Blackstone's goal is to make things look really good on a balance sheet then skedaddle before what in this case may be a literal house o'cards collapses.
I do hope this becomes a contributing factor in the beginning of the end of FEE-PAY
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
Blackstone owns CGC??? Wonderful... things just got much worse.
>
Everyone is so overly negative on here, it’s a bit silly if you ask me. First of all, they don’t authenticate cards already in a PSA/BGS slab. It’s only raw cards over $750. And even if I have to pay .6% extra fees, that’s worth it to me to prevent sketchy buyers filing not as described claims or trying to make off with the card for free by making some absurd claim (I always do signature on delivery and usps insurance for big cards but even that isn’t 100% foolproof).
Now, if eBay keeps increasing fees moving forward, that’s a different story.
There's simply no need for any more self proclaimed experts out there (many who know little or nothing about anything)
that I am being forced to listen to. I too got fooled a few times in the past, it's called learning.
If ebay wants to offer an optional service for those who don't know if they're buying something that may not be authentic, that would be just great. Those buyers can pay for it and wait a little longer if they choose to.
Lots of people are going to get screwed when the underqualified people ebay hires to authenticate make a high percentage of mistakes. Buyers and sellers alike.
PSA has the best authenticator/graders in the business and they make mistakes. I am betting the people ebay hires will be several steps below PSA's employees.
You are not entirely correct. Yes in Feb 2022 they do not but soon they will required authentication for all graded cards sold for $250USD and up.
In what i am perceiving as your zeal to pounce on my post and others as being "negative" and "silly", you appear to have missed the updated news from late Jan.
By mid-2022, the service will expand to include _graded, autograph and patch cards sold for $250+_
CGC brags about it on their website
https://www.cgccomics.com/news/article/9861/ebay-authenticity-guarantee/
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
Regarding the fee increases, that probably has more to do with inflation and other macro factors.
Yep, you ain't seen nothing yet. My guess is $10-$15 for the Authentication possibly with an added shipping charge.
eBay will enlist this as their authentication fee theme song:
You ain't seen nothin' yet
B-b-b-baby, you just ain't seen n-n-n-nothin' yet
Here's something that you're never gonna forget
B-b-b-baby, you just ain't seen n-n-n-nothin' yet
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
Did you see the packaging? It's got a booklet/box and QR/Hologram etc. I will be quite surprised if it's $10. I'm anticipating something like 10% of the value which is simply going to hurt us all real bad. Sorry I'm being so negative on this; but I just don't see the positives on the graded cards with authentication from an inferior grading team. Just don't see why I should be excited...plus the absurd cost that about to be applied to SELLERS. It should be optional for BUYERS; but obviously that ship has sailed.
I agree they will try to monetize this, but I'm in Payments and I am convinced the biggest reason for the change is significant losses their were taking on raw and fraudulent card sales. I explained how it works above- most folks probably do not understand how the full chargeback process works. This change is going to reduce chargebacks dramatically, because the seller won't be funded until the card passes authentication. The return will happen before making it's way to the buyer.
On fixed price sellers of course will raise price of graded cards to compensate. What about auctions? Hard to do that except as handling fee.
Of course as buyer I will feel better CSG has authenticated my PSA Slab. Perhaps as a bonus CGC (CSG) will be able to Introduce Newton's Rings to the PSA Slabs. Or reduce the integrity on sonic seal of the PSA slabs to mimic all the times CGC fails do to that properly on a Comic slab.
All of that is bargain at an addition $25 per $250 of value of the card slabbed
FeePay eliminates most trading card charge backs and now collects huge fee revenue in the process. They did figure a way to eliminate an expense and add a profit, at least in short-term - someone there is gettin' a large 7 fig bonus.
I'm glad i don't sell trading cards. Those of you that do leaner times are a comin' but be overjoyed eBay and CGC/Blackstone will profit like bandits from your reduced income.
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
You are correct I did miss that news. I agree it is silly to authenticate slabs from $250 up. I don’t see a problem confirming the slab on super high end items such as $10K up but if the threshold is $250 they will be inundated.
If they can somehow do this without passing the cost off to the end user it would probably be a good thing, but I don’t see how they swing it with these low thresholds.
That being said, there is definitely still a gigantic chunk of the market they will service even with all these changes. Facebook groups are tricky sometimes and major auction houses don’t make sense for a lot of mid tier items.
I appreciate the correction as I haven’t been keeping up with all the changes.
If they do start charging a fee for this service, I’m guessing it will have certain cap limits based on valuation “thresholds”
I mean it will only cost $60 to submit a raw card for actual grading/slabbing to CSG with a declared value up to $10k
The counterfeiters are getting better and better. Cards that look properly graded in a slab with a real matching serial number can fool many people. Having an Authenticator take a look at it seems like a good idea to me.
A few months ago I saw an MJ rookie card in a PSA slab on eBay that looked a little “off” to me. I reported it to eBay but it ended up selling for 5 figures. A newbie who is buying on eBay will think they are “safe” because it’s graded by PSA. But they would have no idea they just bought a forgery. The middleman Authenticator could have saved them…
To me, this service is welcome and long overdue.
Serious snarkless question. Let’s posit that CSG is competent to catch inauthentic or altered cards, though that is certainly not a slam dunk given PSA’s own imperfection in that regard.
Why should we think they have some special level of proficiency at spotting fake PSA slabs? Anymore than, say, the average collector of PSA graded cards?
Keep in mind what they are doing regarding counterfeit / forged slabs (assuming they do start Authenticating cards already slabbed). The original cards were presumably and most likely legit and properly graded by say PSA. But the counterfeiters have found a way to get slabs that might be authentic, putting in a forged copy of the card, and inserting a legit label that has a true serial number, and also the barcode is legit (printing/copying technology is amazing nowadays). Well, at least a third party authenticator can take a look -- I believe it doesn't hurt. It will certainly help the newbie who doesn't know what to look for and only relies on buying a card that is in a PSA Slab. All I know is the MJ rookie card I saw was from a dealer with a few thousand positive feedback, the slab looked legit, the serial number lookup was for the card described, and the barcode scanned properly.
CSG might be a newborn in the sportscard grading world, but I do have hundreds of graded coins/currency from their sister companies NGC and PMG. CSG also is one of only 2 (I think) current sportscard grading companies offering a Grade Guarantee for cards they grade and slab. Granted, the Authentication they are providing for eBay is not a grade/slab process -- but the company behind it I believe in. But that's just me.
If eBay/CSG eventually do offer grading/encapsulating of RAW cards for a reasonable fee (current CSG cost for a card valued up to $10K is a $60 fee), I say in a few years we might be looking at a new #2 in the TPG World.
Only time will tell if this was a good or bad idea. I vote it was a very good idea (and should have been available years ago).
All the negative comments remind me of the Superbowl Commercial with Larry David.
Card value is now $500 or higher for this service.
Nic
Guides Authored - Graded Card Scanning Guide PDF | History of the PSA Label PDF
The were able to keep up at $750 so makes sense. The true test will be when they open it up to graded since the volume will grow exponentially.
It really seems ill-considered to include graded cards above $250. If the goal is to catch elaborate fake slabs, maybe up it to $5K cutoff? Trying to deal with every $300 slab that sells will ultimately lead to rubber-stamping them anyway, since careful examination of such a quantity of graded cards will prove impossible.
Ha…. Same here. I was surprised to see how quickly they went to $500. Must be confident in the system and can also see the upcoming $.
Nic
Guides Authored - Graded Card Scanning Guide PDF | History of the PSA Label PDF
Welp... that didn't take long.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/134024044278?epid=93932340&hash=item1f34749ef6:g:qXsAAOSwOG5iCb3R
What happens if you finally get your card and it's damaged? What we need is more people handling your card and more trips through the mail service......what could go wrong?