I'm Torn - Purchasing Advice (What would you do?)
NeophyteNumismatist
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About me....
I primarily collect half cents. I am about 2/3 of the way through a modified date set that also captures some of the popular varieties. I have been very dedicated to my set, and it has been fun to watch it grow from one type coin to what now look like a partial set. In 2023 I made a commitment to myself to maintain a laser focus to make greater progress - faster. This has been great, and I am proud of how things are shaping up.
Then this happened...
My buddy retired. He has a great collection that is massive with lots of rarities and high grade coins. He is looking to sell-off his collection in retirement, and he has agreed to allow me to look at his coins and pick those in which I am interested. There are so many beautiful coins, but... not many half cents that fit into my set. However, because we are friends, I am sure that I will get great coins at very friendly prices... certainly better than coin shows, shops, and likely auctions.
and... so my inner turmoil ping-pongs...
- Staying focused will get me to my half cent goal faster
- But, if I stay focused... I will miss out on great, high quality coins from my friend
- But... there are many high quality half cent examples today that are still needed.. will I lose those if I divert my attention?
- But... the cost of those coins are not "bargains" compared to greysheet bid
- But... what will I do after half cents? Shouldn't I buy nice coins at nice prices instead of buying them later at full boat?
- But.... I am not fully committed on what my next series will be (yet), shouldn't I be resolute before moving forward?
- etc etc etc... my brain goes on and on.
What would you do?
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
Comments
One more thing to mention. My friend is a great numismatist - very very smart. This is important because beyond the coins, the time he would spend with me (to help me learn) is beyond that of any dealer relationship. Honestly, he will teach me regardless of whether I purchase coins or not. But, it's one more reason why I would like to support him. I respect him a lot.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
It's a nice conundrum to face. If it were me, I would buy great coins.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Absolutely agree with Tom. You will presumably be collecting for many years and can fulfill your half cent journey if your interest continues. If it doesn't, then you're better off for it because you've moved on to new pastures. This often occurs in the hobby. However, a opportunity to buy a truly special coin doesn't come along often. Pick out a few from your friend. This doesn't mean you're abandoning your half cent efforts, just delaying them a bit as you build additional funds.
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
Stay focused on what you already collect. Why be all over the map. If a deal can be had buy it and make a profit then use those funds for your main interest.
If you are not rich enough to be outside your series then don't be.
NFL: Buffalo Bills & Green Bay Packers
I recently faced this conundrum.
I bought the great coin. There is an appearance that staying focused is better in the long run, but I think it quickly fades when you finish your set and look back and remember all the great coins you missed. I've certainly appreciated the great coins more than finishing a set faster.
I will say - most of the fun in a set is the hunt. I'd probably enjoy it more if it took an extra year to complete.
I think we often give the stay focused advice so that new collectors can learn and know what makes a coin great. I think you're probably far enough along where you can look elsewhere and understand good coins.
I think we need to change the advice to this: stick to what you want to collect and know.
Coin Photographer.
If you (in general. not directed at anyone specifically) get a special deal from a friend and resell for a profit, would you tell your friend? Would you tell your friend before the sale that's what you're planning to do?
Personally, I hate buying from friends. I always overpay. And sometimes they resent it if you resell. I'd rather deal with strangers. It's usually cheaper and always less tangled.
If a deal were provided, I cannot help but to think that some of that is predicated on me being new and him looking to help me build a collection. I have a few nice coins, but my collection is relatively small compared to many. I am not saying that I would "never" sell a coin I buy, but I would not want to buy/flip my friend's coins. While I understand I am free to do what I want, something about that does not feel "right" to me. I would want to buy them with the intention of keeping them, and he would know they are going to a good home.
Thanks for the advice and opinions... keep them coming... I appreciate all the feedback. This is a tough one for me.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
This is why buying to resell could create hard feelings. You said there were some (but not many) half cents, maybe just stick with them.
How about a compromise? Go into it with the thought of sticking to your core collection, unless you see a coin that makes your heart go pitter-patter. And if you do, allow yourself to dip your toes into the (non-half cent) water.
Please note, this post might be the first time I’ve used the expression “pitter-patter”.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
If they're not coins that interest you enough to actually collect (ex. 1/2¢'s) then do your friend a favor and let him sell them to someone else for full retail (or as close to full retail as he can get). Allow him to maximize the profit of his hard earned collection so he can enjoy his retirement. If he has half cents you need that would fit your collection then by all means acquire those.
Without actually being in your shoes, so take it with a grain of salt, I think that's what I would do in your circumstances.
I was just coming back to this thread to say something similar. I see I don't have to.
I would buy those coins that really speak to me, including any of the half cents you are looking for and any coin from another type or series of coins. Just make sure that you really love the coin, that way you will not regret the minor side road. I have found myself in this position a few times. Most recently my saint purchase at the ANA show is an example of your choice. I was down to two coins that I really wanted, one would have been a very nice addition to my primary set and would have filled a vacant slot. In the end I chose the gold saint because it was tugging on my arm are really hard!
Buying that will set me back a bit and will limit my ability to add to either of the two sets that I am working on for the remainder of this year, but I do not regret it one bit.
You do not want to get sidetracked all the time, but special opportunities to buy special coins do not present themselves every day, I do not think you will regret buying one, two, or ten
truly special coins even if it slows down the progression of your primary set.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
I'm with this group. Focus on your core collection, but if you see a few spectacular opportunities that make you smile I would not hesitate.
I see nothing wrong with expanding your horizons a bit. Particularly if you see some coin in his collection that really gets your attention or is one that you have been wanting for a long time. For me, that would be a 1909 SVDB Lincoln, or a 1916 D Mercury dime.
Yes I would. I would state my true goal to buy then sell then buy of what I truly collect and if that is a problem then I would respect that seller/friend.
If they are a friend then they would also know me enough to know I don't collect such coins. But I would be upfront about it anyways.
And if I turned a larger than expected profit then I would give that friend a certain percentage.
NFL: Buffalo Bills & Green Bay Packers
You know I collect gold, but if I had first shot at a spectacular collection that's been off the market for a while, I wouldn't hesitate to buy a coin that's out of my wheelhouse, depending on how special it is. It would have to be the kind of coin that makes your heart "pitter-patter", as @MFeld put it. lol
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I’m sure you can’t afford this guy’s whole collection, and it sounds like he’s got nice stuff. I would go after the ones I liked the most and/or felt like I couldn’t otherwise go to the market and buy easily.
Don’t buy to flip. He’s your buddy and offering you a “friends and family” deal because you’re a collector, not a dealer. There’s a statute of limitations on selling stuff from friends…just nobody really knows what that is. If in 5yrs you tell him you’re selling a coin you got from him to go after a dream coin, he’ll be happy for you. In 5 days if you tell him you’re selling his old coins to go to Vegas he might be less thrilled.
Don’t worry about your core set. It’ll always be there and having some of these new coins might help you think about what you want your overall collection to look like.
Great problem to have. Good luck!
Consider how often certain coins appear on the market that have the look that is rarely encountered. I would cast a big net. I would consider selling coins that can be replaced later in an effort to buy what simply may not appear again for some time.
Good luck with how this unfolds
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
If money is no object then I'd buy everything I like and let the laser focusing work itself out later. You have the coins versus not having them and wishing you didn't let the opportunity pass you by.
If you're old like me, stay focused. I don't think you are from what you've written.
If that's the case, as Cladiator wrote, I would not buy anything from him you are not willing to actually collect.
On that note, if a coin 'speaks' to you and you can afford it, buy it. That said, I've been collecting coins over fifty years, and have only seen maybe five coins that fit that bill.
The above said, at the last Long Beach Show, I saw a truly amazing coin. I could afford it. I passed because although it was a "that's amazing" coin, it would not have been a trophy coin for my collection.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
Just because someone is a "friend" is no reason on its own to buy coins from them. Stay focused.
Indecision may or may not be one one of my problems, but in this case, I'd buy a few of his coins that I really liked,,, then again I can't stay fokused, oops, focused, to save my life,,,, look, a squirrel!
Stay focused on your half cents. I would buy one special coin from the friend that truly spoke to me and that had a story behind it. You would always look at this coin and remember your friend and the story that goes with it. I have a Maria Theresa Thaler in its original holder gifted to me by my old friend Gunther from Camp Hill PA. When I look at the coin I remember the great bottle of wine we shared from his vineyard and the 7 years I spent in PA. A coin from a friend means a lot later in life. It will remind you of good times when you are feeling low. Trust me.
First you come up with a plan. The you carry it out. No one here can do that for you. If you want to own extra coins, do it. But remember, selling is time intensive and can bog you down. If you don't enjoy the selling exercise, just buy what fits your focused goal.
Good luck and God's speed.
Just my take: If you are young enough and will be around for a while to complete your half cent collection, I'd take this opportunity to obtain some nice coins from your friend (who, if I read between the lines, would like for you to have some of his coins). He may also hope to visit some of those coins down the road. If you feel you will have the time to get back to your #1 love and finish it to your satisfaction later, I'd add some new and nice coins to your collection. I'm at the point where I'm done doing sets and just enjoy picking up nice coins from a number of denominations and mostly just updating.
Louis Armstrong
Thank you all for your comments. I appreciate all of the perspective from this multi-faceted group!
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
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he has agreed to allow me to look at his coins and pick those in which I am interested.
This sounds like the 2 of you have talked about it and you probably have a few in mind already that you like.
Pick out a few within your budget and see where it goes from there.
There will always be half cents for sale.
Getting first pick from a buddies nice collection is not something that comes along everyday.
Just my 2 cents
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IMO, you will look back at some point and be thankful you purchased coins from a friend’s collection.
BHNC #248 … 130 and counting.
I'd definitely take a look and see if anything calls out to you. There's nothing to lose.
As for straying from your core collection, I would only do that for either cheap items or very rare items.
besides filling empty spots, you could consider upgrades
Does that mean there will be more?
“ What would you do?”
Catch the fish that is hooked. Take the best coin values you can afford while keeping it a modest hobby. Finishing the Half Cent set is not so important as the good times on the journey. No one is keeping anything and no one is really keeping score on the sets, registries notwithstanding.
I would definitely be buying those coins that are really nice and not easy to find. You can always work on the half cents in the future. This is an opportunity that will not come often. Cheers, RickO
When opportunity knocks, you answer the door. Full stop.
I've never regretted stepping up (and out of my realm) for quality material.
"It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
Hi NeophyteNumismatist,
There are a lot of thoughtful comments here, that did not occur to me. Some of them might apply to your nature and some not.
I personally would consider these coins and mentioning to your friend that some or all might be resold. You are not sure if they may be resold. Then you may accelerate your Half Cent collection or keep the coins.
It's good to give yourself permission to stray from your focus, but have the flexibility to be laser focused again if you wish.
I don't know if you are one to sell your coins. This may not apply to you personally. Would be comfortable selling your friends coins, or even to discuss doing that with him?
I have formed very long term collections like Liberty Seated Dimes and now Liberty $5 Gold pieces. Personally I appreciated a break here and there. During that time I did resell other Liberty Seated Coins, even scarce date quarters and dollars, but ended up with only my dimes. The dimes took 30 years to put together. During that time I put together 4 very scarce Liberty Seated Dollars, which I eventually sold to a friend.
Ken
The majority of "agreed" is greed. If you follow your course and play your cards right , you may not get coins for your collection, but could do well using those friendly prices to acquire whatever you please, in whatever direction your interests take you.
Forget the pitter patter/heart racing/brain teasing emotions of it. Just have fun and do it.
Edit to add:
I meant "ping-ponging", earlier where I typed "pitter patter". It's just that I read Mark's post and it dawned on me how much heart strings are played in our pursuit of happiness.
Stay focused. Resist the temptation to just start buying "nice" coins.
There are many of us, me included, who would have loved to have a mentor. Yours sounds like one in a million. One who offers you something first. See where you are ? Sitting at a king's throne.
Personally, I'd feel a bit weird going into a deal expecting a rip-and-a-flip from a close friend. I primarily collect Middle and Late Date Large Cents, but I also have a Type Set and a Box of 20... if there was something there that would allow me to upgrade a coin in one of those sets, I'd go for it... but this doesn't seem to be your situation. As others suggested, if there was a coin or two that spoke to you, or one that would remind you of your friendship (what are his/her collecting interests?), that would allow you to buy something from your friend while not completely depleting his stock. He could maximize his profits, help out his friend, and come away with the feeling that his coins landed in a good place. Who knows... it might start you on your own personal "Box of 20" coolness...
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Thanks again for the feedback.
Thanks for all the advice and thoughtfulness. I cannot overstate how much I also value the education as he walks me through his collection. It's been a real privilege and treat.
I am a newer collector (started April 2020), and I primarily focus on U.S. Half Cents and Type Coins. Early copper is my favorite.
I'm a bit late to the party, but if I were in your position, I would pause my primary collecting goals, and take full advantage of your friends sale of his collection, IF they have coins that you are truly interested in obtaining. The only reason is that this is a limited opportunity that will only happen this one time. Coins in your primary focus will always be available.
Dwayne F. Sessom
Ebay ID: V-Nickel-Coins
I would advise you to go for whatever deal that suits your collecting needs / budget. Where is he relative to CPG?
There should be no hurry to spend money on coins. Go at the pace that fits in with you, your budget, and a sound procurement strategy. Perhaps he does have a great deal. It’s your responsibility to evaluate that. If it really is a super deal it could it could be the opportunity of a lifetime. Decades ago I had a shot at a collection I had reviewed from with a minister at my church. It was a lot of raw Mexican 19th and early 20th coins in 2x2 holders - several binder pages. Knew some about them not much. I did a seat of pants offer. $1200 wholesale / $1500 retail. He would not take $1200. That weekend a rare event happened - all my double eagles sold - well over $10k. Unprecedented / uncanny. About 15 min later the minister called said he would take $1500. Told him would take it. Two days later on a Monday I bought it all for $1500. Needless to say, I did very well on it.
Often when collectors start to sell late in the game they are ignorant of the business, the overhead costs, the demand for their material, what they can really get for their material, and facing brutal competition on the bourse from big gun dealers. Many of these collectors want an unrealistic amount and quite frankly like a deer in the headlights ignorant of what the public coming in the door wants, can afford. Simply being passionate about an area does not sell coins. Not everyone is into half cents nor has the pocket / procurement need for the better ones.
Based on numerous posts of yours, it's obvious that as a dealer, you're largely focused on CPG, CDN, etc. However, what works for you isn't necessarily the same as what works for other dealers or for collectors. That's especially true in the case of non-generic coins and/or those of particularly nice quality/eye-appeal.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@ Feld
Good day to you, too, sunshine.
Yes, each person has their own way of doing business. But some of us actually try to assist others by thinking beyond how we, ourselves, do things. Instead, we try to take the particular situation and preferences of others into account.
By the way, you've made the way you operate, the business of members here, by posting about it, quite frequently.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
He has a few that fit your set. Just buy them.
I am late to the party, but I will tell you this. When I was a dealer, the Grey Sheet prices were way too low and not a realistic reflection of the prices for GOOD, no problem early copper. I don't know if that is still true, but if it is, if you can buy nice half cents at the Grey Sheet numbers, go for it.
As for the rest, it really depends on what you want to do. I used to have a lot half cents. At one time I had 12 of the 13, 1804 varieties. At one time I had all but four of the varieties in the 1800 to 1811 group. I lost interest because I hit a wall. Even if I had all the money in the world, I could not get those last four varieties. The collectors who owned them were "well healed" and not ready to sell any time soon. So I pulled the plug.
That was unusual for me because I tend to hold coins for years, but the fun just went out of it.
Wow did I miss something?
He doesn't seem to like me very much
and I don't like him. More importantly, I believe that we have very different views regarding how to view and treat both buyers and sellers, as well as about what constitutes a fair price to pay for PQ coins.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.