PCGS Restoration Results. Before and After pictures.

Fairlaneman

Your thoughts.
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1918S Before.


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1918S After.


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1920D Before.


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1920D After.


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1924D Before


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1924D After


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1927S Before


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!927S After

Thanks for looking.
Ken

1madman

Doesn’t look like much changed in the before & after photos. Did any of the coins upgrade?

Kliao

I don't see much of a difference other than a slightly brighter coin.

rip_f

The difference appears to be what an acetone bath would produce.

Zoins

@rip_f said:
The difference appears to be what an acetone bath would produce.

Agree. With the before and after toning, they don't look like they were dipped.

PerryHall

I think the conservationists were very cautious and carefully gave each coin a quick dip in distilled water.

logger7

At least they aren't willing to take the chance of making the coins worse as I found with the competitor, but this is an expensive lesson. I found PCGS conservation better. You could have done it yourself, first acetone, then a non acidic dip such as "Conserv" which I've used. And if you know what you are doing a diluted silver dip. Deep toning is hard to remove with leaving problem residue.

291fifth

Not much improvement. They seem to be wary of very dark toning (as they should be.) Personally, I think they should have declined to do the restorations if they knew the results would be as shown.

Catbert

My thoughts are: BUMMER!

keyman64

There is nothing they can do when the toning/gunk/corrosion has eaten through the luster layer. They did not look to be good candidates for restoration. This is why the before and after photos basically look the same. A lot can be learned by experimenting with MS70 on cheaper coins.

MarkKelley

IMO, a waste of money.

Fairlaneman

My thoughts about this submission.

First off it went through the process in about 30 working days which is unusual compared to what other people have said about the length it takes for submissions now. Did the submission miss a step in the process?

Second I thought there was a very good chance that PCGS would decline to restore 2 of the coins. The 18S and the 20D.

Third I should have put a note in with the submission about what I was expecting that could be done on 2 of the coins which were the 18S and the 20D. The 18S looks like the reverse has been toneing up since I purchased the coin and I wanted to see if something could be done about this. The 20D has a verdi spot on both the obverse and reverse and that is what I wanted addressed on the coin.

I fully expected to see the 24D and 27S to be conserved. Both were good coins for conservation, especially the 24D, in my opinion.

I think I will call PCGS and see if they can actually tell me if the coins went through conservation.

Thanks Much for your comments which pretty much mirror my thoughts about what was done or not done on this submission.

Ken

gumby1234

Looks like the 24 D slightly improved. Probably wasted your money getting these conserved.

OAKSTAR

One coin per thread would have given me less of a headache.

lilolme

BryceM

Hmmm. Looks like wasted effort, money, and time to me. A few years ago I think all would have been returned unchanged with a "can't help you" explanation.

The 24-D was the best candidate, but even it doesn't look like they did much.

ElmerFusterpuck

I'm in the camp of nothing was done. I was thinking any differences were due to a lighting angle change and a possible trick question. Interesting.

justmenutty72

I don’t see any difference. A waste of time and money.

BustDMs

@lilolme said:

Personally I like the before better. Were you happy with the result?

3stars

Hope you didn’t pay for that.

pursuitofliberty

@Fairlaneman

Ken, keep us posted please. I'm really curious, as those really don't look different, with the POSSIBLE exception of a quick Acetone swish. The lighting is slightly different in the before and after's, and that's the brightness change. I am hopeful they didn't take the fees and then didn't do anything (other than put them in new holders).

Oldhoopster

Extremely underwhelmed. Honestly, it looks as if nothing was done to any of them except swish them in water. I'm not being critical of the work, IMO it's better to err on the side of caution, but to agree to do the conservation work and miss so badly does not bode well for their evaluation process. Just my opinion

Namvet69

And a pint of acetone is all of $7. I guess it's advantageous to know condition limitations. Yeah, they're A little bit brighter but that's about it. I wonder how much that costs for a 4 coin dip? Peace Roy

clarkbar04

Looks like they used some ms70 to remove some dirt and haze.

lilolme

@BustDMs said:

@lilolme said:

Personally I like the before better. Were you happy with the result?

That is the PCGS advertisement for their restoration service on their website.

LanceNewmanOCC

@lilolme said:

@BustDMs said:

@lilolme said:

Personally I like the before better. Were you happy with the result?

That is the PCGS advertisement for their restoration service on their website.

@Fairlaneman

that being said. this has been discussed recently, a bit more intricately and what i do remember, is that the restoration service has a specification that they prefer to NOT remove toning that doesn't appear detrimental to the coin in order to help it upgrade, so a person will have to do it themselves or find someone outside pcgs to do it.

alaura22

IMO, a waste of money.

ricko

@Fairlaneman .... Now that is discouraging. I would have expected far more from restoration. Just a waste of money IMO. Cheers, RickO

skier07

@Namvet69 said:
And a pint of acetone is all of $7. I guess it's advantageous to know condition limitations. Yeah, they're A little bit brighter but that's about it. I wonder how much that costs for a 4 coin dip? Peace Roy

True.

But if you do it yourself you still have to submit to PCGS. Grading expenses are incurred and there’s no guarantee they will all straight grade and how.

ChrisH821

@Fairlaneman said:
My thoughts about this submission.

First off it went through the process in about 30 working days which is unusual compared to what other people have said about the length it takes for submissions now. Did the submission miss a step in the process?

Second I thought there was a very good chance that PCGS would decline to restore 2 of the coins. The 18S and the 20D.

Third I should have put a note in with the submission about what I was expecting that could be done on 2 of the coins which were the 18S and the 20D. The 18S looks like the reverse has been toneing up since I purchased the coin and I wanted to see if something could be done about this. The 20D has a verdi spot on both the obverse and reverse and that is what I wanted addressed on the coin.

I fully expected to see the 24D and 27S to be conserved. Both were good coins for conservation, especially the 24D, in my opinion.

I think I will call PCGS and see if they can actually tell me if the coins went through conservation.

Thanks Much for your comments which pretty much mirror my thoughts about what was done or not done on this submission.

Ken

If they went though conservation they should have new cert #'s.

Cougar1978

I don’t see much improvement on the dimes. My gosh they ugly. Tarnish is a cruel process sometimes it progresses beyond point of no return.

What u gonna do now? Keep or just start on bay at amt that gets bids? Inventory write down for sch c?

The dimes in bad shape not anything would make offer on if walked up to my table at show.

If old Teletrade days before they had photos would suggest send there hope no returns.

DisneyFan

@lilolme said:

@BustDMs said:

@lilolme said:

Personally I like the before better. Were you happy with the result?

That is the PCGS advertisement for their restoration service on their website.

Are they the same coin? Notice the invisible hand on the first coin.

TomB

@DisneyFan said:

@lilolme said:

@BustDMs said:

@lilolme said:

Personally I like the before better. Were you happy with the result?

That is the PCGS advertisement for their restoration service on their website.

Are they the same coin? Notice the invisible hand on the first coin.

I believe they are, unfortunately, the same coin.

jesbroken

Sorry for the preconservation pics, all I saved. The after photos were taken about 5 or so years ago. Sent ATS and all toning was removed. I took these photos with a Sony Mavica and the coin was far better looking afterwards than the photo shows.
Jim

ProofCollection

@Fairlaneman said:
Your thoughts.

Check your invoice. I've had some go through that I was struggling to see if there was any difference and I came to find out that they didn't restore the coins. I was told that if you look at your invoice, if it says "Evaluation Fee" they didn't restore it, if it says "Restoration Fee" they did restore it. I'm pretty sure they didn't restore your coins.

I'm a little upset about a recent sub with this coin from my childhood collection from the 80's. Not worth a ton, thought they could remove the green, but they declined:

yosclimber

It would likely leave pits if the green was removed.
You could try doing it yourself.
Perhaps with something like Verdi-Care?
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/937671/please-weigh-in-on-what-you-know-about-verdi-care

SoCalBigMark

The Fun Show bathroom has a better lab.

Manifest_Destiny

LeeBone

Wow, not a difference IMO.

I would expect a lot more.

logger7

I found NGC more aggressive in their "conservation". I had an HR Saint that had a little ball of dirt on the reverse, certified MS62; the bigshot dealer I got it from said it needed to be conserved and then it would grade MS63. After conservation the ball of stuff was still there but the coin was washed out. Subsequently they said they could darken it to make me happy but I didn't want to pay another fee or take the chance so sold it with a multi-thousand dollar loss.

skier07

@logger7 said:
I found NGC more aggressive in their "conservation". I had an HR Saint that had a little ball of dirt on the reverse, certified MS62; the bigshot dealer I got it from said it needed to be conserved and then it would grade MS63. After conservation the ball of stuff was still there but the coin was washed out. Subsequently they said they could darken it to make me happy but I didn't want to pay another fee or take the chance so sold it with a multi-thousand dollar loss.

How does a conservation service darken a coin?

logger7

@skier07 said:

@logger7 said:
I found NGC more aggressive in their "conservation". I had an HR Saint that had a little ball of dirt on the reverse, certified MS62; the bigshot dealer I got it from said it needed to be conserved and then it would grade MS63. After conservation the ball of stuff was still there but the coin was washed out. Subsequently they said they could darken it to make me happy but I didn't want to pay another fee or take the chance so sold it with a multi-thousand dollar loss.

How does a conservation service darken a coin?

I have no idea; that was the offer with the gold $20.

PeakRarities

@skier07 said:

@logger7 said:
I found NGC more aggressive in their "conservation". I had an HR Saint that had a little ball of dirt on the reverse, certified MS62; the bigshot dealer I got it from said it needed to be conserved and then it would grade MS63. After conservation the ball of stuff was still there but the coin was washed out. Subsequently they said they could darken it to make me happy but I didn't want to pay another fee or take the chance so sold it with a multi-thousand dollar loss.

How does a conservation service darken a coin?

Ahh, the ol' "Razzle Dazzle", trade secrets not meant for us mere mortals.

MFeld

@skier07 said:

@logger7 said:
I found NGC more aggressive in their "conservation". I had an HR Saint that had a little ball of dirt on the reverse, certified MS62; the bigshot dealer I got it from said it needed to be conserved and then it would grade MS63. After conservation the ball of stuff was still there but the coin was washed out. Subsequently they said they could darken it to make me happy but I didn't want to pay another fee or take the chance so sold it with a multi-thousand dollar loss.

How does a conservation service darken a coin?

Darkening a coin isn’t conservation. If a submitter darkened a coin it would be doctoring.

coinkat

Good to read that Corporate is now involved....

ProofCollection

@MFeld said:

@skier07 said:

@logger7 said:
I found NGC more aggressive in their "conservation". I had an HR Saint that had a little ball of dirt on the reverse, certified MS62; the bigshot dealer I got it from said it needed to be conserved and then it would grade MS63. After conservation the ball of stuff was still there but the coin was washed out. Subsequently they said they could darken it to make me happy but I didn't want to pay another fee or take the chance so sold it with a multi-thousand dollar loss.

How does a conservation service darken a coin?

Darkening a coin isn’t conservation. If a submitter darkened a coin it would be doctoring.

While I agree with your statement, it would then appear that NGC conservation offered to doctor the coin.

OldeTowneCoinShoppe

@logger7 said:
I found NGC more aggressive in their "conservation". I had an HR Saint that had a little ball of dirt on the reverse, certified MS62; the bigshot dealer I got it from said it needed to be conserved and then it would grade MS63. After conservation the ball of stuff was still there but the coin was washed out. Subsequently they said they could darken it to make me happy

I'm sorry, but that sounds like an outright lie.

logger7

@OldeTowneCoinShoppe said:

@logger7 said:
I found NGC more aggressive in their "conservation". I had an HR Saint that had a little ball of dirt on the reverse, certified MS62; the bigshot dealer I got it from said it needed to be conserved and then it would grade MS63. After conservation the ball of stuff was still there but the coin was washed out. Subsequently they said they could darken it to make me happy

I'm sorry, but that sounds like an outright lie.

I could give more particulars but this is not a court of law; and you will not find me being dishonest here. This was a dozen or so years ago at the Baltimore Show where I was told a couple of their representatives could discuss the issue with me. They did say they could darken the coin; the charge was their conservation fee based on my declared value of around $18K. I sent it to the dealer I got it from who said it looked AU after the "conservation". There probably would be a way to dig out before and after images.