1936-1964 Rattler Proof set
KindaNewish
Posts: 827 ✭✭✭✭✭
Seeking advice. I am more than halfway done with a set of proofs 36 to 64 in old rattler holders. I was trying for a difficult set, but I think I may have bitten off more than I can chew. I have hit an roadblock, and the ones that I am missing are getting increasingly hard to find. At what point do I give up? Are there any proof LMC in ratters at all? or am I seeking something that does not exist? Is it even possible to complete this set?
1
Comments
You could always look for retro holders for the hard issues.
Wasn't there a retro rattler or only the later ogh?
No retro rattlers. I'm stuck trying to fish in a pool that stopped being stocked 30 years ago.
Some things just no longer exists
I wish you the best of luck
Accomplishing your goal would be a monumental achievement in my eyes.
The proofs from 1950-64 DID exist as I put together that set in the '80s - all brilliant proofs, and mostly bought on Teletrade. (the '50 Franklin in gem was a stopper for a long time). Many of the 36-42 proofs were available - I had several of them but mostly cents and nickels.
Unfortunately, I bit on a promo to reholder to the blue labeled slabs. Wish I had kept them in rattlers with perfect 20-20 hindsight. Who knows how many did the same at some point in the past as rattlers were not in vogue then as they are now.
Good luck.
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
The more things change, they stay the same.
The '50 Frankie is still a stopper.
What are we talking about? 5 coins per year and add a coin or two for silver nickels. Almost 200 coins? Damn, that is lofty.
bob
7 for the 36's (brilliant and satin for the cents and nickles). Type 1 and 2 for the '42 nickles, other than that 5 per year.
Sounds like one heck of a project that will take years to complete (if it ever could be). Good luck and post some photos of your collection.
I have undertaken a similar project and have been working on it since late 1998 when I returned to the hobby as an adult. I am collecting raw Cameo proof and SMS coinage from 1950-1970. It has been a fun project. I posted a thread yesterday with photos of the 1950-1964 proof sets in Capital Holders. The photos are cell phone photos of poor quality, but they show contrasted silver, nickel and copper proof coins.
I put together a set of franklins some years back in proof. I believe I had 2-3 1950's. I sold the entire set and 50+ duplicates to a friend of board member oreville. Perhaps he can help you with those.
@joebb21, your complete collection of franklins inspired me to attempt this set. I just didn't know how difficult it would be.
What is a "rattler?"
I think it is doable but you are definitely a high achiever. Good luck.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
In the very early years of PCGS from 1986-1989, the coin in the holder 'rattled' if you shook it back and forth. Because of this, these early generation encapsulated coins became to be known as 'rattlers'
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
Have more eyes looking to help you - what do you need now?
First generation PCGS holder that looks like the photos below.
Donato
Donato's Complete US Type Set ---- Donato's Dansco 7070 Modified Type Set ---- Donato's Basic U.S. Coin Design Set
Successful transactions: Shrub68 (Jim), MWallace (Mike)
It's a cool idea but most likely impossible to complete. Some common proof coins don't really find their way into holders at all. Now add the Rattler requirement.
Any leads on 1958-1963 proof Lincolns in rattlers would be greatly appreciated.
I used to get all my rattlers regraded.. early proofs. All of mine had color... 1937, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42. If I see anymore I’ll keep in the rattler.
~Midwest Coin Exchange
Vivid_coins
If it was easy it would not be satisfying. Stick with it.
Latin American Collection
Now that is one humongous project.... I am not sure it is even achievable...That being said, I would recommend you go to ALL the major coin shows each year (as well as other smaller shows) and visit all the tables. Leave a want list with dealers and put out the word on the internet sites. Also post your needs on the BST here. Best of luck, Cheers, RickO
Good luck !!!
Wow that is an amazing project... I was told I was crazy when I started putting together a toned MS Peace $ set - impossible, you will never finish it, the coins dont exist - well I did and even have a B set. So dont give up -- the coins are out there and you just have to look harder. You might have to fly to shows all over the country to find them though. You will do it but it might take 20+ yrs... it took me 20 yrs to find a rainbow toned 21 Peace $.... the hunt is everything !!!!
Good luck!
The hunt is most of the "Thrill" good luck and please post some photos.
100% Positive BST transactions
I have the 1942 Proof Cent and nickel 5c in rattler holders. Also have a set of 1953 Carver - Washington Halves as well.
Why don't you post a list of what you need? If I ever come across them, I'll PM you a lead.
This is most of the 42's to 64's, I have a few others ,
And these are my favorites: they were born together (sequential serial numbers) and will always stay as a pair
For the coins in the rattler holders that are already in your collection (and for the coins in rattler holders that you do not have and are currently looking for) do you have a criteria that the coins in the holders must meet (i.e. PF63 or better, no haze, no carbon spots, etc.) or is any coin ok as long as it is in a rattler holder (i.e. you will take a 1950 cent with carbon spots and haze grading PF61 to fill the hole in your collection and then look to upgrade)?
I guess another way to ask is whether the primary factor in your assembling the collection is the quality of the coins in the holders, or the fact that the holder is a rattler?
Also, out of the total number of coins that would make up proof sets from 1936-1964 (do you include major varieties?) how many do you currently have and how many do you have left to go?
I like the look of your collection in the photos, The old style rattler holders have nostaglic appeal.
Thanks. I'm trying to fill the holes now, and when complete (if I can) I will upgrade. And I would gladly take a 1960 cent with carbon spots to fill the hole, but I've never even seen a 1960 Lincoln proof in a rattler yet. I am not even trying for die varieties at this time.
Wouldn't that subject the rims of coins to potential damage over time, from the rattling activity?
You can expand into a few OGH. I know someone else doing a very similar set.
The fun of collecting is the thrill of the hunt! Never Give up!
Not for me. The hunt gets old for me after about a year. Discovering new and different historical facts is great for me. The chase is not much fun, especially when it boils down to auctions with sky high prices.
As for rattle holders, I avoid them. I don't find them attractive, and their size does not fit in with the other PCGS coins I have. I also really dislike the rattle when it occurs.
Six month update:
A kind board member shared with me his September 1989 population report. I learned that this is a 114 coin set (7 coins in 1936, type 1 and type 2 cents and nickles; 6 coins in 1942, type 1 and type 2 nickles; and 6 coins in 1960 Small date and large date cents. cents through halfs in all other years 1937-1941,1950-1959,1961-1964.
All of the proofs at one time existed. There are positive populations for all issues, although some are quite scarce.
Some dates and denominations are plentiful. There were only 848 coins of all years and denominations in PF68, only 74 in proof 69, and none at all in PF70. Of course, this was before CAM and DCAM were recognized, and no other varieties other than the ones noted above were recognized.
I have 80/114. Since my last post on this in December, I have added 8 coins, upgraded 12.
a friend of mine took a long while to complete a similar set, all Rattler short set of Classic Commemoratives.
JMHO, but when you reach a certain point in such an endeavor it turns into not being selective about the coin at all, what matters is the holder it's in. that can result in some sub-par coins.
Maybe augment which OGH for the ones that prove to be impossible. Would still be excessively cool. Good luck! Keep an eye out on the CRO Early Bird if you’re not already
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I recommend a thread on the bst with ALL the coins still needed, bumped monthly.
You might only add a couple a year, but do not give up...
Please feel free to PM me a list of what you need and my eye will be out. I do alot of business in this kind of stuff. Infact 2 days ago I just bought a 40 coin collection of 50s-60s cam/dcam proofs in fattys and ogh, lots of sequential serial numbers, however no rattlers.
I am convinced that 1959 coins don't exist in rattler holders. I have seen 1960-1963 pennies in rattlers. Good luck finding a 1958, you'll need it.
I collect rattlers. PM me a list of what you need, and I'll keep an eye out as I check for rattlers for my sets often.
Hey Ray,
I guess we are in the same club, but I am looking for MS Jeffersons in the rattler holders. I know I have kinda slowed down as these things just don't show up much. That said, I believe you will be more than elated as you get down to needing just a few.
Thanks for the lead you gave me on the 50-D MS64 rattler. I was surprised to be underbidder but maybe more are looking for these than I realize.
Also wanted to share this 1959 PR66 Jefferson in a Doily. At least we are looking for rattlers.
George
My War Nickels https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/nickels/jefferson-nickels-specialty-sets/jefferson-nickels-fs-basic-war-set-circulation-strikes-1942-1945/publishedset/94452
No can do, OGH are just too easy. I could probably fill this set tonight via ebay if I were to stoop to OGH.
But I may have to change (not lower; change) my standards to include doily's if you were to to decide to let that '59 go, George.
Annual update
4 years into this set I'm at 88/114. Since my last update I have added 8 coins and upgraded 6.
Many thanks to @toyz4geo for finding me a missing piece and @csanotes for info.
Here is a link to your registry sets for people wanting to help you
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/member/othersets/68110
Six month update:
It has been a very busy half year for the Rattler Proof Set. Since the last update, I have added 8 new coins and updated 10. The current standings are 96/114.
Among the Newps, I finally finished the beautiful 1937 Proof set with the inclusion of both a mighty fine Buffalo and an elusive Walker rattler.
A fine fellow board member found a cent for me to complete the ridiculously difficult 1962 set. Thank you @ilikemonsters .
maybe you should help us and post a BST thread with what you still need.
That's a really cool and challenging way to put the sets together. They should give you a bonus in the registry just for that!
Good luck finding the last ones you need.
Your welcome Ray! That 1937 Buffalo looks really nice!
I'm back from Baltimore and am going to step away from coins for a few months, so let's do the annual update a few days early.
I'm kind of back to to where I was when I started this thread, missing coins are getting harder and harder to find. Only two newps since the last update and only 7 upgrades. But one of the upgrades is this amazing 1950 5c in PR68
This came to me from board member @badger via Heritage.
This was one that I didn't think I would find an upgrade for, PR68 is the top pop in rattlers for this issue with an original production of only 3.
The set goes in hibernation at 98/114 with 5 top pops
I had a friend that tried the 144-piece commem set, was 3 away when he died. Actually I think he knew he was on his way out and sold the set before he went. He worked on it for a loooonnnnggg time. I think there were some pop 1's in the 3 he was missing and a former board member owned them (I don't remember who).
Six month update.
I added 3 new coins to the set and upgraded only 4. One of the upgrades was the 1961 dime in PR68, a top pop (thanks @Kccoin ). That brings the total past the 100 coin mark, the standings are now at 101/114 with 6 top pops.
Among the newps, I finally got a 1960 proof cent in a rattler. this completes the hardest part of the set. Lincoln Memorial cents are really quite scarce.
According to the Sept 1989 population report the production figures are as follows:
1959 total produced in all grades 21, with a top grade of PR67, pop of 12.
1960 total produced in all grades 25, with 14 designated Small Date (no large date coins carry any designation). Top pop is PR67, a combined total of 5 in both flavors.
1961 total produced in all grades 13, with a top grade of PR67, pop of 1.
1962 total produced in all grades 26, with a top grade of PR69, pop of 1.
1963 total produced in all grades 42, with a top grade of PR68, pop of 10.
1964 total produced in all grades 142, with a top grade of PR69, pop of 21.
As a added bonus I think I'm gonna try to complete the proof LMC rattler set post 1964, I included in the pic the 1968-S (pop all grades, 2). This leaves the only other years of proof LMC I'm missing are the 1970-S (pop 9), the 1974-S (pop 1) and the 1983-S (pop 1). No other years were produced.