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  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,365 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 22, 2022 9:34AM

    @cohodk said:
    Anybody ever see a bitcoin?

    As a matter of fact, I could have had this for 24 ounces of gold. My partner was adamantly against it. Customer subsequently used it online and got 220 tenth ounce gold eagles and maple leaf(s) mix along with $400 face value in .900 U.S. coinage. ($52k in gold and silver) last year.
    He purchased said coin for $150 in 2013.

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    Its not close because proponents of equites never hold them out to be a "currency".

    So no one has ever seen a bitcoin. Case closed.

    In your mind maybe. Equities are exchanged for other assets daily...

    Like what?

    Dollars, yen, euro, ect?

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • taxmadtaxmad Posts: 981 ✭✭✭✭

    @cohodk said:

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    Its not close because proponents of equites never hold them out to be a "currency".

    So no one has ever seen a bitcoin. Case closed.

    In your mind maybe. Equities are exchanged for other assets daily...

    Like what?

    Dollars, yen, euro, ect?

    Yes - and more. In fact, anything the other person is willing to exchange for the equities offered

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @blitzdusts assume that is a daily occurrenc

    @derryb said:
    Is now the next move up?

    Not sure but I've still been buying. Last purchase 3/18. GL!

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
    BOOMIN!™

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    Its not close because proponents of equites never hold them out to be a "currency".

    So no one has ever seen a bitcoin. Case closed.

    In your mind maybe. Equities are exchanged for other assets daily...

    Like what?

    Dollars, yen, euro, ect?

    Yes - and more. In fact, anything the other person is willing to exchange for the equities offered

    When was the last time someone offered you a stock certificate for goods or services?

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭

    A growing number of crypto holders make their purchases through crypto exchanges such as Coinbase, brokers such as Robinhood and even Paypal. Their ownership never entitles them to "delivery" and is simply an investment that is bought with cash and sold for cash. They never expect to nor will be able to hold their crypto in their hand.

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 23, 2022 2:22AM

    @derryb said:
    Their ownership never entitles them to "delivery" and is simply an investment that is bought with cash and sold for cash. They never expect to nor will be able to hold their crypto in their hand.

    Agreed. Which is why i find it interesting (if not hypocritical) that cryptos are accepted by PM supporters who have repeatedly stated "if you dont have it in your hand then you dont have it". They have frequently shared pics of their safes full of metals while dismissing others brokerage account statements.

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • RobMRobM Posts: 558 ✭✭✭

    Most individuals or businesses that accept crypotocurrency as a form of payment are simply converting the payments to cash. They aren't sitting there scratching their behinds and wondering whether they are accumulating too much SHIB.

  • taxmadtaxmad Posts: 981 ✭✭✭✭

    @cohodk said:

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    Its not close because proponents of equites never hold them out to be a "currency".

    So no one has ever seen a bitcoin. Case closed.

    In your mind maybe. Equities are exchanged for other assets daily...

    Like what?

    Dollars, yen, euro, ect?

    Yes - and more. In fact, anything the other person is willing to exchange for the equities offered

    When was the last time someone offered you a stock certificate for goods or services?

    Same time I was offered a bitcoin for goods or services. Point?

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 23, 2022 7:02AM

    @cohodk said:

    @derryb said:
    Their ownership never entitles them to "delivery" and is simply an investment that is bought with cash and sold for cash. They never expect to nor will be able to hold their crypto in their hand.

    Agreed. Which is why i find it interesting (if not hypocritical) that cryptos are accepted by PM supporters who have repeatedly stated "if you dont have it in your hand then you dont have it". They have frequently shared pics of their safes full of metals while dismissing others brokerage account statements.

    Hey hypocrite, it's because with PM's PM supporters have a choice between physical or paper. They do not have the same choice with cryptos and they are not willing to let the lack of choice cause them to miss an opportunity in cryptos. I'm sure many stackers also own stocks and I'm sure if they could stack a chunk of Google in their safe or safety deposit box they would prefer to do so.

    "If you don't have it in your hand then you don't own it" does not mean only buy investments you can hold in your hand. It means when you have the choice choose to hold it in your hand. Possession is eleven tenths of the law.

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • jmski52jmski52 Posts: 22,902 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm sure many stackers also own stocks and I'm sure if they could stack a chunk of Google in their safe or safety deposit box they would prefer to do so.

    Jim Sinclair has been advocating that stock owners get a certificate from their brockerage house, but prices have gone up for that service and most brokerages don't wanna do it. The brokerage houses want the stock ownership in their house account. It seems obvious to me the reasons why.

    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
  • LukeMarshallLukeMarshall Posts: 1,983 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmski52 said:
    I'm sure many stackers also own stocks and I'm sure if they could stack a chunk of Google in their safe or safety deposit box they would prefer to do so.

    Jim Sinclair has been advocating that stock owners get a certificate from their brockerage house, but prices have gone up for that service and most brokerages don't wanna do it. The brokerage houses want the stock ownership in their house account. It seems obvious to me the reasons why.

    Is it so they can lend out the share short?

    It's all about what the people want...

  • LukeMarshallLukeMarshall Posts: 1,983 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:

    "...with PM's PM supporters have a choice between physical or paper. They do not have the same choice with cryptos and they are not willing to let the lack of choice cause them to miss an opportunity in cryptos. I'm sure many stackers also own stocks and I'm sure if they could stack a chunk of Google in their safe or safety deposit box they would prefer to do so.

    I think a correlation could be made between

    "Paper" bitcoin - i.e. the stuff you buy in someones sandbox (say paypal) and cannot transfer it out, only sell it back to the provider.

    and

    "Physical" Bitcoin - which would be the Token shown above that contains the physical code typed onto a physical piece of paper. Heck, you dont even need the token at that point just the code.

    Of course the code is a key that grants you access to the bitcoin "asset" that is stored on the blockchain, which once you have access can transact.

    Whats interesting to me is the dual nature of bitcoin being a Commodity, ie a store of value, and a medium to transact that value (and perhaps easier than gold depending where I try to send my AU to)

    2cents

    It's all about what the people want...

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭

    '> @LukeMarshall said:

    Whats interesting to me is the dual nature of bitcoin being a Commodity, ie a store of value, and a medium to transact that value (and perhaps easier than gold depending where I try to send my AU to)

    Sorta like a 1964 half dollar?

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • jmski52jmski52 Posts: 22,902 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Is it so they can lend out the share short?

    I believe that's one of the reasons. The reason to obtain the actual stock certificate is in case the brokerage goes under, in which case it would be forever until the problem would be resolved and there's no guarantee that you would ever be made whole.

    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
  • LukeMarshallLukeMarshall Posts: 1,983 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:
    '> @LukeMarshall said:

    Whats interesting to me is the dual nature of bitcoin being a Commodity, ie a store of value, and a medium to transact that value (and perhaps easier than gold depending where I try to send my AU to)

    Sorta like a 1964 half dollar?

    In 1964 maybe.

    I wouldn’t want to pass one for face value now a days when I knew the intrinsic value of the metal within was 2000% more valuable

    It's all about what the people want...

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:
    A growing number of crypto holders make their purchases through crypto exchanges such as Coinbase, brokers such as Robinhood and even Paypal. Their ownership never entitles them to "delivery" and is simply an investment that is bought with cash and sold for cash. They never expect to nor will be able to hold their crypto in their hand.

    I use RH and they gave me one of them fancy wallets. I can convert directly to Physical gold or even gutter metal if I so choose. Times, they are a changin, it's a Crazy World! RGDS!!!

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
    BOOMIN!™

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    @taxmad said:

    @cohodk said:

    Its not close because proponents of equites never hold them out to be a "currency".

    So no one has ever seen a bitcoin. Case closed.

    In your mind maybe. Equities are exchanged for other assets daily...

    Like what?

    Dollars, yen, euro, ect?

    Yes - and more. In fact, anything the other person is willing to exchange for the equities offered

    When was the last time someone offered you a stock certificate for goods or services?

    Same time I was offered a bitcoin for goods or services. Point?

    Im trying to figure yours?

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:

    @cohodk said:

    @derryb said:
    Their ownership never entitles them to "delivery" and is simply an investment that is bought with cash and sold for cash. They never expect to nor will be able to hold their crypto in their hand.

    Agreed. Which is why i find it interesting (if not hypocritical) that cryptos are accepted by PM supporters who have repeatedly stated "if you dont have it in your hand then you dont have it". They have frequently shared pics of their safes full of metals while dismissing others brokerage account statements.

    Hey hypocrite, it's because with PM's PM supporters have a choice between physical or paper. They do not have the same choice with cryptos and they are not willing to let the lack of choice cause them to miss an opportunity in cryptos. I'm sure many stackers also own stocks and I'm sure if they could stack a chunk of Google in their safe or safety deposit box they would prefer to do so.

    "If you don't have it in your hand then you don't own it" does not mean only buy investments you can hold in your hand. It means when you have the choice choose to hold it in your hand. Possession is eleven tenths of the law.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/projection

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @LukeMarshall said:

    @jmski52 said:
    I'm sure many stackers also own stocks and I'm sure if they could stack a chunk of Google in their safe or safety deposit box they would prefer to do so.

    Jim Sinclair has been advocating that stock owners get a certificate from their brockerage house, but prices have gone up for that service and most brokerages don't wanna do it. The brokerage houses want the stock ownership in their house account. It seems obvious to me the reasons why.

    Is it so they can lend out the share short?

    They cant do that if the shares are fully paid for and held within your brokerage acct.

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmski52 said:
    Is it so they can lend out the share short?

    I believe that's one of the reasons. The reason to obtain the actual stock certificate is in case the brokerage goes under, in which case it would be forever until the problem would be resolved and there's no guarantee that you would ever be made whole.

    You may find this helpful...

    https://www.sipc.org/for-investors/what-sipc-protects

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,365 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Well I know this should be in the coin forum, but....

  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,365 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Any guesses how much it sells for crypto boys ?

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Not sure but my Crypto is shining tonight, the gutter not so much. RGDS!

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
    BOOMIN!™

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • LukeMarshallLukeMarshall Posts: 1,983 ✭✭✭✭✭

    G.> @cohodk said:

    From the article

    "Hacks of cryptocurrencies such as bitcoin and ethereum have jumped in recent years as they’ve grown in value."

    and also

    "While the major blockchains such as the one behind bitcoin have remained secure, tech companies are building services on top or alongside them that don’t always have the same level of security or decentralization."

    There's levels to your love crypto
    Yeah, there's levels to your love crypto (Levels to your lovecrypto)
    And I know, we can get higher hacked (Higher hacked, baby)
    maybe

    It's all about what the people want...

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • ctf_error_coinsctf_error_coins Posts: 15,433 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I started day trading stocks again :o

    I am such an idiot to even think of trying it again :)B)

    Please tell me so >:)

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2022 12:59PM

    Day trade cryptos 24/7

    $223 gain in ETH in a four hour period today. Lots of volatility for the day trader. Hint: don't freak and sell the dips.

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • ctf_error_coinsctf_error_coins Posts: 15,433 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Whats the definition of a "Swing Trade" ?

    Answer ... When a day trade goes bad :D

  • ctf_error_coinsctf_error_coins Posts: 15,433 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2022 1:06PM

    @derryb said:
    Day trade cryptos 24/7

    $223 gain in ETH in a four hour period today. Lots of volatility for the day trader. Hint: don't freak and sell the dips.

    $1500 gain trading pot stocks in the last week all on margin.

    Sold all back to cash no margin.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 1, 2022 1:31PM

    @ErrorsOnCoins said:

    @derryb said:
    Day trade cryptos 24/7

    $223 gain in ETH in a four hour period today. Lots of volatility for the day trader. Hint: don't freak and sell the dips.

    $1500 gain trading pot stocks in the last week all on margin.

    Sold all back to cash no margin.

    The $223 gain was in the price of one coin. A buy and sell of 100 coins would have turned a $22,300 profit in four hours. Of course, no one times them perfectly, but still lots of highs and lows in a relatively short period of time that offer great volatility/profit potential. I turn my profits into more coins for the next trip.

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 3, 2022 9:26AM

    @derryb said:

    @ErrorsOnCoins said:

    @derryb said:
    Day trade cryptos 24/7

    $223 gain in ETH in a four hour period today. Lots of volatility for the day trader. Hint: don't freak and sell the dips.

    $1500 gain trading pot stocks in the last week all on margin.

    Sold all back to cash no margin.

    The $223 gain was in the price of one coin. A buy and sell of 100 coins would have turned a $22,300 profit in four hours. Of course, no one times them perfectly, but still lots of highs and lows in a relatively short period of time that offer great volatility/profit potential. I turn my profits into more coins for the next trip.

    Except for you of course on an internet message board after the fact. :roll

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
    BOOMIN!™

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @blitzdude said:

    @derryb said:

    @ErrorsOnCoins said:

    @derryb said:
    Day trade cryptos 24/7

    $223 gain in ETH in a four hour period today. Lots of volatility for the day trader. Hint: don't freak and sell the dips.

    $1500 gain trading pot stocks in the last week all on margin.

    Sold all back to cash no margin.

    The $223 gain was in the price of one coin. A buy and sell of 100 coins would have turned a $22,300 profit in four hours. Of course, no one times them perfectly, but still lots of highs and lows in a relatively short period of time that offer great volatility/profit potential. I turn my profits into more coins for the next trip.

    Except for you of coure on an internet message board after the fact. :roll

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • RobMRobM Posts: 558 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2, 2022 7:26AM

    So 100 ETH @ $3,300 requires putting $330K at risk. Assuming an experienced daytrader, who will typically risk maybe 1% of their trading bankroll on an individual trade, @derryb's trade scenario, using a rational risk assessment approach, suggests having a bankroll of.....drumroll....$33M. I mean come on, that's nearly 100x the amount of silver some of us are hoarding.

    Wait, I just realized that the above posts were made on April 1.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2, 2022 7:36AM

    @RobM said:
    So 100 ETH @ $3,300 requires putting $330K at risk.

    Correct.

    Assuming an experienced daytrader, who will typically risk maybe 1% of their trading bankroll on an individual trade, @derryb's trade scenario, using a rational risk assessment approach, suggests having a bankroll of.....drumroll....$33M. I mean come on, that's nearly 100x the amount of silver some of us are hoarding.

    I personally do not limit myself to your 1% assumption. My point with the example is that a $330K investment in a crypto could have turned a $22,300 profit in four hours. When was the last time one even had the opportunity to do that with a precious metal, physical or paper?

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • RobMRobM Posts: 558 ✭✭✭

    A 7% gain. Yes, that is a sizable, quick gain. But every day there are tradable stocks, commodoties, etc., that fluctuate by that much in price. My question would be what is your exit strategy if you get caught holding ETH and it suddenly falls, and keeps falling? Not selling the dips works as long as there are no major underlying issues. But that strategy typically only works when prices are generally trending upward.

  • RobMRobM Posts: 558 ✭✭✭
    edited April 2, 2022 8:21AM

    Accidental double post

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @RobM said:
    A 7% gain. Yes, that is a sizable, quick gain. But every day there are tradable stocks, commodoties, etc., that fluctuate by that much in price. My question would be what is your exit strategy if you get caught holding ETH and it suddenly falls, and keeps falling? Not selling the dips works as long as there are no major underlying issues. But that strategy typically only works when prices are generally trending upward.

    Haven't cryptos been generally trending upward?

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:
    a $330K investment in a crypto could have turned a $22,300 profit in four hours. When was the last time one even had the opportunity to do that with a precious metal, physical or paper?

    Ummmmm......everyday.

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • cohodkcohodk Posts: 19,188 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:

    @RobM said:
    A 7% gain. Yes, that is a sizable, quick gain. But every day there are tradable stocks, commodoties, etc., that fluctuate by that much in price. My question would be what is your exit strategy if you get caught holding ETH and it suddenly falls, and keeps falling? Not selling the dips works as long as there are no major underlying issues. But that strategy typically only works when prices are generally trending upward.

    Haven't cryptos been generally trending upward?

    Hasnt everything?

    Excuses are tools of the ignorant

    Knowledge is the enemy of fear

  • RobMRobM Posts: 558 ✭✭✭

    Cryptocurreny has only been around a few years. Does that establish a trend? Tulips and Beanie Babies trended upwards at one point as well.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2, 2022 3:27PM

    @cohodk said:

    @derryb said:

    @RobM said:
    A 7% gain. Yes, that is a sizable, quick gain. But every day there are tradable stocks, commodoties, etc., that fluctuate by that much in price. My question would be what is your exit strategy if you get caught holding ETH and it suddenly falls, and keeps falling? Not selling the dips works as long as there are no major underlying issues. But that strategy typically only works when prices are generally trending upward.

    Haven't cryptos been generally trending upward?

    Hasnt everything?

    so we all agree that cryptos HAVE BEEN trending upward. As far as other assets fluctuating as much in price, this is incorrect for any ONE given asset other than a crypto of your choice.

    I can easily play the volatility of one crypto day in and day out. How easy is it for you to choose the correct, different stock each day in order to profit from its temporary one day volatility? Good Luck Wid Dat.

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • ctf_error_coinsctf_error_coins Posts: 15,433 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 5, 2022 7:20AM

    It ain't that hard to choose stocks to put on the watchlist.

    Or to trade "story" stocks.

    Bought TWTR yesterday afternoon, sold on the open and made a little over 1K :)

    Bought RIVN this AM, looking to sell on a spike or hold if the trade goes bad.

  • RobMRobM Posts: 558 ✭✭✭

    @derryb said:
    Day trade cryptos 24/7

    $223 gain in ETH in a four hour period today. Lots of volatility for the day trader. Hint: don't freak and sell the dips.

    I bought 100 ETH today at $3,300 and sold at $3,370 for a nice profit of $7,000!

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 6, 2022 2:06PM

    yep, time to reload.

    Many assets take a hit today as the FED starts removing musical chairs, one by one. Problem is there are trillions of chairs.

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:
    yep, time to reload.

    Many assets take a hit today as the FED starts removing musical chairs, one by one. Problem is there are trillions of chairs.

    Don't forget to let us know how perfectly you timed it. LOL

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
    BOOMIN!™

  • derrybderryb Posts: 36,948 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @blitzdude said:

    @derryb said:
    yep, time to reload.

    Many assets take a hit today as the FED starts removing musical chairs, one by one. Problem is there are trillions of chairs.

    Don't forget to let us know how perfectly you timed it. LOL

    I'd rather keep you in suspense because I know it keeps you awake at night.

    The government is incapable of ever managing the economy. That is why communism collapsed. It is now socialism’s turn - Martin Armstrong

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:

    @blitzdude said:

    @derryb said:
    yep, time to reload.

    Many assets take a hit today as the FED starts removing musical chairs, one by one. Problem is there are trillions of chairs.

    Don't forget to let us know how perfectly you timed it. LOL

    I'd rather keep you in suspense because I know it keeps you awake at night.

    Big tyme. :sunglasses:

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
    BOOMIN!™

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 5,967 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Finally got some SHIB, better than gutter, THX R-HOOD!!

    The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
    BOOMIN!™

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