BNE, I get the impression you haven't had many brushes with our civil legal system. I have testified in court a number of times as a witness re various civil litigation matters involving my clients.
Litigation is very expensive. Most people become lawyers to make money. If you go the contingency route, take on too many cases you don't win and / or don't win big enough, you go broke.
I am not slamming lawyers. It is in my best interest that they make a great deal of money. A number of well-to-do lawyers are clients of mine. If many of them did not make a fair amount of money, as a certified public accountant, my living standard would decline & I probably wouldn't be buying many coins (among other things). I think it is best to be plain-spoken.
"Vou invadir o Nordeste, "Seu cabra da peste, "Sou Mangueira......."
Ratsicles is actually the "brand name" for a frozen-rodent dealer I used to use. You can various sizes FedEx-ed to you anywhere and in bulk they are much more economical than any alternative other than raising them yourself -- which is really messy and more gruesome if you pre-kill them for your reptile. Unless you're into that, then I guess better rats than higher-order animals.
If you want to raise them, my research led me to hamsters. Big litters, fast growth, and, for monitor lizards... no pesky tails for relatively short lizard-gullets to contend with. Female hamsters with littters CANNOT be housed together, however. Makes a cockfight look tame.
Elcontador: I brush with the civil litigation system every day: I've been practicing law in California for thirteen fun-filled years. I have a trial setting conference tomorrow morning!
Tad: Darn! Someone else thought of Ratsicles? All the good ideas are taken!
"The essence of sleight of hand is distraction and misdirection. If smoeone can be convinced that he has, through his own perspicacity, divined your hidden purposes, he will not look further."
I have to say, sounds like you got out lucky. Yes, its frustrating having Mr BS hold your money for threee weeks. But in the end no harm done. I can think of an incident that I was unfortunate enough to have happen to me. The lawyers basically said the same. Essentially, the law works like this....They can do what they want to to you. If you do something though, it might be illegal.
I am just throwing cheese to the rats chewing on the chains of my sanity!
First Place Winner of the 2005 Rampage design contest!
Meos 1, Maybe I was lucky on the $5 indian, but as I have previosly, this is not the whole story. There are other coins involved that I have not gotten into YET. I tried to keep this simple and present only one impropriety, that I can prove with physical evidence. But you are under the impression, that they held my money for a month, and then I got it back. What would your frame of mind be if a dealer you had only known for a month sells you a coin, you send many thousands of dollars, then he calls you and says he cracked out the coin and has already sent it to another grading service. This is the most important coin of your entire collection. The only 68 for the entire series. Even if the coin had existed, would you not be very concerned by what this dealer has done with a coin that should be yours. Would misstrust be forming in your head, and wondering how or why a dealer would do such a thing. By the way, this dealer had many thousands of my cash in his company account, plus he had two proof gold coins of mine, valued at $120,000, that he said he would have no problem selling. Now that he has ELIMINATED a coin that you have already sent the money for, you get extremely nervous of who you are dealing with and wondering if you will actually lose everything he has of yours. Next, you find out the coin he offered to you, never even existed. Try to imagine now what your chances are of ever seeing the small fortune he has of yours, because now you know without a doubt he is a liar, is unethical, and why has he done this. I can speculate now, why, but as I said I want to keep this simple. If you are anything like me, you would have this on your mind most of the day, maybe, even lose some sleep. As I already said these people are just all about money and care nothing about what they do to you. Sorry for the long response, but I have noticed some people think that the only damage here was that some dealer held my money for a month and I got it back. It is not that simple. This thread will be over soon, so I hope some people will realize from this, how a few totally unscrupulous, lying, greedy people, posing as coin dealers are out there, operating without any fear or opposition. I am so grateful now, of my longtime dealers, that are just the opposite of the BS boys. Thanks for all the support and help I have received here. I really appreciate it. Regards, Zerbe,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Paul Taylor
As this story continues to unfold it becomes increasing clear to me that you have done everyone a great service by bringing it to light. The stone has hit the pond now, and the ripples are going to go far and wide. Anybody that has the guts to go down into the basement with a flashlight and shine it on "the thing under the stairs" has my support. (note to self: stop excessive use of metaphor) It's no fun admitting to the world you got involved in a kind of shaky transaction. It takes a little guts to come forward and admit it. But, you do us all a great service by describing the particulars of it. There are a million ways to get skinned in the coin game. And the best defense is just a little experience and being able to learn from the adventures, good and bad, of others. Names are not necessary for this thread to be of major value to us all. And I do believe whoever it was that was involved will feel the heat of it, somewhere, somehow, someday.
Two cents from another attorney. I practiced in Massachusetts for a number of years.
It's illegal in Massachusetts to record a telephone call without all participants' consent. (Merely as an aside, blasphemy is also illegal!)
Massachusets has effective consumer protective legislation. See M.G.L. ch. 93A, particularly sections 2 and 9. Between double and treble damages are authorized for 'knowing and willful' violations. The statute also permits recovery of attorneys fees. Powerful tools in the quest to compel proper commercial behavior.
Comments
BNE, I get the impression you haven't had many brushes with our civil legal system. I have testified in court a number of times as a witness re various civil litigation matters involving my clients.
Litigation is very expensive. Most people become lawyers to make money. If you go the contingency route, take on too many cases you don't win and / or don't win big enough, you go broke.
I am not slamming lawyers. It is in my best interest that they make a great deal of money. A number of well-to-do lawyers are clients of mine. If many of them did not make a fair amount of money, as a certified public accountant, my living standard would decline & I probably wouldn't be buying many coins (among other things). I think it is best to be plain-spoken.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
I actually liked your response about the rats, very thought provoking.
All others,
"king of cash"
TRUTH
If you want to raise them, my research led me to hamsters. Big litters, fast growth, and, for monitor lizards... no pesky tails for relatively short lizard-gullets to contend with. Female hamsters with littters CANNOT be housed together, however. Makes a cockfight look tame.
Have you been out much lately ... from PKOK Ikes to rodents to lizard gizzards ...
I love Ike dollars and all other dollar series !!!
I also love Major Circulation Strike Type Sets, clad Washingtons ('65 to '98) and key date coins !!!!!
If ignorance is bliss, shouldn't we have more happy people ??
edited to add: I looked it up - Westwood Rare Coins call themselves the King of Cash "No. 2" on ads in the buy section of Coin World
Tad: Darn! Someone else thought of Ratsicles? All the good ideas are taken!
William S. Burroughs, Cities of the Red Night
So, now the challenge still remains ....how does the word get out? And the answer is....if you know, tell your friends.
If you don't know, ask your friends.
Bidnez is still bidnez....especially in the coin bidnez.....done largely by word of mouth.
adrian
Some Queens and Jokers too.
peacockcoins
First Place Winner of the 2005 Rampage design contest!
But you are under the impression, that they held my money for a month, and then I got it back. What would your frame of mind be if a dealer you had only known for a month sells you a coin, you send many thousands of dollars, then he calls you and says he cracked out the coin and has already sent it to another grading service. This is the most important coin of your entire collection. The only 68 for the entire series. Even if the coin had existed, would you not be very concerned by what this dealer has done with a coin that should be yours. Would misstrust be forming in your head, and wondering how or why a dealer would do such a thing. By the way, this dealer had many thousands of my cash in his company account, plus he had two proof gold coins of mine, valued at $120,000, that he said he would have no problem selling.
Now that he has ELIMINATED a coin that you have already sent the money for, you get extremely nervous of who you are dealing with and wondering if you will actually lose everything he has of yours.
Next, you find out the coin he offered to you, never even existed. Try to imagine now what your chances are of ever seeing the small fortune he has of yours, because now you know without a doubt he is a liar, is unethical, and why has he done this. I can speculate now, why, but as I said I want to keep this simple. If you are anything like me, you would have this on your mind most of the day, maybe, even lose some sleep. As I already said these people are just all about money and care nothing about what they do to you. Sorry for the long response, but I have noticed some people think that the only damage here was that some dealer held my money for a month and I got it back. It is not that simple.
This thread will be over soon, so I hope some people will realize from this, how a few totally unscrupulous, lying, greedy people, posing as coin dealers are out there, operating without any fear or opposition. I am so grateful now, of my longtime dealers, that are just the opposite of the BS boys.
Thanks for all the support and help I have received here. I really appreciate it. Regards, Zerbe,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Paul Taylor
<< <i>If you want to raise them, my research led me to hamsters. Big litters, fast growth >>
Gerbils are good for that, also. And, if you have extras, you can sell them on street corners in San Francisco.
Russ, NCNE
As this story continues to unfold it becomes increasing clear to me that you have done everyone a great service by bringing it to light.
The stone has hit the pond now, and the ripples are going to go far and wide. Anybody that has the guts to go down into the basement with a flashlight and shine it on "the thing under the stairs" has my support. (note to self: stop excessive use of metaphor)
It's no fun admitting to the world you got involved in a kind of shaky transaction. It takes a little guts to come forward and admit it. But, you do us all a great service by describing the particulars of it. There are a million ways to get skinned in the coin game. And the best defense is just a little experience and being able to learn from the adventures, good and bad, of others.
Names are not necessary for this thread to be of major value to us all. And I do believe whoever it was that was involved will feel the heat of it, somewhere, somehow, someday.
Clankeye
It's illegal in Massachusetts to record a telephone call without all participants' consent. (Merely as an aside, blasphemy is also illegal!)
Massachusets has effective consumer protective legislation. See M.G.L. ch. 93A, particularly sections 2 and 9. Between double and treble damages are authorized for 'knowing and willful' violations. The statute also permits recovery of attorneys fees. Powerful tools in the quest to compel proper commercial behavior.
FYI.
--chris
Tiger trout, Deerfield River, c. 2001.
It was this thread I guess
My posts viewed
since 8/1/6
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Cacheman, I still see your negative site on President Bush. Go Bush..... he is a great man. >>
Cacheman is ANTI-Bush? Ban the piece of shiss!