@Steven59 said:
Dean Wade out for the Cavs tonight, 3 other bench players questionable with various injuries. Could be a game of attrition for the Cavs.
They're missing most of their wings for this game between Wade, Strus, Levert & possibly Okoro, Tatum & Brown should be able to get their points. The same could be said about Mobley & Allen in the paint with no Porzingis for Boston.
@erikthredd said:
That was a great overall game. Get these two fully healthy come playoff time and it will probably be one hell of a series.
Indeed - that would be entertaining. Tonight without Okoro and LeVert. Kinda scary to think though the Cavs only lost by 3 -
Boston wants to hit their threes while taking yours away and basically making opposing teams scores twos, the only problem with that is, with no Porzingis protecting the rim teams are able to score a ton of points in the paint on them.
Boston made 22 threes (66pts) to Cleveland's 10 made threes (30pts) for a 36pt difference in the C's favor,
Cleveland scored 60 in the paint to Boston's 36 which negated most of that differential on the threes. The Cavs made 5 more FTs and that's why it was so close at the end.
That's why so many of the Celtics games have been so close even though we keep hearing about how many more threes that they make than the opposing team that night. Horford is 38, Queta a work in progress and Kornet has had hamstring issues so their paint protection has been pretty subpar this year. On the bright side Tingus Pingus should be back soon.
@Steven59 said:
Jaylon Tyson for the Cavs had 16 points tonight - who the Hell is Jaylon Tyson?
No clue but take those points when you can get them lol, you can never have too many players that can be slipped into the rotation when needed, especially when they're making cheap money.
Nice bounce back win for the Cavs. i just saw that Boston heads to Cleveland on 12/1.
Tough break on De'Anthony Melton going down for the season, when he's healthy he's a really good two way player.
We're less than a month into the season and the number of players getting injured has been pretty staggering. Some of the teams on this list are missing most of/if not all of their starting lineup. https://www.espn.com/nba/injuries
The Pelicans literally have their top 8 players hurt which is pretty crazy.
@galaxy27 said:
i wonder if Philly envisioned having the worst record in the league almost 1/5 of the way after signing George
injuries, drama, what a dumpster fire they are
I heard this comparison recently and I could not agree more, The Sixers are the NBA's version of the Cowboys. Embiid & Dak have both put up great regular season stats but neither player has been able lead their teams into deep playoff runs.
The Process is now in year 12 and all that it's led to is a bunch of second round exits. 🤣
Maybe my recollection is not very good (or maybe it is); but it seems to me that the current NBA has its players missing games (due to injury; Load Management; or other things) at a much higher rate than in decades past.
I started watching pro hoops on TV and in person in the late 1960's and continue to do so today; and my memory is that many, many players from long ago ended up playing all, or almost all, 82 regular season games; with the first team players many times playing almost 40 minutes a game.
It would be interesting to have a long time pro basketball guy (i.e. the recently deceased Alvin Attles for example whom devoted over 60 years to the NBA as a player, coach, etc.) speak to how things were back in the day and how they differ from how things are today.
I listen to a weekly Cedric Maxwell podcast (C's related) and he's talked on this subject quite a bit at times especially with the Embiid situation not to long ago. He mentioned how hard it was for him to just reach 80-81 games at times throughout his career and as he got older it got even harder.
I'm paraphrasing here but he's also mentioned with how high the player's salaries are these days, its understandable that teams need to load manage certain players to ensure that their stars are good to go come playoff time. I don't think that's going to change anytime soon but at least the league made it mandatory that players need to play at least 65 games to be in the running for any end of season awards. The downside to that is these days not many players are incentivized to win those individual awards like they used to. Now, players just need to reach certain criteria over a 3-4 year stretch that will make them eligible for supermax contracts.
Go back 30-40 years ago and players would get a decent sized bonus (relative to their salary) for making the AS team or winning a certain award, now that same bonus, if they're still being used at all, is likely minimal. Just look at the incentive for All Stars winning that game and their lack of motivation, to them that winner's purse in chump change.
speak to how things were back in the day and how they differ from how things are today.
i was a diehard Bulls fan even pre-Jordan. prior to looking up the stats below, i would have said unequivocally that he played in virtually every game. there was no load management bullshit. sure enough, take a look. even played in 82 his final season.
as an aside, i wonder how many people know that he broke his foot in his 2nd season and missed 64 games. i still remember Charles Oakley helping him off the court
IIRC Jordan came back late in that 2nd season and put up his 63pt playoff game in that series where Boston swept them on the way to wining the Finals. I was in the 6th grade at that time and remember literally watching one of the Finals games vs Houston during school hours, my teacher at the time, Mr Stevens, gained legendary status that day for bringing in his portable TV lol.
Christian Braun 7-7 from the field in the Nuggets win. I noticed when I watch Denver on TV they don’t throw the ball to him very often. So he takes advantage when he actually gets a chance to shoot with an excellent percentage.
Braun is 37-61…. 60.7% his last 6 games. From an outside shooter. Too bad they only let him take 10 shots per game.
@Darin said:
Christian Braun 7-7 from the field in the Nuggets win. I noticed when I watch Denver on TV they don’t throw the ball to him very often. So he takes advantage when he actually gets a chance to shoot with an excellent percentage.
Braun is 37-61…. 60.7% his last 6 games. From an outside shooter. Too bad they only let him take 10 shots per game.
I wouldn't read too much into that last part when it comes to the Nuggets offensive pecking order.
Michael Porter Jr is one of the better 3pt shooters historically (currently ranked 22nd all time in 3pt%)
Jamal Murray when healthy is one of the best one on one scorers/closers in the game
and when Jokic isn't calling his own number he's usually looking to feed whoever is open on any given offensive possessions with throwing lobs to Aaron Gordon pretty much being Denver's bread & butter on offense.
Once Kentavious Caldwell-Pope (Denver's starting SG in recent years) signed with Orlando over the offseason it finally opened up a path for Braun to become full time starter and he's made the most of it this season. It also helps that with Aaron Gordon missing about half of their games with an injury it one less option on offense ahead of Braun.
Year three is usually when things start to click for younger players and Braun looks like he's right on schedule. If his shooting percentages stay at this current pace (57/46/77) then Joker & Murray will definitely keep going to him.
Standings-wise, the Nuggets lack of depth has really hurt them so far this season but IMO they still have the best player in basketball in Jokic so they should still be a legit threat come playoff time..
Eric…. Good breakdown of the Nuggets team, thanks! You mentioned their lack of depth and I did notice very little scoring from the bench in the box scores, I think Russell Westbrook is the main scorer off the bench.
Their overall depth but most importantly their wing depth has taken a major hit since winning the Finals two seasons ago. Bruce Brown, Jeff Green, Kentavius Caldwell-Pope & Reggie Jackson were all legit 3&D players but are all gone now and the Nuggets never really replaced their production with veterans choosing rather to keep developing some of their younger players in Braun & Peyton Watson. Westbrook is a very good playmaker off of their bench but their offense is drastically less efficient when Jokic comes off the floor, its going to be interesting to see how it all plays out come playoffs time.
@Steven59 said:
Yikes - Celtics didn't even break a sweat tonight winning by 32.
That was a very entertaining game! Boston tied for the second most points scored in a quarter all time with 51pts (GS&MEM hold record at 55pts.) In that same quarter they tied the record for made threes in a single quarter with 12.
after the first two weeks the G league came out with PER rankings
out of 336 players, Bronny was at #333
the G league. not the NBA. almost DFL.
him leaving college after one completely fruitless season just so he could make a cameo appearance in an NBA game with his dad was just so gross from the get-go. all of the people talking about how great it was that history was being made.......made me sick, quite frankly. i found it disgusting for myriad reasons. him stripping an opportunity from someone more deserving aside, it was the worst possible path the kid's hoops career could have taken. he was a pawn in his dad's jacked up agenda that was dripping with nepotism and now he's probably going to flame out fast because of it
i've reached the point where i feel a little sorry for him
IIRC he also wasn't playing in the Lakers G League team's road games for whatever reasoning, I remember ESPN had an article about a few weeks back.
Now that Dad has had his moment with him in an NBA game, he should just let him develop like any other late 2nd round pick on a G League team and just forget all of these special dispensations because of his father's name.
@Steven59 said:
Cavs 17 - 1 vs Hawks 7 - 11 tonight. One of them 7's are gonna be an 8 after............
If Cleveland wins tonight and Boston beats Chicago on Friday then the Celtics move on into the Knockout round of the In Season Tourney due to owning the tie breaker over Cleveland. I'm not sure if the Cavs still have a chance as the East wild card team after that.
If the Cavs lose to Atlanta or the C's lose to the Bulls, the chances of either team moving on are much more difficult. The Hawks beat Boston so they own the tie breaker there.
I didn't realize that the Hawks & Cavs play tonight and on Friday with the Friday game counting towards the IST not tonight's game which Atlanta just won. My scenarios above are still in play on Friday which works out great for both the C's & Cavs, had tonight counted Atlanta would have owned the tie breakers over both teams.
the NBA is so unpredictably insane because teams jack up 3-balls like it's going out of style. i still say one night a team that's up by 40 is going to eat an L burger because it's just bombs away in every game
from the middle of the 1st quarter on, the 7-11 Atlanta Hawks outscored the 17-1 Cleveland Cavaliers by 30 points tonight and handed them their first home loss (and second overall loss) of the season. wonder who had that on their bingo card?
they shot -- wait for it -- 90 treys between the two of them
serious question for you guys: are you a proponent of this style of play?
i can't stand it. i'd give anything to go back about 40 years and not be privy to any of this. i hardly recognize this sport anymore
WOW! - Really - Cavs up early by 19 and ready to run Atlanta out of the arena then they go to sleep? Show how much backup players are needed to give the starters rest in this league.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
@galaxy27 said:
the NBA is so unpredictably insane because teams jack up 3-balls like it's going out of style. i still say one night a team that's up by 40 is going to eat an L burger because it's just bombs away in every game
from the middle of the 1st quarter on, the 7-11 Atlanta Hawks outscored the 17-1 Cleveland Cavaliers by 30 points tonight and handed them their first home loss (and second overall loss) of the season. wonder who had that on their bingo card?
they shot -- wait for it -- 90 treys between the two of them
serious question for you guys: **are you a proponent of this style of play? **
i can't stand it. i'd give anything to go back about 40 years and not be privy to any of this. i hardly recognize this sport anymore
I have no problem with it but I'm viewing this as a Celtics fan that watches a team that has roughly 8 players that shot above league average from three last season so my view is pretty biased. I haven't checked their percentages this season but the team just got back Porzingis which lifts their offense into cheat code status when he's healthy.
I know that the running joke from fans and the sports media is that Boston just shoots threes all game but that has really been a pretty myopic viewpoint when most of these people aren't watching them on a nightly basis and see that their unselfishness creates so many open looks from three. Likely really wide open attempts and with Porzingis back he'll start dragging opposing bigs out to the three point line which just opens up the paint for everyone else to drive.
I know that you weren't specifically talking about the Celtics here but they seem to be the poster child when it comes to this topic especially when they're on pace to shatter the season records for both three point attempts and makes this season.
I clearly remember what offenses were like back in the 80's (fast paced/high possession track meets) and 90's (drag them out slugfests.) I loved watching those games in the 1980's but I'll take today's game over what we watched in the 90's every single time. Today its all about efficiency and analytics or as C's head coach Joe Mazzulla says "its just a math problem and threes are worth more than twos."
Again, I'm spoiled because I get to watch one of the most talented rosters ever assembled on a nightly basis but if all I got to see was a bunch of average three point shooters continually tossing them up all game my opinion would likely be different. There are a lot of NBA coaches who aren't creative enough with their offensive game planning and the result is just watching his players chuck up threes all night. Alot of that falls on the players too though when they're the ones out there making those decisions.
@galaxy27 said:
the NBA is so unpredictably insane because teams jack up 3-balls like it's going out of style. i still say one night a team that's up by 40 is going to eat an L burger because it's just bombs away in every game
I know that we've talked about this topic before but it needs to be stated again, offensive possessions these days tend to be much shorter than the 24 seconds that you get each possession so huge leads can be whittled down extremely fast.
During the offseason I tend to watch many of the full game videos of the 80's Celtics/Lakers meetings and 90's Bulls games and you can see how games are coached differently between the two eras. If you had a 5-6 point lead with roughly two minutes left in the game in one of those 80's tilts, those late leads felt almost insurmountable. Teams would play out the entire 24 seconds and try getting one good field goal attempt and each team would have about 2-4 possessions in those finals two minutes,
Today if a team is down late, those final couple minutes get played out almost like a chess match where offenses take quick shots, hope to hit, then try to get a quick stop on defense. We may see 10-15 possessions by each team in that same two minute stretch which can erase large leads so quick.
I gotta ask bro and don't take offense here, did you bet on the Cavs tonight lol? 😎
How many people had the Houston Rockets with the 5th best record in all of basketball a quarter of the way into the season? Ime Udoka has that team rolling right now.
I gotta ask bro and don't take offense here, did you bet on the Cavs tonight lol? 😎
none taken, yes i did. lol i parlayed them with the Thunder who are tussling with the Warriors right now, so the outcome may have been a moot point.
but that's not why i posted what i did. i've spoken about this gradual evolution for quite sometime now. if Cleveland had won by 60 i still would have said the same thing. two teams shooting almost a HUNDRED threes in a game is just lunacy imo. and it's because of this transformation that monstrous leads vanish into thin air in seemingly no time at all. Cleveland lost that 19-point lead in less than 5 minutes tonight. that just blows my mind. it was a barrage out there.
i'm not knocking anyone who likes that style of play. if a ridiculous amount of unpredictability suits your fancy, more power to you. but coming from someone who fell in love with the sport back in the 80s when it was -- to steal your words -- a fast-paced track meet, i still have yet to get on board with today's NBA
hell even Wemby launches like a mad man, and it's not necessarily what i want to see out of him. i know it's fun to watch a 10-foot tall dude knock threes down, but when he shoots 15 in a game and makes 2 or 3 or them, i want to throw him into the paint and tell him to go destroy people
The Celtics are actually likable now that Marcus Smart is gone. King of Flop when he played in the Big Twelve. Coincidence that they win a championship the year after they get rid of him?
I gotta ask bro and don't take offense here, did you bet on the Cavs tonight lol? 😎
none taken, yes i did. lol i parlayed them with the Thunder who are tussling with the Warriors right now, so the outcome may have been a moot point.
but that's not why i posted what i did. i've spoken about this gradual evolution for quite sometime now. if Cleveland had won by 60 i still would have said the same thing. two teams shooting almost a HUNDRED threes in a game is just lunacy imo. and it's because of this transformation that monstrous leads vanish into thin air in seemingly no time at all. Cleveland lost that 19-point lead in less than 5 minutes tonight. that just blows my mind. it was a barrage out there.
i'm not knocking anyone who likes that style of play. if a ridiculous amount of unpredictability suits your fancy, more power to you. but coming from someone who fell in love with the sport back in the 80s when it was -- to steal your words -- a fast-paced track meet, i still have yet to get on board with today's NBA
hell even Wemby launches like a mad man, and it's not necessarily what i want to see out of him. i know it's fun to watch a 10-foot tall dude knock threes down, but when he shoots 15 in a game and makes 2 or 3 or them, i want to throw him into the paint and tell him to go destroy people
I did too, those Celtics/Lakers meetings were the NBA's peak, IMO. Between that rivalry and Jordan practically flying on a basketball court, they're what made me fall in love with this game.
Unfortunately, the game has evolved to what it is today and I don't see it ever going back to what it was back then. It's all about spacing in 2024 and we literally have players shooting threes literally a step or two inside halfcourt. The days of having a dominant big man like Shaq are long gone, the closest that we see to him is Joel Embiid, when healthy, and Philly hasn't made it past the second round with an offense built around that type of offensive force.
A 20-25pt lead in the first half means almost nothing in today's game when that team up is in all likelihood going to take their foot off the gas with so much time left in the game. it just takes one to two quick runs by the opposing team and it can be tie game just like that. Just look at the OKS/GS game right now (which I'm also watching) OKC was up 19 early and the Dubs fought back back and are now up 1 with just over 7mins left in the game. For me, these comebacks are now just par for the course and aren't really all that surprising when they happen. If you actually check enough weekly postgame box scores you'd see that there are like 4-5 blown 20pt leads across the league each week. It is what it is. 🤷♂️
Al Horford and Brook Lopez are both great examples on how much this game has evolved over the past 10-15 years. Both play the center position and came into the NBA around the same time. (Horford in 2007/Lopez in 2008)
Horford
first 8 seasons - 21 made threes
his next 10 seasons - 874 made threes
Lopez
first 8 seasons - 3 made threes
his next 9 seasons - 968 made threes
In today's game, your starting center needs to be able make threes at a decent clip to open up the paint for the rest of your offense to drive. This is probably the greatest change from the past, just having your "5" that has that weapon in his arsenal. Joker, Horford, Lopez, Porzingis, AD, Chet, Wemby, Embiid, KAT, Bam, Turner, Vucevic, Valanciunas & Sabonis, that's almost half of the starting centers in the league that are all capable three point shooters.
i loved me some Artis Gilmore. when i latched onto the NBA and became a Bulls fan, he was a force. the thought of that dude cranking from downtown literally makes me laugh out loud. in fact i just looked up his stats and he made one 3 his entire NBA career
the way the game was played then compared to today's NBA is like apples to jackfruit
To this day I still remember a no look pass that Gilmore made during his final season when he played for Boston. At that time I was just a little over a year into consistently watching NBA games and I just thought that that was one of the coolest passes that I had ever seen.
He was posted up just to the right of the rim and he had the ball held up high with his left hand, I don't remember who the other Celtics player was but that guy cut along the baseline to the rim and Gilmore just flipped it back over his head for an easy two points. Never even looked at the cutter.
Comments
Dean Wade out for the Cavs tonight, 3 other bench players questionable with various injuries. Could be a game of attrition for the Cavs.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
They're missing most of their wings for this game between Wade, Strus, Levert & possibly Okoro, Tatum & Brown should be able to get their points. The same could be said about Mobley & Allen in the paint with no Porzingis for Boston.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Probably boils down to who makes their 3's. I don't see the Cavs winning this one at all. Boston had 2 days rest.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Cavs are just running out of steam to keep up with Boston. That last 3 for the Celts putting them up by 7 looks like the dagger.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
That was a great overall game. Get these two fully healthy come playoff time and it will probably be one hell of a series.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Indeed - that would be entertaining. Tonight without Okoro and LeVert. Kinda scary to think though the Cavs only lost by 3 -
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Darius Garland was 3-21 - 0-6 from 3 Mitchell 13-29 3-11 from 3 crazy numbers!
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Boston wants to hit their threes while taking yours away and basically making opposing teams scores twos, the only problem with that is, with no Porzingis protecting the rim teams are able to score a ton of points in the paint on them.
Boston made 22 threes (66pts) to Cleveland's 10 made threes (30pts) for a 36pt difference in the C's favor,
Cleveland scored 60 in the paint to Boston's 36 which negated most of that differential on the threes. The Cavs made 5 more FTs and that's why it was so close at the end.
That's why so many of the Celtics games have been so close even though we keep hearing about how many more threes that they make than the opposing team that night. Horford is 38, Queta a work in progress and Kornet has had hamstring issues so their paint protection has been pretty subpar this year. On the bright side Tingus Pingus should be back soon.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
WOW! Ty Jerome with 27 in the first half for the Cavs tonight! 7 of 10 from 3.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Jaylon Tyson for the Cavs had 16 points tonight - who the Hell is Jaylon Tyson?
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
No clue but take those points when you can get them lol, you can never have too many players that can be slipped into the rotation when needed, especially when they're making cheap money.
Nice bounce back win for the Cavs. i just saw that Boston heads to Cleveland on 12/1.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
GSW wins easily against Atlanta and remain at the top of the Western Conference at 11-3.
Who would have predicted that on opening night?
Tough break on De'Anthony Melton going down for the season, when he's healthy he's a really good two way player.
We're less than a month into the season and the number of players getting injured has been pretty staggering. Some of the teams on this list are missing most of/if not all of their starting lineup. https://www.espn.com/nba/injuries
The Pelicans literally have their top 8 players hurt which is pretty crazy.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
i wonder if Philly envisioned having the worst record in the league almost 1/5 of the way after signing George
injuries, drama, what a dumpster fire they are
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
I heard this comparison recently and I could not agree more, The Sixers are the NBA's version of the Cowboys. Embiid & Dak have both put up great regular season stats but neither player has been able lead their teams into deep playoff runs.
The Process is now in year 12 and all that it's led to is a bunch of second round exits. 🤣
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Talking about the 76s - Embiid supposedly isn't going to play in back to back games anymore.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Maybe my recollection is not very good (or maybe it is); but it seems to me that the current NBA has its players missing games (due to injury; Load Management; or other things) at a much higher rate than in decades past.
I started watching pro hoops on TV and in person in the late 1960's and continue to do so today; and my memory is that many, many players from long ago ended up playing all, or almost all, 82 regular season games; with the first team players many times playing almost 40 minutes a game.
It would be interesting to have a long time pro basketball guy (i.e. the recently deceased Alvin Attles for example whom devoted over 60 years to the NBA as a player, coach, etc.) speak to how things were back in the day and how they differ from how things are today.
I listen to a weekly Cedric Maxwell podcast (C's related) and he's talked on this subject quite a bit at times especially with the Embiid situation not to long ago. He mentioned how hard it was for him to just reach 80-81 games at times throughout his career and as he got older it got even harder.
I'm paraphrasing here but he's also mentioned with how high the player's salaries are these days, its understandable that teams need to load manage certain players to ensure that their stars are good to go come playoff time. I don't think that's going to change anytime soon but at least the league made it mandatory that players need to play at least 65 games to be in the running for any end of season awards. The downside to that is these days not many players are incentivized to win those individual awards like they used to. Now, players just need to reach certain criteria over a 3-4 year stretch that will make them eligible for supermax contracts.
Go back 30-40 years ago and players would get a decent sized bonus (relative to their salary) for making the AS team or winning a certain award, now that same bonus, if they're still being used at all, is likely minimal. Just look at the incentive for All Stars winning that game and their lack of motivation, to them that winner's purse in chump change.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
i was a diehard Bulls fan even pre-Jordan. prior to looking up the stats below, i would have said unequivocally that he played in virtually every game. there was no load management bullshit. sure enough, take a look. even played in 82 his final season.
as an aside, i wonder how many people know that he broke his foot in his 2nd season and missed 64 games. i still remember Charles Oakley helping him off the court
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
IIRC Jordan came back late in that 2nd season and put up his 63pt playoff game in that series where Boston swept them on the way to wining the Finals. I was in the 6th grade at that time and remember literally watching one of the Finals games vs Houston during school hours, my teacher at the time, Mr Stevens, gained legendary status that day for bringing in his portable TV lol.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Once again tonight - No Zion for the Pelicans - Is he the new Embiid????
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Christian Braun 7-7 from the field in the Nuggets win. I noticed when I watch Denver on TV they don’t throw the ball to him very often. So he takes advantage when he actually gets a chance to shoot with an excellent percentage.
Braun is 37-61…. 60.7% his last 6 games. From an outside shooter. Too bad they only let him take 10 shots per game.
I wouldn't read too much into that last part when it comes to the Nuggets offensive pecking order.
Michael Porter Jr is one of the better 3pt shooters historically (currently ranked 22nd all time in 3pt%)
Jamal Murray when healthy is one of the best one on one scorers/closers in the game
and when Jokic isn't calling his own number he's usually looking to feed whoever is open on any given offensive possessions with throwing lobs to Aaron Gordon pretty much being Denver's bread & butter on offense.
Once Kentavious Caldwell-Pope (Denver's starting SG in recent years) signed with Orlando over the offseason it finally opened up a path for Braun to become full time starter and he's made the most of it this season. It also helps that with Aaron Gordon missing about half of their games with an injury it one less option on offense ahead of Braun.
Year three is usually when things start to click for younger players and Braun looks like he's right on schedule. If his shooting percentages stay at this current pace (57/46/77) then Joker & Murray will definitely keep going to him.
Standings-wise, the Nuggets lack of depth has really hurt them so far this season but IMO they still have the best player in basketball in Jokic so they should still be a legit threat come playoff time..
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Eric…. Good breakdown of the Nuggets team, thanks! You mentioned their lack of depth and I did notice very little scoring from the bench in the box scores, I think Russell Westbrook is the main scorer off the bench.
Their overall depth but most importantly their wing depth has taken a major hit since winning the Finals two seasons ago. Bruce Brown, Jeff Green, Kentavius Caldwell-Pope & Reggie Jackson were all legit 3&D players but are all gone now and the Nuggets never really replaced their production with veterans choosing rather to keep developing some of their younger players in Braun & Peyton Watson. Westbrook is a very good playmaker off of their bench but their offense is drastically less efficient when Jokic comes off the floor, its going to be interesting to see how it all plays out come playoffs time.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Kristaps Porzingis is finally a go to start his season tonight with the Clippers in town.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Looks like the Cavs found some more offense - Ty Jerome 26 points last night.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
Yikes - Celtics didn't even break a sweat tonight winning by 32.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
the Warriors were up 18 on the crappy Nets in the 3rd quarter tonight at home
Final score: Brooklyn 128, Golden St 120
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
And the Knicks on the road aced the Nuggets. Go figure.
That was a very entertaining game! Boston tied for the second most points scored in a quarter all time with 51pts (GS&MEM hold record at 55pts.) In that same quarter they tied the record for made threes in a single quarter with 12.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
So Minnesota/Boston played on Sunday afternoon and Jaylen Brown starts the game by hitting five straight threes in the first 2:30ish minutes of the game and this was the Wolves TV guys calling that stretch. Then Brown's response after hearing it. 🤣
https://x.com/FCHWPO/status/1861075154140324089?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1861075154140324089|twgr^b3c8ac782d7fc2bff1380da3467b38aeab3fc427|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/celtics-jaylen-brown-calls-out-timberwolves-hating-ass-broadcast-after-best-shooting-game-of-the-season/
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
after the first two weeks the G league came out with PER rankings
out of 336 players, Bronny was at #333
the G league. not the NBA. almost DFL.
him leaving college after one completely fruitless season just so he could make a cameo appearance in an NBA game with his dad was just so gross from the get-go. all of the people talking about how great it was that history was being made.......made me sick, quite frankly. i found it disgusting for myriad reasons. him stripping an opportunity from someone more deserving aside, it was the worst possible path the kid's hoops career could have taken. he was a pawn in his dad's jacked up agenda that was dripping with nepotism and now he's probably going to flame out fast because of it
i've reached the point where i feel a little sorry for him
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
IIRC he also wasn't playing in the Lakers G League team's road games for whatever reasoning, I remember ESPN had an article about a few weeks back.
Now that Dad has had his moment with him in an NBA game, he should just let him develop like any other late 2nd round pick on a G League team and just forget all of these special dispensations because of his father's name.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
three invaluable collegiate seasons to develop his floundering game............poof
all because daddy had to play in an NBA game with him
now he's a fish completely out of water and his career is closer to being totally screwed than it is to ever amounting to anything remotely noteworthy
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
Cavs 17 - 1 vs Hawks 7 - 11 tonight. One of them 7's are gonna be an 8 after............
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
If Cleveland wins tonight and Boston beats Chicago on Friday then the Celtics move on into the Knockout round of the In Season Tourney due to owning the tie breaker over Cleveland. I'm not sure if the Cavs still have a chance as the East wild card team after that.
If the Cavs lose to Atlanta or the C's lose to the Bulls, the chances of either team moving on are much more difficult. The Hawks beat Boston so they own the tie breaker there.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
I didn't realize that the Hawks & Cavs play tonight and on Friday with the Friday game counting towards the IST not tonight's game which Atlanta just won. My scenarios above are still in play on Friday which works out great for both the C's & Cavs, had tonight counted Atlanta would have owned the tie breakers over both teams.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
the NBA is so unpredictably insane because teams jack up 3-balls like it's going out of style. i still say one night a team that's up by 40 is going to eat an L burger because it's just bombs away in every game
from the middle of the 1st quarter on, the 7-11 Atlanta Hawks outscored the 17-1 Cleveland Cavaliers by 30 points tonight and handed them their first home loss (and second overall loss) of the season. wonder who had that on their bingo card?
they shot -- wait for it -- 90 treys between the two of them
serious question for you guys: are you a proponent of this style of play?
i can't stand it. i'd give anything to go back about 40 years and not be privy to any of this. i hardly recognize this sport anymore
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
WOW! - Really - Cavs up early by 19 and ready to run Atlanta out of the arena then they go to sleep? Show how much backup players are needed to give the starters rest in this league.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
I have no problem with it but I'm viewing this as a Celtics fan that watches a team that has roughly 8 players that shot above league average from three last season so my view is pretty biased. I haven't checked their percentages this season but the team just got back Porzingis which lifts their offense into cheat code status when he's healthy.
I know that the running joke from fans and the sports media is that Boston just shoots threes all game but that has really been a pretty myopic viewpoint when most of these people aren't watching them on a nightly basis and see that their unselfishness creates so many open looks from three. Likely really wide open attempts and with Porzingis back he'll start dragging opposing bigs out to the three point line which just opens up the paint for everyone else to drive.
I know that you weren't specifically talking about the Celtics here but they seem to be the poster child when it comes to this topic especially when they're on pace to shatter the season records for both three point attempts and makes this season.
I clearly remember what offenses were like back in the 80's (fast paced/high possession track meets) and 90's (drag them out slugfests.) I loved watching those games in the 1980's but I'll take today's game over what we watched in the 90's every single time. Today its all about efficiency and analytics or as C's head coach Joe Mazzulla says "its just a math problem and threes are worth more than twos."
Again, I'm spoiled because I get to watch one of the most talented rosters ever assembled on a nightly basis but if all I got to see was a bunch of average three point shooters continually tossing them up all game my opinion would likely be different. There are a lot of NBA coaches who aren't creative enough with their offensive game planning and the result is just watching his players chuck up threes all night. Alot of that falls on the players too though when they're the ones out there making those decisions.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
I know that we've talked about this topic before but it needs to be stated again, offensive possessions these days tend to be much shorter than the 24 seconds that you get each possession so huge leads can be whittled down extremely fast.
During the offseason I tend to watch many of the full game videos of the 80's Celtics/Lakers meetings and 90's Bulls games and you can see how games are coached differently between the two eras. If you had a 5-6 point lead with roughly two minutes left in the game in one of those 80's tilts, those late leads felt almost insurmountable. Teams would play out the entire 24 seconds and try getting one good field goal attempt and each team would have about 2-4 possessions in those finals two minutes,
Today if a team is down late, those final couple minutes get played out almost like a chess match where offenses take quick shots, hope to hit, then try to get a quick stop on defense. We may see 10-15 possessions by each team in that same two minute stretch which can erase large leads so quick.
I gotta ask bro and don't take offense here, did you bet on the Cavs tonight lol? 😎
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
How many people had the Houston Rockets with the 5th best record in all of basketball a quarter of the way into the season? Ime Udoka has that team rolling right now.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
this is what i fell in love with......i miss it greatly
none taken, yes i did. lol i parlayed them with the Thunder who are tussling with the Warriors right now, so the outcome may have been a moot point.
but that's not why i posted what i did. i've spoken about this gradual evolution for quite sometime now. if Cleveland had won by 60 i still would have said the same thing. two teams shooting almost a HUNDRED threes in a game is just lunacy imo. and it's because of this transformation that monstrous leads vanish into thin air in seemingly no time at all. Cleveland lost that 19-point lead in less than 5 minutes tonight. that just blows my mind. it was a barrage out there.
i'm not knocking anyone who likes that style of play. if a ridiculous amount of unpredictability suits your fancy, more power to you. but coming from someone who fell in love with the sport back in the 80s when it was -- to steal your words -- a fast-paced track meet, i still have yet to get on board with today's NBA
hell even Wemby launches like a mad man, and it's not necessarily what i want to see out of him. i know it's fun to watch a 10-foot tall dude knock threes down, but when he shoots 15 in a game and makes 2 or 3 or them, i want to throw him into the paint and tell him to go destroy people
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
The Celtics are actually likable now that Marcus Smart is gone. King of Flop when he played in the Big Twelve. Coincidence that they win a championship the year after they get rid of him?
I did too, those Celtics/Lakers meetings were the NBA's peak, IMO. Between that rivalry and Jordan practically flying on a basketball court, they're what made me fall in love with this game.
Unfortunately, the game has evolved to what it is today and I don't see it ever going back to what it was back then. It's all about spacing in 2024 and we literally have players shooting threes literally a step or two inside halfcourt. The days of having a dominant big man like Shaq are long gone, the closest that we see to him is Joel Embiid, when healthy, and Philly hasn't made it past the second round with an offense built around that type of offensive force.
A 20-25pt lead in the first half means almost nothing in today's game when that team up is in all likelihood going to take their foot off the gas with so much time left in the game. it just takes one to two quick runs by the opposing team and it can be tie game just like that. Just look at the OKS/GS game right now (which I'm also watching) OKC was up 19 early and the Dubs fought back back and are now up 1 with just over 7mins left in the game. For me, these comebacks are now just par for the course and aren't really all that surprising when they happen. If you actually check enough weekly postgame box scores you'd see that there are like 4-5 blown 20pt leads across the league each week. It is what it is. 🤷♂️
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
i know @SanctionII 's fandom precedes ours
i'd love to get his take
my biggest fear is NBA games turning into a full-blown glorified 3-pt shooting contest and little more at some point down the line
(if we're not there already)
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
Al Horford and Brook Lopez are both great examples on how much this game has evolved over the past 10-15 years. Both play the center position and came into the NBA around the same time. (Horford in 2007/Lopez in 2008)
Horford
first 8 seasons - 21 made threes
his next 10 seasons - 874 made threes
Lopez
first 8 seasons - 3 made threes
his next 9 seasons - 968 made threes
In today's game, your starting center needs to be able make threes at a decent clip to open up the paint for the rest of your offense to drive. This is probably the greatest change from the past, just having your "5" that has that weapon in his arsenal. Joker, Horford, Lopez, Porzingis, AD, Chet, Wemby, Embiid, KAT, Bam, Turner, Vucevic, Valanciunas & Sabonis, that's almost half of the starting centers in the league that are all capable three point shooters.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
i loved me some Artis Gilmore. when i latched onto the NBA and became a Bulls fan, he was a force. the thought of that dude cranking from downtown literally makes me laugh out loud. in fact i just looked up his stats and he made one 3 his entire NBA career
the way the game was played then compared to today's NBA is like apples to jackfruit
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
To this day I still remember a no look pass that Gilmore made during his final season when he played for Boston. At that time I was just a little over a year into consistently watching NBA games and I just thought that that was one of the coolest passes that I had ever seen.
He was posted up just to the right of the rim and he had the ball held up high with his left hand, I don't remember who the other Celtics player was but that guy cut along the baseline to the rim and Gilmore just flipped it back over his head for an easy two points. Never even looked at the cutter.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486