<< <i>Traitor is not too strong, but it wasn't directed at you Jminski, but if you feel you deserve the moniker, so be it. If you are against the US's success, then that's the label you deserve.
If I were to soften "traitor" maybe I could have said you (not you personally Jminski) want the country to become Somalia. None of that horrible government intervention there. >>
The name calling has no place here. Even sleeping on it, you stick to this language? Are the Swedes that opposed the bailout of their auto makers Saab and Volvo traitors to their country? Just because they oppose policy? Did they wish Sweden would become Somalia? What? I would say an apology, now two apologies are warranted. If a person wants to resort to name calling to make their arguments, there are plenty of vile names that I have heard for those that favored the GM bailout as structured.
Treason is an offense where the maximum penalty is death. The minimum if convicted is like 20 years in prison. Literally millions of honorable Americans, many of them veterans that served in combat opposed the GM bailout as it was structured. Is there any calm person advocating prison camps for them? Or worse, mass gas chambers? That is what traitor means, and the weight that word carries. Think before you throw around such strong emotion laced language. Many people opposed the bailout. Many wish it was structured very differently. Perhaps a tiny minority wanted the millions involved with the company thrown out on the street with no recourse, no hope, but differences on policy are often wide.
What is ironic is that one president ago, there were bumper stickers saying "dissent is patriotic." Now that there is a new president, much of the same crowd now views opposition to POLICY as sedition (= treason). Which is it? Can't honest people disagree without the name calling? Why is it patriotism when one side of the aisle disagrees with the president's policy, but sedition when the other side disagrees?
Again, I'd say an apology, now two apologies are warranted. >>
Red Tiger, I had written a shorter, but not nearly as exact and eloquent post as yours above re: the charge of 'traitor' and wholeheartedly agree with all of your salient points. I hit the back button so as NOT TO FEED THE TROLL because I thought EE was just baiting, and was not serious. But to read the followup posts...I am dumbfounded.
Do your best to avoid circular arguments, as it will help you reason better, because better reasoning is often a result of avoiding circular arguments.
<< <i>Well on Nov 2 at 8pm PST we may have a clearer picture of America's chances of success or at least its path. MJ >>
I'd like to think so MJ, but I don't feel it is going to happen. EVERYTHING needs to be cut, they were talking about the mortgage interest deduction on something the other day, and what a dent it would make in the deficit, do you think that would ever get past the banking and real estate lobbyists or appliance and building supply,never mind the countless "hangers on."
Everything has to be on the table and watch the TeaParty crowd grouse if you mention SS, or entitlements. I know a Colonel, retired in 69, died two years ago, his pension was in multiples more than anything he had ever seen while on active duty, yeah, I know inflation, those COLA"s every year were like gold. Did he earn it? Probably, He saw action in WW2, Korea, and Nam, but I think the question has become can the country continue to pay it, and I don't mean to pick on the military, almost any government employee, be they federal, city or state, or teachers union, car maker, it goes on and on. Government employees at one time got decent pensions because the were paid so poorly, but know it's a ride on the gravy train.
I don't believe most of our elected officials are capable of handling the job, whatever side of the political spectrum they inhabit.
I could see continuing to pay pensions for the military in order to attract enough quality career-oriented people. There is really nothing quite like the demands on one's life as you have in the military. And at least when I left the service, the salaries being paid our enlisted personel were a considerable ways from what they could have earn in private industry. On the other hand, I think we can afford to scale back on govt pensions in most other areas. If you want the "gravy train" pension from the military then go ahead and put your 20+ yrs in.
<< <i>Well on Nov 2 at 8pm PST we may have a clearer picture of America's chances of success or at least its path. MJ >>
I'd like to think so MJ, but I don't feel it is going to happen. EVERYTHING needs to be cut, they were talking about the mortgage interest deduction on something the other day, and what a dent it would make in the deficit, do you think that would ever get past the banking and real estate lobbyists or appliance and building supply,never mind the countless "hangers on."
Everything has to be on the table and watch the TeaParty crowd grouse if you mention SS, or entitlements. I know a Colonel, retired in 69, died two years ago, his pension was in multiples more than anything he had ever seen while on active duty, yeah, I know inflation, those COLA"s every year were like gold. Did he earn it? Probably, He saw action in WW2, Korea, and Nam, but I think the question has become can the country continue to pay it, and I don't mean to pick on the military, almost any government employee, be they federal, city or state, or teachers union, car maker, it goes on and on. Government employees at one time got decent pensions because the were paid so poorly, but know it's a ride on the gravy train.
I don't believe most of our elected officials are capable of handling the job, whatever side of the political spectrum they inhabit. >>
I don't think our current governing system is broken. I think are current elected officials are though. Therefore, I hope to see as many new faces as possible elected this time around. Then in two years clean even more out. Knowingly, this will not necessarly solve the problem. However, I know for sure that what we have now is a bobsled ride to hell. Change it or enjoy the ride.
On Nov 2 I would love to send a clear message to our elected officials. A real mandate. Sh!t or get off the pot. MJ
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I am ready for my industry to be labeled CORE so we can have bene's and retirements paid for by taxpayers. As it is, if we analyze the data incorrectly and drill a dry hole, we have to pay for it. Choo-choo where is that gravy train to pay the bill for our misfortune?
<< <i>Well on Nov 2 at 8pm PST we may have a clearer picture of America's chances of success or at least its path. MJ >>
I'd like to think so MJ, but I don't feel it is going to happen. EVERYTHING needs to be cut, they were talking about the mortgage interest deduction on something the other day, and what a dent it would make in the deficit, do you think that would ever get past the banking and real estate lobbyists or appliance and building supply,never mind the countless "hangers on."
Everything has to be on the table and watch the TeaParty crowd grouse if you mention SS, or entitlements. I know a Colonel, retired in 69, died two years ago, his pension was in multiples more than anything he had ever seen while on active duty, yeah, I know inflation, those COLA"s every year were like gold. Did he earn it? Probably, He saw action in WW2, Korea, and Nam, but I think the question has become can the country continue to pay it, and I don't mean to pick on the military, almost any government employee, be they federal, city or state, or teachers union, car maker, it goes on and on. Government employees at one time got decent pensions because the were paid so poorly, but know it's a ride on the gravy train.
I don't believe most of our elected officials are capable of handling the job, whatever side of the political spectrum they inhabit. >>
I don't think our current governing system is broken. I think are current elected officials are though. Therefore, I hope to see as many new faces as possible elected this time around. Then in two years clean even more out. Knowingly, this will not necessarly solve the problem. However, I know for sure that what we have now is a bobsled ride to hell. Change it or enjoy the ride.
On Nov 2 I would love to send a clear message to our elected officials. A real mandate. Sh!t or get off the pot. MJ >>
I haven't entirely written us off MJ, I'm just not too sanguine about the economic future, wouldn't I love to be proven wrong!
Believe me Jerry I'm prepared for the worst and pulling for another Miracle on Ice............. I'm certainly not counting on it. It will be a 20 to 25 year reclaimation preriod at least. MJ
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
<< <i>Believe me Jerry I'm prepared for the worst and pulling for another Miracle on Ice............. I'm certainly not counting on it. It will be a 20 to 25 year reclaimation preriod at least. MJ >>
The market shrugs off yesterday's S&P negative outlook. No follow through in the stock market as if to say it means nothing. S&P statement wasn't "if" but "when." S&P gives the current administration a two-year egg timer. What does it take for the fat lady to start singing?
As per the OP, what I have done since 2008?
1) stopped my 401k contributions and took the equivalent in a monthly PM purchase plan...PMPP. 2) have expanded my garden and in the Fall will increase it by another 1/3 of an acre. 3) have a food storage and rotation plan. 4) save a $100 cash per paycheck. 5) have drinking water via my pool and filtration system. 6) rented out my "granny" house. 7) home-schooled 3 out 4 kids in the past 4 years. That one is tough. 8) refi on primary house @ 3.75%, 15 year.
"have expanded my garden and in the Fall will increase it by another 1/3 of an acre."
Wow, that's a huge graden! What kind of food are you growing for storage? (I easily grow all I need for mid-July through end-Sep, but storage is the real art and science; potatoes and corn meal are pretty easy)
<< <i>"have expanded my garden and in the Fall will increase it by another 1/3 of an acre."
Wow, that's a huge graden! What kind of food are you growing for storage? (I easily grow all I need for mid-July through end-Sep, but storage is the real art and science; potatoes and corn meal are pretty easy) >>
I plan on giving some away. I/we couldn't can and preserve all that. I think it will be a great education for my kids.
I sold my home as I truly believe that here in California, Prop 13
will be massaged to jump the tax rate on many long term owners.
Further it is reasonable to assume that a cap will place on mortgage
interest, charitable contributions with an increase in the trigger for
medical deductions from 7/1/2% to 10% of gross income before you
can take deductions.
The great cooperation between the political parties will both come to
agreement ,that reducing special tax deductions for the working stiff,
are not to be considered tax increases.While the truly wealthy will
pay more, it will not be on the same percentage scale ,as the pounding
delivered to the less fortunate. As for the corporation welfare, I think that
they will be adequately protected by their lobbyists. What it comes down
to is this, the supposed shared sacrifice, will mainly land on the poor and the
middle class. The transfer of wealth from the lesser to the greater will continue
unabated. It is the same old story, we, the don't haves lose ,while they, the haves gain
NEVER WERE SO MANY LED SO BADLY, BY THE ELECTED FEW.
NEVER WAS THE DISPARITY OF WEALTH SO GREAT
NEVER HAVE WE SEEN THE TRAGIC LOSS OF QUALITY JOBS OVERSEAS IN SUCH A GIANT TORRENT.
NEVER HAVE THE PEOPLE HAD LESS FAITH IN THEIR FUTURE, THEN NOW.
NEVER HAS THE LOVE OF COUNTRY BY THE CORPORATIONS AND THE HAVES BEEN SO DIMINISHED BY GREED, AVARICE, DECEIT, MISREPRESENTATION OF THE STOCK HOLDERS, LYING, FRAUD AS WELL AS ACTUAL MISMANAGEMENT THAT IS REWARDED BY HUGE SALARIES AND BONUSES AT THE SAME TIME AS THE WORKING CLASS IS SHOVED INTO UNEMPLOYMENT.
May heaven help us all, in our hour of greatest need.
@ Bear, the transfer of wealth from the middle class to the elite, a virtual elimination of the middle class is called....nah....that could never happen in the US. Right?! History is full of examples where this has worked out "well."
Buy lots of ammunition..it is the only currency that will work.......The whole bartering trade will come back...you are only as good as the knowledge you have to to survive...Why carry metal around when you can carry food and water...and of course my sidearm
Pilgrim Clock and Gift Shop.. Expert clock repair since 1844
<< <i>Buy lots of ammunition..it is the only currency that will work.......The whole bartering trade will come back...you are only as good as the knowledge you have to to survive...Why carry metal around when you can carry food and water...and of course my sidearm >>
Can you "carry around" $50,000 worth of food? I can carry $50K in gold in 1 pocket.
I get the firearm/ammunition part. But lets be serious.....nobody can carry more than 4-5 days worth of food and water on their person. So if I had a firearm....and lets say 1,000 rounds of ammo.....and also enough dry storage food to survive 6 months.... and a hand pump model water purifier....and still have $50,000 left after all of those are in place....then whats the proper next move? Thats right....gold and silver bullion.
<< <i>Buy lots of ammunition..it is the only currency that will work.......The whole bartering trade will come back...you are only as good as the knowledge you have to to survive...Why carry metal around when you can carry food and water...and of course my sidearm >>
Can you "carry around" $50,000 worth of food? I can carry $50K in gold in 1 pocket.
I get the firearm/ammunition part. But lets be serious.....nobody can carry more than 4-5 days worth of food and water on their person. So if I had a firearm....and lets say 1,000 rounds of ammo.....and also enough dry storage food to survive 6 months.... and a hand pump model water purifier....and still have $50,000 left after all of those are in place....then whats the proper next move? Thats right....gold and silver bullion. >>
We seem to talk about what we can "carry" a lot. Where the heck are we going with our beans, bullets and bullion?
<< <i>Buy lots of ammunition..it is the only currency that will work.......The whole bartering trade will come back...you are only as good as the knowledge you have to to survive...Why carry metal around when you can carry food and water...and of course my sidearm >>
Can you "carry around" $50,000 worth of food? I can carry $50K in gold in 1 pocket.
I get the firearm/ammunition part. But lets be serious.....nobody can carry more than 4-5 days worth of food and water on their person. So if I had a firearm....and lets say 1,000 rounds of ammo.....and also enough dry storage food to survive 6 months.... and a hand pump model water purifier....and still have $50,000 left after all of those are in place....then whats the proper next move? Thats right....gold and silver bullion. >>
If there is nothing to buy ...you are going to starve with $50,000 of gold in your pockets
Pilgrim Clock and Gift Shop.. Expert clock repair since 1844
So glad to see there are others here who can smell whats coming ; total collapse of the U.S economy ........
I got me a 65 acre Farm in downstate , am stocking it with enough dehydrated/canned foods for three people for one year . Going to instal a hand pump on the well, and am stocking up on ammo and
the things that hurl them .
Am cleaning out my S.D.B , and buying as much junk silver as I can afford .
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I intend to be looting and robbing all the city folk rocket scientists that are carrying $50,000 worth of gold in their pockets and heading out into the wilderness where they don't have a clue as to how to navigate the terrain or concealment, dragging their wives and kids, and are so out of shape that they'll probably die from cardiac arrest before I even get to them. Alone and without support........................good thinking!
Forum AdministratorPSA & PSA/DNA ForumModerator@collectors.com | p 800.325.1121 | PSAcard.com
I will bring you a 1969 Nolan Ryan PSA 9 as payment for entry into Fort PP...................MJ
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
During the Great Depression life continued. People still went to the movies, drove cars, rode on trains, listened to the radio, rode their bikes, ate, drank, etc, etc,... Seventy-five to eighty percent still had a job albeit at lower wages. Life sucked for many for a long time but those who prepared weathered the storm. Sadly, many didn't make it. But the character of the majority of American's back then had the moxie and guts to fight off the Fascist Nazis, Imperial Japan, and Communists.
"But this time it's different." There's a difference between America in the 1930's and America in the 2010's. Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free. We now have more debt than all the nations in human history added together times infinity (so it seems.) And then we have Joseph-Stalin-lite in the WH with questionable leadership and allegiance. So there is much to be concerned about these days.
How does the entitled half become self-governed, principled, proud of their country, enjoy the blessings of hard work, love their neighbor? That entitled half will always vote for increased taxes, bigger gov't, PC-fairness with no regard to their affects on the country. Debt schmebt. Who cares as long as the opium is administered.
When the money stops this is the group, the entitled half, that I fear the most because they will be co-opted by the "union-types" and other nefarious leaders to be organized to take from those who apparently "have." Witness the "unions" in Madison last month (and that was just about collective bargaining.) Look who was rioting last year in Greece...the gov't class.
Hyper-inflation or Great Depression preparedness is more than protecting one's purchasing power through PM's.
2) No debts. House, cars and credit cards paid off ( I realize that debt freedom isn't possible for many). At least rid yourself of the credit card debts.
3) Personal preparedness; guns and ammo, foodstuffs, etc etc.
4) diversification in businesses. I have used much of my cash to grow multiple companies over the years knowing these times were coming; payroll, insurance, business services etc etc.
5) Lastly, I read books on mysticism and other eastern thought so that I can take my mind off the fact that I am probably going to be caught up in the financial malestrom and probably don't have much of a chance.
<< How will you prepare for the upcoming Hyper-inflation? >>
Over the last three years we put in a garden, did the store room thing, stocking up on raw materials, reclaimed nuts, bolts, wire, rope, lights, pipe, steel, just all the things needed to repair things. rebuilt a couple generators, learned to cook solar, reclaim grey water, buying good electronic parts(looking for inverters, step down transformers, ect), also ammo, meds, pm's in 90%, some fuel but not much. Much of the raw materials were dirt cheap or someones thrash. I'm lucky to have a place to put it. Sure is nice to fix or build without going to Lowe's. e.g. I ebay'd a lot of used but quality tap and dies for next to nothing. Never going to need to buy those new, ever, and those that build know you have to have a good set to build or fix correctly.
Even if the SHTF doesn't happen, which it probably won't. It's still a money saving lifestyle that I enjoy.
<< <i> Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free >>
Renman, where do you come up with this cr*p? You are using the term "feels entitled" in the definition of personality disorder....That's how Fox "News," Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity want to spin "entitlements."
Belief in the special, exceptional nature of entitlement dictates that the patient has a right to life on his own terms...Such narcissistic entitlement plays a central role in borderline pathology, since the borderline sees himself as a special person with special rights and entitlements, such that any frustration of these entitled desires tends to undermine and often shatter the patient's self-esteem (Meissner)
But "entitlements" in the legal sense merely means that someone is "entitled" to something because they have participated in an agreed to contract or law. The the VAST majority of entitlements are EARNED.... Social Security, Medicare, pensions for public employees, unemployment, survivors benefits, military pensions, disability... People PAID INTO the system through direct contributions or salary reduction.
Frank Provasek - PCGS Authorized Dealer, Life Member ANA, Member TNA. www.frankcoins.com
There's a difference between being entitled and "feeling entitled". There's such an undercurrent of "feeling entitled" being created by government giveaway programs that the incentive to work is destroyed when you can be better off by staying home and collecting benefits than you can by going to work at an entry level job. This has been going on for 50 years, so it's nothing new except for the pervasiveness of it. It's not new, but the magnitude is.
There's plenty of "feeling entitled" to go around in all social classes, if you really need to point fingers, but it is every bit as "greedy" to sit on your duff and collect welfare benefits without making an attempt to look for a real job as it is to sit on your duff having lunch with the bridge club collecting social security because you used to work 20 years ago but decided to marry a doc instead. It's unconscionable to collect social security disability if you can do just fine when nobody's looking, or if you collect welfare and live off your parents without going to school or looking for a job.
There's a difference between the type of person who is willing to work and one who is not. Whether it's the chronic unemployed, day labor, entry level, middle management, or upper management - it's true in every case - some people work for a living, and some don't. The ones who actually work feel used by the ones who don't, won't and can't be made to work. There are scammers at every level, and there are workers at every level. Know the difference before you start generalizing about anyone who works and is consequently critical of the non-producers.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
<< <i> Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free >>
Renman, where do you come up with this cr*p? You are using the term "feels entitled" in the definition of personality disorder....That's how Fox "News," Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity want to spin "entitlements."
Belief in the special, exceptional nature of entitlement dictates that the patient has a right to life on his own terms...Such narcissistic entitlement plays a central role in borderline pathology, since the borderline sees himself as a special person with special rights and entitlements, such that any frustration of these entitled desires tends to undermine and often shatter the patient's self-esteem (Meissner)
But "entitlements" in the legal sense merely means that someone is "entitled" to something because they have participated in an agreed to contract or law. The the VAST majority of entitlements are EARNED.... Social Security, Medicare, pensions for public employees, unemployment, survivors benefits, military pensions, disability... People PAID INTO the system through direct contributions or salary reduction. >>
Earned may be too strong a word. For the high majority of people who are or will be receiving social security, medicare, medicaid and other benefits, they paid a lot less into these programs than what they end up receiving over their life time. Yes, they should receive what they have paid in but we all know they receive a lot more. When Republicans discuss entitlements, we are not against them but we have a real problem with how the programs were designed.
They are not self-sustaining. One candidate called social security a ponzi scheme and by definition, that candidate was correct. When more money comes out of an investment than what goes in, you are going to have a big problem unless you make massive changes to how pay-outs are made.
Food stamps, child care, and other benefit programs are paid for by taxes but many of those who receive these benefits have never paid Federal income taxes. They are living off the forced charity of others. The cycle of poverty grows when the incentive has been taken away to work. The lack of education, parenting, and other factors compound these problems.
Whether by design or unintended consequences, politicians have created a huge mess over the last 70 years. Their intent was to help those in need but they never thought it through. You need money and lots of it to make these plans work. At the same time, they created a tax structure that enables half of our workers not to pay Federal taxes. That leaves the other half to have to pay for everything. Even the most socialist politicians know in their heart that if you tax those who are paying into the system too much, you take away incentive and eventually the system as a whole collapses.
So yes, many Americans feel entitled but when you look at the facts, you deserve only what you put in. The next shoe to drop will be on the State and Local level with all of the government employees pension plans. They put in a small percentage of what they hope to receive when they retire. The State and Local governments simply cannot afford to pay these ridiculous amounts. Do these employees feel entitled to these pension pay-outs? Of course they do. Do they really deserve them when they put in X and hope to get 10, 15, or 20 times that during their retirement? I wish my retirement investments would pay out that well.
Businesses and personal budgets work with reality. Government works on promises, smoke, and mirrors. Sadly, too many believe in these promises and do not take the responsibility to prepare for their own future.
American Numismatic Association Governor 2023 to 2025 - My posts reflect my own thoughts and are not those of the ANA.
<< <i> Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free >>
Renman, where do you come up with this cr*p? You are using the term "feels entitled" in the definition of personality disorder....That's how Fox "News," Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity want to spin "entitlements."
///
I didn't just come up with this 'cr*p.' It's an observation over time. It's not unique. The statement was a generalization of where our society stands today, not defining some personality disorder. It's a fact that more are dependent on gov't than ever. It's become generational,...expected...demanded.
I'm not going to repeat Comrade Jmski's explanations on the differences between feeling and being entitled because they're spot on.
<< <i>During the Great Depression life continued. People still went to the movies, drove cars, rode on trains, listened to the radio, rode their bikes, ate, drank, etc, etc,... Seventy-five to eighty percent still had a job albeit at lower wages. Life sucked for many for a long time but those who prepared weathered the storm. Sadly, many didn't make it. But the character of the majority of American's back then had the moxie and guts to fight off the Fascist Nazis, Imperial Japan, and Communists.
"But this time it's different." There's a difference between America in the 1930's and America in the 2010's. Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free. We now have more debt than all the nations in human history added together times infinity (so it seems.) And then we have Joseph-Stalin-lite in the WH with questionable leadership and allegiance. So there is much to be concerned about these days.
How does the entitled half become self-governed, principled, proud of their country, enjoy the blessings of hard work, love their neighbor? That entitled half will always vote for increased taxes, bigger gov't, PC-fairness with no regard to their affects on the country. Debt schmebt. Who cares as long as the opium is administered.
When the money stops this is the group, the entitled half, that I fear the most because they will be co-opted by the "union-types" and other nefarious leaders to be organized to take from those who apparently "have." Witness the "unions" in Madison last month (and that was just about collective bargaining.) Look who was rioting last year in Greece...the gov't class.
Hyper-inflation or Great Depression preparedness is more than protecting one's purchasing power through PM's. >>
You sound like a good individual whom might enjoy keeping up with GB
NumbersUsa, FairUs, Alipac, CapsWeb, and TeamAmericaPac
<< <i>During the Great Depression life continued. People still went to the movies, drove cars, rode on trains, listened to the radio, rode their bikes, ate, drank, etc, etc,... Seventy-five to eighty percent still had a job albeit at lower wages. Life sucked for many for a long time but those who prepared weathered the storm. Sadly, many didn't make it. But the character of the majority of American's back then had the moxie and guts to fight off the Fascist Nazis, Imperial Japan, and Communists.
"But this time it's different." There's a difference between America in the 1930's and America in the 2010's. Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free. We now have more debt than all the nations in human history added together times infinity (so it seems.) And then we have Joseph-Stalin-lite in the WH with questionable leadership and allegiance. So there is much to be concerned about these days.
How does the entitled half become self-governed, principled, proud of their country, enjoy the blessings of hard work, love their neighbor? That entitled half will always vote for increased taxes, bigger gov't, PC-fairness with no regard to their affects on the country. Debt schmebt. Who cares as long as the opium is administered.
When the money stops this is the group, the entitled half, that I fear the most because they will be co-opted by the "union-types" and other nefarious leaders to be organized to take from those who apparently "have." Witness the "unions" in Madison last month (and that was just about collective bargaining.) Look who was rioting last year in Greece...the gov't class.
Hyper-inflation or Great Depression preparedness is more than protecting one's purchasing power through PM's. >>
You sound like a good individual whom might enjoy keeping up with GB >>
It took a while for him to finally get on board but he's coming along.
Nawwwwwwww...man, don't eat the dog, you're gonna need him because he can hear about a hundred times better than you can and he can smell 'em comin'; just watch the dog and you'll know what's going on around you. Now, cats, that's a different thing but the problem is catching them when they know you're trying to. Recommend a few pair of breeding gerbils or you could just go the easy way and GET SOME CHICKENS.
I've got guns, ammunition, several thousand ounces of silver, farmland keep a good stock of canned food and bottled water on hand and also plenty of toilet paper, soap, etc.
I hope it doesn't happen but it appears that it can happen at any time as the house of cards continue to crumble.
Why does everyone feel the need to pay off their debts? When TSHTF the banks wouldnt be able to foreclose on your house anyway. Same for your credit cards, car loans, ect.
Hyper inflation would make your debts disappear into nothingness.
<< <i>Why does everyone feel the need to pay off their debts? When TSHTF the banks wouldnt be able to foreclose on your house anyway. Same for your credit cards, car loans, ect.
///
Because it's the right thing to do. With debts paid off, no one has that leverage on you no matter what path the economy takes.
<< <i>Why does everyone feel the need to pay off their debts? When TSHTF the banks wouldnt be able to foreclose on your house anyway. Same for your credit cards, car loans, ect.
///
Because it's the right thing to do. With debts paid off, no one has that leverage on you no matter what path the economy takes. >>
Things may get bad, but it's doubtful that the system will crumble into nothingness. Unemployment may skyrocket, inflation may rise 10% a year. If that happens, then one of the best things you could have done is pay off your debts. Paying off debts is a bad idea for hyperinflation, but for every other inflation situation, it is one of the best things you can do.
Paying off debts is a bad idea for hyperinflation, but for every other inflation situation, it is one of the best things you can do.
Sorry, but im not understanding the logic here.
Renman95,
The right thing to do would be to let the debt collapse begin. The ensuing deflation would benefit those who did the right thing all along--reward the savers while punishing those who benefitted from excess.
What will I do? Relax and have some fun. Fortunately we have't listened to any of the "experts" who usually sound pretty smart but don't have 2 nickels to rub together and so we're pretty comfortable and can weather any storm.
Comments
<< <i>
<< <i>Traitor is not too strong, but it wasn't directed at you Jminski, but if you feel you deserve the moniker, so be it. If you are against the US's success, then that's the label you deserve.
If I were to soften "traitor" maybe I could have said you (not you personally Jminski) want the country to become Somalia. None of that horrible government intervention there. >>
The name calling has no place here. Even sleeping on it, you stick to this language? Are the Swedes that opposed the bailout of their auto makers Saab and Volvo traitors to their country? Just because they oppose policy? Did they wish Sweden would become Somalia? What? I would say an apology, now two apologies are warranted. If a person wants to resort to name calling to make their arguments, there are plenty of vile names that I have heard for those that favored the GM bailout as structured.
Treason is an offense where the maximum penalty is death. The minimum if convicted is like 20 years in prison. Literally millions of honorable Americans, many of them veterans that served in combat opposed the GM bailout as it was structured. Is there any calm person advocating prison camps for them? Or worse, mass gas chambers? That is what traitor means, and the weight that word carries. Think before you throw around such strong emotion laced language. Many people opposed the bailout. Many wish it was structured very differently. Perhaps a tiny minority wanted the millions involved with the company thrown out on the street with no recourse, no hope, but differences on policy are often wide.
What is ironic is that one president ago, there were bumper stickers saying "dissent is patriotic." Now that there is a new president, much of the same crowd now views opposition to POLICY as sedition (= treason). Which is it? Can't honest people disagree without the name calling? Why is it patriotism when one side of the aisle disagrees with the president's policy, but sedition when the other side disagrees?
Again, I'd say an apology, now two apologies are warranted. >>
Red Tiger, I had written a shorter, but not nearly as exact and eloquent post as yours above re: the charge of 'traitor' and wholeheartedly agree with all of your salient points. I hit the back button so as NOT TO FEED THE TROLL because I thought EE was just baiting, and was not serious. But to read the followup posts...I am dumbfounded.
"A First: Tips sell for negative yield...."
Questions?
<< <i>Well on Nov 2 at 8pm PST we may have a clearer picture of America's chances of success or at least its path. MJ >>
I'd like to think so MJ, but I don't feel it is going to happen. EVERYTHING needs to be cut, they were talking about the mortgage interest deduction on something the other day, and what a dent it would make in the deficit, do you think that would ever get past the banking and real estate lobbyists or appliance and building supply,never mind the countless "hangers on."
Everything has to be on the table and watch the TeaParty crowd grouse if you mention SS, or entitlements. I know a Colonel, retired in 69, died two years ago, his pension was in multiples more than anything he had ever seen while on active duty, yeah, I know inflation, those COLA"s every year were like gold. Did he earn it? Probably, He saw action in WW2, Korea, and Nam, but I think the question has become can the country continue to pay it, and I don't mean to pick on the military, almost any government employee, be they federal, city or state, or teachers union, car maker, it goes on and on. Government employees at one time got decent pensions because the were paid so poorly, but know it's a ride on the gravy train.
I don't believe most of our elected officials are capable of handling the job, whatever side of the political spectrum they inhabit.
roadrunner
<< <i>
<< <i>Well on Nov 2 at 8pm PST we may have a clearer picture of America's chances of success or at least its path. MJ >>
I'd like to think so MJ, but I don't feel it is going to happen. EVERYTHING needs to be cut, they were talking about the mortgage interest deduction on something the other day, and what a dent it would make in the deficit, do you think that would ever get past the banking and real estate lobbyists or appliance and building supply,never mind the countless "hangers on."
Everything has to be on the table and watch the TeaParty crowd grouse if you mention SS, or entitlements. I know a Colonel, retired in 69, died two years ago, his pension was in multiples more than anything he had ever seen while on active duty, yeah, I know inflation, those COLA"s every year were like gold. Did he earn it? Probably, He saw action in WW2, Korea, and Nam, but I think the question has become can the country continue to pay it, and I don't mean to pick on the military, almost any government employee, be they federal, city or state, or teachers union, car maker, it goes on and on. Government employees at one time got decent pensions because the were paid so poorly, but know it's a ride on the gravy train.
I don't believe most of our elected officials are capable of handling the job, whatever side of the political spectrum they inhabit. >>
I don't think our current governing system is broken. I think are current elected officials are though. Therefore, I hope to see as many new faces as possible elected this time around. Then in two years clean even more out. Knowingly, this will not necessarly solve the problem. However, I know for sure that what we have now is a bobsled ride to hell. Change it or enjoy the ride.
On Nov 2 I would love to send a clear message to our elected officials. A real mandate. Sh!t or get off the pot. MJ
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Well on Nov 2 at 8pm PST we may have a clearer picture of America's chances of success or at least its path. MJ >>
I'd like to think so MJ, but I don't feel it is going to happen. EVERYTHING needs to be cut, they were talking about the mortgage interest deduction on something the other day, and what a dent it would make in the deficit, do you think that would ever get past the banking and real estate lobbyists or appliance and building supply,never mind the countless "hangers on."
Everything has to be on the table and watch the TeaParty crowd grouse if you mention SS, or entitlements. I know a Colonel, retired in 69, died two years ago, his pension was in multiples more than anything he had ever seen while on active duty, yeah, I know inflation, those COLA"s every year were like gold. Did he earn it? Probably, He saw action in WW2, Korea, and Nam, but I think the question has become can the country continue to pay it, and I don't mean to pick on the military, almost any government employee, be they federal, city or state, or teachers union, car maker, it goes on and on. Government employees at one time got decent pensions because the were paid so poorly, but know it's a ride on the gravy train.
I don't believe most of our elected officials are capable of handling the job, whatever side of the political spectrum they inhabit. >>
I don't think our current governing system is broken. I think are current elected officials are though. Therefore, I hope to see as many new faces as possible elected this time around. Then in two years clean even more out. Knowingly, this will not necessarly solve the problem. However, I know for sure that what we have now is a bobsled ride to hell. Change it or enjoy the ride.
On Nov 2 I would love to send a clear message to our elected officials. A real mandate. Sh!t or get off the pot. MJ >>
I haven't entirely written us off MJ, I'm just not too sanguine about the economic future, wouldn't I love to be proven wrong!
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
<< <i>Believe me Jerry I'm prepared for the worst and pulling for another Miracle on Ice............
MJ I probably don't have 25 years left.
I wonder which trillion will break the camel's back.
As per the OP, what I have done since 2008?
1) stopped my 401k contributions and took the equivalent in a monthly PM purchase plan...PMPP.
2) have expanded my garden and in the Fall will increase it by another 1/3 of an acre.
3) have a food storage and rotation plan.
4) save a $100 cash per paycheck.
5) have drinking water via my pool and filtration system.
6) rented out my "granny" house.
7) home-schooled 3 out 4 kids in the past 4 years. That one is tough.
8) refi on primary house @ 3.75%, 15 year.
I know there's more to list and do....
"have expanded my garden and in the Fall will increase it by another 1/3 of an acre."
Wow, that's a huge graden! What kind of food are you growing for storage? (I easily grow all I need for mid-July through end-Sep, but storage is the real art and science; potatoes and corn meal are pretty easy)
<< <i>"have expanded my garden and in the Fall will increase it by another 1/3 of an acre."
Wow, that's a huge graden! What kind of food are you growing for storage? (I easily grow all I need for mid-July through end-Sep, but storage is the real art and science; potatoes and corn meal are pretty easy) >>
I plan on giving some away. I/we couldn't can and preserve all that. I think it will be a great education for my kids.
will be massaged to jump the tax rate on many long term owners.
Further it is reasonable to assume that a cap will place on mortgage
interest, charitable contributions with an increase in the trigger for
medical deductions from 7/1/2% to 10% of gross income before you
can take deductions.
The great cooperation between the political parties will both come to
agreement ,that reducing special tax deductions for the working stiff,
are not to be considered tax increases.While the truly wealthy will
pay more, it will not be on the same percentage scale ,as the pounding
delivered to the less fortunate. As for the corporation welfare, I think that
they will be adequately protected by their lobbyists. What it comes down
to is this, the supposed shared sacrifice, will mainly land on the poor and the
middle class. The transfer of wealth from the lesser to the greater will continue
unabated. It is the same old story, we, the don't haves lose ,while they, the haves gain
NEVER WERE SO MANY LED SO BADLY, BY THE ELECTED FEW.
NEVER WAS THE DISPARITY OF WEALTH SO GREAT
NEVER HAVE WE SEEN THE TRAGIC LOSS OF QUALITY JOBS OVERSEAS
IN SUCH A GIANT TORRENT.
NEVER HAVE THE PEOPLE HAD LESS FAITH IN THEIR FUTURE, THEN NOW.
NEVER HAS THE LOVE OF COUNTRY BY THE CORPORATIONS AND THE HAVES
BEEN SO DIMINISHED BY GREED, AVARICE, DECEIT, MISREPRESENTATION OF
THE STOCK HOLDERS, LYING, FRAUD AS WELL AS ACTUAL MISMANAGEMENT
THAT IS REWARDED BY HUGE SALARIES AND BONUSES AT THE SAME TIME AS
THE WORKING CLASS IS SHOVED INTO UNEMPLOYMENT.
May heaven help us all, in our hour of greatest need.
Camelot
Menomonee Falls Wisconsin USA
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistr...dset.aspx?s=68269&ac=1">Musky 1861 Mint Set
<< <i>Buy lots of ammunition..it is the only currency that will work.......The whole bartering trade will come back...you are only as good as the knowledge you have to to survive...Why carry metal around when you can carry food and water...and of course my sidearm >>
Can you "carry around" $50,000 worth of food? I can carry $50K in gold in 1 pocket.
I get the firearm/ammunition part. But lets be serious.....nobody can carry more than 4-5 days worth of food and water on their person. So if I had a firearm....and lets say 1,000 rounds of ammo.....and also enough dry storage food to survive 6 months.... and a hand pump model water purifier....and still have $50,000 left after all of those are in place....then whats the proper next move? Thats right....gold and silver bullion.
<< <i>
<< <i>Buy lots of ammunition..it is the only currency that will work.......The whole bartering trade will come back...you are only as good as the knowledge you have to to survive...Why carry metal around when you can carry food and water...and of course my sidearm >>
Can you "carry around" $50,000 worth of food? I can carry $50K in gold in 1 pocket.
I get the firearm/ammunition part. But lets be serious.....nobody can carry more than 4-5 days worth of food and water on their person. So if I had a firearm....and lets say 1,000 rounds of ammo.....and also enough dry storage food to survive 6 months.... and a hand pump model water purifier....and still have $50,000 left after all of those are in place....then whats the proper next move? Thats right....gold and silver bullion.
We seem to talk about what we can "carry" a lot. Where the heck are we going with our beans, bullets and bullion?
<< <i>
<< <i>Buy lots of ammunition..it is the only currency that will work.......The whole bartering trade will come back...you are only as good as the knowledge you have to to survive...Why carry metal around when you can carry food and water...and of course my sidearm >>
Can you "carry around" $50,000 worth of food? I can carry $50K in gold in 1 pocket.
I get the firearm/ammunition part. But lets be serious.....nobody can carry more than 4-5 days worth of food and water on their person. So if I had a firearm....and lets say 1,000 rounds of ammo.....and also enough dry storage food to survive 6 months.... and a hand pump model water purifier....and still have $50,000 left after all of those are in place....then whats the proper next move? Thats right....gold and silver bullion.
If there is nothing to buy ...you are going to starve with $50,000 of gold in your pockets
Menomonee Falls Wisconsin USA
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistr...dset.aspx?s=68269&ac=1">Musky 1861 Mint Set
–John Adams, 1826
I got me a 65 acre Farm in downstate , am stocking it with enough dehydrated/canned foods for three people for one year . Going to instal a hand pump on the well, and am stocking up on ammo and
the things that hurl them .
Am cleaning out my S.D.B , and buying as much junk silver as I can afford .
I'm stashing away candles, lighters, aspirin, hydrogen Peroxide and alcohol.....chap stick, etc
Sooner folks realize there will be no electricity,no gas, no food, no way to get medicine - the better
First the Gov will steal all funds in all banks, then pillage the S.D.B's, then evoke Martial Law ;
by then the have nots will be running the streets looking to take whatever they can from the have's .
I'm building a fortress/bunker type building on the farm surrounding my pump house
.......it is not a question of IF ...........but WHEN
Your place ain't nowhere near Baleysville is it?
MJ
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Forum AdministratorPSA & PSA/DNA ForumModerator@collectors.com | p 800.325.1121 | PSAcard.com
<< <i>PawPaul,
Your place ain't nowhere near Baleysville is it?
MJ >>
MJ,
I can tell you it backs up to a huge National Forrest and is so remote -it's classified as being in the middle of nowhere !
i will save a place for you M.J when the sheet hits the fan
and Lordy yes, i get the "off my rocker" stuff from friends , family , and co-workers ever time the subject comes up -
......if i'm wrong , GREAT ............
if i'm right (and a LOT of folks are thinking like me ), then hopefully I'll be around to tell you "I told you so ...."
but wait .........., if you don't plan and prepare- you won't be around for me to say it to
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
it is better to have it and not need than to need it and not have it
Remeber the old BSA motto..."BE PREPARED"
food and water is the only thing you need....I will sell you a snickers bar for $50,000
Menomonee Falls Wisconsin USA
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistr...dset.aspx?s=68269&ac=1">Musky 1861 Mint Set
Your place ain't nowhere near Baleysville is it?
MJ
PawPauland is on the same planet as Baleyville, but on a different plane of conscious reality. The distance between is not measured in miles
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
"But this time it's different."
How does the entitled half become self-governed, principled, proud of their country, enjoy the blessings of hard work, love their neighbor? That entitled half will always vote for increased taxes, bigger gov't, PC-fairness with no regard to their affects on the country. Debt schmebt. Who cares as long as the opium is administered.
When the money stops this is the group, the entitled half, that I fear the most because they will be co-opted by the "union-types" and other nefarious leaders to be organized to take from those who apparently "have." Witness the "unions" in Madison last month (and that was just about collective bargaining.) Look who was rioting last year in Greece...the gov't class.
Hyper-inflation or Great Depression preparedness is more than protecting one's purchasing power through PM's.
2) No debts. House, cars and credit cards paid off ( I realize that debt freedom isn't possible for many). At least rid yourself of the credit card debts.
3) Personal preparedness; guns and ammo, foodstuffs, etc etc.
4) diversification in businesses. I have used much of my cash to grow multiple companies over the years knowing these times were coming; payroll, insurance, business services etc etc.
5) Lastly, I read books on mysticism and other eastern thought so that I can take my mind off the fact that I am probably going to be caught up in the financial malestrom and probably don't have much of a chance.
Tyler
Over the last three years we put in a garden, did the store room thing, stocking up on raw materials, reclaimed nuts, bolts, wire, rope, lights, pipe, steel, just all the things needed to repair things. rebuilt a couple generators, learned to cook solar, reclaim grey water, buying good electronic parts(looking for inverters, step down transformers, ect), also ammo, meds, pm's in 90%, some fuel but not much. Much of the raw materials were dirt cheap or someones thrash. I'm lucky to have a place to put it. Sure is nice to fix or build without going to Lowe's. e.g. I ebay'd a lot of used but quality tap and dies for next to nothing. Never going to need to buy those new, ever, and those that build know you have to have a good set to build or fix correctly.
Even if the SHTF doesn't happen, which it probably won't. It's still a money saving lifestyle that I enjoy.
Very good discussion. Thanks to all.
I put it here for safe keeping.
edited to add: Wow! Gold up $47 to over $1,700 in the last hour.
<< <i> Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free >>
Renman, where do you come up with this cr*p? You are using the term "feels entitled" in the definition of personality disorder....That's how Fox "News," Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity want to spin "entitlements."
Belief in the special, exceptional nature of entitlement dictates that the patient has a right to life on his own terms...Such narcissistic entitlement plays a central role in borderline pathology, since the borderline sees himself as a special person with special rights and entitlements, such that any frustration of these entitled desires tends to undermine and often shatter the patient's self-esteem (Meissner)
But "entitlements" in the legal sense merely means that someone is "entitled" to something because they have participated in an agreed to contract or law. The the VAST majority of entitlements are EARNED.... Social Security, Medicare, pensions for public employees, unemployment, survivors benefits, military pensions, disability... People PAID INTO the system through direct contributions or salary reduction.
There's plenty of "feeling entitled" to go around in all social classes, if you really need to point fingers, but it is every bit as "greedy" to sit on your duff and collect welfare benefits without making an attempt to look for a real job as it is to sit on your duff having lunch with the bridge club collecting social security because you used to work 20 years ago but decided to marry a doc instead. It's unconscionable to collect social security disability if you can do just fine when nobody's looking, or if you collect welfare and live off your parents without going to school or looking for a job.
There's a difference between the type of person who is willing to work and one who is not. Whether it's the chronic unemployed, day labor, entry level, middle management, or upper management - it's true in every case - some people work for a living, and some don't. The ones who actually work feel used by the ones who don't, won't and can't be made to work. There are scammers at every level, and there are workers at every level. Know the difference before you start generalizing about anyone who works and is consequently critical of the non-producers.
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>
<< <i> Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free >>
Renman, where do you come up with this cr*p? You are using the term "feels entitled" in the definition of personality disorder....That's how Fox "News," Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity want to spin "entitlements."
Belief in the special, exceptional nature of entitlement dictates that the patient has a right to life on his own terms...Such narcissistic entitlement plays a central role in borderline pathology, since the borderline sees himself as a special person with special rights and entitlements, such that any frustration of these entitled desires tends to undermine and often shatter the patient's self-esteem (Meissner)
But "entitlements" in the legal sense merely means that someone is "entitled" to something because they have participated in an agreed to contract or law. The the VAST majority of entitlements are EARNED.... Social Security, Medicare, pensions for public employees, unemployment, survivors benefits, military pensions, disability... People PAID INTO the system through direct contributions or salary reduction. >>
Earned may be too strong a word. For the high majority of people who are or will be receiving social security, medicare, medicaid and other benefits, they paid a lot less into these programs than what they end up receiving over their life time. Yes, they should receive what they have paid in but we all know they receive a lot more. When Republicans discuss entitlements, we are not against them but we have a real problem with how the programs were designed.
They are not self-sustaining. One candidate called social security a ponzi scheme and by definition, that candidate was correct. When more money comes out of an investment than what goes in, you are going to have a big problem unless you make massive changes to how pay-outs are made.
Food stamps, child care, and other benefit programs are paid for by taxes but many of those who receive these benefits have never paid Federal income taxes. They are living off the forced charity of others. The cycle of poverty grows when the incentive has been taken away to work. The lack of education, parenting, and other factors compound these problems.
Whether by design or unintended consequences, politicians have created a huge mess over the last 70 years. Their intent was to help those in need but they never thought it through. You need money and lots of it to make these plans work. At the same time, they created a tax structure that enables half of our workers not to pay Federal taxes. That leaves the other half to have to pay for everything. Even the most socialist politicians know in their heart that if you tax those who are paying into the system too much, you take away incentive and eventually the system as a whole collapses.
So yes, many Americans feel entitled but when you look at the facts, you deserve only what you put in. The next shoe to drop will be on the State and Local level with all of the government employees pension plans. They put in a small percentage of what they hope to receive when they retire. The State and Local governments simply cannot afford to pay these ridiculous amounts. Do these employees feel entitled to these pension pay-outs? Of course they do. Do they really deserve them when they put in X and hope to get 10, 15, or 20 times that during their retirement? I wish my retirement investments would pay out that well.
Businesses and personal budgets work with reality. Government works on promises, smoke, and mirrors. Sadly, too many believe in these promises and do not take the responsibility to prepare for their own future.
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<< <i>
<< <i> Today many more are dependent on the gov't than ever. Nearly half the nation feels entitled while the other half is trying to get by. Half want to live in a society that is "fair" and the other half want to live in a society that is free >>
Renman, where do you come up with this cr*p? You are using the term "feels entitled" in the definition of personality disorder....That's how Fox "News," Limbaugh, Beck, Hannity want to spin "entitlements."
///
I didn't just come up with this 'cr*p.' It's an observation over time. It's not unique. The statement was a generalization of where our society stands today, not defining some personality disorder. It's a fact that more are dependent on gov't than ever. It's become generational,...expected...demanded.
I'm not going to repeat Comrade Jmski's explanations on the differences between feeling and being entitled because they're spot on.
Meissner: filtering the 'cr*p'
<< <i>During the Great Depression life continued. People still went to the movies, drove cars, rode on trains, listened to the radio, rode their bikes, ate, drank, etc, etc,... Seventy-five to eighty percent still had a job albeit at lower wages. Life sucked for many for a long time but those who prepared weathered the storm. Sadly, many didn't make it. But the character of the majority of American's back then had the moxie and guts to fight off the Fascist Nazis, Imperial Japan, and Communists.
"But this time it's different."
How does the entitled half become self-governed, principled, proud of their country, enjoy the blessings of hard work, love their neighbor? That entitled half will always vote for increased taxes, bigger gov't, PC-fairness with no regard to their affects on the country. Debt schmebt. Who cares as long as the opium is administered.
When the money stops this is the group, the entitled half, that I fear the most because they will be co-opted by the "union-types" and other nefarious leaders to be organized to take from those who apparently "have." Witness the "unions" in Madison last month (and that was just about collective bargaining.) Look who was rioting last year in Greece...the gov't class.
Hyper-inflation or Great Depression preparedness is more than protecting one's purchasing power through PM's. >>
You sound like a good individual whom might enjoy keeping up with GB
<< <i>
<< <i>During the Great Depression life continued. People still went to the movies, drove cars, rode on trains, listened to the radio, rode their bikes, ate, drank, etc, etc,... Seventy-five to eighty percent still had a job albeit at lower wages. Life sucked for many for a long time but those who prepared weathered the storm. Sadly, many didn't make it. But the character of the majority of American's back then had the moxie and guts to fight off the Fascist Nazis, Imperial Japan, and Communists.
"But this time it's different."
How does the entitled half become self-governed, principled, proud of their country, enjoy the blessings of hard work, love their neighbor? That entitled half will always vote for increased taxes, bigger gov't, PC-fairness with no regard to their affects on the country. Debt schmebt. Who cares as long as the opium is administered.
When the money stops this is the group, the entitled half, that I fear the most because they will be co-opted by the "union-types" and other nefarious leaders to be organized to take from those who apparently "have." Witness the "unions" in Madison last month (and that was just about collective bargaining.) Look who was rioting last year in Greece...the gov't class.
Hyper-inflation or Great Depression preparedness is more than protecting one's purchasing power through PM's. >>
You sound like a good individual whom might enjoy keeping up with GB >>
It took a while for him to finally get on board but he's coming along.
Nawwwwwwww...man, don't eat the dog, you're gonna need him because he can hear about a hundred times better than you can and he can smell 'em comin'; just watch the dog and you'll know what's going on around you. Now, cats, that's a different thing but the problem is catching them when they know you're trying to. Recommend a few pair of breeding gerbils or you could just go the easy way and GET SOME CHICKENS.
I hope it doesn't happen but it appears that it can happen at any time as the house of cards continue to crumble.
Hyper inflation would make your debts disappear into nothingness.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
If bread is a million dollars a loaf, I'm going to need a billion a week for doing my job.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>Why does everyone feel the need to pay off their debts? When TSHTF the banks wouldnt be able to foreclose on your house anyway. Same for your credit cards, car loans, ect.
///
Because it's the right thing to do. With debts paid off, no one has that leverage on you no matter what path the economy takes.
<< <i>
<< <i>Why does everyone feel the need to pay off their debts? When TSHTF the banks wouldnt be able to foreclose on your house anyway. Same for your credit cards, car loans, ect.
///
Because it's the right thing to do. With debts paid off, no one has that leverage on you no matter what path the economy takes. >>
Things may get bad, but it's doubtful that the system will crumble into nothingness. Unemployment may skyrocket, inflation may rise 10% a year. If that happens, then one of the best things you could have done is pay off your debts. Paying off debts is a bad idea for hyperinflation, but for every other inflation situation, it is one of the best things you can do.
>
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Sorry, but im not understanding the logic here.
Renman95,
The right thing to do would be to let the debt collapse begin. The ensuing deflation would benefit those who did the right thing all along--reward the savers while punishing those who benefitted from excess.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
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Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870