A Panama - Pacific Five Piece Coin Box
BillJones
Posts: 34,189 ✭✭✭✭✭
Here is an item that for which I have been searching, off and on, for about five years, a Panama-Pacific coin box that complained the five pieces set. This box and its more famous alternative, the copper frame, were the devices that housed the Panama - Pacific sets. The photo above is courtesy of Stacks' Bowers.
I find this box more interesting than the copper frame because of the back paper, which is a forerunner of the modern Certificate of Authenticity. It provides information about the artists who designed the coins and descriptions of the symbolism on each piece. Here is a close-up of the back paper. This is my photo and unfortunately mediocre, but the item is fragile which limits how much I can fool with to get a picture.
I have a set of these coins although there is virtually a zero chance that any of these coins were once housed in this box. The coins range in grade from MS-64 to one MS-66.
Comments
Very Nice set, hope you find the box.
POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
I have the box. It's in the middle of slabbed coin photo. It's taken me five years to catch up with one.
I missed that, duh...
Beautiful set.
POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
Bill, Am I reading between the lines and that you would like to crack a fill the box?
Well let's get crackin
Seriously, Nice set and congrats on finding one of the original boxes.
Bill, you never fail to amaze! Congrats on acquiring an original box.
Thanks again for sharing your info and your photos with the forum.
.
That is cool!
Sorry, that will happen when pigs fly. (image courtesy Wikipedia.)
Pretty damn cool
That VERY nicely preserved box seems to present an unrelated issue---storage. I assume that the box, in today's market is valued in the $1-3K range. Some people might want to store it in a safe or safety deposit box as a result. Looking at the materials, I think that organics might outgas if the box were stored in close proximity to coins. What is your view?
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
I obviously understand no crack-outs.
But, oh, what a look that'd be, to have them in the display box!
Here's a warning parable for coin collectors...
Crack em!! Put them in the box damn it!
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
crack em out and put them in that pretty box!!! YOLO!!!
I suppose you mean "accompanied" or "complimented"?
The "round" seems outta place with the ATS holder.
An incredible set that I would never be able to put together.
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
or "contained".
You want to know something funny? I think that the round is the best coin in the set, and not just because it's the key. It's a whisper away from one or two more grading points. It's much nicer than the octagonal in fact.
No doubt it is a beauty, as are all of the set, but not in an ATS holder...it's your set...just my opinion.
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
Well CAC liked it.
And I buy the coin, not the holder when it's between the two leading services. Maybe I'll do something when it comes time to sell, but not now.
Really really nice...I always enjoy seeing these coins! Thanks for posting...
I bet one of the techie guys on the forum could photoshop the coins into that box and make it look pretty original.
I have the poor man's version of this set (3 coins)
As previously mentioned the box is delicate. I put mine in one those black leatherette archival museum cases. This fits in my SDB at the bank perfectly. I bought mine years ago so the coins are still raw in the case. I'll probably get them graded when I sell the set.
Love the set and box.
Latin American Collection
Back before slabbing, I never saw one of these sets in boxes like this. I did see several sets in the copper frame. For a while in the '70s the prices were around $17 or $18 thousand. In the late '70s they got up to $28 thousand or so. I never saw one of the double sets until '80s. There were probably less than five of those sold back in 1915.
A great acquisition and complement to the coins.
A great acquisition and complement to the coins.
Well done - I expect Mr. Zerbe would be proud.
Pacific Northwest Numismatic Association
Beautiful set.
- Jim
I never owned either of the coins, but I did have one of the boxes, sold it years ago.
Oops, I do own the half, but none of the gold.
Fantastic set of coins...I have an extra box but did not know you needed one !
I also have the 3 piece box with original coins, bought from an estate in the 1980s... all the coins have lost their "flash" from resting in touch with the velvet lining and exposed to air for 70 years.
Commems and Early Type
Great post...but I have to ask. Why is there no date on the slab for the 50C coin?
CC
You will have to ask our hosts about that one. I bought it years ago from JJ Teaparty.
Certainly not being critical...just the opposite...trying to learn something. Thanks again for the post...stunning.
CC
Very cool artifact Bill, I am always glad to see things like this in the hands of people who truly appreciate them.
Just an amazing set! Each coin in the Pan-Pac set is a thing of beauty.
I could only dream of owning the octagonal one day, but to have all of them and the original box is extraordinary.
Though it is no surprise from our Bill Jones!
Awesome accomplishment, Bill!
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
That is a wonderful set. I came close to buying one years ago. The study of the various sets and their timing of availability for sale is quite interesting. I'll post what I have read an submised later.
Beautiful set, box included. Congrats!
Bill what do the 5 piece boxes go for in average shape?
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Bill-
Do you know hat box was used if you were able to get an early set struck at the expo?
Nice catch...my Pan Pac Half does have the date on the slab insert...although it is a RPM S/S...and a different Generation of holder/insert.
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
Very cool! I remember back in 1974 my dealer buddy had a set in the box for sale. It was way too much money for me.
The range seems to run from a low $800 to $3,000. There is one that is "for sale by the owner" at Heritage now, but it seems like it's sort of beat up. He paid, in round numbers, $800 at auction and wants $1,300. It looks like the back paper has been detached from the box, which for me would be significant negative because that was one of my motivations for buying it.
The copper frame used to sell for as much $12,000, but it's come down because of slabbing.
It is interesting to look at the issue prices and see how they changed over time.
The individual coin prices were as follows:
Half dollar - $1 each or 6 for $5
Gold Dollar - $2
$2.50 gold - $4
$50 gold, either type $100
The three piece half dollar, gold dollar and $2.50 gold set with the case was priced at $7.50
In the beginning the either type of the $50 gold coins was sold for $100 and there are boxes with just one space in them. After a time, and this partly my supposition, the three small coins were added and sold in a box with four spaces with one of the $50 gold pieces for $100. (In words of the late Colonel Sanders of Kentucky Fried Chicken fame, like the chicken wings, the three smaller coins were "just throwed in" to make the customer more likely to buy the big coin.)
The five piece set with the both $50 gold coins was priced at $200. There were double sets with ten coins so that both sides could be displayed in a special copper frame. It would seem logical that those sold for $400, but Anthony Swiatek said in his
Encyclopedia of the Commemorative Coins of the United States that we don't know that for sure because no invoices for those sales have surfaced.
To put the $100 price into context, at the time these coins were sold that represented half to third of the annual income for many Americans. The sale of the of the $50 gold pieces was limited to banks and very wealthy individuals. Therefore it is not surprising that two thirds or more of the original mintage of 1,500 coins for each type of $50 gold was returned to the mint and melted.
The US Census Bureau reported the following in 2015:
So to compare, a slug at $100 could have an issue price from $10,000 to $22,000 if issued today.
How many would be a $10,000 or $22,000 gold coin from the US Mint today?
All I can say is
BEAUTIFUL!
The octagonal gold coin has been a 'dream' coin for me for as long as I can remember... Very impressive set Bill...Cheers, RickO
Need a custom purple velvet box to hold the slabs
If I owned such a set I might try to make one
Thanks for a most interesting thread. I recall seeing the box listed in past auction catalogues.
Yep, amazing set. My dream coins, especially the octagonal.
Gonna get me a $50 Octagonal someday. Some. Day.
The box looks pristine as does the paper.
I wonder if you could find some kind of archival sleeve to protect the fragile paper yet leave it in the box.
Having a compete set of coins is the icing on the cake.
Thanks for showing us.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress