Most Popular Half Dollar Series
Zoins
Posts: 34,359 ✭✭✭✭✭
I was thinking about Liberty Seated Half Dollars given the 1843 Seated Half with Wild Reverse Die Cracks... thread by @MrEureka and my love of the Liberty Seated series, which got me wondering about popularity of various series. I wanted to compare these to say the Capped Bust Half Dollar series and was surprised by what I found:
- 363 Early Half Dollars - Major Sets
- 134 Liberty Seated Half Dollars - Major Sets
- 222 Barber Half Dollars Major - Sets
- 733 Walking Liberty Half Dollars - Major Sets
- 2,334 Franklin Half Dollars - Major Sets
- 1,503 Kennedy Half Dollars - Major Sets
I even checked Commemoratives:
- 455 Silver Commemoratives 50 Piece Type Set, Circulation Strikes (1892-1954) - Major Sets
- 147 Silver Commemoratives 144 Piece Mintmark & Variety Set, Circulation Strikes (1892-1954) - Major Sets
I was surprised that Liberty Seated Half Dollars have the fewest sets given the LSCC to promote them.
I was also surprised by the strength of Frankies, Go Ben!
So... given the above, are the Liberty Seated Half Dollars one of the rarest sets to collect?
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Literally, all of the half dollars mentioned are fun and desirable to collect. but as a lifetime member of the bust Half Nut Club, who currently owns zero Bust Halves, let me say that it is a very active and interesting group. I'm plotting my comeback as we speak!
Tom
It wouldn't be one of the series that I hold near and dear; Reeded Edge half dollars.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Seated half dollars have two issues that are not attainable to any save the most wealthy collectors. Early small eagle half dollars are much the same.
Walkers are my #1 choice (obviously...big surprise, right?
). They are beautiful, challenging and rare, yet still do-able.
Kennedys and Franklins are only ranked 1st and 2nd, in set numbers, because they are less expensive for the casual collector and thus easier on the pocketbook, so more people can participate.
I'd say that Seated and Capped Bust halves should be 2nd and 3rd, respectively. JMHO.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
For whatever reason I find seated anything unattractive. I do however find the Walking liberty half dollars probably one of the most attractive (Beautiful) designs for most every US coins aside from the mighty buffalo nickel. But that should be of surprise to anyone here on this forum. I agree with @Walkerfan on this note.
I'm having a hard time understanding what your data points even are... are these registry sets or something?
If so, I guess its reasonable to extrapolate the popularity of each type outward from there, but who really knows?
I've never once considered doing a registry set or anything of the sort.
I'm sure the majority of collectors out there are similarly uninvolved with them.
Maybe a more accurate way to determine this might be to ask all of the coin folder and album manufacturers which albums they sell the most of?
It kind of reminds me of that time Naploen called Uncle Ricos football tape pretty much the worst video ever made.. to which Kip replies.." Napoleon, like anyone could even know that..."
Yes. they are the sets maintained by this site's host, PCGS and Collectors Universe.
Sure, but if the inclination is similar across series, it should still provide a reasonably accurate picture.
It's an option if they publish that info. Do album publishers publish this data like Collectors Universe does for Registry Sets?
Did he have data across all types, like we do from PCGS Set Registry?
I’ve collected walkers, Barbers, and seated half dollars.
Walkers are challenging in a few dates and grades, Barbers are challenging in a significant number of dates and grades, and seated halves are extremely challenging in many dates and most grades.
@crazyhounddog said:
For whatever reason I find seated anything unattractive.
LMAO
Mike
My Indians
Danco Set
I have several Walkers and lots of Franklins (almost a complete set). I can’t tell you I like either one better than the Seateds because Seateds have bee out of my price range except for just a type piece (which I’ll get around to). If the budget goes up, maybe I’ll venture into them and find out how popular they really are or aren’t for me.
They might just sit in that sour spot between low budget guys like me and high budget guys and don’t get appropriate love from either of us.
Ok, I gotta agree that the registry data is probably as good as any in terms of determining the ratio of set building between one half dollar type and another, sure...
But, with the various fifty cent types, popularity is also a very emotional thing. Try to imagine the surge of energy one might feel acquiring their first 1796 half dollar, your first 1817/3, or a truly dcam 52?
The chakras will open one after another and a fountain of pure energy will be released high into the sky.
When it comes to really understanding what the most popular 50c piece is, I gotta agree with Kipper, how Could anyone even know that?
I can imagine the surge of energy from my first CBH, LSH, WLH, BFH, and JFK
That being said, my first purchases for those didn't release a "one after another" for me since I focus on attractively priced toners, and those can be really hard to come across!
Just look at Registry Sets, like this "I gotta agree that the registry data is probably as good as any in terms of determining the ratio of set building between one half dollar type and another"
For me, I have always considered the WLH to be the most attractive half dollar coin in design. Far better than any of the other standard issues. I do have sets of the Franklin and Kennedy halves - but the WLH is best. Cheers, RickO
As per the registry numbers being used to determine which is the more popular...there are 2 flaws to this:
1) availability of coins and number of sets possible.
2) budget! Remove the constraints on folks having to collect on a budget and those rankings would change!
Good to know you have Franklin and Kennedy sets.
Given your admiration of the WLH, do you have any WLH sets?
Alert - thread resurrection. Thanks to @Zoins for a good thread.
I was joking with my friend @pursuitofliberty that busty
collectors are an odd bunch compared to us sophisticated 
seated half collectors. Nonetheless, it seems to me that BH collectors are numerous and the demand for their material is inexhaustible that also includes many variety collectors. And, since back then bank transactions were made with bags of BHs, there are more available in higher grades than the seated halves. The SHs were typically used in commerce and the series length is intimidating; further reasons why they are not pursued as often as other series.
So, I was curious to learn from readers why you think bust halves are more popular than seated halves (given they are adjacent time periods)?
Is it because the love of the buxom Liberty? Is it the burly nature of Liberty? Is it because the minters were incompetent with all the sloppy strikes and poor die administration?
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
The Seated Half is my all time favorite, but I look at Halves the same way I do dogs. My lifelong dog friends are Papillons, but i am thrilled they are not as popular as labradors or french bull dogs.
Seated Halves can be easily collected in R-4 or better varieties at pennies on the dollar for the same rarity in Bust Halves. It is my simple opinion that Seated coins in general are less pursued because of the large number of altered coins. Seated coins have a far different past than Bust Halves. Seated coins went thru a few periods of history that caused them to be hoarded, melted, collected but with many damaging traditions and finally thrust back into circulation to die a normal death. Many, Many Bust Halves have the same background as Morgan dollars. They lived their lives in bank vaults and counting rooms for decades on end. THEN they were rediscovered, cataloged and reintroduced as a part of collectible history. just my perspective. James
I’ve said this before but it bears repeating - the CBH collectors on this forum are a “treat”. Not only have I learned a lot, but their back & forth banter is special.
Still, there’s too much with these for me to enter that collecting realm. I absolutely love the early Walkers, though, & am pretty close to completing the Registry set. Only the brutally tough 1921-S remains.
“The thrill of the hunt never gets old”
PCGS Registry: Screaming Eagles
Copperindian
Retired sets: Soaring Eagles
Copperindian
Nickelodeon
I would think that the Kennedy half dollar might be the most popular.
My collecting is limited to the type coins plus a short set of Walkers and a BU set of Franklins, none of them slabbed.
Great thread indeed!
Now, as to my one-time friend @Catbert and his assertation that Seated Lib's are a "sophisticated" man's game, compared to the "odd bunch" of us Capped Bust collectors ... well he is probably correct I suppose ... although have any of you actually met @Catbert ?
While I can easily subscribe to the "odd bunch" breed, fitting Dan into a "sophisticated" group might be harder than counting the reeds on those SLH edges. At least I can read mine!
Speaking of which, there is quite a lot to read when it comes to Capped Bust (and earlier) Half Dollars, even for us not quite so sophisticated folk. Try to find one Die Study book still in circulation for the SLH's, much less several.
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Of course, for many of us, the historical aspect surrounding the early days of our American Republic under the new U.S. Constitution, as well as understanding the intricacies of hand-made dies, the Screw Press, the Castaing Machine, and early Federal Coinage in general is just more exciting than the Westward expansion, Civil War and thrust towards the Industrial Revolution, coupled with the changes to the somewhat monotonous design and very mechanized coinage that followed for a half a century afterwards. I mean for us "odd bunch" guys anyway.
And for what it's worth, we call ourselves "Nuts". That is a proper pronoun description for the "odd bunch" you describe. What the heck do you call your "sophisticated" bunch?
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Oh, and while I can agree that many Capped Bust Halves found their way around in Bank Transfers, so did Seated Halves (of course) ... until the Silver Barons invented the false demand, and the Mint created the Morgan. After that the SLH was nearly left for dead. Unused but minted for both the aspiring and stubborn collectors who wanted the latest denomination from the Mint. A trend many seasoned Numismatists still mock today.
And of course the Seated design was so uninspiring in comparison, is it any wonder that of all the coins melted, the CBH's survived and the SLH's disappeared? I mean really.
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Series length and difficulty finding? Ha! Blasphemy. Yeah, the SLH's have a longer run overall (even if the design was pretty worn out by 15 years prior) but if the 450 Die Marriages for CBH's isn't enough to claim the crown, the 980+ Die States sure will.
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Did I miss anything?
Oh, the comment on beauty. Of course.
I'll take my wild and crazy, always unique, lettered edge (tattooed?), large-breasted, hot Bohemian girls over your studious, draped gown, have a sit on the rock (couch?), prim and proper, hide-my-butt behind a shield girls, any day.
Hell even our Eagles look more fearsome!
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p.s. I like ALL Half Dollars, but Bust Halves rule! Dan, I'm not so sure about any more!!
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
I suspect the numbers captured by Registry sets may not be a measure of popularity, but a measure of what can be completed. A SL Half set would require patience and $$$ to complete whereas a Franklin set, if one skips FBL coins and is satisfied with coins in a 64-65 range is quite doable.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Oh the burn! Masochism is my thrill! I expect your buddies will add their fire!
I do appreciate a classically ugly Liberty depicted on the BHs, similar to modern art in a museum where one wonders “why” while being simultaneously repelled and fascinated. In any event, we do share Eagle designs at least for a few years.
All in good fun and I’m trying to stir the pot!
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
As much as I enjoyed collecting seated halves, walkers will always be special to me. Here are a few I wish I still had:
"Look up, old boy, and see what you get." -William Bonney.
Having read through the posts more closely, the real question is why are there fewer seated half registry sets than any other series. Here are a few random on seated halves which I collected years ago:
"Look up, old boy, and see what you get." -William Bonney.
Excellent analysis, if I do say so myself 😉😆
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
I am currently working on a 50c date set 1794 to 2024. Seated halfs are the most difficult to find in MS(BTW seated 25c are even more difficult). My favorite set is early 50c before 1840.
@breakdown . You can't have numerous sets of something that doesn't exist. To have more registry sets you have to have the coins. Take any five year period from the Bust half era and add up the number of coins certified. Take any 20 year period from the Seated era and add up the number of coins. Take 25 years if you want. Won't change much. James
You won't see me in your coin shop any time soon (if you own one).
As far as popularity and the set registry are concerned, most popular = most available.
Us odd bunches are even more committed to the Capped Busties ever since the Nut Club's enacted mandatory tattoos and buzz haircuts.
I'm with @pursuitofliberty, the stout and pretty Capped Bust type is more artistic and attractive than the couch potato and pajama Seated Liberty type.
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
@jacrispies . I am equally positive the entire "lowball' craze was started by bored Bust collectors who became obsessed with finding a coin that did an actual days work. james
I will also caution everyone to not get too hung up on looks. The broad on the Bust Half (wearing her maids mob cap), looks more like the woman sent to clean Liberty's room rather than Be her. On the other hand the aquiline beauty and slender figure of the Sully based liberty looks more like the one waiting on that maid. It is no wonder she found a convienient place to sit while she waited. Judging by the apparent "girth" of the woman she is waiting on she is in for a long sit.
To quote the great philosopher from that 70S show (Kelso), BURN James
I get why Franklin Halves are popular. They have higher relief, easy to find and build a set on. Cannot build a set in any other old series and Kennedy is still too recent. In all honesty, if you have a 1964 Kennedy Half, you have every single half you need in that series as none of the others are as good as the 1964.
You know @seatedlib3991 @breakdown @Copperindian and @Catbert , and by association anyone who wants to debate the merits of beauty for Miss Liberty, including @jacrispies (despite his buzz cut comment) and that lurker @Davidk7 and my friend @Eldorado9
Here's an extension to my post earlier, summarizing my 2c for the merits of beauty for Miss Liberty on the Half Dollar
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Franklin and Kennedy are out, of course. Definitely men.
After that, the Barber design is the roughest looking of the bunch. In fact, I am not sure that depicts a real woman. And if it does, she looks like she could take both Franklin and Kennedy in a wrestling match. At the same time.
Now, I think if we stay away from Patterns and Commemoratives, the Walking Liberty is pretty tough to beat from an overall artistic dispaly, but kind of like the Seated Liberty Halves, you really can't see her face. And probably for good reason, although especially so with the SLH's.
I mean it has to be intimidating to go up against a girl-next-door hot-chick with a wholesome attractive face, who can probably go surfing and rock climbing with you (on the same day) ... and warm your blood afterwards ... like the Miss Liberty depicted on the earlier date Capped Bust (and by association Draped Bust) Halves. I mean, when it comes to attractive, "real" women anyway.
Now somehow the Reeded Edge Capped Bust Halves failed completely in the in-between follow-up, and let's face it ... Flowing Hair Halves, while better than some other denominations for the period, has a kind of scary looking Miss Liberty. Actually, her profile kind of looks a little too much like my friend @PNies20 ... I mean with hair.
But like I said ... just my 2c ... to each their own.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
@pursuitofliberty Only if you get my good side.
BHNC #248 … 130 and counting.
Interesting thread to read, thanks to the OP for creating it. All I can say is that there is something magical about a no motto seated half.
Edited to add: This is why it's smart to read an entire thread before one posts. I'm thinking this is a serious discussion, write a long post, and then find out a food fight broke out...
I like discovering things. I like all half dollars but Seated halves and seated coins in general feel like The Last Frontier in US coinage to me. A chance to find something new in numismatics. Ha! I get to put the nu in numismatics.
An eBay seller sold me this 1877 with a large reverse die break after negotiating the price down to the troposphere.
I was curious about this very large die break because they usually indicate terminal die conditions, though the list of exceptions is long and fun to contemplate (eg., 1840-O WB-10 (R2), the common faux or eBay "baseball die cracks" seated half die marriage). After some preliminary emails and research, this late die state, as well as the die marriage itself, are more than likely undescribed. It will be fun discussing and integrating this into Bill Bugert's research on this date. Now, the challenge for me is sitting my ass down and writing a description rather than going back to looking for something else that's new.
I also have to write up my adventures and misadventures from my addiction to 1855/54 overdates. The CU forums may be useful for rough drafts. The skinny: Watch out on the coin frontier, you might stumble into a sweet honey pot that will seduce you. It's "been the ruin of many a poor boy."
WB-2 PCGS AU50
Well, the third post in this thread (mine) mentioned Reeded Edge half dollars and then 34-months after the thread started and 36-posts into the thread the second mention of Reeded Edge half dollars occurred in the post of @pursuitofliberty where he describes them as-
"somehow the Reeded Edge Capped Bust Halves failed completely in the in-between"
Which I guess is a euphemism for the idea that Reeded Edge half dollars are the red-headed step-child of US numismatics and that they might truly be the best numismatic definition for the "rebound relationship" where it sure was fun getting tangled up together, but don't expect me to be hanging around anymore.
I guess I'll just blowtorch my small pile of them...
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Yes, they are. They're largely collected as type coins. Are they similar in relationship (though enantiomers) to that of the flying eagle and the Indian head cent in terms of their popularity being collected as a series? Of course, Flying eagle cents don't have stoppers like the CBRE series has. Yowza! I answered my question.
Time to go to bed.
@pursuitofliberty Only 450 die marriages?! That's closer to DBSER die marriage numbers than the numbers of die marriages that Seated half sophisticates curate.
I collect Barber halves and have for a while. I am collecting them in a dansco album, I would bet most Barber collectors are not doing registry for collections but just raw and in a album. Seated is probably alot in albums as well, provided you are not going for high end stuff, which is out the range of most collectors.
@Barberian Mentioning new discoveries is a lose-lose situation for seated half dollars and severely damages your leverage for the series. I discovered a couple new die marriages, including one of the date 1842-O, and nobody cares. The references stay the same, emails are ghosted, and premiums are not met. The coin is lost in a sea of type collectors ready to crack out the coin and place in their whitman type folder.
Capped bust halves, on the other hand, I've discovered a handful of unknown die states. The discoveries are met with enthusiasm by an entire club, the references are immediately updated with print soon to come, and there are countless collectors who are very interested in late die states matching rarity. New marriages can potentially be found, and when they have been in the past, they are met with high interest and massive wallets ready to shovel out onto the auctioneer.
@TomB just gained my respect for torching those worthless reeded edge bust halves. They are not even worth spending at face value.
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
Has Bill Bugert looked at these new die marriages? Did you try publishing them in the Gobrecht Journal?
I'm going to jump back in here and make sure you guys know I really love all Half Dollars ... even the ones that look like @Pnies20 good side (with hair), and those @TomB threw into the melting pot.
The fact that we study these enough to know their histories, Die Marriages and even Die States, and our respective passion for the pursuit of our favorites is infectious for all of us. And let's face it, from the very first Half Dollars until the current day (especially when you consider Commemoratives), they really do offer more in overall design attractiveness and collectability.
That said, Reeded Edge Bust Halves somehow had the ugly stick dropped on Miss Liberty's portrait. Not far from Barber's monstrosity, but not that close either. I think Barber invented the Ugly Stick (kind of an uninspired design but a great fishing pole).
Of course, Miss Liberty has a honker of a nose on some of the SLH's too, so there is that.
Although, maybe as a rebound relationship the RE CBH would do. God only knows after three tequilas and a couple of beers.
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I mean, in my opinion anyway.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
@Barberian I had a short conversation with Bill about the 1842-O over email. The other marriages were later dates where new findings are somewhat expected every once in a while, not really worth reaching out imo.
But..... back to regularly scheduled programming of Liberty vs Liberty!!! Capped Bust liberty would certainly beat Seated Liberty in a fight. Except perhaps the Gobrecht type because that Liberty has some extra muscle mass.
@pursuitofliberty We are keeping with objective qualities here, I have not read a single opinion on this thread yet.
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
Seated Liberty can shatter die with her head. Capped bust Liberty makes only measly spiral breaks on their flimsy planchets.
That may be true...
But nobody... and I mean nobody.... can defeat the final boss and ultimately masculine BEARDED GODDESS!!!!
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606