“Unfortunately, we have lost faith and confidence in the system of government with which we have been blessed. Today too many Americans support, at least in the early stages, the use of force to spread our message of hope and freedom.”
Tom, We have not lost faith, our ORIGINAL system has slowly and methodically been changed to socialism bordering on communism, and these two forms of government demand being spread by force.
Most people would find it odd that in our first 150 years our country wanted nothing but to be left alone. It was not until the socialists began taking control of the country that our military desires for meddling began!
“Then scrap the whole dang thing and start all over again. Revolution!
Only problem Mr. Bear, is this time the socialists have the numbers while the lovers of liberty are way out numbered.”
This is very true, but the system will, and is in the process, of failing on its own. We will all have to just wait and see what happens when it does. Generally when socialistic systems fail you end up with marshal law and then some form of a dictatorship. Some strong personally types will show up to shut the mouth of the media, the Universities, and those on the dole. It is a nasty business but the panic will have to be controlled.
I believe that voting rights should be tied inextricably to literacy, citizenship and payment of taxes due.
Added: I would also include a comprehension test over the Declaration, the Preamble and the Constitution - but I'd probably be attacked as being discriminatory.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
"I would also include a comprehension test over the Declaration, the Preamble and the Constitution - but I'd probably be attacked as being discriminatory."
Curious that those who apply for citizenship and go through the citizenship program of learning about democracy, a little American history, the role and contents of our constitution, our culture and all the other things they learn in citizenship school are much better aware of what being a citizen is than the 50% of high school children that drop out and go on the dole or end up clogging up our prison systems. It is also intersting that those immigrants that become citizens regard their vote as a sacred individual right as opposed to our "citizens" that vote in racial blocks because some organizer told them how to vote. Democracy was probably evisioned as an imperfect system that none the less operates under a concept of democracy with ample opportunity for interpretation and that is one big reason why we have had a successful run at growing our nearly 250 year old nation.
My parents were the children of immigrants that had come in through New York immigrant processing center; one Greek and one Irish. Until they died, they both held our right to participate in politics as a core responsibility. They voted, they organized, they participated in taking the census every ten years, they were part of the deal. Legal immigrants are the very lifeblood of the U.S. and we have a cornucopia of potential citizens waiting to be part of this country. On the other hand we have a resident, embedded population that couldn't give a crap about anything except getting their check from the government and carping about how poorly they are treated and how their rights are constantly violated while they contribute nothing of substance. It leads one to wonder if maybe those are the people that should be in immigrant dentention centers instead of those that really want to be here. Causes one to wonder.
So here's a Mother's Day thank you to the nation that has nurtured us all. Happy Mother's Day, USA!
My parents were the children of immigrants that had come in through New York immigrant processing center; one Greek and one Irish. Until they died, they both held our right to participate in politics as a core responsibility. They voted, they organized, they participated in taking the census every ten years, they were part of the deal. Legal immigrants are the very lifeblood of the U.S. and we have a cornucopia of potential citizens waiting to be part of this country
Like yourself, my grandparents were immigrants (from Greece), came through Ellis Island, but ended up settling in Toronto Canada and had the same values as your family.
However, I can understand today's apathetic nature when it comes to voting. I actually have not voted in quite a number of years (and I'm referring to Canadian politicians) mainly because of the fact that all politicians can be lumped in the same category.
My wife always gets annoyed at this fact and says it is my duty and responsibility to vote.
My answer to her is 'why bother, since they are all cut from the same cloth"
But this year in your country, I would have been first in line to vote for 'Ron Paul'
and this is exactly my point.
Ron Paul stands for something radically different than all the politicians in the last twenty years and he stands for the Constitution and something worth fighting for. AND WORTH VOTING FOR!!!!!!!!
I'm a Canadian, yet even I can recognize the greatness of his beliefs and the errors of the other politicians.
"Gold is money, and nothing else" (JP Morgan, 1912)
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I actually have not voted in quite a number of years (and I'm referring to Canadian politicians) mainly because of the fact that all politicians can be lumped in the same category."
Yes, I understand how you and a large number of reasonable people choose to not participate, it does seem meaningless but it is not. Borrowing from a quote I like "The world is run by those that show up." By not participating, you give "them" the victory simply by not showing up. In a democracy there are individual rights but the government is run by the concensus of those individuals that do have the rights, particuarly those that have the right to vote. Granted that one person has an individual right but as an individual, it really has little consequence in the decision of the greater body. But, the consensus of the greater body is decided by the nearly inconsequencial individual vote. The rally for this election year get out the vote drive should be...
<< <i>"I would also include a comprehension test over the Declaration, the Preamble and the Constitution - but I'd probably be attacked as being discriminatory."
Curious that those who apply for citizenship and go through the citizenship program of learning about democracy, a little American history, the role and contents of our constitution, our culture and all the other things they learn in citizenship school are much better aware of what being a citizen is than the 50% of high school children that drop out and go on the dole or end up clogging up our prison systems. It is also intersting that those immigrants that become citizens regard their vote as a sacred individual right as opposed to our "citizens" that vote in racial blocks because some organizer told them how to vote. Democracy was probably evisioned as an imperfect system that none the less operates under a concept of democracy with ample opportunity for interpretation and that is one big reason why we have had a successful run at growing our nearly 250 year old nation.
q]
My Wife scored solidly in the Libertarian quadrant when She took the worlds smallest political quiz and she grew up in a communist country.
Has read Paines Common Sense, the Rights of Man, "Mainspring of Human Progress by Henry Grady Weaver, numerous copies of the Freeman by the Foundation for Economic Education, can recite the 13 original States ( how many here can do that ? ) without even a seconds pause, , is pretty well versed in the American Revolution, and absolutely despises socialism , recognizes how it's growing to out of control proportions in this country and also sees the current election as a scam. Just got here for the last election so she has made no comment about it.
MOST Americans support socialism and whine for even more of it. As ignorant as a piece of wood and that's not going to change.
When we went to the naturalization ceremony, I will say that it was quite a moving experience, however, not everyone being naturalized even had to do it in english.
<< <i>My parents were the children of immigrants that had come in through New York immigrant processing center; one Greek and one Irish. Until they died, they both held our right to participate in politics as a core responsibility. They voted, they organized, they participated in taking the census every ten years, they were part of the deal. Legal immigrants are the very lifeblood of the U.S. and we have a cornucopia of potential citizens waiting to be part of this country
Like yourself, my grandparents were immigrants (from Greece), came through Ellis Island, but ended up settling in Toronto Canada and had the same values as your family.
However, I can understand today's apathetic nature when it comes to voting. I actually have not voted in quite a number of years (and I'm referring to Canadian politicians) mainly because of the fact that all politicians can be lumped in the same category.
My wife always gets annoyed at this fact and says it is my duty and responsibility to vote.
My answer to her is 'why bother, since they are all cut from the same cloth"
But this year in your country, I would have been first in line to vote for 'Ron Paul'
and this is exactly my point.
Ron Paul stands for something radically different than all the politicians in the last twenty years and he stands for the Constitution and something worth fighting for. AND WORTH VOTING FOR!!!!!!!!
I'm a Canadian, yet even I can recognize the greatness of his beliefs and the errors of the other politicians. >>
It's a shame more Americans don't recognize that. What's happened here in that regard has crystalized what a scam the entire election has become.
These people would support Stalin if he had a good suit on and could throw a football
Hence, if voting could actually make a change in electing a NON socialist, voting would be then declared illegal.
<< <i>"I would also include a comprehension test over the Declaration, the Preamble and the Constitution - but I'd probably be attacked as being discriminatory."
Curious that those who apply for citizenship and go through the citizenship program of learning about democracy, a little American history, the role and contents of our constitution, our culture and all the other things they learn in citizenship school are much better aware of what being a citizen is than the 50% of high school children that drop out and go on the dole or end up clogging up our prison systems. It is also intersting that those immigrants that become citizens regard their vote as a sacred individual right as opposed to our "citizens" that vote in racial blocks because some organizer told them how to vote. Democracy was probably evisioned as an imperfect system that none the less operates under a concept of democracy with ample opportunity for interpretation and that is one big reason why we have had a successful run at growing our nearly 250 year old nation.
My parents were the children of immigrants that had come in through New York immigrant processing center; one Greek and one Irish. Until they died, they both held our right to participate in politics as a core responsibility. They voted, they organized, they participated in taking the census every ten years, they were part of the deal. Legal immigrants are the very lifeblood of the U.S. and we have a cornucopia of potential citizens waiting to be part of this country. On the other hand we have a resident, embedded population that couldn't give a crap about anything except getting their check from the government and carping about how poorly they are treated and how their rights are constantly violated while they contribute nothing of substance. It leads one to wonder if maybe those are the people that should be in immigrant dentention centers instead of those that really want to be here. Causes one to wonder.
So here's a Mother's Day thank you to the nation that has nurtured us all. Happy Mother's Day, USA! >>
Great post mhammerman.
I went through the naturalization procees with my wife (Poland), and agree your sentiments. She is appauled at the apathy and attitudes of many of our "neighbors". To paraphrase her, if people in Poland are hungry, they work to earn money to buy bread, while in America they stand on the street corner with their hands open.
Unfortunately, too many people have had it too good for too long. If one has never had to suffer, then one knows not what it means to succeed. While we are undeniably a successful society, if we want to continue to grow and prosper, we will need to suffer.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I am hearing that there are grumblings coming from France, Spain, Italy that they are unhappy with monetary constarints placed upon them by their adoption of the Euro. I believe they see their economies faltering and the strong Euro is hurting them and they cant do anything about it.
When a Nation surrenders a portion of its economic freedom to a faceless multi national entity, there is always a heavy price to be paid. Let this Great Republic observe and beware.
<< <i>OT...... is this the longest thread ever on the US coin forum?
By the way, I hope $849 was the bottom for gold. >>
c' mon who's gonna win the Cup this year?
it is the longest because we don't mind putting our hot air in a thread instead of starting a new topic....ie our soapboxes are small in a coin forum.
i think the GLD ETF is responsible for most of the 'problems' with gold and all of the spin off. the worst case scenario for any stock market is for someone to put their $$$ or trade for physical PM, so there are barriers to keep that from happening by supressing the price.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>The dollar continues to slide after the recent rate cut. This chart represents in my opinion wave 4 down, and wave 5 to follow sometime next week. Taking the dollar down to new lows, before any recovery in a long term outlook. >>
Its the dollar Vs YEN
short term you may get a correction, as wave 5 appears to be complete. >>
short term you got your correction, prediction dollar will continue its slide to the yen, in the near future.
may touch 104.40 before it goes down again..
Humblepie
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
What is called a Fibonacci spiral? The eye of Horus, or Elliot wave trading?
Commodities, investing in your future, looking through the past. The sky is the limit, and looking for the secret is easy as (PIE).
With a short list of commodities, gold, silver, platinum, copper, A short list of foods, such as grain, orange juice, wheat, corn, soybeans. Acquire a brief understanding of time, a man called Leonardo Fibonacci, or the study of wave fractions, and patterns. What we begin to see is the past, present, and future emerging.
Even the eye of horus symbolizes a spiral not out of control, but predictable. By breaking an area down to a predetermined fraction Information emerges, and is manifest.
The spiral itself gives us the ability to see past price action, under many different circumstances, Including line charts, and futures of trading real goods, or services.
By looking at a type of line chart we can view, fractions in currency trading, trading real goods,looking at its futures. Look at directional movement, understand price action, add in related data, then set time period. Look at the past, and predict the future.
Typically 5 down, and a 3 up is equal to price direction, and corrections in currency charts, even stock charts apply. In nature we can understand patterns, such as flowers, or a spiral galixy, as having a predictable shape, or fraction to that shape.
Time flows out. When we look back the truth is finally understood. We have moved ahead of the curve in the spiral, and its fractions are then predictable. We have evolved through time.
Humblepie
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
What is called a Fibonacci spiral? The eye of Horus, or Elliot wave trading?
Commodities, investing in your future, looking through the past. The sky is the limit, and looking for the secret is easy as (PIE).
With a short list of commodities, gold, silver, platinum, copper, A short list of foods, such as grain, orange juice, wheat, corn, soybeans. Acquire a brief understanding of time, a man called Leonardo Fibonacci, or the study of wave fractions, and patterns. What we begin to see is the past, present, and future emerging.
Even the eye of horus symbolizes a spiral not out of control, but predictable. By breaking an area down to a predetermined fraction Information emerges, and is manifest.
The spiral itself gives us the ability to see past price action, under many different circumstances, Including line charts, and futures of trading real goods, or services.
By looking at a type of line chart we can view, fractions in currency trading, trading real goods,looking at its futures. Look at directional movement, understand price action, add in related data, then set time period. Look at the past, and predict the future.
Typically 5 down, and a 3 up is equal to price direction, and corrections in currency charts, even stock charts apply. In nature we can understand patterns, such as flowers, or a spiral galixy, as having a predictable shape, or fraction to that shape.
Time flows out. When we look back the truth is finally understood. We have moved ahead of the curve in the spiral, and its fractions are then predictable. We have evolved through time. >>
Great post but there is nothing new under the sun.
Utterance 257.
304a. To say: There is a clamour in heaven.
304b. "We see a new thing," say the primordial gods.
304c. O Ennead, a Horus is in the rays of the sun.
<< <i>short term you got your correction, prediction dollar will continue its slide to the yen, in the near future. may touch 104.40 before it goes down again.. >>
The correction appears to be over, although there is a possibility from here we go higher.
Prediction, I expect a drop from this level..
3 for 3 not to shabby!
Humblepie
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
<< <i>Time flows out. When we look back the truth is finally understood. We have moved ahead of the curve in the spiral, and its fractions are now predictable. We have evolved through time. >>
Great post but there is nothing new under the sun.
<< <i>The quote I use to remember philosophy is, everything has been done under the sun, and will be done again... >>
In fact We are learning more everyday...
Humblepie
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
beyond repair means something entirely different then a few years of rough times and low profits to me... shouldn't the title be: rough times ahead for citi as they try to turn things around?
the title above makes it seem like a collapse is coming very soon which hardly seems to be the case.
beyond repair means something entirely different then a few years of rough times and low profits to me... shouldn't the title be: rough times ahead for citi as they try to turn things around?
the title above makes it seem like a collapse is coming very soon which hardly seems to be the case. >>
That's what many are saying, it's not if but when. I guess we'll see but hope it doesn't happen.
beyond repair means something entirely different then a few years of rough times and low profits to me... shouldn't the title be: rough times ahead for citi as they try to turn things around?
the title above makes it seem like a collapse is coming very soon which hardly seems to be the case. >>
That's what many are saying, it's not if but when. I guess we'll see but hope it doesn't happen. >>
Citigroup was nearly belly up in 1990 but it was saved. The Fed has already shown that they will bail out.
Yes, we are not out of the woods, which may be deeper than we thought, but the Fed--read as YOU--will save us.
We gotta get oil down, or there will be much bigger problems.
Yeah, the banking cartel will save us, right after the oil cartel does. Free market competition won't do anything for you though. Capitalism at its finest... :rolleyes:
“Yeah, the banking cartel will save us, right after the oil cartel does. Free market competition won't do anything for you though. Capitalism at its finest... :rolleyes:”
Crito, We have not had any true Capitalism in this country for a hundred years, it went down the tubes about the time the Federal Government decided that Standard Oil was just to big and gas was to cheap at 5 cents a gallon.
How can Capitalism work when the various governments take all the oil profits and distribute the money to whatever system they are funding this year?
Look at our example of Exxon’s taxation situation above. Exxon sells its oil, and then pays its expenses, and its employees who then send 20 to 30% of their money to the government. Then it pays its taxes, about 35% should be about right, after that, it pays dividends to its shareholders, and they send 20 to 30% of that money again to the Federal government and who knows what to the States for taxes.
After the refining of the oil and the sale of same, the refiner pays its expenses and employees and they all pay taxes, then the refiner sell the gas, pays taxes on its profits, sends out dividends and all the shareholders pay taxes.
Once the gas reaches the pump all the greedy little government entities put all the gas taxes on the final product.
NOW, how much would gas be per gallon if there were none of these taxes? Maybe 50 to 75 cents per gallon.
How much money would be left to invest in future energy projects of all kinds if all these taxes were gone?
The American socialistic system is what has us in these messes, and they are doing the same with the banks. They have to bail out the banks because who do you think buys and sell all these treasuries to cover the debt the government has to borrow to keep this socialistic ponzie scheme going?
Even with all the taxes collected 6 times in every deal there is not enough to fund all this socialism and the system is going down the drain, so BE PREPARED!
"...the system is going down the drain, so BE PREPARED!"
OK, I'll bite; so how do we know when it's actually CTD (circling the drain). No ax to grind here, just looking for what might be the lynch pin for "modifications" to the system. There are a lot of things wrong with how we are doing things now and clearly that will have to change as will the comfortable routines that the dreamers and charge all's have grown comfortable with. Darwinism is still out there, whether you want to believe in it or not.
Socialized medicine? Seems like we have to go there, the medical community has priced themselves well beyond any realistic pay as you go plan so this is a no brainer for the fed govt.; this is truly a nightmare camped out on everyone's pillow.
Banking industry? Let them bleed and regulate the bejezus out of them. Credit unions and community banks may make a resurgence, seems like a logical alternative to getting bent over a table and whipped every time you use your credit card. So, a bank can borrow money from the fed at 2%, give you 3% for savings and charge 21% interest on credit balances...who the heck thought this scenario up and why is it cool with the federal regulators?
Housing market? Leave it alone and let nature take it's course; there will be much bleeding here before the patient can be revived. Remember this for next time. Every one knows that greed kills what...did you think it didn't apply to you? But, how do we know when we're done here?
Federal government taxation? This has to be revised, the tax code is a zoo and we are being taxed at incredible rates on every increment of our lives from cell phones to gasoline to income to interest; everything under the USA sun is taxed to the full amount Federal, State, Local and who ever else can levy tax but only for those that can pay...this isn't going to work much longer. If you're working, you're paying 50% of your AGI in taxes other than the federal tax on your income...Hello, hello, IS THIS THING ON? You're working for the government, whether you realize it or not. It's kind of like flippin' burgers for each other huh? Surely this can't go on much longer.
So, same question...how do we know when this madness is over? How can we transform our system to something a little more rational? Does the answer lie in the federal govt.? Could our state representatives help us out? Do we move to Kuwait? Do we let England take us back? Do we let states succede from the union and form a more perfect union? It's about the money!
“OK, I'll bite; so how do we know when it's actually CTD (circling the drain). No ax to grind here, just looking for what might be the lynch pin for "modifications" to the system. There are a lot of things wrong with how we are doing things now and clearly that will have to change as will the comfortable routines that the dreamers and charge all's have grown comfortable with. Darwinism is still out there, whether you want to believe in it or not.”
MH, It is circling the drain NOW! This does not mean this is the end of the world. All this means is that the America that our Great Forefathers took away from the British and established as a shining example of freedom is now mostly gone. If I had to put a number on it I would say it was 70% gone.
Can you imagine any of the signers of the Declaration of Independence giving over 50 % of their income to Socialists?
Can you imagine any of those same gentlemen putting up with what goes on in our schools today?
Can you imagine any of them putting up with so many IRS and Government regulations that you could fill a thousand books?
Can you imagine them allowing for a Federal reserve system who is allowed to print Trillions of dollars out of thin air.
Can you imagine them being told what they could or could not do with their own property by environmental groups?
Oh my friend the list could go on for many pages, but what is the point. This is a really big toilet bowl so it is going to take some time for all this to collapse, but NOTHING can be done at this point. Total control rests in the hands of the socialists, look at the 3 candidates we are running for President.
You Sir have been posting on this thread for some time and I have read all of your posts. You are a very very smart guy and you already know what to do, and are doing it, JUST KEEP DOING IT!
"Surprisingly, the Labor Department reported that seasonally adjusted energy prices did not rise from March's levels. Though unadjusted gasoline prices were up 5.6% in April from a month earlier, seasonal adjustments made to that estimate resulted in gasoline prices being down 2% on that basis."
"Seasonal adjustments." Niiiiiice. How convenient.
"Surprisingly, the Labor Department reported that seasonally adjusted energy prices did not rise from March's levels. Though unadjusted gasoline prices were up 5.6% in April from a month earlier, seasonal adjustments made to that estimate resulted in gasoline prices being down 2% on that basis."
"Seasonal adjustments." Niiiiiice. How convenient. >>
It's been a long time since I read it and I don't remember the exact details, but that reminds me of the the book "1984".
“When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.” — Benjamin Franklin
My icon IS my coin. It is a gem 1949 FBL Franklin.
<< <i>Did I read that the Euro is complain because strong, and the Dollar is complain because weak?
and back when other currency weak like Yen and Dollar Strong, also complain?
maybe always complain instead of trying to profit from the cyclical behavior of markets? >>
I believe what you are witnessing coming out of the euro zone is called honesty. You see even though the fix is in, the euro zone feels it is unethical to keep ripping off the public, and because the scam is still in its deceptive stage.
The America zone continues there deceptive media practices, wile guilt from the Euro zone has been influencing the government to come clean.
In other words they care more about there people than our government does. They have enjoyed very positive expectations when compared to the U.S. side, and are preparing for the negative effect to hit them very hard. At least the are not trying to say they are not in a recession Like the U.S. has continued to say.
Humblepie
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
Comments
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>"at least he didn't toss the Mayan calendar into his pitch as well."
Hey, Man
Be cool with the Mayan calender, we don't need them after us too. >>
okay then how about the shifting magnetic pole?
How about the slowing resonate frequency of the Earth?
neither of us will be around for that to make any difference
“Unfortunately, we have lost faith and confidence in the system of government with which we have been blessed. Today too many Americans support, at least in the early stages, the use of force to spread our message of hope and freedom.”
Tom,
We have not lost faith, our ORIGINAL system has slowly and methodically been changed to socialism bordering on communism, and these two forms of government demand being spread by force.
Most people would find it odd that in our first 150 years our country wanted nothing but to be left alone. It was not until the socialists began taking control of the country that our military desires for meddling began!
“Then scrap the whole dang thing and start all over again. Revolution!
Only problem Mr. Bear, is this time the socialists have the numbers while the lovers of liberty are way out numbered.”
This is very true, but the system will, and is in the process, of failing on its own. We will all have to just wait and see what happens when it does. Generally when socialistic systems fail you end up with marshal law and then some form of a dictatorship. Some strong personally types will show up to shut the mouth of the media, the Universities, and those on the dole. It is a nasty business but the panic will have to be controlled.
Added: I would also include a comprehension test over the Declaration, the Preamble and the Constitution - but I'd probably be attacked as being discriminatory.
I knew it would happen.
Curious that those who apply for citizenship and go through the citizenship program of learning about democracy, a little American history, the role and contents of our constitution, our culture and all the other things they learn in citizenship school are much better aware of what being a citizen is than the 50% of high school children that drop out and go on the dole or end up clogging up our prison systems. It is also intersting that those immigrants that become citizens regard their vote as a sacred individual right as opposed to our "citizens" that vote in racial blocks because some organizer told them how to vote. Democracy was probably evisioned as an imperfect system that none the less operates under a concept of democracy with ample opportunity for interpretation and that is one big reason why we have had a successful run at growing our nearly 250 year old nation.
My parents were the children of immigrants that had come in through New York immigrant processing center; one Greek and one Irish. Until they died, they both held our right to participate in politics as a core responsibility. They voted, they organized, they participated in taking the census every ten years, they were part of the deal. Legal immigrants are the very lifeblood of the U.S. and we have a cornucopia of potential citizens waiting to be part of this country. On the other hand we have a resident, embedded population that couldn't give a crap about anything except getting their check from the government and carping about how poorly they are treated and how their rights are constantly violated while they contribute nothing of substance. It leads one to wonder if maybe those are the people that should be in immigrant dentention centers instead of those that really want to be here. Causes one to wonder.
So here's a Mother's Day thank you to the nation that has nurtured us all. Happy Mother's Day, USA!
Like yourself, my grandparents were immigrants (from Greece), came through Ellis Island, but ended up settling in Toronto Canada and had the same values as your family.
However, I can understand today's apathetic nature when it comes to voting. I actually have not voted in quite a number of years (and I'm referring to Canadian politicians) mainly because of the fact that all politicians can be lumped in the same category.
My wife always gets annoyed at this fact and says it is my duty and responsibility to vote.
My answer to her is 'why bother, since they are all cut from the same cloth"
But this year in your country, I would have been first in line to vote for 'Ron Paul'
and this is exactly my point.
Ron Paul stands for something radically different than all the politicians in the last twenty years and he stands for the Constitution and something worth fighting for. AND WORTH VOTING FOR!!!!!!!!
I'm a Canadian, yet even I can recognize the greatness of his beliefs and the errors of the other politicians.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
Yes, I understand how you and a large number of reasonable people choose to not participate, it does seem meaningless but it is not. Borrowing from a quote I like "The world is run by those that show up." By not participating, you give "them" the victory simply by not showing up. In a democracy there are individual rights but the government is run by the concensus of those individuals that do have the rights, particuarly those that have the right to vote. Granted that one person has an individual right but as an individual, it really has little consequence in the decision of the greater body. But, the consensus of the greater body is decided by the nearly inconsequencial individual vote. The rally for this election year get out the vote drive should be...
"SHOW UP!"
Edited to add:
<< <i>"I would also include a comprehension test over the Declaration, the Preamble and the Constitution - but I'd probably be attacked as being discriminatory."
Curious that those who apply for citizenship and go through the citizenship program of learning about democracy, a little American history, the role and contents of our constitution, our culture and all the other things they learn in citizenship school are much better aware of what being a citizen is than the 50% of high school children that drop out and go on the dole or end up clogging up our prison systems. It is also intersting that those immigrants that become citizens regard their vote as a sacred individual right as opposed to our "citizens" that vote in racial blocks because some organizer told them how to vote. Democracy was probably evisioned as an imperfect system that none the less operates under a concept of democracy with ample opportunity for interpretation and that is one big reason why we have had a successful run at growing our nearly 250 year old nation.
q]
My Wife scored solidly in the Libertarian quadrant when She took the worlds smallest political quiz and she grew up in a communist country.
Has read Paines Common Sense, the Rights of Man, "Mainspring of Human Progress by Henry Grady Weaver, numerous copies of the Freeman by the Foundation for Economic Education, can recite the 13 original States ( how many here can do that ? ) without even a seconds pause, , is pretty well versed in the American Revolution, and absolutely despises socialism , recognizes how it's growing to out of control proportions in this country and also sees the current election as a scam. Just got here for the last election so she has made no comment about it.
MOST Americans support socialism and whine for even more of it. As ignorant as a piece of wood and that's not going to change.
When we went to the naturalization ceremony, I will say that it was quite a moving experience, however, not everyone being naturalized even had to do it in english.
This place is lost.
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
<< <i>My parents were the children of immigrants that had come in through New York immigrant processing center; one Greek and one Irish. Until they died, they both held our right to participate in politics as a core responsibility. They voted, they organized, they participated in taking the census every ten years, they were part of the deal. Legal immigrants are the very lifeblood of the U.S. and we have a cornucopia of potential citizens waiting to be part of this country
Like yourself, my grandparents were immigrants (from Greece), came through Ellis Island, but ended up settling in Toronto Canada and had the same values as your family.
However, I can understand today's apathetic nature when it comes to voting. I actually have not voted in quite a number of years (and I'm referring to Canadian politicians) mainly because of the fact that all politicians can be lumped in the same category.
My wife always gets annoyed at this fact and says it is my duty and responsibility to vote.
My answer to her is 'why bother, since they are all cut from the same cloth"
But this year in your country, I would have been first in line to vote for 'Ron Paul'
and this is exactly my point.
Ron Paul stands for something radically different than all the politicians in the last twenty years and he stands for the Constitution and something worth fighting for. AND WORTH VOTING FOR!!!!!!!!
I'm a Canadian, yet even I can recognize the greatness of his beliefs and the errors of the other politicians. >>
It's a shame more Americans don't recognize that. What's happened here in that regard has crystalized what a scam the entire election has become.
These people would support Stalin if he had a good suit on and could throw a football
Hence, if voting could actually make a change in electing a NON socialist, voting would be then declared illegal.
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
A young boy enters a barber shop and the barber whispers to his customer, "This is the dumbest kid in the world. Watch while I prove it to you.'
The barber puts a dollar bill in one hand and two quarters in the other, then calls the boy over and asks, 'Which do you want, son?'
The boy takes the quarters and leaves.
'What did I tell you?' said the barber. 'That kid never learns!'
Later, when the customer leaves, he sees the same young boy coming out of the ice cream store.
'Hey, son! May I ask you a question? Why did you take the quarters instead of the dollar bill?'
The boy licked his cone and replied,
'Because the day I take the dollar, the game's over "
Chance favors the prepared mind.
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
<< <i>This Guy Understands Economics!
A young boy enters a barber shop and the barber whispers to his customer, "This is the dumbest kid in the world. Watch while I prove it to you.'
The barber puts a dollar bill in one hand and two quarters in the other, then calls the boy over and asks, 'Which do you want, son?'
The boy takes the quarters and leaves.
'What did I tell you?' said the barber. 'That kid never learns!'
Later, when the customer leaves, he sees the same young boy coming out of the ice cream store.
'Hey, son! May I ask you a question? Why did you take the quarters instead of the dollar bill?'
The boy licked his cone and replied,
'Because the day I take the dollar, the game's over " >>
priceless.....
<< <i>"I would also include a comprehension test over the Declaration, the Preamble and the Constitution - but I'd probably be attacked as being discriminatory."
Curious that those who apply for citizenship and go through the citizenship program of learning about democracy, a little American history, the role and contents of our constitution, our culture and all the other things they learn in citizenship school are much better aware of what being a citizen is than the 50% of high school children that drop out and go on the dole or end up clogging up our prison systems. It is also intersting that those immigrants that become citizens regard their vote as a sacred individual right as opposed to our "citizens" that vote in racial blocks because some organizer told them how to vote. Democracy was probably evisioned as an imperfect system that none the less operates under a concept of democracy with ample opportunity for interpretation and that is one big reason why we have had a successful run at growing our nearly 250 year old nation.
My parents were the children of immigrants that had come in through New York immigrant processing center; one Greek and one Irish. Until they died, they both held our right to participate in politics as a core responsibility. They voted, they organized, they participated in taking the census every ten years, they were part of the deal. Legal immigrants are the very lifeblood of the U.S. and we have a cornucopia of potential citizens waiting to be part of this country. On the other hand we have a resident, embedded population that couldn't give a crap about anything except getting their check from the government and carping about how poorly they are treated and how their rights are constantly violated while they contribute nothing of substance. It leads one to wonder if maybe those are the people that should be in immigrant dentention centers instead of those that really want to be here. Causes one to wonder.
So here's a Mother's Day thank you to the nation that has nurtured us all. Happy Mother's Day, USA! >>
Great post mhammerman.
I went through the naturalization procees with my wife (Poland), and agree your sentiments. She is appauled at the apathy and attitudes of many of our "neighbors". To paraphrase her, if people in Poland are hungry, they work to earn money to buy bread, while in America they stand on the street corner with their hands open.
Unfortunately, too many people have had it too good for too long. If one has never had to suffer, then one knows not what it means to succeed. While we are undeniably a successful society, if we want to continue to grow and prosper, we will need to suffer.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
per person, we can get this unfunded debt thingy off
the Governments books. See how simple things can be.
Camelot
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
greg
www.brunkauctions.com
Ah, the pains of adolescence.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
freedom to a faceless multi national entity, there is
always a heavy price to be paid. Let this Great Republic
observe and beware.
Camelot
At least our money is going for classic cars?
Diamond Covered Mercedes
of Prince Waleed:
Remember this when
gasoline hits $5.00 a gallon.
You paid for this
one.
By the way, I hope $849 was the bottom for gold.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
<< <i>OT...... is this the longest thread ever on the US coin forum?
By the way, I hope $849 was the bottom for gold. >>
c' mon who's gonna win the Cup this year?
it is the longest because we don't mind putting our hot air in a thread instead of starting a new topic....ie our soapboxes are small in a coin forum.
i think the GLD ETF is responsible for most of the 'problems' with gold and all of the spin off. the worst case scenario for any stock market is for someone to put their $$$ or trade for physical PM, so there are barriers to keep that from happening by supressing the price.
<< <i>Just could not resist this one sent by a friend.
At least our money is going for classic cars?
Diamond Covered Mercedes
of Prince Waleed:
Remember this when
gasoline hits $5.00 a gallon.
You paid for this
one.
That is not a "classic" car. That is a "Liberace" car.
PS: I would have put some ruby flames on it if it were mine.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>
<< <i>The dollar continues to slide after the recent rate cut.
This chart represents in my opinion wave 4 down, and wave 5 to follow sometime next week.
Taking the dollar down to new lows, before any recovery in a long term outlook.
Its the dollar Vs YEN
short term you may get a correction, as wave 5 appears to be complete. >>
short term you got your correction, prediction dollar will continue its slide to the yen, in the near future.
may touch 104.40 before it goes down again..
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
.
the spiral
What is called a Fibonacci spiral? The eye of Horus, or
Elliot wave trading?
Commodities, investing in your future, looking through the past.
The sky is the limit, and looking for the secret is easy as (PIE).
With a short list of commodities, gold, silver, platinum, copper,
A short list of foods, such as grain, orange juice, wheat, corn, soybeans.
Acquire a brief understanding of time, a man called Leonardo Fibonacci, or the study of wave fractions, and patterns.
What we begin to see is the past, present, and future emerging.
Even the eye of horus symbolizes a spiral not out of control, but predictable. By breaking an area down to a predetermined fraction Information emerges, and is manifest.
You hold the key.
The spiral itself gives us the ability to see past price action, under many different circumstances, Including line charts, and futures of trading real goods, or services.
By looking at a type of line chart we can view, fractions in currency trading, trading real goods,looking at its futures.
Look at directional movement, understand price action, add in related data, then set time period.
Look at the past, and predict the future.
Typically 5 down, and a 3 up is equal to price direction, and corrections in currency charts, even stock charts apply.
In nature we can understand patterns, such as flowers, or a spiral galixy, as having a predictable shape, or fraction to that shape.
Time flows out.
When we look back the truth is finally understood.
We have moved ahead of the curve in the spiral, and its fractions are then predictable. We have evolved through time.
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
<< <i>A little theory for making predictions.
the spiral
What is called a Fibonacci spiral? The eye of Horus, or
Elliot wave trading?
Commodities, investing in your future, looking through the past.
The sky is the limit, and looking for the secret is easy as (PIE).
With a short list of commodities, gold, silver, platinum, copper,
A short list of foods, such as grain, orange juice, wheat, corn, soybeans.
Acquire a brief understanding of time, a man called Leonardo Fibonacci, or the study of wave fractions, and patterns.
What we begin to see is the past, present, and future emerging.
Even the eye of horus symbolizes a spiral not out of control, but predictable. By breaking an area down to a predetermined fraction Information emerges, and is manifest.
You hold the key.
The spiral itself gives us the ability to see past price action, under many different circumstances, Including line charts, and futures of trading real goods, or services.
By looking at a type of line chart we can view, fractions in currency trading, trading real goods,looking at its futures.
Look at directional movement, understand price action, add in related data, then set time period.
Look at the past, and predict the future.
Typically 5 down, and a 3 up is equal to price direction, and corrections in currency charts, even stock charts apply.
In nature we can understand patterns, such as flowers, or a spiral galixy, as having a predictable shape, or fraction to that shape.
Time flows out.
When we look back the truth is finally understood.
We have moved ahead of the curve in the spiral, and its fractions are then predictable. We have evolved through time. >>
Great post but there is nothing new under the sun.
Utterance 257.
304a. To say: There is a clamour in heaven.
304b. "We see a new thing," say the primordial gods.
304c. O Ennead, a Horus is in the rays of the sun.
304d. The lords of form serve him,
304e. the Two Enneads entire serve him,
Well, not in a very long time anyway.
+1
<< <i>short term you got your correction, prediction dollar will continue its slide to the yen, in the near future.
may touch 104.40 before it goes down again.. >>
The correction appears to be over, although there is a possibility from here we go higher.
Prediction, I expect a drop from this level..
3 for 3 not to shabby!
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
.
<< <i>Time flows out.
When we look back the truth is finally understood.
We have moved ahead of the curve in the spiral, and its fractions are now predictable. We have evolved through time. >>
Great post but there is nothing new under the sun.
<< <i>The quote I use to remember philosophy is, everything has been done under the sun, and will be done again... >>
In fact We are learning more everyday...
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
.
<< <i>CITI IS BEYOND REPAIR >>
beyond repair means something entirely different then a few years of rough times and low profits to me...
shouldn't the title be: rough times ahead for citi as they try to turn things around?
the title above makes it seem like a collapse is coming very soon which hardly seems to be the case.
<< <i>
<< <i>CITI IS BEYOND REPAIR >>
beyond repair means something entirely different then a few years of rough times and low profits to me...
shouldn't the title be: rough times ahead for citi as they try to turn things around?
the title above makes it seem like a collapse is coming very soon which hardly seems to be the case. >>
That's what many are saying, it's not if but when. I guess we'll see but hope it doesn't happen.
NY POST????
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>CITI IS BEYOND REPAIR >>
beyond repair means something entirely different then a few years of rough times and low profits to me...
shouldn't the title be: rough times ahead for citi as they try to turn things around?
the title above makes it seem like a collapse is coming very soon which hardly seems to be the case. >>
That's what many are saying, it's not if but when. I guess we'll see but hope it doesn't happen. >>
Citigroup was nearly belly up in 1990 but it was saved. The Fed has already shown that they will bail out.
Yes, we are not out of the woods, which may be deeper than we thought, but the Fed--read as YOU--will save us.
We gotta get oil down, or there will be much bigger problems.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
France says EURO is 20% overvalued.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
“Yeah, the banking cartel will save us, right after the oil cartel does. Free market competition won't do anything for you though. Capitalism at its finest... :rolleyes:”
Crito,
We have not had any true Capitalism in this country for a hundred years, it went down the tubes about the time the Federal Government decided that Standard Oil was just to big and gas was to cheap at 5 cents a gallon.
How can Capitalism work when the various governments take all the oil profits and distribute the money to whatever system they are funding this year?
Look at our example of Exxon’s taxation situation above. Exxon sells its oil, and then pays its expenses, and its employees who then send 20 to 30% of their money to the government. Then it pays its taxes, about 35% should be about right, after that, it pays dividends to its shareholders, and they send 20 to 30% of that money again to the Federal government and who knows what to the States for taxes.
After the refining of the oil and the sale of same, the refiner pays its expenses and employees and they all pay taxes, then the refiner sell the gas, pays taxes on its profits, sends out dividends and all the shareholders pay taxes.
Once the gas reaches the pump all the greedy little government entities put all the gas taxes on the final product.
NOW, how much would gas be per gallon if there were none of these taxes? Maybe 50 to 75 cents per gallon.
How much money would be left to invest in future energy projects of all kinds if all these taxes were gone?
The American socialistic system is what has us in these messes, and they are doing the same with the banks. They have to bail out the banks because who do you think buys and sell all these treasuries to cover the debt the government has to borrow to keep this socialistic ponzie scheme going?
Even with all the taxes collected 6 times in every deal there is not enough to fund all this socialism and the system is going down the drain, so BE PREPARED!
OK, I'll bite; so how do we know when it's actually CTD (circling the drain). No ax to grind here, just looking for what might be the lynch pin for "modifications" to the system. There are a lot of things wrong with how we are doing things now and clearly that will have to change as will the comfortable routines that the dreamers and charge all's have grown comfortable with. Darwinism is still out there, whether you want to believe in it or not.
Socialized medicine? Seems like we have to go there, the medical community has priced themselves well beyond any realistic pay as you go plan so this is a no brainer for the fed govt.; this is truly a nightmare camped out on everyone's pillow.
Banking industry? Let them bleed and regulate the bejezus out of them. Credit unions and community banks may make a resurgence, seems like a logical alternative to getting bent over a table and whipped every time you use your credit card. So, a bank can borrow money from the fed at 2%, give you 3% for savings and charge 21% interest on credit balances...who the heck thought this scenario up and why is it cool with the federal regulators?
Housing market? Leave it alone and let nature take it's course; there will be much bleeding here before the patient can be revived. Remember this for next time. Every one knows that greed kills what...did you think it didn't apply to you? But, how do we know when we're done here?
Federal government taxation? This has to be revised, the tax code is a zoo and we are being taxed at incredible rates on every increment of our lives from cell phones to gasoline to income to interest; everything under the USA sun is taxed to the full amount Federal, State, Local and who ever else can levy tax but only for those that can pay...this isn't going to work much longer. If you're working, you're paying 50% of your AGI in taxes other than the federal tax on your income...Hello, hello, IS THIS THING ON? You're working for the government, whether you realize it or not. It's kind of like flippin' burgers for each other huh? Surely this can't go on much longer.
So, same question...how do we know when this madness is over? How can we transform our system to something a little more rational? Does the answer lie in the federal govt.? Could our state representatives help us out? Do we move to Kuwait? Do we let England take us back? Do we let states succede from the union and form a more perfect union? It's about the money!
“OK, I'll bite; so how do we know when it's actually CTD (circling the drain). No ax to grind here, just looking for what might be the lynch pin for "modifications" to the system. There are a lot of things wrong with how we are doing things now and clearly that will have to change as will the comfortable routines that the dreamers and charge all's have grown comfortable with. Darwinism is still out there, whether you want to believe in it or not.”
MH,
It is circling the drain NOW! This does not mean this is the end of the world. All this means is that the America that our Great Forefathers took away from the British and established as a shining example of freedom is now mostly gone. If I had to put a number on it I would say it was 70% gone.
Can you imagine any of the signers of the Declaration of Independence giving over 50 % of their income to Socialists?
Can you imagine any of those same gentlemen putting up with what goes on in our schools today?
Can you imagine any of them putting up with so many IRS and Government regulations that you could fill a thousand books?
Can you imagine them allowing for a Federal reserve system who is allowed to print Trillions of dollars out of thin air.
Can you imagine them being told what they could or could not do with their own property by environmental groups?
Oh my friend the list could go on for many pages, but what is the point. This is a really big toilet bowl so it is going to take some time for all this to collapse, but NOTHING can be done at this point. Total control rests in the hands of the socialists, look at the 3 candidates we are running for President.
You Sir have been posting on this thread for some time and I have read all of your posts. You are a very very smart guy and you already know what to do, and are doing it, JUST KEEP DOING IT!
"Surprisingly, the Labor Department reported that seasonally adjusted energy prices did not rise from March's levels. Though unadjusted gasoline prices were up 5.6% in April from a month earlier, seasonal adjustments made to that estimate resulted in gasoline prices being down 2% on that basis."
"Seasonal adjustments." Niiiiiice. How convenient.
and back when other currency weak like Yen and Dollar Strong, also complain?
maybe always complain instead of trying to profit from the cyclical behavior of markets?
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>Inflation? What inflation?
"Surprisingly, the Labor Department reported that seasonally adjusted energy prices did not rise from March's levels. Though unadjusted gasoline prices were up 5.6% in April from a month earlier, seasonal adjustments made to that estimate resulted in gasoline prices being down 2% on that basis."
"Seasonal adjustments." Niiiiiice. How convenient. >>
It's been a long time since I read it and I don't remember the exact details, but that reminds me of the the book "1984".
My icon IS my coin. It is a gem 1949 FBL Franklin.
<< <i>Did I read that the Euro is complain because strong, and the Dollar is complain because weak?
and back when other currency weak like Yen and Dollar Strong, also complain?
maybe always complain instead of trying to profit from the cyclical behavior of markets? >>
I believe what you are witnessing coming out of the euro zone is called honesty.
You see even though the fix is in, the euro zone feels it is unethical to keep ripping off the public, and because the scam is still in its deceptive stage.
The America zone continues there deceptive media practices, wile guilt from the Euro zone has been influencing the government to come clean.
In other words they care more about there people than our government does. They have enjoyed very positive expectations when compared to the U.S. side, and are preparing for the negative effect to hit them very hard. At least the are not trying to say they are not in a recession Like the U.S. has continued to say.
I have found power in the mysteries of thought.
It is always a question of knowing and seeing, and not that of believing.
Our virtues, and our failings are inseparable, like force, and matter. When they separate, man is no more.
.