"Black Beauty" Peace $ ????
Ive seen and owned a couple of black toned Morgans (usually just one sided) but in 20 years I have never seen a black toned MS Peace $... it has almost become the holy grail of my collection now... I have one darkly toned Peace $ that has some color along with the dark/black toning but not one where the entire obverse or reverse is toned black on top of nice luster...
Has anyone ever seen one ?
Comments
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Hold some over a bit of burning sulfur - that will create all the black sulfide tarnish you could want. It will also ruin the coin since the tarnish can never be completely removed and "conservation" will always leave a residue.
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I owned one- neat coin. Wish I had kept it! Called it, "Black Betty" back in the day. (PCGS MS60)
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Have not seen one
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@RogerB said:
Hold some over a bit of burning sulfur - that will create all the black sulfide tarnish you could want. It will also ruin the coin since the tarnish can never be completely removed and "conservation" will always leave a residue.Also, open a window.
Try this with a 22P for your best chance of maintaining the illusion of remaining underlying lustre.
If you can stop at one coin it'll be cheaper than a psychotherapeutic intervention."People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." - Geo. Orwell3 -
Do not recall seeing one here
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I just saw 3- Peace $'s not my cup of tea.
Hoard the keys.1 -
graders are thrown for a loop here n there....a black beauty peace buck
yup
this will be such a casehere's mine from a black leather coin purse with neon toning on some areas
pcgs called it enviro damage...trueview was a tad dark too which hide the colors
this trueview is lightened a tad
enjoy if ya do
everything in life is but merely on loan to us by our appreciation....lose your appreciation and see7 -
@lasvegasteddy said:
graders are thrown for a loop here n there....a black beauty peace buck
yup
this will be such a casehere's mine from a black leather coin purse with neon toning on some areas
pcgs called it enviro damage...trueview was a tad dark too which hide the colors
this trueview is lightened a tad
enjoy if ya doIts a nice coin but its not what I mean when I say "Black Beauty" as in Morgan "Black Beauty" -- the entire obverse/reverse is monochromatic black with luster underneath the toning...
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Wow...great looking coin.
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Black is normally the terminal phase of tarnish on silver.... unless it is not tarnish, but rather a foreign residue. For a full black tarnish on silver, I am not sure any luster would remain, or be visible. Cheers, RickO
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@Type2 said:
I just saw 3- Peace $'s not my cup of tea.It was a joke from another post no where as nice as a "black beauty"
Linky https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/991429/two-made-it-ahhh-one-did-not#latest
Hoard the keys.0 -
In my experience, black beauty refers to coins that have been improperly annealed as oppose to toned coins.
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@ricko said:
Black is normally the terminal phase of tarnish on silver.... unless it is not tarnish, but rather a foreign residue. For a full black tarnish on silver, I am not sure any luster would remain, or be visible. Cheers, RickONot all black toning is the same or terminal... and PCGS, NGC and ANACS all grade
black coins...But I suppose these are as close as I can find on Ebay right now to the type of toning I am talking about...
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Back when I collected toned Peace Dollars a couple of years ago, Joe Kaminsky had one. I seem to recall it being jet black, yet it had at least the appearance of luster beaming through. It was low grade MS in PCGS plastic. I think the asking price was $400 or $500.
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@coinguy1989 said:
@TonerGuyBack when I collected toned Peace Dollars a couple of years ago, Joe Kaminsky had one. I seem to recall it being jet black, yet it had at least the appearance of luster beaming through. It was low grade MS in PCGS plastic. I think the asking price was $400 or $500.
I remember when he was selling off quite of few of his but I dont remember the jet black one - I would have bought it for that price.
Well it took me 20 years to find a rainbow toned MS65 1921 - it might take another 20 to find a jet black one with beaming luster... lol
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@TonerGuy said:
@coinguy1989 said:
@TonerGuyBack when I collected toned Peace Dollars a couple of years ago, Joe Kaminsky had one. I seem to recall it being jet black, yet it had at least the appearance of luster beaming through. It was low grade MS in PCGS plastic. I think the asking price was $400 or $500.
I remember when he was selling off quite of few of his but I dont remember the jet black one - I would have bought it for that price.
Well it took me 20 years to find a rainbow toned MS65 1921 - it might take another 20 to find a jet black one with beaming luster... lol
If I come across one, I’ll PM you a lead.
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Ever see a black beauty gold?
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@coinguy1989 said:
@TonerGuy said:
@coinguy1989 said:
@TonerGuyBack when I collected toned Peace Dollars a couple of years ago, Joe Kaminsky had one. I seem to recall it being jet black, yet it had at least the appearance of luster beaming through. It was low grade MS in PCGS plastic. I think the asking price was $400 or $500.
I remember when he was selling off quite of few of his but I dont remember the jet black one - I would have bought it for that price.
Well it took me 20 years to find a rainbow toned MS65 1921 - it might take another 20 to find a jet black one with beaming luster... lol
If I come across one, I’ll PM you a lead.
Thank you very much !
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I've been looking for this white whale for a while myself. I haven't seen one in a problem-free holder, yet.
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Oh, how I love dirty, crusty, old gold!
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You guys are not helping with my decision NOT to buy a gun-metal blued Dollar that I have been looking at...repeatedly...over the past few months. My holdback is that the dealer wants quite a bit over market for it.
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Do you have a Morgan example of exactly the look you are talking about? Please post!
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I had a very nice Black Beauty Morgan a few years ago, but I suspect a Peace $ will be extremely hard to find with that kind of toning. Good luck with your hunt. Here is what I think you want, only the entire coin toned.
Trade $'s0 -
@jerseycat101 said:
I've been looking for this white whale for a while myself. I haven't seen one in a problem-free holder, yet.Yep... I finally got my rainbow toned 21 Peace $ after 20 yrs. I knew that one existed since I saw one when I first started. It was owned by a friend and I knew he would never sell it. But as for this type of toning, I never seen any examples, Ive never seen anyone even post an example on any message board. Its like a PL Peace $... I dont think its exists but I will keep looking. Good luck on your hunt as well!
@TennesseeDave said:
I had a very nice Black Beauty Morgan a few years ago, but I suspect a Peace $ will be extremely hard to find with that kind of toning. Good luck with your hunt. Here is what I think you want, only the entire coin toned.Thats one of the Leather Pouch Hoard toned Peace $... they arent black - more blue/purplish...
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@TennesseeDave said:
I had a very nice Black Beauty Morgan a few years ago, but I suspect a Peace $ will be extremely hard to find with that kind of toning. Good luck with your hunt. Here is what I think you want, only the entire coin toned.
Thats one of the Leather Pouch Hoard toned Peace $... they arent black - more blue/purplish...Not only are the Leather Pouch 314 Peace Dollars AT (in my opinion), I also believe they have altered surfaces.
It's a shame these circulate at the prices they do.
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@jerseycat101 said:
@TennesseeDave said:
I had a very nice Black Beauty Morgan a few years ago, but I suspect a Peace $ will be extremely hard to find with that kind of toning. Good luck with your hunt. Here is what I think you want, only the entire coin toned.
Thats one of the Leather Pouch Hoard toned Peace $... they arent black - more blue/purplish...Not only are the Leather Pouch 314 Peace Dollars AT (in my opinion), I also believe they have altered surfaces.
It's a shame these circulate at the prices they do.
I like'em. I have one of the highest graded at NGC MS65* ... Im over the whole AT/NT/QT/MA issue. If someone collects rainbow toned coins - there is a very strong likelihood that a percentage of their coins are not as NT as they would like to believe. The more I learn about toning the more I realize that PCGS, NGC and CAC are clueless about it.
The fact that the Leather Pouch Hoard sell at the prices they do and that the toned Ikes coming out of Utah also sell for nice premiums seems to indicate that its the color and the blessing of PCGS/NGC is all that matters. (and CAC has beaned those Peace $ as well)
Worrying about is this AT or NT just isnt that important to me anymore. Rather its do you think PCGS/NGC will slabbed it and will CAC bean it ? lol
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@ErrorsOnCoins said:
In my experience, black beauty refers to coins that have been improperly annealed as oppose to toned coins.Yes like this.
Hoard the keys.1 -
Will PCGS straight-grade those Jefferson's?
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Even if you don't request or pay for the "mint error" fee of $60 per coin?
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Good luck @TonerGuy; I'm looking for one too. I'd seen a few "black" peace dollars in a silver junk bin a few years ago but they were no beauties. Probably XF at best, and showing no luster. They caught my attention but I threw them back...
Here's my Morgan "Black Beauty," I call her the "Apocalypse..." Not really- lol, but she is my black pearl! Faint textile at 3 o'clock, and I'm quite pleased to own her...can you tell????
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@PocketArt - beautiful... that is exactly what I am talking about and looking for in a Peace $ "Black Beauty"
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I have one.....well, a nephew of mine does. My brother and I were at a show and I pointed it out, how the luster and charcoal toning gave it tremendous eye appeal. We moved to look at more coins at other tables before he disappeared and than reappeared with the coin. He gave it to his son.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
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@leothelyon said:
I have one.....well, a nephew of mine does. My brother and I were at a show and I pointed it out, how the luster and charcoal toning gave it tremendous eye appeal. We moved to look at more coins at other tables before he disappeared and than reappeared with the coin. He gave it to his son.PICTURES REQUIRED!!
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Here's my 1922-D with some reverse black toning.
AU501
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