Everybody has their own opinion, and mine is Jordan. I have to admit, this thread has been a lot of fun. It has brought back a lot of memories of the NBA's good ol' days.
Mine is Jordan. The man was a killer. Couldn't stand him winning, but the best I've seen.
I didn't see Kareem in his prime, but have to believe he deserves more credit. His accomplishments are remarkable and the fact that they changed the rules because of him says a lot. Six MVPs in a ten year period is amazing. I can see a valid argument for Kareem.
@doubledragon said:
Everybody has their own opinion, and mine is Jordan. I have to admit, this thread has been a lot of fun. It has brought back a lot of memories of the NBA's good ol' days.
Agreed - no personal insults, fun info, great gifs and a few laughs.
SEGA!
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@RedHeart54 said:
Back to the ('86 Jordan) card. I'd like to read everyone's earliest memories of it. I started going to shows in around 1987 and I guess I have vague memories of knowing about it in passing. It wasn't until the October 1989 issue of the first Beckett Basketball that it really became a hot commodity booking at a whole $175.
I guess the Jordan must have been selling well through 1989 to originally "book" at $175. (I mean, not many recent baseball rookies (let alone football or hockey) were selling in that range at that time but for a few ( '86 Donruss Canseco, '84 Fleer Update Clemens and Puckett, '83 Topps Traded Strawberry).
I had a friend back then whose father had purchased around 30 packs for 50 cents apiece earlier in the year. Needless to say they had a lot of very nice cards. My dad bought a number of cards from him including the Jordan for "book". Still have it 30 years later. Originally graded an 8 but was eventually regraded to a 9.
I started collecting all four of the major sports in 86-87 when the closest store to my house,a Cumberland Farms convenience store, only sold the 86 Fleer basketball packs for some reason while a very small corner store next to my school had 86 Topps football,87 Topps baseball & 87 Topps Hockey. I eventually started buying all four but where basketball was my favorite sport having Larry Bird's Celtics as our local team i would spend most of my money on the .65 cents 86 Fleer packs near my house and at one time I had a full 9 pocket page of Jordan rookies on one side with 9 of his stickers on the otherside. Unfortunately as I got older in my late teen years where girls and owning a car took precedence over collecting I sold off most of my collection but kept these two through all the years. I hadn't graded the rookie until a couple years ago but BGS graded the sticker a 6 back in the late 90's and I actually just recently cracked it then added to a PSA sub that just got delivered home on saturday. I wouldn't clean the wax off the back and asked for no qualifiers so overall I was just happy to finally get it into a matching slab with my rookie.
Eric...... I too bought my 86-87 Fleer packs from Cumberland Farms in 1986. I would stop by the convenience store every night on my way home from visiting my girl friend buying 4-5 packs at a time. .50 cents a pack, damn if I only knew. Are you from New England? I grew up in Maine.
Yup,I'm in Mass. It was weird because they had those packs for at least a couple years but never sold any 87 Fleer basketball. They did eventually sell 88 packs but I never got to collect 87 until years after they were out.
I'm with you on the if we only knew,i traded my friend that got me into collecting all of my hockey,mostly 86-88ish Topps for all of his Fleer basketball and his 85 Star Lite All Star set. I sold or traded off too much but luckily held on to those two for sentimental reasons.
@doubledragon said:
Everybody has their own opinion, and mine is Jordan. I have to admit, this thread has been a lot of fun. It has brought back a lot of memories of the NBA's good ol' days.
Agreed - no personal insults, fun info, great gifs and a few laughs.
SEGA!
I had a few year stretch where I was to cheap to go buy the new yearly updated version of NBA Live so I would manually create the drafted players and move all of free agents & traded players to their new teams. If I remember right I did this for three straight years lol. Sega was the best and yes I had way to much time on my hands.
@doubledragon said:
Everybody has their own opinion, and mine is Jordan. I have to admit, this thread has been a lot of fun. It has brought back a lot of memories of the NBA's good ol' days.
Agreed - no personal insults, fun info, great gifs and a few laughs.
SEGA!
I had a few year stretch where I was to cheap to go buy the new yearly updated version of NBA Live so I would manually create the drafted players and move all of free agents & traded players to their new teams. If I remember right I did this for three straight years lol. Sega was the best and yes I had way to much time on my hands.
If I remember correctly, one of the years you could ‘Create a Player’ and there was a ‘hack’ that if you put in about 15-20 different Legends (and spelled their names right) it would load the correct info of the player automatically.
@doubledragon said:
Everybody has their own opinion, and mine is Jordan. I have to admit, this thread has been a lot of fun. It has brought back a lot of memories of the NBA's good ol' days.
Agreed - no personal insults, fun info, great gifs and a few laughs.
SEGA!
I had a few year stretch where I was to cheap to go buy the new yearly updated version of NBA Live so I would manually create the drafted players and move all of free agents & traded players to their new teams. If I remember right I did this for three straight years lol. Sega was the best and yes I had way to much time on my hands.
If I remember correctly, one of the years you could ‘Create a Player’ and there was a ‘hack’ that if you put in about 15-20 different Legends (and spelled their names right) it would load the correct info of the player automatically.
@doubledragon said:
I have absolutely no doubt in my mind, that if Jordan hadn't left the game for the 94 and 95 seasons, the Bulls would have won 8 straight NBA championships.
Had a Bulls-Rockets Finals taken place that might have arguably been Chicago's toughest Finals matchup yet having to face a center like Hakeem Olajuwon in his prime. Looking at all of the Finals teams they beat there was only one team that had a better than average center,The Lakers with Kareem but he was literally at the end of his career. This would have been before Rodman arrived and Hakeem would have destroyed the Luc Longley/Bill Wennington/Will Perdue matchups.
It would have been a pretty entertaining series to say the least.
I don't think Kareem played MJ in any Finals. He had retired by then. I believe Vlade Divac was the C for the LAL in the Bulls Lakers Finals.
@1951WheatiesPremium said:
And by the way - to anyone reading along - I grew up rooting for Bird and the Celtics so I actually hated Kareem with a strong passion. He was a total beast.
Michael Jordan was also fantastic - that isn’t debatable. Still, the game began to worsen considerably during his ascent as rule changes were made to basically legislate the game toward being guard oriented and guard dominated. Similar to passing in the NFL, the league wanted it and made it so. Refs began to call any light contact as a foul - in both sports. All of a sudden, scoring goes up, stats become watered down and defense goes out the window. And then everyone goes immediately to the stats to prove how great this personal pick is - and they all just happen to be playing now.
So please consider my support for Kareem really a case for the guys who came before...
In regards to your statements above, I definitely think rules changes have turned the game into a more guard oriented game. There is little doubt of that. However, I disagree with the idea that less defense is being played now, at least in terms of the NBA. I don't watch enough NFL these days to comment on the state of defense in that league. The type of defense being played now is different than that of the preceding eras in the NBA, but the level of intensity on defense is at an all time high.
@1951WheatiesPremium said:
And by the way - to anyone reading along - I grew up rooting for Bird and the Celtics so I actually hated Kareem with a strong passion. He was a total beast.
Michael Jordan was also fantastic - that isn’t debatable. Still, the game began to worsen considerably during his ascent as rule changes were made to basically legislate the game toward being guard oriented and guard dominated. Similar to passing in the NFL, the league wanted it and made it so. Refs began to call any light contact as a foul - in both sports. All of a sudden, scoring goes up, stats become watered down and defense goes out the window. And then everyone goes immediately to the stats to prove how great this personal pick is - and they all just happen to be playing now.
So please consider my support for Kareem really a case for the guys who came before...
In regards to your statements above, I definitely think rules changes have turned the game into a more guard oriented game. There is little doubt of that. However, I disagree with the idea that less defense is being played now, at least in terms of the NBA. I don't watch enough NFL these days to comment on the state of defense in that league. The type of defense being played now is different than that of the preceding eras in the NBA, but the level of intensity on defense is at an all time high.
@doubledragon said:
I have absolutely no doubt in my mind, that if Jordan hadn't left the game for the 94 and 95 seasons, the Bulls would have won 8 straight NBA championships.
Had a Bulls-Rockets Finals taken place that might have arguably been Chicago's toughest Finals matchup yet having to face a center like Hakeem Olajuwon in his prime. Looking at all of the Finals teams they beat there was only one team that had a better than average center,The Lakers with Kareem but he was literally at the end of his career. This would have been before Rodman arrived and Hakeem would have destroyed the Luc Longley/Bill Wennington/Will Perdue matchups.
It would have been a pretty entertaining series to say the least.
I don't think Kareem played MJ in any Finals. He had retired by then. I believe Vlade Divac was the C for the LAL in the Bulls Lakers Finals.
Steve, you are correct. He was actually retired a few years by the time the Bulls finally won.
He was an MVP, champion and Hall of Famer before ever playing a game for the Lakers.
I don't doubt that one bit, but the discussion is about who is the GOAT? So if Jabbar isn't even the greatest Laker of all-time, then how could he be the greatest NBA player of all-time?
He was an MVP, champion and Hall of Famer before ever playing a game for the Lakers.
I don't doubt that one bit, but the discussion is about who is the GOAT? So if Jabbar isn't even the greatest Laker of all-time, then how could he be the greatest NBA player of all-time?
Similarly, Babe Ruth wasn't the greatest Boston Brave of all time.
Comments
Ask Magic and Bird who the GOAT is. They'll both tell you. Michael Jordan.
Both of those guys would privately answer themselves and publicly say whomever it is they’re honoring in the documentary or at the dinner.
Kareem, Wilt, Russell, Michael, the other guy - whoever
(Maybe you wouldn’t get Bird to say Kareem; I think they really hated each other.)
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Everybody has their own opinion, and mine is Jordan. I have to admit, this thread has been a lot of fun. It has brought back a lot of memories of the NBA's good ol' days.
Mine is Jordan. The man was a killer. Couldn't stand him winning, but the best I've seen.
I didn't see Kareem in his prime, but have to believe he deserves more credit. His accomplishments are remarkable and the fact that they changed the rules because of him says a lot. Six MVPs in a ten year period is amazing. I can see a valid argument for Kareem.
Agreed - no personal insults, fun info, great gifs and a few laughs.
SEGA!
Curious about the rare, mysterious and beautiful 1951 Wheaties Premium Photos?
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/987963/1951-wheaties-premium-photos-set-registry#latest
Yup,I'm in Mass. It was weird because they had those packs for at least a couple years but never sold any 87 Fleer basketball. They did eventually sell 88 packs but I never got to collect 87 until years after they were out.
I'm with you on the if we only knew,i traded my friend that got me into collecting all of my hockey,mostly 86-88ish Topps for all of his Fleer basketball and his 85 Star Lite All Star set. I sold or traded off too much but luckily held on to those two for sentimental reasons.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
I had a few year stretch where I was to cheap to go buy the new yearly updated version of NBA Live so I would manually create the drafted players and move all of free agents & traded players to their new teams. If I remember right I did this for three straight years lol. Sega was the best and yes I had way to much time on my hands.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
I have to show a Darryl Dawkins shatter dunk.
If I remember correctly, one of the years you could ‘Create a Player’ and there was a ‘hack’ that if you put in about 15-20 different Legends (and spelled their names right) it would load the correct info of the player automatically.
Jordan, Bird, Magic, Russell, West, Kareem, Wilt, etc
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Shaq.
I was there that night.
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NBA Jam. Sega Genesis.
I didn't know about the hack but i was using the "Create A Player" for my draft picks lol.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Dontavious Smith.
Vince Carter's famous dunk over 7' 2" Frederic Weis at the Sydney Olympics.
Never seen that. It might be the greatest dunk ever. What is better than a guy jumping over a 7'2" center?
Impressive in a different way?
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Anyone's highlight's can make them look like GOAT. Look at high school recruiting videos!!
I don't think Kareem played MJ in any Finals. He had retired by then. I believe Vlade Divac was the C for the LAL in the Bulls Lakers Finals.
In regards to your statements above, I definitely think rules changes have turned the game into a more guard oriented game. There is little doubt of that. However, I disagree with the idea that less defense is being played now, at least in terms of the NBA. I don't watch enough NFL these days to comment on the state of defense in that league. The type of defense being played now is different than that of the preceding eras in the NBA, but the level of intensity on defense is at an all time high.
Spud Webb. Little 5'7" Spud Webb won the 1986 dunk contest.
A good read...
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theringer.com/platform/amp/nba/2018/10/30/18038802/nba-defense-offensive-boom
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Steve, you are correct. He was actually retired a few years by the time the Bulls finally won.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
what about Chuck Nevitt?
What's better is clocking Kevin Garnett in the face during the celebration of the dunk. LOL
How can Kareem Abdul-Jabbar be the greatest of all-time when he isn't even the greatest Laker of all-time?
@WAXPACKCOLLECTOR
He was an MVP, champion and Hall of Famer before ever playing a game for the Lakers.
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Welcome to the forum
59 minutes. Props....
Kris
My 1971 Topps adventure - Davis Men in Black
going to be looking for one this year at the national....maybe will find something, but not looking for anything below an "8"
I don't doubt that one bit, but the discussion is about who is the GOAT? So if Jabbar isn't even the greatest Laker of all-time, then how could he be the greatest NBA player of all-time?
I appreciate that Boss.
I thought the discussion from the OP was how are Michael Jordan cards holding up? I would say just fine...
Similarly, Babe Ruth wasn't the greatest Boston Brave of all time.
No one flew like Air Jordan.
We have lift off.
Such a thing of beauty.
How can you defend it?
More passing skills.
The Pass to Pippen.
Just look at them eyes. Intense gaze.
Toying with his opponent.
Just tell me, how can you defend this?
The defense.
Defend this. I'd just like to see you try.
The iconic pictures.
You take such great pictures, your airness.
This will not be popular. But.
That’s a travel. He did this a lot.
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All-star game fade away.
Turn around fade away over Kobe.