Good time for Collectors
Gazes
Posts: 2,315 ✭✭✭✭✭
These are truly good times for US coin collectors. Anyone who has put together a nice collection has seen the value of their coins increase or in some cases soar. Young collectors have found our hobby and seem ready to not only keep it going but make it stronger than ever. Instead of wondering why new found millionaires and billionaires are throwing their money into art and other hobbies---they are now buying coins too. All the doom and gloom about the hobby seems to have been outrageously pessimistic.
Of course, if you had sold your coins and no longer collect and are on the forum, you are not thrilled (and will disagree with this post). If you want to buy more coins right now, yes you have to pay up (that is a classy problem to have as opposed to everything being dirt cheap). Some will say not everything has done well---thats good! It would be a bubble if everything under the sun went up including coins that have been messed with. Coins that are truly rare and coins that are strong for the grade have done well. As long time collectors we should be happy about this---are knowledge and passion is being rewarded as opposed to someone buying any coin and expected it to double in value.
Going forward I will still keep buying coins that i believe are rare and accurately graded and not messed with. And I will enjoy the challenge continuing to build my collection and expect those coins to continue to be sought by others down the road.
Comments
Thank you Gazes, I appreciate your post. Coin collecting has been of immense joy and a refuge from the worries of the world over the last two years. The PCGS Registry, TrueViews, this forum, and CoinFacts all have added to the enjoyment of the hobby for me. The biggest difficulty I see is lack of supply of great coins across the board. In my area, Proof Barber's I've seen very little fresh material, particularly over the last 12 months. The Simpson sale was an amazing event, but those prices were really steep! Gotta pay to play these days. Happy collecting, Eldo.
Nice post and I agree. I only have a small handful of coins at the moment but the few I have are doing nicely.The increased interest is exciting! Its the best thing for our hobby.
Jb-rarities.com
IG: jb_rarities
I 100% agree that the supply of great coins is the greatest hurdle. Requires alot of patience and then when you find that great coin pulling the trigger quickly.
Have to disagree with much of the initial post. Yes, truly rare coins that are strong for the grade, or of Draped Bust or earlier ear without problems, have almost always done well, and today is no exception to that. They cost more now because there is more demand for them, as there is money in the market.
That said, very few coins are truly rare. For example, you can find a 1916 SLQ in any grade almost instantly. It's not rare. Except for true rarities, like high grade Barber Keys (ie., 1896 -S, 01-S and 13-S), that series has gone nowhere for years. There has been a downward trend for years on most mid 19th century type and later materials, excepting key dates and coins like Carson City silver dollars.
A buyer can say this is a good thing, as such coins are more affordable. That MS 66 N/C Liberty Nickel will cost a fraction of what it did 30 years ago. That applies to most the that, and other series.
Coin collecting is a hobby for me. I see works of art on metallic discs and wonder on what journeys they have traveled. If I want to make money, I go elsewhere.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
It's refreshing to see an optimistic post once in a while.
I've been winning almost zero of the auctions I'm bidding in lately. Most likely, my willingness to pay has not kept up with the realities of the market. First world problems.
I cannot imagine how different coin collecting would have been in 1958 when I started, if the information available now was accessible then. The beginning collectors today have no idea what it was like, waiting for the three coin mags to come out to learn something new each month. I am grateful just to have access to all this information. I truly appreciate the hard work you authors put into our hobby and wish to say thank you for sharing your work.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
A collector had better be wealthy because anything of quality is now priced out of the range of the average collector and in some cases even the above average collector.
I’m happy but old😱
I wonder if collectors that live on a fixed income share your viewpoint?
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
I always have fun. I don't care if prices go up or down. I also don't care what anyone else is doing.
A nice collection of Ike dollars with nice proofs can be made for less than $1k. Collectors with a higher budget can have a nice type collection of 19th century silver. The current crazy prices are for top pop registry coins and CAC gold.
I don’t know what you consider to be the range for the “average collector”. However, there are still many high quality coins that can be acquired for less than $1000 - some for quite a bit less than that. If, by chance, you were referring to coins in the range of $100 or less, if they were $80 but are now $100, the average collector shouldn’t be impacted too badly.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I would disagree with the statement that they are "good times for collectors", generally. They are indeed good times for some collectors - specifically, for investors/speculators, for dealer-collectors, for flippers, for downsizers, and for other people who either routinely sell their coins or are currently wishing to sell.
For people like me, who never sell anything from their collection and only buy, and who literally could not care less what the current market value of their collection is, these are not "good times", because prices are high, and my fixed coin budget now buys me fewer coins.
And they are probably not the best of times for dealers, because in such markets, everybody wants to sell, and very few people want to buy - meaning their inventory goes up and their cash reserves go down, leaving them vulnerable if prices crash back down again.
Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius, "Meditations"
Apparently I have been awarded one DPOTD.
I’m as average as there is. I’m on a pension. My silver has done very well. My choices are not as expensive but there’s plenty of opportunities 👍🏼
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
Many people want to buy, even at current, considerably higher prices. In fact, my guess is that many of those who are buying are doing so because of (rather than despite) higher prices. Conversely, many people don’t want to buy at lower prices in a down market.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I am sure they are ecstatic if they carefully and prudently built their collection over time and have the option to sell for top price now if they choose.
You can buy eye appealing coins at any price level.
You can find great deals on coins with great eye appeal at any price level.
If you never sell anything and only buy and "could not care less what the current market value is" then you certainly would like prices to be depressed for your entire life time. I don't think that would serve the hobby, dealers and most collectors well.
If they’d rather add to their collections, than sell at higher prices, being able to do the latter isn’t going to make them ecstatic.
Your optimism is probably shared by collectors who are in selling mode, but you appear to be ignoring all of the ones who are more interested in buying.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
It is definitely an interesting market. I have some 1850’s $10 Eagles in PCGS AU55 CAC holders with low pops. Under 30 and single digit CAC pops. They have not increased in guide price at all. I have other gold CAC coins that have more than doubled from below $2000 to $4500+.
It is a good time to be a buyer of some coins. It is tough to be a buyer of others. One well know gold dealer puts out 25-30 coins every month or so. They sell out in under an hour and amount to $300,000 in total normally. There is not enough supply currently. I had hoped higher prices would bring some coins out from the SDB in the bank.
Successful BST with drddm, BustDMs, Pnies20, lkeigwin, pursuitofliberty, Bullsitter, felinfoel, SPalladino
$5 Type Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/type-sets/half-eagle-type-set-circulation-strikes-1795-1929/album/344192
CBH Set https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/everyman-collections/everyman-half-dollars/everyman-capped-bust-half-dollars-1807-1839/album/345572
The problem is you assume too much.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
I am definitely not ignoring all the ones more interested in buying. First, I like to post something optimistic on these boards because there is so much negativity. The OP talks about price increases for anyone collecting for several years, the influx of new money into our hobby and not just other hobbies and more young people involved. Generally good things but sure there maybe some that would rather our hobby stay at a static level.
Second, I responded to a post about collectors on a fixed income. If they truly are needing extra income, I would think most would love to have the option to sell some coins for a profit. I understand some would rather not---thats fine. As you correctly pointed out in your previous post "there are still many high quality coins that can be acquired for less than $1000." And you correctly point out that even $100 a coin collectors shouldn't be too impacted. Everyone can enjoy this boom in the market and also have hope that it may produce a profit too.
Some want it all----low prices for whatever coins we want but certainly higher prices when we sell or our heirs sell. We can't have it all. But after hearing for years that there are no young collectors coming into the hobby, prices will be depressed forever, etc., I am loving see new collectors pour into our hobby (both young and older) and I think the educated collectors will thrive in this market whether buying or selling (by the way---I am not selling and I still love what is going on).
Well, I don't think so (read my last post), but at the end of the day I'm not going to sit back and be upset because we have a booming market and few people are upset because prices have gone up.
As I only buy and do not sell, I find that the rise in buying prices has limited the amount of coins that I can acquire in a year. It has driven me to pursuing only ones that fit my main registry sets. Buying a high end, upgrade coin is almost an impossibility for me. It has taught me to be more prudent about what coin I really need at this time and which coins can wait until the price is more reasonable. I might have to wait a year or so for the price to drop or get lucky in an major auction house bid.
I need two coins to complete two 2021 modern sets. When this is accomplished, I will probably only buy a few more coins for the year, hopefully an upgraded Kennedy.
Wayne
Kennedys are my quest...
I was satisfied with the sale of 7 of my coins at FUN which helped fund the acquisition of 6 others. I paid strong premiums for the new coins and believe I strengthened my collection. Don't be afraid to sell a few coins to help you reinvigorate your collection.
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
Got it, you want an order of yes men, a side of happy talk, and hold the reality. Coming right up!!
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
I've been the underbidder on 2 auctions in the last week. Missed out on a 1916 SLQ graded F12/F12. I'm obviously a week behind current prices.
I would think a booming coin market would help bring to light some beautiful specimens that haven't been offered for sale in decades. I say bring it on!
Matt Snebold
The market is certainly very hot right now, but I disagree to an extent on this as I think some people who have sold at market highs and were able to make a profit may be thrilled.
Laura is recommending people sell and we've seen many top coins sell recently.
I'm holding.
It's insanity out there.
My Saint Set
Or perhaps "quality" has shifted. For example, if a coin in your series was common in VF and only "quality" in XF and above, now it might have separated in VF since XF is not affordable. I mean as long as there are billions of coins available at face value, there are likely to be coins at whatever price level you find affordable, whatever you find a stretch (that is you need to save up three-six months of your coin budget for one coin), and some that are plain out of reach. If your coin budget is $100 per month, you can't say that a $200 coin isn't "quality" even if it's not a coin that would have excited you two years ago at $50.
I agree with you. I meant (but did not say) those who had sold their coins several years ago and no longer actively collect.
Laura is not without incentive to say this. The biggest dealer challenge right now is the lack of inventory, so surely saying that prices are high and that collectors should sell now would directly help her trade. I’m not saying that’s her only motivation in making that statement, but it’s worth pointing out.
Nothing is as expensive as free money.
It doesn't do any dealer any good to have sellers and no buyers.
Interesting conversation. Perspective is important in such a discussion. Much like health or the weather, it depends on what situation the individual is experiencing. Certainly some general statements may be made regarding price or availability. However, I find that such statements are largely more applicable to the business of numismatics than to the hobby. As some members have indicated, good coins are still available at reasonable prices.... Exceptional condition coins and rarities have always been expensive - which, again, is a matter of perspective. When one looks at prices from 20 or 30 years ago, they appear cheap in todays market. The same applies to cars and other products. I will continue to enjoy collecting coins, buying those I like - and can afford. Cheers, RickO
It was the best of times; it was the worst of times.
(he mused, content with his collection of dimes)
Good luck buying any nice midgrade Barber anywhere near Price Guide! There's plenty of washed out,scratched or otherwise molested material in holders you can buy for a little under price guide!
I don’t blame the overall market when I’m out bid on a coin at auction. To me, my bid a personal measure of interest, preparedness and appetite.
And, there are many places to buy coins other than well advertised and heavily promoted auctions. There will always be somebody somewhere who can and will pay more for a coin. I’ve found that when I put in the time to study and hunt hunt hunt and network I land awesome coins. Patients is a key ingredient and timing is everything. Everyone gets lucky once in a while, but luck isn’t really a strategy. If you want a mid range or lower price for something, you have to out work the other guy. When you don’t you usually have to pay that guy handsomely. Boots or your wallet.
I can certainly concur with Gazes post that it is a good time financially for those of us who have bought rare date gold with CAC. I think that this will persist given the small population of coin in this grouping. That said, I find myself unwilling to pay some of the new prices in the market. I am also selling a coin here and there.
This. I haven't won much at auction for a while, and not for lack of trying, just not trying hard enough, I guess.
Are we talking about PCGS & NGC holders or cardboard holders?
Laura has been advising to sell some of your coins that have done well NOT to sell everything including the kitchen sink.
Apparently her philosophy is that it never hurts to take a profit. A sensible one.
You mean it was the best of dimes?
I'm not agreeing or disagreeing, but how is this determined?
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.
What if you were astute enough that all your coins, including the kitchen sink, have done well?
Bruce is selling everything at a profit now which is great.
Likely anecdotal evidence that I have also seen. 2 witnesses! 😂
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
Has the recent stock market decline going to be a cause for concern to the near term future of the coin market?
Yes and no. When the stock market Dow Jones Industrial Average suffered the massive decline from 1020 in December 1972 to 607 in September 1974 and still not fully recovered at 729 in March 1980, it was known as the lost decade yet coins shined overall.
Yet when the stock market suffered prior to 9/11/2001 the coin market suffered in sympathy.
There are probably collections emerging but since they are sold as individual coins we don't even realize it. I was fortunate enough to pick this one up from a complete collection of C dates which your well known gold dealer recently purchased. Between greater interest in Charlotte coins and the overall increase in prices for old gold I'm sure that this collection had significantly appreciated in value.
Bruce is fishing in very shallow waters. His experience is not indicative of anything in the general coin market.